Chace Crawford

21:39Do you remember what kind of car it was? My saving grace was like, I hop back in. I'm like, yes, it's a rental car. Oh. What a blessing. It was a blessing because, you know, all these things have their own insurance or whatever. So I went right away, told the main real guy that ran the restaurant. Told him to put his joint down for a second. I guess I'm going to harsh your high right now. Like, you idiot, go home. We'll deal with this later. But you're lucky it's a rental car. Do you remember, were you stoked when rad cars pulled up? Did you care? Yeah, I remember being very nervous when it was like a Ferrari.

22:09And John's like, get that one, you know? And it was like a paddle shifter. I had no idea. I was like, I don't know how to do it. I kind of learned, but it was bad. That's not the place to practice. It wasn't easy on the car. It wasn't a place to practice. But I remember like Orlando Bloom coming in and like tipping me money. And I was like, good tip. and Kate Bosworth. I'm like, oh, this is awesome. The stars are here. Yes. What an exciting LA job. It was, it was. What other celebrities you see? That's great. Oh, God, who else? I remember, and I think I've told him this when I saw him. I'm like, dude, you know, you gave me a nice tip one time.

22:40Thank you. But I remember like Suge Knight coming through, which was weird because he had like punched the valet. So everyone was scared of him. Yeah, yeah. Random people. It was like Tommy Lee and Malibu locals out there. Who's the old, oh, hell, Chewie. What was that actor from 48 Hours? Nick Nolte. Nick Nolte. Did you ever see Nick Nolte? I did see Nick Nolte. Yes, he's a staple in Malibu. Yeah, he is. Did you ever see Robert Downey Jr.? Never saw Downey Jr. Fuck, okay. No, no, no. Keep him coming. I was pumped though when we see him. Johnny Carson, no. He was on Malibu. He was? Oh, yeah, yeah.

23:12Are you religious? Because Pepperdine's religious. Right. You went to a Catholic school. It was Baptist. But yeah, so my mom's dad was a pastor, a Nazarene pastor, I want to say. and lived in Texas, grew up religious. Okay, yeah. Didn't quite realize how strict Pepperdine was, actually. It's very, isn't it? I don't want to butcher. I think it's Church of Christ, which is very like no instruments in worship. Yeah, exactly. No fun. No fun. That's where Jedediah went, right? To law school? Yeah, he did. If you had a girl in your room or vice versa, past like 11 or 11.30 p.m., something really kind of weird, they give you like a demerit.

23:49There's like three demerits, whatever. I don't know what happens. But the mag light would come through and I'd be caught. Not in a copper light. It was like, you're literally just talking. Yeah. In college. In college. Like, this isn't high school. So I do remember that. I quickly realized there was like small little fraternities that were just basically friend groups to actually be able to have fun off campus. I didn't know it was that direct. Yeah. I didn't either until I showed up. Okay. Was it great money to, I'm sorry, we're going to move off of L.A. soon, but I'm so envious of this role.

24:16In fact, that's another job I could do in retirement. You should. Other than 7-Eleven. You should do that. That's better than 7-Eleven. It was. I remember feeling so lucky to have the job because a buddy in college, a good friend was older and he had the job, but he couldn't do it. So he kind of like, hey, I'm giving this to you. It's tough slot. Everyone wants this thing. Yeah. It was great. He knew I couldn't really drive stick, but he vouched for me. And it was like, I was in this little cool fraternity and it was summer time there. And you'd have like a family meal, free meal, like cash. Can I guess what you were making a shift?

24:46Yeah. I'm going to go with 350. $350. But then tips. I wish I knew. What were the tips? Oh,$350. I thought you meant$3. I wish I could remember. I guarantee you it was somewhere around that. But on a big night, I remember going home with some good tips. It was like a dopamine hit. It was like a slot machine mentality. I get like, what's going to happen next? And it was like a lot of fun. And this was 2004 or five? Summer of 04. So it's cash baby too. You're walking with hard cash. Yeah. I know. It was great. I was living in Malibu with four other dudes in this house. Kind of a decrepit, like, 70s house.

25:20It had never been updated. But, like, we had this cool little spot. They were, like, surfers, and it was a lot of fun. This could be a reality show. The good old day. I know. Now I'm, like, 40. I'm, like, was it going to get any better than that? No. No. No. I'm so jealous of this whole spell of yours. Okay, so how do we get from there to 2006, The Covenant? I got into an acting class. Oh, a Meisner class. Meisner class. Exactly. I forget the name of it, but it was a more serious class. A friend was doing acting. I had done some acting in high school and I was always sort of artistically inclined.

25:52I did photography. I loved it. I painted, I drew. And so my parents kind of like, why don't you just get out of your shell, take an acting class? And I randomly got this very serious Meisner. I knew nothing about it. I just loved it. I loved watching it. It was so abstract about coming to the door and the exit. And I like was like, what is this? You didn't feel panicked? Like I'm out of my depth. I wasn't trying to be an actor. I was so naive. There was no pressure. It was just fun. And these kids were in there really trying. And I was like, okay, I'm going to try and be this good actor within class.

26:21I was never thinking about really becoming an actor. And did you get an agent from that class? I did. I just kept kind of networking. A friend was like an actress to a manager was like, hey, I know this very low boutique, small agency. It was probably more like a management company as today. Just a few people. And I went with them. This is where people pleasing, like people pleasing gets a bad rap. But this is where it's great, right? Because I wasn't a people pleaser. And consequently, no one wanted to help me because I didn't avail myself at all. Right. I was trying to act like I knew everything and don't help me.

26:53And I got it figured out. And of course, no one tried to help me because it didn't seem like I was open to that. I didn't have a fucking agent for like six years and I wanted one. I didn't get a job at a valet. I can see the value. You're nice and there's a great word for it. I mean, no. Well, I was a bit of a chameleon as well to try and survive as a kid. You know, you learn it was kind of a survival thing to make new friends, all the different cities. It wasn't like I was completely changing. I had an ability to kind of connect with people from all walks of life. Yeah. And I think it's a great thing.

27:23And then so people are like, yeah, I'll vouch for you. That's what's tricky about when people are like, I'm going to stop being this way. And it's like, well, also acknowledge none of it's good or bad. This characteristics also got me to here. And so what part do I keep and what part do I get rid of? It's hard to know. Completely. Yeah. And you don't really know that as a kid, even in your 20s, if you haven't really examined it. So when you end up in the Covenant, you're now like, I want to be an actor, clearly. Yeah. So I went with this agent. She was great. She did guys. And it was back when pilot season was a real thing, like happening every fall.

27:53And she was like, I'm going to send you out for some auditions just randomly. And I was getting good feedback. I was very green, but they're like, oh, he's talented. I need to work on this. And I was doing auditions and I was having fun with it. I was like part time in school. I was fouling cars, living in this house. And then The Covenant came along eventually in 2005. You know, it was a real budget Sony Screen Gems movie, you know, at the time. Yeah, it's wild. So Taylor Kitsch was in it. Yeah, Taylor Kitsch, Sebastian Stan. Wow. A guy named Toby Hemingway, a British guy we're still friends with.

28:23And Stephen Strait was like one of the guys too. Did you and Taylor get on? We did. Me, Taylor and Sebastian and Toby. They were my first real friends. Yeah, like Taylor would like sleep on my couch back then when he'd come to LA. And he was kind of new. Okay, so I only know the lore of him because I'm an enormous Friday Night Lights fan. Me too. I've never met him, and we'll get to that. But the lore is he was a trainer, right? So at that time, was he a trainer? Was he already fucking jacked and looking gorgeous? Or were you not intrigued to go and jacked and looking gorgeous? Yeah. That's fine because I specifically remember going and meeting them for the first time in Montreal at the hotel.

29:01And we were going to eat dinner. We all got spaghetti or lasagna and all this stuff. And he kind of was like looking at us. And he got some chicken and vegetables. And kind of cut to it. He's like absolutely shredded. And like he was a nutritionist. He went to school for two years. He's like, you guys are killing yourselves. He basically, well, he basically like in hindsight, it was funny. He introduced us to all this stuff of working out and eating right. It kind of gave us a trainer. So that was like the start of falling in love with working out with the guys. Like it was fun. And looking back, we were like just shoveling bread and pasta.

29:30And we had a reason to get in shape. It was a fun boot camp type thing. And everyone's going to be shirtless. You got to show up. It was hilarious. Warlocks. So do you love men's bodies too, like that? He's obsessed with men's bodies. Yeah, you have a good routine, right? You go to the gym and you do the full thing. Yeah, but also I'm just obsessed with other men's bodies. Yeah, more than my own body. I'm much more obsessed with other men. If I were a good painter, I could paint right now perfectly Taylor Kitsch's body. Like I know it. Like I know Brad Pitt's in Fight Club. He showed up. We were like, oh my God.

30:02He did nutrition. He was doing modeling. but he was like really working and he didn't have a place in LA, but he was full on shredded and eating right and the whole nine. It's funny because I've kind of forgot that was him because the last thing I saw him and I think was the Waco thing. Yeah. Where he's like, well, he's not ripped in that at all. I don't think. Skinny for that thing. So skinny. So that's kind of my new version. Well, you need to rewatch FNL. We just rewatched it because of our daughters were finally old enough. And I was like, oh, right. It is the best show ever. Incredible. And the story there was we shot the thing.

30:32We come back. He stays at my couch for like a month and he's like, I'm going to screen test for this show. And I had been auditioning for it. I got a test deal to read for the quarterback for Jason Street. Yeah. I was so excited because I knew he was basically going to be Riggins. He had to think, jump through one more hoop. And I was like, oh, the idea of we just become friends. Like he was like my only friend. Yeah, yeah. Let's move to Austin and be Texas football. That's where I'm from. I didn't get it. I remember being bummed for like a month. Yeah, that's a heartbreaker. That was a heartbreaker.

