Anxiety Narrows Your Brain. Here's How to Widen It Back Out. | Susa Talan

0:04This is the 10 % Happier Podcast. I'm Dan Harris.

0:18Hello, everybody. How we doing? We are so often exhorted, encouraged to be here now, to be present, to be in the moment. But then, of course, the question, how do you actually do that? And then how do you remember to do that? That is one of the things we're going to be talking about today with an ace meditation teacher named Sousa Tallon. What you're about to hear is a recording of a live session that Sousa did with subscribers to my meditation app, 10 % with Dan Harris. We do these weekly sessions that are only available to subscribers where you can meditate with me and or with one of our teachers and get your questions answered.

0:59So what you're about to hear is the Q &A portion of one of these sessions. Just a little bit more about Sousa before we dive in here. She's a meditation teacher, an artist, and a writer who's been studying for nearly 20 years with her primary teacher, a Burmese master named Sayadaw Utejaniya. I have known and worked with Sousa personally for more than a decade. She is great, and I think you're really going to enjoy this session. Real quick, before we dive in, just a rapid plug for my weekly newsletter. I think a lot of you know that I have this weekly newsletter, but if you're not signed up, I'd love you to sign up.

1:33You can do so at danharris.com. Every Monday morning, you'll get a little nugget of wisdom from me in your inbox. It's a great way to start the week, especially when your inbox is likely filled with lots of annoying work and distressing news missives. But what I do is something very different. I give you just a little bit of wisdom that you can operationalize in your life immediately. Also, the newsletter is a great place to stay abreast of all the doings in the wider 10 % Happier Cinematic Universe. It's where I talk about all the new content we're adding to our meditation app and also give you updates on live events that I'm doing in person.

2:09So danharris.com, sign up. I'd love to have you on our list. All right, we'll get started with the great Sousa Talon right after this. Lately, I've been trying to be a little bit more intentional about what I wear every day, leaning into pieces that feel easy, comfortable, and still put together. It just makes getting dressed simpler. Quince has been a big go-to for me in this regard. The fabrics feel elevated, the fits are clean, and everything just works without needing to overthink it. Quince has all the wardrobe staples for spring. Think 100 % European linen shorts and shirts from$34, lightweight, breathable, and comfortable, but still looking put together, and clean 100 % Pima cotton tees with a softness that has to be felt.

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4:47First of all, just thank you for all of your questions. There's such rich curiosity and care and interest in all of them. And of course, I won't be able to answer them all, but I'd like to try and offer as many as I can. So the question is, I really like the simplicity of Sousa's awareness practices. I think I know the answer to this question, but unsure. Why is being aware a preferable way of moving through the world? In essence, I'm asking, why is this worth cultivating? Thank you for this question. I love this question because it really gets right to the heart of exactly, you know, why are we doing this and what is the point of being aware?

5:28I can't remember if one of the meditations that has dropped so far in the app spoke to this, but I think I use it in one of the meditations, which is, I love this example of driving. So most of us have gotten in a car at some point, and 20 minutes later, we've arrived in our destination, right? And we can think back on the drive, whether we were driving ourselves or we were in the car. We were at stoplights and green lights, and there were pedestrians, and so many things happened, but where were we, right? You get to the end of where you were arriving to and you realize, wow, I was driving the car, but my mind was somewhere else.

6:08Has anybody had that experience of, yeah, checking out in parts of life? Our bodies can do incredible things without awareness. It's amazing. We're conscious, so we're engaging with the world, but we're not necessarily aware of what we're doing. So I love this example because the invitation of awareness of this practice is that we want to know what we're doing for the whole drive. We want to know that our hands are on the steering wheel. We want to feel them there. We want to know that we're looking out the windshield. We want to know that we're seeing the sky or seeing the road. We might even be able to feel our own breath just coming in and going out steady as we're driving.

6:58And in those moments when we're more aware for the ride, we have a chance to actually feel what's going on for us. We're not just thinking about life. We're not somewhere in the future or in the past. We're actually there for the whole ride. And the way my mind often thinks about it is a moment that you come to a stoplight If you're being aware, you're really present for what's unfolding. You might see a pedestrian on the street, and you might catch eyes, and you might share a smile. Or you might notice that they're struggling, and you might feel your heart kind of move towards them in some way.

