JACK THE RIPPER was Part of the Royal Family

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55:28Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting work mode available on Plus and Pro plans. So, my grandfather's gone turn around and said to some traveling men, he said, we ain't going. He said, we go. He said, down where we go. he said crank idiot we'll go so he said don't go so me grandfather is here here's the money you have it we don't want it and a week later uh these there was only two of them two uh uh brothers and they were part of the Cunningham family which are North Country travellers very very well educated the Cunningham's are known today and both of them was found floating down the Thames with a throat cut So, obviously, they realised, then my grandfather said, we got to bolt.

56:34We got to bolt. So they were trying to kill them because the guy's identity was revealed? Yeah, it was revealed. So they ended up, they were doing the scams in the pub. So was that a set-up then? Were they getting set-up to be killed? Because your great granny seen the guy with the cane? Yeah. Is that correct? That's right, yeah. So then what happened? And that was the guy who was doing it? Is that Jack Redipper? No, that was Queen Victoria's. He was Queen Victoria's personal bodyguard. He was his bodyguard. And then so they realised who it was. and my great-grandma Caroline, because she was in the palaces

57:28when Queen Victoria's grandson was in the alleyway, she recognised him straight away. And the man said, she looked like, shit, because she was with him in the palaces. So she's the killer? He was the killer. He was the killer. but there was a few men that used to do the killing apparently so what do you think the killings were about was it satanic or was it for their own gain you know yourself when you're so wealthy up that ladder money no everything is there's nothing there's no feeling to it no but there's some sick people in the world even now with money without money but what do you think the agenda was behind it was it satanic or was it I don't know what the word satanic means so it's like devil worshipping it's like right yeah cutting organs and they do like prayers and all that weird shit.

58:17I think personally, my old grandfather said nothing on it. He said, there was just sickos. They had everything. If you've got everything, what do you get? If you've got everything, you've got to do something else for kicks. Ain't you, James? So, you know, and that's what he used to say. He said, there was just, there wasn't writing yet. You know, they had everything so they could, they were above the law. You know, they were literally above the law. So they were getting a buzz just by killing people and cutting out their organs. So it wasn't just one killer. He was getting other people to do the killings as well.

58:52Yeah, there wasn't just one. And they were doing gays as well. So there were a few records. There was lovely gentleman, you know, obviously gentleman. Today it's acceptable. I've got lots of friends living in Brighton. And I've got lots of friends, okay, and they're my best mates. Give them a cuddle, give them a kiss, you know. But it ain't not long that way. You know what I'm saying? It ain't that way. No, but back then, back then, James was a different, you know, trying to take him out. And it was a different world. Why was the gays never mentioned then? Why has it only been the five female sex workers?

59:31Well, I think why that was, he was James and my grandfather. And I asked him the same, similar question to that. He said, if it ever got tracked down, that a part of that society were all gay, he said it would have turned into a civil war. Who's leading the countries? Gay people. And it would have done, James. It would have led to a civil war. But they were just... It was just all for kicks. How many murders do you actually think there's been then? Because they say there was 11, but five had their organs cut out. So obviously if it's different killers, there could potentially be 20, 30, 50, over 100 if there's different people getting killed.

1:00:18Because I'd imagine some of these people might have been watching other people get killed as well for their own kind of sick kicks. Well, to my knowledge, what my grandfather said, he reckoned that when he used to do what he'd done, he'd done over 25 appointments. So 25 appointments he'd done. 25 that's a lot appointments if there was only 11 killings but 20 over 25 appointments he done that was a period of time so he done a lot of appointments only on a couple occasions he said me father he said he done over over he said 24 20 over 24 25 he said but sometimes he He said he was so pissed out of his brains.

1:01:09And then he says, can you come tonight? He said, so on odd occasions, he said he didn't even attend. You know, too drunk, couldn't stand up. So that's why there's no one ever been convicted. Because there was so many, I think 80 people would attend. There was a Polish man, I've wrote his name down, Aaron Kaminsky. I think he was sort of psychotic. He was in that area of an immigrant. And then you had Charles Allen. Because they brought in butchers They thought because people were getting sliced up It was possible a butcher or a doctor And then you had another guy, Antonio Which, Klawowski or something But he'd killed his three wives Prior by poisoning them They became their main suspects So do you think that was just to deflect away then To try and keep the royals safe?

1:01:55Once again, I have to say Because you've hit on a very good Point there And he said, my grandfather said he said all them stories just going about he said that's just deferring people making them look that way that way different aspects he said because it was close he said it was close he said i i don't know how we got away with it so long he said we used to love it he said being paid to kill someone was handy in it which is true no not handy really is it it ain't handy but but yeah they used to deflect a lot you know um but there was travels were so in the back much in the back even today where there was a lot of mystery around us today you know we're very honorable people you know they argue today they get in the field and have a punch up you know and that's it shake hands walk away but we go we literally you know me and my missus on the side of the road we'd wake up early in the morning and move so no one didn't know which way we went you know so there's still a lot a mystery here I kind of love that idea though I always think about going off grid yeah I hate this bullshit yeah you know and the more I get older the more I can't be arsed with people yeah it's just fucking do my nothing I just love my dogs my kids but even my kids are a pain in the arse yeah but I just feel like going off grid I feel as if there's always something calling me to go off grid and then pop up from time to time I just I feel as if it's a very fast paced world and I feel as if people have completely lost the plot people ain't good anymore there's always been bad anyway but social media has heightened the madness I think we're now starting to see the effects of social media what it's done to people's minds I agree James social media is a bad thing today some of it's good some of it's bad you know politics is a very bad area to go in at the present moment as I look at it you know my opinion of politics if you want to go there I'll give it to you but we all do a job we try our muckmost artists and i've got to give it to all the guys you can't be you can't please everybody in the room you know and that's the trouble you you can't please everybody but we go off the grid all the time me and my missus we go up in the morning we do our own thing you know we try we try to be the best we can um i pay my taxes which i don't like we've got a massive bag big tax bill at the moment which we got to pay but people say travelers who don't pay tax do yourself a favor i pay more tax than you've earned this year you know but people don't realize that but we do like going off of crib me and my missus we just you know we just like doing our own our own thing like we're respectful for everybody but listen life we have seen so much and Mikael we've seen so much changes in our life so much James that's the world we live in at the present moment you know um you know going on about the boat people if you want to just quickly on that one Travers opinions of the boat people and you you won't agree with me listen they're coming over they're here once someone's here you've got to cope with the people you know where some are not genuine there's not genuine people but the majority of them are genuine people they come over here so what we say all they want to do if they want to come give them a job picking up paper if they don't want to do it put them in a compound and you know let them be processed or send them back but they want to come over here and work give them a job picking paper up make a but tag everyone you know because we don't know who they are just tag them and if you're happy to be tagged you can stay there so all the problems that's happening up and down but the politicians today haven't got the balls because everything is about you know hold on you can't say this look at what's happened with all the MPs he's messing about with that lady he's messing about with that lady so what has they messed up with?