31:05I remember that was my first reel. Like, that's a role I wanted. And you'd only had good luck thus far. No, you probably misled a little bit. Oh, yeah, when I go in, I get these things. And then I make friends. And then we all work together. We have adventures. That was like the most rare situation to become friends with those guys. And we're still all friends. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert. If you dare. We are supported by Allstate. checking Allstate first could save you hundreds on car insurance. That's smart. Not checking which platform you watch that new show on. So frustrating. 15 minutes later, you've logged into seven apps, reset two passwords, and still haven't found it.

31:45Yeah, checking first is smart. So check Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate. Potential savings vary. Subject to terms, conditions, and availability. Allstate North American Insurance Co. and affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois. Thank you to our presenting sponsor, Grubhub. Gold Days is here, which feels like a dangerous time to be ordering food because suddenly everyone in your life is very interested in what you're eating. Grubhub Plus members are getting nonstop savings all month long. And if you're not a member yet, you can join for just 99 cents a month for six months.

32:21That's a 90 % discount off of the usual price. Grubhub Plus membership auto renews and terms apply. Sign up now in the app or at grubhub.com slash plus slash gold. This episode is brought to you by Walden University. So here's something I've been thinking about. There are people out there who want to make real change, not just talk about it, but actually do it. Maybe it's advancing in their career. Maybe it's making a difference in their community. And they're working full time, juggling life, wondering if going back to school is even possible. That's where Walden University comes in. And for over 50 years, they've been helping working professionals get the W, the knowledge, the skills, the confidence to build the future they actually want.

33:02Here's what makes it work. Walden's tempo learning means you're in control. No rigid weekly deadlines, no set schedules. You move through your degree at your own pace on your terms, and you're learning from faculty who've actually been there. Scholars and practitioners with real-world experience, 94 % of whom hold doctoral degrees. If you've been waiting for the right moment, this is it. Head to waldenu.edu and take that first step. Walden University, set a course for change. Certified to operate by Chev.

33:39Now, were you able to watch the show and enjoy it or did it fuck you up? Did you have to boycott it because you didn't get it? I've boycotted things I didn't get. I remember him being back in L.A. maybe this summer he had it on DVD. We don't even have those anymore. He had it. He's like, do you want to watch it? I was like, yeah, I do. I do. And watching the pilot, it wasn't jealousy. It was FOMO. It was like, I wish. It wasn't like I wish death upon everyone. It was like, oh, I wish I was a part of that. That's amazing. The wheelchair element, though, that's hard. You might have dodged a ball.

34:08We didn't know. They didn't tell anyone that that was going to be the role. So that was interesting. So you may have dodged a ball. Did you have any interesting interaction with Pete Berg? Because I had one meeting with Pete Berg for people who know me as an actor forever, and then he became a great director and he directed the movie and then the pilot of that show. And I had a general with him one time and he was like five minutes late and they let me sit in his office before he got in there. And then he walked in and he had tissue crammed in his nose that was just caked with blood. Nose bleed.

34:31And he goes, oh, sorry, man, I'm late. I was sparring with so-and-so. I'm like, this dude's such a raw dog, man. He's fucking like, he's broke his nose and now he's in this meeting and he was just fighting a man seconds before this meeting. He's a wild dude. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've been to dinner with him with mutual friends since. It's like, he's a great guy. I remember him being in the room and directing the screen test and throwing me curveballs a bit. I was like freaking out. I don't know how to be off the script. Yeah. But that was, in hindsight, that was cool. Like, I would appreciate that more now, like the improv nature of that.

35:01He's okay. You're in an interview. Throw me questions. You know, how would you answer this as the quarterback, which really threw me, which is probably why I didn't get it. But now I would welcome that. Okay. And then Gossip Girl comes pretty quickly after that, right? So the heartbreak doesn't last terribly long. What do you think the duration is between screen testing for Friday Night Lights? Exactly a year. It was the next pilot season. Did you do anything in between there? Covenant came out. I did. It wasn't Lifetime. It was a movie. It was a movie that we shot in Turks and Caicos, which was a lot of fun, but a very small budget.

35:30But my mom loves the movie. I'm blanking on the name of it. Thank God. Don't go watch it. But I remember feeling like that was cool. You're not blanking on the name at all. You know exactly the name of it. No, you should say the wrong name of the movie. So we go watch like the other movie. No, it's not a good shape. They changed the name of it. It's called like the Sixth Sense of the Man. Yeah, exactly. It's something ridiculous. I came back and I got with ICM, the new agency, because the Covenant came out. You got a little heat. It was like, ooh, I'm doing the thing. And then I remember going into their office to see the pilots and it was these hard scripts and it said Gossip Girl.

35:59I'm like, that's like the stupidest name ever for a show. You know? They're going to change that name. I'm going to change it. Sounds a little emasculating. I'm going to be on a show called Gossip Girl. It sounds so weird. I didn't realize it was a book franchise and they had people that were fans of it. I'm offended you hadn't been reading the Gossip Girl YA book series. You know what I'm shocked? Yeah, of course I did. Then that was back when you would have to read for the first couple people, then producers, director, execs, and then you're in like the conference room with like the stadium seating.

36:29And for people who don't know, you also at some point in auditioning, they make you negotiate your contract. They don't let you go in and read for network without a contract because they don't want to fall in love with you. And then you have the leverage. It's a leverage thing. By today's standards, we both know is probably not a lot of money. But at 21 years old, when you negotiated that contract for that last audition and you're like, I'm going to make hundreds of thousands of dollars if we do. I mean, what was your brain doing at that moment? Oh, it was such a high. I remember thinking I'd won the lottery.

36:59Yes, you did. You're not doing all the math of the percentage that everyone takes. No, you're getting 100 % of that money. Yeah, yeah. I was thinking that number per episode times. How many? I think I'm just going to drive a Ferrari. One certainly in my future. Going back. Yeah, I'm going back to that job. Lo and behold, it's like the lowest possible thing for six years. But, you know, you sign your life away for six years, too. You're not really thinking about that. Hell no. You don't even know if it's going to be successful. So that's like a pipe dream. So one cute thing I learned today is that you and Ed Westwick.

37:30Yeah. You guys immediately start roomaining together in Chelsea. Out of the gates. How did you meet him so quick and go like, let's move in together? We shot the pilot in April or something in 07, three weeks in New York. I'm like, I love New York now. It's incredible. He was young. He was like 18. I remember looking at prices that summer. I guess we got to move there. I'm like, how much is it? I'm like, it's insane. And you just found out you're keeping 40 % of what you make. Yeah, a little more realistic. Not one check has come yet. I'm like, maybe I get a roommate. I just text him. I'm like, dude, you want to like live together?

38:05He's like, yeah, sure. Whatever, man. Like, just go find it, you know? Tell me what address to show up to. Yeah, I remember my mom went up there. We saw like three places. And I was like, I guess this one will work. Did he live in England at that time? He had never left his hometown. I don't know if he was outside London. I forget the name of it. But he was like in London area. And he was a mini Pete Doherty, you know. He was like trying to be in a band. You from Plano, him from England. You guys are in Chelsea. It was wild. Yeah, it was like Animal House. How nice or not nice was the apartment?

38:35It started out nice. And then it was like, what was funny, It was a, I forget what they call it, two-bedroom convertible. So there's an office. I had a wall, which is a sheetrock built, basically like a closet. And I was like, hey, I'll pay a little bit more a month for the first six months, take the master. You live in the closet. You live in the closet. I found the place. Oh, you proposed a flip. I actually did propose a flip. And they don't flip, you pay more. And that, of course, never happened. Yeah, yeah, never happened. Every six weeks, every hundred. Team of movers are in there. Yeah, yeah, never, never happened.

39:05And it was decidedly disgusting. but it was so much fun. You have a charmed life on the fun spectrum. Yeah. It was a lot. It was a lot though. What did that do to the dynamic of all the people on the show? Because I mean, for one, it's, you know, teen show, hot show, all eyes. So dramatic. So in real life, you're really good friends with him. I can only assume you guys are living together. Totally. Yeah. But then there's other boys on the show. Yeah. They didn't actually. I had a good relationship with all the main, like Penn and Blake and Layton and him were kind of the core cast. And we all got along.

39:41We all had a great time. I mean, but me and Ed, we would go out. We would go out, shoot pool. You know what I mean? We would go out. We would go out. And I remember they had like on one of the buildings, a rooftop, which was kind of redone. They had couches up there and a grill. And we would just bring a Bose speaker and a bunch of beer. And like, we would have parties up there. Were you banging darts ever? Oh, yeah. Yeah. He was a big smoker. Of course. All my New York friends smoked. They were like actors there. And they could smoke somewhere indoors. And I never enjoyed them. You're a good boy.

40:12You wanted to be cool. But I would hit the button, you know, get the cigarette thing. I think I'm cool. Like I really loved it. You know what I mean? You're on a rooftop banging a dart, drinking beer in New York City. On the hottest show. Yeah. How was your ego, though, at the time? It must have been through the roof, right? It's funny. It does affect you. Of course. Like how fame always affects you. Yeah. Can we talk about the moment? Because you were seeing the Black Keys in Central Park. Yeah, you got it. You and Ed. Right. And that was the first time where all of a sudden people are starting to come up to you.

40:40Yeah, that was the very first time. I'll never forget it. It's a validating feeling to kind of know that what you've been working on is being enjoyed and seen. It's the signal of success. It's impossible to not like that. You can get annoyed in certain situations. But to this day, even people that are fans of The Boys are like, I love it. It's a fun thing. It's lovely. There's uncomfortable parts, but boy, it's lovely. especially when you're young. I mean, that was like the show. It still holds up. I can't watch it. My memory of how funny the thing was versus when I watch it, I'm like, oh no, I inflated in my mind.

41:09I remember the Timberlake one was hilarious. Oh my God. It was a kind of cultural phenomenon. Yeah, it was. You guys created a word. That word now is in the zeitgeist. Yeah. After eight years of auditioning, not getting anything, it was a rocket ship. And so you, and you already hinted at it, but it can make you an asshole or it can make you a bit paranoid and it sounds like you went down the paranoid route. How is it affecting you? And I would imagine it's more tolerable when you're drunk. Right. It becomes a great companion piece to this new experience. It does. And we're not working all the time and we had the keys to the city in a sense.

