Inside Salford's Crime Family - Pat McCann, Over 20 Years in Prison

38:23That's where it started. Yeah, that's where it started. Do you know what I'm saying? And also, every war in the last thousand years, there's been a Scotsman involved in that war. That kind of makes me proud, mate. Yeah, you should be proud, because once you realise, you're like, wow, Scotland, because we just look at it as, I'm for independence as well for Scotland, don't get me wrong. I believe independence should be everywhere in the world. So I believe everybody should have control of their own country. 100%. But we don't. Scotland is a woke country now. It's become softer. It's become weaker.

38:56It's forgot who the fuck it is. It used to fight for freedom and independence. Yeah, man. The Scots, like, listen, they will rise up, mate, 100%. The Scots, I remember something, right, and it's stuck in my head. And obviously, I think it's just been an anniversary of William Wallace as well, yeah. But I remember there was an attack in Scotland, yeah, at the airport. the guy was in the Cherokee I think he was like some doctor or something but the jeeps ended up blowing up all some shit right at the airport do you remember it? yeah yeah maybe over a decade ago but the baggage handler from the airport had him and he said if you come to Scotland we'll sit about you yeah I think his name was John Svito, Steve yeah yeah and I just remember that and I thought yeah that's the Scots yeah because I think they were on fire and he was fucking yeah yeah but he said we'll fucking sit about you and I thought yeah man yeah they've got that fight in blood the Celtics you know what I'm saying but I just think the whole world is full of divide it's full of hate it's full of madness you know and Scotland has become a woke country which is sad to see and I'd like to think they will rise but a lot of people are scared but that's understandable so growing up kids footballers are their idols you've got gangsters and robbers like do you believe that then that's only going to propel you for prison because you're sort of role models are criminals yeah so yeah because that's all i'm looking at them and thinking i want to do that i want to be better than what he's done i want to be bigger than that and it's just um it's a slippery slope because you're surrounded by other people that are doing it and you're always finding ways to make it sound normal and do you know i'm saying and justify things when really it's not it's a fucked up life to live to um to go out and steal things off other people it's not good to do and i'm not proud of it and i've got my own hands and feet what god gave me to go out and get my own stuff i shouldn't have to go and steal over people's so i feel like that now sincerely i hadn't thought but back then it's hard to feel like that because all i wanted to do was have money because we was very poor do you know what i'm saying my mum was on her own she didn't have her her family she'd run away from my dad so she didn't even want people to know where we was so my mum don't get it wrong she got a hustle on and she did exactly what she everything she could to get exactly what we needed whether it was christmas east or new uniforms so she did her best but the poverty was still there we was poor do you know what i mean we might have had a lot of things but we're still poor and i'm thinking like most other people this is the fast track out of poverty i'm gonna be able to rob a million pounds but even back then like a hundred grand it was it was massive money do you know like now you don't look at it the same but back then 30 odd years ago that's how i was thinking and you know cash machine sold a hundred grand do you know what i'm saying after your five what happened so after my five um i got back with my beautiful wife man like we'd had a little break we've been together since we was 15 um on we've known each other since we was like 13 and 12 or some lived on the same street and then yeah um i asked her to be my girlfriend when we were kids and then yeah we was boyfriend i don't even think it was real was it like it was boyfriend and girlfriend and then we was together for like three four years split up um i was an idiot i was a young man do you know what i mean and i did it i wasn't the best guy to her the way i should have been and uh yeah i was in and out of prison i was putting my mates before her do you know what i mean and i wanted to be out with the lad rather than be with her so we split up and we was apart for like five years it was apart from 03 to 08 and then i come home in 08 we got back together and she i stayed out of trouble relatively then.

43:01This might sound a bit warped but it's the way the criminal mindset thinks so I'm thinking, I'm selling drugs, I'm thinking I'm a straight head now. Do you know what I mean? Because I'm thinking I'm not out doing robberies. This is straight so I was doing drugs and stuff but I hated that I've ever got involved in that. I hate drugs. What did you end up back in prison for? I didn't go back to prison then It was in 2008 Till 2015 What was that for? For firearms So you'd done for firearms What was the sentence? Yeah 18 years You know So what are you thinking then Life sentence? Yeah I was thinking So you stayed out of trouble Between then?

43:44Yeah I stayed out On the graft Just trying to make money Mrs and my kids Yeah I was doing drugs Do you know what I'm saying And you became a father For the first time? Yeah I became a father How was that for you? That was a massive shock To the system for me that because once my kids was there it's like it's scarier as a man to think right that I've got to protect these so it changed me from wanting to go out and do robberies and do those um more daring things because you got to be daring to really go and put hit the pavement like that you can't be half-hearted. It's not for the weak or the fake-hearted.

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45:50Once my children was there, I knew that I can't step like that. I've not got it in me, no way, because of the fear of going away from my children. So, yeah, that made me, like, change. But to be honest, I was still an idiot. I still wanted to be a gangster. Like, still a sausage, do you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm not leading, for example, for my people, for my children. I'm still thinking I'm fucking the big man. Do you know what I'm saying? so I'm still carrying myself like that like yeah oh I want all that attention I want people to think these kind of things like now I don't give a shit what people think why should I do you know what I mean I think Elon Musk cares if I just say he's a dick he's not asked is he do you know what I mean like so yeah but how was it getting an 18 then you've got your message you've got two kids mate to be honest yeah I took that on the chin like boom because I was expecting higher so I was thinking it was four shootings do you know what I'm saying because Spirits have four shootings over like a two three day period and yeah so I was thinking I'm getting fucking slammed yeah or like ADS where I've got to do two thirds of it or something do you know what I mean but it was even though I wasn't saying oh I could have got worse it was a stitch on me I shouldn't have got that long all I did was got my friend a gun do you know what I'm saying friends phoned me to get a strap and that was it Yeah, but that is conspiracy because if he kills two bodies, you're doing more than him.

47:21Yeah, basically, yeah. Do you know what I'm saying? I got longer than him. I've never done anything. You've got a big side. You gave some kind of gun. Yeah, no, I know. But let me give a bit of context to that. Yeah, I understand what you're saying, but obviously... No, no, no. So what I'm saying is, yeah, that was what I was accused of facilitating a firearm. but by the time I got sentenced I was sentenced as a shooter do you know what I'm saying so really I should have got a 10 for facilitating a firearm but by the time sentence come the indictment's been changed around I'm the leader of the OCG yeah and I'm a shooter now do you know what I'm saying and we'd already gone guilty so we'd already gone guilty and then four months later it got changed I don't want to get into that why it got changed but yeah it got changed and I got put as a shooter so I got 18 years what did you do?

48:18if you didn't plead to it you'd get 25 no so basically I got, my credit was 18 years and the credit brought it down to 17 years, 2 months so it took 10 months off but guess what I got that 10 months put back on in jail for phones, I got jailed for an iPhone I got jailed for a Zanco getting extra time added on what June were you in I was in Strangeways Garth Armless Strangeways Garth Full Sutton Dovegate Oakwood Fossway Earl Stoke Portland got released from Portland I've done I've done about 25-30 prisons in my life what's the worst one just done 10 erm erm I don't know all the same yeah like a shovel's a shovel to me Strangeways is fucking Strange Ways is home, isn't it?