7:37And there's a moment of shared humanity that happens, where your mind isn't in the future or the past, but it's right where you are. This is a more full way of living. You know, there's a fullness to our experience when we actually are in the present moment as it's unfolding. It gives us an opportunity to live in more intimacy with ourselves, with others, people we love, and the natural world. You know, we're there, more present for the things we really care about. So in a way, being more aware means we're here for the whole car ride, which if that's our life, you want to be here for it, right?

8:19There's all kinds of things that you can do when you're more aware. You can make choices. You can do Kegels at the stoplight. You can take care of someone in your backseat. You can listen to something that really impacts you. You can have more agency to make the choices that we want to make in the present moment. And that's listening to a rainstorm and really knowing that you're there. That's it. Awareness isn't some magic bullet. It's just being in the present moment exactly as you are. Yeah. Yeah, so I see this question about, do you have more tips for meditating with palpitations from anxiety or stress?

8:56Really, I mean, one of the reasons that we want to work with palpitations and anxiety is because we want it to go away. If we're really honest with ourselves, we want to work with it in order for it to stop or to go away, right? And so often the strategies that we use to try and work with it are actually subtle or more than subtle experiences of resistance to the palpitations, right? We don't like them. They're uncomfortable, they're unpleasant, and we want them to go away. But instead of pushing against them or sort of getting lost in them, I'm going to ask my mind, what else is happening? And I'm going to bring my attention into my hands, which maybe are going to feel more neutral, more settled.

9:42I might be able to feel the way my body feels sitting in a chair. I might tune into the sounds that are happening around me. and suddenly we're teaching the mind that anxiety isn't the only thing that's happening. I know there are lots of guests on Dan's show who could speak with a lot more expertise about this, but the very basic way I think about this is anxiety often brings forward sort of more fight or flight, like amygdala responses, right? We zero in, we can narrow in on feeling like we're in a more binary relationship to the world. The mind narrows and it can attend just to this one experience.

10:26But actually, there's a lot of things that are happening at the same time, all the time. So when we ask the mind, we use the prefrontal cortex a little more, come into the part of the mind that has more ability to navigate complexity. We're inviting the mind to navigate that there are multiple things arising, things that are difficult like sensations of anxiety, and then we're also noticing connection with a loved one or listening to the sound of someone's voice who we care about. We might be putting our hands on a cat or a dog or the hair of someone we love, and we can recognize we can have those experiences.

11:11That's also what's arising while we're also experiencing some of these other sensations. And sometimes it can help to lessen them. That is an outcome. But that's not what we're going for. We're working to develop a mind and a heart that has the capacity to be with whatever's here. It's not dependent on conditions changing outside of us or inside of us, but a mind that has a resilience and a capacity to really be with experiences even when they're difficult. help. So I hope that's helpful. All right, here's one from Julie. I find myself crying or wanting to cry often when I meditate. Can you help me understand why?

11:53One of the reasons I like this question, why it's landing with me, is because in many ways, our job isn't actually to know why something is arising when it comes, but to just let it be here when it does come. And in a way, what it's doing is it's moving from a mind that wants to figure things out in order to fix, possibly in order for it to go away, right? This is another one of those sneaky moves of the mind to want to understand, but often in order for it to change. So when crying comes, you can just recognize what are the sensations of crying, right? Maybe a little bit of pressure in the chest or the throat.

12:37Maybe there's some experience of tears. We can actually just be with the experience of crying and not have to even know why it's happening. And maybe something will come forward in the relaxation of that, in the ease of just letting it be there that allows your mind to understand something more about it. But maybe notice first, is it pleasant? Maybe there's something easeful happening with the crying. Or maybe there's something that brings some sadness or tension. We can just notice that too. It's really a culture shift, this meditation practice. It's inviting us not to use our minds to try and fix or figure things out, but to just learn how to trust and be with things as they are.

13:26And there's something, even though it can feel a little uncomfortable to start doing that, There's something sort of relieving that can start to happen when we're not trying to change an experience or even trying to understand it. But we're just letting ourselves sort of trust that, like all things in nature, an experience comes and then it goes. So the crying might come and then it goes, it changes. and I can understand, Julie, like it makes sense that you might want to know how come every time I sit down and go to meditate I cry or that happens. It's an understandable curiosity but we could just leave it as an open inquiry.

