Talk Your Book: How Not To Invest Like Buffett

28:44So I would encourage anybody listening to read the book. It's more important in 2025 than it was in 2024, right? Yeah. Talk about dumb luck. I always quote - All right, Barry. Appreciate the time. Who do you always quote? Son of a bitch. By the way, all - Oscar hook. Play the music, Daniel. Right? I literally had Michael's eye roll in the back of my head as a lot of those chapters were written. Like, yeah, you heard that story before. Too bad. It's a good one. It's going in the book. All right. So in closing, Barry, what would you like to say to our listeners? I'm just going to channel the great Charlie Ellis.

29:22You know, Vanguard board of directors, chairman of the Yale Endowment. he drew the parallel between investing and tennis. Most of us are not professional tennis players. Those guys win by scoring points, hitting with power precision. They score aces. They keep the ball away from their opponent. Amateurs lose through unforced errors. We hit the ball into the net. We hit it long. We hit it wide. We double fault. Investing is the same thing. Instead of trying to pick the next in video or market time or whatever, just make fewer mistakes you'll be so much better off than everybody else. Well said.

30:01Thank you, Barry. Thanks, guys.

30:06Okay, that was fun talking to Barry. That's the first time we've had on Animal Spirits, obviously. And now here's our talk with Alex Morris.

30:17Alex, welcome to Animal Spirits. Thank you for having me. Fan, excited to be on. Oh, thank you for that. All right, so you did something really interesting with your new book. You went back through the archives of all the Berkshire meetings going back to 1994. You plucked out the best lessons. You laid it out in a way that is digestible for readers. I'm curious, when you saw that they released the archive, did you go back and then you were like, hey, wait a minute, I should turn this into a book? Or immediately, did you think, I'm going to write a book. I'm going to go back. What was the thought process like?

30:52It took me a couple of years to kind of connect the dots from when they, when they released it, I thought this is really interesting that they're doing it. And I always loved as a young investor, Larry Cunningham, Cunningham's book, which is the essays of Warren Buffett was a book that I loved. And I read all the time and still have a dog-eared copy on my desk. So I think I immediately thought there's probably something here. I also thought somebody else would probably do it. And I also So that was going to be a lot of work to get it done. So at first, I was just going through it more for kind of personal interest.

31:24And then after a handful of years, especially after someone from Harriman House reached out to me about writing a book, I thought, OK, maybe I actually should do this. How long did it take you to figure out how to compartmentalize the different? Because you do a great job in the book of organizing it in different parts and different topics. How did you even narrow down those topics? It took me listening to a couple of years to start to get a good understanding of exactly how I was going to try to bucket these things. I mean, obviously, I knew I was going to do one on value investing and one on valuation and one on management.

31:57But then I had to kind of figure out how do you actually do that? Like when he talks about share purchases at Coca-Cola, is that going to go in a capital allocation bucket or is it going to go in a Coca-Cola bucket? And, you know, things can end up in two areas as well. So it took a while to get a strong sense for how to really bucket them. And I basically at one point just built a very simplistic Excel sheet of, okay, red, yellow, green. Is this definitely in? Maybe in? Definitely out? And to the extent that it's in or maybe in, where would it kind of go? And after I kind of finished, I went back and re-bucketed things a lot.

32:32So it took going back over the material probably two or three times total. All right. I want to ask a personal question. This is obviously a lot of work, like a massive amount of work. And if you back into the amount of money that you would make per hour, it's a joke, right? Like we've written books. It's a joke. And I love, love that you're donating 50 % of your net proceeds from the book to Glide, a charitable organization that Buffett has supported for years. So clearly, it's not just about money for you in terms of writing the book. So why did you do this? Is it like personal satisfaction that there's a book with your name?

33:10Is it for name recognition so that people will subscribe to the sub stack, which I do and I want to get to later? Is it for money? Like, why did you do this to yourself? Yeah, it wasn't for money. And thankfully, so as you point out, because I have a, well, so far I haven't received anything. I hope the publisher sends me a check at some point. I don't, I don't think it's going to be life-changing money is my expectation. Funny enough, the thing that's now become the most, from a financial perspective, probably the thing that's going to be most fruitful is the translation rights, which I didn't even know was a thing, basically.

