My Mother, the Satanic Killer - Cult Leader's Daughter, Kelly Higgins Speaks Out

39:09So dad put us in at nine years old Where my grandparents tried to take us in at first but obviously and how is that though when it's not no one doesn't want you but when you're getting passed around like that oh horrendous and you end up with your first foster carers and because they've come through as family members because my first foster carers was related to my grandma they'd had no training you know at the end of the day they was cheap they would have been paid cheaper because they were passed as family even though it wasn't of their bloodline they weren't supported they weren't trained you know so that broke down quite quick um by 11 years old I knew um he's been incredible with me by the way um they've been very good my first foster parents have been amazing with my firstborn son you know they've raised him as their own grandson and they love him unconditionally but for me it wasn't a pleasant experience living in their home yeah I was loved but they didn't have they didn't we was classed as naughty children you know to them we was out we was out of control we were feral is the words I've had thrown at me before as well not by them by another family member but you know they had they had nothing so it wasn't until I got to Sue and Pete that that I really had the love and the care because they had the training to deal with me and when I first still got to them I still was scared of eating that meal quickly in case I never got fed again I used to store my food in my cheeks I remember walking in and Sue saying this is the treat cupboard you can go in that whenever whenever you want.

40:37It was well weird. I still used to sneak food from the fridge and I had it in my bedroom. Do you hear that? That sound, right? That means that summer's officially here. It means that grown adults just sprint into the street for a frozen dessert shaped like a cartoon. But this summer, Mint Mobile has a better treat. Every plan, including unlimited, is$15 a month. And unlike ice cream, it won't drip down your wrist or look nothing like the picture. Does anyone have any cash? Give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three months, $90 for six months or$180 for 12-month plan required.

41:07$15 per month equivalent. Taxes and fees extra. New customer offer for initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy. See terms. Star Wars The Mandalorian and Grogu is now streaming on Disney+. What are you waiting for? Hop on. The must-see galactic adventure comes home on Disney+. This is the way. Our only chance is to work together. I like this, kid. Always wear your seatbelt. Star Wars The Mandalorian and Grogu now streaming on Disney Plus Read PG-13

41:43Where did you go to that house? Eleven How long were you there for? Until I had my boy Were you drinking? Taking drugs then? No, not really I was quite I'd go on sometimes with the kids you'd go on so we lived in where there was farms and stuff so I'd be on the hay fields and stuff with the goods, drinking a bit, but nothing that caused Sue any worry. One of the girls there got us all trying a bit of weed in the woodlands near there, but it was never for me. I wasn't one who luckily felt a release from anything like that at that age. I was just very much, yeah, I wasn't really into it, but then later on at times in life I did.

42:25How long were you visiting your mum each month at this time? Six times a year until I was 18. So over the two months? Yeah. And what was the relationship then? Like you said, you didn't understand what she... No. You knew she was in for murder? Yeah. But you didn't know how dark it was? I knew it was murderous, Suzanne. I knew Suzanne was a child. And I knew my memories was there with Suzanne. I grieved for Suzanne my whole life up until probably... Even now, he's still going to grieve for Suzanne. You know, at the end of the day, that girl's life went because of us being in that house. But, yeah, I can't remember what you just asked me.

42:58When you were going and visiting your mum, and what was the sort of conversations? Was she still being evil and kind of controlling them? She wasn't being evil, but at times she was clever, you know, and at times as well when you was in them visits, Gina was in there as well with her children on her visits, so you're not only visiting one abuser, you've also got another abuser in the room that you traumatise up to the eyeballs with, so you're sitting there like a shitting dog. It was angering, me and James would be literally trembling with fear waiting to get out of there. it was a very weird situation um there was a time and i'm going to say this when mum was sleeping with the wing governor um he did lose his job obviously i don't know if you've read up on that part of it but i remember that visit was very weird went and visited mum um she had like a colour in the caterpillar cake she had a little black dress on she was sat on the governor's desk because we was allowed in his office for this visit and it was just it was very honestly it It was weird, all of it.

43:58I don't think they should get any visits, any associate. I interviewed a prison officer who befriended Myra Hindley. My mum had a sexual relationship with Myra Hindley. These people are so calculated, though, that this guy was so fucking manipulated. Yeah. It says in the papers that he had a relationship. He denies it. I think it was a lot more sinister because she ended up in a relationship with the social worker who had the keys, who was letting her out. This prison officer took his kids. you could take kids in for the day visit. Took his kids to spend the day with Myra Hindley who'd fucking killed kids.

44:31He was sticking up for her, this stupid cunt. And I thought like, everything is vibration with me. I see things differently from everybody else. But there was something dark. How can you... And he tried to justify it to me. This woman is a convicted killer. Killed kids. You have took your daughter to be around this woman and made excuses that or people change. These people don't change. there's something in their mind that's wrong that's wired up wrong it's like a paedophile they can't change the way they think they can't change their urges that's why they need to go so for the same as these kind of I've interviewed murderers, mafia, gangsters a lot of them come out with regret and pain that they've done it and try and change their life to speak to the youth and go to prisons these people can change but to pre-plan and kill and torture I don't think there's any coming back from that but these people are so calculated people forget their crimes yeah but in their mind they still know who they are so they can kind of manipulate around it and i was i couldn't understand this prison officer he wasn't making sense yeah and i was trying to understand because i try and look at that from all angles how people see it how people lived it and the whole experience to give everybody an open mind of the whole situation i couldn't get around why he could take his kid to this woman when he was making excuses that oh she's a good person and she's changed because they don't change they're just using you Mary and they never change there's enough there's enough people that have been in Durham prison to say that Bernadette, Mark Neely and Mary Hindley ruled the wing ruled the wing there was the biggest bullies on there so your mum was in a relationship with Mary Hindley she had a sexual relationship yeah which I've recently found out has actually been proven and there was nobody they stepped in while you were getting took for visits to see your mum yeah social services would take you on them visits so it wasn't always a one always my foster carers that had to take me for the visits they couldn't commit to them visits obviously six times a year they foster many many different children there was loads of us in our house i think there were 14 of us in there at one point it wasn't a children's home but they had four biological children of their own we have two houses put together so sue could put a lot of us in there and um so nine times out of ten it'd be your social worker as well taking you on that visit did you love your mum?

