Drugs, Bets & Football Regrets: The Paul Merson Confessions

30:21What did he sign in, 90 or 91? So I'm 22 then, about 22. And we were coming back from pre-season training. He was giving me a lift back. It was boiling hot day pre-season. And he said, do you want to pop in the pub on the way home and have a pint? And I went, what, one? And he went, yeah. I said, what's the point? I said, I'll come in if we're going to have a load. But if not, I might as well just come in and have a coat. And that was at 22, and I didn't know. But I'm still talking like an alcoholic at 22 without even knowing. And he'll tell you that story now. He remembers it as plain as anything.

30:55And that's a shame. It's like that. When I hear that and I hear myself say it, I'm like, it's not the money. Like, the money's gone, like, you know, for how much it was. And it was a lot of money I lost. I lost time. time's light was lost. You had a mental sign, yeah. Yeah, and it was the madness. And when I used to want to kill myself, I used to think, how can I tell anybody this? You know, I'm playing for one of the best clubs in England, you know, Rolls-Royce of a football club, Arsenal. I'm playing for England. I've got the world at my feet. I'm earning good money. How can I go and tell someone what I'm doing and I want to kill myself?

31:31They'll think, and in them days, you know, there was nothing like it is now with mental health. it was like I'd have thought I'd be in a straight jacket you can't be right how could you even think like that when you got everything at your feet and I just couldn't tell anyone Were you getting your wages and rattling on that day? Yeah I mean as much whatever I could get I would bet I mean I won the league in 91 for the second time so we won it 89 we won in 91 I bought a house in Wheat Amstead nice house in Wheat Amstead quite a big house and we just won the league and I got home that night and the floor was concrete.

32:08Like I chose to gamble instead of get carpet. I just couldn't get the carpet. And people say, oh, people gamble, they gamble because they want more and more. Well, how, why, what am I gambling for, to get silk carpet? You know, there's only one carpet. Do you know what I mean? It might be more expensive ones, but I chose to live on concrete floors. You know, my boy Charlie, I tell you, I lived in Birmingham. I had an apartment for 12 years I didn't have blinds once for all the gambling I'd done I just couldn't justify buying curtains or blinds yeah that's how far the addiction takes that's how far you know what I mean if you get in the bookies with a grand ten grand you would rather put the nine grand on when I used to gamble I used to try and put half of what I had on just to try and double it pay back the people that I owed money to so I could still have that extra bit to gamble but before you know it you lose all that before you know it you're fucking tapping somebody else I was bumping somebody else to place a bet where sometimes I'd I never had money to top up my phone the car would die a petrol because I thought fuck it I'm just going to keep gambling until it wasn't the fact of winning the money it was just the buzz we spoke earlier if I had I used to bet on the handicap bet in rugby league rugby sit up to all those watching rugby in fucking New Zealand in South Africa but if my bet was winning if it was cruising I hated the feeling because my buzz I wouldn't have a buzz I just wanted the money to get put back into that so I could gamble on to the next bet that's out the power of the disease my family and that couldn't understand but why you keep doing that it's money save your money and I'm thinking nah sneak away lying had the kids in the car I used to get into the bookies pawn at everything it takes you to the fucking brink of hell did you have a good network Arsenal seemed like a good team at the time Ian Wright Sol Campbell I never played with Sol I played for Sol with England but they were good people they were shock they were majorly shock when I come out with my drug situation they didn't know that you know gambling was it was a football thing as well weren't it yeah it was a football thing the drinking we had a massive Tuesday club which was well known around London up and down the country but but we we were a good team so we got away of it because you know everybody else was doing it but we were better players and a better team and we we worked hard we boozed hard or whatever we'd done but we trained hard you know George was like quite clever like go out enjoy yourself we go Marbella three times a year team spirit but he knew that that team spirit that was the thing that would win us things not our because we wasn't a good team in my opinion we wasn't a great team 91 was decent but we had a togetherness even though the lads we didn't all get we weren't all best mates we weren't like we all went out with our wives on a Saturday far from it but on a Saturday everybody would work their nuts off for each other What was Bergkamp like when he came?

35:00Yeah he was like I remember we played we was in Norway or Sweden on tour and it was his first session I remember we were walking back to the hotel because he used to stay in a little town where there would be nothing there and all the lads were like wow Inter Milan must be good if they're letting him go like he was the best player I ever played with by a million miles yeah he was light yeah he was light but then he didn't fly he wouldn't fly so it's weird you know what I mean he's a great player but he wouldn't fly so there's something do you know what I mean there's something there do you know what I mean you know it's weird how it works you know it's weird how everybody's different and everybody is I remember years ago I was lying on a psych I used to go and see a psychiatrist when I was about 22 I used to lay on the couch and I used to go I want to be like Alan Smith I want to be I play with a lad up front I want to be like him you know he lives his life right he lives his life properly you know he goes home to his wife and kids.