33:45I didn't even think about it at all. So it's kind of funny how that worked. But no, I certainly didn't do it from a financial perspective. Wait, what do you think is the biggest country for Buffett overseas? Japan? Oh, India? The one that, I don't know how much I'm allowed to say, But the one that has been the largest by quite a margin is Korea, which, yeah. So, yeah, interesting to me as well. I didn't know this. I didn't know the North Koreans love Buffett that much. Yes. I'm waiting. I think it's for the South. I'm waiting for the offer from the North still. They're really concentrated there.

34:18Exactly. But I had talked to enough people like you guys to have a sense that this probably wasn't going to be something that made – unless I reached Morgan Housel's status, which is like impossible to do. Um, so it wasn't really that as much as, you know, as I started going through it, one, it was material for, um, for TSOH investment research. So I write a lot of philosophy articles that are built around quotes and conversations from, from periods in the past, from things that I talked about the meeting. So I was already kind of using it in that regard. Um, you know, I thought over the longterm, maybe there's some benefit in terms of branding and, you know, what it might do for TSOH investment research.

34:56But that was all kind of secondary to being able to produce this thing that I thought would probably, if I did it well, be kind of timeless like the essays were. So I just thought it was something that, yeah, it's going to be a lot of time to put in. I also wasn't married and didn't have a kid before I started this. So that helped a little bit. So personal satisfaction. Yeah, I think, yeah, that's certainly part of it. I mean, it's everything you mentioned. Having written a book is, it is, it's like an accomplishment. I used to paint houses in the summer when I was in college. And when you're done painting the house, you feel like you actually did something.

35:27Yeah, it still feels weird to say like, actually, it still doesn't feel like I actually finished it. So I think at some point, I'll step back and be like, Oh, yeah, I actually did that thing. That's pretty cool. So I'm, I'm of the opinion that nothing in the internet era is rated properly anymore. Like everything's either over or underrated. And it would be impossible to say that, Oh, Buffett's underrated somehow. But I feel like in recent years, watching so many rich and powerful people trip over themselves and make themselves look like fools and sell out. it makes me appreciate Buffett even more.

35:57So I'm, I'm curious what your opinion of him as a person is because, and I guess this is more business persona because he, he didn't have a perfect life. If you read his biography, like his family life wasn't perfect. Um, no one's is obviously perfect. Well, it was, you know, there was some weird stuff where he did like a, he did a partner swap somewhere and it worked out. Everyone was happy. But, but what, what do you think about him as a person after going through this exercise? Yeah, I think I'd probably echo a lot of what you just said. I mean, I think he's someone who was very focused on one thing or primarily one thing for a very long period of time.

36:31I think that that's changed certainly to some extent over time. But I, I think that's very fair. And it also speaks to why his net worth is where it is versus anybody that we know. I just think the fact that he never, he never really ruined his reputation after being in the public eye for that long is really extraordinary. And maybe it would have been different if he would have come up now in the social media era. But that's one of the most impressive things about him to me. Yeah, I mean, in terms of what they, everything they've talked about the meetings for 30 plus years now, business stuff, but also stuff broader than that.

37:04I mean, it's all been consistent, basically, for long periods of time in terms of I don't, I don't, you know, the idea that he's out there in Omaha, and people think he's like plotting or something, I just never really get into that thing, because it just doesn't make a ton of sense to me, given what he's done for so long. But yeah. Alex, as you were writing this book, was there somebody that you had in mind that like an intended audience member? I thought of it as a range. I really thought of myself as starting off and call it the mid 2000s, someone like that who could read it and have it still be somewhat useful to them.

37:35But I also really wanted something that I heard frequently and thought I would hear was, hey, I've listened to a lot or all these meetings before. Why would I need this book? Or I've followed Berkshire for so long. Why do I need this book? I've invested for 20 years. Why do I need this book. I wanted those people to be able to pick it up and get value out of it. Thankfully, I've heard enough people say that they have, but I wanted to hit both ends of the spectrum. Again, just like I feel like the letters kind of do that as well. You read it, you read something two years into investing and letters that stands out to you and you can read the same letter 20 years later and different things might stand out to you from it.

38:07When I was first out of college, it was like 2005 for Christmas one year, my dad gave me a copy of Port Chalier's Almanac and I still have it. And I didn't know much about Munger at that point in my life. I had maybe read a Buffett book or two and was still kind of coming up to getting up to speed on him. But I read poor Charlie's Almanac, like cover to cover in like two days. And I was like, wait a minute, how, you know, and obviously I was way behind there. But what was your first experience with Munger and realizing like, oh, maybe he's even like more of a genius than than Buffett is? Yeah, it's funny.

