The Dark Truth About Jay Z - Best Friend DeHaven Irby Tells All

27:13Yeah, I drove past that just last week. Oh, yeah, you know what I'm saying? Looks cold as a motherfucker there, bro. Yeah, yes, it is. Nah, yo, but take it case in point, man. I didn't have a little brother, so... having Jay in my life was my little brother. So when I sit here and tell you this story, I want you to really think about it as your little brother. If anything happens, anything he get into, what am I here for? I'm just the best brother. So everywhere I went from the time of fourth grade, Spanish Jose, everywhere I went, yo, Jay, when I opened up Trenton, you know what I'm saying? When Trenton opened up, like I tell you, I went there for basketball, right?

27:56But when I got day one, when I got to go to that school and sing, it was like a hustler's paradise. I've never seen it like that before. I'm talking about hustler's paradise. I'm talking about teenagers coming to school with Benzes, this and that, big fucking rings. It was a hustler's paradise. I was like, wait a minute, I just left New York, what the fuck? Like, that's when I seen like, start seeing some real money because I was amazed that this high school, I was going to this high school. This was supposed to be for my basketball, this and that. But when I got in there, man, I seen some real shit, shit that I didn't have.

28:43You know what I'm saying? These dudes come in to Iceland. These have got Porsches and they hustling. So I'm like, hold on. Wait a minute. What's the lick here? And like I said, I had family there too as well. Once my family put me on, you know what I'm saying? what I had was selling in New York with the Spanish Jose. What I had there was selling for 40 bucks. What I was selling in New York for$10, I came to Trenton and I was getting 30, 40 bucks for it. And what happened to your run in New York? Did you still have that going? Nah, I immediately stopped because my mom wanted me to leave. My mom was like, yo, you can move into Trenton.

29:19But I still had those packs. So I said, I'm going to take this to Trenton with me. You know what I'm saying? My cousin was... Do you regret that? Did I regret that? Yeah, taking it with you. Nah. Because that would have been your opportunity, though, to fully focus on the basketball. That's true, but this script is already wrote. You feel me? Yeah, that's true. Yeah, yeah. This script is already wrote, man. Nothing, I could go back and change nothing, because when I realized this was already wrote, man. Because in New York, you've got your family, you're from the streets there, you know everyone, but how hard was it to build up a run in Philly?

29:56Did you get any hassle, any trouble? Trenton, you mean? Yeah. No, I tell you, my cousin was a good, my cousin was the dude. My cousin was a good guy. And he was a hustler, too. And he had a lot of respect in that neighborhood. So when I got there, you know what I'm saying, he was, they was like, he introduced me to everybody. You know what I'm saying? And let me tell you, man, I'm the best friend, man. I'm, I'm, I'm the best friend. If you a loyal person, you're a good person, man. I'm the best friend. So you leaving me with, hey, this is my guy. You leaving me with someone, but when you come back and the day is over, that's someone that'll be like, yo, that guy's a fucking cool guy, yo.

30:37You know what it is about my era, my energy or whatever. But everybody my cousin introduced me to, man. They trusted me, I trusted them, and they put me on and showed me everything and showed me how everything was supposed to be out of this. So periodically, while I got Jay coming down on the weekend, You know what I'm saying? And he's seeing, and I'm showing him, yo, this is how I move. This is how you this and that and the third. By then, man, he in. It's already laid out. The blueprint is already laid it out already for him. And what was happening with his rapping then? Was he doing any? Yeah, he was still, he was always rapping.

31:16I was the one banging on the table. When we was 14, 13, up all night, in his house banging on the table, his mom have to put me out. You know what I'm saying? We had our little trio rap group at one time and shit. His name was Shawnee D and my man Al and this and that. We had our little turn to. We was doing what he do. Only thing, Jay never stopped. He never stopped rapping. So while I'm dipping and diving in Trenton, in the beginning, him and Jazz moving around. You know what I'm saying? Him and Jazzo moving around. Then when him and Jazzo say, look, man, he come to me, Jay come to me and say, yo, you know, we going to London.

32:01Jazzo gonna take me to London. Word? That's what's up. You know what I'm saying? That's nothing. Here, take that with you. You'll be all right. Y 'all need anything? Call home this, that, and the third? You know what I'm saying? So while they over in London, I'm burning the block down. So you gave him money to go to London? Yeah. No, that was all paid for with jazz on it, but you still need money, man. You know what I'm saying? You still need your own bread. How long were you in Trenton for? Oh, I stayed in Trenton from 88 to like 90. What happened with the basketball? Nah, I never went back to school, man.

32:46I watched two of those players go to D1 college ballplayers and shit, that class that I would have came out of. I couldn't stay in school, man. I was making plenty of money by the time I got in high school over there. Like I said, you're sitting on$60 ,000,$70 ,000 in high school, man. It wasn't no purpose, man, for me. And, you know, this is when your family say, you know, look, man, if, you know, you want to be, you do everything as you grow. Pay your own bills. You know, we was all living in my art house for a minute in Trenton. You know what I'm saying? It was, I had two of my own boys and my uncle here.

33:34You got Jay. I had another guy named Panama and my uncle Buzz. Like, I had the right team there in Trenton. Were you partying also back then? Hard. Were you? Because that's all it was about, man. Were you taking drugs? Uh, dipping and diving. When you say taking drugs, it was party. It was for entertainment. You know what I'm saying? It wasn't users. Were you sniffing? Hard. So what? You went to basketball training. Yo, listen, it's a serious story, man, in this book, when it comes to when you say hard, because I really end up, later down the line, I ended up with an addiction. So, you know, that's something different.

34:21But, yeah, that's when you was able to, you know, it was just dipping and diving and partying. It wasn't like you wasn't getting high Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. No, you know what I'm saying? When we finish done and work is done, yeah, I'm going to dip and dive. We're going to party. We party all the time in Philly. I partied all the time in Delaware. I partied a lot, man. Where did you go after basketball then? Did you go back to New York? So basketball never took off in Trenton. Like I said, I just got deeper in the game. I just got deeper in the game. So going back to Jose, it was just one time, you know, it's just finally one, you know, Like, I was getting the huge packages from Jose at the time.

35:10Like I said, Trenton, I was getting damn near double amount. So then I go back to New York and find out Spanish Jose got murdered.

35:22So, you know, what am I going to do now?

35:28His father even said, yo, you know what I'm saying? That belonged to you. You know what I mean? I took the money to his father and everything, bro. His father said, yo, man, I belong to you. You know what I'm saying? So, you know, I'm sitting there like, I don't know what I'm going to do next. And then I had my homeboy, a good friend of mine that's always been on my right-hand side, always had a connection with somebody that was in the business. You know what I'm saying? So I started going uptown, Harlem, seeing these Dominican guys. And once I started a relationship with them, I pretty much never looked back.

36:09Why did Jose's dad not take the money? I don't know, man. Jose probably had so much money anyway. You know what I'm saying? His dad doesn't want any more. It was, you know, like I said, his dad knew me. His dad knew what it was. You know, I think that's just part of the game, or he could have took it, or I don't know. But he said, that belonged to you. how serious then does it become when you start moving through the gears and getting bigger bits because now you are talking life or death it's okay selling ten dollar bits twenty dollar bits it's not that extreme but once you start selling the bigger bits money starts going missing drugs start going missing now you're talking life or death like josey joe i mean one thing i always knew i knew what came with this you know i'm saying and i try to tell people yo regardless on if you think this shit is easy, you know what I'm saying?

37:08You know, I've played the trenches for a long time. For a long time. When I say the trenches, I played the trenches when I was in Trenton. I was in the blocks, in the trenches, in the alleyways. I played, I'd done that already. You know what I'm saying? From Trenton to Maryland, I'd done the blocks. I'd done the projects. I've done, I've been in the trenches. You know what I'm saying? So when you tell me about stepping it up and another, you know, stepping it up to another level,

37:49it's a lot more than you, it's a lot more responsibility. And how many's in your team at this point? Will you just quote the Rock Boys or is that just a myth? Nah, that's just a myth. Where does that come from then? I don't know. I don't know. You know, it was four of us. Like I said, my team, like I had a good team, man. It was me, Jay, Panama, and my Uncle Buzz, rest in peace. From Trenton. We all in Trenton together. You know, my Uncle Buzz would play the role of making sure that the drugs got from A to B. because my Uncle Buzz, he had a profile that he looked just... You look at him and be like, you the police.

38:34You know what I'm saying? He had this police look, straight guy, square. You know what I'm saying? And this is when racial profiling is at its peak. You know what I'm saying? You be driving in the police and you look over there, you see one baseball cap, everybody put him pulled over. So my Uncle Buzz was good at that part. He can get it from A to B. you know what I'm saying the police is never going to stop him or whatever and that third um Panama Panama was one of the guys that somebody be like yo this is my man Panama and shit uh nah I'll be right back I'll use the bathroom and he don't come back no more and 10 years later you'll be like Panama's still here you get what I'm saying like you know I mean he he was that kind of energy he was that kind of guy he was the missing link to me having my first key of cocaine you feel me like it played its purpose because at one time i'm like damn panama is a fucking extra mouth to feed you know what i'm saying like he's good but the numbers the math ain't mapping you know i'm saying so one day like i'm hustling to get this whole key i'm hustling to get a whole brick i'm hustling 150 grams, and then you get to have this.

39:57You'd be getting so close. I remember one day I was like$2 ,000 off from the break. I might have been paying about$18 ,000 for them,$18 ,000,$19 ,000. And I was$2 ,000 short, and I had Panama with me. Right? And they speak Spanish. I'm going to a Dominican spot in a restaurant, and we at the table. Panama's sitting right here to my right. And they discussing, and I tell them, yo, I got to sit. 17 or 19, can you give me that? I'll bring that back. And they in Spanish talking. I don't know what the fuck going on. They in Spanish talking. And as you know, Panama said something to them in Spanish.