41:46I remember the first iPhone coming out and being like paranoid about iPhone pictures where she couldn't even see anything. I was like one pixel. You know, I remember it was the young teenage thing where sometimes it'd be a lot of energy and that would sometimes kind of like startle me a little bit, you know? Yeah, you had rabid fans. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I became a little bit rabid. I mean, it was crazy for a minute. I remember feeling like a bit of a fraud, like an imposter. That's why alcohol helps, because when you're drunk, your ego gets to inflate, and you're like, yeah, I am the shit. But when you're sober, you're like, I don't deserve this.

42:18Exactly. But when you're hammering, you're like, you're damn right, I'm fucking awesome. It's such a high, yeah. You almost need the booze to actually enjoy the celebrity. That's so profound. It's so true. It's so true. I'm just now realizing that. You're so much more comfortable in your own skin, though. And we would go out. We had other friends in the city. Were you making also other actor friends that you were flattered by? Like, are other actors around town starting to hang with you? A little bit, yeah. Nick's players. And it was kind of like you're kind of making friends with someone. Like, yeah, the pitcher of the Mets.

42:47Pretty cool. And Sebastian, I think he came on episode four or five, Stan. And we were already friends. So it was like, yes, got another friend here. And we were all just going around. We had a great time. It was a lot of fun. but it is sort of like a weird drug that you chase. You need to kind of be validated in your life. Like what is wrong with me? It's a very heightened experience that's hard to compute. And then it's also quite addictive. And in the absence of it, you feel a big drop. Right. Yeah. If you're out in New York City and fucking 40 % of the girls at the bar like you. 40? 99? Probably 99.

43:20As one of them, I will tell you 99. Yeah, man, that's a special experience. Yeah. It was good for a while. It is a bit empty, though. You're trying to keep chasing that feeling or that high. Well, you feel it when you're not experiencing. Again, it's so high. It kind of like drives you that question. Like, why? Why am I doing this? What am I doing? What am I going to do next? I need to kind of maintain this thing that's been created. And what's my reason for doing the next project or picking the next thing? And if it's fame and you're trying to maintain that, it's a lose-lose. Yes. Did it ever get weird on set while you guys were becoming these big stars?

43:52Were you guys kind of like, do you guys know I'm a big star? on set when they would ask you to do things or you'd have to be there for so many hours. You guys like, do you know who I am? All of you, you were all becoming such big stars. You know, we were pretty lucky. I feel like everyone was in their own respects, very well adjusted. Like everyone was cool. And you're working with everyone at some point. The characters are in a thousand episodes are going to sleep together. Like you have like six months with someone and then me and Penn are doing, me and Ed are working. So you kind of, I had my own time with everyone to kind of forge a relationship.

44:23They were good relationships. I know there's this kind of stereotype of anytime you have a bunch of young people on a show, they're going to be very competitive. But I actually think the blessing of it is when you're the singular star of the show, you can really start thinking your shit doesn't sting. But if you're sharing it, you're not this big special thing. You're all getting fucking heat when you walk out. You're all experiencing it. So it's like you can't feel so unique in it. That helps. Yeah. And it kind of all happened at the same time. And then inevitably there is a little bit of what is this person getting?

44:54When you're young, I'm older. You're just more relaxed with all that stuff. It doesn't really matter when you're kind of become pretentious or, you know, you kind of become self-important. You know, you want to be important. You want to like be the guy. There is a little bit of that anxiety of like, what is he doing that I'm not? Right. I think when it gets dicey is the summer break. Exactly. It's like, who got what? Oh, they're working with that person. I better be doing that too. Yeah. It's hard not to feel that way. sitting on your ass and you're like, yo, they're doing like a studio movie.

45:24Eddie Murphy, first year of Saturday Night Live. He's on Saturday Night Live. They go away for the summer break and then he stars in 48 hours and when they return, he's in the biggest movie of the summer and they're all castmates that all started. It's like, that's a lot to deal with for everyone. Totally. How did you, or maybe you did, I didn't follow the drama of it, but did you avoid getting romantically involved with any of these people? Yeah, I did. Because I would have, that's where I would have absolutely floundered. I would have tried to date all of them. Some of them dated each other.

45:52Yeah. Okay. There's things that happen, connections that happen. I mean, you know, yeah. I never dated anyone on the show. Officially. No, no. I mean, there's a lot of like guest stars and people like in the orbit of the show that you'd meet through other friends even. And I remember that was a way to meet people. You should. Everyone dates people from work. Why would you not do that in show business? Especially when you're already kissing them. I mean, you're literally already. You've already. Yeah, but you know. Crossed the threshold. On that, it's like there's 60 people watching you at the boom mic and say, oh, you know, they want you to be shirtless again.

46:26It's like the whole other thing, you know. When you're young, it is a different thing. It is like a college experience. It's all different. Everyone's kind of single and dating or whatever. Everyone's sort of up for, you know, up for whatever. No one's married. The stakes are very low, you know. It is a funnier, more college, like, school experience for sure. You wish you had his life. I would have blown it up. Like, I'm impressed you navigated it. I would have fucked up. I would have been partying too hard. I think I was close to fucking. Okay, okay. Fuck, I missed the part that you're an Abercrombie and Finch model.

46:54Oh, yeah. Oh, God. Fuck. Oh, my God. Were you in the documentary? Oh, no. I wasn't. Thank God. I did watch that documentary, though. Yeah. What if I said, you know what would have been great is I said, did you get romantically involved with any of the cast members and you go, just Kristen Bell? Oh! Kristen had the best job. She was in this room with a mic doing a weekly, and that was amazing. We had started dating just as she was getting that offered. And she's like, this is pretty great. I'm getting like an episodic fee. And I think it's going to be about 15 minutes a week. Yeah. They redid it, right?

47:25Yeah, she got that one too. Suck off of that. Yeah. It's incredible. And it showed her voiceover skills, which took her someplace, as we could say. Right, right, right. No, completely. My last question on that period is how blessed and or resentful do you feel that you guys got to do that just before social media was a thing? That's a good question. I feel really blessed, actually. In some weird way, Gossip Girl was ahead of its time because it was about this blogger. And it kind of was looking at that social media thing in a different way. But I'm just so thankful that wasn't around when we were there.

47:58I mean, how many athletes and actors, you know, you tweet something when you're 18, 20, you do something. Oh, that's another thing I would have a ton to say. I probably would have lost everything if the video thing was real. But the other flip side of that is I wish I'd started an Instagram account when Lash and Kutcher did it at the very beginning. Like I would have a million, you know. So that's what I was going to say. The con of it not being there is there are so many people that have been on these shows that they're very zeitgeisty and all young people like them, but they're not huge ratings hit.

48:25People aren't renegotiating, making a ton of money, but they're making a killing on their social media, which is a nice little thing that you probably could also made a ton of money outside of the show. Had that been around at that time, I kind of missed a generation. Like I'm not all about putting myself out there all the time. But you've had some success in it. You and Miles Teller dancing and stuff. Those have gone viral. That was against my will. There's many videos. There's not just one. There's a golf one you're probably referencing, but you guys are shirtless and masks. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

48:58You did a lot of dancing. Everyone's bodies look great, by the way. You've done a deep dive. Yeah. That was a pandemic. That was when we all went a little crazy. Okay, so when the show ended, I had this very mixed feeling about parenthood ending, which is I also had done six years on that show. like you did six years, right? And I had these two feelings, which was like, one was, I could have done that show for the rest of my life. I loved everyone so much. It was such a lovely work environment. I had such freedom. And also if I do anything for six years, I'm kind of like, okay, I want a new experience.

49:29So what were you feeling like when it ended? With the Gossip Girl thing ending, I got super depressed and it was way out of left field because I felt like I had to move back to Los Angeles. You probably did need to for your health. Yeah, no, no, no, completely. Completely. But I kind of remember thinking, why didn't I just invest and buy a place and stay in New York? I'm glad I didn't. But I remember getting plopped back in L.A. And it's like anything else. Those people become your identity in a way. They're a family. I realized that became really important to me. It's the hair and makeup girls you talk to every day.

50:00It's the transpo guy that picks you up. It's just that rhythm and that you are somebody and you mean something in that sphere. And the schedule is tethering you. Completely. It's like it's what's allowing you to go be a fucking maniac. And enjoy it. For a four-day week. Because you click back into the routine and it's stabilizing. Yes. I got spit back out here and I remember being like depressed for six months. Listen, not like clinically. I was getting out of bed, but I was not in a good way. And I would imagine too, at least in my experience, you have all these waves of thought. You first get off the show and you're like, okay, I probably have a lot of options.

50:35So I got to choose correctly. And then a couple of months goes by and all of a sudden you're like, do I have this many options? You start recalculating what you're going to do. And it can be madness trying to figure out what you're supposed to follow up something like a parenthood or a gossip girl with. People think, you know, you're the star of this show. And the reality of it in the industry, it's a double-edged sword. You know, you're like the pretty boy who was like on a CW show. That honestly was, you know, you're in the doghouse, but there is a little bit of that. Yeah. That was the reality I was facing coming back.

51:05People think you have all these options and these offers. You have an option to do the same thing probably. The same thing. People don't really have an imagination in casting. You kind of got to prove yourself, which is all well and good. But I remember it being limited and not realizing, oh, shit, I'm not getting the looks I'm wanting. And even if I'm getting close to stuff and putting in good work, it's like, oh, it's not a good fit. So it was a bit of wanting to really, really switch it up. I don't know about you, but you also start losing confidence. I got to readjust what I think I'm going to be able to get into.

51:34It was a real lesson for the first time of like, OK, I was stripped kind of of all the confidence. And again, how you go into that room and act confident to get that job if you're feeling completely desperate for it, air of desperation. And it's those moments of being in this business industry that people don't see, but you got to navigate. And that was my first time really. And you're also pretty darn young still. Like, how old were you when the show ended? 27, 8. That's the age I was when I got on Punk'd. Let me ask you this. Did you have a chip on your shoulder about the show? Because I don't anymore.