1:06:02The man's doing his job as long as he's doing his job in his private life let him do it. But they're all corrupt I don't trust any of them like I say If you've got the right documentation Or we know who you are I'm not arsed Where you go I travel the world But when I travel the world I've got my passport I'm spending Exactly I'm spending dough People can work Listen The UK and America Has caused more destruction On this planet Than fucking anywhere You know what I'm saying They've conquered over 90 % Of the world England 100 % But I just feel as if I have the right documentation Because if a woman and a child Gets hurt We don't know who the fuck you are Then somebody's got to Somebody's got to pay the price But if somebody's willing To work and graft And integrate Into that society where they're going to By all means do what the fuck you want Nobody's asked but it's just worth the rise in rapes It's the rise in other things that's happening I think nah something needs to happen Because as a father who's got three kids My job is to protect them for their future Because the kids are the future but they can't be protected Even in London You're not supposed to wear a watch I still wear my jewellery I think it gives a fuck I'm not going to go hiding but That isn't safe to the way it used to be I'm always on, not on edge But I've always got my wits around me I always want to know who's behind me who's in front of me I'm always on guard but it's not as safe as it used to be five years ago ten years ago it will change again people are but James I can tell you you know and put this out on the podcast which is a very good thing and I tell people you know when you're in London any city in the world and you and someone happens to give you eye contact and you think send him if you see that person three times they're following you because you've got that lovely watch on.

1:07:38Jump in a taxi and piss off. This is what people... People today, they're uneducated because of it. That's how they are. On that phone all the time. They're not aware of the surroundings. And the same travellers were around with the surroundings all times, all times. It's like everywhere over Europe, the travellers can move freely. But they're putting a thing now and they're all about racist. We can't stop side the road no more. We're not allowed. If we tow our caravans, three in a row. They take our caravans off. But all the other countries still let the travellers do it. So, you know, we live.

1:08:16It's a lovely country in England. I love it. And I don't think I want to visit, but I wouldn't. But we could all improve the way we are. But like you said, down to the end of the book, it's so corrupt. Me and my lady wife, we're cashers. What's cash? I don't know what cash is. You know, I drawed£100 out of the bank a little while ago, had to pay a chap. And another chap said, oh, can I have£100? And I draw the money out to pay these two chaps. Genuinely, I can prove it. The poxy banks froze the money for three months. And we had to go cashless. So on the campsites, when people come in, on coastal camping, we have.

1:08:59Now when you come up and you go, oh, I'd like to get a pitch for the night. We can't take cash. We'll catch this So they've got me Yeah Where they want me James Yeah but that's the whole system Is going to go cashless anyway Yeah But You've just got to keep your head above water And like I said Not a lot of people might not want to hear this But if you get robbed sometimes The majority is on yourself Because the majority of people are good But if you're not keeping your wits around you The telltimes or signs are there When you're getting your phone stuck Or whatever It is more pre-planned than what people think Obviously you've got your kamikaze jobs But if you've not got your wits You're going to become a target No matter who you are where you are.

1:09:36Yeah. See, but what it is, years ago in this day and age, when we were young, a lot of that people, travelers never used to rob people on the high street. It was just like I told you, how the scams they used to do, the scam amount of things. You know, it was just scams. And another one scam we used to do years ago, my great-grandfather BNI Park, he loved this one, do rugs. And then he'd sit there and a traveling man you know it probably would be one of the cunningham's would pull up would you like to buy a rug sir oh hello sir how are you yeah oh what you got yes i'll take them yes put them here's some money no i know they're delivering and you say to the bloke this bloke here i gets loads of rugs pays for me trip in london and i said i'm normally locals so then they go to your house in york or because you know you had a banner house to sell five rugs to you.

1:10:36Then a bloke would be coming up to deliver something to your door. And then, oh, I'll buy some rugs off you. No, I'm selling it to this gentleman. I'm a dealer. I can't sell it to you. But you can buy rugs. So you'd end up buying a complete cart load of rugs off of him. Andy, so I'm doing a short version. So you had them stuffed up your ass. We didn't know how to get rid of them. But it was different scams there. But like today, it's the thieving on the streets. You know, it's not safe when you, it's not safe anywhere today. What are you thinking then when you started hearing these stories? You must have been gripped in then, sitting around a fire and people are telling these stories.

1:11:23I used to struggle between my grandfather's legs. And he'd say, what do you want to hear about? and then there'd be my uncle Dolphris that's me dad's grandfather's oldest boy and he'd go show him the journals show him the journals and so there was journals read it as well what old Andrew and it was you know was he documenting it he documented it was he yeah he documented all that in case why he documented it because if he thought he ever got caught he could like go to I don't know the Times or whatever you know if he chucked that to him he he might be safe you know so it was he was really fucking on it ain't he he's on it he was what you know what I'm saying not even back in the 1800s he's still planning ahead listen he's still taking the dough no matter what's happening he's just wanting to earn and he was documenting just in case he was documenting the shit hit the fan yeah and because there was over 150 different tabloids back then.

1:12:30There was loads of them writing about this, especially the Sherlock Holmes was like 1987, 1887, so he was massive, all that fiction stuff. Yeah. It was all docked,

1:12:45and I see, I see the little trunk that was in, and I know where the trunk went. And then when I was a young man, and she always called me Casey because she said you don't let your left hand know what your right hand's doing and uh and I used to go with my uncle Sam and then you know when I always asked him saying you know I'll be about 15 16 let's get the journals out of it so as I was now my grandma was dead then my uncle Sam he his name was Tubby he'd fight like a donkey kicking he was a very he was known for fighting a very very always fighting always fighting and he go I don't know if that was right Keith what Grandfather told you then let's get him out so we'd get him out he'd get him out and I used to go to pictures on a Sunday and my mum used to drop me off there because the bus stop have Sunday dinner with me at the same and we'd sit there and mum said what was the pictures like Keith lovely mum don't tell your mother and we'd sit there to like Because the bus back from Mason, where we were stopping at the time, was like, the last bus was like half past seven.