40:42And they fucking looked at each other. They looked at Panama. And then they discussed something and they talked and shit. And I'm like, what the fuck? Panama. And I never heard Panama speak Spanish until then. You know what I'm saying? So, Panama tell me, yo, go ahead, sit in the car and wait. I'll be out there. I'm going to talk to them for a minute. Yo, Panama come out, the duffel bag, get in the back seat, throw the duffel bag in the back seat, and we peel off. And shit, I was like, everything good? He like, yeah. I was like, yo, as soon as I get back, you know what I'm saying, I know I got$2 ,000 or something I can get, and I'm going to send you back there with that.

41:21and I want to say, nah, you owe him 22 ,000. He said, nah, you owe him 22 ,000. I said, what the fuck? And he pulled a bad guy. He got two fucking keys and shit. And I'm like, yo! It's on! I never look back. I never fucking look back, yo. I never ever look back. And I took that from I don't know. I used to cop with a quarter million dollars sometimes. You know what I'm saying? At that time, that was just, you know, to what I hear now, with guys having connections with cartels, I ain't have a connection with cartels. I ain't have nobody. If it was someone in my circle at that time would have influenced me about, hey, let's go to Miami.

42:10Hey, let's go to fucking Mexico. If it would have been somebody that influenced me, I know I would have done it. I'm surprised you didn't think that way, though, with your hustling mindset to go Jamaica or go Cuba or Columbia. Nah, that shit never crossed my mind. I think because it was the comfortability and the loyalty. You know what I'm saying? Because it got to a point where my connect would be like, man, don't bring that money up. You don't have to bring the money no more. You know what I'm saying? We'll come get the money. Because you're buying from here for 18 and 20. You could have got it for five or six.

42:49Yeah. Across the water. Yeah. Nobody never told me, yo, let's take a trip, and we fucking this and that. No, I was just too comfortable with the connect that I had. You know what I'm saying? That was a blessing. To not to go up there and fucking wait for them to count 200, a quarter million fucking dollars. And I used to be like, why would it count? Why would it take so long? I'm talking about six, seven hours. Why is it taking y 'all so long to count the money? I'm ready to fucking go. You used to tell me, no, Papi, no, no, everybody can't touch money, two guys count. They didn't trust their fucking team.

43:25They didn't trust money count machines, and they didn't trust their team. I used to be like, yo, man. So it got to a point where I'm like, yo, tell you what, bro. Let me know when you finish. We come get the money, and we dropped this off. And it made it less, you know, less responsibility. So that comfortability to have you loyal to that, I'm not even going to look at nothing else. You know what I'm saying? If I could wake up, it's 25 bricks at the location. I'm not looking at nothing else. That's the loyalty. So you're top of the pyramid. Are you passing the gear down to Jay and the people around you?

44:02Or are they getting a cut of what you're making at the top of the tree also? When that happened,

44:11I would leave Jay and them about nine ounces out of two bricks. and I'm going out of town because I'm moving it much faster and at a higher price. This is new to me. By the time I started buying keys, I had a new spot. I was going down to Maryland, and that was something different. That was more money, faster money. I was running into people who already had money, people that already had. I got$10 ,000. I got$20 ,000 now. I got 40, I buy the whole thing. So I wouldn't leave all of that with them, because by the time they get a finish, I'm heading back already. You know what I'm saying? I'm heading back.

45:00So that's how fast that was going. And then after a while, it was just moving so fast that training was no, it wasn't an option for training no more. Where were you at when you were at the peak of it? How many boxes were you moving each week? How many kilos? At my peak, how much were you making? I can move, on my peak, I moved 20, 25 keys in a week, week and a half. You know what I'm saying? And that was a lot of work. Because it was just me. When I say it was just me. Sierra has all the best active and outdoor brands for the super athletic stuff. Like running gear for cruising up the trail. Woo!

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46:45When I say it was just me, it was just me. And the reason why I say that, because I want you to understand when I talk about my federal case and I looked around and I said, damn, it's just me. You get what I'm saying? I'm the only one from New York that's here, you know what I'm saying? So just me.

47:08I had set up things really I had set up a blueprint that like couldn't fail right I got locked up in 91 I got locked up in 90 I got locked up in 90 that was the first time I ever did a bid I had to go to jail the day after my birthday I had to turn myself in the day after my birthday

47:37right and when they locked me up my first bid and i said this bid i'm so i was looking at uh 18 months in there and i was saying to myself in this bid like this is the blueprint i wrote everything down on paper on what i was going to do as soon as i get out of jail how i was going to do it how I was going to set them up, how I was going to get, you know, because I established a nice clientele before I got locked up. So I knew these guys I could count on. You know what I'm saying? So I laid this, I drew up the whole blueprint for when I'm going to get out. During this time, I'm sitting back in jail.

48:18You know, Jay and them, they maintaining the business. It's not flourishing. You know what I'm saying? They maintaining the business. Meanwhile, you know, they come, Jay came once, I think he came once. Emery been here a few times. But anyway, yeah, they was making sure I was good in it, definitely. But everything's still tight when you're in prison? Yeah, no, yeah. They keeping the business going. Just going. Like, there's no, it's just going. You can't, you know, not, it's just... Yeah, but it's your business and that is all you had. Yeah. So you would have had 100 % committed to the cause. You knew who you were, you knew what you were about, and you knew how it operated.

49:04Jay would have still had the rapping at the back of his mind. He would have probably just been happy, still making money, but also the rapping. The drugs would have been his backup plan. The drugs was your plan. Drugs was my plan. So during this bid, I'm fucking hustling in jail, like big time. Like, this shit was sweet. You know what I mean? I don't got weed. Like these fucking guys are coming in, you know, going to visit and swallow four balloons and come shit it out. And the old school way. Right. Meanwhile, I'm getting a quarter pound of weed, a half a pound of weed in every other week and shit.

49:41So I got the whole fucking jail on lock. So I'm hustling. And so I mean, it was a good bit. That's why I mean, like that was one of the best fucking times I ever I needed it to pull out this plan, though. so when I got home and I came home I started to put the blueprint to exist put it to play I said yo these five guys right here Emery this guy that guy that guy that guy right there I knew those was key those was go getters street niggas I said this is what I'm gonna do alright I'm selling you an ounce you buy you buy them your ounce for 1200 an ounce you buying four of them I'm going to hit you with four on consignment I need you to keep doubling up you know what I'm saying I need your money to grow so when I hit you you can't come back and buy four again you get what I'm saying I gave you those extra four so you can come buy six, eight or something you know double up I knew that these type of guys this is who they was you understand so let's say a month in the time that four they bought now they coming back buying half the keys and i'm giving them a half a key they got a whole one now you get what i'm saying stacking their money up stacking their money up you know i'm saying so now that i got you buying a whole key now right i'm charging you 24 for a whole key now right i'll tell you what how about you give me the money up front.

51:20I give it to you for 20. Knock off 4 grand off of them. So now I got 5 guys giving me their money up front. The trust. The fact that they trust me with this shit. You feel me? The trust. I come back here. Here, here, here. I'm fatten them all up, man. I'ma fatten them all up. Now, when I fatten them all up and they all buy, now I got you buying two, three keys. I got you buying two and three keys. Now that all stops. No more, I can't take your money up front. Now it's all straight, direct. Now y 'all all gotta buy from me. now it's just me now I made sure that y 'all got this so it's easy for me to have get rid of 25 keys easy you know what I'm saying because now he want four he want four he want four he want four in rotation and Emery who's part of the story as well I think he's still friends with you how was that connection because did you not put that connection together for people who don't know yeah While Jay and I was in Trenton, Emery was the first guy.

52:48Emery was one of the first guys I took a liking into. Why? He had that man. So I saw me in him. I saw me in him. Like, this guy got potential. And I'm telling you, the relationship I had with him is almost like how I felt. I mean, Jay, this could be my little brother here. You know what I'm saying? His mother was like treating me like a son, like really treated me like so I had a real bond with Emory. It was times that I'm like, I need some extra cash to go to New York. And I call Emory. He said, yo, go ahead, go to my house. This is my safe number. Give me the safe number. I go in there. If I was getting 30 ,000 extra dollars from Emory, I go in there.

53:39If I took 30 ,000 hours, I could still see another damn near 100 in there. that's what kind of guy Emory was in high school my work out my litter you know what I'm saying but they're also putting in the graft they're also on the streets as well yes it's your supply chain but they're also out there hustling it's all working together you're obviously the top of the tree but they're out there still putting in the hours still putting in the danger and still risking their life to make that money Yeah, well, it wasn't danger for them. Why? They left because they was on another level now. They didn't have to do that.

54:21They was supplying. You supplying your area. This one supplying that area. This one supplying that area.

54:30It's like seven of me running around these counties. It's like me having somebody hustle in Brooklyn. I got one in Queens. I got one in Long Island. Like I went, yeah, that takeover that's running all of that shit out there through me. How much stash? You must have had a good amount of put away.

54:53Spending money is frivolous, man. I used to spend a lot of money. Is that one of your downfalls?

55:04That came with the game. It wasn't a downfall. spending it recklessly on things that didn't have value was the downfall. This is where I talk about when I do my speaking, when I speak to the kids and they ask me, the money, the money, and I tell them how vital education was. Because yes, I could have been owning property in Dumbo. Yes, I remember having, looking at a place over there and someone wanted to sell it to me for a low price, and I used to be like, well, what do I want to buy this for? you know what I'm saying? So lack of knowledge, not an education. You know what I'm saying? So that's what I learned about having money.

55:44What's the most you had aside? I left the game with almost half a million dollars. 390 ,000, something like that. That was the most I ever had that was belonging to me when I left, when I quit. did anybody ever try and put it on you and your crew? Did anybody ever try and out muscle you or threaten you to try and take over your patch? Because there's a lot of big families out in New York as well. There's a lot of tough people. Well, I wasn't in New York. You know what I'm saying? And I ain't advocating for no violence around me. Violence never got me no money. You know what I'm saying? That's one of the things that came up in my trial.

