Deena’s Birth Plan: Birthing Without the Bullsh*t - Autonomy, Advocacy, and Asking for What You Need

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16:10Deena:Okay, so why don't you tell us what you're specifically doing differently, what you've been reading on, because I know you're going into this really with intention. So what have you learned and what are you doing differently?

16:26Kristin:Yeah. And before we even get into that, I feel like I just want to say I had two very different birth experiences. Both were at home for my first two kids. The first one, because I knew nothing, I went in, even though things kind of, like I said, went a little bit off track, my mindset was, I can do this. I am made for this. And then it got crazy. With my second, because I already knew what was coming, I actually went into that birth pretty nervous, pretty scared. And I don't know if you remember, Kristen, a lot of the time I was just saying, I don't want to do this. I don't want this to be done.

17:05Kristin:I want this to be done. I don't like this. And so while I got through it, and that was kind of at that time, what I just where I was at, I also want to have a different experience. So this time around, I'm really focused on being intentional around my prep. And one of the big things that I'm working on is this fear, tension, pain cycle. So diving into this, when we go into labor and we feel scared, like I did the second time, honestly, our brain releases adrenaline and that blocks oxytocin, which is the hormone that actually helps labor progress. And it helps us bond. It helps us just feel better.

17:48Kristin:So fear actually leads to more pain and more pain leads to more fear and it becomes this loop. And I know I definitely had that last go around and the way we break it, it's through regulation. It's through intentional grounding and breathing. And there are actually things and tools that we can use to break that fear pain cycle.

18:14Deena:If I may, also for me, that tool is epidural. And for Dina, you have other tools because we all have different goals with our births. And one of Dina's goals is a home birth that is unmedicated, non-medicated. And that is the perfect birth for Dina. And the perfect birth for me is going in. And once I reach that fear pain cycle, I get an epidural and And there's no one right or wrong way to do it. But I am curious to hear the way that you are prepping because you are going to go to the end and how you do sort of break this like fear, tension, pain cycle.

18:59Kristin:Yeah. And by the way, I honestly never thought I was going to have a home birth. When I was pregnant with my first baby, I talked to like 10 different doulas and they'd be like, OK, describe your perfect birth or like what you want it to go like. and I'm like, okay, I'm in the hospital. The lights are really low. There's music playing. I'm on my hands and knees. You are keeping the doctors away. Nobody's talking to me. Nobody's touching me. They're like, girl, you're describing a home birth. And after like 10 people said it, I was like, let me look into this. So yeah, I think it has so much to do with me just being kind of like a sensitive person, if you will, who just wants to be left alone.

19:37Kristin:so yeah so I just like there's no trophy that I'm going for of like unmedicated birth you know and honestly everyone needs to do exactly what feels right to them so going into it my regulation is really about grounding my nervous system so this is about breathing this is about the way that I'm talking to myself. And for me, one of the most helpful things is to have that external kind of like reassurance of the midwife. And I've talked to her about this, which is part of my plan here is I'm going to look at you and I want you to reassure me that things are on track, that I am safe. Hearing that is going to allow me to tap into some of the things that help me feel safer, which is like my body's made for this.

20:36Kristin:And I think the biggest one for me, honestly, is every contraction is bringing me closer to meeting my baby. And that's it. I'm just going to mantra that over and over and pair it with breathing.

20:48Deena:I'm triggered because I did hypno babies, not to shout out hypno babies. I'm sure there's like a thousand different programs. It just didn't work for me. I'm going to be honest, probably because I wasn't as committed And I knew like, I'm just an epidural girly and that's okay. But I do think that that works for some people. I know it works for a lot of people, by the way, the whole like each contraction. With me, I was just like, I'm gonna die. And I would like you to stop this pain right now. Thank you.

21:14Kristin:I'll be honest. I mean, it is, it's very painful to give birth. And what I've realized with both of them now, because the same thing happened, the moment the words came out of my mouth of, I can't do this anymore. I was one minute away from meeting my baby both times.

21:32Deena:Yeah, not me. I remember being there and it being, I thought I was doing it on medicated because blah, blah, blah. Right. But I was in a hospital, thank God. And I had a safe word with my doula and the safe word was Mexico because it was a very strict program that I did. It's very different than what you're doing, Dina. It was a very strict program where you're like not supposed to talk about pain. You're not supposed to say the word pain. You're not supposed to say contraction, whatever. And so I wasn't even supposed to say the word epidural. I had to say a safe word. And so we're like, you know, we're real at the beginning here.