38:38So I'm a couple years behind you. When I went to college, I stumbled across the book and the Warren Buffett shareholder letters. And I think it was, you know, at that point, there were no videos, obviously, or there wasn't even barely YouTube, right? So I mostly knew about Warren. A buddy and I, probably two years after we really got into this stuff, I went to the University of Florida. We drove to Omaha to go to the Berkshire Hathaway meeting. Wait, so how old were you? Like 20, maybe. Save some chicks for the rest of us, man. Well, we were sleeping in a crappy Honda Civic and Walmart parking lots.

39:13And that might not have been the problem with the chicks anyways, but that didn't help. But yeah, so I think that might have been the first time that I really started to see Charlie more and more. And then at some point, poor Charlie's almanac and things like that. So yeah. So what was that experience like as a 20-year-old going to this? Because I look back at myself when I was in my young investing days and just didn't know anything, but thought that I knew something. So what was that like for you? Was it just completely eye-opening? like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. What year was that? I think, I think it was 2009.

39:44Oh, wow. I believe, I believe it was 2009. Um, yeah, it was probably similar to what you just said, Ben. I thought I knew something and I knew absolutely nothing. Um, you know, getting there and getting, I really think we drove for two days, went to the meeting and drove back for two days as, as I remember it. Um, so it was like a big, it was a big rush in terms of the time of it all. You know, it's hard to remember now. I think I probably didn't take it in as much. I'm definitely a late bloomer in terms of a lot of this investing stuff. Like I wasn't doing it when I was 12 or anything like that.

40:15Like I've really picked it up in the last 10, 15, 20 years. I was the same way. I wasn't like, you hear these stories of people reading Barron's with their dad at the coffee table and picking stocks. Like I was never like that. I knew nothing about the market still like after college basically. But reading about Buffett was my first experience into like, I read all the Hagstrom books, Warren Buffett's Way and the Warren Buffett Portfolio. Those are some of my early favorites. And like you said, I read the Larry Cunningham one. And I've heard people say, reading through his shareholder letters is like an MBA, right?

40:46Because you learn so much about business and stock selection. So what do you think the meetings are like? If the shareholder letters are like the MBA, what are the meetings like to you? Yeah, I didn't come up with the idea for the title, the gentleman that I work with at a Harriman house and Chris Parker. He was the one who came up with the idea for Buffett and Munger Unscripted. I wanted to call it a Saturday in Omaha, and I realized his title is much better. But unscripted is unscripted is such the perfect word. Like the letters are, especially these days, are edited and fairly short, and they get across what Warren wants to get across.

41:18And the meetings are people asking about a wide variety of different topics where, you know, they can ramble and talk about something for two, five, ten minutes, depending on what Warren's thinking. or a lot of times Charlie would say something that would then Warren would feel the need to kind of interject again into the conversation. So it was just unscripted. It allowed them to talk about things in a way kind of more freely when you talk about things like stock option accounting or during the tech bubble. As far as I remember, I can go back and look. He didn't write about these things in the letter in the same way that he surely talked about them at the meeting when people were talking about or asking about them in a very pointed way.

41:55So I think that's really the main difference between the two and you know why I think this this material is so valuable in addition to everything from the letters so Alex you you write a substack the science of hitting and I'm a subscriber too and I love it um and you do I would say I would say you do dives into companies because they're deep ish but they're not like too deep that you're like stuck on the minutiae where it's like, it's plain English. And I really appreciate that about your writing. I understand what you're writing. I'm not an analyst. I'm not covering these companies, but I feel like I have a sense of what's going on because you laid out so cleanly.

42:39And I bought Dollar Tree because of you. And I followed the company for a long time because of you. So one of the things that you do that I also appreciate is you share your portfolio. You shared the first purchase. You shared the percentage. You shared your returns. You're extremely transparent. Do you think you're going to be at the market over the long term? I certainly hope so. I think it kind of goes back to what I was saying a second ago, which 20 years is certainly a long time in terms of how long the average person usually lives. But I've spent a lot of the last 20 years really kind of building the foundation for what I think and how I invest.

43:15And hopefully, I've come a long way over that period. But the honest truth is some of it was still being built as recently as, you know, five years ago. And it's kind of always being built. Yeah, sure. Right. Especially as we're going through periods like this, where, you know, you kind of step back and think a position like Dollar Tree being a notable example, like how important is macro and politics, my understanding of even the lay of the land to my investment process. And, you know, you kind of test and learn as you go through periods like this. Wait, dude, sorry to interrupt, but Berkshire, Buffett bought Apple when he was like, what, 75 years old.