56:33And, you know, listen, there's no murders. There's no guns. You're only talking about coke and money. There's no violence in my case and nothing. I never saw a reason to have to do all that, man. You run off with my 5 ,000, there's chances that you'll run off with somebody else's 5 ,000 that's not going to be as kind as I am. That's how I always handle things. I'm not wasting time looking for you. If you think you're going to come up off of stealing or taking in the game, trust me, man, it just don't work like that, man. You know, this life don't work like that way. If it ain't meant for you, I don't care how you get it.

57:22If it's not meant for you, it's not going to last. So I ain't had no chance. I ain't really spend time on violence. Do it come with it? Yeah. But I always stay straight and narrow, man, and loyal.

57:40I remember an older guy, right? Much older guy than me, Hustler. Three times bigger than me from out of Washington, D.C. I'm talking about way bigger than me. He was way bigger than who I was. and I remember going to one of my stash spots where I had about three keys stashed there before I had a little three keys stashed there and I went there and I go in my stash spot and there's a duffel bag next to my stash spot and I'm like this is not mine where the fuck this come from I open that duffel bag it's five fucking keys in there what do I do I sniff out who's it belong to go get him and bring him back there and ask him, do these belong to you?

58:30You know, first of all, he looked at the bag, he looked, he said, he said, and then when he looked at the bag, he went under the bed, he pulled out two more duffel bags, five more, and then a whole duffel bag full of money. That was in my staff spot. When he pulled that out to make sure that, you know, that was there at least, and I'm like, damn, I didn't know that was under there, neither. But the big, long story short, you know what he told me? He said, yo, bro, you know what, shorty? You're going to stay in this game for a long time, man. As long as you a loyal person like you are, man, because, you know, this shit could have started a war.

59:09He said, you're going to live a long time in this game as long as you have those values and those morals. What about the shooting? When you got shot, you said you took a billet for Jay. How true is that story? shit what how true this is life you see that this is life this nigga put the fucking gun in my back and shot me I wasn't running where he shooting no he grabbed me put it in my back and shot me and we started fighting for that gun after that because only thing went through my mind was Jay mother will never forgive me for this if I let something happen to him. And then the next thing went through my mind is my own mother is not going to fucking understand what happened if something happened to Jay.

1:00:07My own mother would be like, how could I let that happen? So yeah, it was one of those situations with that type of shit come to the get, come with the game. I went to a different connect at a spur of the moment, nothing planned. Just, yo, let's just go grab this. We got a couple of thousand on us. Let's just go grab this. Frivolously not even thinking. And I seen it all unfold. And I end up jumping in front of this dude, pushing Jay off the scene, and I end up getting shot in my back. So he was there to kill Jay? No, they was there to rob us. You know what I'm saying? Jay had on jury and everything too, so that was even more tempting, but to connect who I went to, they was there to rob me.

1:00:53They was there to get all of that. They set up me. They the one who set me up. You know what I'm saying? And when I pushed Jay out the way and me and homeboy started fighting and shit for the gun, I don't know, just got... I got up out of it. You know what I'm saying? When I caught up with Jay, Jay was down the block. Jay was like, you all right? I was like, yeah, I'm all right. I said, I couldn't understand why I was so out of breath, though. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, I need to sit down for a minute. And then as I'm feeling around in my back, you know what I'm saying, I put my hand right in the hole and said, oh, shit, they shot me, yo.

1:01:32Just laid on the ground for a little while and shit. And I'm like, nah, Jay. I'm looking at Jay, and Jay got all this jewelry on him. I'm like, yo, Jay, we can't wait on no ambulance, bro. I said, you got to go flag a cab. We was like on one of those busy blocks where, you know, you could flag a cab, easy. Jay flagged a cab. We jump in the cab and shit, and I get to the hospital and shit. And I'm like, yo, right before we get out the car and shit, I'm like, yo, just tell my mom I'm here. You go straight home. He like, nah, I'm staying with him. I'm like, nah. I go in my pants, I pull out all the coke, say, no, you got to take that home.

1:02:11You know what I'm saying? Because they didn't get the yayo, man. They didn't get the yayo. And that's how Tony Montana said it. Get the fucking yayo, bro. So yeah, but that came with the game, and Jay talked about it and it's music and everything, man. But the fact of the matter, man, I wasn't going to let nothing happen to him. No, so that come with it. Like I said, they brother shit. Why did they not stand and fight with you? Nah, he could - I mean, he ain't - we ain't have no gun. What - what we fighting against? Why did you not just give him the gear? So you were willing to risk your life to protect - See, my first thing was to protect him.

1:02:55You know what I'm saying? To get him out of there. This is why he shot me, because I went to push him out of there. And when I went to push him out of here, that's when he grabbed me back and pulled me back and shot me in my back. How long were you in hospital for? I don't know, a week and a half, two weeks. Two weeks. And I remember getting out of jail and shit, going back to Trenton. I mean, getting out of the hospital, going back to Trenton and shit. And fucking Jay had worked his fucking ass off. He had the money up. You know what I'm saying? I was proud. I was proud of him to keep, you know, he showed me something different.

1:03:37like, yo, I could do this shit. And then coming to figure out how he did it and shit. It was, yo, I've done a lot of work myself. Jay was more of a, I'm going to get them workers. I'm going to get me some workers. You know what I'm saying? He kind of came home. Jay had a nice, put a nice team together and shit. Had shit and organized. But, yeah. When do you start reevaluating your life? Because, listen, money's great. Everybody needs it. We work hard to get it. but when do you really start trying to figure it out that, is it really worth it or are you just straight back on the hustle? You'll be straight back on the hustle until you understand that that shit is built against you.

1:04:23Because I went to prison and came home and try to re-fix our relationship, Fifth-hour friendship I did. Went to prison, came home. I did almost five years. And I realized, like, yo, you know, that's... It's over. Like, you know, I'm gonna go home, get my life together, and get with my boy. I know he got something for me. Like, every... I'm a changed person and shit. And then... I'm gonna get out of prison, and this is when it all started. Like, wait a minute. You act like you fucking don't even know me. What happened with prison was there must have been heat on you if you're moving big bits anyway, but how did it come crashing down?

1:05:05How did you end up in prison? So after the federal case, I realized that I wasn't going to be fucking around with no cocaine no more. And when I came home, weed started to become the next product. I had a little cousin who used to sell weed and shit, and I used to be like, damn, how the fuck are you making, you know, that kind of money selling weed? And he's like, this is it, huh? this is the new shit. You know what I'm saying? So I'm watching them shit, how you doing it. So I'm like, damn, you know, there ain't no fucking harm in weed. You know, that's how I'm looking at it this time. Like, it ain't fucking coke, but I'ma treat it like it's some fucking coke.

1:05:46When I hustle, I'm not gonna be hustling to fucking just be hustling. You know what I'm saying? When I actually, so I started fucking with the weed and in no time, like, you know, hundreds and hundreds of pounds, I was like, man, how the fuck? I need to track the trailer. You know what I'm saying? I seriously needed to track the trailer. I was only getting a couple of hundred pounds. But my cousin was like, God damn, ump. He was like, you act like this is cocaine. I was like, that's how you got to treat anything you hustling for. You know what I'm saying? So I ended up getting caught doing that shit, and I ended up having to do five years.

1:06:23You know what I mean? And during that five years, that's when you done. You done. Like, I'm done with the streets. You know what I'm saying? I don't want no, like, I'm watching my man. I'm watching my man, my little brother, the whole time. He's just escalating, escalating. And I'm like, no, this shit's going to be an easy fix. When I get home, tell him, no, let's just sit down and put this shit behind us. How was the relationship before you went to prison? The relationship before I went to prison was rocky. How? Because of the way it fell out. Why did you fall out? It fell out because agreed, or I don't know what he was thinking.

1:07:04You know what I'm saying? I got locked up, and I got locked up for a parole violation. And while I'm locked up, I still got a$40 ,000 a week operation going on, right? So I sit back while I'm locked up,

1:07:26And nobody coming to see me. Like, nobody's coming to say, hey, look, you know what I mean? This is what, you know, are you... Do you need me to do this and this and that? Because I know this... Like, I'm just sitting there like, what the fuck is going on? Like... Seemed odd. So I ain't have nothing but four months left on that violation. So it wasn't like I'm going to be doing a whole bunch of time. So within that four months, when I'm sitting in it, when I come home, I had my right-hand man, which was, this was my, this was not my brother. This was a guy I grew up with too. We all from the same place.

1:08:05But he's always been my guy. If it's going to come to a battle, this is who we going to war with. I have to tell Jay like any other time. Now just chill for a back. This is my guy. You know what I'm saying? Straight, street, etiquette, gangster, nigga here. Morals, principles, everything. This is my guy. So when I come home, first thing my guy says, it's like, yo, we got a problem. What's the problem? Well, you know, I had to put Jay in his place. What you mean you had to put Jay in his place? Well, I went to go see the Connect, and while I'm seeing the Connect, I see Jay there. I said, did Jay talk to you about anything?

1:09:00Nah, Jay ain't talking to me about anything. Why would he be there? I don't know. So with that happening, and him seeing Jay at the Connect, that kind of let my man know, nah, you're not right. so my man set Jay out got into a conflict with Jay and it went downhill from there our relationship cause now when I come home now when my man tell me that I'm like well where's Jay at Jay off touring somewhere scared to death you know what I'm saying so I have to tell my man cause my man he's on he's on 10 and they don't stop I threw shots at him, and when I see him, it's going to continue. You know what I'm saying?

1:09:51So now I'm at my man, I'm at my guy, like, hold on, hold on, hold on, you get a feeling? Relax. This went on me. Relax, man, I can't, we can't have this. I can't allow that. So now my guy looking at me like, what? Niggas stealing from you and you, these are the rules. you understand so i gotta explain to him yo bro that's the same shit if somebody asks me to do that with you we can't rhyme that's not gonna happen so i'm in the middle of this so now i gotta tell him this dude tell my guy yo slow no this one i'm saying on behalf there's a certain word we use in new york we say on behalf that means yo what on behalf of me could you let that go man Behalf needs on what we have.