14:08See if maybe over time you start to understand something more about it or as you start to settle some days maybe it does happen and some days it doesn't. So just staying curious and maybe offering yourself a lot of care if it brings up some uncertainty in you when that arises. so rose z asked a question does it make a difference whether you do a guided meditation or just meditate on your own i have a lot of trouble sitting and trying to focus i know there's no wrong way to do it but i have a hard time finding the time every day for a five minute meditation i know that sounds crazy but it's very hard for me it's a little bit easier with a guided meditation, but I still find myself multitasking while the meditation teacher is walking you through the meditation.

14:58Could be my ADHD. I don't know, but I'm trying. Okay, thanks, Rose. So what I like about this question is, in some ways, it reveals that sense that if we're sitting in meditation, that there's sort of something that we should be doing and paying attention to. and so I have a lot of trouble sitting and trying to focus, right? So first of all, it doesn't make a difference whether you're listening to a silent meditation or a guided one. It's really more about what supports your mind to be aware, to come into the present moment, and to stay in the present moment. One of my favorite definitions of meditation comes from my teacher, Sayadaw Utejaniya.

15:44His definition is, meditation is cultivating wholesome states of mind. And that word wholesome might work for some of you or not others, but we could just say, you know, states of mind that are skillful, kind, wise, onward leading in a direction that we want to go. Most of us are here and most of us are cultivating this meditation practice because we We want to feel more patience, more kindness, more care. We want to feel more connected to ourselves and others, right? We're here to feel more of those feelings that we experience in our lives and to be able to navigate the difficult feelings with more ease and more skillfulness.

16:27What I love about that definition is that it says nothing about form. We can cultivate our mind and heart whether we're sitting on the cushion or we're moving about our day. So it can be helpful to have a practice and sit on the cushion. Yeah, I often think of it as a renunciation practice. We're putting down a lot of our life when we sit on the cushion, right? We're letting go of a lot of the things that we're holding throughout the day to just attend to the body or just attend to the mind. But that doesn't mean that we can't also be cultivating awareness all day long. And as we know, awareness allows us to come into more intimacy with our experience, right?

17:09So for Rose's question, it's not about meditation practice just being an experience where we sit on the cushion and we focus on one thing and we just listen to the sound of someone's voice or we just notice the breath. We can actually cultivate awareness while walking and multitasking. We're not cultivating necessarily focused mind or a calm mind. But focus and calm bring certain states and support. But what we're really doing here in this practice, at least in insight practice as I've come to understand it, is that we're cultivating awareness not as an end goal, but to understand more. Awareness is a tool.

17:53It's not the goal. If we could use that word goal, we would say understanding is the goal. We want to understand more about why we struggle. You want to feel more of what is actually happening for you when you're multitasking. If that's something that we do a lot of the day, we want to be able to be aware while we're multitasking. Maybe just paying attention to where the hands are. everything that you're picking up, everything that you're putting down. Or while you're moving about the kitchen or about the house, you're paying attention to what you can hear. This isn't sitting silently on the cushion, but this is cultivating awareness, and we can do that all day long.

18:37My teacher invites us from the moment we wake up until the moment we go to sleep, which gives us a much bigger on-ramp for cultivating our heart and mind if it's all day long, not just on the cushion. So, you know, for Rose, if it feels more comfortable to be walking around the house while listening to a guided meditation, I would say just see what you can be aware of while you're walking. So notice the feeling of your feet on the ground. or for any of us that have sight who are on this call that are able to see to use the eye door for seeing and some of us might not. Maybe there's just the ear door for hearing.

19:22But these are our sense doors, as we call them, that are happening all day long. We're hearing and potentially seeing from the moment we wake up until the moment we go to sleep. How much effort does it take right now to just recognize that you're hearing? Was that hard to do? Right? Yeah, not hard to do. Right, that was easy to do. Or how about just noticing that you're seeing, for those of you for whom you have sight, noticing that you're seeing right now. Just noticing, seeing. Yeah. Right, that doesn't take a lot of effort. Very light awareness to simply remember that you're seeing. to remember that you're hearing.