46:51yeah yeah it's mad that do you know how hard it is to grieve every day for someone who's still alive and isn't even real very hard because you create an illusion in your brain and you know when you're pregnant and you go through life I lost contact with my foster mum for five years and she won't mind me saying that and she's got a lot of regrets for that but you're with your friends and they have pregnancies and the mums are buying them nice things for these babies and everyone's getting excited and no one around you is really that person for you and you sort of put a woman on a pedestal in your mind and you sort of think if I had a mum she would if I had a mum she would for so for years of your life you create if I had a mum she would so you don't end up really grieving for Bernadette you grieve for the illusion that you wish Bernadette was.

47:48Of what should have been? Yeah. Yeah I can understand that. You know, like just wanting that father figure, their mother figure to protect you and just feel loved. Did you feel lonely? Yeah it's a lonely world isn't it? Not having a mum. It's a lonely world not having a mother's love because even though I have the love of my foster mum she has her own children and I don't take her away from her children. You know I don't expect her to grandmother my children and my children don't have any hands-on grandparents in their lives and that's lonely for them as well you know Bernadette and my dad choosing the life that they chose they didn't just make me lonely really in life it's affected my kids massively you know to not have a grandma knocking on the door during my 40th birthday in September and I just had a magical wedding in August my foster mum were there first ever holiday in my life abroad with my brother you know so excited to see him in the pool and play with him like we should have done when we were kids but I woke up on my birthday and honestly if my husband was here he'd tell me I opened my eyes and he said happy birthday and I just burst into tears and he said what's the matter and I said just wish I had a mum like I wish someone would knock on my door with a cake and say my girl you're 40 you know how could no one how can no one love me like that you know but we don't all have that in life and they're sad but it's something that we have to try and just accept isn't it you'll see when you get good things happen in your life yeah it's horrible you don't feel as if you can enjoy it because you're the way it should have been my wedding was really hard mentally was really hard because i've got family that have traveled abroad for their friends weddings they've gone on the friends hindus and stuff abroad and they didn't come to my wedding and I found it really hard you know because even though my foster mum was there and she loves me so much it's just I can't explain it unless you experience it you don't know that feeling and my friendship group around me believe it or not like my best friend who's here with me today she lost her mum at a young age and you seem to form a very close friendship with people that don't have a mum or people that have got a bad mum because they're the friends that even though my friend there today had a fantastic childhood I don't know if me and her would have the friendship we've got today if she probably had a mum that she could keep saying to me oh my mum's coming for dinner my mum's this all over it's hard to connect with people who have an amazing mum because it's not the jealousy you just can't watch it all the time it's very hard my foster mum don't come to my house for tea my foster mum don't invite me to her house to see she's got a very busy life so i don't have that i have the love from sue massively but doesn't stop you craving and wishing that you had your own mum yeah every kid wants to be loved yeah do you feel as if not envious but when you see other people with parents it can make you sort of bitter yeah i don't it's not that you're a bad person but i kind of understand yeah it's natural isn't it you know if you're a child and you're in a shop with your friends and they've got money and you aren't you jealous that they're buying toffee you know it's a similar thing isn't it you're not jealous because you're a twat you're jealous because it hurts in a way that no one will ever understand what was it like becoming a mother for the first time very hard i was scared to death that i would fail him and that's probably when i had him that's when i really wanted to die because i was scared i was gonna let him down to the point where i actually did take my life try and take my life when he was six months old with full intent and I was gutted that I woke up absolutely gutted because I was was so scared what did you try and do I OD'd on every single tablet that I could find in the house my foster sister came along she she had college for me that day she was amazing she was always there for me with him and I sat downstairs of him and I just said to her I didn't sleep you know he didn't let me sleep and And she was like, okay.

52:02And I went upstairs and then I woke up in the hospital. Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile with your summer price forecast. Now, unfortunately, we're seeing rising costs across the country with possibility that big wireless hates you 100%. Now, over here at Mint Mobile, we're seeing sunny skies and dropping prices. Every plan to just$15 a month. Give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three months,$90 for six months, or$180 for 12-month plan required. $15 per month equivalent. Taxes and fees extra. New customer offer for initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy.

52:34See terms. Star Wars The Mandalorian and Grogu is now streaming on Disney+. What are you waiting for? Hop on. The must-see galactic adventure comes home on Disney+. This is the way. Our only chance is to work together. I like this kid. Always wear your seatbelt. Star Wars The Mandalorian and Grogu Now streaming on Disney Plus Rated PG-13 And we're back Streaming on Peacock May I present to you the award winning staff Of the Toledo Truth Teller Slap me, let's jar something loose I like that The certified fresh series returns Your boss, you always like this Or is this just an act Oh no, this is mad Oysters, everybody There's a certain satisfaction when you work with someone.

53:27Maybe we could be a family. You sadistic pig! The Paper. New season streaming September 9th, only on Peacock. This show gives me a reason to live. Were you ever concerned that you could have potentially been like your mum? Never. I've just had a weirdly big heart, you know. Throughout my whole life, I've won awards at bloody school for opening a drama group for, even though I was dyslexic as anything myself, there was a girl who started the school with severe disabilities and I went out my way and because my foster parents put me in stage school so I went out my way and I opened a drama group at dinner time myself and made this girl make friends.