49:12It's very violent right now. It's the most violent prison in the country. But we are the most unruly prisoners, James, the Mancunians. The POA openly say that, that the Mancunians are the most unruly prisoners in the prison system. Us and the Scousers, because of Strange Ways riots, they've not forgot that it was a month, took the full prison for 25 days. so the cons for 25 days had the full run of the prison and that's something that the poa and they don't forget lightly so wherever the mancs are around the prison system because this is another thing this country is a very small prison population and even though we lock up twice as many as any other european country we've got more prisons probably more prisons in london than there in germany this is a like a fact honestly germany france they have small amounts of prisons we have like some cities have five or six prisons in here but there's 70 million people in the country yeah there's um 87 000 is the british estate for prisons so say if 20 000 of them are like women another 10 000 of them are like um young offenders yeah then you've got like like another 10 ,000, maybe 20 ,000 nonces, yeah?

50:46Then another 10 ,000 accidental criminals, like wrong place, wrong time. There's probably 10 ,000 hardcore villains in the system. And if you've gone once and you're one of them, you're always going to see one of them. Do you know what I mean? No matter what establishment you're in in the country, I've never since my very first time to jail I've never been back to jail I've not known nobody never so in a nutshell the whole British prison system could fit inside of Wembley Stadium do you know what I mean so that lets you know it's not that big if you've ever been to a game at Wembley or something the whole British everybody who's locked up in England could fit inside of Wembley Stadium what's the worst thing you've seen in prison erm I've seen like, to be honest, yeah, the worst thing I've seen in prison is probably self-harms.

51:46Do you know what I mean? I've seen some bad self-harm happening and I've seen a lot of stabbings and slashings and stuff like that, yeah. But you can wrap your head around that because, you know, you're in the jungle, survival. but the self-harm I've seen people do to the self, certain things you can't unsee. They'll never leave you. Do you know what I'm saying? I've seen guys cut his own eyelids off, his own ears, nose, his own lip. I've seen a guy that has got no skin on his body to cut himself no more. He has to cut old cuts. Do you know what I'm saying? Because he's literally, James, he's cut himself that many times that he can't do it no more.

52:32So that's probably the worstest thing I've seen in prison. And also to see a man break, especially if it's someone you respect, someone you like, and you see them go, and then it's usually over a woman. Do you know what I mean? And you see a man go like that, that ain't nice, because if I love you, I love very deep. and if I see you hurt, I'm an empath. I hurt also and I've seen a couple of my friends like lose their head and not being able to help them or do anything for them and then have to hurl other people staggering them off and stuff. Because you can't, once someone's gone, you can't start backing them all of the time.

53:15Like people talk, it's reality, it's what it is. Do you know what I mean? So when you hear that and you see someone that you looked up to and had the greatest respect for and stuff, then you see them go. and yeah man they just lose the self respect and stuff and those kind of things are hard Jordan sings about it your dad passed away in prison yeah my dad passed away in prison when was this? 2016 September 2000 yeah did that play in your mind when you're in prison? yeah because did Jordan not sing I think he's done a song where he was in the same cell as your dad yeah man that's a mad one Jordan was actually on the same landing is that true?

53:54yeah Jordan was on the same landing as my dad yeah I've never been there but my big brother's been in Preston and Jordan's been in Preston I went once I've been in a visit I visited my dad in there I visited Jordan in there I had to fight on the visit with Jordan in there me and Jordan had a massive fight remember babe I've gone to visit him me and my mum and ended up having a scrap on the visit but I know what it was because when I've walked in that visit I'm in this jail and I know my daddy's died in here and that's the last place I seen my dad alive was in that jail. So now I'm visiting my dad's youngest son in here.

54:32It must have just brought all of these emotions because I've ended up shouting at him and stuff and God love him in his own little mind. He's probably going through his own motions and I'm coming on a visit, screaming at him and he just fucking smacked me. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I've got carton I've dragged out of the visit. He's just fucking... But I'm shouting at him, I'm like, you need to stop this for mum you're fucking do you know what I'm saying when really I have no right to speak to him like that big brother or not because I could have treated my mum just as bad as him and caused her just as much stress but I just think it was the emotions of being in that building knowing where my daddy was last yeah and um yeah another time I did go in there James I was in Lancaster Farms as a juvenile, young offenders prison.

55:18And I was going, so I was coming from Lancaster, you pass through Preston into Manchester, yeah? So they stopped off at Preston to pick someone up that they're bringing to court. I'm on my way to court in Manchester. And I'm like, out to the jail, or let me off, I need a piss. They say no, because I think I want to go in there, I want to walk in there, I've never been in this prison, we're at the reception. Fox News is streaming live on Fox One, bringing you the stories you won't hear anywhere else. Live coverage, sharp analysis, real perspective. Stream now. Who says Halloween only lasts one day?

55:56With Wayfair, one night of Halloween becomes a whole season at home. From larger-than-life yard decor and moody lighting to festive accents for every room in the house, Wayfair has what you need to make Halloween feel like magic all in one place. Because the best Halloween memories aren't made in just one night. They're made all season long. Shop Halloween decor now at Wayfair.com. So I'm like, if you don't let me off, I'm going to piss here now. So I'm like, right, I'm going to fucking piss in the cubicle. And they've unlocked me, brought me in. I've walked into the reception. They didn't even use the toilet.

56:32As soon as I walked into the reception, I just said, nah, get me out of here. Just felt it. A lot of people that have been in that prison tell me it's a hell hole. pressed him but yeah um to be honest um while we're on that subject my dad yeah he he basically killed himself because he took tablets but my personal view is i don't think he committed suicide i don't think he intentionally killed himself killed himself by consuming those tablets um but he didn't leave a note for his family this was a very proud man loved his family james seven children and a wife at home um me and myself being in jail for years knowing like there's no way people don't do that people say what's going on and why and he never left a note and also he pressed his belt his um cell buzzer emergency buzzer he pressed that so um yeah if if um a man was trying to kill himself intentionally i don't think he would have pressed the bell and I think he would have left a note for his family.

57:42See when you're doing an 18, do you feel potentially that you could have died in prison as well where you think it could be the same when you're doing such a big sentence? Yeah, it was up. My fear was I'm going to die in here. That's all, that's all, my whole, that last 10, that's all I was thinking is I'm going to die in here and now I am. Because I was just thinking it's history repeating itself. I'm gonna die in here my children like my daddy what you have to understand about my dad as well Sharpie Jim McCann legend my daddy yeah he's he was in the bed with my grandfather when my grandfather died my daddy was only seven Jordan was seven when his dad died six, seven and so my dad got into bed during a camp in Manchester in caravans and my dad gets in with my grandfather in the bed and my dad has a little tangerine, yeah.

