Ruby Ridge Standoff | Northern Exposure | 2

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0:21podcasts. It's January 17th, 1991, in the mountains of northern Idaho. Randy Weaver helps his wife Vicki off the back of their snowmobile and into their pickup truck, which is parked just below their property on Ruby Ridge. Before he climbs into the truck himself, Randy takes a quick look around, scanning the trees for any movement. But the snowy forest is silent. Six months ago, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives approached Randy with a deal. The ATF wanted him to pass along information about his friends in the Aryan Nations, a white supremacist neo-Nazi group. In return, they promised to drop charges stemming from an illegal sale of sawed-off shotguns.

1:06Randy refused to cooperate, though, and a month ago, he was indicted. But so far, he's refused to turn himself in and has instead remained at his family's remote mountain compound. But now the Weavers are running low on supplies and Randy and Vicki have no choice but to head into town.

1:25Randy starts up the truck and pulls out onto the highway. All right, Vicki, what do we need from the store? I figure it needs to last at least another month. Well, the best bang for the buck is potatoes. Probably get two of the 50-pound sacks. Milk for the kids, feed for the chickens. I need oil for the chainsaw and a few other things. We've only got 25 bucks, though. You think we can make do with just one sack of potatoes? Well, I could talk to the store owner, see if he could give us a deal. Maybe he's got a beat-up bag no one else wants. We can put the kids to work and cut off the bad parts.

1:57As they continue down the highway, Randy thinks about how dire their financial situation has become. They're talking about buying half-rotten food just to feed their kids. Honey, I don't know how much longer we can go on like this. All the money we save from back in Iowa is gone. Selling firewood for a few bucks a bundle isn't cutting it. At some point, I might need to get a real job in town. But that's out of the question. The feds would see your name pop up in the system and you'd be arrested in a week. The only safe place for you is up on the mountain. But we gotta eat. God will deliver us a path he always does.

2:31As Randy considers his wife's words, he spots a pickup truck towing a camper broken down on the side of the road. You think those folks need help? I'd be Christian to find out. Randy pulls to the side of the road and parks 20 yards in front of the broken down pickup. Its hood is popped open, and in the rearview mirror, Randy can see a young couple hunched over the engine. All right, why don't you wait here? Leaving Vicki behind in the truck, Randy hops out and begins walking toward the couple. Hey, you need some help? I used to work on John Deere's. Kind of handy with an engine. But as Randy nears the truck, the young man by the car suddenly spins around and points a pistol at Randy's head.

3:11He screams that he's a federal agent and Randy is under arrest. Randy turns back to his truck, but a female officer is already sticking a gun through Vicki's half-open window. Hey, leave her alone. She's got nothing to do with this, Vicky. You don't tell him anything. A second later, Randy is tackled to the ground. As he lies on his belly with a knee in his back, Randy watches his wife be dragged from their pickup. He thinks about his three children back up on the mountain all alone, and he wonders when he'll get to see them again. He starts to think that maybe he should have made that deal with the ATF.

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5:21In the early 1980s, Christian fundamentalists Randy and Vicki Weaver began to have visions of impending Armageddon. So they uprooted their young family from their home in Iowa and moved to a cabin in the remote mountains of northern Idaho. There, they prepared themselves for what they believed would be the final battle with the forces of evil. The apocalypse never came. But Randy and his family stayed in their mountain retreat, convinced that the federal government wanted to oppress white Christians like them. So they felt vindicated when they were arrested on the side of the highway. Vicki was quickly released, but Randy was arraigned in court.

5:57It was there that a crucial misunderstanding occurred. The part-time magistrate who handled the hearing left Randy confused, and when he was released on bail, he returned home certain that if he lost at trial, he'd be forced to sell his family home to cover his legal fees. This wasn't true, but it would be just the first in a series of blunders and misconceptions by both Randy Weaver and the federal government. These were errors that would have deadly consequences. This is Episode 2, Northern Exposure.

6:30It's January 1991 inside the Weaver's cabin on Ruby Ridge. Vicki Weaver sits at the kitchen table, looking through a pile of letters just dropped off at the cabin by a neighbor. She tosses aside a few pieces of junk mail and past due bills she knows the family will never likely pay. But then one envelope catches her eye. It's from the federal courthouse in Coeur d 'Alene, where Randy appeared before a judge last week. Vicki tears it open. The letter inside confirms the date of Randy's trial. But something's not right. It says the hearing is due to start on March 20th. She could have sworn Randy said the judge gave him a date of February 19th.