22:09Deena:And I am just like Mexico, Mexico, Mexico, Mexico. And she's like, well, you know, blah, blah, blah. And they check me and I'm at a three. And I'm like, if somebody doesn't get me an epidural right fucking now. that's right to I'm gonna freak out for me it was not right before I met the baby it was real early on in the experience that I was ready to say I'm I'm I call it I gave that one a really valiant effort too like the goal was to get as far as I could go and that was as far as I could go

22:36Kristin:again there's like truly no no trophy in this no you should do exactly what feels right so I'm proud of you for being like you know what I'm gonna be flexible throw this out the window here's what I need. That's right. Epidural is great. And if you don't do the epidural, I'm not saying why it does hurt. It does hurt.

22:55Deena:I know. I can attest to that too. Unwillingly. I have also done that. Yes. I'm the last one.

23:00Kristin:I was there. Like we talked to the entire staff. We were like, listen, there's only one thing that matters today. And it's getting this girl an epidural when we need it. And somehow they gave it to you too late. Yeah. Let's get back to you. Okay. So the other big thing that I'm doing to prepare for this birth is really one yes trusting my body I can do this I was made for this but also being flexible which is like really really hard for me as a human you know me I'm a rigid ass person like being flexible is tough but I think part of my preparation my birth plan if you will is to be flexible because no matter how this baby comes out like that's going to be the right way.

23:46Kristin:And I'm going to lean into that. So plan is be at home. We're doing the breathing. We're doing the mantras. The moment if something were to shift and we have any concerns, I am mentally ready to be like, okay, we will transport. We will head to the hospital. That will be the right move. And any way this baby needs to come out, that's the right way.

24:09Deena:I think that that's where a lot of us look back and have regrets because we were so focused on the birth being one specific way with our exact birth plan. And when it goes off track, that is where real fear comes in. And that fear is totally valid. Like it is really scary to suddenly have, this is a medical, we are in the hospital, is your baby on the line? And I do think that being prepared with some flexibility can take a little bit of that fear and trauma away after just a little bit, just a little bit, because when you're going in and you have the one mindset and suddenly that all of these possibilities for the very first time are being sprung on you, that's terrifying.

25:02Deena:Like that's traumatic right there. The flexibility and just the knowledge of things, you know, could go differently and that's okay is really comforting in the end.

25:15Kristin:Yeah, I completely agree with you. And the last thing that I'm doing to really get prepared, feel like I'm going in confident is kind of like a flexibility thing, but it's really giving myself permission to say and do like whatever I need in the moment without feeling shame or guilt about it. So if I'm like, you know what, everyone just be quiet, then that's okay. Hell yeah, girl. That's right. And if in my case, my kids may be there, I've prepped everybody.

25:49Deena:I know. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about the way. Let's just stop. just stop right there okay let's just stop why have we made the entire podcast about this okay your kids are what are we doing your kids are four and three that's right four and three and you have prepped them i have prepped them and they're to be there yeah let us see the scene of this because you're not a you're not actually a tub home birth person because i've seen this with my own eyes. So normally those of us who have seen it from afar, it's like a tub and you're at home for you. It's a shower curtain on the floor. Is that correct for this one as well?

26:29Deena:If I may see something that won't ruin your rug. Okay. And there's like, that's like low lights. There's some soft music happening. Very soft by the way. And now your four-year-old and your three-year-old will be there with Mike and his wife. Is that the scene?

26:47Kristin:That's the scene. All right? Okay. And my mom might be there. Okay. Yeah. We'll see. So basically what we've prepped is, well, obviously what birth is going to be like. And so we've gone through like, mommy might be screaming. Mommy might, you know, be quiet. I'll be breathing, but like getting a baby out is a lot of hard work. It doesn't always feel good for a mom. So I'm like being really honest with age appropriate language here. And then I've also prepped them to be flexible. Like there is a, there is a chance that mommy's going to need some private space to get the baby out. And if that's the case, then grandma's going to take you and play with you.