1:14:00So my mum would be back there to pick me up. So she knew about that eight. But I was there from nine o 'clock in the morning all that time. And the same, you say, how much money have you got here? I've got a pound, I'm going to say. You sit here. And he'd give me 20 pence back. You know why? Because my mum knew I had to pound on. She knew I'd even go nowhere. Does that? Even down to that, they had the wits about her. We used to sit for ages and he'd go, then he'd tell me things out there. You know, Grandad never told me that. Yeah, this is what Andrew wrote. You know, he was a nice old man, you know.

1:14:44And he killed himself at the finish. Who? Grandfather. Andrew? Killed himself. Why? Did he lose his wife? No. No. very tragic so um you're right this is the next book but how old was he he was an old oldish really old but what happened his three boys went to war so my my grandfather sam and lawrence my great grandfather's three brother uh boys went to war in the first world war and he got three letters in the post back sorry boys missing in action and he was to carry a bag of sovereigns and a gold chain all the time and they were stopping at Belvedere and this flying scotchman was coming through they said he took his his chain off his money out put him in the wagon and i've got a picture of me old he's actually wagging when it was set alight and um put him there wait for the flying scotchman to come and he stepped straight out in front of the train committed suicide and then fucking three days later what happened all three boys turned up my grandfather had his foot blown off um his brother lawrence uh got shot in the arm and the brother Sam got machine gun put it across there so they wasn't missing in action he said I've got to be with my boys so he he killed himself to be with his boys and then his boys obviously end up carrying him to his grave but he only killed himself he said I've done all this my life he said looked after them and not one joined the army they they actually got took because the soldiers would come and take them.

1:16:45And my grandfather, Togo, was handcuffed to a boat and went to France. And that's Henry. Henry. And halfway through, the bloke handcuffed him. So jumping everywhere. And I handcuffed him. And he said, right, Henry. He said, if you want to fuck off back to England. He said, you know I can't swim, you cunt. So he did. He fought in the First World War. so but that I could talk to your dad about that that's tragic though for him to think but did he ever think then when he lost his three boys it could have been karma with all the shit that he'd done was that I ever spoke about funny enough I was talking the same had the same story with me Uncle Dolphy and me Uncle Sam about that I said I said you know I said it was payback he said no he said your great-grandfather never believed in payback he said that he said it was just a he said he couldn't take it he said he couldn't take it he said his children was his life life it literally his life is you know he could another family man could smack his kids up the ear roll because doing something wrong wouldn't take no notice he said but if a gorgeous man was down the road shouting to them he said he'd go down and buy his house out so he was a very family man but he loved his boys he couldn't take it and uh my uncle dolphy he was there and he said he had his hands in his lap and old caroline was in the wheelchair then he said i can't take it he said i've got to go with me i've got to go with my boys i can't leave them on their own i don't know where they are he said but I've got to be he said I've got to keep me boys safe so in his eyes he was going to kill himself and wherever them boys was he's going to look after his kids it's a silly way of looking at it so he killed himself to try and still be with his boys kill himself and the boys have showed up and the boys showed up three days afterwards yeah three days afterwards me obviously great granny she was over the moon me granny Abby I wouldn't say she was home with him me grandfather Togo because he was he'd done 28 grand in a prostitute house one night he liked a woman and that was in his day he loved he loved a woman he loved a woman but but to come back and you've got three ladies sitting there all dressed in black with veils over them and you know Granny Abbey was probably thinking Andy get someone Someone else You know got a paid apart And then The bastard walks in the door That's mad That's mad That's mad That's mad That's absolutely So see all the books And everything was written Are they still around then?

1:19:42Yeah They'll be worth fortunes Not for sale Yeah but they will be No They will be worth fortunes Is that just a generational thing then It just gets kept in the family How many books? um there's actually only all about the war things like that that's only in here with the one andrew one there's only a pole like that and like that all in and on the top right he used to put a smiley face and never talked even she doesn't know that the top smiley face so every book i sign you'll see i'll put a smiley face on the top right so i try to imitate what he's done and um When did you realise how big the story was and the book and Jack the Ripper?

1:20:28When did you realise how big it was? James, I knew it all the time. But my grandfather said, and he used to say, don't tell anyone. And me Uncle Sammy, me Uncle Dolby said, for fuck's sake, don't tell anyone. Because if anybody finds out, us lot, for the iJump, it will, we have, you know, payback on it. But life's changed, like they said, don't tell it today. so he was kept under and the reason why I'd done it is that lovely lady on the left hand side she would say shut the fuck up you make yourself look like a cunt don't tell no one and I thought one day I thought yeah I thought no you know and when I used to have a few beers and I'd go to a funeral sit up with people then oh well Keith tell us that story because I'm the last of the storytellers does that make sense and i thought if i don't get this down and it's not put down from a different point of view you know and if i said something and it was at a funeral sit up the night force you know we set up for dead and my other son call my baby tell him and i'd say something that would all be around me because he found interest because I knew what these old men didn't know and these old men old, old, old men they'd say, I remember that I remember that I remember that so they'd start talking and they'd come and listen to this boy so I'd say something and I'd get excited and I'd say a lot of words and I'd say, oi tell the fucking truth oh, sorry I got to say So I might change one word about it.

1:22:20How many people was in the room? There was 15 in the gang. How many?

1:22:31Okay, I'm going to say eight. There was eight. There was eight. He had eight in his gang. There was eight in his gang that they used to run with. So there was eight. So I was corrected. So I kept on, as the years went on, and um and i was renowned to go to funerals you know when i walk into i used to go and uh put me in the coffin look at the people in the coffin check the you know so i wasn't frightened to death the other kids would be frightened of it and i tell the stories over and over and over and over and over again and and it like i say then i just tell people and then carol stopped me just telling me stories.