20:11We like to say awareness isn't hard. What's hard is to remember to be aware or to remember that you're seeing or hearing. As we start to come into more of a relationship with awareness as something that we can do all day long in an effortless way, we get to have the experience all day long of cultivating awareness, being available for that whole car ride as we talked about before. And then also by the time we end up getting on the cushion at the end of the day, or maybe we start the day, there's some momentum of awareness throughout the day that really supports us in that time on the cushion. They're really simpatico.

20:52They support each other. Okay. So we've just got a few minutes left. So remembering to be aware, Stephanie, is almost impossible for me. Thank you for saying that. How many people feel that way here? Yeah, I see some head nods. A lot, right? It can sometimes feel really hard to be aware, to remember to be aware. So here's what I would recommend, is you start with something that you do on a very regular basis. So often it's like, you know, you might start with brushing your teeth in the morning, or ideally we do it twice a day. So start with brushing your teeth and set that as an intention to be aware while brushing your teeth.

21:40You know, you can do things like be aware of what it feels like to be brushing your teeth. So you can be aware of the sensation of the toothbrush in your hand, of the sensations in your mouth. You can ask yourself questions like, what is my other hand doing? You can feel your body standing wherever you are. You can notice seeing if the eyes are open. You can notice hearing the sound of brushing your teeth. And if you start with that intention, I'd like to just be aware as much as I can when I'm brushing my teeth. That's twice a day for a few minutes each day that you could be cultivating awareness.

22:29Great, Stephanie. Yeah. So where you live, it's really common to have eye contact with somebody when you see them or say hi to them. I think that's what I just saw you, right? Yeah. When you're out walking. So you could just start with seeing and noticing that you're seeing when you see somebody, right? If you know that you're out walking a little bit every day, right? Some of you might be taking a dog for a walk. You're going to be holding onto a leash, maybe, or you're going to hear them, or you're going to see them, right? Something that you do on a regular basis, start folding in awareness into the things that you know you do every day.

23:04Maybe you open the same door every single day. I imagine many of you do, right? So as you move towards the handle and you feel it in your hand, that can be a moment of awareness.

23:18We want to make it sustainable and accessible and available so that you can have a relationship to awareness all day long. That's right, Barb. Yes, tuning into the cooing of the morning doves is awareness practice whenever the mind is there. Yeah, that's right. And what's beautiful is as you start to notice those moments of awareness that you're having already in your day all day long, you'll start noticing more of them. And you'll develop a momentum of that awareness that grows on itself. We say it's onward leading, right? It leads into more. So it is pretty profound. It's radical. If we start to recognize that we can be aware all throughout the day, suddenly our whole practice is not just limited to time on the cushion.

24:13And yes, we can be aware while talking. I do this all day long. I work with people one-on-one around their meditation practice, and so I'm cultivating throughout the day when I'm in conversation an ability to be aware. So I wouldn't say it's happened the whole time I've been talking to all of you, but a lot of it, there's an awareness of hearing the sound of my voice. I can feel my hand moving as I'm talking. I can feel my mouth moving into a smile, and I can feel my body in the chair at the same time that my mind is thinking quickly and words are coming out. Yeah, it is really possible, and it really changes our ability to be more intimate with ourselves and with all of life.

24:59You know, it creates potentially a more dimensional experience of our life day to day and moment to moment, doing the things that we really care about and being more present for them. I imagine that's why most of you are here. Thank you, everybody. It's really, really nice to be with you. Keep awareness close by.

25:30Thank you so much to Susa Talon. Don't forget to sign up for my meditation app, 10 % with Dan Harris. You'll be invited to our weekly sessions like the one you just heard in these sessions, which are live and on video. You can meditate with me or one of our great teachers and then get your questions answered. You hear me say this all the time, but it is so powerful to do this practice in the carpool lane. It's a great way to keep the momentum in your practice and to go deeper. The app has a growing library of meditations from world-class teachers. It's also the place to get this podcast without any ads.

26:06And further, it's a place to connect with other people who take this meditation practice seriously. There's a free 14-day trial if you want to try before you buy. DanHarris.com. Join the party. Finally, thank you so much to the people who work so hard to make this show. Our producers are Tara Anderson and Eleanor Vasili. Our recording and engineering is handled by the great folks over at Pod People. Lauren Smith is our managing producer. Marissa Schneiderman is our senior producer. DJ Kashmir is our executive producer. And Nick Thorburn of the band Islands wrote our theme.