27:28Kristin:So yeah, like mine's maybe a little more complex even because my kids are there, but everyone's ready to pivot if I say we need to. And I felt like that was a really important part for me. And you know, like the last go around, I just remember looking at my husband being like, shut the fuck up. Oh yeah, girl. That's like all I would say.

27:50Deena:And I felt really bad because he was doing a really good job, but he's the only one that I can just be like, stop fucking touching me. Stop touching me. Don't do that. Get a washcloth. God damn it. Get a washcloth. Why aren't you focusing? Like, why don't you know what I need right now? We got a lot of washcloths. A lot. That was really a perfect race. I know. You remember that? And like, oh my God. My question for you is how are you going to stay in the zone? Because I know that like the zone has to happen. Allegedly, I never, I never could achieve a zone, but allegedly there's a zone. And I know that you're the one who can tap into those kinds of zones.

28:22Deena:And how will you stay in the zone with your kids there? Like, have you thought about that yet?

28:30Kristin:No, actually, I have thought about that. And that's been part of our prep is making sure that they understand mommy is not going to be available. That's literally how I've said it to mommy is not going to be available. If you feel scared, if it feels too intense, you can go to daddy, you can go to grandma, and they will be there to help you. And if you ever want to leave, you can leave with grandma. So I feel like I've made it really clear that like I am not available. I'm pushing out a baby, which is hard work. And if they have needs, like they can go to the other two trusted caregivers who are going to be there to help.

29:07Deena:They're very intuitive kids. They're very, very like connected kids. So and your birth goes fast, I will say, to have been there. So I think it might be a little bit different. It might be.

29:22Kristin:but like that's that's what I've prepped for is plan c is like hey grandma like love these boys boys I love you I will see you in a little bit like get them out of here you know what I mean

29:33Deena:I hope they make it I'm so curious I can't wait to find out if they make it through the whole thing

29:38Kristin:me too last time the other one was sleeping so I know yeah but we've definitely had to talk through like if mommy is screaming, like that's really normal. Yeah. Well, you're, he didn't wake up last time cause you weren't. No, that was weird. The first time I screamed my head off, like we lived in a townhouse and I felt bad for all of our neighbors. Cause I'm sure it was echoing through the walls. And the second time I just remember the midwife, I was like pushing the baby out. She's like, make a noise. And I was like, make a noise. She's like, make a noise, make a primal noise. Go ahead. And I was like, okay.

30:12Kristin:Yeah. There's like one.

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33:42Deena:So now let's shift just a little bit because I'm so curious about how you're also preparing for this baby. Let's say just like right after the fact, because I know in the past, You've been very vocal, which is amazing because so many other women have been in this situation where you were really unsupported directly after the birth, in the weeks after the birth. So is there something that you're doing prep-wise to prevent that part from happening? Yeah.

34:11Kristin:I mean, the biggest thing that comes to mind is me and Mike. That was the biggest challenge. And I don't know if you've listened to other episodes where I like really spill it all, but basically we were going off of love and good vibes of like we love each other so much of course we'll be great co-parents together and work as a team and like it could not have gone worse where he literally just like went back to work it was me with a crying hungry baby and I was just I couldn't get up and get water or food because I actually did bleed quite a bit I needed to stay laying down. And so it just became a mess where I was like, my needs are not getting met.

34:57Kristin:I am completely alone here. And this just sucks. This is not the happy family experience that I really imagined was like being so overjoyed that our baby is here. Instead, I felt super isolated. So definitely worked really hard to a get her marriage back on track after all that, because that took a lot of hard work and be now proactively get prepared for this to be different. And part of that is we have systems set up now. And the system really is that me and baby are worth a priority in those beginning days. He's actually going to take time off, but also in a realistic way, because I, part of, part of our marriage working is we both have to be able to be ourselves 100 ourselves and the way Mike is wired whoa whoa whoa let's hold the

35:57Deena:phone here okay part of the way your marriage works I would argue any marriage works is say

36:05Kristin:say it again you both have to be a hundred percent yourselves compromise is not a 50 50 thing where you're reducing your needs down to 50 % to appease the other person. It's you're both a hundred percent yourselves and learning how to work together to get everybody's needs met. Wow. Yeah.

36:28Deena:Continue. Okay. Now we're putting this into practice knowing what Mike needs and what you need. What does he need that we're like, we're being flexible on?