1:23:13How was it writing the book? Were you nervous? No, not a bit. I had Robert, you'll see his name on the back of the book, you know, he helped me with it. He wrote some paragraphs with me, you know, to put it, you know, right. You know, Rob, that ain't right. Yeah, but Keith, I said, i don't give a fuck it was interesting or not i want it my way i want it done to the best of my ability my way so you can see it because you can you know where you go so you can put what you like in so i'm explaining like i'm explaining to you but we was in the room and you know you can say yeah there was oak beams and candle lits and 50 people in the room yeah i don't know that probably was in that.

1:24:07So he actually put the bits in the room where he'd say there was a pub and there were a lot of people staying at the bar. Yeah, there would have been people to stay in the bar. And people were bowl at. Probably was people staying. So the bits of the book like that, Robert put the bits in the books like that so people would get the... Storytelling. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But what was said, that's what was said. How was it fact-checked? Who fact-checked that? which is important for people because it has been fact-checked. Yeah. Because it's such a mad story. And that's why we don't give too much away today because we want people to abide about, of course.

1:24:43But how was it fact-checked? How did people go, yep, that's legit? We had a Jerry Sherard, didn't it, Carole? A Jerry Sherard. And he was up in London. And he literally, he checked all the dates, every date, all the things where people was the murders where people were found and names that my grandfather um andrew uh give to my grandfather um so how would he know that piece of paper that i had had james on it hold on that's right james got killed on the 10th of december right but uh he he was found on the 15th of January. So it was, because obviously the body wasn't found straight away. So it was all cross-checked, cross-checked, dates, everything cross-checked.

1:25:47It had to be. And he was... All the timings, all the dates, everything, Tretti, with all the killings. Yeah. And all the, so everything was cross-referenced all the time. He went up to London. cost me a fortune in which she moaned at me unreal over there you know she's going to kill me over that but it cost me a fortune james said but the other day you know uh yes life is about money sometimes this had to be put to rest it had to be known to the world it had to be done so he was up in london and carol said for fuck's sake you're giving that man more fucking money again, weren't it? Look James, look how she's laughing.

1:26:33She knows the score on that one, didn't she? So yes, it took, um, um, it took a lot. When did the book come out? It was last December, was it, Carol? And what sort of publicity has it had so far? It's had a lot, a lot. Have you been on the TV or anything yet? I had offers from the BBC to go on a podcast with the BBC in Brighton. So that's where I live. A couple other people, James, approached me. But, you know, are you Billy the Bullshit? And I thought, I don't like you. If I don't like you, and I've had a couple of people, directors, and a bloke called Kent, he's made over 40 films, hasn't he?

1:27:38What's his name that done the three mini job? What's he called, the bloke with the three minis? What's his name? Michael Caine. Oh, yeah, yeah. He's made lots of films. The Italian job. Yeah, yeah. he's made lots of fields and I've been offered to sit down with him I've talked to him on the phone he sounds a proper prick does he yeah yeah you know and yeah yeah yeah and he was saying he said your wagons have your wagons Keith I'd send them on the internet I'd love to sell how much you want for them it ain't for sale mate they're not for sale they're not I will sell anything I'll sell my granny yeah but you know my wife has got me some uh got me things money can't buy that money can't buy heirlooms some things are not for sale you know oh yes well um and they wanted a new there's a film going on about jesus a film and they wanted me to go on it uh to some of the language, you know, because Travers was there at the crucifixion of Christ, so it goes way, way back.

1:28:46Same as pinky blinders. I'm going to say, can I say hello to you? Is this wrong? I see too far too. Is that okay? Shake my head. What does that mean, James? Because I ain't got the fuck. I don't know what the fuck that means. I don't know what the fuck that means at all. They put subtitles down, and it was, and I offered them, you know, to go on it. Well, again, Latcha Divas, Mon Prow, Colin Latcha, how are you, my brother? So, they got the language one, and in the last one, so I watched about two programs of Peggy Blinders, thought, this is a load of bullshit. The only thing they got right was Jook.

1:29:32So when they were sitting talking, nothing, and in the last one they'd done, odd words but it wasn't the subtitles it's such a shame they should have once again not cross reference not got the right people should have got someone like me on board you know I've been quite happy because no one speaks the language no more and we've we've got to document these things James do you agree? Yeah of course it has to be documented so we've got to document everything or else it's forgotten that is important to have books out because in a hundred years we're going to be forgotten anyway unless there's history there.

1:30:11Like my family's history is kind of all hazy now. You hear different stories but you hear so many different stories everything you don't know you don't know what's legit because nothing was documented. Do you know what I'm saying? So it's important to then if you want to keep the family histories documented. So you be polite to me James will you be polite to me? Yeah. Did you say to me Grey Mondire? Grey Mondire? You just said to me go fuck your mother. So I let my grandson on the square in Romanesque. So no one doesn't understand it. But even down to... So as that was done, it was undocumented.

1:30:43And it's very annoying to see from my point of view, you know, how things have gone so much. Change, isn't it? It's changing down to basics. Yeah. It's changed so much. Where does it go then with this? Was this man ever mentioned the killer beforehand? Was he ever a suspect? No. Where does Jack the Ripper name come from, Jack? Where's that come from? Oh, sorry, I understand what you're saying. I think that was social media. They just put him up. You know, he's ripping plates up. Sounds good. Yeah, because there were sacks, and there was a sack felt. Did you know that? A what, sorry? A sack that the organs were felt.

1:31:28Right. And what them sacks were used for was to put fish to transfer, and one of the sacks and my great-grandfather was asked to go get one of the sacks it's a famous shop in london they used to get the sacks which was lined out so the fish would go off there and he went and got the sack for the man to give to the man and they sent the sack to the police station with the organs in it so it was all like put put together very very clear but the name jack the ripper i don't know where that that i think it was just to chuck people out i think but so you've got to understand when they're in all these streets james and we're all military men standing we're looking after this bodyguard and this lovely lady but we're paying dormant who all jacked up on this they think they can handle the self but we want them to wear the people out first and that's what it was about.

1:32:27It was just smoke and mirrors. No one could get in. So where does it go then, the book? Where does it go? Are we talking a movie? Are we talking six-part docuseries? Like, where does it go from here? Because if there's valuable information everybody's been trying to find for 100 years and you've cracked the code with the family history, where does it go then? I imagine it's going to go a lot further than just a book. Yeah, well, one chap wanted to do it in AI. Fuck that shit, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I didn't, I didn't. It takes away the quality, man. It takes away the realness, rawness.