54:03I've just always had a weird big heart. Yeah, but you can see that. Yeah. Did you take your son to see your mum? Yeah, once. How was that? I was 18. How was that? Weird because when I look back, because I was so fragile and timid. He needed his bum changing. And yeah, I regret it, but I don't know why I did it. I passed him to her to change his bum. But luckily she changed his bum in a glass room, you know, so that it was never, she was seen at all times. And when I look back, I realise, like, clearly she was seen at all times. She'd never have hurt him. But isn't it weird that even though she was my biggest abuser, I still passed to my child at that moment.

54:46And when did you start asking the questions of what she really done? When he were born. When your son was born? Yeah. Who wrote the book on her? Who's wrote the book on? Your mum, on those killers. Who wrote it? Do you mean on the Sadistic Killers? Yeah. That came out when I was 18 that I heard about. I don't know. I just know that the man was, I think he was sat in court cases and he wrote, I think it might have even been his retirement book or something. He wrote the book based on the worst murder cases that he'd had to sit in a courtroom with. And what are you thinking then when you actually find out what your mum was actually involved in when the penny drops?

55:23Well, at that point at 18 years old, when I questioned her, she still stayed with my friend until I was 22. I visited her one more time, I think with one of her friends, because he lived local to me. But then when sadistic killers come out, honestly I was ill. I was really poorly. to the point where she used to say to us when we was little, like, we'll always be connected for life because we have a bend on our little finger. And honestly, I can't look at my own hands. I couldn't... I heard every single person in my head, oh, Bernie's daughter, Bernie's daughter. I couldn't look myself in the mirror.

56:01I think that's where the makeup really came in as well because I was like, shit, I look like one of the most evil people that I could ever hear of. and I was scared I was carrying a face. And I don't believe I look like her now, even though I've actually had my face been threatened to have been removed this weekend. From who? From a family member that I'm not going to talk about. Fuck them. You know, your mum are happy to see them now if you want I'm happy to see them. You remind the world of evil every day, so I'm going to cut your face off. They was arrested for that and they are on bail and it's horrible, isn't it, that at 40 years old I'm still getting punished.

56:41and told that I represent a person that I could be nothing more opposite of. But, you know. You're going to get that. There's so many other things out there and there's so much madness. On social media, you know, I'm quite hard with social media. I do not care what a stranger thinks of me. You know, luckily my grandma was a bit hardcore with me at times as a kid. And, you know, it doesn't sound nice when I say this, but I thank her for it. And sometimes she'd say, Kelly, don't look at me today. You look like your mum. don't be in the room with me today you look like your mum like i've had it along a lot and as an adult going on social media i knew that it was a big brave thing to do i knew i was going to get some hate from somewhere but i tell you what every time someone says oh yeah i see her i see her when i look at you you know she's there she's in your face i'm not bothered yeah fuck what they say on social media i've been doing this eight years people are always going to talk shit not one person has ever came up to me and says anything negatively when someone's going to do anything it's the ones who don't say anything you need to be concerned about not that he's a date so online but you're doing amazing anyway yeah do you think you're in denial as well with what your mum done growing up because you never really had anything else yeah probably great denial you know if you want to believe that your mum was scared for your life you know she was she wasn't involved she she was scared and she wanted to protect you and your brothers even though you knew she'd never protected you ever before as an adult now I look back at 18 year old Kelly and I think bleeding hell should have shut her off there and then but did she ever tell you she loved you yeah How did that make you feel?

58:23It's dead sad, isn't it? Because I do believe that she does love me, of course. I do believe that now and I know she'll be fuming with this because she's used to that vulnerable. She'll be gobsmacked to think that my face is everywhere at the moment on social media but do you know what, I'm not scared of her. And I'm not scared of any thought. Like that girlie would be thinking, I'm not going to speak out, what if she kills me? I'm not going to speak out, da da da da da da. She doesn't exist no more. done too much work on myself you know I've seven years I've spent healing um I've been through counseling most of my life obviously but the last seven years I've been on a different journey and do you know what I said and you know I've I said if I don't speak out I'm gonna I'm gonna end up dead because I'm either gonna take my life through not speaking out because I need my voice to be heard and i need that i need that little girl to have gone through all that for a reason i need to look at life and say that's why and you know what the fact that is obviously now i'm speaking out and i really want to raise the concerns regarding the laws of parental rights around these children i feel like now actually i'm i'm not scared of nothing anymore the laws around kids and their parents is mad there's people rapists who get a girl pregnant and still get parental rights to see their kids like that is fucking psychotic the system needs change listen I've went through family courts and I know how dark and depressed it is and I can't speak for women as well but I just know as a man what I had to go through the money I had to spend like what was getting says and it was lies and then you prove like what I went through I've experienced it so I can only speak first hand anything I do in life I'll put my hands up and say yeah I fucking done that I apologise or whatever but when there's certain things in the system that are out to fuck you I've only created an independent podcast I don't fuck anybody over I like to think my actions do my talking but when you go through family courts I know how dark it is and they want you to throw mud it was me who was out nearly 60 grand to try and fight to see my son I've got two other kids great relationship they do background checks never had social work involved never but it's just when you go through a process and having to justify that's the thing that upsets me because I'll shy away from nothing but yeah we live in a world where you a person like you has to go through that he's probably never ever physically put a hand on your child but yet in this world we live where a man can murder his child and still go and see his child's dead body you know because he's got parental rights and he's got the right to go and grieve that child and say goodbye even though he killed that child and put that child there and I know that for a fact and then we live in a world where someone like Bernadette gets to have six years six times a year contact with their with their children even though she put them through what she put them through where behind closed doors parents can be absolutely levering putting cigarettes out on their children daily they then have their children removed and put into care but they get still six visits a year they've got no prison sentence for what they've done there's no criminal record for the abuse on them children to this day that is still happening in this world and that is the reason that i have finally found my voice to try and change that but good on you because you've got firsthand experience yeah from it you've lived it and these people when they don't have to answer the police for their actions on them children they've got no criminal record to say actually they've brutally beaten their own child and that child is then expected to meet their abuser in mcdonald's or in a in a in a center where you have contact where's the fairness in that in life you know like it needs to change and it needs to stop but then you've got someone who can have a partner that claims that they're abusive and they have to go all the way through that court because we know because we've been through it as a family ourselves and that court doesn't always see that in that child's best interest but yet these courts are even questioned on children that are being actually physically abused daily then there's no court there to say that their parents can't see them six times a year because the social worker and the rules of the government are that them that them parents have still got legal rights where's the sense in it did your mum ever say sorry no never never never so obviously i do respect my little brother and i'm not allowed to speak out about him but i can tell you that the visit that he had with her there were no remorse and that I found really difficult to hear because he went and spent time with her when she was released I think he spent three days with her and yeah she's just she felt very sorry for herself that she'd become very institutionalized that um she had to now get used to being back out in the world I'm going to be very honest with you um I had a phone call when that visit was happening and he said I was told mom wants to speak to you and I said your mom and he said if you've never done anything you're fucking regretting life and I said yeah I forgot to pay a bill I never took anyone's life you know like I don't want nothing to do with her anyway I received a mobile number and um I'd gone out I had a mobile number on a text message I never saved it but I'd gone out and I'd had a lot to drink and um I'd gone back and I ended up ringing that number And, you know, hearing the voice of the woman that you call mum that lives on the pedestal.