36:01You know, I go straight out. I don't want to go out, but I just find that I'm always out. I'm always searching for something different. And she said, everybody's different. And that, that, that's all I needed to hear. That was it. Then I didn't go back. It justified me. Like I'm different. I'm not like you. So I, what I'm doing is nothing wrong with it. I'm just different to you. And I thought, well, I'm not paying you 150 a week anymore. I'll have that. Do you know what I mean? And that's, I justified that then that I was just different. You know, that I was different to him so what I was doing was no different it could have been him but it's me you kind of accepted that yeah I I accepted that I could be like that did you ever look at other people's lives who you thought had it together and was envious that he's going home to his missus he's saving his money they're buying property I've only just started over the last year or so not wishing I was someone else I've never ever I've never ever as I said I've never felt comfortable with my body I always I wish I was like him I wish why can't I be like him you know my hero was Ray Wilkins when I grew up being a big massive Chelsea fan you know he was captain of Chelsea you know and they say don't meet your heroes and I met you know he was the nicest bloke I ever met and I always wanted to be like him do you know what I mean and even the end before he passed away God bless him you know we were at the football meet Kate and Freddie with him you know having a meal at Chelsea before the game and you know I always wanted to be like Ray Wilkins you know I always wanted to be like someone else.

37:28It's sad to think that so many people would want to have been like you i ain't sure you didn't i'm not yeah they might have they might have wanted to be they might have wanted to be the football who was good at football who won stuff and who could entertain and play football but you you wouldn't you wouldn't you wouldn't want to be my addiction you wouldn't you just i don't know anybody who would have it's it's the worst thing in the world is to have addictions like like this i mean i used to go to florida and in the time we used to go florida all the time and i never used to have to save up you know we'd go Florida that was it and I used to you know we'd stay in the top hotels and I'd get there and I'm like but then I'd be in the car and I'd see a family who probably saved forever had nothing but saved to get there and they're happy and laughing and joking I used to feel I wish I was like you I wish why can't I be like that why can't I be happy do you know what I mean and I just couldn't and it was no it's nobody else's fault you know I don't want people go oh the kids to go oh was it us or no it was me you know it was my addiction I you know I just are never happy always searching that's where it's sad always searching for something different always searching for that you know yeah but it's searching for the external things the stuff that's never going to take away a pain it just adds to the pain makes it a hundred times worse the next day and the next day but we keep chasing it because it's a very short blast of those dopamine levels where we think life is okay when we're betting or fucking drugs or hookers or whatever the fuck it is to get that little kick but realising it only eventually adds up and the mindset just eventually dissolves but when did you leave Arsenal?

39:0497? 97 I got offered a lot of money to go to Middlesbrough I'd just been offered a four year contract to Arsenal and Middlesbrough offered me £350 ,000 a year more than what Arsenal did like Arsenal offered me £650 ,000 a year four year contract and Middlesbrough offered me a million pound. Now, that's hard enough to turn down if you're not an addict. But when you're an addict and you're a compulsive gambler and you're getting your feed out of gambling, I just couldn't turn it down. Couldn't turn it down. I went to Middlesbrough. My wife at the time never come. And after a month, I would give the money back.

39:46Were you in debt at this time? I've always been in debt. I don't think there's a time I've never been in debt since I was 17 18 never been not been in debt you know like always having to do something to pay you know write a book pay that write a book pay that do this to do that you know always sign for them that you'll get a signing on fee pay that you know it's always that hand to that hand out never own it now if you're getting money off like loan shards and stuff they know that I'm not getting it back there's that play I think they keep giving me money as well that do you ever think that you're just getting used as well where a lot of people weren't getting their money back they knew that but yet they would still feed you money not so much not so much the loan sharks if I'm being honest because the loan sharks don't know what you're doing the people that I bet with the underground people that I bet with I do get that I think you knew you know you knew and these betting companies that you know you're having 60, 70 bets a day they know do you know what I mean and that sort of hurts sometimes.

40:54People go, oh, yeah, but he's a grown-up. He's four-year-old. No, the age goes out the window. It doesn't matter if you're 16 or 82. Do you know what I mean? If you're addicted, you know, and sometimes that disappoints me, but you have to let go. I mean, I don't, I'll grudges now. I don't get bitter or twisted. I mean, what's the point? You know, I live my life now. They have my money and they took it like taking candy candy off a baby did you ever bet on yourself? never once I did bet on myself to win and we lost I had 60 grand on us when I was at Portsmouth and I had a bet when I was at Walsall to win one of them we won one we got beat yeah but never never bet against ever ever wouldn't do that in a million years the day I'd done that I would have jumped off a bridge but I think that shows you your character as well that even though you were a compulsive liar a fucking a gambling addict a drug addict but you still wouldn't bet against your teammates because I was a winner for me if I was playing I would have I would have fixed matches I would have been fucking junk for penalties and getting sent off and doing whatever I could yeah I love winning I love winning I hate losing I mean I'd done an advert last week with Jamie Carragher and Karen Carney and Micah Richards me and Micah were in the same team and we lost the quiz and I was fuming and Jamie was laughing his head off he thought it was funny but and Karen couldn't believe it and I was like I play to win you know if I'm doing something I want to win and if I don't win I get the ump so I would never ever do that that was my one buzz was winning football matches you know that was and if I ever done went against that fuck what's the worth in living yeah what's the biggest bet you've put on 150 that won I'm sitting here and I

42:47no I got beat got beat yeah no got beat yeah yeah yeah that's and now like when I say it's like what would I give like to have 150 now do you know what I mean I'll be able to buy a house like or put a deposit down a house it's it's sad but you have to laugh you know because if you don't you know you've got to let go you've got to surrender but hindsight's a wonderful thing like oh someone said to me someone said to me like what you hear it from I've heard it from the age of 10 to And now it's like, you know, if we knew now what we know now at 22, how different life would be, but how boring would that have been at the same time?