1:33:04Because, like, I know, I know a few people, if I, what I've been, I want to put people there myself. You know how to carry yourself. But can you talk like a travelling man? No. No, you fucking can't. You can't, you can't talk like a travelling man. But I want, I would want people there that could play people's parts like a good friend of mine, for argument's sake, and you know him. He's a nice lad. And Peter Fury. Yeah, he's a good guy. He's one of the best. Yeah. So he's loyal to the core. He's, that man's a gentleman. Yeah. An absolute gentleman. So if I was going to put someone to play a part, I'd get him to play my grandfather, Togo.

1:33:54Because he, because A conducting himself properly knows how to speak knows the language you know and can pronounce it properly as my grandfather because he was brought up in our society and very pleased to meet you do you know but he Peter wouldn't say like that to him alright my mate how are you keeping do you know what I mean how's your family how's your but he could portray the right people yeah I've got a lot of time for Peter yeah you know fucking mad story as well Peter he's yeah Yeah, I went up to his house, man. Yeah, beautiful. So it was just a good guy. Just loyal to the core. We're still in contact from time to time.

1:34:34But just a good guy. Just a good man. See, Peter's family, his whole mother was from London. They were from London. And the Wilsons, the Cunninghams, I know all of them. my mum's brother, Kayleigh Bottom, he was bare knuckle champion of Canada. You'll get a book called Bartley Gorman. You've heard of Bartley Gorman? When you next see Peter, say, I was talking to, you can say your cousin Keith, if you like, and old Bartley Gorman, that was one-armed man. Uncle Bartley was an absolute, the man was an animal. animal and he was he was the i would say in his day and even today uh uncle bartley he was one of the best known traveling man everybody had so much respect for him remember uh my mom doing very very uh uncle bartley but very very nice but that's what i'm saying um if i get the right people come to me too about it um i supposed to as a company that i won't mention nobody's names they want me to go to see them no you come to me i'm here i ain't running to you you come to me and you know we can do this do that no i don't suffer bullshit and don't do bullshits do you no i just want i want it done i want it done properly and they want to say, well, we would want to change things.

1:36:16No. We want to change places. No. If it stays a book on the shelf, being covered in dust, so be it. But it's got to be done properly. It's got to feel right for you. And people that are the songs we used to sing, I want the songs put on there. Because I've written songs myself. but I want them songs that I knew on it not what you want I've got a chap that's already written all the music for it so all the music is all written for it I've got songs that's been written for it which I've written with a couple other people that relate to it so everything's there in place but we've got our own people fuck off James yeah you've got to stand your ground yeah that's so you don't mind what you've done with the book he's put the truths in it and he's maybe set or fluffed it up a little bit for the story you know but same as with the movie stuff if you want your actors and the music you can have it in yes they can add little bits here and there but you just want whatever you've got in your mind to be put in the story and the truth that's what I'm saying would it change it Hollywood changes that fucking media changes that but the officer oh you know we would change straight away conversation over James I'm out here and I get up and walk away I'm not interested in it's got to be done so people see it from a total different angle it is a different angle it's a different angle it's an inside angle so it's a total different angle you know and i've got the wagon up there one of the wagons that one of the original wagons uh that me grandfather and that used to be in you know uh will i sell them no do we rent them out yeah it goes to charity you know because we do a lot of charity for different people but at the end of the day you've got to keep things close.

1:38:08Yeah you've got to stay loyal but even the story of Andrew and Caroline your great grandparent's story themselves as being the Bonnie and Clyde and all the scams is a seller in itself. Throwing the Jack the Ripper stuff is gold. Yeah. You know you've got to stand your ground you've got to value your worth because people will change the story. There's many films of Jack the Ripper there's many books there's many documentaries but. But when I used to watch the films Jack the Ripper, you know, going on. I know the Sherlock Holmes was made, and I used to laugh so much. I could, you know, picture me, my grandfather, Togo.

1:38:42Were they ever mentioned? Were they ever mentioned at all the travelling community within the Jack the Ripper stuff? Never. Was there anybody standing in alleyways? Well, if you see people standing in alleyways, like Cloak and Dagger, you used to see that. But they were in them alleyways all the time, you know. and my grandfather uh old togo which means soup by the way he was always togged up to the nines and he was there he was actually there because he's just watch because he'd see marks when they were playing darts you know so it was a family it was a family affair everything was a family affair they brought everybody along so if anybody was getting um so i've just beat the shit out of you or you beat the shit on me doesn't matter who's had the hiding but you know if the old bills come running in of course straight away i've got my lady wife on my arm walking along with my young son that can't be the man that's have you said no no no so they would have took the children with them and the wives as well purposely because there's a back door to get out does that make sense, James.

1:39:57It does make a lot of sense, doesn't it? Yeah, they knew the streets like the back of their hand. Yeah. They owned the streets. There was a world within a world. Exactly what you just said. They did own the streets. They owned all the streets. And travellers were very, very clever people. We have lost that cleverness today. Why do you think that is? Because the travelling community in the UK is dwindling down. It's non-existent now. The Stolte boys are still there and the families are still there. You know, I pull up with people and I walk straight up. And it's a shame young boys today, a lot of them don't call me uncle no more.

1:40:34No respect. I just think it's because they've not been taught that. Everything's dwindling. I think, I don't know what it is, James. How do you think that is? How do you think the travelling community is in the UK? 90 % are nice people, but they just... I've got lots of cousins. i was at a funeral one day this gives you an example imagine being at a funeral now you're my cousin james right your boy's there your boy's name's james so i'll walk up grab your hand kiss you on the cheek alan moll james how are you how's your mother and father i ain't seen you for years mother said sorry to hear that so playing a story your boy's there's james uh and i go I can see is that your boy yeah James come over and say hello to Uncle Keith boy comes out very pleased to meet you Uncle Keith I went geared up you crazy yeah so straight away he's changing so I said are you rummered I beg your pardon I said you rummered I don't understand that what do you mean are you married I said go away James don't he know nothing he said, Keith, he's married an old gorgeous girl.