58:42And my grandfather's saying, give me some, give me some and he never gave them some. And then when my daddy woke up in the morning, my grandfather was dead in the bed, stone cold. So, yeah, then that ended up being my dad staying in Manchester. And my dad was actually, my dad's a Salford, he was born in Salford, my dad, yeah. But he's full traveller. his mum was a ward his dad was a McCann shout my granny with him and my grandfather Jim as well but when my grandfather died in Manchester that was then my granny stayed in Manchester whereas we probably wouldn't my dad and I wouldn't have stayed if my grandfather was alive they would have stayed traveling they probably would have more been in the West Midlands but when my grandfather died on that camp it was in 66 and yeah 1966, 1966 so when that happened she stayed in Manchester so my dad similar to me he was brought up in a house yeah until he was about 15 16 then my great uncles my dad's uncles they've come and picked him up and brought him to the Midlands and been like look because he's getting brought up on the council estate single mum they've showed him the way like come on this is what you're doing and he was one of the best men in the country my dad to get work like the jobs he got boom everybody wanted to be partners with my daddy everybody wanted to work with him people from all different families because he could get the work and then he'd always come back to manchester and everything would just up can you see this sort of psycho you visiting your dad in prison your kids visit you in prison yeah somebody needs to break the chin you say that yeah james but to be honest like i know exactly who i am i know exactly what blood runs through my veins yeah and i'm under no illusions mate of what my ancestors have been through and i'd say oh century my bloodline's got a millennial of british prisons mate whether they're colony prisons around the world or the stone concrete walls on the mainland so i'm not under no I'm not we're not unique my family aren't unique do you know what I'm saying I know this is this is what runs through my veins and this is probably what my grandchildren are going through like you know what I'm saying you just accept that it's just sort of madness against the famine and the crown everybody put me down like it is what it is mate you can't escape that yeah we might have more technology and it's 2026 but I'm not under no illusion who I am and who my people are, where I come from and what I won't stand for and what I will stand for.

1:01:26So if I have to stand for something yeah, and that might mean prison, I'll stand for that, not a problem. Because like I said, I know where I come from. Do you know what I mean? When did you get out? August 21st 2025. So still very recently. Yeah. How was it getting out after the big one? Oh man. Because as you get older you do start looking at life a little differently. yeah there's a lot of people big percentage of people do go back no matter what sentence they do but what are you thinking then after the big one 2025 when you get out mate it was a hard one you know because like i'm gonna be honest mate i come home james to no family bro do you know i'm saying i come home to my wife and my two children um like it was bad i had to get a train home yeah i had to get a train home from portland basically portland's an island off the coast of Dorset yeah it's an old proper old Victorian prison it's a little island called Portland and yeah man I had to get a train home from there with all of these things in my mind thinking shit then I come home and get to the train station and it's just my beautiful wife and my two children do you know what I mean and I wouldn't have wanted anybody else to be there don't get me wrong but yeah it was like a bit of a shock to me like I was like wow coming home like this everything I'd done for my fucking town, my estate, like, and yeah, mate, it's just one of them.

1:02:50It took a bit for me to get my head wrapped around things, but what it was, I'd been, you know, I'd been arguing with my family and stuff before I'd come home. Probably also, I'm Muslim, I'm coming home Muslim, do you know what I'm saying? So, like, in the last ten months of my sentence, I took my shahad, I became Muslim. So, that's a massive shock for my family, bro, the Irish Catholics. Do you know what I mean? So I think that would have played a part in it. But, you know, I've got friends also, I've got cousins and friends that I would have died for. I don't speak to them no more because I'm Muslim.

1:03:27These are people that I would have really died for, yeah? People that I love, that I still love. And, you know, if God wants them people back in my life, then he'll soften their hearts. If he doesn't, I don't care. Do you know what I'm saying? So you're a Catholic man, raised Christian. I was raised Catholic, yeah. What about you? I'm Catholic But in prison system A lot of people become Muslim. I thought he was Rangers family, James. Nah, Celtic bro. I thought he was Rangers. He was from my family, no Rangers? Right, right, right, right. Yeah, so a lot of people go Muslim. A lot of the white guys go Muslim for the extra perks.

1:04:05We know this. When they come out, they don't even follow up. What was the idea behind it? How would you go Christianity to Islam? So basically, the years and years of what I've been through in jail. So obviously online, I got a lot of people going, Muslim convert and like they don't know they're looking at me thinking fat guy yeah yeah you know what I'm saying I know I'm not stupid they don't know that I'm a motherfucker do you know what I'm saying and like I've I've been this for me jail is nothing no no man has ever like ever in any prison in this country has ever violated me and got away with it inside of a prison so and if um Muslims in um the prisons a lot of people do turn Muslim in prison yeah because not um nobody's compelled because in Islam you can't you cannot make I can't make you become a believer I can't pressure you to accept this because then your heart's not in it but a lot of people do it in prison it's like fashion a lot of london kids and stuff are like it's like like it's a fashion thing do you know what i'm saying so but that's like with anything there's going to be a stigma attached to it but for me um the biggest thing in islam for me was finding this peace because i'm so internally conflicted also no i've i've like i'm a student of scripture

1:05:39and nothing has ever settled my questions of where we are in the universe, where I stand in, like we're just on this rock spinning through space, yeah, around a massive ball of fire. Like, I'm a ponderer. I always think in me, James. And today as we stand in 2026, even me and you, lots of other people, we don't really have our own thoughts I know we think we do, but we wasn't made to process this much data and imagery, what we do today. We could process, I could process it this morning just on my phone, probably more imagery than a man 1500 years ago did in his lifetime. I could do in one day.

1:06:24Your brain is just a computer. so our subconscious is littered with stuff that was not ours the the ancient people they're like in mesopotamia the ancient greeks and the ancient egyptians these people they just had the stars at night to ponder and stuff and think so i do so many great thinkers and philosophers back then but so they us we have a lot of other shit in our mind so because i've done lots and lots of solitary even without a book james even without a bible you get to find your own thoughts back and your own things so with me i've always been respectful to every religion but i was islamophobic because i was such a staunch catholic and i was had a fear that islam is gonna take over catholicism and do you know what i mean so in my mind i was like oh it's a war but after reading and learning and coming to an understanding of like no this it's all connected this is just the last chapter in like there's been four great books over 120 000 prophets have come from the creation of man so there's so much stuff in the quran that if you are a thinker like me or someone who's the scriptures you start reading the Quran you're going to become Muslim you're going to find peace and you're going to become Muslim like if people I see people go I've read the Quran and I think sweet but I know they're lying because anyone who reads the Quran with no bias and um opens the heart and reads it and takes it in they will not have a problem with islam islam can save the world james did the the thing what really upsets me is don't forget i've took on the whole far right on my own yeah the whole far right came for me tommy robinson all of them yeah no the thing with islam is people say it's the enemy it's this yeah islam is here to save humanity it's the last bastion in humanity nuclear weapons are haram yeah they're not allowed like nuclear weapons are a no-no now the people in this country are the working class people from areas especially in northern towns yeah they are championing the likes of Nigel Farage for me what's so upsetting is I know that this man and the reform are the arch enemy of the working class people the arch enemy they do not have no working class person's interest at heart, none of them and I'm very observant and I'm a very political person and I've watched the reform party and I ain't got nothing good to say about any of them but when I see the people that should be scared of Naevajah Faraj, the people in Blackburn, in Burnley, in these low-income towns, in these northern towns he's a hero in these towns these is this these places is strong holes for Faraj yeah but you you should be opposed to him and um so when I come home yeah and I'm seeing all of this uh propaganda on all this far right shit I started speaking out because I couldn't I didn't have to yeah my my missus built while I was in jail she built my Macario music you know on my Instagram, she built it up, she was sharing all of the kids from jail because I was down the block or whatever, she, you know, she was going out of her way and I'd phone her and she was doing it and she built it up and I had a good thing going on with my music and I just can't see something and not say something, if I, you know, I thought I'm doing myself a disservice, don't get me wrong, I've been shadow banned and all that stuff but I just can't stand the fire right and I thought I I need to speak out about these people.