1:03:52So even though she isn't the woman on the pedestal, she's got the voice connected to the woman on the pedestal because she's still the person who's your mum. It was horrible. And she didn't even say sorry then. And when she answered the phone, I was like, oh, my God. Mum. Because that was her voice and that was my mum. I was like, mum, mum, she knew, she said, Kelly. And I said, why? Why did you have to do this? Why have we had to live this? She just didn't say anything, really. She just wasn't sorry. She never, ever said sorry to me in my life, and I know she hasn't said sorry to any of the other siblings either.

1:04:34Did she get psychiatric reports? Surely there's reports on her. I know she's won awards and everything, you know. She's mental. For what? It's been acknowledged in every female prison throughout the UK. There's like some Bernadette McNeely award everywhere. She created some counselling service within all these prisons so that now people that are in prison, say if I was a prisoner, I could be trained to become a counsellor. So they'd train me to become a counsellor. And then if there was like a suicide watch on someone in the night, that prisoner would then go and be in that person's cell with them for the night to make sure that that person doesn't take the life and I know that that was created from Bernadette and it was recognised and there was an award she was awarded for that How can you recognise anything from a child killer?

1:05:24Like it's fucking nuts the whole system but the people who run this system are fucking satanic as well Yeah Like I've exposed enough of it and I've spoke to enough people who I don't know if that's why I'm being targeted like I say I'm no saint never portray myself as some fucking angel certainly not but I think but why? Like what the fuck is going on in this world, you know, and you've got to question it and people think, oh, a conspiracy theorist, this and that. Listen, there's dark shit all over the world. These trafficking rings, paedophiles, higher from fucking the top judges and billionaires to the lowest.

1:05:56Like there's, there's a difference levels to it but the child trafficking has become one of the biggest money makers in the world because they're not just trafficking the kids for sex and rape, they're trafficking them for their organs or, do you know what I'm saying? There's so much money to be involved and it's so lucrative that people are benefiting from the misery of others. Was there any sort of reports that she got? Did you not get any reports of her mind, her brain? There must have been scans. I've never been interested enough to ask for them reports. The thing is with Bernadette, people ask me even now on social media, what was the childhood like?

1:06:33My childhood was hell. You could create a horror film out of my childhood and I wouldn't even kick someone in the street. So unless that person was attacking me, I would protect myself, obviously, at all costs. But you wouldn't go out your way to cause anyone any trouble, would you? So it doesn't matter what's going on in her brain. She chose to be as evil as she chose to be. Jeannie chose to be as evil as she chose to be. And so did Glenn Powell and Anthony Dudson and everyone else. There is this theory of Anthony Dudson being groomed and stuffed by this group of people. Do you know the other names of the other people?

1:07:08Because I don't know them, I'm rubbish. Because there were six of them. These people, all six of them was as evil as each other, is what I want to say. Because I know that my voice being heard brings so much attention to Bernadette, and she deserves bad attention. But they all do. They was all evil. A lot of the abuse on me, James, and the others in that house when we were little, once she'd met them, the abuse came more from them than it did Bernadette to me and James the sexual abuse was never performed on me from Bernadette it was performed on me from a male within that house you know the man used to come in the room at the night time and he would go in between your legs and that first you're petrified and this is another thing I want to try and speak out about and it's going to sound really odd but I want to speak out about it so that if anybody watching this who's experienced sexual abuse that is sat out there and living in their own heads because they're petrified of speaking and telling the truth but when you're a child your body does not react as an adult so when you're a child and you're receiving sexual abuse if that person isn't hurting you with that abuse it's as might as well be just when your mum's playing with your hair do you know that abuse at that time is not it's not painful if if it isn't painful at that time do you know what I'm trying to say with that people need to realize so many people in this life take their lives because they don't want to ever sit and admit that actually the sexual abuse wasn't the worst part of the abuse that they suffered in that house as a child star wars the mandalorian and grogu is now streaming on disney plus what are you waiting for hop on the must see galactic adventure comes home on disney plus This is the way.