43:49So it's okay to be learning on the fly. A few years after they had said, or Charlie had said, basically, we'll never have the confidence in Apple that we do in something like Burlington Northern or even IBM, I believe he said. And fast forward five years, and they have, I think at one point, a$200 billion position. So it's kind of interesting how that works. I think I have a good understanding of what I'm looking for. And I think I have a good understanding of how to be not too smart, basically, how to do things in a way that's reasonable where I'll have staying power. And I think those two things together may lend themselves to the ability to generate good returns over time, potentially to outperform.

44:31It's been obviously very difficult in a market that seems like it's just been straight up and even just hanging on feels like it's been so difficult for the vast majority of my investment career now. And it's been really interesting to watch how really, really smart people have navigated that, right? It's 2010 to today has been kind of crazy. I try to get rid of as much of the noise as I possibly can and just focus on the individual companies. But obviously, that can be hard to do at times. As a Buffett disciple, are you contractually obligated to own Berkshire shares? I am not, but it's something I...

45:09It's one of your larger positions. Yeah, I've owned it for a long time. I obviously have confidence in the capital allocation and the businesses that they own, generally speaking. I mean, obviously, we're going to go through an interesting transition period here at some point in the coming years. But yeah, it's something I've been comfortable owning. But it's a good example of what I'm saying in terms of, you know, I started in one place as an investor. And I think the companies I'm interested in and that I probably kind of should be owning to the extent I'm going to be able to outperform is probably stuff that looks less like that and looks more like a dollar tree, a fever tree in terms of just how much is followed and where the opportunity set is.

45:51But that's a learning curve. I think one of the reasons why I gravitate so much to your writing is because a lot of what I do is focused, certainly on the podcast, is unfortunately the day-to-day. And I am the noise. I get caught up way too much in the gyrations of the market. But what you are doing on your subsect, the science of hitting, you're actually looking at the underlying companies. What a novel concept that is. So I have a sense reading what you do, how you think about investing, but what is your framework? Would you say that you are a Buffett accolade? Obviously, you've learned a lot from him, but what is your personal?

46:26Because everybody's investing philosophy is personal. What is your personal investing philosophy? Yeah, I think maybe just a quick example in terms of what his is probably helps to frame this with Coca-Cola, which he started buying in the late 80s. For people who don't know this, he bought more three or four years later at a price that was three times higher than what he had paid in 89, I believe it was, which is not something that value investors, generally speaking, do too often, right? Pay three times what they had paid a couple of years ago. They probably just let it sit. He bought a good chunk more a handful of years later at three times higher price.

46:56And I believe the last time he bought or sold a single share was in 1994. And at one point, At one point during the 90s, that was an equity position that accounted for more than 30 % of the equities portfolio. So it wasn't like some small thing where he's like, hey, I got a lot of taxes to pay. I'm not going to touch this. You know, the kind of typical example that you would hear is something that he's let sit for 30 years and was a very large position at points along the way. Directionally, I think that's how I kind of think about things. I'm trying to find stuff that I truly, truly, truly want to own, which obviously requires a lot of confidence in the business and then also the management team, which both of those things can change and they're interrelated.

47:37And as a result of that kind of first desire, it tends to lend itself to, in addition to being long term, more concentrated. But then the kind of asterisk to all of that is still having some concern or consideration for valuation and kind of realistically thinking about what expected returns are, you know, three, five, seven years out and not getting too far ahead of myself. So which has obviously been harder to do in the last six to 12 months or so with with holdings like a Netflix is a prominent one for me that I bought a lot of in early 2022, thankfully, largely informed from a Disney investment that I'd gone poorly.

48:17But it helped me to kind of appreciate the strength of Netflix's position. Then it did very, very well. And now you get to a period where it's like, OK, I think they're obviously going to be the winner in this industry. but I have to tie that back to some idea of what the valuation is and what the expected returns are. Right. And that's a lot more difficult at a thousand dollars a share than it was at 220 a share or whatever. So it's just always that balance and trying to think about things in the context of a portfolio. So, again, I think a big part of what I do is just trying to be reasonable and not getting too, you know, hopped up by outputs of a model or letting action kind of compound on itself, which I certainly did more as a younger investor in terms of, hey, something's down 5%, I'm going to buy more.