1:10:34And yeah, so anyway, I'm going off a bit. So back to Islam, yeah? So I was in jail, yeah? And shout out Father Leonard James. I need to tell you about Father Leonard Cox. Shout out Father Leonard Cox. I confirmed three Catholics with him just in Dovegate, yeah? I was there four years. Confirmed three Catholics in that prison alone. Father Leonard, right, yeah? He's the only Catholic priest in the world. Catholic priest he's married right check this Father Leonard he's in Birmingham his diocese is there St Margaret and Mary's church yeah and I know you know Father Leonard I hope you're still well alive and kicking and I hope he won't mind me telling this story he's a dear friend of mine Father Leonard and so he was a Church of England vicar he had a church yeah but really he was a Catholic right his stepdad made him be Protestant but he was brought his mother was Catholic, his grandmother, so he's grown up in the Church of England, Protestant, yeah, he's in church, he's giving out mass, so he's giving out Holy Communion, he's doing mass inside of the Church of England, do you understand what I'm saying?

1:11:49so instead of doing a Church of England service he's doing mass he's giving Holy Communion everything so they got onto him what he's doing and they disown him, they take his house, his church, you're gone how dare you sacrilege this, what you're doing so the Pope finds out what he's done the Pope flies Father Leonard out to Rome, face to face the Pope says listen, what you was doing was brilliant he said like that I can't believe that you're in England yeah in actual England the head of the church of England is the king or the queen at that time yeah and you're there giving out catholic mass and holy communion so he says to him I want you to become a catholic priest and he said but I'm married and the pope said do not worry you can keep your wife I need you as a catholic priest so that's how father Leonard became a catholic priest right and I used to have deep chats with him so we tell one day he tells me have you heard of Iona in Scotland Patrick so I said no there's a little island called Iona right it's where Colombo he brought Christianity to Scotland Colombo 1500 years ago this like 500 year AD his father was called Nile in the island Colombo so Nile was King Nile in Ireland and Colombo has a fallen out of his father over scripture so he comes to scotland he leaves on a little boat he leaves ireland a little boat few months and some scripture and he goes and he lands in iona do you know the island in the hebrides and he builds the monastery there yeah so he builds this monastery there 1500 years ago and then so far the reason fatherland is telling me about this because he's just come back from visiting there and i'm like what and he shows me the pictures he brings the pictures in he's like look he said between that island pie said and america there's nothing but the atlantic he said it's so beautiful then he gets to tell him that this man from glasgow just william mcdougall or something like that right takes a load of kids from glasgow 30 odd years ago somewhere up to this island because that monastery what colombo was built yeah it's fell into disrepair so he takes these young kids up these neds whatever they call them non-inducated delinquents yeah he takes them the jock's always been the good words out he brings them up there yeah and um they're fixing it up and they build it back up and princess diana's mum she heard what he's doing she was catholic she starts donating stuff to him so father leonard told me this story then he's telling this man this story on the actual island james because he visits it three times a year right and the man is telling this is a glaswegian man he's telling him and he's like yeah i know because i was one of the kids that came with willy and rebuilt it so anyway he's telling me this story right and i'm like wow this is amazing i want to look at these things then the imam comes in so fatherland is like oh come here imam sit down say hello to patrick right chatting to the imam then fatherland says to me patrick do you know that mera and in mary is you if you know with Catholic she's you know Catholics are very devout to Mera where Protestants Church of England is not what Catholics are as you know very very devout and he's like do you know Mera has got the only female in Islam with her own chapter in the Quran and I was like no way I didn't know that no and then the imam's talking so then we're talking and then when I'm doing prayers yeah and every Sunday at mass, I do prayer, open prayer and I'll talk and I was praying for the Rohingyas and the Uyghurs, they're Muslim people, the Uyghurs are in China and the Rohingyas are like Myanmar, Bangladesh, but they're an oppressed people, a people that's getting persecuted, so I was praying for them and then Father Len come up to me and he's like, I really like Patrick, that he was praying, that you mentioned the Uyghurs and the Rohingyas and I'm like yeah, you know, any oppressed people anywhere in the world.

1:16:10And then Father Leonard tells me, he says, get this book about an Arab perspective on Jesus. So I'll get this book, Arab perspective on Jesus, and read that book. And then this is like four years or something before I became Muslim. And yeah, so I read that book, and then I go to another prison now, yeah? I go to a sea cat prison, yeah, and the war in Gaza's kicked off bad and I just couldn't watch it. I was watching it and I couldn't, I was getting so stressed out. So one day, my friend Isaac, I said, it was during Ramadan, I said, I want to fast today, just in solidarity with the kids in Gaza.

1:17:01like it's knocking me sick seeing it on the news Al Jazeera was on the news every day then they took it off the telly now you can only watch it on the telly if it's internet connected yeah so my mate's like yeah he said I'll do it with you so we did that and then the next day after that night I felt so good and then the next day I'd made up my mind I knew like I'm I'm gonna do this and I'm becoming Muslim and the next day somebody passed away who from Manchester well-known person yeah and very fit man as well he'd been in 20 years he had the 10 or something left to do and he'd passed away and my other mates come to me and he's like who heard that I said I know I know and he said Pa man you know look at all your fucking you're overweight and stuff as well you don't know if you're gonna make it out of here you and then that was it that day I said yeah I became Muslim and then I just went and did it but don't forget I wasn't even like chilling with Muslims James you know what I'm saying all my mates that are around me are like um they're from Salford or Manchester or Liverpool yeah so um don't get me wrong I had a few Muslim mates but I wasn't chilling with them like with the boys so then when I'm come back I'm Muslim and then I'm like I can't I'm not eating that yeah you know like a bacon grill and stuff people are like what I'm not eating that I'm not eating that and people are just like people couldn't understand my close friends that really know me they understand but some of my friends were like you're the most catholic guy I ever met yeah yeah you don't stop so and I'm like yeah exactly that's what's led me to do this like because you you could only go so far and i know what i'm upset your faith james you're a catholic any other i was raised catholic i'm not religious yeah i am i question it all the free abraham religions they're all sort of similar in a way it's whatever person buys into it you could be raised you can be raised anywhere and see the world where your surroundings is so i don't judge anybody i just sit back and question it all jesus has mentioned in the kran many times more times than i know muslim people who are amazing people i know plenty christians are amazing people and i know plenty cunts in both religions there's demonic there's extremists there's killers and paedophiles in all religions as well i think we need to take away the words the religious word of what this person is just label betray them as fucking evil evil you know so I think the divide is part of the problem I just sit back and question oh I don't care if you're good to me I'm good to you I don't give a fuck what you are I believe James also that I believe that 1 % of all humanity is bad and that 99 % is good you know and that doesn't matter what creed or faith you come from so what are you thinking when you came out Muslim Christian guy in for robberies and ain't coming out yeah so It must be a shock It is funny as well Because people think Nah You've been in there Getting better food You can't do this No but how could I Because I've only done it At the end of my sentence It's not like I did that At the beginning When I first went to jail Like I did it At the end of 20 years So why do you Believe in it so much Why did Why did transition Because I don't even think You can go from Islam To Christianity Can you Yeah Can you go Yeah Is that not Kind of like No but like Listen This is what I'm saying So I don't know Because I've never read them So for me right I'll tell you now exactly how it goes Mark John Luke Matthew the Gospels that we know that's in the New Testament who was the they writ by you don't know no right so nobody does so it wasn't by the people that they're saying it was by they when the Bible was canonised there was a meeting called the Council of Nicaea and Paul went there now Paul Paul was called Saul in the Bible.