1:08:57Our only chance is to work together. I like this kid. Always wear your seatbelt. Star Wars The Mandalorian and Grogu. Now streaming on Disney+. Read PG-13. And we're back. Streaming on Peacock. May I present to you the award-winning staff of the Toledo Truth Teller. Slap me. Let's draw something loose. Ay, yes! I like that. The Certified Press Series returns. Your boss. You always like this? Or is this just an act? Oh no, this is mad. Oysters, everybody! There's a certain satisfaction when you work with someone. Maybe we could be a family. You sadistic pig! The Paper. New season streaming September 9th, only on Peacock.

1:09:43This show gives me a reason to live. This episode is brought to you by ChatGPT. Hey, it's Bill Simmons from the Bill Simmons Podcast. Have you guys heard about ChatGPT work? It's the new way to use ChatGPT for bigger multi-step projects. And when you need more than just answers, give ChatGPT work access to your apps and files and it can create real work documents like spreadsheets, slides, and structured reports. Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting work mode available on Plus and Pro plans. Did your mom know about it though? I couldn't tell you. I interviewed a girl who was being abused when she was six 38 for years Yeah And you know when she wasn't getting abused she thought she wasn't loved Yeah, because that's life isn't it You know unfortunately that's the way that the brain goes And I questioned So people who used to like My foster mum's taught me to speak out from a very young age But my foster mum will tell you that I used to say to her I've never been sexually abused I've never been sexually abused And I worked So I've been a beautician all my life, fun and off but I eventually worked in a mental health unit myself I wanted to give something back I worked there for three years and I went on a training course and it was really it was mega that training course because it could have made me very ill but luckily I found strength from it because there was no one knows who you are in that room you know and at the end of the day you're working with people that have been from a lot and this man stood up and he was speaking about his trauma and his sexual abuse and he said are a lot of people in the mental health units out there and a lot of drug users and people they're in them positions because they're scared of ever letting out of their mouth that that sexual abuse wasn't the worst part of the abuse in their childhood people get scared of even talking out about it because they don't want to be taken as in oh were you asked for that then because you enjoyed that then you didn't enjoy it you as a child your body was non-reactive as an adult if you're if someone's touching you sexually eventually your body would react but not as a child your body doesn't react it's the same as stroking a child's hair or stroking a child's back it's just the fact that you're not being hurt at that time i've interviewed a lot of guys it took them 20 30 years to open up when they did because they were being abused by their karate instructor or the football coach they questioned their sexuality going through their whole life because we're being abused by a man and they didn't know what was going on because their mind count program yeah and it becomes normal so i think that happens to everyone that's part of growing up like it's sick yeah when you walked away from your mum how how was that decision when obviously you've been she's been in your whole life no matter what but when you decided right enough's enough and you decided to kind of walk away how was that around us i begged my grandma to have me sectioned i said i'm not well this is it i thought that was the tipping point for me i thought i've never ever ever had to take any um mental health medication my parents my foster parents were very strong on the fact that I should always speak don't ever let anyone give you any medication and that was the point where I was saying I need radicating I need I'm gonna die I need to die my poor husband took me shopping um because obviously I was in massive trauma it was like right we're going into Manchester I'm gonna buy you whatever you want you know to come I had with the babe my second baby by this point she was only very early I think she was about eight week old and I was driving and I ended up out the car I threw myself out the car while the car were driving with my son in the back of my daughter I ended up on a bus and my husband traveled behind the bus kept ringing my mobile begging me to get off and the whole time I was ringing my grandma saying you need to get me to the hospital now I'm gonna die I need to die I either you leave let me take my life now or you have me section now because I can't do this no more I'm done and then I got off the bus and Gaz got me in his car and I went into my gran and she wasn't the most cuddly grandma and at this point she just opened her arms and she just cuddled me so tight and she said you're not going into that we're not getting you sectioned because that's where we'll lose you she said we're going to get you through this we're going to do this and yeah it was like a grieving process you know you look back at that little girl and you look back at your mum and then you realise that your mum's evil in a way that you never even could have imagined.

1:14:09You knew that she was evil anyway for what she'd inflicted on you and then to realise what had happened to Suzanne in that room and you and James have got vivid memories of that room because you had to clean it on your hands and knees. It was a lot. It's a ripple effect it has from these six people. It's not just a effect that only has put the people around their lives to kids, the families of Suzanne and it's something you have to live with but these are the cards you're dealt and the thing about you, you've grew strength from it, you've got the twinkle in your eye, you're looking to fight back and that's the beautiful thing because when you fight back, that's when you must keep going and you don't falter you've fought your whole life, this is the easy part because once you start tearing it and speaking from it it's like layers, you just start peeling them off and then that heavy weight becomes lighter and then you start finding your voice and go do you know what because the thing about people who's been abused no matter what it is a lot of people take their life yeah some of them become abusers themselves but then you'll get people who use it to their advantage yeah and speak out because you don't know who's watching or listening to then come forward to then be the light and the voice and the strength for them yeah and some people can utilize it to their advantage and you're at that stage you're willing to fight back so i take my hat off to you and anything i can ever help with you know where i am but what's the steps then now where do you go with it all because obviously you're doing TikTok videos that's how I came across you people were tagging me in the comments but I'm all over stories like this because I understand the power of them and it's to understand because a lot of people I don't know if you blamed yourself but a lot of people can blame themselves for being abused or going through mad stuff and people don't understand it unless they've lived it but what's the process now with it all?