1:10:47Can you let that go on the strength on behalf of me? All right, cool. But you know, if he'll steal from you, he'll kill you on the low. Just keep that in mind. If a person's steal from you, you don't know what he might do.

1:11:05But see, so now when I did that, that kind of affected me and my guy relationship because he don't know how solid I am. when it come down to having to stick to the morals of this shit. But this is my brother. So now Jay look at it like, man, fuck it. This is... Man, fuck that, man. I don't want nothing to do with none of them. And I think the Haven got something to do with it. This is what he put on record. This is what he just said on Drake's... On All Love. I don't know if it's on Drake's album. He said, you niggas want me to chill with somebody that tried to kill, had me killed. Why would I do that?

1:11:53With the history I just told you we have, where would I benefit doing that? So it's bigger than just what you saying. So that altered our relationship for the time being. So he's went to the source. cut you out one of your best friends has found out trying to shoot Jay-Z you've tried to piece it together but you're still friends with the guy who tried to shoot him and that's why sort of it all stems from I can understand with your story and your backstory and the brotherhood and taking a bullet for him and your mum's knowing each other your sister's knowing each other and him coming through the game I understand your frustration but I also see it from his point imagine if someone tries to shoot you three times or how many of her times and supposedly your big brother is still fucking with the man who tries to shoot you it is maybe your sort of trust was broken obviously if you're the peacemaker you don't also know it's Chinese whispers what's being said to Jay either because if he's rapping about it you try to set him up and then doing videos when you come out of prison angry it sort of balances it out there as a possibility I'm just trying to look at it from all aspects.

1:13:13Right. But he only tried to... Well, what makes you... It stopped. It stopped, though. Did he ever think of why that shit stopped? Why my guy backed off him? Did you ever think that? You know what I'm saying? Did you ever take any accountability? Did you ever say, hey, this is why I was there? You know what I'm saying? This is why I say when men have a conversation and shit, we can see, you know, where it went wrong at. But at the end of the day, I had no control over that. He did what he knew of. This is how the streets, this is what it's supposed to be.

1:13:59Because the mob would have said, who brought him in? Who, who, who, that's who taking him out. There wouldn't have been no question. so at the end of the day you know what I'm saying it's about you ain't taking accountability for nothing you did not to have you don't owe me a conversation instead it's on record you go out and you try to narrate the story from a change the narrative of the story by saying that I set it up

1:14:37Come on, guy. Did you ever find out why he was at your connect? Why you went to the source? Did you ever find out why? Yeah, I knew why. Because he was working, he was continuing, he was dealing with the same, he wound up dealing with the same, all of my folks. All it was was a visit, my guy, by principles and morals. Hey, man, you locked up. I'm coming to see you. See, the betrayal is the biggest is when you find out he don't think like you. He's not... That's what we bond on because I'ma go to war for you because I think you would do that for me.

1:15:20I'm the guy that went to prison and said, yo, bro, listen, what you want me to do? How you want me to... Who do you want me to see? I know shit still got to go on.

1:15:34So, it just hurt more when you realize that they're not going to treat you like you treated them. Would he have took a bullet for you? See, that comes to say, I can't say. I don't think so. No. But then again, even listening to your story, he was still by your side. He went with you where you went. You were still brothers. when you took a bullet, he was still with you when you were in your hospital bed he was still grafting for you so it's clear that he still had loyalty something has made him change that maybe the fame, maybe the attention maybe when he started touring maybe you try and cut away from that old life maybe you're a liability you're in prison, you're being shot yes, you're doing it for a friendship and a brotherhood but maybe you were he thought maybe you could have been a distraction, a problem maybe you bring heat I don't know but he still had loyalty somewhere growing up, something has tangled those wires and it's sad that yous have never got the bottom to it and then as time goes on it gets worse and worse and worse, you're doing YouTube videos he's doing rap songs and really the bottom line is you'll probably still love each other, you would probably still take a bullet for him and that's the sad reality when you're at, when you're thinking we've had all this sort of emotion and brotherhood and everything that we've went through and it's probably frustrating how messy it has got because the bottom line is you probably just want to hug it out and actually have that conversation but sometimes things get too deep sometimes money gets involved sometimes other people around that person is telling him lies as well and feeding him information because there's also jealousy comes into play you're the big man in the neighbourhood everyone looks up to you as the big brother there's a lot of jealousy that comes with that no matter who you're surrounded with see when you were in prison doing your five you must have had a realisation of not hearing from him that something was up did you already know inside and how big was it how fast was the rapping coming how was he moving through the ranks with that what year was this just going 95, 96 so 96 so 96 his album drops it's taking off yeah his career is taking off in that yeah reasonable doubt it was his first album yeah and are you in prison when the album drops Nah, I'm home on the streets like, yeah!

1:17:58Like, yeah! You know what I'm saying? Like, what? Like, my fucking status is up now. Like, yo, your little brother, your little brother, your little brother. Yeah. But not people really knowing what the fuck is really going on. You know what I'm saying? So when this Fed situation come about, that's when all hell break loose. That's when hell break loose. So why were you the only one? Was that an indictment you got? Yeah. Why were you the only one? When I say the only one, I'm the only one. Yo, you read the files in a case that tells you that I come down there with a whole gang of New York niggas.

1:18:41I'm the only one here. Where's the gang at? You understand? The rest of my co-defense was from Maryland. You know what I'm saying? And you remember those guys I told you, those five guys that that I made rich. Those were the five guys on the stand testifying to put me in jail.

1:19:01That's the sorriness of the gang. Who testified against you? The same five guys that I told you, yo, I put you in place, put them in place, this and that and the third. Everybody but Emory. Did Jay-Z give a statement? Now, here's where the trickery come in at, right? Like, there's where a whole spinoff coming in. Ask that question again. Did Jay-Z give a statement against you? How about Jay name never came up? Sierra has all the best active and outdoor brands for the super athletic stuff. Like running gear for cruising up the trail. Woo! And the super athletic-ish stuff. Like fishing gear for chilling by the creek.

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1:20:35Never. Read my indictment. It says from 1989 to 96, I've been on investigation. Me and Jay had one time like this.

1:20:55You think not, Kamil?

1:21:01I know. Strange. But we gonna wave that to the side, right? So while I'm going through this trial, right? And it ain't a fucking game fucking with these feds, right? It's different. It's not this state shit, man. You know what I'm saying? I blew through the state. I used to go through the state cases like Gotti, yo. I had a banging lawyer in the state, but this federal shit is serious. Serious. So everything is off the table now. No arguments, no beef. We have a problem here, Jay. We have a problem here. I need your help. When I need you most, And you should backtrack everything I've done, everything my family done, this, that I need you most.

1:21:57Yo, I need to get out of here, OJ. And I tell him I have to run him down. I have to run him down, run him down. He ain't come looking for me and say, hey, you all right? He ain't gonna knock on my mama door and say, hey, went to Haven, he, I had to send people to get him.

1:22:20And then when I see him, face to face, me and you right now, I said, Jay, listen, man, all I need is some help. Lawyer. You don't got to give me no money. Just give me a lawyer. Give me the right lawyer to defend me in this case. Because I can get around this. I think I can get around this. You know what he said? He looked me in my eyes and said, Yo, don't even worry about it. I got you. I got you. We in 2026 now, bro. I ain't seen them yet.

1:22:57Friendship? Loyalty?

1:23:02Yo, yo, bro. I ain't seen them yet. All I got was songs. All he talked about is in songs.

1:23:16And you want me to have, like, they be like, how you so peaceful with it? Because you drive yourself crazy trying to figure that shit out. To say, yo, you all right, don't worry about it, I got you. I ain't seen him yet. So... What year was that? This is 9-8. This is going to 9-8 with my Fed case, 98. After his albums dropped out. After albums, yeah. He, he... Becoming that's his thing. Yes, he's that thing. You know what I'm saying? But see, now, like I said, you don't get to understand things until you look back on things, right? He never showed up. You know what I was in court with? A legal beagle, a legal attorney, a court-appointed attorney.

1:24:01Yeah, they're shut. Shit! They're going to get you. You know where he was? He said, you know what he said? He said, yo, I tell you what, Mr. Irby, would you be considering would you consider to take 20 years if I can get you 20 years

1:24:23I ain't seen no fucking transcripts I ain't seen shit yet you know what I'm saying I ain't seen shit but I'm telling you they have you the feds it's nothing to fucking play with I know their conviction rate in the back of my mind if he would have said I get you 10 I would have already said yeah yeah yeah yeah you know what I'm saying this is where they got our mind with you know what I'm saying the conviction rate because if he would have said 10 I would have been considering it like I think I could do 10 and without even looking at nothing that's how scared I was I've seen what they can do I've seen them I've had jail buddies where I watch them.

1:25:13Tell them, I tell them, yo, listen, you're going to say something. We're going to get your mother. We're going to get your grandmother out her walker. Because she has no business making those deposits in the bank. I've seen them do shit to break a man. This is why I tell you, nah, trust. You trust this guy. You think he's going to get his mama locked up? For you?

1:25:44So when I say they offered me, if they didn't offer me 10, I would have fucking jumped on it. But I said, nah, bro, I'm fucking 40. I'm damn near 30 something. You want me to do 20 fucking years? That's life right now.

1:26:00Nah, we gonna play ball with them. We gonna fucking go to championship. We gonna play ball. You know what I'm saying? So fuck it. I'm doing my own shit. I go to my lawyer's office and shit, and he got stacks and stacks of fucking papers and fucking suit in these little boxes of my case and wiretap, fucking shit, nice and that, and just say, hey, lock the door when you finish. He got a wiretap. The guy who was supposed to be snitching on me, the tapes. They got tapes. You know what I'm saying? So you get to listen to what they got. They had one little cassette tape with the snitch, which I wanted to use for my evidence.