43:29Do you know what I mean? You know, there's a journey, you know, and, you know, I have a story to tell, but my story now is to tell it to get people to understand not to go through it. Because I have a choice now, and I think people need to have a choice. I didn't know I was an ill person. I just thought I was a bad, bad person who was trying to be good all the time. And when that doesn't work out, which is never going to work out because you're just going to keep on going back, then it hurts. But, you know, like some of the stuff, you know, I played in the World Cup final, like in the World Cup.

44:01I mean, it's extraordinary. Do you know what I mean? It's like to be able to play in a World Cup is, you know, they're things you dream of. And to be doing what you're doing at the time is like madness. Who was that game against Argentina? Yeah, amazing. When you're playing for your country in a World Cup, you know when you're going to take that penalty in the World Cup, even Tottenham fans are watching that game and they want you to score. Even though they hate you with a passion, they want you to score that day. And that's the only thing that every time that brings Arsenal and Tottenham together is when England are playing and that's how big it is.

44:41you know but I was always one of them of was always the next year like we won the league in 89 we won the league 89 but when you watch it the following year and someone else wins it and they're all celebrating you think wow that was a massive thing what we did last year or with the FA Cup final or with a Cup winner's cup it's always the following year when you watch someone else celebrate and you think wow it's massive but you're watching them and they're all in the moment they're all in the moment they're all enjoying it and you don't realise until afterwards how big it was because you were living it you didn't realise how big it actually was the fans and family friends you must have made so many people proud as well even though you know what you were doing was wrong but you gave people around you so many good memories which is a fucking great thing as well sometimes we can talk about the past as if it's all dark look at your achievements fuck's sake to win the league twice the cup winners cup do you not win the league the league cup and the FA Cup the same season yeah there's not many players done that they hadn't done that no one had done that for God knows how long and then Liverpool hadn't done it a few years later it's you know it's a major feat you know they're one off football matches you know it's not like the league where you know you have a bad 45 minutes or a bad 90 minutes in a cup game and you're out don't matter how good you are you know it happened when we went to Wrexham but yeah there's been a lot of positives don't get me wrong you know don't get me wrong but you know there's been a lot of dark days you know a lot of dark days you know when you want to kill yourself they're not good days but you know what brother you're fucking through it today I'm through it today some people never got through it some people did kill themselves some people couldn't handle the pressure they own the people money the constant lie and that some people have not made it here you're clearly here for a reason what was the stage what was the closest you ever came to killing yourself Paul took a load of tablets a load of tablets, enough tablets.

46:42I started taking a bit more, but obviously, you know what? I don't know if I was weak and I shit myself or, you know, I was brave and I thought, you know what? I don't want to do this. You know, I want to get, I'm going to give it a go. Or I don't know. I don't know if I was scared and I shit myself. I don't know. Sometimes I want to give myself credit and think, no, you were brave. You lie. You went, no, I'm going to get through this. something was on my shoulder you know i mean what it may be i don't know but there was times when i i'd gone home and put a put a rope around around the curtain rail thing like and like i wanted to do like hang myself you know it was up it was up you know things like that it's like but at this after that it was like no something was always in something was there like it'll be better you know you always believed yeah I think so yeah yeah yeah I try and live my life like now like you know I'm powerless over people places things and situations every day is different you know what I mean the name of it just try for anybody listening try and get through that day you know it might be 10 minutes might be 5 minutes you know I've had days in the last year I'm not going to lie, where I've wanted a bet, you know, for everything I've done and how great life is.

48:09And, you know, the accolades Paul's getting because he's, you know, he's got sober and he's, you know, with his addictions, he's not gambling. I've had days when I've wanted to go back, you know, that scares me. And I've had to get go five minutes through the day, get through the next five minutes, get through the next five minutes, get through the next 10. And before you know it, it passes again, you know, but I block. There's a lot of blocking in the way now. There's a lot of blocking. I can't just think fuck it and put a bet on in two minutes I can't do that anymore which is a relief you'll lose everything again you know what it ain't the money it ain't the money it'll be the time it'll be the dignity it'll be my self-respect people respect me today do you think you've got another recovery in you that's the question as well I don't think I have because I know I know now I know I'm an ill person if I go back again you know I know that it's not right you know that's the one thing I think when you start getting well and i've been six years without a drink once i went six years without a drink and i went into treatment for gambling went into arizona they sent me in there to for gambling didn't want to go come straight back out flew back landed straight to the off license wait a minute i've gone six years without a drink i never drunk wine never drunk wine let's try wine wine might be better i was drinking like lager and brandy but a lot of people drink wine now so let's try wine that might be the one four bottles later up the off license back to square one again and it becomes unenjoyable because you know you're sitting there and you're drinking and you know you're an alcoholic and you know there's only one way out and it's that's the insanity of this disease is that it'll keep on telling you it's alright it's alright I'm the same like every day I still think about gambling I'll hear a result on the radio or I'll see something online I'll think fuck that would have been a nice one half time full time the thing is now Paul but we're not acting on it yeah the thoughts are always going to pop up when having a bad day now i'm addicted to fucking sugar i just want to eat yeah if i have a bad day i'm just eating shit i'm not i'm drinking taking gear and gambling where then i'm not seeing my kids and then i'm not doing anything with my life and then i feel like a loser yeah and then i'm that low vibrational people i'm hanging around with the same crowd that you've got to give yourself credit for what you're achieving and fucking finding the strength to go do you know what i ain't doing it anymore yeah i want to fight for my life i want to give something back and yeah yeah did you find that with your own life you had a lot of leeches around you because you're a professional footballer as well no not really i was a loner if i'm being honest like people go to me like i go to dinners every now and then and i'll do a dinner up north and i'll sit on a table and there'll be like nine other people on the table and they'll be all mates like 40 odd years of age you know each other since i was at school and i find that sad like not for them for me like i didn't have that addiction took me away from friends took me away from people it wanted me on my own so i i'm i've really I haven't got a lot of friends and I don't mean that in a horrible way but I haven't like got loads of friends you know my addiction took me away from that yeah because you don't want to let them down either so the less people in your life the less people you're hurting yeah I used to look at and I don't want people to I don't want to sit around people who talk sense I don't want to be I don't want to talk see sit around people that will go to me oh what are you drinking for why you know let's go home now or you know why are you betting like a maniac i don't want to be around them people my addiction don't want me around them people addiction wants me on my own i mean we had a flat we rent a house but around the corner my wife's got a one bedroom flat literally the back of the house sort of thing around the corner and i'd plan it i get up sunday morning and i start an argument she go oh get out you're getting on our nerves and i go all right bye i just take the ipad and i take i go straight around the corner go to the off license get get a lorry load of drink and everything.