1:15:52I think I just really want it so we've got a petition going out for a Kelly's law to be looked at to remove parental rights for any parent that is proven to have physically abused their children before and then have them taken off them and put in the care system I want but I will really want to try and have my voice heard to be used for foster parents to have some parental rights because there's no parental rights for foster carers out there I've had so many foster parents reach out to me a lot of them don't even really foster anymore you know I've had a lady reach out to me and I won't go into it but they've took a child in and loved that child as their own the parents didn't want anything to do with this child this child dies why in their care because he was severely disabled they knew they'd have him for a limited time and then foster parents wasn't even allowed to attend the child's funeral and then them foster parents are the only parents that that child would know and remember they weren't even allowed to give a song to that little boy's funeral that is mega that you know these children deserve to have foster carers that when they say to their foster parents I don't want to go and see my abuser today their foster carers can say I can say no we're not in a world where that that the foster parents have the rights to do that foster carers can I please take your child to Disneyland and give them an adventure of a lifetime if that parent says you're not leaving the country with my child they're not leaving the country with their child it needs to change it needs to stop i think anybody who works with kids as well they should be everybody should be placed under a polygraph test yes they say it's not 100 accurate but you get a rough understanding who this person is and what their attention their intentions are people who work in schools football coaches and listen are some great teachers and some great coaches but your biggest fucking predators will want to work with kids whether that's a priest a football coach a school teacher there needs to be enough protection for kids because it destroys their whole fucking life it's okay these people going to prison and the sentences are so lenient the kids have got the death sentence their whole life they've got to live with that sort of pain there's got to be more protection for raising children and keep and who's protected you're not just talking male you're talking female some of these nursery teachers in schools some of the stories I've heard like it's fucking with minor because I didn't realise I grew up in an alright life in Glasgow yes a bit scatty a bit mad done some mad shit but when you start hearing the stories it makes you question everyone I don't trust anyone who wants to work with kids I love my kids but they're fucking pests so I've got to question that why somebody can enjoy their time with a kid 24 7 working in schools and that's just the way my mind is I interviewed an undercover paedophile and always mention this man I questioned him I thought why do you want to look at those videos and photos every day I questioned him and he says look James once I he went to a house and there was like eight people in this house they're all clucking they're coming off drugs and they're all high because I knew there was a young boy coming to the house a young boy who's only 11 he saved that young boy and I asked him the question why would you want to do that job because for me I would be angry and agitated he says James I was feeling the same way as you but once I saved that young boy how could I walk away so it made sense because there is good people out there with good intentions and wanting to help but he just couldn't walk away knowing the damage it would do to his mind so I respected his answer but I had to ask the question because I think because people get the green light as well to work with this sort of material and get their own kicks but not everybody is bad but it's just when you hear all those stories you've got to question everybody that's why my kids don't have sleepovers nothing to do with the parents the parents could be good but it's the fucking postman the brother, the sister, the next door neighbour who the fuck is coming in I don't know who's coming in and a lot of kids will remain quiet because like you say we'll kill your mum you'll kill your dad and I just don't want to put anybody in that position I've interviewed people when people have had cameras heading in toilets and in rooms and you're thinking the house fucked up it's an hard one though isn't it for people like us who live with them anxieties because we also have to let our kids live life and what we do is once we form a friendship group we open up to that friendship group and like my kids have got an auntie and an uncle there they've just had their baby that you know who you can and can't trust don't you in life my brother james oh my god i trust him with my kids lives janine and johnny i trust him with my kirstie i trust him with my kids lives you know so even though initially you think i can't let them sleep i can't let them sleep i can't let them go anywhere you've got to as well because we then trigger raging anxiety and we can trigger raging mental health in our children can't with that and they can backfire yeah we've got to dead careful and I'm being guilty of that the way I see it I would rather you in my protection and for me knowing that you're safe whether you're going to fall out maybe you will rebel in 5-10 years I'm not willing to take that chance because if anything happens I'm in for murder or I can't live with that regret knowing as a father your job is to protect at all costs and I've just listen my daughter fucking hates me for it wait until your kids are going on nights out you're going to struggle there I'm not giving a fuck but it's just I get a little older and my daughter's starting to understand it a bit more I'm not saying why she's not going to sleepovers I'm just saying listen you can't go half a leg out for meals and play dates and the weekend and stuff but just not sleepovers thankfully now she'll understand it Do you allow them all to sleep at your house though?

1:21:25No Oh we have everyone's I love kids so I'm completely like and I'd be the person you might think why do you love kids but honestly not sleepovers they can all fucking play and get their pizzas and watch TV's but everybody can fuck off at night I love it it's just I just don't trust the people that I've interviewed yeah it's so fucking damaging like nobody understands the levels of the mindset even these I'll go home and I'll think fuck me like that was dark yeah but I need to expose it I need to shed more light on it and I just understand how the world can operate listen there's a lot of beauty in the world as well so we can't get things twisted and make everybody depressed like I love my life yeah But it's the fine-to-fine balance of living it and also staying protected and on guard.

1:22:09So I just think we're living in a day where nobody can be trustless. My mum, my dogs, my sister, my kids. There's people who I do, would die for and kill for, no problem, no blink of an eye. But there's just certain people you never know their true intentions. And it's not until you get fucked over you realise you should never let that bastard in. But that's just years and years of having those ups and downs for now. It's just keep your calves close to your chest. and you don't really need any new people in your life James that's where I'm at anyway I do what I do is keep yourself very close very tight, very small when you haven't got the privilege of having the family like you've just said you've got around you I don't have that privilege so my family is a friendship group that I've formed which are of incredible people and you know I know that I trust them with my kids and they luckily very much trust me with theirs yeah but that's a good thing because you've had to take some risk to trust someone but in your position you're probably thinking how do you trust because what you've went through there's not many people actually went through that I'd imagine the nightmares and all the other stuff your mum gets 25 years but all those killers are now three when did she get released I don't even know how many years ago but I reckon about so it's got to be about I reckon four or five she's definitely been out over four and I think the last one to be released was Glenn Powell Are you ever concerned that she might show up and try and befriend you again?