48:57It's down 5 % again, I'm going to buy more. Next thing you know, it's your largest position. It's like, well, I didn't even intend for that to kind of happen. It's just my actions led to that. But that can happen so easily in investing, especially when you're talking about a time period of, you know, you're going to do this for the next four years or whatever it is. So I just try to keep those things in mind. I try to be mindful of the things that I certainly don't know. And I just try to kind of plot forward from there as intelligently as I can. Michael and I talk all the time about how the holding piece is so hard.

49:26Like you talk about Buffett owning Coca-Cola for, I guess it's whatever, 30 plus years now. That is the hard thing to do of there's enough examples of stocks that had great returns and then fell flat and never came back versus the ones that, you know, you buy an Apple or an Amazon or Microsoft early and hold it and you make out like a bandit. But I think that piece, knowing when it's time to hold a stock for multiple decades, I guess, becoming comfortable enough to do that, how do you ever get there? I think it's very difficult. I think you have to have a lot of confidence in what you're doing.

50:01I think about something that you said on one of your guys' recent podcasts that I was listening to. You basically talked about you have a set period of time that you're basically adding incremental dollars to your investment accounts and buying more stocks. Like I think there really is, even for someone like Warren, like there's a mental there's a mental part of it with having cash flow coming in and having new cash to allocate. That makes the game a bit different than if you're sitting with a fixed pool or depleting from that pool. Right. Like it just makes it I think it makes it a bit easier, honestly, to to think and act in that way.

50:34So I think that's a part of it. But I just think he really has a ownership mindset. And I think he, you know, particularly as you're talking about the wholly owned businesses and things like that, like I think he appreciated how that could be beneficial to Berkshire, but also how that truly compounds when you have, you know, again, all the companies that we know that you named, you know, there's some combination of they were in an attractive market or they had a leadership position in an attractive market and they had great leadership. but they kind of always tend to surprise to the upside, at least in my mind they do, versus the alternative has a way to frequently surprise to the downside when you're buying something cheap, but you think the person running it sucks or isn't really working kind of in your interest.

51:18That has a way to surprise to the downside quite often. One of the hardest parts about investing, even if you have an ownership mentality, is there's a scoreboard every day. And you might have conviction, and I'm sure you've experienced this more than once in your career, but the market's telling you, hey, buddy, you're wrong. And maybe the market's wrong. And how much does your conviction, how much do you let your conviction fight with the market? Yeah, again, I think it's something that I lean much more against as a younger investor than I do now. And I'm much more comfortable with the idea of one, letting time play out and letting, okay, I have this thesis of XYZ happening over the next few years.

52:01I need to let that happen to some extent. I don't need to make five purchases in the next six weeks. I can slow down and let things happen a little bit. I think John Hempton's work on losers, average losers, I think it's called, or when to average down is another write-up that he did. I think it's a great way of thinking in terms of what exactly do value traps look like and kind of how do you avoid those? So that is probably the part of my approach to, I guess, trading, you would call it, that has changed the most in terms of if something's going down, how am I thinking about buying versus selling or holding?

52:37So you're less likely to add to a position as it's going in your face, which I think a lot of young value investors, they would probably love that and they'd be like, bring it on. But you go through that once three dozen times and you're like, all right, maybe I should stop being such a tough guy. Like maybe the market's not completely stupid. Or just at least not reflexively slash immediately, right? Like you can reassess the situation and buy more a month from now potentially. But you also need to make seven purchases in the interim, right? Right. I think there's something about the markets being open, it being down another 2%.

53:10You're like, I got to buy more now. So slowing down on that part of the equation. And then the flip side of that is being kind of willing to hold some things for when they feel like they're getting more extended. And obviously, to the extent that you're working with a fixed pool, those two actions are directly related to one another because the money's got to come from somewhere. So those two things have been big. But yeah, in terms of, you know, kind of making a stand against the market, I kind of just constantly come back to, OK, what do I actually believe about this? And how does that kind of relate to very roughly what the stock price is saying in terms of kind of where the key variables are going over time?

53:50And to the extent there's a big discrepancy between the two, then I'm willing to lay bets, which, as you know, from following my work is pretty infrequent, right? Like maybe twice a year or something like that. I mean, Dollar Tree is a top position that has been added recently. But as you know, every other top position is there's two from 2011, there's one from 2018, and there's Netflix from 2022. So it's really infrequent that this happens. And sometimes, as you know, like a position like Match that I got into, sometimes I get six or nine months down the road and I'm like, I think I'm just dead wrong on this.