7:08So Vicki calls across the room to where Randy is kicked back in a recliner, cleaning one of his rifles. Setting the gun aside, Randy joins Vicki at the table. She shows him the letter, and Randy is just as confused as she is. Everything about his arrest is seared into his memory, and he's certain this date is meant to be February 19th. He lets out a deep sigh. He's going to have to drive down to Coeur d 'Alene and find out what the real date is. But as Randy goes to pick up his winter coat from the back of the chair, Vicki grabs him by the arm. She tells him he can't go anywhere near that courthouse.

7:41The feds are clearly out for him. First, they set Randy up on a phony gun charge, and now they're playing games with the trial date. This letter isn't a mistake. They're trying to trick Randy so they'll have an excuse to break up the family and take their land away. Vicki reminds Randy that this is exactly why they moved to the mountain, to protect themselves. What he needs to do is stay here, prepare for the worst, and most of all, keep praying. This seems to convince Randy. He sits back down at the table, tells Vicki he's lucky to have such a strong-minded woman of faith at his side. Because she's right, he's not going to set foot in a federal building ever again, and he's certainly not going to give himself up for trial.

8:19Vicki takes her husband's hand. She closes her eyes, and they begin to pray, asking God to protect them from all the agents of the devil trying to do them harm.

8:31In the weeks leading up to the trial, the Weavers refuse to come down from the mountain. They don't even communicate with their court-appointed lawyer. Instead, Vicki sends a scathing and at times bizarre letter to the U.S. Attorney's Office in Idaho. It's addressed to the servant of the Queen of Babylon and warns the government that war is upon the land and the tyrant's blood will flow. It's soon after that the court date arrives and when Randy fails to show up, he officially becomes a fugitive from the law. The job of bringing him in falls to Deputy U.S. Marshal Dave Hunt. Hunt is a former Marine who started out in law enforcement as a regular cop before transferring to the Marshal Service 15 years ago.

9:12And at first, Hunt is not too concerned about the Weaver case. He's dealt with these types of fugitives before. Stubborn, anti-government survivalists are not that rare in Idaho. But when Hunt meets with his boss, the chief deputy marshal in Boise, he hears a different point of view. The chief deputy has been spooked by Vicki's letter. He worries that the Weaver's extreme religious beliefs will lead them to kill themselves and their children rather than surrender willingly. Taking Randy by force may be the only option. What Hunt pushes back, he wants a chance to negotiate with the Weavers before any tactical team is sent in.

9:46Eventually, he and his boss settle on a compromise. Hunt will be given time to reason with Randy, but he won't be allowed to risk approaching the property directly. Instead, he'll have to use intermediaries to communicate with the Weavers. It'll be safer that way. So in late February 1991, Hunt begins passing letters to the family through the Weaver's neighbor, Bill Grider. But when Hunt receives Randy's replies, they're full of the same defiant, radical language as the letter Vicki sent to the courthouse. After more than a month of this, Hunt begins to grow impatient with Randy's stubborn refusal to surrender, and so he pays a visit to the neighbor, Bill Grider, to discuss what to do next.

10:28Snow still clings to the ground, and their breath fogs the air as Dave Hunt and Bill Grider walk through the quiet woods near Grider's cabin. Hunt nods further up the mountain toward the Weebers' property on Ruby Ridge. Were you able to get that last letter up to Randy? Yeah, I sure did. I even stood up there in the cabin while he read it. I heard his reply. Oh, what'd he say? Well, I don't want to repeat all the profanity, but safe to say he's not had a change of heart. Man, I don't get it. I told him he could keep his land, and he'd barely do any time on the charges. Juries around here usually go easy on minor gun charges.

11:03He just doesn't trust you. He thinks it's all some kind of trick. Well, maybe if I go up there and look him in the eye, I'll get a better response. Oh, I'm not sure that's a good idea. Assuming you want to come back in 1P settings. You really think he'd shoot me? I'd come alone, make sure he knows I'm just there to talk. Well, like I said, Randy thinks this is all a big conspiracy to take away his land and break up his family. He's convinced that if you ever got his hands on him, he'd be going away for a long time. And I think he'd rather die than let that happen. But what about Vicki? I mean, surely she doesn't want her kids caught up in some sort of shootout.