1:23:35She won't befriend me She might turn up and hurt me at some point which is, I know a lot of people have that concern Kelly, you're putting yourself at risk here taking on six killers You're speaking out openly but if that's that, isn't it? They're all sex cases, child killers They don't have any leverage They don't have any support They don't have And those sort of prisons all support each other They make friends with psychos all unfortunately, don't they? I just hope if there is anything about Bernadette and she does have any tiny bit of love in there as a mother, she should sit back and say, you deserve to speak.

1:24:12You deserve your time. And that's all I can hope with that. She just does think, you know what? People love me to shut up. I've been told to shut up my whole life. Don't tell anyone who you are. Don't speak to anyone. Don't let anyone know who you are. Don't ever speak out. It's embarrassing, all this, that and the other. Bernadette managed to keep my mouth shut for a long time till I was 22 years old and family around me from dad's side they get embarrassed they'll get embarrassed that I speak out I'm not bothered I've always spoke out my foster mum has taught me she's honestly them foster care is mine she's my best friend in the world I speak for every single day you know she's all nervous right now sat there at home for this you know she's waiting for the phone call to see if I'm crying or happy or whatever you know the witches obviously she's incredible but from a very young age teach kids to talk out teach them to not be embarrassed don't teach a child to ever not speak about their trauma they if they're having a nightmare in the night do what Sue did with me get them out of bed make them a brew make them some toast give them some biscuits whatever get a little diary at the side tell them them words in that in their head them thoughts need to come out of their mouth and not to be embarrassed about sharing them because otherwise they'll get to 40 years old and only just get the balls to speak like me yeah no keep speaking keep speaking because it's a strength people tell you to be quiet it's because they're in fear because they can't speak out speaking out it's a strength they've not lived your life they can't tell you to be quiet so fuck them as well just keep doing what you're doing and like i say hopefully this podcast will give you the most strength and realize i want it that wasn't that bad and then you'll see the support and then you'll start growing inner strength and then you think yep this is the right path go with your gut feeling like you say it's been suppressed your whole life and once you start speaking I'm telling you it gives you some sort of mad inner strength and these are like therapy sessions as well you'll feel good after this you'll question what the fuck did I say should I have said that don't worry about any of that shit what's meant to be is meant to be I don't question anything I'm too dizzy to spend enough time thinking about my own head how is your daily routine like now?

1:26:17I have a busy day a busy routine I've got obviously the three kids Obviously, my boy's 21, so he's working, but I still run around after the older girl and my younger girl. And I work, you know, my husband works. Do you sleep? Yeah, not always, though, sometimes. Like, might not tonight, but then eventually after tonight, I'll deal with it. I'll meditate. I've got, I do a lot of Reiki meditation, inner child work, sound healing, breath work. I've worked with my Nicola. I call her my Nicola because she is my Nicola. I call her my earth angel you know worked with her a lot I went and seen a new man on um Sunday recommended from James had some meditation soon as I know because my body will respond before my head so my body will respond with trauma responses before my brain will soon as I know where I'm going I get myself seen I get myself I go in that zone and I pull myself out of it Nicola will be back by weekend so if this affects me in any way I'll work on myself on the weekend and then I'll we'd got us new by Monday.

1:27:19Yeah, clearly found responses how we got with us. Yeah, we have to, we have to. And a lot of people ask me that. How are you, you today? How have you become this person? Where's your strength come from? And it's from working on yourself. We can all live life feeling sorry for ourselves. We can all walk around with drugs, drink, destruction and say, well, what else do you expect from me? Look at the hand I was dealt in life. You know, feel sorry for me, feel sorry for me. No, actually work on yourself. The only person who answers for you and your actions in life No matter what your childhood was Or no matter what trauma you've been put through Is you, you've got a choice in life Make the right one Do you think you'll ever get any closure with What you've been through and what your mum done?

1:28:01Do you know meeting Stephen Capper? Incredible, like You've grieved for this family Your whole life My foster mum used to say Shall we try and reach out to this family? Shall we go to Suzanne's grave? You know, you're grieving for this girl she was the only light in the house that was full of darkness and trauma and torture and evil there was this one face with that beautiful smile and her being in there for me and my brothers cost her her life and I find that very difficult and I met Stephen for the first time I think problem rubbish for time but I reckon two weeks ago and he walked in and it was weird like a weight had been lifted he had this big beautiful smile on his face he gave me the biggest cuddle and he said this was not you and I feel like honestly that is that is all I've needed I think you know and I'm going to form I believe not a trauma bond may I add that because people are a bit toxic and they like to make out as if you're going to form some toxic trauma bond and no Stephen's healed through the church his dad his dad raised him to be a really good strong man you know he's done a lot of healing himself on himself so he's not going to project anything onto me and i'm certainly not going to project anything onto him but for him to hug me and i've met him twice now and he wants to be part of my life and i want to be part of his life i want to go venturing together make some memories you know go and have a few drinks a nice bit of food he's a chef so he's a big foodie i'm a massive foodie i love food i was never fed as a kid so i need feeding as an adult I can I'm a big foodie honestly I was fed well as a kid and I'm still a greedy bastard so nothing will change for me he's the best kind of friend really for me to meet and you know when you're cuddled off that person that you've grieved for your whole life and yeah I'm not going to say I've found out Susan has an amazing loving family and that's nothing to do with me but you know this one man is incredible and I don't need any more closure than him you know and he's behind me he wants kids to have a voice he wants kids to be heard he's not about me being on anything and being all about his sister he knows i've lived my trauma they have their book out um regarding what they wanted to come out about suzanne and have suzanne's memory honored and they've done that themselves he is supporting me in a way kelly be the voice of the children of the future and that is all i need you know yeah it's a good match though because both yous have sort of lived it and understand that I don't want any closure from Bernadette.