1:41:53He said, got a lovely grandchildren. He went, yes, but. I said, what do you do? Better call him my James, you know. He went, no, I'm team leader for Tesco's. I said, please go fuck away from me. So, you know, and his dad was embarrassed the way he was talking. Was that not the dad's fault, though? Well, no, it's because I've settled down. Um, and my grandkids, uh, they play with your kids, you know, gorgeous. And he, as his kid's over, then his mate's over. And we're only two pleased. And, but when it's Appleby Fair, my grandson's up at Appleby Fair, you know, with his own kind. You've got, you have to respect everybody around you, James.

1:42:38Of course. But you get it so you don't want your children, you don't let your children go anywhere. you know my daughter she wouldn't allow that on her own but my cousins because they've been brought up in houses they've let the children run with your kind yeah my daughter and that's the same my daughter I'm very protective my daughter my sons and that they do Muay Thai my nephew young Carter he's under 16 Scottish champion they've always fought with each other and sometimes you think fucking stop but then again listen it's good for them as well it toughens them up my son he's doing UFC young Carter he's under 16 champion boxer like you do feel proud of them but there's fucking hard work but you've got to let them be you've got to let kids be kids because this is a dog eats world out here and if you become soft you're going to get chewed up and spat out I agree with you but James at the end of the day we've still got to learn but with the travelling boys today is that you pull up on a Rolls Royce they're over you like a rash yeah of course pull up on a Bentley over you like a rash but next week pull up on a little Land Rover

1:43:48because you you haven't got on there are more you know uh oh that's a chanel bag that's a rolex watch that is a gucci i don't know the more market do you know what i'm saying but it's an easy selling point it's easy to brainwash people yeah anybody can get a lease car people can wear fair oak lexes and people would still be how did you get that i don't mean fuck all it yeah it doesn't make the man james let me tell you something my wife's got lovely bags and i will say that and my wife i'm very proud of her because if she goes anywhere and we was out with you and your missus and she didn't know your missus and she knew your missus didn't have a chanel bag or whatever bag it is my wife would go to the shop buy a loaf of bread chuck the loaf of bread out and chuck her bag in a Tesco bag and put it, because she, Carol, you've never been like that, have you?

1:44:44She won't show out. She wouldn't show to people to make you feel uneasy. Yeah. And people do. Yeah, and Carol's a very traditional traveling woman. You know, everywhere we go, she'll see who she is. But she had never put anybody down. Always got a good word for everybody. and she'll try to be not but there's no tradition anymore not just the travel community but any community that's why divorce rates through the roof that's why everyone's struggling you don't get married my mum and dad were married at 17 with each other for 36 years before my dad's pads and God bless him but there's no tradition anymore everything's confusing there's no women want to be masculine now and the men are becoming more feminine roles have reversed men are becoming so for people hold on there James pull up there pull up Rains up boy Every woman Every man Every man is a better woman They always say that You trying to get me In trouble with a wife But I always say it The universe revolves around women Women are The salt of the earth The way they can carry a baby The way they nurture The way they love And people talk about men Being protectors But have you ever seen A woman protect her kids Have you ever seen How far a woman goes Women could kill Just as easy as the man Yeah yeah And men are vulnerable We're vulnerable We don't fucking speak about Our emotions and feelings And all that shit Unfortunately let me say what I've got in life um I know what I have got in life um very well breached but people will look at me and it's annoying it does annoy me and they go he got that but if it wasn't for my lady wife we wouldn't have had that do you know what I'm saying she was the one that took the money put a pin in it and put it in the cupboard so to speak she saved it if it wasn't for the wife of the family you know the odd people that but everything that we've got i gotta thank my lady wife for because she's been behind me all the way you know and she's she let me run she let me go and then she say keith told you not to do that should have done that so i listened you got to stand back and listen sometimes james and this is all the community every community they have to stand back, pull the handbrake up, think, don't keep running all the time, you have to pull back and think of everybody, it's just not you today, it's everybody around you, and this is why, um, I like to keep to my, we had my niece over yesterday, and Steve's, uh, is he tiny, Karen?

1:47:17They're funny, it's a good story, this is, my brother Lawrence rings me up, he said, Keith he said Kelly's got a gorgeous chubby I went go away you crank tell me what you think

1:47:34invite him over to come over Sunday lunch he said if you don't like him beat him off out of it so I've got in my mind that this boy is going to walk in the door and I'm going to backhand him up the road because I don't want him around my niece good point yeah because me brother's already paying. So I said, why aren't you? No, I want your advice, Keith. I said, all right, Lawrence. So he names, everybody calls him Lally, but I'm the only one who calls him Lawrence. Fuck me, James. He's got the motor. He's your wife. Fuck a pair of shoulders on him like that. He's a personal trainer, personal bodyguard, and a kickboxer.

1:48:17I'm fucked. I'm proper fucked here now. And he looked at me and he said, what do I call you? He said, I'm not a traveler. I said, well, you know, and he's tight. You can see he's tight. And he's just died over with cancer. Just got over it, touch with a finger after that. And he said, do I call you sir, Keith, or Uncle Keith? He said, so what do I call you, Keith? I said, don't be brazen. I said, if you're a couple of things. I took to him straight away. and he got lovely kids in the cow, absolutely lovely, lovely kids. And he was there yesterday, still cool. So if you got that 100 years ago or 50 years ago, my niece would have had to have left the country to be with this fella.

1:49:06He's so good and I'm so proud of him, so proud of him, so proud of him. Did they get in? Is he adapted okay to the sort of families? Anikawa, he's good. Oh, I'm telling you, he's really good. And he's a... Yeah, he got... That's what you want, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. But don't cut him up in a motor. Because my niece, they say she takes after me. Because every year I seem to get locked up. I don't know why, do you know what I mean? I'm all, I don't take shit. I just backhand him, do you know what I mean? And the other day, he said that Lenny was talking to me. This is the boy. He's the son, Lenny.

1:49:51Lovely, very air-swept back. But I ain't just saying it. He's handsome. He is. Well, I wish I was looking at him. He said, Uncle Keith, he said, these cranky cunts here, man's cut us up. He should have coursed him for an half hour in the motor. Ended up swinging, jumping at the motor. and what's her name? Roma. She does this boxing. She's very good at it. She goes, she's a very good boxer. And she slid across the bonnet like starved skin, ripped the woman out of the car. No, no, we don't want her trouble. And she said, Uncle Keefer, take after you. I said, no, you take after. But he's nice in the car.