54:23Even though it's a long-term thesis, everything's gone against me so far. Something tells me I need to get out and kind of reassess and maybe I'll be back in a year from now. When you say you're wrong, you're more likely to hear from management on the earnings call than you are to say like in the interim 90-day period, oh, I'm down 13%. I must be wrong. You're going to hear from the management, which unfortunately, oftentimes by the time you hear, the stock will gap down 11%. But you say, OK, well, now I know I'm wrong. Now my thesis has been invalidated. Sure, I could have got out last week, but whatever.

54:54I didn't. How would you have known? And you take your cues from management and it is what it is. Yeah, you make the bet. And if you find out you're wrong, then you adjust. But again, that's a perfect example. In the interim, I'm completely past the point of I'm almost certainly never going to buy and then buy again before getting an update on the actual business results or something from it. It's too much activity and it's kind of all unnecessary. That's experience. There's no way that you could have done that early in your career because you're too antsy, you're too impatient. Patience is something that develops over time.

55:27Yeah, and it might not be optimal on the upside, but it definitely protects from something on the downside that I've experienced firsthand and have seen elsewhere closely. So the stock market right now is down 10 % to 15%, something like that. But there's a lot of other stocks that are down 30%, 40%, 50%. Are you getting excited about anything right now? Like, are you starting to perk up a little bit because a lot of stocks have fallen out of bed? Yes, there's certain ones. I mean, Dollar Tree is one that's, again, like remains really interesting to me just in terms of the broader thesis and the changes that are underway, particularly family dollar, all the stuff that's going on with tariffs and trade now.

56:04My sense is it's not going to be a massive impact for them, but it's certainly not inconsequential. I mean, especially to the extent that it just makes the economy overall more difficult and their core customer situation more difficult, right? I think that's, even if they're a kind of a share gainer in that environment, it's probably not a net win for them. I think Five Below is a really interesting company to the extent that they really key in on what their core value proposition is, or at least has been historically. They are very exposed to kind of Chinese tariffs. Those are two in retail that I think are interesting.

56:36Airbnb has interested me for a really long time. I've always kind of struggled with the valuation and having clarity on their competitive position internationally outside of kind of their key five, six, seven markets, but then also what their plans are beyond alternative accommodations. And it sounds like we're going to get some big news on that in the coming weeks. Use me as a contrarian on that one because I bought it at the IPO and I sold it like six months ago. Yeah. Because it did nothing for me. Alex, can I give you a homework assignment? Yes. One of my larger positions is IMAX. You ever look at that company?

57:09IMAX. No, I have not looked close. Okay. They're the leader. Just saying. They have a role to play in the theater business. Is that what it is? So the theater business has obviously gone to shit. But I think that their advantage is that when people do go to the movie theater, it's an experience. You look at a movie like Dune Part 2 or any of the tempo blockbusters, they'll have 3 % of the screens and 25 % of the audience of the ticket sales. They are the clear leader. It's reasonable valuation. They're growing mid-teen double digits. Yeah, it's like a lot of these things. I think there's probably something comparable there to sports rights.

57:44If you're at the very top of the food chain, then there's still a value there. But to the things that can be more easily replaced by Netflix or other screen time is what's in trouble. In terms of IMAX specifically, maybe not specifically, but just broader to your style of investing. So IMAX is a billion-dollar company. Is that way below your comfort level? No, I don't think so. No, I'd be okay with a billion dollars. I get nervous when we're talking about low hundreds of millions. And I'm not very well versed on things like the amount of flow or the volume that's out there. But if that starts to be a question mark, then I get a little bit nervous, particularly if I'm telling – for people who don't know, I disclose to people what I'm going to do in my portfolio before I do it.

58:25So to the extent that people are using it to buy or sell anything as they look into the work, that could be a bad situation for me if something's too small. Sure. So I'd have to be cautious about that. Well, Alex, like I said, I am a big fan of your research, thescienceoffitting.com. I've been a subscriber for, I don't know, a couple of years now. And I don't read everything because some of the stuff doesn't – like you did an update this week on – what was the egg company? What was the deal with that? Vital Farms. Okay, so Vital Farms. Okay. I don't know what Vital Farms is. Not of interest. But I would say I read like 80 % of your stuff and I love following it quarter after quarter.

59:01So appreciate you coming on the show. Hope this helps you with the book sales. so thank you thanks guys happy to go back to being a listener you guys are great at what you do thank you

59:13all right thank you to Barry and Alex Morris buy their books right now I insist buy their books or if you've read it if you bought it buy it for a loved one thank you very much for listening animal spirits at the compound news.com we'll see you next time

59:35Thank you.