11:38Maybe she could talk some sense into him. Oh no, she's just the same, maybe even worse. Hell, one of the kids might even take a shot at you. God, who are these people? I mean, in all my years on the job, I've never known a family like this. Well, in all honesty, Marshall, I don't know what you hope to achieve here. He's not coming down off that mountain, no matter how nicely you ask. As Dave Hunt walks back to his car, he feels more frustrated than ever. He's beginning to doubt if his plan to bring Randy in voluntarily will ever work. Maybe his boss in Boise was right, and it's time to start planning a way to bring him in by force.

12:18By the summer of 1991, Randy Weaver has been a fugitive for nearly six months. U.S. Deputy Marshal Dave Hunt has come to the conclusion that he's unlikely ever to surrender peacefully. Still, Hunt is wary of storming the cabin. He's concerned that Vicki Weaver or their three children may be caught in the crossfire. And to make the situation even more precarious, he's learned that Vicki is now several months pregnant. So Hunt decides he has no choice but to continue with his cautious approach. For the next six months, he turns his focus to other cases while still occasionally trying to communicate with the Weavers through intermediaries.

12:55But then in the spring of 1992, the Weaver case suddenly becomes a priority again. The national media starts taking an interest in the story. They're fascinated by the eccentric survivalist family holed up in their ramshackle cabin, thumbing their noses at the feds. Outlets from around the country request interviews with Weaver, but he declines them all. Eventually, TV journalist Geraldo Rivera resorts to flying a helicopter over Ruby Ridge to get footage. But when the crew on board hears popping noises outside, they mistakenly think they're being shot at by the Weavers. And this story of a chopper under fire only draws more attention to the authorities' failure to bring Randy Weaver in.

13:36So the Marshal's service decides something must be done. On March 27, 1992, a meeting is held at the Marshal's National Headquarters in Arlington, Virginia. Art Roderick, a deputy marshal, pulls up a chair inside a large conference room. Looking around the table, he sees more than a dozen of the country's highest-ranking marshals, including the agency's new acting director, Henry Hudson. The meeting kicks off with a briefing from the lead marshal in Idaho. Roderick listens closely as the agent lays out the long timeline of the case, which by now has dragged on for more than a year with no resolution in sight.

14:12Next to speak is the head of the Marshall's elite special operations group. His team has conducted some surveillance of the Weaver property, but he warns that even with all the resources and expertise at his disposal, any attempt to storm the cabin would carry an enormous risk. Finally, acting Director Hudson takes the floor. He confesses that he's so concerned about the case that he plans to take the extraordinary step of calling the U.S. Attorney for Idaho with a proposal. He thinks the attorney should publicly drop the charges against Weaver, wait for him to let his guard down, then secretly indict him again.

14:45When Weaver thinks he's safe and ventures out from the property on his own, then they can make the arrest without endangering his family. But unfortunately, there's a good chance that the idea is a non-starter, as a U.S. attorney might deem it unethical. So Hudson is open to any other proposals from around the table. At first, no one speaks. Then Roderick raises his hand. He explains that he's been studying the case and has put together a three-part plan to bring Weaver in. It goes like this. First, he and a few hand-picked colleagues will travel to Idaho to scout the area, talk to Weaver's friends and neighbors, and take one last shot at negotiating through an intermediary.

15:23Then, assuming Weaver rebuffs them once again, the team will spend several weeks surveilling the property with state-of-the-art long-lens video cameras. This will allow the team to find patterns in the Weaver's daily routine. And finally, in phase three, they will use that information to anticipate a moment when Weaver ventures away from his family, and then they make the arrest. When Roderick is finished, the room is silent. He looks at the faces of his colleagues, trying to gauge their response. He knows his proposal will take plenty of manpower, money, and most of all, patience. And with the agency's ballooning PR crisis, that is running thin among the bosses.

16:00But then Director Hudson speaks up. He says that Roderick's put forth the best idea so far, so he tells him to submit a list of marshals for his team and start executing phase one of the plan as soon as possible. With that, Roderick quickly gathers his briefcase and heads toward the exit. He's got a flight to Idaho to catch, and he just hopes the weeks or months away from home that lie ahead will pay off, that they'll be able to bring Randy Weaver down from the mountain without anyone getting hurt.