51:58And I'd just sit and punt for three days solid, like not go to sleep, just bang, bang, bang. Because my addiction wanted me, and after I lost everything, I'd go back with my towel between my legs, and I'd go, really sorry, I didn't mean to do what I'd done. And it wouldn't be all right, but it would be right in time. You know, my wife's, I was fortunate, you know, how things work is, my wife's mum's dad was a compulsive gambler. so she knew like my wife would go I'm going to leave or I've had enough he hates me and her mum would go no he's not well he needs to get help and that was a blessing because otherwise I'd be on my own now of course I would who would stick around with me you know what I mean you're losing everything not coming home and gambling everything and lying I mean lies were like scary I mean you know I do think we're compulsive gamblers I do think you know if this was in the Olympics get lying we'd represent England.

52:56We'd represent our country up and down. I would have a fucking... All around the world. All around the world. I mean, my wife would say to me like she'd be indoors and she'd go, oh, I don't want to do this tomorrow. How do I get out? And I'd go, bang, bang, bang, bang. She'd go, how the fuck do you... How do you make that up that quick? And I wouldn't know. I just would. I just would. It was scary. But you've got to remember with drinking, if I come home after being out a night or two nights, if I told my wife a lie, in a month's time I'd have forgot that lie you know because I'd have been drunk or hungover but with gambling I didn't get hangovers but like I'd been drunk but with gambling you've got a clear head you know you tell a lie you remember it you know you keep on just you know it's another lie on top of a lie I mean I used to say to the postman when I used to live over in City Albans don't put any bank statements through the letterbox you keep every bank statement I bought my wife something on a credit card if she opens a statement when a you know she'll know what the present is and i'll meet you next week and i'll you i'll get all the letters off you it wasn't i fucking gambled all my money away and i didn't want her to see it but they they were the things you know i mean like always thinking ahead always like one step ahead try to cover your tracks yeah one step ahead you know i mean i've everything i've done you know like even have a lawyer on as a lawyer like my mate you know there was no mobile phones in them day so i'd have a lawyer like my mate my make out he's a lot if i ring you and i go all right it sounds so and he'll make out he's a lawyer and then i'll go you know my wife would be upstairs my first wife and she'd be listening on the phone i know she'd be listening and i go right there's a there's an article in the paper to like on sunday paper this morning i need to sue the paper i can't have this this is a ridiculous it didn't even happen and it'll be planned and he go paul you you can't do that.

54:46You can't do that. You haven't got the money to do that. These papers can't lose. You know, you have to go call. You have to, it'll cost you fortunes. Will you win? And I'll go, oh, well, I ain't got the money to do that. And he said, well, you just got to let it go. If it's not true, don't worry. I put the phone down. I know my wife's listening upstairs, my first wife. Put the phone down. It's my fucking mate. He ain't a lawyer. Do you know what I mean? But that's the madness. It's like, it's the madness. You know, it's, it was, you know I used to in the end I used to think if I'm not on the front page of the paper I'm doing alright like that means I'm alright you know and that was that was the thing I used to judge myself from the front pages of the paper if I'm if I'm not on them I'm being good I'm being good So even your career started to come to an end then how hard was that to you for you to look back and think I've got fuck all You know what Are you glad I don't know I don't know the money wise I mean I look back now I was a millionaire, I was playing for Arsenal, earning unbelievable money, and a nice car, big house.

55:49I wanted to kill myself. Umpteen times, umpteen times, umpteen times, and I was a millionaire. So the money's irrelevant. And I know people will sit there, and rightly so, and go, oh, that's easy saying that, because you were a millionaire. What about if you ain't got any money? Sometimes it's even worse when you have got money. Because if you feel like that and you ain't got any money, You always got that thing in the back of your head is, if I had money, that would be the problem solved, which it wouldn't be because it's up here. It's not in your pocket. But, you know, I had it and still wanted to do that.