1:21:07He was called Saul, yeah? And he was persecuting Christians, killing them, capturing them and killing them. Then he has a change of heart. He says that some Jesus speech to him, he says, yeah? This is what Paul says in the Bible. And then he's like, oh no, he's a Christian now. So Paul was like nearly 300 years after Jesus, yeah? Three centuries later. And he's there when these books get ripped. these four Gospels. I've always been an Old Testament person. I don't know where you are with the Bible. I've never read that. Right, so me. I've just raised it through school. I think it was not 30 Jewish people who wrote the Bible.

1:21:48Did I not say it was 30 Jewish men who wrote the Bible? Well, so it was, the Bible is 66 books, so the Bible wasn't. It's been changed, man. No, no, no, it's not that it's been changed. It's different books of different times. There's a chronological. cool so the the bible and the quran and the torah is 6 000 years of history that's it so bible was first yeah so the torah's first yeah obviously uh the first five books of the bible is the torah so the the but they have another book as well i believe jesus existed i believe it was black where was it joshua or something is that is joshua or something yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I believe he existed.

1:22:31There's plenty of evidence to say he existed. But for me, man, with so many gods and so many religions, I question who's right. No, I know. I know. So the thing is, yeah, when you're a Muslim, you accept it all. This is what I'm saying. So there's 66 books. So from the beginning. So should we talk about the creation? You can talk about what you want. Right. So the creation, people, this is an RE class today as well. So the creation story of us is that Allah, subhanahu wa ta 'ala, God, created us, Adam, from clay. He creates us from clay and he assembles his angels to say, look at this creation.

1:23:19Now, one of these angels is called Iblis or Shaitan, to Satan, Lucifer. yeah so this one angel the devil he says i am not bowing down to that yeah god says why he says i'm not bowing down to him because i'm made from fire he's made from clay right so there's a little a dispute the disobedience from one of the angels yeah he then takes the shape of a serpent and convinces Eve to bite the apple, right, then us, we are sent here as a punishment, yeah, Adam and Eve were sent to earth as a punishment, naked as well, yeah, they were sent here naked, different parts of the planet, they met up and parented, humanity, now they were sent here, but also the devil was sent here, yeah, to prove to God that he can corrupt us, that our species, our creation, yeah, was not worthy of him to bow down to because we're corruptible.

1:24:36So he's been here. Now, there's been 120 ,000 prophets sent and four great books. And you follow this, you get back the whole time the devil has been here. and the devil's made of fire yeah the angels is made of fire we was made of clay right in in in heaven in eden we was made of clay no clay is 70 percent water we're 70 percent water water is the only thing in the universe that can kill fire so the devil's made of fire but we're made of water so every human has that goodness inside him to be able to overcome and defeat the devil do you know what i'm saying and um so we come here and humans um if you look at every other planet every other species on the planet sorry every species james and they can survive four seasons outside in their habitat it takes us two years to acclimatize to the gravity of this planet before we can even stand up yeah a shark's born swimming a horse is born it can stand up and walk yeah we need to take the animals what are indigenous to this planet and peel their skin do you know what i'm saying to survive like have you never questioned are we even from here yeah of course, I don't know, do you?

1:26:12Right, so that, so that, that suffices for me, the creation story in Islam, yeah, it satisfies everything, the scientific stuff, the stuff about the mountains being three times as deep as they are high, they act as stakes, yeah, things about biology, things about the human biology, things about the stuff in the Quran what they're, scientists are just discovering today now it's hard i understand for a lot of people a lot of white people like you said oh i've got i know good muslims bad muslims no matter what but i know people still what they still think in their head because i'm a human myself mate and i've been there i've looked at someone who's white and muslim and thought he's radged yeah yeah i i have do you know what i'm He's rad because I couldn't comprehend.

1:27:09Yeah. And when you embrace Islam and you realize there's no colors, there's nothing but the worship of one God, that's it. No partners, no association, the worship of one God. It teaches you to not drink. I don't drink. I don't take drugs. I smoke weed. Yeah. That's not a drug. right so i weed god put that there right now if i go and get um a card to say that this weed is for my medical whatever that's halal man no god knows your intention i don't smoke weed to get high james yeah i smoke weed to deal with my ptsd and my other personality disorders because what happened with my daddy he overdosed on tablets yeah so i've never been a fan of taking tablets do you know what i mean but i know that i'm i've got a few issues um what obviously comes from a lifestyle and prison so the weed it keeps my ptsd at bay so i don't smoke weed to get high i smoke it for a medicine did you think the backlash would be so big when you if you've done that video and you were saying free this trip and you had the outfit on and yeah you're out the mosque no i was just outside my house what it was i'd basically i'd put a i'd put a post up a few weeks before that at the start of ramadan so like four weeks before and i got bare stick james you know what i'm saying and like i've got an ego still i can sit here and all of course i've still got an ego i've still got that but i've got that instinct to to activate you know what i'm happening i'm fucking fuming bro i want to hurt people yeah but god is working inside of me and like nah this is the other thing what people need to realize like me being muslim has stopped me doing so much stuff already and it's put i had never had an ounce of forgiveness catholics talk i'll forgive when i was catholic mate i i wasn't forgiving nothing yeah nothing like no do you know if it was forgiving something it was a lie but now being Muslim I have that forgiveness so I was I was getting it yeah and no matter who you are mate it's hard like one little comment can piss you off yeah I'm getting bad comments me bad good comments essays of people saying oh you're great all of this yeah one little dickhead with no picture and no followers says something and it's in my head you know what I'm saying so it's human nature so I was getting so badly trolled so when I that post that went like that was viral but that that post yeah I was a bit like I was in people's faces because I was like I wanted to ram it down people's throats because I'm pissed off from getting trolled for a month do you know what I'm saying but as a Muslim I have let myself down a little bit because I should be doing more I should be giving more dawah I should this like the way I'm talking about things here now about the creation and all of these things and about how you should love Jesus.

1:30:14My Islamic name is Esau, yeah? And that's Jesus, that's Arabic for Jesus. But I've not been doing enough, giving out enough dower and trying to educate people. Even if you don't want to be religious, just don't hate someone else's religion. Don't fall into the trap of thinking that this is bad because I've been there before and I've thought that. And there's so many people around the world. I mean, Tucker Carlson, you know, Tucker Carlson now for years when Tucker was on Fox News he had his ankle show on there and he was nothing but slating Islam and Muslims all of the time he's you know he's got the balls to come out now and say I got it wrong yeah I got that wrong like nah Islam is not the problem do you know what I'm saying?