1:26:36I was like, shit, I ain't talked to this guy in years. Who the fuck, he reaching out to me? You get what I'm saying? It's like he's trying to trap me. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm not doing nothing. It shows you. The phone call says, yo, where you been? I haven't heard from you in years. So it goes to show that he's trying to reach out and get me. Is that not entrapment? That's what I was saying. I'm going to use this shit for me. And then I go through the papers. I'm talking about thousands of fucking papers. I'm leaving. I'm not leaving my lawyer office two days straight. Ain't nothing.

1:27:11My name is not in none of this shit. They don't have a wire. They don't have a camera. They don't have nothing. My name is not in none of this shit. Your only thing they got is these guys testifying against me. That's all they had. That's how I got out on bail. The fucking judge said, yo, listen. do you have any hard evidence on him? Any hard evidence? He was like, no. We just got corroborating witness. You know why they didn't have nothing on me? Because I fucking quit the game.

1:27:52I wasn't part of the conspiracy. I was gone. How long were you out the game for? I was out the game three years, four years. when I realized that something is wrong when I realized that I don't have the same leadership that I had at one time I got back and I was like still trying to hustle and I'm trying to figure out all those guys I was dealing with now everybody's buying coke everybody's able to buy bricks everybody getting sold and I'm like who's doing this this is out of order I said, it's not, it's not, it's fucking something, something's going to go wrong here. I had it in order. I had it organized.

1:28:42I said, something's going to go wrong here. And one night, my fucking lady was like, look, we got cars, we got houses, we got this. What the fuck else we need? And I said, you know, we fucking right. and I packed up almost$400 ,000 in cash packed up left and moved to North Carolina three years later they came and got me for this case that's why I wasn't on it y 'all ain't start this investigation until I was gone I was long gone you understand that's just why I'm not into this oh y 'all got the right man but I quit You got the right man, but I quit. Do you feel as if you have been set up? Thrown under the bus.

1:29:36Is that a lot darker? Say if Jay got you the best lawyer. It would've hurt me. If he got, if Jay got you the best... It would've hurt me. Why? Because they look at that. See, I say, I had to struggle with myself to say, look at it from a different perspective. And I was saying, damn, what if Jay would have came? What if Jay would have got me alive? A lawyer. Maybe the lawyer would have negotiated all the way down to five years. One thing for sure, they would have been like, where the fuck you get them from? Because they know where the cost of attorney is. But maybe that's why he didn't get your help then.

1:30:13You know what I'm saying? So it's a gift and it's curse, but you... But see if he did, see if he got you the best lawyer in New York. Right. And says, listen, that's all I'm doing for you because you're friends with the guy who tries to shoot me. Would you have been okay with that decision? And you could have just got on with your life faster? I would have go, yeah, I would have been okay because he came and said that. That would have been okay. I would have had to be okay with it because he came and said it like a man. Yo, this is all I'm doing. But to look me in my face and say, yo, don't worry about it.

1:30:45I got you. I'll be, I'll get you, I got you on the lawyer. And then I never see you again? nah man that's not acceptable how hard was it in prison when you seen him blowing up were you still happy for him thinking everything's going to be okay when you're out were you still supporting him yeah when I was locked up but once I came home and realized that that shit wasn't going to work it was just something beyond that it was just something beyond that Because I came home to actually, like I said, to make up and make this. Nah. It was hard. It helped me. Oh, that shit helped me in prison, man. When I got in prison, it's like, you know, you could hear them whispering, you know, that's Jay-Z brother.

1:31:37That's Jay-Z brother. Jay-Z brother.

1:31:43Oh, it helped. It helped. You know what I'm saying? You know, it helped. because it was quite a few people that knew me in there. So the word spread, and I'm like, nah, that's his brother. That's the man behind him. That's the man, you know. So, you know, people going, you know, prison has always been easy for me. Like, I can't really recall having a rough time in prison. I had some rough times in jails, but I never had no rough time in prison. How hard is prison though? Even though you say it's not tough, but it's... been away for a long time, and seeing one of your brothers rising to the top of the rap game, like, it must be a whole mix of emotions.

1:32:25Yo, no. To sit in the cafeteria eating, and you hear two guys arguing about, yeah, Jay-Z was this, and yeah, and my cousin told me Jay. And you sitting there, you like, these fucking dudes don't have a clue, man. They know, you can sit there and argue, they know so much of Jay-Z, but they would not know who the fuck I was. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's hard. Then you got the other guys that run to your cell. Yo, you heard this? You heard this? You heard this? Him and R. Kelly, Jay talking about you on this one. Listen to the Boast of Both Worlds. This one, he talking about you. Yeah. What's the worst thing you seen in prison?

1:33:08Wow.

1:33:13Well, the worst thing I seen... was my sister passing away from drugs.

1:33:24It's the worst thing I've ever seen.

1:33:29So are they here not? Drugs. You know, all the drugs that I pushed out of New York, I never sold drugs in New York. You know what I'm saying? When you think it would never affect your family. You get what I'm saying? because you going somewhere else pushing drugs, pushing drugs and pushing drugs and shit. But to watch my sister be on drugs for so long and then catch AIDS virus to me seeing her last days I couldn't even recognize her. So that's about the worst shit I've ever seen. Do you blame yourself?

1:34:20Nah. It was nothing I can do. You know what I'm saying? That's, you know, that's what, um... I remember the state's attorney in the fucking... On my trial, she said. She was begging the judge. Please don't let him go. I'm trying to get a bail. And she's begging the judge. Please, please don't let him go. He is responsible for 85 % of the cocaine coming in on the Eastern Shore. Please do not let him go. Do you understand the impact? Do you understand the impact on what that is? And I'm sitting over there like, this bitch is crazy. What is she talking about?

1:35:13But she was right.

1:35:17She was 100 % right. The impact on the communities, on what I did. I said I never kill nobody, you know, and murder and all that, but I fucked up two generations probably.

1:35:41You know what I'm saying? This is why I'm so patient now, trying to educate these teenagers and these youth now, because I fucked up two generations. Has that been the penny drops? That you actually destroyed other people's lives to benefit your own? You never realized the destruction at that age. You just want to get off the streets. But was that when the penny dropped, when you lost your sister, that the damage you had caused all around the city? That's when it set in, yeah. It set in, but you don't blame yourself because guess what? I ain't put that shit here. I ain't put the fucking coke in my community.

1:36:18I ain't fucking jump on no plane and go to fucking Columbia.

1:36:25So far as I'm concerned, we were set up. that's why my forgiveness to these people to everyone is because we was set up anyway to play in this fucking game of death and penitentiary Jay ain't no no better

1:36:49than for me to come home from fucking jail and prison federal case and you partner with a known a known fucking FBI informant.

1:37:02Desiree Perez, CEO of Rock Nation. A known informant. President Trump just departed her. He just pardoned her two years ago. He just pardoned her two years ago When did they team up? What year? 9-6 9-6, 9-7 Yeah, I'm just speculating here But could it be a possibility if he's teamed up with her She's asked him about his past He's told her he's passed And says, listen, this can come back and get you If your rap carrier's kicking off And you're going to prison three years later potential he could have been on that indictment. Could it be speculating that he's teamed up with her, gave them you, for him to then be free?

1:38:03You could speculate. But I'm going to tell you, you know, it's all out there. It's all in the facts. What am I supposed to look? How am I supposed to look at that? Other than saying, yo, Jay, when did they come to you?

1:38:22When did they come to you? How could we done all what we done and the morals and the principles and all of this shit and you end up with that? If she just got part two years ago, she's been working the whole time. Sierra has all the best active and outdoor brands for the super athletic stuff, like running gear for cruising up the trail. Woo! And the super athletic-ish stuff, Like fishing gear for chillin' by the creek. Nice cast. Fitness apparel to push for higher reps. You got this. And golf balls priced so you can afford to lose one. Or a few. Head to Sierra or Sierra.com for the brands you want at the prices that let you do it all.

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1:39:47I mean, you could call it for what you want. I don't know. You know what I'm saying? But like I said, you don't get to see things until you start to look back until the chips fall. You know what I'm saying? It's just, I don't believe in coincidences and none of that. But how the fuck could that be? What did you do when you came out of prison?

1:40:12Came out of prison, I went... When I came home, man, it was at a time where it was horrible, man. It wasn't no jobs. It was a crash. The crash market, I was doing extortant. For the first year, two years, I was extortant. I knew a few snitches that I've seen on paper that was out in the street still getting money. Extortant. Tax, man. Just taxing people, taking stuff up. Yeah, you're a fucking snitch. You out here selling drugs for free? So I ate off of that for the real street morals and values. I was doing it the right way. Like, okay, if you're not going to, because the mob going to get due, they don't even want you to exist.

1:41:02So if you guys going to let them be out here, the game changed. The game is over. So I did that for two years, this, that. Then that started to work, and... You know, um... You know, I think... Me starting to get closer to God, right? I started getting closer to God, right? For help, right? And I tell people this, and I don't know what your religion is, I don't know this and this, I tell you what worked for me. Everything I ask God for, you listening? Everything I ask God for and pray for, to this day, I got. I got. So can't nobody tell me nothing. I prayed to get out of prison, prayed to get out of jail, right?

1:41:53I prayed that this judge let me out so I can handle my case and fight my case. I got out of case. Then when Jay and this situation was on my mind, so heavenly, so heavenly, to it just had me filled with rage and hate. I asked God, please stop. Can you reframe them from being in my head, in my mind? And God helped me with that one. All right, so you need help with that? You tired of thinking about them? You tired of chasing them around? I ended up with a brand new kid, a newborn baby. That's more fresh. Yo, yo, yo, you know what I'm saying? Like, if that ain't no fucking answer, that's what I tell people.

1:42:38You pray to God, man. You better be like, have that shit in detail of what you want. Because you leave it up to him, boy. You're going to be like, what the fuck? You know what I'm saying? So here I am now. You know what I'm saying? I got, this is the last one. This is my last one that I can be in his life. I can play a role model. And I can't do nothing but pay attention to him. so paying attention to him that took my mind off of the you know the betrayal this shit this all of this story and all this you know i'm saying and you know the next thing for that i asked for for help to take care of him i'm gonna take him you know god i meant prayed got a good job good trade you know i'm saying and i ain't stopped praying asking nothing yeah everything i asked for I prayed to get my documentary out.