56:24You know, someone who's got nothing who wants to kill himself, they've got that thing. If I did have money, I'd be all right. You wouldn't. You wouldn't. And that's the problem now. I don't get me wrong. I like money. I used to love money because it fed my addiction I used to love it but now now I like it because it gets us food and you know and I got to save up to get a future for our kids and and then I got to save up to go on holiday do you know what I mean and if we want if the microwave breaks you know I save up to a new microwave you know things like that you know they're they're achievements now you know I fly on holiday and I'm like save for this holiday yeah you can enjoy it Yeah, you know, it's not like, it's not like, but I've been to Florida and the amount of times I've been to Florida and like, and like, I go to get to the room after like eight days in or so and my key don't work and I ain't got no money on my card.

57:27You know, they've locked the door. Do you know what I mean? All like them kind of things because my credits run out. You know, my card's max because I've lost it, but I didn't know like at the time, you know, I'm gambling. you know it's like like all them like horrible things do you know i mean i don't sit and worry about having to put the key in the door anymore on holiday or being a big queue at whatever shopping i'm in and and i put my card in and i literally pray please get let's go through you know i know now there's there's my wife looks after the money i know there's money in there when i go to the shop yeah it's a horrible disease i remember my dad was dying with leukemia here like three months to go the family used to go for like dinners and stuff to try and obviously his last few months i used to just sit in the house place bets on the laptop and smoke joints yeah because that was more i wanted to do that first that that's a big part of regret like that i think fuck me like how much of a fucking mess i was like couldn't go and spend the last few meals with the people that you love but but because i was partly broken as well i was hurting like people need to understand the disease like every day I wanted to quit every morning I woke up thinking fuck this I'm not not today five minutes later once I get washed brush my teeth I need to get a bet on I need to feel something I need to oh yeah myself it's it's you know I get up every morning and pray don't be selfish don't be selfish today you know because that is one thing you become when you're you know in addiction is you become a selfish person and that's that's the addiction that's not the person do you know what I mean if you had that time around tomorrow you'd be at every meal you would it's as simple as that but you know i i was talking to someone the other day and they they you know that they said you know i'm struggling with gambling i'm struggling my kid was in intensive care the weekend and i still chose to bet i under you know but that that's the way it is he to get out the way he feels you know he's not a bad person he doesn't not love his kid he just he's not well he's not well and that that's the thing with this It's a hideous disease.

59:33It's a hideous disease that will keep on. The best thing I've ever heard is it's out there doing press-ups. If someone said to me, Jane, you can never have another drink, a bet or a drug for the rest of your life, I'll be back out today. I would because I can't do that. I just can't do that. It's impossible. But I get up in the morning and I say I won't do any of them today. It's doable. And I can get through the day with that. but I can't look any further than that honestly if you said to me never again I couldn't do it I just I couldn't have that thought in my head of not having that buzz again but I can I can go without that buzz for a day when did you realise okay I need to I'm going to give life a go here I'm putting my hands up and I've got so many issues and I'm going to try because if you've done it without the booze for six years and you've done the gambling like I'd done two years and then as soon as I drank again I opened the door for the restroom I just ripped the whole ceiling down and it was full self-sabotage for a year.

1:00:30The reason why I quit so fast again is because I know how good I'd felt the two years I was off it. I know how life was okay. I wasn't in debt. I wasn't switching my phone off. I wasn't pretending I'd lost my phone. I wasn't the bullshitter that I was for so many years. But when did you decide for the last, it's never, I wouldn't say the last time, but I hope it's the last time. Yeah, yeah, I hope it's the last time. The last lockdown, like when I was playing for Arsenal, I bought my three boys that bought their mum a house and you'd think that was their future. You know what I mean? And then I got twins in Birmingham and I bought a house there and when we got divorced, their mum had the house.

1:01:06So you think their future was... And I got three little kids now and we saved up and we have to save hard. Do you know what I mean? I have to save hard and we're saving up for a deposit for a house to give the kids a future. Do you know what I mean? Like when I'm not about that there's just something there for them and I got hooked on the news in lockdown. I was watching the news every day. I'd swap my addiction. You know, I was news, news. You know, five o 'clock or six o 'clock, I'm watching Boris Johnson and the other two lads. Like, and I'm feeding all this into me and my brain was telling me, that's it.

1:01:40We're not, I'm not working again. There's not going to be another soccer Saturday because they'll be playing, you know, they're playing one game at a time so everybody can watch them at home. And I got scared, I got anxiety attack and the addict in me was like, you've got to race this up, race this, this money's not going to be enough to buy a house, and it's not going to be enough money to live on for the rest of our lives, because what am I going to do for a job, and I gambled it all away, and that was it, for the next week, my wife hadn't known, and watching the kids on the sofa, and I was thinking, fuck, I've just done all my money, I've just let you all down, and the hate for myself was like overwhelming, I wanted to kill myself and I thought that's it no more you know I and that it was a lot of money and I always used to think if you got a lot of money you got a chance you know I'd never start off with like 200 or 300 I'd have to have a lump you know I used to think you know if I got a lump and then I've got a chance of winning because I can bet what I need to bet on and and that was it I told my wife and wow she went like you'd expect uh and that was it since that day I haven't had a bet and And I think that was it.