36:37Kristin:It might be a little unconventional. I'm going to be honest, but this is what we've realized is going to real life, worked for us. Good for you. Okay. Brace yourself. Baby and I are the priority period in those early days. I'm not going to be getting out of bed. Mike has to be ready to take care of the boys. He's going to be wiping every butt, getting every snack, whatever they need. They can either be in the bed with me. And if they need something, that's Mike. If I need something, that's Mike. And here's the unconventional part maybe is he is going to have time to check in with me and see if it's an okay time for him to go check his emails or have work phone calls for one hour at a time.

37:29Kristin:But he has to make sure that I'm stable. It is an okay time. I say yes or I say no. Not right now. And then the other thing is he really wants to be able to work out, which I mean, yeah, like if that's going to keep him feeling fulfilled and restored and present for the rest of the time he's with this family, like fantastic. Go take 45 minutes, go work out, come back and be present with us.

37:56Deena:Absolutely.

37:57Kristin:That's a big part of what we're doing. And then the other part is I'm super fortunate. My mom's going to come out for a few weeks to help us just with food. and I made that really clear too like your job is to help with food and to help with dishes like

38:11Deena:thank you so much I love you it's huge though that's huge like half the battle is like yeah how do you eat and with what and the spoon and the dishes and I'm sure she'll help with like take the trash out you know like the dog and stuff like and it sounds so simple to an outsider you're

38:25Kristin:like what food like that's not hard that was actually one of the worst things in my first birth was just the food part. And like for some reason, you know, I love to cook. I really had it in my mind that I was going to like stock up my freezer. I wish I had. I just didn't have the energy. And then we didn't do that. So I was like, well, we'll just order food. And guess who had to order the food like Mike did? And guess who didn't order the food? Mike didn't. And I just remember at a certain point with him like juggling work and me texting being like hey I'm really hungry like can you bring some water some food and he'd be like yeah no problem an hour would go by literally one hour away I mean this is why things got so bad but yes well I'm proud of you guys I

39:13Deena:mean this is your moment this is your time baby number three if I may is so healing and cathartic because you get time in the space to be like, okay, this may or may not be my last one, by the way. Oh, you've done it two times before. You get to soak in what you soak in. You advocate for what you need. You've done this before. And I just hope and wish for a wonderful healing newborn phase. I think a lot of people have a healing third, and that's not always the case. But I've heard from a lot of my friends because it's like at a certain point, I don't know what it is. Maybe you just don't have as much fucks to give.

39:54Deena:I don't know. You just go for what you need unapologetically. You know, you're just like, this is what I need and this is how I'm going to get it. And you set it up in advance. Really?

40:03Kristin:I did too. I think you've also stretched your bandwidth of the chaos that you can handle and know you can get through. Like having two little kids, you're like, life is chaotic and we find ways to thrive in it.

40:17Deena:When Fox had, he was maybe six weeks old and he had RSV. Do you know how it wasn't, it's a bloop on the radar, just a little blip on the radar. I didn't even, I called the doctor, but I didn't even end up taking him in. Cause it was like, he was going to get sick from something else. If I did, it was like wheezing. I would have literally checked. Like, I don't even know how I'd have to check you into a hospital. No, really. And with three, not that that's not serious because it is RSV is very serious, but you know, I would like do all the checks that I was supposed to do. I was right on top of it.

40:51Deena:I kept him really close. I did all of the protocols, but it didn't completely send me because you've been through hand, foot, mouth. You've been through croup. I had taken my first to the hospital a hundred times with low oxygen. I kind of do. And so it's just all the things that really you panic over them with the first two you can kind of settle into with third and it's pretty healing to be honest yeah motherhood makes

41:15Kristin:you stronger than you've ever ever realized you could be am i stronger or am i so tired i don't

41:21Deena:care as much but like in a good way you know what i mean i just i i think both are true i think both are true right i'm more resilient i'm stronger and i just i only have so many fucks i can give and i've always said that but now the fucks i can give are at like uh just like a pinpoint i got like a thimble. I got a thimble amount of effort.