1:43:27I prayed. I got that out. Made nice money off that. Then I had a vision of, yo, let me tell my story in a book. And then through film. I've been on film sets. I know about film. And I'm like, shit, man, I'm independent. I could take this. I could be my own Jay. I am. You know what I'm saying? I learned through everything through him with this business. So do I, other people are like, do you hate him? Nah, I don't hate him at all. Nah. I need him to be, at this point, I need him to be biggest he can be. Because my name never, never gonna go away. Did you realize how big he would have got to be one of the biggest rappers of all time?

1:44:12Um, nah, I ain't surprised. I ain't surprised, you know why? Because I seen it when it was in its rawest form, yo. I seen it. I seen it. When he was putting two and two together, I seen it. I was there. I knew. You think when I used to go in other cities in D.C. to hear these guys rap, I used to be like, yo, don't make me go get my brother, yo. Please, don't make me go get him. If I have to go get him, you're going to be embarrassed. I was going to get him like he was a weapon. You know what I'm saying? When I saw guys, they knew what they was doing, battle and rapping, I'm like, yo, let me go get my other brother, yo.

1:44:53But it must be a special thing as well Even though With what you'd have went through And the bitterness And sort of the anger To then seeing someone from the streets To have that billion dollar status Like as much as There is hate there And there's rage And there's lack of understanding Of what truly broke down But You've got to give him his flowers as well For the rise of who he end up becoming Yes And in fact the thing is though as well Everyone he seems to be around He always seems to fall out with them Also So there's always a darkness when you raise through the ranks as well. There's always a badness.

1:45:25I've seen it through other people I've interviewed. I've seen it through, you kind of see how people go crazy. And I think surely not everybody's crazy. Instead of blaming the ones who are maybe acting crazy, like Kanye West, yourself. Sometimes you've got to go straight to the source as well and think maybe they are so calculated that they damage people so much. So there's no impact in their words because people just call them crazy. It's just the lyrics. It's the Bible language on the street. It's the lyrics. It's if one fall, we be each other's crutches. We la familiar, this, that. It's the lyrics.

1:46:11That they get so buried into. It's like the word, and they develop a trust. in Kanye's eyes, he was like, yo, that's my big brother. But when Kanye needed him most,

1:46:30that's where the betrayal set in at. That's when I say, yo, you don't set in until you realize that they not gonna do what you thought that you would do for them. I sat there and was like, damn, Kim Kardashian got fucking kidnapped and fucking robbed. My man's wife? You know what I'm saying? It's a certain shit, you know, morals of that. My man's wife? Hold on. Yo, what's the... How we... What? So when Big Brother don't show up like you thought he would, bro, that shit is... It bring them down to make them look like they crazy.

1:47:14Jazzo, source money. It's a whole... I watched a lot of careers go fucking down the drain because they can't get back out of that hole. State property, single, all of them guys, yo. That's because you put so much trust into some people, yo. Who knew that when these guys figure out some of the record game that they would rape their own people?

1:47:40Money, controversy. I look at podcasts now as filth, Like, that is the filthiest shit I've ever seen in my life. I watch guys that claim they're in the game together, this, that. Now they all talking about it. This is a guy I brought into my house around my kids. And now you want to talk about me for fucking views and money?

1:48:07Nah, bro. And I always look at it like, you know what, it just was different purpose for me, man. so when people say man I'm so mad you supposed to be on them boats and ships and shit and yachts with them niggas and this and that and the third and I be like nah I used to think that way I used to be mad looking at Jay courtside fucking watching the game and shit LeBron slapping fire I'm looking at this shit fucking courtside tickets courtside you know what I'm saying next thing you know I was at a fucking game courtside. Just telling my story. I got there by just telling my story. You see how God works?

1:48:56I ain't need the fucking billion dollars to fucking sit courtside. I didn't need all of that money I thought I may need just to sit courtside. Guess what? I was sitting fucking courtside watching the Brooklyn Nets like this. I did this shit just through telling my story. Just through people really fucking with me. Like, I feel your story, God. I feel your pain. Everybody been betrayed. Everybody been betrayed. But, you know, it's just how deep it is. You know what I'm saying? And like I said, it's not just us, man. It's our families. It's our mom. You know how disappointed I am with his mother?

1:49:33She asked me to make sure her son was good.

1:49:40And she ain't come and ask to say, yo, you all right? that this shit to Haven, no, this can't work. Y 'all can't do that. Y 'all fuck your brothers. The one time my mom needed her,

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1:51:37So when I say this, if it was just about me, I'm going to be good. You know what I'm saying? I'm a hustler, man. I'm going to get mine. When I think about that shit, that shit just, that's what brings out that energy that people think that, oh, he's still hurt or he's a, what's he, all kinds of names and shit. And I'm like, man, you can't understand until it was your mother. You feel me? You would never understand until it affects you. Once it affects you, then you get to see the point, but you can't tell me how to feel and how emotional I get. Because it's hurting. It hurts. It's trauma. It's definitely trauma.

1:52:24You know what I'm saying? But I seek help in God, so... I ended up with, you know, like I said, life is good. I'm good when I'm in a good space. I'm around good people. You know what I'm saying? You're welcome, bro. You know what I'm saying? And this is to show you that no matter what somebody do to you, and how hurt you are and how hurt you can be, we're always trying to find a different perspective. Even if you're not going to get the answer, why, yo, why'd you do that to me? If that person don't want to talk to you, so be it, this, that, and the third. but at the end of the day, you can't let it consume you.

1:53:08You can't let the hurt turn into hate, because that'll block all your blessings. How was it when he sings about you and raps about you? I know he thinking about me. Because what was the one that says his friend get shot up? What was that one? Which one? He gets friend, gets sprayed. Got his side sprayed up on the Uptime Brack. That's me. Yeah. I mean, like I said, all the way up until now, that he still talks about me on record. You know what I'm saying? I know you can't tell me he ain't thinking about me. Of course. Listen, yous have been through a lot. You know what I'm saying? And whether he don't give me a dime, right?

1:53:51And like I said, whether he don't give me a dime, he spoke about me so much that I should be able to get paid for that on my own. JC co-signed me. Now, does it look crazy when he un-co-signed you? I don't know. That shit, it creates a problem. But he co-signed me. What do you mean? Meaning, he couldn't use my name. He had to use my name in reasonable doubt to make him relevant. You say people names on your record to let them people know that you affiliated with these people. which are big names, right? So you use my name. The Haven introduced me to the game. Why? Because the Haven was that nigga.

1:54:37He knew the game. You know what I'm saying? So when he say stuff like that, he co-signing that I am that nigga. I am qualified. And I have to use that in my story to be able to compensate. They talked about our lives all through the music, on what we've done in the street. All that rap stuff came from the street, came from what they saw, what we was doing. You know what I'm saying? So now, it's just the same thing, man. It's just showing you what I'm doing. What about when he says, fuck the heaven? Who was that? American Gangsta. Why did they do that? Let me tell you, when you're so emotional, you can't think.

1:55:26I want to say about two years after he said that shit, I'm only thinking about, damn, you could have sued. Nah, no bullshit. I'm talking about on a high-ass level. Because of your ego and your street code, we don't go to fucking lawyers and do this, and that's for Hollywood. But in reality, that was the biggest paycheck I missed in the world. You know what I'm saying? I miss that shit like yo wait a minute do you know what I could have been in court I got how much money I could have got that came out through Def Jam music this that that's a lot of money I could have got and that shit went platinum or something like that they would have had to pull that would have been a huge lawsuit but I wasn't thinking I wasn't wasn't thinking that way by the time I asked about a lawyer I could matter of fact I couldn't even...

1:56:22When I asked about a lawyer was... Oh, it's out of... What's this? Uh, when it's take too long? When you take too long, it's out of, uh... You could... Statue of Limitations. And I'm saying, how could it be Statue of Limitations if they still play the music? I don't understand that. But hey, you know, every lawyer told me no. So what difference does it make? So I have to use that fuck the haven for caving. It was a gift and a curse. You know what I'm saying? The curse was, damn, my boy called me a snitch, and his partner is a fucking... Like, what kind of boomerang shit is this going on right here?

1:57:04But these people could be so high in places that people don't really think rational. They say, oh, shit, he's a snitch, he's a snitch. Man, come on now. In this day and time, y 'all won't even question this man and ask him, Yo, you said this, man. Is this true? Because we can't find it. Who'd he tell on? What did you mean by that? Because you could've got him hurt. You could've got me killed in the streets. Maybe that was his plot. You get what I'm saying? But I can understand his anger because I says things about your mom, too. Like, you know, fuck your mom, this and that. So I can understand his anger.

1:57:46You see how I gotta think of a different perspective to give him a green light, you know what? He could be that mad that he said, no, man, this motherfucker said, what, my mom? Okay, cool, fuck him. And then it's just all ugly. Yeah, but like you say, if you're saying fuck his mom, then he wouldn't be caring if you got killed. So the worst thing you can do to a man's reputation is call him a snitch or a pedophile. Yo, exactly, you know what I'm saying? But I had to live with that. But it ain't work because so many people knew me. you know what I'm saying and you have to prove it that's where we come from too this is what made me more disappointed and angry because I come from a place and I come from an airway if you call somebody that you have to prove that shit or it's gonna be trouble ain't nobody gonna respect you at all if you call somebody that and you just fucking playing, they're not gonna ever respect you.

1:58:50So he called me that, and I've not seen that interview, near interview of him saying, anybody asking.