1:30:35I don't need all that from her. I'm not going to get that from Jeannie or Glyn or anyone else involved in the trauma inflicted on me and my brothers in that time. I believe I'm bringing James closure through being a voice of today. You know, my brother's behind me. If he wasn't, I wouldn't be speaking out. There would not be a video of me anywhere speaking out and saying who I am. James is behind me as my best friend in the world. You know, we've suffered so much in life. My brother's support, my kids support. My husband's support. support my friends and families my foster parents i'm fine i've got the closure how was it doing your first video on tiktok well scary but i think by that point you know i knew this is my life now i either do this and i make my voice heard i had a really strong feeling i thought this is gonna go big i'm gonna have to back this massively because once i make a start on this i'm riding this wave out but you know what if i'd have been hit by a bus tomorrow and the world didn't hear my voice if there is a heaven I'd have been up there devastated why didn't I make why didn't I give that little girl a voice why didn't I give the children out there still suffering now in these services why didn't I try and that's what it's about isn't it let's just yeah how are you feeling now alright I'm dead fidgety I went the fidgetiest person you've ever yeah but listen that's understandable listen you've done amazing today proud of you all you can do is keep going though and every day you'll get stronger and stronger and then it just becomes easier remembering the first video done to what you're doing now now you're doing podcasts in front of millions moving through the ranks doing amazing but that's what it's all about do you question why you were dealt those cards?

1:32:16I used to, I'm not going to lie to you I used to, obviously a teenage Kelly early 20s Janina was a bit fervil at 1.1 my sister-in-law will tell you when she first met me honestly like my mental health I've never obviously, like I say, been medicated, but I've struggled so much to regulate my emotions in life. I've struggled so much to, why me? Why was that me? But now I don't even, don't want them questions anymore. I believe that that maybe happened to me for this reason. You know. For anybody watching that's maybe stuck in a life of struggle, what advice would you have for them? Please speak.

1:32:54Please talk out. No matter how embarrassed you are, no matter who did what or where they did it to you who it was who did it to you don't hold them in your head anymore don't keep their secret anymore do even if you are so scared of saying that abuse that sexual abuse was not always horrific and even if you're struggling in your head thinking but why didn't it feel that bad that time did I want it did I enjoy it is that am I weird am I come out of that mindset you know you're a child you never ask for anybody to touch you in any way whatsoever. Break that barrier down in your head. And if you are sat there thinking drinks, drugs and destruction, come away from it.

1:33:36Sort yourself out, you know. And you have got a choice. Don't sit there wanting everyone's sympathy around you. You're wanting a pity party. Get out of your pity party. Shake yourself off. Have a firm word with yourself and remember life's worth living. Where can people get in contact with you? What's your social media links for anyone who's going to ask questions or maybe struggling and too scared to turn to anyone? There is a lot of people out there questioning me and I don't get to answer every single inbox. It's very difficult but I do answer as many as I possibly can. But I am available obviously to be reached on TikTok.

1:34:09It's Kelly, Lives for Living and Forgiving. My Facebook is Kelly Higgins. My Instagram is Kelly. They've all got the same picture. They're amazing to find. Kelly, would you like to finish up on anything else? No. Just obviously, do you know what, I'm really, really big on this and it's not for everybody, but I'm going to say it. If there's a local person around your area, if you are suffering and you don't want to do the counselling, the re-trauma, because counselling's trigger, trigger, trigger, trigger, trigger. If you've got children in your care, if you're a foster carer or you're a caregiver in any way whatsoever, get these children into spiritual healing as in Reiki, meditation, breath work, inner child work, go and work on yourself from the inside out instead of letting someone try and mess up your head.

1:34:55Kelly, listen, nothing but love and respect for you. Thank you. Thank you for showing strength today and telling your story. And I wish you nothing but the best for the future. Anything I can ever help with, I'm only a phone call away. Thank you so much for your time. God bless you. Thank you. Cheers. Thank you.

1:35:13Hello. Look what TJ Maxx dragged in. The Devil Wears Prada 2 is now streaming on Disney Plus and Hulu. We are digital. We are downloadable. We are downloadable. Dreamable. The fashion event of the year is certified fresh. Pull yourself together. We have work to do. Critics say it's smart and witty and the perfect sequel. That's all. Get runway ready for The Devil Wears Prada 2 on Disney Plus and Hulu. Rated PG-13. And we're back. Streaming on Peacock. May I present to you the award-winning staff of the Toledo Truth Teller. Slap me. Just draw something loose. Ay, yes! I like that. The Certified Fresh Series returns.

1:35:54Your boss. You always like this? Or is this just an act? Oh, no. This is mad. Oysters, everybody. It has to have my heart. There's a certain satisfaction when you work with someone. Maybe we could be a family. You sadistic pig. The Paper. New season streaming September 9th, only on Peacock. This show gives me a reason to laugh. This episode is brought to you by ChatGPT. Hey, it's Bill Simmons from the Bill Simmons Podcast. Have you guys heard about ChatGPT work? It's the new way to use ChatGPT for bigger multi-step projects. And when you need more than just answers, give ChatGPT work access to your apps and files, and it can create real work documents like spreadsheets, slides, and structured reports.

1:36:36Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting work mode available on Plus and Pro plans.