52:01I have nothing but gratitude. But I had a few years where I couldn't stand when people would bring up Punk'd to me. Really? Yes, because it was like... It was a reality show. And they would ask me like, what's it like to act when I was promoting Without a Paddle? And I was like, I've been acting. That's the most acting. Like I convinced a real person, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was just so defensive about it being a reality show. And then were you friends with Ash? And I'm like, no, he didn't give me. I just had all these chips on my shoulder about it. I did too, for sure. I would feel defensive, I guess is the only word.

52:32But I just feel like defensive, like, don't ask me about that. You know what I mean? I'm moving on to other things. But I was always grateful of the show. It was never the people. Well, that's what I'm sad about is that I had that association with it. Even the first time I interviewed Ashton, I was kind of admitting to that. And he's like, yeah, I very much felt that. And it kind of hurt his feelings that I wanted to be so distanced from this great thing he and I did together. And now, of course, I can go like, oh, my God, no one gets to be on a cultural phenomenon. I can't believe I never had apex gratitude for it.

53:04Like, of course, I always had the gratitude that it gave me all the opportunities I ended up getting. But also just, dude, if you're on something like that one time in your life, that's going to the Super Bowl. It just doesn't happen. It's hard to get to that rarefied era. It really is. But again, you're so scared because you've had that. It's like, oh, my God, how on earth do I get on another thing of that kind of cultural momentum? Yeah. Right. Which is tough. And now that it's had this weird life through streaming, it's had like these nine lives in the same age, you know, fan comes up. I love it.

53:33But there was a time it just felt like this black cloud, you know, I couldn't get away from. And it was hard to break out of that. By the way, I used to have it with Kristen, too. It's like every interview I'd get in, they would ask me about Kristen. Right. I'm like, oh, I'm only here because they want to hear about Kristen. And then I was smart enough to realize, like, oh, when I see Kristen, all they do is ask about me. They just don't know what to fucking ask you about. They don't have to ask about. Right. Nothing's personal going on. There's no evaluation of anything going on. Exactly. But now, yeah, I can sit and do a two-hour podcast on Punk'd.

53:58I'd be delighted for someone to go through every episode. You're like, I would love to talk about it. You should have done a rewrite. That would be great. I'll come out in, but I couldn't watch it. But that is the most acting, though. That really is, though. That's the thing. That's the real shit. The commitment. You can't say cut. Yeah, there's no cut. You either fuck up the entire three-day thing they've been setting up. The stakes are high. It's always like the celebrity that you can sniff that out quickly, you know? I mean, it's high stakes. If I tip it and go too big, and yet I want to go big, that's my chance to be funny.

54:30Yeah. I'm wearing a fucking wig and shit with Nick Lachey. Yeah. I'm going as hard as I can without it. Like, I'm in a cutoff shirt. What a great episode. It's due for a rewatch. It really is. It's brilliant. It's my favorite. It's so good. I watched it recently, even after knowing him. I'm like, it's so good. Like, Jury Duty's great and all, but it's not punked. You know, that was like the thing, man. It was the best. It was really good. So, walk me through this chapter, right? This is a chapter between, I would say, Gossip Girl and the Boys. Right. How do you keep your spirits high? Do you find joy?

55:03Do you figure out how to recalibrate? Like, what is that journey? Yeah, that was probably the toughest journey, like the lowest point. Let me think. I basically sort of snapped out of it a little bit, a little bit. And it just felt so daunting, the task of like auditioning and trying to get that next thing. Yes. And will I ever get something as culturally rather than like a big again? I did a pilot. It got picked up. Oiling. Yeah, they changed the name of it. The best version of it would have been like Yellowstone, basically. And that's what I thought in my head. Oh, they're going to want this thing.

55:31The guys who created and wrote it were amazing. They all got fired. But ABC wanted it. They put on all these new people. We moved to Park City, which was amazing to live up there. Early on, it was like, oh, shit. It was the first time I was like scared. Am I going to be stuck on this? It was a great experience, but I was a little nervous about it. It was fine to be stranded in New York City as a young person. Yeah. But you probably never envisioned moving to Park City, Utah when you left Dallas. That's a big part of the job that I think is fine to be like, well I don't know or live in Canada for seven eight years right right right it's a nomadic leave your life yeah I bought a truck drove out there it was great for a while but it's a sleepy town it's not New York thank god I got a girlfriend that was kind of a nice thing I dated a girl that we were working your longest relationship three years yeah exactly yeah congratulations thank you

56:23that's interesting because if you're me and you fall in love and you're both out of town A, of course you're going to fall in love. You're both lonely and out of town. Yeah. You're also playing house. Totally. That's a good way to put it. And then you got to return to real life back and forth. I don't know. I think that would be weird. Yeah. I've never done that full experience, but I could see it being tricky. And somehow we did. We navigated it. It ended. It was actually in totality. It was like, oh, that was actually great. I did 13 episodes of this thing. We kind of had summer through winter in Park City.

56:50It was great. And then you guys stayed together for a long time. And we stayed together. Yeah. Yeah, we did. And we worked that out. and that's when I realized I am better in a relationship. I'm just, you know what I mean? Like single me is not the best version in a way. Well, there's a lot of data to support that. Married guys live like 11 years longer. I mean, it's like, yeah, we're not great on our own. You guys like don't go to the doctor. Right, right. No, yeah, yeah. I realized I like need some help. So that was all great and we're still friends. What do you do wrong in relationships? What do I do wrong?

57:19I just try too hard. I'm just too perfect. I love too much. I love too hard. I'll go first yeah what do you think yeah I had this relationship with Marie for nine years I left that one and there's no way it could have been her fault I mean she was a great human being I had to be responsible for a lot of it and I think I had the wherewithal I was like 36 at the time or something and I was like we gotta figure out what we were doing wrong clearly I need to break some habits I'm probably a bit I want them to think like me too much I was terrible about money I was so bad at sharing money I was like, oh, this is my money.

57:54You know, I did a lot of things that I knew I got to break this the next time I'm in one, which was Kristen. I met Kristen. She was a Christian, vegetarian, who lived with eight people and had 16 dogs. These are all things I would have normally been like, I love her, but there's no way I can hang with all this other stuff. Right. I'm laughing because she does all those things now. But I didn't ever challenge any of those. They're not religious. Well, that's the funny thing about life. You didn't control it. But you want to, though. We get past the honeymoon phase and you start to try and change the other or control the other person in just small ways, even.

58:31I'm guilty of that. Yeah, and it has the veil of being gross and controlling, which certainly it is. But really, it's about safety because you're like, I don't know, man. If she feels this way and I feel this way, I'm scared that we can both hold these conflicting opinions and still be a unit. Underneath of it, some weird fear. Don't we need to be more aligned in order for it to work? I don't think it's entirely disgusting in premise of why you're acting that way. It's just like, well, how are we going to? I remember we had a fight one time about like if we had kids, were we going to raise them with religion?

59:02And after that fight, I think I had a wise person in AA tell me, I'm sorry, is she pregnant? And I'm like, no. So why are you fighting today about something that you don't even know is going to happen? Things could change. You're living so far in the future. You guys are having a fight about something in the future that is so out of touch. Right. And then I never brought it up again, right? We get worried about those things before they happen. One of my biggest things is I'm like a bottler. Passive aggressiveness is a big problem for me. Like I'll hold on to things and I won't communicate them properly.

59:30You got a little vault. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then you can pull out when necessary. I don't run to the hard conversation. It'll turn into a fight and it's about something else. I'll realize, oh shit, it's actually about all this other stuff. I'm so sorry. And you were holding on to six months of shit. Yeah, exactly. And so that all comes out in the fight. It's about like a cup left on the table. You know what I mean? It's something so stupid. And then you're like, oh my God, I'm so sorry. This is not, you know, but that's one thing for me. So that's part of the people pleaser thing, right? Like, will you lose her affection by having these issues in this relationship?

1:00:00It's out of fear. Things are safe. Don't rock the boat. Don't do anything that could jeopardize. And things are just kind of now piling up. Homeostasis. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they're all little things until they're not, right? Because was there not a lot of fighting in your house growing up? Or was there fighting? Because I think it'd go either way. Some of both, really. I mean, my parents were really young. I can't believe they even got through that time with med school. I can barely have a dog now. I'm 40. You know, I've dealt 20 with two kids, but they were amazing. Yeah. And they figured it out.

1:00:26Yeah. Med school workload and two little kids. And your mom's living somewhere she didn't want to live. Right. Yeah. In Minnesota. Yeah. She did not like putting those chains on that van. She's in Park City. So it's not like you grew up around it. So you are emulating it or trying to avoid it. Right. I guess it's in relationships. you need to run to the hard conversations. No one wants to do it. You got to have the hard conversation sooner rather than later. And that's just what you need to do. And is your move to shut down? Yeah. Get quiet and distant and wait for her to figure out why you're hurting.

1:00:58Exactly. You just resort to being like the child you were with your parents. That's really what it is. Oh my God, I'm doing what I did to my mom. And it's all that stuff. And you always got to be aware of it. Okay, so good. So the relationship I'm presuming that was an identity outside of acting. That was forward momentum as a human building a life. I imagine those three years bought you a little reprieve from just you sitting there contemplating your career by yourself. Completely. She was an actress. It was very much a great support system. It was also in a weird way. This isn't the only reason I was getting in a relationship, but it was to prove to myself I was capable of being in a successful relationship.

1:01:37So I was motivated to be a good partner and boyfriend, you know, and I definitely failed at that in many ways, but I need to like grow up a little bit. It did facilitate that. I learned a lot. You always do. Right. Was it hard for you to let go of the fun nights out and lots of options? Yes and no. I definitely still stayed at the party a little too late. I was still like having fun with the guys and like going out and stuff probably could have shut that down a lot sooner. I still like that fun, but now I'm like, I love home. I love cooking. I love being in a relationship with miles. with a loaf of white bread.

1:02:14Yeah, that was embarrassing. But that stuff just gets tiring after a while. You just get old. It gets less fun. It gets less fun. It affects you a lot more. Your body will tell you. Yeah. And the illusion. Again, I'm a novelty seeker. So it's like, it has the appearance of a novel night. But if you really take inventory, you're like, oh, I do this same thing over and over and over again. Even if I hook up with a new person, it's the same thing. There's really no surprises. Exactly. and you feel like it's going to be this thing and it's never what it is. For me, it was a bit the revelry of it. Being with friends and the drinking, it was always kind of like this high of revelry.