1:59:01But you sit here and ask me every fucking detail about him, but if, you know, I've been on podcasts that you, we can sit and have this conversation, but Jay sit here, you won't ask him nothing about me? Yo, yo, like, this happens This happens And I'm sitting here scratching my head like What happened? They would have been told not to mention you This is what I'm saying One million percent Do not mention him or I won't be on That's the bottom line Because if I was interviewing him I would need to ask him about their story Because he needs to speak from his side You could be talking shit he might say that or he could verify it that you're telling the truth but that's the purpose and everybody should have a fair platform to tell things from their side he might have a different perception of you an outlook of why the relationship broke down he might have thought you tried to get him killed you don't you just don't know but for people not to ask him those questions tells me that he's told them not to mention you yeah yeah because it brings relevancy to you gotta have the facts, the facts show it all but you must look now look at the P Diddy stuff P Diddy and Jay Z were tight look when P Diddy get through under the bush there's not one social media post there's no one ever backed P Diddy and P Diddy, no matter what they say, he helped bring people up the ladder also and his charges there, alright he's doing his prison time, I've interviewed people that says he used to fuck with people's ex-girlfriends and stuff, I don't like that, Tupac, 50 Cent but, you just got There's no response or no backing for a friend.

2:00:43No support at all. Does that make you feel better in a kind of way? No. When I see that, nah, because I know what they like. Yeah. But does that not verify what you're saying is the truth, though? To go, I told you what this guy's like? Yeah, but they don't care if they ain't doing it to them. I sat there and watched as... If you sat there and watched how Jay treated me, right? take case in point Dame that's why I laugh at Dame Das all the time right number one he can never fucking tell me that I ain't never I didn't help build Rockefeller records you understand that's outside of me and Jay relationship that Dame came to me and said yo look I need your help you know what I'm saying I need to generate some extra cash to fucking fund Rockefeller you know what I'm saying So that's me and Dame relationship outside of Jay.

2:01:42And this is why I don't respect him neither, because he never once has said, hey, yo, you need any help, bro? I know you're going through a federal situation. You need any help? And all that bullshit and gangsta shit you talk, he ain't never asked me that I need help. He knew how vital I was to him putting that shit together. He knew how vital I was when he was getting his ass whooped in the club and who he run out to go get. Thank you. So when I say, they ain't no way around when you need them to support. I just said, that's why Kanye was so hurt, because that's why Benny Seger was so hurt, locked up.

2:02:20Nowhere to be to support nobody. They don't come around. It's like their image. And that's scary. On what a man will do to protect his own. What about 50 Cent? Was he ever on the scene? I don't know 50. He's Queens. I never had any run-ins. I admired him in the beginning. Very get-rich-dying-trying era. That shit was my guy. That was the underdog guy that knew how to fucking do this shit right. That knew that guy hated on. I watched them hate on 50. Did not want him to come out. where 50, yeah, this is like the same way now. You know what I'm saying? 50 had to go to the West Coast to get the bag because New York wasn't going to allow him.

2:03:17All that black ball shit was going on. So yeah, I was rooting for 50 when he came back from West Coast with the money and was able to buy New York. New York is up for sale. You can buy that shit here. Just like now, I'm doing UK. You know why? Because it's hard as hell in America with all the hate and all the other shit going on. The black ball, it's difficult. It's different. It's always you got to go somewhere else to get on first, and then you got to come back and then show your ass off. What about when Nas released IFA, the diss track? What were you thinking? That's good for the culture. that was good for the culture.

2:04:05But they should have kept it for the culture. It shouldn't have gotten so personal. You feel what I'm saying? And this is where I feel like God protected me. Because it's so much that happened in that game, there's no way I would have tolerated them trying to handle Jay in any kind of way. You feel what I'm saying? Those beef situations, I know it would have been ugly. You know what I'm saying? Dame Dash having... I just told you my crew, my Ryan Manning, them was all gangsters. They all street-certified gangsters that I fuck with. Outside of Jay and me, brother, this is who I fuck with. There was no way that you was gonna have us around that industry...

2:04:49with a bunch of pussies. It wasn't gonna work. Wolf and lambs and sheep together, it ain't gonna work. But that could have been a problem then if you... It would have. It definitely would have been a problem. I know it would have. It's bad for business. Bad for business. But you needed it. Because they ain't have no go-to when it was time. When shit get heat, when the beef came, they ain't had nobody to go to. That's why Philly played their part. Because them niggas was ready. Benny Siegel and them was ready to brawl. See, when you released the video exposing Jay-Z, Why did you wait so long and why did you do it?

2:05:30Because people said he was angry. The very first one? Yeah. Oh man, I fucking pressure bust pipes. I was doing so fucking bad in my life, yo. And I can only blame them. I can only blame them. And that was the only way that you could fucking reach. That was the best way. The internet was the best way for us to level with Phil. You know what I'm saying? To get on the internet and release, you know what I'm saying? I said, that Jay-Z exposed, that shit took off. And I did it out of so much anger that I missed the money. I wasn't even focusing on the money. I was so angry and wanted them to talk to me and talk about this relationship and mend this shit that I was so angry that I wasn't focusing on the money that I can get from YouTube.

2:06:27You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that was a whole lot of emotions and shit stirred up, man. It was like every fucking day, I think it's because of them. I can't get a job, it was because of Jay-Z. I can't get no pussies because of them. This, that, and the third. I just was fucking anti-Jay-Z. I couldn't get it past that shit. So that YouTube was just a release. And then when I saw all that came with it, and I wasn't prepared for that shit, I was glad to get that word out, but I wasn't prepared. You know what I'm saying? That's just anger, but I came from a different place. And I got so much hate when I did that.

2:07:06I got so much hate. Everything was hate. And then over the course of the years, man, that fucking shit just went like this. Because the industry started getting more and more corrupt, more and more corrupt. People got to see more and more and more and more and more. Now, look at my following. I got a huge following that I'm cool with, and it's gonna continue to grow. What about the stabbing? 1999 Lance Ramirez or something? I wasn't around, yeah. Oh, I wasn't around for that. I wasn't around. I'm telling you, like... I used to think it was Dame that fucking was in J.E.A. like, yo, you can't have to have it around, man.

2:07:49and it's just, you know, they carry negativity. But I wasn't around for that. How much did Drocka fail at End But Worth? Did they not, they fell out, Jay-Z and Dane? Do they have money as well? Did they not get sued? They fell out because... They may respect Jay.

2:08:13They may respect Jay. Even though they were partners? Even though they was partners. you know, fall has never looked or tasted this good. Sweet greens fall harvest menu is back with seasonal favorites dressed to impress and made to be devoured. Warm roasted sweet potatoes, crisp apples, maple glazed Brussels and crave worthy flavors in the autumn harvest bowl, maple glazed salmon plate and roasted bacon Brussels side. The season's most desirable menu has returned to sweet green featuring fall's best dressed. Make your move. Order on the Sweetgreen app. Star Wars The Mandalorian and Grogu is now streaming on Disney+.

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2:09:47season streaming September 9th only on Peacock. This show gives me a reason to laugh.

2:09:58If I was next to Jay all the time, if Jay would have kept me around and Dame knew how much I was an enforcer, Dame wouldn't have got away with a lot of shit the way he tried to handle Jay. It would have never been no Jay come back from vacation and Cameron's the fucking CEO of Rockefeller shit. It wouldn't have been the fucking word. None of that shit would have been going on. I would have never been able to let anybody handle Jay. So with me not there, Dane could poke his chest out knowing that, man, Jay ain't, I know who Jay is. He ain't really that. You know what I'm saying? The hemen was, but he ain't here.

2:10:44So the type of shit he to do with Jay and be disrespectful and all of that shit, Jay just got tired of it. And fuck that, you know what I'm saying? You think you're gonna handle me type of shit, like any other fucking business. Because if you look at state, if you look at fucking Dipset and look at Rockefeller, you tell me who's still fucking standing. How's life new? Wonderful. Wonderful. You know what I mean? bestseller book I'm working on get ready to release that I got my own non-profit I teach OSHA you know the safety and construction I try to get the team get these youths to understand how vital it is to have a trade become an electrician become a carpenter become this you know it's other ways it's so many ways of hustling you know what I'm saying I speak about like Like, we living in a generation now, I have never seen so many young millionaires.

2:11:48You keep saying, like, this is it, bro. Like, nothing can stop you. So I try to motivate, I do a lot of motivation speakers and shit, and try to motivate them to tell them how creative they can be, how talented they can be, that you can make money, but you still have to have an education, you know. And I fly around doing that all the time, talking about my story. And that's it, man. I mean, what could I ask for? People would still be like, yo, well, you still telling that story 25 years? Because, oh, it didn't even reach its peak yet. Until you sitting in your living room going, yo, this shit is hard, man.

2:12:28This is way better than all of that shit you watching now. This is real deal. You know what I'm saying? So, life is good. I pray for those guys, man, that they still successful, that, you know, Whatever it may be, it may be. I know what's meant for me. I know what's meant for them. Like, life is good, man. I mean, I'm glad. You know what I mean? This is a story about how you can come back from that betrayal. You know what I mean? When someone fucking hurts you on that level. Do you think you can ever resolve it? Do you think you can ever have that conversation to get the closure? Or do you think it's just went so far now that there's just no one stopping?

2:13:11Everybody's just firing shots from time and time, whether it's in songs, whether it's in podcasts. Do you think you'll ever get to have that conversation? Nah. Nah. I think, um, they still, I think the Carter family still feel some type of way. It's a jealousy. I can't put my fucking finger on it, right? but I can't understand why I still can't understand why I went this way I feel like the Carter family is something

2:13:50I don't know it's almost like

2:13:56example every year his mom come and do a book bag back to school drive every year right which is a fucking block away from my mom right so two years ago I finally said you know I'm gonna run down there and see come face to face with Gloria his mom and when I go over there and stand there she looked me in my eyes she hugs me and she says I forgive you and I was like okay and then she just slowly deters me off to Eric, which is her son, the older brother. And then I go over to Eric and have a brief conversation with Eric, and then I walk off. And the only thing in my mind is hearing her say, yo, I forgive you.