1:31:01What do you think the problem is then? Me the problem is corruption the problem is capitalism the problem is the money doesn't exist it's an imagined belief 500 years ago in this country you had goldsmiths and silversmiths and you'd take your gold in and they'd say yeah James there's a receipt to say how much gold you have and the goldsmiths and the silversmiths yeah they realised that wow everyone never comes for the gold so we can print these receipts yeah that that was basically how fractional reserve banking was born frb it's a legal practice what banks still practice today fractional reserve banking yeah so that means that they can loan out 10 million even though the vote only holds 1 million if i do that it's fraud or something so the goldsmiths and the silversmiths realize something there oh hang on we can do this yeah Then the Bank of London, you know, comes about, yeah, by the Bank of England, sorry, yeah.

1:32:13That gets took over by a certain firm of people. And then for the last 500 years, like the world has been under their strings, basically, because the money makes the world go round. So also we live in capitalist cities. We live, you know, capitalism. I'm a capitalist. You're a capitalist. But we're mass consumers. And then advertisement makes the world go round. Yeah. So we're mass consumers. We see something. Rolex. I want it. I see that. I want Gucci. We want it because we're seeing the advertisements for it. So then that leaves us way more easier to be manipulated with propaganda as well. so because we live under that we don't see it because we're just a part of it but once you realize and you think nah it's fucked that's fucked so you've got all these poor people around the world and majority of these poor places a lot of poor muslim places poor christian places in the third world and we're over here and if you look at what we've done for money me just personally me myself the shit i've done i'm ashamed of do you know i'm saying like i've hurt people or scared or whatever, I've done what just for that for money.

1:33:33Because in the reality of it is, if I lived, I had a piece of grass here by this river and there was a forest there, like me and my son could go and fish every day. We could go and chop down wood, build a house out of that wood, could burn it for fire every day. Her and my daughter could be cleaning the pots or doing whatever. Like, what do we need money for? Do you know what I'm saying? money is being introduced to us for one thing and one thing alone that is corruption yeah is to corrupt us as a species what did judas sell out jesus for do you know what i'm saying so the money and the people that control the money yeah that's that's the problem because they're the same people that are dividing they're the same people that are undermining the integrity of Europe they want Europe on its back do you know what I'm saying so these these things are going on yeah and I'm not just going to say oh it's Jews because that's ridiculous I've got some great Jewish friends yeah and they are just as upset as me and other people at what's going on under the guise of any religion you know what I'm saying so what's really going on is elite people yeah these elite elite people and they might be christian they might be muslim they might be jew they might be hindu they're all elite and they have a say in certain things that none of us will never know about i'm sure you know about the foods james the ultra processed foods yeah the water supplies like us as as i think about this yeah i'm a traveler used to being outside a lot never had no jabs me as a child never had a tb none of these things skills and we're out playing in muck and you know messing around like if if you just look at the way the medicine and food is controlled do you know what i'm saying like the our species since cave was outside bare vitamin D yeah eating fresh veg so we was outside for thousands of years yeah hunter gatherers then 30 ,000 years ago 25 ,000 years ago Homo sapiens domesticated wild wheat yeah so we domesticate this wheat then agriculture is born so for thousands of more years we're in the field yeah you're outside all day 150 years ago 170 odd years ago industrial revolution everyone's pushed into factories pushed down coal mines into houses so our bone density is shrinking this is proved by archaeologists um on dig sites and they're taking bones from 700 800 years ago our density our bones is shrinking because we're all we're indoors all day we're told to put sunscreen on to protect you from the sun the sun gives life to everything on the face of the planet do you know what i'm saying so we're controlled through these revolutions the industrial revolution we're in the middle of a digital revolution right so our species has been controlled and pushed down since the industrial revolution yeah do you think we're devolving yeah we're devolving yeah because we're becoming less intelligent right kids will the faith that people have in chat GPT and technology is unbelievable because all those having all of this faith in that it's going to be so easy for that to hoodwink us what do you think life is?

1:37:34I think life is to live you know what I'm saying you think humans know how to live we've ever been looking through our system your whole life no we're full this is that we're fully programmed yeah like we are fully programmed if i'm born in china i'm going to speak chinese i don't know what the fuck's coming out of my mouth i'm speaking chinese if i get to 18 and i've never seen someone with a blooded nose or a bust mouth yeah first time i see that 18 years of age i'm want to start hyperventilating because we're all made the same we're all inherently good we we are desensitized from young for you to hit another person another human and bust it or stab them or shoot them that should violently make you sick first time things like that happen if you're 18 19 and you only you've never heard of it happening you didn't know it could exist that someone could get a bus nose or a bus mouth bus lip soon the first time you see that you'll start hyperventilating yeah like because that's we've all got the same makeup because we're all inherently good we're taught to be bad it's learned behavior and they want us bad they want us playing gta yeah they want kids killing kids you know the taxi driver yesterday said to us his nephew 15 year old killed and he said they had to sit at a trial and watch the video and he's like no no these other kids, other kids as well killed him, they've already children and they've took his life and I just think the powers that be didn't want these things to be happening, they wouldn't you know what I'm saying, you can't even slap your child James that is like how can you discipline your kid now you can hit your kid, he's going to go do you know what, if I ran the world yeah if I ran this country every kid that's 16 to 18 would be in the military they'd have to do national service no matter what because they would come out at 18 with qualifications license discipline ready for the world instead of I wish they threw me in the armor instead of juvenile and if they went around and said no matter what they own your children till they're 18 yeah they've got them on the curriculum until they're 18 now so every boy and girl at 16 has to do two years national service the country would be way better but also people would be tougher they don't want tough people the people that are really pulling the strings they want men weak yeah they want women um promiscuous and giving away the dignity do you know what i'm saying they want boys to be girls and girls to be boys do you know what I'm saying so I know what's going on in the world I believe you know what's going on as well James but there's a lot of other people that don't and they're the people that I clash with because sometimes if I'm only trying to give you my opinion what I think might be helpful then these people are so pig brains sometimes like they're not trying to rear it So did people disown you for turning to Islam?

1:40:52Yeah. People you've known for a long time. Yeah, people like family and friends that like cousins and stuff. It's not the disobey, just don't speak. But you know, I would die for them people, they would have died for me. And it is what it is. I don't care, I have her and I have my children. Why do you think people are so against it? I was against it so I understand why. I understand because of the propaganda that's at play. like, Islam is under attack but once you understand like, if you live on a street, James, yeah with practicing Muslims now, just because someone's born as an Arab or a Pakistani or an African, they're born into a Muslim family and they're born, like if they do something, they're not a Muslim unless they are living as a Muslim bro, they are not a Muslim unless they're practicing Islam Do you know what I'm saying?