1:50:32Such a lovely, and I'm so proud. But years ago, when I first met him, I thought, I've got to eat this boy with a bar of iron, because I ain't going to put this boy down. But it's nice. So that's what I'm saying, James, how it's changed. And it's going down so fast. And there's only likes of Peter, I can say, that he's kept what he is, like me. Tony Barney, another one, isn't he, Cal? He's another one. very nice very nice wife's lovely people not Paddy Doherty there's another one man's a gentleman an absolute gentleman because I'll I don't understand what he says well story me and Paddy I'll tell you a story about me and Paddy I was at Epson one day the boys would go at the top and have a beer so I'm walking along thinking to myself walks in this pub and it's packed full of Irish travellers.

1:51:40So I walked in there and everybody's looked at me. So I walked to the bar and I thought, I've got an Iden here now. I've got an Iden. So I walked up to Paddy Docherty's dad, but I've seen the old man before. Walked up, I said, hello, Uncle, how are you? He said, lovely, my boy. I said, how are you keeping chatting to him? Sit down, sit down. So straight up, because all the fellas are approaching me. So they wanted to take me outside and give me a beating. You went, oi, see my nephew here? Obviously no relation. This man can sing. So he said, go on, give us old motors. So I sing traditional traveller songs.

1:52:26And I started singing. I thought, thank you, Uncle. And he saved me getting a beating that day. And I see Paddy a couple of times afterwards But I ain't seen him for years But Paddy's a jet He's still fighting as well Do you not think there should be Not a cut off to a degree But do you not think there should be More respect on the elders Once they maybe go past Late 50s, 60s to go Stop calling people out Because these people are still calling him out Some of them I have to say Peter doesn't do it Paddy doesn't do it um it's just that sometimes they get a young man come on uh james look the size of you look the size of me you know you look like you can handle yourself but it's like my son-in-law walks in here he's you know he's 30 year old mate built like a shithouse in your day you wipe the floor of him but you ain't that man no more this is the thing and he's picking on you so what do you do you have to stay on your ground, James.

1:53:30You've got to put your hands up. You're not letting anybody hit you, but how many times have you been hit and someone stopped the fire? You went, fuck the fuck with that. Because you know you was going to get annoyed, but you got stung or vice versa. And that's what it was a lot of the boys. Years ago, they wouldn't do it. How was it when Paddy went into Big Brother? How was that in the community? Because he was loved. People loved him I think it done a lot For the community But how was it How was it treated Inside it When he went on TV What do you mean The travellers Yeah What thought of him Because he went in Big Brother Didn't he Yeah he went in Big Brother But tell me the angle You're saying on that one James Yeah because obviously A lot of people don't speak out In the travellers Like the mafia and stuff Nobody speaks out at school Yeah But he was going on there Just kind of being himself And Is it And Because people were scared Of the travellers community People are still wary Not so much now because it's not as big and popular.

1:54:29Impossible where we're from, we had the trap and there was a park. Impossible was fucking wild. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Nobody dared to go in there though. Yeah, yeah. You know, and we didn't fucking care. Like older boys, whatever. Everybody was always at the thieving. So, but you just would never go there. Yeah. We knew. But with Paddy and stuff, like speaking out and doing Big Brother in the Fame, you never really had anyone at the forefront or on media. He actually done a, I would say, Cal, he done a lot for the community. Positive. Yeah. And it was, It then looked at people, people looked at us at a different aspect.

1:55:04Yeah. Like yesterday, I had an issue yesterday, so this is a real issue yesterday. On the campsite, I got Cossall camping up in Oxford. It was just around the corner from Jeremy Carlson's place. And we're rammed all the time, absolutely rammed all the time. We got some people from Manchester. We were cutting the rock violence, turned up yesterday. and they they big booked through a booking agency not with us a lovely manager up there but when you book for an agency they put you on different bays well of course because you booked one night then you booked another night you booked another night that picture you're on it's like an hotel room that's booked out tomorrow night so you've got to move your pitch but these lads and he said Keith he said they're built like grillers he said they really are men he said Keith I've called the police on them I said please please so with that the police are showing up this is yesterday it was so funny wouldn't it go so funny they wouldn't go this is a police officer he said you do realise what who you're living on where you're living on I said what do you mean he said where you're camping on he said it's Keith Dighton he said he's bare knuckling he's got a book out he said he's on the way with three van loads because I said if I've got to come up there I'll bring a few boys up there I said and they're going to be pulled off it ain't going to go nice so I said but just tell the boys please we don't want it well he's there the police heard him because I wouldn't have said it over the phone so the police went up there he said if you don't go tonight he said they're on the way he said anyway the boys got on the phone they folded like cards hello mate how are you and then my manager come he said Keith he said these lads he said they were so violent to me he said come up he said I see them take your words folded in he said like a deck of cards because they realised if we would have done it would have gone south unfortunately we would have done the business first it's bad be saying that actually but we don't often go like but let's do the duty first and say sorry afterwards you know so but why do people like that i would soon have stand in talk but they were smoking my me and my wife 42 years you know i'll have a fag i'll have a cigar she slapped me out the back of the egg when she sees me smoking but I've never took drugs our generation we never but this is what is changing you know you you're on my campsite so James excuse me I'll go down to the lay by in the road and smoke that or get out my gate there's a lovely family there they don't need it this is what I'm saying this is how things are changing but no getting back to Paddy yeah he done a very very a tremendous amount for the community I wish he'd and there's another man which we ain't gonna mention his name that's not doing so well for the community you know but he's a role model the man's a I'm surprised you haven't done a podcast yeah I was supposed to there was a Bare Knuckle event six seven years ago we were at and he was there and I was introduced to a man lovely man and I always rated him on the TV not anyway but yeah I think he's only maybe done one or two interviews podcasts and stuff But yeah I would be happy to have him on Like for me he's done well For himself And he could scrap as well He could fucking have a dash Yeah Paddy he could fight Yeah But don't be He's like punching the brick wall Everybody that I know His hands Have you seen his hands?