2:14:49I forgive you. And I'm like, forgive me for what? What the fuck do you forgive me for when my mom is a block of fucking way? She didn't ask, hey, how your mother? she ain't knock on the door and say hello

2:15:12you forgive me nah I forgive y 'all cause there's some pain there over there there's something over there that I don't know but I forgive y 'all and I pray for y 'all

2:15:28you know what I'm saying I just thought that that's the deepest shit I've ever seen so when I think about if this is ever going to be resolved I doubt it. I think some people could be so fucking rich that they just blind to fucking human dignity. You feel me? I have several family members pass away where I know they took care of Jay where it's no show. But to see him at another funeral of somebody else's boohoo and you're like, what the fuck could this be about? How much money you need to say, I fucked that. I forget about everybody.

2:16:08That you could just... I don't think they sleep good at night. I don't give a fuck how fat Beyoncé ass is. I don't give a fuck about how pretty, you know, but I don't think that he actually sleeps good at night. Is there a lot more darkness around Jay-Z than what people know? Yeah, because that's not who I know. I don't know that guy right there, yo. Do you think that's the money, the fame, the attention? do you think there's a lot more deeper because it does change people money you would have seen it moving through the ranks with people it doesn't matter how much it is a thousand dollars ten thousand hundred never mind having hundreds of millions that's a whole different level that's a whole different club and that's a whole lot different faces around that table so it does it changes people at different levels but you cannot forget where you've came from and understand as well that when you do, you do outgrow people also.

2:17:00If you're still active and hanging around with real gangsters, that is a liability. So I understand that aspect of it also. But it does change people in a big way. And you have to understand, people change. Yeah. Them people ain't the same people as them active gangsters. These dudes now granddads. You know what I'm saying? So it's over. If I put the streets behind me already and I said, yo listen I forgive you because that shit we was all set up. You can't see that's not clarity. Whatever happened in this game in the street, this that and the third, whatever you misunderstood about what this guy did, all of that shit, leave it.

2:17:43What's more happy than having your guys around you? Or are you, or you can't be, you can't be who you are because the real people there? You're intimidated by the people that know you, the people that can say, man, you, uh, and fucking call a clown you. You too rich that you can't be clowned.

2:18:08That shit is weird to me. What happened to the 100 kilo that went missing? Oh, 92 bricks? Yeah. Whose was that? oh man I don't know whose it was it wasn't 92 but you know that sounded good in the bar I don't know whose it was it was a large amount but I don't know whose it was but I know someone that paid for that I know someone that took the lick for that right you know and to see that that person's fucked up you know what I'm saying and he ain't in the right space. You know what I'm saying? It's just one more casualty that I've seen. I've seen so many people sacrifice their lives and do so much shit.

2:19:00And they're really like, look at them now and be like, damn, he did nothing for them. What's your biggest regret?

2:19:15The biggest regret is probably not speaking up when I should have said things. I should have spoken up for certain people. What's the best advice you've ever had? Stay loyal in this game. Like, man, that was the best advice because I'm here. I beat the odds. I got away with a whole lot more than what I should have done time for. I realize that I'm here for a purpose. God has a purpose for me to be here. And I'm living in my purpose, giving, providing, making sure the kingdom, you know, trying to look out for the kingdom.

2:20:08So, that's it. Where do you go forward for the future, brother? What's your plans? I know you've got the book there. I know you're doing your thing, but where do you see yourself? The next Spike Lee. The next John Singleton. The next Hughes Brothers. I want some directed movie shit. On my life. I want to fill my life. For anybody watching that's maybe stuck in a life of struggle, life of anger, frustration, what advice would you have for them? Pray. Ask God, for real. Just pray. You don't know how to pray. just fucking say, yo, you know, God, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know. Just give me a direction.

2:20:54Ask for a direction. Pray and stand on it. Have faith. You know, he don't show up tomorrow when you want to change your life around. It don't fucking work that way. You have to prove it to him. And once you start that, man, the blessings, I kid you not, man. when I say I tell you, everything I asked for and prayed for, I got. You know what I'm saying? I played for clarity, I mean, clarity, and I'm clear. I'm humble, I'm clear. You know, I get emotional, but I'm not, I don't hate no one. I'm a good guy, man. Like I said, I'm your best friend. Yeah, I can see that, though. I can see your loyalty.

2:21:43I can see your still fucking mad bastard as well behind all that but yeah life is it's a mad thing brother you know it's full of ups and downs but you've clearly worked through the ranks everything's patterns whether it's serving fucking coke weed socks chocolate bars the patterns are there no one stops you but you no matter what's happened in the past we can point blame we can have all that anger but where your focus where your focus goes your energy flows it's to focus on the present moment focus on the future focus on being top of whatever you want to achieve, you know? And I just think sometimes we can get completely lost and sidetracked.

2:22:18We are constantly thinking about something else negatively can burn you out. And before you know it, you've wasted 10, 20, 30 years. That's the whole point. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that's the whole point. And I talk about it in my book. I fucking went homeless, my guy. Homeless thinking about that shit. So, yeah. You know what I mean? Don't waste time. Is Jay still friends with people who he grew up with? Just the guys that's around him right now, Emory and Tata. So they're still with him? Still with him. But it shows you then that he has still got some loyalty then, if he's still with the friends he grew with.

2:22:59Emory did time. That's my co-defendant. He was old that, without having to be with Jay. He was old that. you know what I'm saying Ty Ty was just in the right place right time you know what I'm saying so you know my thing is you think by Emory being my co-defendant that he could have been like yo Jay you can't say that that's my co-defendant he's on my fucking case the fuck you call him a rat wouldn't that put him in an awkward position you know what I'm saying so now you started defending like damn dude what the conversation could have been like when Emery came home and realized that Jay is fucking the CEO is his partner is a former FBI informant what was Emery thinking did the conversation go like look man fuck that man you ain't got to worry about nothing you know what I'm saying don't worry about what them people think because of this and that.

2:24:08And we're going to be so rich, we're not going to be breathing the same air as them. So don't worry about them fucking people back home talking that shit. You know what I'm saying? That's what the conversation could have been like. Man, this is what it couldn't be like to me. He couldn't have been able to tell me though, come on, man. And I'm like, who's that? Who's her? You know what she did? It wouldn't have worked out. You know what I'm saying? No fucking Roc Nation! Really! Like, you know what I'm saying? Because that's who I am. Maybe that's why. You know what I'm saying? And Emory more cool with it.

2:24:49You know what I'm saying? Like, fuck it, I don't have to work another day in my life. I don't give a fuck. But I'm thinking about, damn, well, why me and Emory ain't had a conversation? Did you have the nickname, The Headache? Yeah. Where does that come from? This. Telling the fucking truth, always whining. Yeah, a fucking... I always gotta debate for someone, you know? I mean, it's always that, man, you're a fucking headache, yo. You know what I'm saying? That's always, I'm gonna argue all the time. If you fucking not right, I'm gonna fucking say something about it. You know what I'm saying? And they're like, come on, you're giving me a headache.

2:25:23I'm like, yo, what the fuck? You're mad at your girl, man, you fucking... But you cheat. They be like, I don't wanna hear that shit! You know what I'm saying? So yeah, that's where headache came from. How are you feeling today, brother? Man, I'm feeling really great, man. Great about this interview, great about, you know, I'm in a comfort zone with you, man, and the honor to be introduced to the UK, man, with my story. And I know it's people over there that can relate. You know what I'm saying? I don't have been seen on TV. They got just as bad hoods as we got, drugs and shit. So, you know what I mean?

2:26:00I don't know if they're snitching and shit. I never really got into the crime over there. do they tell as much as Americans? Is there a federal, is the feds over there just like the feds over here? It's all sort of similar. There's a lot of snitches, a lot of backstabbing, but there's a lot of beauty in the UK as well. There's still a lot of good people. I think there's more opportunities though in America. I think people are more honest in their stories. I don't think the UK, no one really is 100 % honest. But it's still a beautiful place, some great people. People really enjoy their story. but you can tell you're a good guy listen you've lived a life as well you're not sitting here making shit up you are verified out there which is important you've been in his songs which is important it's just sad to see such a strong brotherhood collapse for many different reasons there's more than one side from what you were saying there's going to be other sides I don't have them all but I can only judge people from what they are and who they are and I think you're a decent guy I thoroughly enjoyed your story I think you're going to just be bigger and better again I think big changes are coming for your book Where can people buy it when it comes out as well?

2:27:04All right, so... The name of the website is In My Lifetime. The book will go on pre-sale next month. It's dropping in spring of June, like May, June. Other than that, man, after that, I pretty much want to focus on the script, doing a book tour, you know, riling up my revenue to be able to pay for my own film, independent film and uh you know just want to be a great director director in my life story but anything you've put your mind to you have achieved as well you may have wasted a few years people might think by being angry and bitter but you would have learned more from that than anything yeah everything's a stepping stone and you're clearly a guy who likes to navigate through pain life is chaos is how we get through that and how we overcome that but for people watching who's maybe want to reach out maybe ask you questions what's your social media link social media IG is called the Marcy Made.

2:28:03The Marcy Made series, all one word. My YouTube, Marcy Made series. And I'm always on there, always engaging, always doing live. I'm about to start my own podcast. So yeah, you can follow me there. Marcy Made. I got a documentary out. You can go on my page, actually, and look at the documentary. It's called Marcy Made. That done wonderful. If you ain't see that, that's pretty much what we talked about but I have my mom interviewed the actual people so check that out and let me know what you think what about your YouTube channel my YouTube channel is Marcy Made everything everything Marcy Made Marcy Made Series and that's it man I look forward to being in the UK on a book tour that'd be dope yeah definitely brother for anybody watching jump over give them a follow my brother would you like to finish up on anything else oh man Man, much love to you, man.

2:29:03And your podcast. You dope, man. I'm real comfortable, man. I'm glad you said you to bring my A-game because you definitely bought yours. Yeah, thank you. And it was an honor, yo, for real. Likewise. And I wish you nothing but the best for the future, brother. Keep doing what you're doing and God bless. All right, that's what's up, man. We out.

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