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17:38In March of 1992, U.S. Marshal Art Roderick and his team begin implementing his three-part plan to study, observe, and ultimately arrest Randy Weaver. The operation is given the codename Northern Exposure. After arriving in Idaho, Roderick starts by speaking with Weaver's friends and neighbors. He wants to gain some insight into the unusual family's thinking. The marshals then make one last-ditch effort to negotiate with Weaver through intermediaries. But by mid-April, it's clear to Roderick that Weaver still has no intention of surrendering to the authorities. So Roderick orders his team of marshals to move on to Phase 2 of the operation.

18:18They spend several weeks quietly setting up motion-detecting video cameras in the woods surrounding the Weaver property on Ruby Ridge. By mid-May, Roderick and his men have almost completed their surveillance and are ready to move on to the next stage when their colleague in the Marshal's service, Dave Hunt, pays a visit to their makeshift base camp.

18:39The Marshal's headquarters has been set up in a barn on a property near the Weaver's. Dave Hunt slides back a door and steps inside. In a corner of the barn is a table equipped with the latest surveillance technology, and there Hunt finds Art Roderick standing over a bank of video monitors. Hey, W. Marshall, tell me you have good news. Hey, Dave, good to see you. Why don't you take a look for yourself? Roderick types into his desktop computer, bringing up still images of each member of the Weaver family on the monitors. You're familiar with most of our players here? Randy, Vicky, the kids? Oh, look there, and the three dogs.

19:15Yeah, they could actually be a problem, especially the Labrador. where he seems to roam free, barking at anything that moves. Hunt taps on the screen. And who's this? That's Kevin Harris. 25 years old, longtime family friend. More like an adopted son, I guess. He's living at the cabin full time now. Oh God, just what we need. One more guy who might shoot at us. Yeah, and we've run the numbers. Randy is seen carrying a weapon in about 70 % of the footage. Vicky is armed half the time, and that's even when she's holding the baby. Kevin Harris is, I don't know, something like two-thirds of the time.

19:49What about the kids? Sarah's 16, and she's packing around 30 % of the time. The same goes for 10-year-old Rachel. The one that worries me the most is the 14-year-old boy, Samuel, or Sammy, they call him. He's armed in 80 % of our footage. That's even more than his dad. Hans shakes his head. Remember what it was like at that age, 14 years old? Jesus. Bundle of hormones and a head full of dumb ideas. You know, when this all started, I was worried that the kids would be caught in the crossfire. But now I'm getting scared they might be the ones doing the shooting. And they know we're coming for them, too.

20:22We've been working at night and hiding our equipment as best we can, but Samuel and Kevin, they found one of our cameras in the woods and destroyed it. Another time, someone let out the air of my tires. All right, so they know we're here. Does that give us any chance we're going to get up to the cabin without being seen? That's going to be tough. Roderick brings up a collection of photos, displaying various sections of the property. They've started daily patrols and rarely stray more than a few hundred feet from the cabin. They've obviously got the advantage of the high ground, and they're using these boulders here as natural bunkers as well, stashing guns and ammunition behind them.

20:58Well, Randy has special forces training. I can't say I'm shocked by these tactics. They've also set up a barricade of rocks and logs near the entrance. Whenever they hear a vehicle nearby, one of them grabs a weapon and then heads down to the driveway, while another sits up at this boulder here, ready to provide cover fire. Jesus, it's like a mountain fortress. Is there any hope of resolving this without bloodshed? Well, maybe. One thing we've noticed is that the family does occasionally open the barricade to let neighbors drive through on the old logging road. So we know they're at least cordial with some of the people living around there.

21:31The idea we've come up with is for one of my guys to go undercover and pose as a new neighbor building his own cabin. Over time, he'll befriend Randy, and then he'll find a moment to get him alone. And then we'll arrest him and bring him in. You make it sound easy. Oh, no, I know it's not. But I figure it's the best shot we've got at ending this with cuffs and not coffins. Dave Hunt looks over the computer monitors, trying to imagine how this arrest might go down. He wishes he shared Roderick's optimism. Making an arrest anywhere near the property sounds incredibly risky. But Hunt understands it's probably the best possible plan considering the circumstances.

22:10He just hopes Roderick knows what he's doing.