1:58:58He's got big hands Fucking hell He's got my hands I've got big hands Massive But he's a big hand But the man can handle himself He knows how to do He can take a punch And he can dodge a punch But he is And you don't hear the man swear the man's respectful around everybody the man is an absolute gentleman and like i say he's brought it to light for everybody and brought down the nice points but you've got to understand james from my point of view i got arrested last year again right do you want to hear a laugh do laughter. Do you want to hear it? Do you want to hear it? Now, I don't suffer people too much.

1:59:44I'll try to talk to you, and then she'll know, she'll tell you, then I'll just knock you out. You've got to get knocked out. So she said, Keith, you're getting old. Don't do it. So I try to cut down on the bits on it, but here's the factor of it. Here's the factor of it. he his dog was running about my caravan park and we say if you dog runs about the park it poos on the park you pay a fine of 25 pounds but you pay it to a charity I don't want your 25 pounds so you get a charity to email us James has donated 25 pounds so come on James I don't want your 25 pounds the dog's shit and shit and shit and shit and shit and shit and shit and walk around the customers show them and everybody comes to our park we tell them we're travelers they go wow electric gates it's beautiful james come down please you're welcome down the highest standard you could think is like walking into the cleanest gay community and my wife has flowers in it it's beautiful so anyway the dog's running about we give him a letter give him a letter give him a letter the last letter i give it he put down the back of his trousers wiped his ass with and threw it in me face but i'm with customers come out and told carol yeah carol said i said but i said next time your dog craps on my place i said i'm taking out the road and tying it to a tree i'm sorry james this is not going to go down nice with a lot of your podcasters so the dog done it so got the dog by the thinking feet for dancing so i go out my gate got cameras up so every camera every stock documentized you know so you can't go on there and the old bill comes they can look at the cameras they can see what's going on so i went up the road tied in to a fence waved to the camera

2:01:57Give the dog a bowl of water, you know, it's tied to the fence. Dog's all right. So I rung him up. I'm going to kill you. I said, when he comes back, I'll knock his mother out of him. My lovely wife, Keith, too old. Leave it. Leave it. Leave it. She said, be clever. Be like the Gorgias. Ring the Gathers up. or police, you know, muskos, mingris, whatever you like to call them. So I thought, yeah, the police has already been rung. He's rung the police. So I thought, no, I can't hit him now, can I? He's pretty cow. He picked up a rock like this, James, and he's thrown it out of the new Spectras, and he's thrown it on the bonnet of his Spectra.

2:02:49so grabbed it grabbed it off I thought all on camera all on camera put it to one side I thought I can't hit this boy can't hit him and he's a kickboxer well they're not nothing to me but anyway the police come three riot vans with a cow three riot vans three police cars you know all come James James, who did he arrest? Yeah. Me. They arrested me. But the dog jumped so much, he choked himself. And died. And died. But he told the police, I shot the dog. Oh, he says you killed the dog. No, shot the dog. So they came, arrested me. He's up the top of the park. I thought, when I come out, he's got to have it.

2:03:46they put an injection on me on my own land that I couldn't go up to the top of the park thought this is Andy and I said well the dog is it only holes in it they had me for 24 hours in the car James is about this is racist you know in the sales I didn't take that I've got a good scene so all these people watching here think of old Uncle Keith I've ripped the button off his shirt got the toilet paper I always do it you know it's me next bed and breakfast I scratch the chess set on the floor right and then rip some toilet paper up playing chess I've seen a couple of walks and he said Oi what are you doing I said excuse me I'm playing chess sit on the floor so he knows I sit on the floor it's unusual for me to sit on and sit on the floor he said I can arrest you I went silly cunt I fucking arrested fuck off he said you got an interview at uh four i said it's later today i said i need a time he went what do you mean i said no i need a time i need appointment playing chess mate so you got a line four o 'clock ten past four come and he said sorry mate you were near for your appointment he said but do you want i said no no no you told me four o 'clock it's now ten past make another appointment i said because when i get in that room you know that bar on the wall i'm gonna hit it i said i know the score here so i do play up but i was there 24 hours every cell across the front of me and the side of me jane bill harry was in it we've got a menu here what would you like for lunch what would you like for tea they never gave me a fucking glass of water not a fucking glass of but you're from the traveling community so fucking what i deserve the so that's what you call bad and I was on bail for a long count.

2:05:48I was on bail for a long, you know, police bail. Yeah, a couple of years on it, yeah. No, no, only six months, would it count? And it gets funnier now. It gets funnier. It does get even more funnier. They only had to take the man's close circuit CV. So I said, well, where's the autopsy on the dog? They didn't do an autopsy on the dog. And then finally came back to me, kept on coming in the middle of the night, didn't they? get me out of bed you know um they did the autopsy proved I didn't do it and then they come and he sat in the morning he said to Keith all the allegations that he's had against you yeah it's total lies um would you like to press charges on him I said why do I want to press charges on him I said I don't want to press charges on him he said but everything he said was lies he said we proved I said well why didn't you he said well you are travellers you're known to the police I said but it was known he said so what do you want to press I said no don't press charges I said you said why is that I said his caravan's at the top he give 95 grand for his caravan so nothing like honesty I rung him up and I bid him 12 grand for it now wouldn't even that so I got his caravan off him for 12 grand and then sold it for 95 so it was a bonus yeah so it was no win but like you're saying James we ain't the people that people think we are and via this book i think it will make people understand what today's society is and help people to come and talk to us and you know at the cotswolds everybody coming into my park in the cotswolds cotswolds camping everybody come there we've got so much repeat people because they love the wagons everybody goes they remember carol of course she's and they always say of course she's a proper pie Keith they don't mean no harm we don't we don't we don't mind and all our customers know we're travelers and they love it because they sit with my customers and I've got time and I go time for all of them I didn't know that Keith I didn't know that Keith and then some of my customers turn up there and a little boy comes to me Keith it's my birthday put me in my pocket give me a score you don't do that this is what you've got to do it's tradition James how are you feeling today brother?

2:08:08we ain't fighting the day are we? nah it's Sunday bro it's the day of rest yeah good day nice chat to you to be frank thanks for having me on board hope you enjoyed it but get that a point with Paddy yeah definitely brother yeah Keith but listen it's an absolute pleasure for coming on today for people going by the book it's a great read and it's very fascinating hopefully you can turn that a movie and yeah listen i wish you all the best for the future God bless Take care