1:02:49Yes. The socializing aspect was tough for me. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare.

1:03:07I just had a thought. Yeah. I love the intimacy you could have with other men while drunk. Right. I just craved that. And I loved, I show up with a six pack and then now I can say I love you. Your inhibitions are so down. Yes. Right, right, right. I craved that intimacy with men and drinking gave that to me. You don't even realize you know that's what you're looking for or what you need in your life. And you'll find a lot of them, you know, friends that you're just friends within that bubble of partying or whatever it is of drinking, right? And then that disappears and it's okay. You know, it's tougher.

1:03:37Jack London, the writer, he wrote a book called John Barley Corn. I don't know if you've ever heard of it. I have not, no. But it's this very, very honest book about his relationship with drinking towards the end of his life. And he was a hardcore alcoholic by the end where he had to wake up in the middle of the night and drink in the middle of the night to stay asleep. And it was, I think, reading that book that occurred to me, oh, that's what I was kind of craving that I loved. is he just talks about the intimacy at a bar with males and how without that, he could have never had that. He couldn't get there without that.

1:04:07Like a real conversation with them. Just the intimacy. The depth of a relationship. Yeah, being emotional. Exactly. And saying your fears to another man. Yes. And all these things you just dare not do. Right. Sober with another dude. It's so hard to get there. Yeah. It feels like it's hard to get there if you're sober. Yeah. Yeah. AA is a hack for that. It's like you're kind of forced to be with these other men. It's great. It's a community, right? It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. We all agree. Let's sit down for an hour and like be real as fuck. Yeah. Talk about what we're afraid of, how we fucked up in our relationship, what we regret about our parenting.

1:04:37It's like, how are you doing that unless you're hammered at a bar at 2 a.m.? When I left New York, all those guy friends were still in New York and I didn't realize I was doing a lot of that just to have those connections. And when all that kind of goes away and you realize you're a homeboy, I was like, I really don't have that many friends, real friends. Yeah, yeah. You gravitate to those guys that are going out and the revelry of that and connecting with those guys. So where were you at optimistically just before The Boys happens? How are you assessing what the future of your life is professionally just before The Boys?

1:05:05It was dark for me. I mean, in my mind, it wasn't really, you know, I know I was probably in a place that a lot of people would love to have been. Sure. You weren't on Taylor's couch. But there is that, you know, what have you done for me lately type thing and keeping up with the Joneses. Like, what are these guys doing that I'm not, you know, it's all that. You're seeing everyone you know on billboards all day long as you drive through the city. Yeah, it's LA. And there's that anxiety there that I don't get, even if I'm working in Toronto, that you kind of relax when you're out of LA. You have no clue what's going on.

1:05:32Sebastian's getting like nominated for Oscars. So you're just like, what the fuck? You can be happy for them and still be like, uh-oh, what am I doing? No, no, completely. And I'm in a different place now. I'm almost 41, but I'm much more relaxed. In the early 30s, it was just a doom loop. What am I going to do with my life? It felt like there was nothing that was ever going to happen again. Well, you're 34 probably, right? Seven years ago? 32 probably. Oh, okay. I think I turned 33 the year that The Boys happened. I remember reading it and not getting that many good, you know, again, people's casting imagination is limited.

1:06:05I was getting all these things. It was more the same. I didn't want to do. And I read the script of The Boys. I was like, what the fuck is this? This is amazing. I would imagine too, there's a little bit of a gift in that. It's such an enormous swing. I can only imagine reading that first script because that shows so much about execution. That script, the pilot, goes so wrong. The odds of it being executed in the way it was is like a 1 % chance. Yeah. So I also imagine getting that script and going, wow, this is really cool. And also, if I don't get it, this is probably going to fail. Like, I could be liberated by what a big swing it is and not get overly worked up about auditioning for it.

1:06:43Honestly, I'm like, how are they going to do this? Like, how are they going to make this thing? A guy's getting miniature and going on a guy's penis and exploding the whole body. You're like, how the fuck is that? It felt like a shot at the moon. Like, is this too good to be true? Am I tripping? Like, this is insane. And are they letting us do this? It goes so hard. Yeah. But I did feel, I was like, this is hilarious. I was like, I know this guy, this narcissistic, unselfaware asshole who's in a therapist couch talking about his only friends is the local lobster. Like that was the audition scene.

1:07:08It was like a monologue of this thing. I just felt connected to it. And like everyone is reading for it. And yeah, it was a great audition. Okay, so I'm going to be dead honest with you. Your fear is a little bit grounded, right? Which is like, I only know of you as an actor on Gossip Girl at that time. And I never watched Gossip Girl. So I just fill in the blanks of what Gossip Girl is. Yeah. And so I had this wonderful, shocking moment when I'm watching The Boys. And, you know, maybe Kristen said it out loud first, where she's like, fucking Chase is so good in this. And I'm like, yeah, this dude's fucking awesome.

1:07:46It was like a huge revelation to me. I was like, well, this dude has got no vanity. You're the butt of every joke. And you are just fucking driving straight into it. And you're not protecting yourself at all. It's the way you got to play that character. It's the only way to do it. But a lot of actors would get vain and they would just wink enough to go, I want you to know I'm in on it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's very tempting to go, I want the audience to know I'm a little in on it. I've always appreciated in the women, you know, I think of like Margot Robbie, even on SNL, that she's not afraid to go there and to be crazy or ugly for comedy.

1:08:19The way to go about it is have no ego about it. I think even Anthony, who plays Homelander on the show, came into it and had the same thought about me. Like this asshole is going to try and alpha me out. And it is just not the right way to play it. So we had a good time on that show. Yeah, you're so goddamn good. It's very impressive. Yeah, you're fucking great. And then your body. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. God, your body. Oh, man. Do we amp, we ratcheted up the training for that? I did, yeah. What was the approach? No pasta, no more fucking up and can't eating spaghetti. Keto, I'll never do it again.

1:08:54It was bad for six months. I got so excited for this role. I'm like, I'm going to get shredded or jacked, you know, just for fun for me. Of course. And I don't know what the suit's going to be. It was sleeveless, whatever. They didn't give us a trainer. I was like, wait, I'm going to do it on my own. But I did the keto thing for six months. It was good for like a few months and it was brutal after that. I had to stop it. I know people think it's vain and everything, but the sensation of having control over that. I was just about to say, it gives you control in a way. It's a healthy, I was able to channel my obsession kind of into that without going overboard.

1:09:24And it was a lot of fun, you know, like have time to do that too. If you're an actor and you're not working or if you are, but it's, if you're off, it's the only way to like structure your day. I feel like a workout or something. It's mentally for me, like, yeah, I have to do it. There's a lot of great performances on that show, but Anthony's is fucking outrageous. Outrageous. It is outrageous. When Chris and I watch the show, we love the fucking boys so much. We're like, the fact that this guy hasn't won every single Emmy is absolutely insane. It's insane. He's been nominated once. Because he's despicable.

1:09:52And yet he has these turns where I feel bad for him. And he's funny sometimes. He's hilarious. Yeah, yeah. Man, is that a performance. And so I'm at a restaurant like six months ago and I see him and then we're like, hey, we stand up and we hug. And I'm like, oh, my God, it's so great to meet you finally. And he goes, yeah, yeah, since New Zealand. And I was like, what is he talking about? And he goes, you know, I'm without a paddle. And all of a sudden I was like, oh, my God. Do you remember you watched it for the reunion? I know. We have a dead friend. The whole movie is about our dead friend, Billy Newwood.

1:10:27Yeah. He played Billy Newwood. He was the guy without a paddle. And I'm like, oh, my God. And I've seen it. I don't even remember. I'm like, dude, nothing could be more out of context. I met you in New Zealand 20 years ago. And yes, now, of course, I realize that. Did they show the dead bullpuss? They show him, yeah, yeah. In like our flashback scenes where like I'm wearing a leather jacket and we're like young and cool. Right, right. He was Billy, too. He's from New Zealand. You meet him, he's like, hey, mate, how you doing? You know, you're like, oh, wow, different than Homelander. It's great.

1:10:55Where did the guy who created it, his name starts with a K. Eric Kripke. Where did he come from? He came from Supernatural. I don't know that show with Jensen Ackles and Padalecki. Jetson was on our show as well. It was a great show. Had a long ass run that show. Civil War guy. What was his name? Yeah. Soldier Boy. Soldier Boy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's got a spinoff they're doing. Oh, they are. Yeah. They're doing a spinoff. That's a great character. Like a prequel. I don't know all the details, but yeah, it's good. Are you so excited you get to play kind of like a weirdo? So against what people think about you.

1:11:24It was so refreshing to me. We had a day, like fourth episode. They had a full series order because of Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg. Like they were behind us. They got the full order. Yeah. I'm like, we're middle of the show. I'm like, are the people going to like this? Because I was like, you know, squirting down the dolphin, like talking to some inanimate dolphin in the back. And they're moving the van. And like, Anthony's over there, like in an airplane, not saving anyone. Because he's like, oh, fuck you guys. It was amazing. We're like, are people going to like connect with it? And people do.

1:11:50It felt really tonally weird. So he came from Supernatural. Were Seth and Evan around at all? They were actually. They didn't come to Seth that often. They would be at the press stuff. But they would send me emails like, dude, this one line you ad-libbed. I keep replaying it. They were watching. I was like, oh, that's really cool. Evan would email me sometimes. And they were just super fans of the show. They really are comic book fans at heart. And they just wanted to do what they love. Now, did they have you in mind? Or did you have to really win them over for this? How did you get it? I don't know the entire genesis of it.