41:44Kristin:And for me in particular too, now that we can kind of talk about like the postpartum phase, which was really, really hard for me the first times. I mean, this is more for me specifically, I think being autistic too, which is being out of my routine is so stressful to me. And when you have a newborn, you literally can't be in routine. Like everything is so unpredictable and for me, like at times overwhelming. And I feel like I'm coming into this now so much more prepared as to like what to expect, you know? So at least I'm more ready for the chaos that's about to ensue and have a few things that I'm building in.

42:32Kristin:Like I'm going to have my earplugs really close and on standby for like the loud crying moments. And having lived through what that kind of postpartum looks like where they're like eating, they're sleeping. And that's kind of all they're doing. Like I'm ready to build a different kind of routine. And even just mentally preparing for that has put me so much at ease.

42:55Deena:And for the besties that don't know, Dina has been diagnosed with autism. them. We have an episode on it. So she's not joking. Oh, that was a joke. I think that we're joking. We're like, Oh, I'm autistic. No, Dina was diagnosed with autism. And I think that's a really good point because everyone's postpartum experience is really different and what they need is really different. And I think that a lot of people feel shame over it or that they should have a postpartum. That's just like somebody else's. And I, I just remember with your second, because, okay, with your first, you took no time off and you thought you could just like bounce a baby and work at the same time.

43:29Deena:And it was chaos. Okay. So you kind of learned your lesson, right? And we were like, Gina, you're having a maternity leave. And I just remember on your maternity leave, you were really struggling. And I remember you bringing, bringing your brand new newborn baby to your usual work spot, your usual work cafe, sitting down with like a laptop. And that wasn't necessarily the right answer either. But I think now with the autism diagnosis, we understand what that was, where you're trying, you're feeling really uncomfortable being out of your usual routine. And you were trying anything you could do, even though it didn't really make sense from the outside.

44:12Deena:And it wasn't necessarily working either, because it's not the same. And now that you have the diagnosis, how amazing, because you can prepare for that in advance and maybe come up with a different, better routine now that you know that that's what you're going to need afterwards.

44:27Kristin:It's funny you bring that up because that's actually part of the preparation is like, I will probably go to that exact cafe, but I'm not going to be working. I'm not even going to think about working. I'm just going to go hang out there and just have a moment, but be there because I kind of need to be in my routine to feel settled and comfortable. Yeah.

44:47Deena:Which is so different than a lot of other people. Like for my maternity leave, I just want to sit on the couch and watch the crown. And that's what I did. I didn't leave the couch. And when my other kids were at school, like it was glorious. I don't want to ever leave. I didn't leave my house for 90 days. So we're all different. And to just be unapologetically yourself and figure out what you need. Thank you for sharing. I am so excited for you. I'm so excited for this little baby. Do we have a name? Don't share it here. But like, do you have a name? Is it completely settled, Dina? It is.

45:18Kristin:Okay, good. thank god I and I told my mom last night and she hates it so we're right on track three for three

45:26Deena:with all babies so it's the right name is what you mean it means it's approved it's approved that's the right answer okay well besties thank you for joining us this was delightful because I as much as birth was really hard I do love talking about it and I'm bummed I'm not going to do it again.

45:45Kristin:But also, you know, it is it's a really special experience special in so many ways. And if you're going into it, bestie, I hope that you can trust to put your needs first. You matter. Your voice matters. What you want matters. Even if the people around you don't agree with it, it's your experience. So advocate for yourself because you are worth it. You deserve it.

46:10Deena:yes girl and beyond birth how about that how about this great takeaway let's all go tell people our needs right now i need a coffee i need a nap oh let's do that i want a nap too okay that sounds better all right i wish we could dina i love you i love you and i'll talk to you in three minutes and besties we'll talk to you next week that's right see you soon oh go grab our go grab our play kits available at target yes and tag us in it hello we're like the worst we're two present. We're just we're just pretending to be real people, but we we don't know what we're doing. Maybe grab a play kit. They're awesome.

46:49Kristin:They're awesome. And they really they really work. They really tackle the tough behaviors.

46:55Deena:Do my children literally started sharing and mirroring what the play kit, the little monster in the play kit was saying. They started saying the sharing phrases instead of annihilating each other. They really do work.

47:07Kristin:It's what it's designed for.

47:11Deena:All right. Go to Target. We love you. We love you. Love you and see you soon.

47:39Kristin:Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.