1:02:53Now I have to start again and try and save up to try and get a house. I'm 53. You know, you see now, and I don't like looking forward, but, you know, when I was a kid and I used to come home and my mum and dad would go, or talking, I'd go, oh, sound so passed away, 75. And, you know, sound so passed away, 73. And when you're a 10-year-old or a 12 or 14, 15-year-old, you go, good innings, good innings, that. It is, when you're 12 or 13. I'm 53 now 73 is not like you know it's you know when you look at it like that and I look and I go 33 32 years ago we played against Liverpool and it seemed like yesterday you know 32 years from now I mean it's not long away yeah how hard is it for your missus that when you've done it the last time for to try and convince her that you're not going to do it again oh I don't I don't she has all the money so it's you know So, you know, she always looked after the money sort of thing.

1:03:57And it was like, I always had that resentment, like, you're not looking after my money. I'm 50 years of age. You know what I mean? I do what I want to do. And that was a bad, bad thinking. That was stinking thinking. And now she looks after me. She's in charge. So when I get the card to go to the shopping, the money will be on there to pay for the food. and I know I ain't got to sit there and pray that this is going through. And she has the money and now we've got to try and save again. And I will. I will. I'm one of them people that I have to have goals. When I went into treatment many, many years ago, we sat around the table and they went, what's your goal?

1:04:34And I went and played for England again. And they were like, whoa, we need to bring that down a bit. You know what I mean? You're sitting in here for drugs and drinking. You'd be lucky if you played for Arsenal again, let alone England. and I did. You know what I mean? When I get something going, I can get it going. But it's when that happens and then after that, I'm like, what do I do now? And that's what happened. I played for England again and it was like, now what? And that's my problem every time. It's hard, but it's good. It's a good hard, if you know what I mean. Yeah, but that's life. Yeah, and that's the problem.

1:05:11It is life, but Paul's never lived in life. Paul's never lived in life. Paul's lived in a buzzy world the whole of his life, 36 years of drinking, betting, gambling. It's like, that's not life. That's like, you might as well live on a spaceship. You know, I'm never in life. I'm never in the moment, never, you know, in life. And today, you know, my life's either been up here or it's been down here. It's never been in the middle. And for 36 years, I've searched for that middle just to be like that. And, you know, the other week I was sitting indoors or the other month. And my wife's always dubious now and she's very aware of my moods.

1:05:48And she said, what's wrong? And I said, it's groundhog, isn't it? It's boring. And she went, what do you mean? I said, well, just here. It's like every day is the same, same. And she went, well, was it better than when you was down here? And I said, oh, it was 100 times better than that. 100 times. And she just looked at me and she said, that's enough. And it put it in perspective. but I do, I've searched all my life to be here, and I used to love that up here, I used to love that buzz, and I got addicted to that buzz down here, you know, of trying to, where am I going to get money from next, where am I going to get my next bet on, if I back that, and I'll get out of trouble, and I'll pay that, and I'll get that, but, and I was used to that, that was the norm, that was normal for Paul, normal, that was a normal life, this life that I'm living now, it's like a little kid coming back into like starting off in the world it's like it's doing normal things like tonight i'm putting on the lights at ted and it's like people are asking paul to do things now before you know i've never ever been asked to be a god parent or best man or anything like that because you can't rely on paul but you're appreciating life now oh yeah a hundred percent a hundred percent like things like today give me a buzz now you know i mean turning on the lights the kids will be buzzing they'll be happy and that that's good like you know i got offered an unbelievable job tonight got this morning jamie redneck rung me up and said i've got a job if you want it when i was bang at it i would have took the job i wouldn't have cared about yeah fuck the kids i'm not being horrible but i would i've fought my addiction but now it was like no i promised the kids i'm i'm turning on the lights you know i go and watch my boy play football now he's at chelsea academy and he goes down to arsenal every now and then and Fulham he goes to and you know I go and watch him train and I take him there and you know I come home my wife goes out did he do and I can tell her everything before I'd be there but I wasn't there I'd be on my phone looking at my phone and you know we go upstairs and my boy on his Playstation and I go I'll come and watch you and I'll lay on the bed and all he could he was ever shouting down was mum dad's on the phone again dad's on the phone I was more interested in gambling do you have a liable now when you're in the present moment and the past is the past it's fucking cool you know someone a mate of mine's asked me he said would you be a godparent do you know i mean yeah like that's never happened before in my life you know you get well you know the the lights i've lived here seven years you know never asked me to put the lights on now i'm reliable now i'm a good person you know i was a good person before but i'm a well person now they can rely on me to be there tonight you know over the last seven years they probably thought i ain't sure about him you know do you Do you ever think if you never played football how your life would have turned out?

1:08:35No, I don't as it goes. No, I'd have probably been in Tenerife working in a bar. I would, and that was me. Even now, that was it. When I used to watch Cocktail, Tom Cruise film, I'm playing for Arsenal, England. I want to be like that. I want to be like that. Why can't I be working in that Coyote Ugly bar? You know what I mean? It's always something else. always wanting to be somewhere else or do something else never happy just keep trying to escape you yeah exactly today I'm happy today I'm you know I can live in the day today you're on this podcast brother you should be fucking yeah I know this is the ultimate career change this is it no more podcasts after this fuck the pinnacle you're turning earpong fuck's sake now your life has turned around you're on the podcast today you're switching on Christmas lights at night fuck me cup winners cup me Yeah, exactly.

1:09:29But they are. These are the things that please me now. You know, them other things are gone now. These podcasts, that's all changed lives, brother. Your misery and pain at what you've battled through will change lives. No, I hope so. You know, if one person listens to it and they go, that's me, I can relate. And I always say, you know, listen to the similarities. Don't listen to the differences. You know, if a footballer's on 50 grand a week or someone's on 50 grand a week and they're losing 25 grand a week and a postman's on 500 pound a week and he's losing£500 a week, the postman has 100 times worse of problem than the footballer.