1:12:19I remember them landing on they want to cast people that aren't all their famous friends, basically. Right. So they wanted to read everyone for it. And Kripke was in every room for every single, I think it's Anthony. Anthony. I think Anthony was in New Zealand, made some tape and they're like, we want that guy. I remember going in and it was like 60 people. I saw the thing. I'm like, oh, I realized I'm like, I'm last of the day. What's the worst name you saw on the list? And I don't mean they're bad, but you're just like, oh, I'm fucked. Like actors, you know, you mean? Well, I'll give you an example.

1:12:46I remember going in for baby mama and I'm sitting in the waiting room and he's next to me, James Gordon. And he's telling me they just flew him from London for this callback. And I go, Well, I'm done. Then I spent 15 grand to bring this guy from London here. But there's these moments in auditions where you're just like, I'm dead. I remember recognizing some names and some friends who had been, they weren't actually in the room because I was like last. I remember being upset. These people aren't going to, it's like a Tuesday. There's going to be 60 people all day. And I didn't even realize that Kripke was going to be in the room.

1:13:21At the time, I didn't really know maybe he was like the creator. Or maybe I knew he was like a producer. But I remember being just irritated. And that's kind of the best, sometimes the best state to be. Because you kind of don't care at that point. You just don't care. You're not, you don't have this air of like, hi, nice to meet you. I can't get it now. You know. They're dead in there. I remember before the holidays, I'm like, they're not even going to remember this. They're going to go on hiatus top of the year. They're going to keep recasting it, bring it back in for a million different reads.

1:13:45So I was literally the last person in there. And I was kind of mad, just kind of went in there and did it. And I kind of heard Kripke chuckling in the corner. And then he was like, okay, try it, do it. Like, you know, he kind of threw me a few improv things. And you had the lobster was your... The lobster thing. And then it was that. And then an intense scene with Starlight Aaron's character. They changed it in the pilot, in the real pilot, with what I actually do, which is a crazy thing. Sexually assaulted. Yeah. That wasn't in any of the pilots or anything. Okay. They were holding that. Yeah.

1:14:11They were like, hey, this was like a big storyline jumping off for her character in the comics. And we're actually going to put that back in. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're going to be the guy to do it. And I was like, oh. I remember being very nervous. Me Too was going out. I was like, oh God, this is terrible. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of people were like, I'm not playing that. I don't want to play that. I remember being like, okay, I'm just going to own this. We're going to talk about it and talk about it until we can get this thing right. And they did. Took it with very great care. And I was nervous as all, you know, about that airing and like, oh my God, what are people going to say?

1:14:42Is this going to be the right timing? About you. Not about the show. And not wanting to be a big joke either. Like we were making fun of it. They did it in a very real way and it was dark. That was kind of the theme of the show. Like you don't want to meet your heroes. The way they handled the tonal shifts on that show is sublime. It's like you get every single thing you could want in a show in that thing. Pripy's genius. Yeah. You're bringing back so many audition memories. Thinking of sitting in the room, I can tell you I've been numerous occasions. Like I have an audition where I'm going to have to cry.

1:15:12And I'm like, yeah, I can't do that. Right. And you're sitting there. You can hear a guy who's three feet away divided by a paper door. And this guy's bawling. And I can hear it. Yeah. And you're just like, oh, I'm so fucked. Toss the papers out. You want to leave. You go, I can just get up. No, that's when you go in and you're like, so I'm making a different choice. Yeah, yeah. And it's a choice. I presume you guys saw him crying. So I'm going to do this other thing that's very hard to do also. He's like a trained British dude, of course. You're like, oh my God. Your arc on the show. Yeah, you sexually assault someone.

1:15:48Terrible. Then you got to rehab your public persona. and you join this very Scientology-esque church. Amazing, yeah. Lose your autonomy in there. And then they pair you with a wife and then she ditches you. And then you find love with an octopus. Yeah, like the... Has there been any... My favorite. Like, have you pushed back ever? I imagine after season one, they've built now some confidence with you. Like, these motherfuckers can pull off anything. So I'm just... Now I can go with God. You enter like season two just going like, oh yeah, I'll fucking snorkel beer out of someone's ass. Like, I'll do anything they say because they can land the plane.

1:16:25Yeah, I mean, season two was great because they had this mushroom tea thing and I was like tripping with the gills and talking to them. I thought that was so great and funny. But then season two, well, Krypti called me up and he's like, have you seen like my octopus teacher? And I was like, yeah. Didn't it seem like that guy was like trying to fuck the octopus? I was like, oh, kind of. What are you talking about, man? Like, that's your storyline. Oh my. I remember being hesitant, but then he was like, no, no, no, but it's real. Like, you can't connect with humans. That's like your safe space. And you keep her, like, in a tank in your closet.

1:17:00Yeah, and you're kind of mean to her. And she feels like a secret, and she's, you know, so you're ashamed of her. It's very deep. Oh, he's like, you're reading poetry, Thomas. It's brilliant. You fucking didn't clean her tank, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not only will you not let her be in the tank by your bed, but, like, it fills the air. Well, people can't see. But she's sitting in there in a murky fucking stew. No, it's really bad. You know what? It's kind of like when people fell in love with their slaves. Munchausen syndrome kind of thing? Well, no, like really when people fell in love with their slaves, but they were still enslaved.

1:17:29And it was like, you're over there, but I'm going to. Yeah, maybe I will cut that. Yeah, we'll probably take that. Well, I'll probably. I make the decisions. Yeah, yeah. I'll decide. You'll decide. Hopefully you're in a good mood. But also Munchausen's I'm very interested in as well. That's her favorite. Munchausen syndrome. Her two favorite topics are CTE and Munchausen's. Yeah. Really? Yeah, I love those two. If you met someone who Munchausen was claiming they had CTE, he would spray. Oh, I see. Like part of their Munchausen is that. Faking that they had CTE. No, no, no, no, no, hold on. I don't want someone with CTE.

1:18:02I'm just always on the lookout for CTE. I just think it's everywhere. I think a lot of people have it. She thinks 60 % of the population. You might have it. You play football. So I hate to tell you. I might, actually. Yeah, I mean. And she has looked many guests in the face and said, do you think you have CT? And it's like, there could be nothing scarier to evaluate as whether or not you're about to turn. Now I'm not sure. Maybe. Thanks for suggesting that. Yeah. You should get that really checked out. I did lose my temper at the grocery store yesterday. So yeah. I've been volatile recently. Yeah.

1:18:31Now I hear that it's the biggest show on Prime. Do you have any sense of like how big it is? I want to know. I want to understand. I want to know too. I guess they don't release the numbers. They say it is. It's a very global show. It is, which was kind of shocking because humor, that's the one thing they want is like a global show nowadays. And it was shocking that our show, the humor crossed over. All people are disgusting, it turns out. Everyone's a dirtbag. Superhero genre was saturated with the same formulaic storyline. Anytime the show comes out, there is like an influx of people like, you know, flight attendant, like, oh, my God.

1:19:05You can tell people are watching it. Even in like Europe to Brazil, like people are crazy about the show. It's a good feeling, you know. Yeah, it's really nice. Beth and Evan, they just cannot miss. They're so good. They're so good. I'll say, though, even internationally, though, it's more Gossip Girl stuff. That was hugely syndicated, right? I sometimes turn it on for a little comfort show. It's a good background. Like an old background. 2009, you got People's Summer's Hottest Bachelor. Did I? You did. I would be both extremely flattered and like, that's so specific. Did you have to make up this category?

1:19:38Summer's Hottest Bachelor. People's Summer's Hottest Bachelor. such a specific award. Congratulations. 2009. Yeah, my heyday. This is unfair on me, but what happened with Footloose? Why were you rehearsing for that? Yeah, that was an interesting story. Yeah, what happened? I remember really wanting it. It was Kenny Ortega, who's amazing. I remember telling him, I'm like, I can't sing or dance. It was an interesting challenge because they're like, no, we're going to learn and do this thing. And they're like, we're going to fly you out and do a big screen test. And I rehearsed for it a little bit, but they were just kind of testing out if I was even trainable.

1:20:12You know, everybody even had like basic body wear. So you were connected with your body at all. Right. And I had a whole day of that. And what was funny about that, they put in this like reader to read opposite me, a female actress. And she was really good and natural. And we'd eat lunch and she was cool. From Kentucky is Jennifer Lawrence. No. No way. Jennifer Lawrence. As the reader? Yeah, as the reader. And she was like 17, probably hadn't even done that first. Winter's Bone. Hadn't done Winter's Bone, definitely not yet. But I heard it being really cool. And I was like, hey, thank you for being there with me like all day.

1:20:43And she was like, yeah, no, it was really good and whatever. But I remember it was Jennifer Lawrence. That's so funny. So I did that and I felt good about it. You know, Kenny Ortega was, oh, it's great. You know, I can do this thing. And I think they want to go in a totally different direction at some point. They hired a new director like, oh, but you're still going to be the guy. I had signed a contract that I didn't even know what this meant, pay or play at the time. That's my dream. Yeah, it never happened since. You get paid whether you do the thing or not. So I remember being kind of irritated it didn't work out because I like the new director.

1:21:11Craig Brewer seemed to be a cool guy and they went like maybe darker with it. But I get it. They hired, I forget his name, but they hired a real dancer. I remember doing a screen test with Julianne Hough. That's right. And she was phenomenal dancing. And she got me there and she made me look good. Drugged you along. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Literally, it drew me around. I was like, she's going to be great. I'm going to have fun with her doing that screen test. But anyway, I remember like, go with God. That's great. And I got paid to do it. I felt like I'm like, I probably would have not been able to dance or sing properly.

1:21:39But ego-wise that hurts. because it's like, oh my God, they don't want me so badly that they're going to pay me anyway. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then somebody else do. No, totally. I remember feeling okay with it. I got to pay to not do this thing. I don't have to sing and dance. They paid me not to do it. Why would they do that? Because they need you committed. And then likewise, they can sue you for that money if you don't show up. So it's like, it's a mutually assured annihilation kind of situation. That's exactly what it is. But the only time it happened to me where it was really great is I got fired from Will and Grace.