1:41:49So a Muslim means to submit to God. That's what the word Muslim means, one who submits to God. So just because Muslims might do things and they go, mate, what about what the Christians do or the Catholics or the Sikhs? but when it's Islam, it's Muslim guys that's done this, not this guy called such and such a thing has just done this, it's this Muslim guy, and it's those little subtle things, those microaggressions, yeah. The media though, hyping. Yes, it's the media. Or the divide, they're the biggest problem on the planet, because people believe what they see, people believe what they read. Yeah, I used to, so when I fell foul of propaganda, now bear in mind, James, yeah, I have always had affinity with the Palestinian people from very young as soon as I was aware I think it was like 05 yeah it was 05 when I got nipped for that jewellers and it was at the bollocks then yeah and I was like whoa oh my god what's going on here then I researching and learning more over the years and realizing my own people went through exactly the same off the same people as well in in 1913 before world war one or two there was a english lord called belfo and he is called a belfo declaration he come out saying there should be a land for the jewish people yeah and then that ended up being the catalyst for the other Zionist movement for the formation of the state of Israel in 1947.

1:43:34But it was the British, a British lord who first started that idea, who came up with that idea. What do you think of it? So I've always been like, because even the Black and Tans went to Palestine. Do you know what I'm saying? I've always seen a similar, every Celtic home game, the Green Brigade fry, three Palestine flags. Do you know what I'm saying? so it's a shared solidarity you know what was the navigation for me was hard is because i'm saying yeah i support palestine right but james i do not support unvetted males coming into the country bro do you know what i'm saying like i'm not for that and i don't like that because i don't know who they are i don't know what they're gonna do yeah we don't know anything about them they can say the nine you don't know what country they're coming from they can say yeah i'm tech they can say anything so we know that's been allowed to happen we've got a great military that could stop that do you know what i'm saying so that's been allowed to happen but why do you think it's been allowed to happen do you think it's to cause the unrest the sort of civil yeah yeah yeah yeah civil unrest between the people who live here as well listen right there is very powerful people that want to see Europe destructed.

1:44:47Now, since 2011, what has been happening? It went off Tunisia, Libya, Egypt, yeah, Syria. Remember the Arab Spring? Yeah. So that happened, that was designed because, you know, that was a revolution of BBM. Because I remember we rioted there in Salford, yeah. It was BBM. It was Blackberry Messenger. So the technology, that's how they levels uh the arab springs spread so fast because of the technology but there's been mass big billionaire people behind the mass influx of migrants coming from north africa yeah coming from north africa then coming from asia in through land routes yeah that could have been stopped at the on the Mediterranean you we could have summonsed a flotilla a naval officer NATO ships you know combined countries to put all our navies together and stop this influx because it's definitely an attack on Europe yeah there's correct channels to come through so for asylum and stuff and I'm all for asylum don't get me wrong like I'm all for someone having a better life yeah of course but I know that the amount of people that have been making their way into Europe that there's something behind it there's people behind it driving it because they want Europe in tatters like these people do not like Europe they don't for Europe has been behind a lot of shit that's happened to the Jews throughout history do you know I'm saying like this is the thing the Jews are such an easy target to blame because kings and emperors and popes from thousands of years ago you know whenever something's going wrong even machiavelli said to keep you know to be a fair a status man to be a leader it's a fine balance you've got to keep everybody happy and as soon as the people started to turn around a king or an emperor in europe hundreds of years ago what did they do they blamed the jews do you know what i'm saying so then jews was expelled from this or expelled from that city and persecuted it's way bigger than jews the zionist movement as a whole is run by atheists do you know i'm saying they're not religious people the christians and jews beside that run the zionist movement but if you ask me the fully godless uh atheist people now the the jews that live in manchester practicing in synagogues they shouldn't be getting attacked james the jews down here that they're going to do the fit they shouldn't be getting attacked right that people attacking jews that are not bothering nobody just going to pray or worship that's playing into the hands of the divide i see that that's why i don't sit there calling it's the jews or it's this or it's that because that's just another black glass that'll settle people go yeah it's the jews no it's not it's something even more of elite and bigger what's going on but the jews are just there because they've always been there to blame they've all that's why the pope kept them around so much i can blame the jews blame the jews blame the jews and mate what that satan yahoo he's a horrible piece of shit i hope to god uh god willing one day i get to see that man in handcuffs in the hague yeah i would love nothing better but um what he's doing there is is horrible but when i see a jews getting attacked here for it or in in England you know or in Europe I think they're just falling into the trap of this is what the people really want they want this divide and they want you to say that life's precious but that's not for me all life is precious any child deserves to live any child should have basic needs met You know, any child should have food, water, loving mother, you know, school to go to or whatever it may be.

1:49:12Any child should have that and that whatever faith they're from, whatever colour they're from, they should be allowed that. They should have that. How's Leif now? He's good. We're flying. We're flying. We're flying. Yeah? Yeah, mate, do you know what? We're getting on so well. Like, I'm doing something honest now, James. and you know it's rewarding for me mate to not have to look over my shoulder to not have to worry you know what I'm saying it's really rewarding and we're doing well and people when people are seeing you doing well they're wanting to help you more do you know I'm saying honestly I've had in the last few weeks me and her have had great support and thank you to those people like there's been supporting us massive because it was hard for us James come on the internet you know everyone loved us then everybody hated us now everybody loves us again yeah but it because of who we are the internet doesn't mean shit to us it's just a little bit of fun we're we're living real life every day but for lesser people it could easily break us man i mean i took on the full far right on my own mate you know what i'm saying they was lining up bro even whilst I was in jail for an eight-week record trolling her and stuff.

1:50:30So, yeah. But you know what? Let me just say a couple of the lads from the far right, whatever, the Patriots, whatever, like, a few of them, I've spoke to them, a few Scousers, a few other kids, spoke to them in depth and, you know, we've found a mutual ground and they've said, pa, you know what? Fucking respect your... I thought you was just a fucking cunt at first, mate, yeah? But you know what? Fair play. Like, and we ain't going to try and give you no more shit because we feel like you're actually sincere and genuine in what you're saying but it's and you've highlighted things to us what we didn't know communication is key what we've got now is everybody's screaming past yeah that's nobody's sitting having a nose like i don't give a fuck who you are what yeah if you're decent to me i'm decent to you people see the world differently from everybody else you could be a christian next year you could be a muslim for the rest of your life you just don't know the way life goes but for me it's just to sit behind it and go do you know what let's listen to all aspects of it yeah let's understand let's like look yeah um there is so many people in this country right now that i'll say it's usually like the poor people man and it's sad and it's usually like i i don't think like you get intelligent racist people i feel like it's a lot the racist people are low iq people do you know what I'm saying because for anybody to feel like they're superior to any other human to me I just think that's stupid but white people are the minority though there's only 8 % of white on the planet yeah we are the minority people the white man came from the Ural Mountains in Russia the white Russian came there down from the mountains like 60 ,000 years ago so white has always been a minority on this planet so you had Asia and Africa I think there's racism in old walks of life as well I think it's more online though when you walk the streets you'll never see any badness I think social media makes the thing the world's falling apart I think that's the thing and for some of these people that are abroad and not even hearing stuff when they're seeing all this shit online they're not living in the day to day like our neighbours are black our last neighbours was black on both sides everyone on the streets get along it's just yeah the majority is not asked No, it's online.