1:10:03Forget the£25 ,000. He's still got another£25 ,000. The postman's doing everything. And that's why look at the similarities. Don't look at the differences. Because we can all look at the differences and go, oh, yeah, but that's not me. That's not me. I didn't play football. This addiction takes anybody. It don't matter if you're a postman, a dustman, a barrister, the top lawyer. You could be a multimillionaire. This will take everything. like I say mate the addiction the disease if you're in a million pound gaffer a hundred or you're homeless whatever it is disease is a disease it's the power of addiction so everything else is outside of you but everything in here if you're battling you're fucking gone and people need to understand if you're battling with drink, drugs, gambling whatever it is you're battling with if you've got kids, family you are the all time loser you are an all time failure and it's hard to admit that but once you start admitting okay I need to change but think about your kids in the house and you're away gambling and drinking and taking drugs.

1:10:58My mum was staying in a rough area in Glasgow and all right, I was making dodgy money but I had enough to probably get them out and fucking put them somewhere nice but I just wanted to fund the habit where nobody knew what I was doing. Nobody knew. Everything I'd done was in-house so nobody even knew the extremes that I was going and how dark the fucking depression went with the gambling and then throwing in the drink and the drugs with that. My head was fucking gone but for your status, people will look at you in a different status and think fuck me footballer. Why has he got him wanting to complain?

1:11:23Yeah, put everybody in a line up. everybody's the same they're all fucking battling some disease every day is still a struggle exactly it's like now if I see something I like or my wife sees something I say buy it buy it and she'll go oh it's a bit much I go buy it buy it you know what I mean see I remember having£8 ,000 on table tennis players do you know what I mean I remember that I mean the money's you know if you got it enjoy it do you know what I mean it's not an addiction you don't want it to be an addiction but if you like something nice I work hard now do you know what I mean I have to work for my money.

1:11:56I work hard. And if I want to treat myself, I want to treat myself. Do you know what I mean? I don't get involved in addicted shopping. I don't. I don't because I can. But I am addicted to sugar. You know, I open a packet of sweets and them sweets are all going. I mean, they're all going. And that's what it's like. But it's been good. I mean, I wrote a book a couple of months ago called Hooked, which is about my recovery, about what we talked about today and things like that. And there's hope. It's hope. You know, there's hope for everybody. It don't matter who you are, you know. Start now, this minute.

1:12:33You know, if someone's listening to this and they've had a drink or they've had a bet today or they've had a drug or whatever they've done today, you can start. You don't have to go, oh, you know what, I'll start tomorrow because I'm already in it. Tomorrow never comes. You know, start when you can. Yeah. How was it reading your new book, Hook Paul? That's our fourth book, huh? Yeah, fourth book, you know. But this was, it was hard. It was hard. You know, like when you get well and the fog gets away from the brain and your thinking becomes a little bit better, you know, like 35, they give me my pension.

1:13:09Do you know what I mean? Like at the time I would have kissed their feet. I couldn't believe my luck. You imagine someone turning up to you and saying it's 750 grand. You can have your pension now. I'm an addict. You know, I'll take that all day long. when I look back now I think you knew I was ill you know I mean they knew I was ill and someone earned money out of giving me my money and that's I don't like when people prey on people that are not well I just think it's sick and and that disappointed me now it didn't at the time and it never has since but as I get older and older and it becomes I'm getting 53 now and before I know it, you know, there ain't going to be a job that I can do.

1:13:51I haven't got a pension and I just think people pray. I don't like people who pray on people that are not well, you know, and I've seen it too many times over my life so far. Your new documentary, the one that was just released a couple of weeks ago on BBC, was it? Yeah. Powerful one about your addiction as well. How is it, like, talking about it as much? Because you talk about it with ease now, you talk about it with, fuck it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How do you feel talking about it though? I feel all right. You know, it happens, so I'm comfortable with it. Do you know what I mean? You've worn that?

1:14:23Yeah, it's not like, you know, when I go and do a speech, people go, oh, my God, your story, you know, you don't write anything down. I've done it. You know, I ain't got to make anything up, so I'm comfortable. If you call me in today and say, right, we're going to talk about politics, I ain't got a clue. I ain't got a clue. You know, sometimes it's not always clever to be clever. But, yeah, I mean, I just live in the day. I like talking about it because, you know, with this addiction, you become very selfish when you're in it. When you're out of it, you want to help other people. And that's the name of the game.

1:14:55The more people you help, the weller you stay. It's not like you get well and then forget everybody else. I'm well now. I don't want people to go through what I went through. I want people to have a choice. I didn't have a choice at the time. I didn't know. I didn't know. I'm an ill person today. I'm ill and I'm trying to get, and I'm getting well day at a time. You know, if I, I didn't know at the time. Now, if I had a nut allergy, I wouldn't eat nuts, would I? But, you know, now I know and people who have nut allergies know when they, and it takes whatever it takes to find out when they eat a nut.