1:22:10Really? Yeah, episode of Will and Grace in a table read. Come on, that's a crazy story because they always tell you you're not going to get fired at the table read, but it happens. I'm going to go further and say that they kind of begged me to do it. I was like, I was too busy. I'm doing this show. You didn't want to do it. But I'm friends with Sean Hayes. Finally, I'll do it. All to come in and just get fired at the table read. But they were like, you know, of course they're going to still pay you. I was like, okay, that's kind of cool. And then that same week, Netflix called and they're like, do you want to be a guest judge on this cooking show and it's X amount of money.

1:22:37So I just remember that day being on there and being like, oh, wow, I'm getting paid for Will and Grace right now and this cooking show. Worked out. Fuck, I finally got my dream come true. Yeah, double dipping. That's great. That's great. We share in common that we've both been directed by Lake Bell. I love Lake Bell. She's the best. I just saw her yesterday. Did you? She's the best. She's the best. You got to go to her auction thing next time she does this auction. I love to. Okay, I'll tell you. I love auctions. I never miss an auction. Well, they were right. These people that told us, you're a fucking champ.

1:23:08Yeah. Season five, obviously, just started airing. Just came out, yeah, last week. So exciting. I know you've already been asked this, and I think you're smart in saying that The Deep is a tricky character to try to have his own show because you need some kind of redemption. He's not a fun character if he's redeemed in some weird way. Right, right, right, right. But with all that said, how do we keep doing The Deep? Man, I'll tell you, I pitched them a spinoff. like three years ago, Evan and Kripke, you know, like loose pitch, like over like email or maybe it was in person. Like it was, I mean, in hindsight, it might've been before Barry, but it was like, what if he's like a shitty actor?

1:23:45He's kicked out and he's like a D-list act, you know, trying to do like some really B movie, but it was like, you see him shooting the bad movie, like Tropic Thunder, but it's like Barry, it was kind of an all over the place pitch, but I was like, what if he has to come to LA and we'll make fun of the industry type of thing? They liked it. Like, oh yeah, but like, you know, Now it's like no one's opening the wallets to do many things. But how do we keep him? He doesn't have to be fully redeemed, but it would be fun to like do a half hour comedy. All right. Well, you probably have other plans, but I don't hate the idea of you playing the deep in your free time.

1:24:14You could be president. It could be like idiocracy. That's a good idea. You know? Yeah. All right. Well, Chase, what a delight. This has been so fun. Everyone was right. Pleasure, man. And everyone should check out The Boys. Sincerely, if you don't watch The Boys. Who was I just talking to that said they had a, oh, fucking Tyler outside? And I couldn't believe Tyler. Get Tyler on it. I'm like, what do you hate to laugh? Tyler would love it. Oh, you guys are fans, man. No, thank you for the kind words. And then our friend. Anna. Anna. She loves it. We got screeners and I tried to give them to her.

1:24:44That's illegal. It didn't work anyway. So she was pissed. Yeah. Leave that in or not. That'll be like with the slavery thing, whether you're. Okay. It's up to having to decide later. Now you gotta stay in. That's gotta stay in. All right. Great meeting you. Nice to meet you too, man. Good luck with everything. Thank you guys. I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode But we'll find out when my mom, Mrs. Monica Comes in and tells us what was wrong We were just discussing what your nephew, right? Yes, what my nephew will call me Yeah, because the girls call Carly Titi Yes, which is so cute And is her permanent name now?

1:25:21I know No, I forget her name's Carly sometimes Yeah, I only call her Titi I call her Titi to her face. I like it. It's so cute. It's so much more endearing. Exactly. Nicknames are always better than non-nicknames. Sorry. Well, not always, but sure. Well, if they're mean, those are slurs. You do occasionally meet someone. You're like, oh, that's your nickname. Really? What's your real name? Like Blaze. Gunner. Gunner. Oh, guys, those aren't nicknames. Okay. Okay. Those are like pseudonym. Those are like they took that on as their persona. Non-deplores? Mom de plus. Mom de plus. But a nickname, a shortened or a cute version of your name or something people call you to love you is so, it's the best.

1:26:07Best. Dad. I cherish dad. Yeah, that's the best you got. Aaron calls me. Yeah, that one's really cute. No one else does. Well, two people do. Three people do, including Aaron. Yeah, yeah. And TT sometimes. Mm-hmm. Yeah, uh-huh. And you sometimes. And Kristen and me. I'm sad Rob's never called me dad or daddy Oh Rob you don't have to call me daddy Okay HR I'll go with daddy I just think that would be such a wonderfully uncomfortable thing For you and I to have as a bit That in public he called me daddy And you would be like What an unhealthy work environment Exactly In front of a guest Do you want your coffee daddy Daddy are you ready for your coffee I mean, the age gap is such that they might think you're my son.

1:26:54Well, you do look quite young, Rob. Wobby Wob. How old are you again, Rob? 37. Yeah, no problem. No problem? 13? 14. I'm 51. No, you're 12 years older than me, so you're 13 years older than Rob. Look, he's 37. I'm 51. That's 14. But you're January. I'm June. I'm almost 38. Yeah, June. He's close to me. January. Okay, I have a funny story. Oh, great. So... you may remember that I was asked to go speak at Delta's class about Malala. Yeah. Yeah. Which was a little stressful because like, I'm not an expert on Malala. I certainly did my research. So she did a report, right? They had a whole section on her.

1:27:37They had read her, maybe both of her books. And, you know, they really got into everything that happened in Pakistan. And then so Miss Brown, who I love, shout out Miss Brown. She invited me to talk about Malala. And then, of course, it evolved into, like, the boys asking me what sports stars we interviewed, which was hilarious. What's so funny is I couldn't, on the spot, I couldn't think of anyone. Tom Brady. Well, I got to him. Okay. But mind you, we've had so many. Like, I couldn't remember Shaq. And be erotic. Oh, Lord. Right. I was just like, one of the boys was like, you ever interview any sports?

1:28:09You know. Yeah. So, Dwayne Wade. Oh, yeah. There's been a million. But I did. I was like, oh, yeah. Well, I've done a lot. And I'm like, I've done a lot of NBA players. I know I've done some NFL players. and then I go, oh, Tom Brady. That's the one I came up with. Okay. And this kid literally. I wish we could say Simone Biles, but she won't come on. We would have said, we would have said it. I'd remember her the most. Yep. But this, I said Tom Brady and this boy shot out of his chair. He couldn't sit in his chair. He said, you interviewed Tom. Like, it was so funny. Anyways, that was that. Yeah.

1:28:42I did that. So Lincoln's whole seventh grade class is doing a whole segment on, for I think literature, English or whatever, a whole segment on podcasting, like for, I guess, months, they're going to learn about podcasting. And then I think they're all going to make a podcast, right? Oh, she has such a leg up. Well, so one of the teachers said, would, you know, would your dad be willing to come in and talk? Yes. And then so Lincoln asked me and I said, yeah, of course. And so it was approaching and then the night before Lincoln was such a ball of nerves as I totally understand. I mean the notion of one of my parents coming into my 7th grade I just.

1:29:25And you're a live wire I'm a live wire but I just would have been terrified like you know for so many reasons like A I hope they think they're cool if they're not I gotta fight everyone. If you think my mom if you're mean to my mom now I gotta fight everyone. If anyone makes fun of you or makes fun of my mom everyone's dead. Okay. Okay, so anyways, so I know it's stressful and I'm already honored she's even open to letting me come. I guess that says a lot. But the night before she was like, okay, you cannot wear those, your light colored Levi's that have a hole in the back. That's fair. And I was like, okay.

1:30:00It's inappropriate. You cannot wear a headband. And I go, okay, what do you think people are going to think? You know, I like to poke. What do you think? You know. What did she say? Just don't wear it. It's drawing too much. And then I said, okay, well, I'll just wear a hat. You cannot wear a hat. You can't imagine, Monica, what this list became of things I couldn't and could not wear. Yeah. Was it all aesthetic-based or was it like you can't say this or you can't? No, it was all aesthetic. Well, okay, we had this bit going. This backs up a whole week. They, thank goodness, the teacher urged the students to write out questions like last week.

1:30:39and so Lincoln said I want to hear like what are your answers going to be to one of these questions and um also I don't know why we've been watching a good deal of British stuff I don't know that's in the mix so I said um okay let's let's workshop this and you be Lincoln in this situation okay this is a week ago okay and I said um ask me how many episodes we've done yes um Mr. Lincoln's dad Yeah. How many episodes of your podcast have you made? A thousand. That's a lot, isn't it? Ew. Isn't it? Ew. That's a lot of episodes, isn't it? What do you think, isn't it? It's so aggressive. It's so aggressive and loud.

1:31:19Like, why did it get so loud? I think what made it so funny for both of us is if anyone might do that, you know, there is just a thin thread of that. That's what makes it good. Of course, I would never do that. Are you sure? But she has seen me act bizarre enough that I'm sure some tinge of her is like, Jesus, is he think he's going to do this? I'm going to laugh. Yeah. Yeah. So I keep hitting her with it and it all week. And then and then I am told all these things I got to wear. OK, so then you and I recorded someone. We had to record someone earlier than we normally do so that I could get there.

1:31:52That's why we did it. Oh, that makes sense. Yeah. We had a 10 a.m. I know. And I didn't know why, but I figured it was just yesterday. It was two days ago. Two days ago. Okay, so I left that interview, and I think I was wearing a hat. I don't even know what the hell was going on. But the point is I went upstairs and I put on, like, all the appropriate approved clothes. And then I got in front of the mirror. And, Monica, I have never fretted over my hair this much in my life. Way worse than if I'm, like, on my way to Kimmel, which I do my own hair when I'm on a talk show. I was in there like, fuck, this is it.

1:32:24And I was, like, wrestling with it. And I was like, fuck, it does not work. Oh, that's nice. It's so important. I don't embarrass her. Oh, it's so cute because this, yeah, I imagine like if I'm, if I'm putting myself as a little girl and I, my dad's coming to class and I'm like, oh my God, dad, please do not just don't, don't, don't. But then now cut to however many years, you know, 20 years later, since I'm so young, um, that if I heard that he was like worried about his hair because I said that like, oh man. Yeah, yeah. Anywho. How did it go? Oh, so it was not just her class. It was the entire seventh grade.