1:52:48It's all fake shit. And people are thinking, but also some people might just live in an area where they never see any other culture. They might never mixed in school with any other culture. Yeah. And all they know about this other culture is what they've been told or misinformed of other people. You can't blame them people. I've been misinformed. I know I keep jumping but I'll have to come back again another time because I've got a lot to say and I jump it from topic to topic but I was trying to say before when I felt foul of propaganda when I was about 17 or something it was just after 9-11 yeah and Saddam Hussein and the son oh that was another thing I'll tell you in a minute about Murdoch the Rupert Murdoch another a scotchman right even though he's born in australia his heritage is scottish the most powerful man in the last thousand years him him alone is the the most single powerful individual in the last thousand years that's a fact and you know that just by the media what he controlled he he's the ultimate um king maker but yeah i fell foul of murdoch's propaganda because it was the sun paper with big finger like this going to press a button and like so that was saying that basically saddam can press this button and we're all fucked weapons mass destruction everyone's gonna die so i was like fucking hell go and get him and i was well for the war and going to iraq and killing saddam i was well for that now as i sit here as a 40 year old man i realized how over a million innocent people was killed in that campaign yeah pointless so lots of soldiers died young men people i know personally died or family members died over there for what what was it for yeah nothing greed power oil yeah okay all war is murder though all war is murder and you get 9-11 you've got all these soldiers patriotic it's understandable let's go to afghanistan iraq whatever yeah but what did Iraq have to do with it?

1:54:59Not nothing. Exactly. They didn't make sense. It was like Pearl Harbor happened off your Japs, yeah? It was like them saying let's go and do fucking Greece because Japs have just bombed us. You've got the Gulf of Tonkin incident which was a boat which is out near Vietnam and it got bombed and they said it was a Vietnam people who'd done it so they could go and attack Vietnam. It was proven. I know. It was bullshit. Yeah, it was bullshit. I tried to say the Vietnam we were sticking it off for the French and that is bullshit so everything's to do with money, greed, power you know so the media plays a massive part in that I'm opposed to warming James I'm against warming it's all work done there's no right or wrong there's no everything's wrong in it it's the people behind it pulling the strings with fun both sides that's where my problem is but people want to choose a side for me it's all fucked up it's all bad but how long when you out in licence till?

1:55:5320.34 20.34 mate what's the longest you've actually been out since you're 15 uh yeah so few years Nah, so this is the basic, when I got back with Becca in 2008, that was the longest I'd had out from 2008 to 2015. I'd never, and like now I've been out 12. You're going to beat this seven years? Yeah, like mate, I won't go back. I don't care. People can try what they want. I ain't going back nowhere. I'm here. I'm here to stay, mate. Like, I ain't going back nowhere. I'm not doing nothing wrong. and I'm fully prepared to take on anybody, yeah, anyone, anyone ever born from my mother, any government, any judge, prosecutor, because I ain't doing nothing wrong.

1:56:37They could come with Trump's up shit. I don't care. I'll fight it where I have to fight it. Yeah, good luck. I'm doing nothing wrong and I'm not leaving. I'm not leaving my family. Mate, listen, they need to make a film, bro. We want some movie deals and see what he could do for us, for me and I, Jordan, because what we've done from our city, mate it wasn't easy and another thing we put little one on the map and people need to know that before us like little one people was going to jail and stuff to get bullied and not respected that stopped with me yeah and everybody in Salford will tell you that then with our Jordan as well and like now the younger kids growing up it's more cooler to be from little one when it wasn't back then because it was just an overspill town built because obviously had the docks in Salford all the navvies, the ship canal's been built and then the population's growing.

1:57:29So Little Autumn was just like four fields, yeah? Just fields, nothing there because of the boom of the population. They had to build estates there and then they build estates like as an overspill town, you know what I'm saying? And yeah, so we really set the levels there and, you know, what Jordan's done with his music to come from that place and to have fans. He's got fans in China, Japan, all around the world, man. And, yeah, there's definitely going to be a mover coming out of Salford. What's your plans for the future? So my plans is getting my app built, my Cario Music app, for my music, because I love music, and I love to help other people, James.

1:58:12So me helping someone, even if it's to write a bar, or even if it's to put them in contact with a producer, I like that, and it's not just to get a penny off somebody. that i like to help someone it helps with their ptsd to to help others and i like to hear poetry i love you know i love music i love i love writing so i want my act to be open running and my cario music app and my metal business man yeah i want a good few scrap yards and it's something you can trust it's a physical thing metal do you know i'm saying where the money changes all the time where metal is like it's real do you know what i'm saying it's what's your social medias brother for people who want to contact you drop your message yeah so basically it's lady in waiting at the minute it'll be changed but lady in waiting or my carry on music yeah shout out lady as well and shout out all the boys everybody all my mates everyone who supported me do you know what I'm saying I love yous all for anybody watching brother that's maybe in a life of struggle and can't see a wee out what advice would you have for them listen I'll just say to you is carry on also if you could get a hold of me and my dm I always write back to people people ask me all the time and I'm always there to help another human being out or I always respect a man that admits that he's struggling because you know it's not it's not easy for a man to come out and say or ask for someone but I can just say that I'm an advocate for therapy this is therapy now me and you speaking james and i said it to my missus last night i said i really like james's interviews because he's a really deep person and i've watched lots of your interviews james and some of the questions you've asked people i thought what a good question he's trying to invoke the right um emotions and he's he's trying to shine a light on the darker sides of some of the things we go through you're not just concentrating on all of the glamour all of the glitz so i really respect that about you as a man that you you're a deep person and i could tell you really care about the world and you i could tell you care about the people around you so anybody who is struggling i'll just say guys carry on because i've been in dark dark places you mate i've been down freezing cold blocks with no phone credit with bare beef, yeah, knowing I've got to get back up, got bare beef, like, mate, and I never give up, because I had a beautiful wife and loving children, yeah, and I had my faith in God, but what helped me massively was talking about how I was feeling, if I didn't have that outlet, my life could have been different, but me, I'd done two years on the Therapeuta Community, you know so learning to say how I'm feeling and not shy away from it and not be ashamed do you know what I'm saying because you're a man and if you could say you're feeling a bit like this about something I respect that I would never take that as a weakness I'd take that as a strength only a coward would try and exploit that and take that as a weakness I'd take that as that's a man who's confident in his own skin and he doesn't mind sharing this is how he feels and there's many of, you know, there's many of clubs out there, like men's clubs and things like that you could contact if you didn't want to speak to a helpline or something, because I know that's hard.

2:01:43But yeah, my inbox would always be open. Also, Lady and Waiting, she's helped on a daily basis. She has so many women writing to her. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task, unless you have a partner like Shopify. They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website, to marketing, to selling, and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need. There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz, and Allbirds continue to trust and use them. With Shopify on your side, turn your big business idea into sign up for your$1 per month trial at shopify.com slash special offer.

2:02:20And so you know that message you sent me, you've helped me so much. So I believe my and her job here on this internet, the lane we're in, is helping others. And if users are going in our DMs and see users, it's helping others. Because when we're just posting together, people are like, oh, it's beautiful. We love your relationship. But we both individually engage with our fans. We will take our time out to write back. Not just someone who looks good or who's got loads of followers. I don't care if this guy's down and out or he can't offer me. I feel it's my duty. He's wrote to me. I've opened it.

2:02:55I'm going to give them a bit of advice. You know what I'm saying? Thanks for coming on the day. Thank you so much. I wish you nothing best for the future, bro. Yeah, listen, God bless you. Hopefully I will be back again one day, mate. It's been amazing. Is that all right, Steph? Yeah? Yeah, si.