1:15:33But when they've done that, they don't eat another nut. And that's the same with addictions. You know, I know what will happen to me if I start doing what I did before. But this will help a lot of people. and I can repeat myself quite a lot in podcasts about addictions and stuff but for new listeners or people maybe it's just sometimes that seed plants and they go do you know what if he can do it if Paul can do it I can do it and we'll not mention any names if there is but is anybody who's still active maybe in football ever came forward to you and says look man I'm fucking I've got an addiction also you know what football haven't even what's name football haven't even been in touch I thought you know I thought you know you might get the odd club that might go I need you to come in you know The gambling's taken over.

1:16:15Sporting Chance, Tony's treatment centre down there for sportsmen is 70-30 gambling now for the first time ever. It's swung round from drinking. Drinking was 70-30, now it's gambling. No clubs, but clubs think that's not a problem, it's their money. Let them do what they want, that won't affect their game. That will affect their game at least 30%. At least. It's a tiring, tiring, draining addiction. It's draining because you're constantly, constantly thinking. Your brain is just ticking over all the time. Can you imagine going on a pitch with a clear head? Do you know what I mean? I mean, it'd be amazing.

1:16:55And that shocked me, really. You know, the clubs haven't gone, you know what, come in and just do a talk for us. I went over to Jersey to talk to the Gambling Commission this week, which was interesting. You know, they want to try and change the laws. they want to try and change it you know and for the compulsive gambler for the addict not for the normal gambler and rightly so if you can gamble normally gamble I would I would if I could drink normally I'd drink normally you know I'm not one of these people who's on a crusade to change the world no chance it's just to give the addict that better chance that better chance you know normal people who can gamble fair play to you fair play yeah you just want to give humans a better life and I understand yeah you know Addicts, you know, we're different.

1:17:41We are different. You know, addicts, you know, we're ill. We have an illness. We're different. You know, not everybody's brain is wired like ours. So, you know, you don't punish everybody else for so many people. But at the same time, don't throw numbers at me that 30 million people can bet normally. But I'm not worried about the 30 million. I'm more worried about whether it be 100 ,000 or one person. that one person you know it's not just that person it's his wife his husband his girlfriend boyfriend partner kids their mum and dad you know their brothers and sisters you know it's not one person is it more women are gambling now as well it was more that man of course yeah women are gambling big boy fucking online roulette but that's a difficult well you know you get to a certain you know women get to a certain age you know they've looked after the kids you know and done one of the hardest jobs in the world in my opinion is looking after kids and being a parent it's difficult it's hard but and then all of a sudden the kids go to school and it's like what do I do now and you know and then it's like well I'll go shopping or or you know how much stuff can you buy you know you buy it you don't open it or you leave it in the cupboard or you leave it in the box your shoes and then all of a sudden you know this bingo and gambling and all that and it you know or you know I have a glass of wine you know I wait till five well it'll be five somewhere you know and it's just little things you know but it's unfortunate I've got three little kids and they keep me very occupied I'm not lying James if I was sitting at home on my own you know and I didn't have little kids and I was on my own 24-7 I'm not going to lie I would find it hard yeah the loneliness will kick in obviously you've got a lot of the sports teams sports or the bigs they are sponsored by gambling as well which is hard because if you're trying to get away from it it's constantly in your face like I say I hear all those noises and you see all the games and even the hotel we're in and now I've seen the Samoa rugby players I'm thinking I wonder what handicap bet they'll play do you know what I mean I'm still constantly betting I'll still constantly put bets on in my head so you can never get away with it the thing is we're not acting on it which is so important but going forward for the future Paul before we finish up brother what's the plans what's the plans for Paul Merson you know my plans is is to get through the day I'm not going to lie I do keep it as simple as I can.

1:20:03I try and keep it simple and then go from there. If I had a, you've got to have plans. As you say, you can't just live day at a time. Otherwise, everything will just pass you by. It's to save and get a house. That's my main thing now. That's my goal, to give my kids the security, you know, to bring them into the world and then leave nothing when that's okay if you haven't got anything. But I have had something, you know, and that's where it's hard. I understand people come in and they haven't got anything and they do an amazing job. Do you know what I mean? But when you've got it and you've lost it, it's hard.

1:20:41Of course it is. It's hard. But I still, I just want to give them that secure. I'm 53. Time goes quickly. I don't know how long you're around, if you know what I mean. And that's scary, but what a career you had, even though you might not feel it, you've got a lot of great memories, you've met some great people, adored by millions like people do adore you people do get so much respect for you Paul that you don't ever forget how far you've come in life don't ever forget what you ever what you ever achieved that even though you want to get a house you'll get it because everything you've ever set your mind to you've been out and done against all the odds against all the bullshit it's probably people thought you would never have stopped gambling never stopped drinking never took drugs so you're sitting here showing what can be done so it's important for people watching that people can make changes if you eventually set your mind to it and believe it yeah exactly at a time keep it simple exactly do you know what I mean keep it simple For anybody watching, Paul, who's maybe struggling with addiction, what advice would you have for them?

1:21:34You're an ill person. You need to get well. You're not a bad person who's trying to get good all the time. You're an ill person. You have to accept that you're ill and you're never going to get better until you get help. And I think that, in a nutshell for me, we're ill people and we need to get well. Yeah. And where can people buy your books, Paul? I think you get it on Amazon. It's in Asda. and I think it's in Waterstones yeah it's called Hooked it will help yeah it will change your life so I'll leave the links in the description Paul but forgive me the time for coming on today pleasure thank you for having me I thoroughly enjoyed that thank you what you're doing is amazing stay strong brother and I'll be keeping that on you for the future cheers mate thank you