1:33:05How many people? 88. Okay. Yeah. So first of all, I got there greeted by one of the teachers. They're all so awesome. Okay. And this is so lucky. I'm just so delighted with the school that Lincoln goes to. Yeah, great school. And of course, they want to know everything. They want to know what kind of show it is. It's an interview show. What makes a good interviewer? and then they want to know the mechanics of it right like you record for how long what's the editing process like all that kind of stuff but at any rate um they did open it up to questions and again this is this is the incredible like i can't even compute what happens at this school because it's all girls oh that's important to say it's all girls yeah one hand after another boom every girl had a question they're so confident and they're just question question question it It was really, really fun.

1:33:57And Lincoln sat in the directly front row in front of me. And I said to her, I'm like, I thought you were more of like a burnout like I was. I thought you'd be in the back row trying to hide. No, she was front and center. Yeah. And then I took a big swing. Oh. Uh-huh. What'd you do? I got asked. I can't remember the exact wording of it, but I got asked, like, have I ever gotten really emotional in one of the interviews or something like that? Yeah. Wow. That's an astute question. Yeah, but it was a little, I wish I could remember the particulars. However the question was, it led me to, and as soon as I started talking about it, I was like, this is a disaster, but I'm pot committed.

1:34:34I've already begun talking about it, which was Dove Cameron. Oh, I thought you were going to talk about your mom. No, just as bad. I said, does anyone know Dove Cameron? All of them know Dove Cameron. Okay. Right? Well, they should start listening. Well, they're young. I was going to ask, how many do you convert? Like, honestly, we need them. That's the age. I'd say of the 88, maybe six are in. Yeah. That's pretty good. Pick up six listeners. Okay. So they all knew Dove. They all knew Dove. And I'm explaining the episode. You told them what happened to her? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Her father died by suicide.

1:35:13Yes. And she thought he didn't love her. Yeah, it's horrifying. It's so sad. And then she found this box. Yeah. And she found this baby book. and in it he had written my best friend. Yeah. That's the saddest story. And then as I'm telling it, of course, I'm back in the moment that I totally broke down the first time we heard the story. Such a, yeah. And then here's the biggest, this could have been career ending for me as a parent. And I said, and I was very emotional because this little person's my best friend. Oh, and then what? That could have been really embarrassing for her. No, I don't think so.

1:35:49She looked at me and smiled so very. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I rode home and I got another helmet. And then I came back and I picked her up and we rode home together. And she said she was really proud of me. All told, it went well. But high stakes. Again, I don't get nervous to go speak in front of people. And I was very nervous. You should. Yeah. I'm glad you took it seriously. Her only complaint was the way I was calling on people. I got a little too animated when I was calling. You! Oh, my God. Great. Back row. You know that I was getting pumped. Especially if someone seems shyer. I was like really trying to celebrate them.

1:36:24That's the worst. Because they want, they like, they're already nervous. And then you're making a big. Okay. Listen, so we had that day, the interview that we did in the morning that you were coming from was also a very. I told them about it. Oh my God. Because they asked me if I ever interviewed a killer. Well, that we can't tell people that. Well, I guess we can. Guys, there's a, there's an interesting. I said I've not interviewed a killer that I know of, but. one hour ago. Yeah. And I told him that. Okay. And then that episode. Okay. Also has any parent like reached out like, Hey, please don't ever.

1:37:02Hey, it was a little inappropriate for you to bring up. I was debating those things because I got into real dicey. I did paint myself into a corner really quick. I've had like a panic because they asked me who I'd want to interview. That's dead. And I was like, oh, my God, we just had this kind of debate on the podcast. And all of a sudden I'm saying I'd interview Jesus. And this is a Catholic school. Well, that's they probably like that more. But I was saying why I want to interview him is I'd love to be able to look at him and see like, is this guy really? I was just honest. You said that? I did.

1:37:39I said. And then I realized later after I had given that answer that I just assume I'll be talking to him in English. And I remember this guy doesn't speak English. I'm saying all this in front of it. And the teachers are around and I'm like, sorry, girl. Oh my God. I said, and then I realized, oh, he doesn't speak English. And then I said, but then I realized, oh, well, that would be the proof. If this, if he magically just started speaking English, I'd be like, wow, this guy really is the son of God. I said all that. That's crazy. It was an hour and 40 minutes. Okay. That's a long time to get me talking where I'm not going to.

1:38:13But the teachers did not mind it. I was like checking in with them a little bit. And I think they're just like, yeah, we're here to debate this. Okay. Well, that's cool. Did you mention JonBenet Ramsey? She was an important part of that conversation. I did not bring up JonBenet Ramsey. What if you were like, you know, there was a girl about your age. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I want to look out at you guys. I can't help but think of. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's awesome that you did that. I'm just basing it on like Lincoln's hip. She knows what's going on. I'm just granting the rest of them the same like cognitive aptitude as her.

1:38:48But it's not. OK, what I would what I would push back a second on. They can be smart and thoughtful and curious, but a lot. There is a wide range of of how exposed that age is. There's a wide range. But I don't. They're all watching Netflix. They're all listening to the news. Like, they know what's going on in the world. They know there's murderers. They know people do and don't believe in God. Like, they're not eight-year-olds. And I just, I always hated being pandered to. I know. That's what I'm saying. You're doing some projection because you hated that. Possibly. And also some percentage, yes.

1:39:34Did you bring up anything sexual? Nothing sexual. Oh, my God. Thank you. Yeah. No, I, that's, it's an all girls school. I'm an old dude. No, I was somehow, I think goodness. I didn't say anyone was hot or anything. Oh my God. Not the students, the guests. None of our guests. I was, I didn't say any of our guests were hot. You know, it was the sexiest guests we ever had. What have I said that? Oh my God. Like I know nobody asked. I put my own question in. Yeah. Nobody asks this, but I know you're thinking it. Anyway, I do. I am, I am, I am a firm believer in the fact that the kids know way more than you think.

1:40:07they do and it's okay to talk about things if they get to see murders and stuff then we can talk about everything i guess that's true yeah i think the whole like no one fated during topics is the way to navigate topics but i also don't think they're gonna be protect like like i think just because i didn't talk to my parents about certain things didn't mean i was like sheltered in the world you you talked to your friends about it and you figured out that's always my point is like yeah you found out all of them but you found out from peers and it would have been cool to have From the parent's perspective as an adult who's been through some stuff.

1:40:40Yeah. Well, I'm glad it went well. I do think you failed on a big opportunity to get us some listeners. Well. Yeah. Did you bring up Armchair Anonymous? Yeah, I think Lincoln did. See, she's doing the Lord's work ding, ding, ding for us. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert. If you dare.

1:41:15Well, what's problematic about Armchair Anonymous, I just, you know, I say like we do a show. I was explaining Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays. And I was talking about our workflow, you know, interviews with listeners. Yeah. We don't have a single prompt that's really cool to tell them about Armchair Anonymous. We don't want to talk about Dicey Water. But they're all listening. Well, the funny thing is, is that is the show they would want to listen to. Yeah, exactly. But I wasn't really free to promote it because, again, the topic, I wouldn't have felt comfortable. No, you just say, well, because there's one topic that pops in your mind all the time.

1:41:49But we have others. It's like evacuation. Yeah, you don't have to do that one either. It's all I could think about when they wanted to know what the show is about. I was just all I kept thinking about is the guy who cut his own penis off. I was like, don't tell that your brain does that. You're like fucking whatever you do, do not mention. And it's like the second that question was asked, I just thought of that penis thing. I was like, and that's all I could think about is don't say that. Okay. Example. Okay. Well, would you, would that story have popped into your mind? No, never. Which one would have popped into your mind?

1:42:19I guess I would have been like, oh, tell us about a bad job interview or tell us about a meet cue. Oh, yeah. We do have a nice one. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely ones you could have said. Yeah. Waterparks is this week. Waterparks. Waterparks. That's great. But didn't nasty stuff happen at the water park? Well, you don't have to tell them what happens. It's just they're really funny stories. That all am nasty. People love to, people your age tend to listen and love them. You just give them the links and then have them click. In fact, so Lincoln is running for an office at school. Yeah. And I haven't told her this yet, but when she wins, I hope maybe like, Like, I'm just, like, hoping she's in charge of the announcements or something.

1:43:08Okay. Okay? And then she can play clips and slowly convert a whole school. Yeah, yeah. You got to think ahead like this. Exactly. Future leaders. You got to think ahead like this. I look out at that audience of young ladies and I was like, these girls got it. I know. They're such badasses. So cool. I was in the audience. I saw myself. She was in the dead back row. Oh, no. I have a question. I have two questions. One was legit. And she goes, second question, why haven't you interviewed me? When are you going to interview me? And I'm like, all you got to do is win a Nobel Peace Prize. I got a seat open for you.

1:43:44So she's funny. Later, second round of questioning. Oh, boy. Right back at it. When am I going to be on the show? Oh, she didn't know that the, okay. I'm like, this is me. I'm looking at me. Yeah. It's great. Does Lincoln get along with her? Yeah, I asked her about her specifically. I'm like, I like that girl in the back row. And she's like, yeah, she's got, you know. Problems. No, no, no, no, no.

1:44:11She's considered the bad kid. And I guess we had this, but we never said it this way. But they have friendship groups. Oh, yeah. And they're like delineated and everyone knows what friendship group they're in. And there's migration. Like someone will try to join a different friendship group. And then they all sit together and stuff. Yeah, lunch. Yeah. So that gal was not in her friendship group. Right. Which is not to say she doesn't like her. Yeah, yeah. She doesn't dislike the people not in her friendship group. Yes. It's complex, man. Oh, I remember it. The little monkeys, they. I remember it.

1:44:44Remember it. It still exists. Yeah. It still exists. It's actually really funny because I have a few new friends, which is weird. You know, as an adult, it's weird to have new friends. Yeah. And I have a few new friends and like they have friendship groups and I have a friendship group. And it's like kind of weird to like. Cross-pollinate. Yeah. Uh-huh. And I guess it just never ends. Like you're like, oh, but would they like me? Yeah. Well, because, you know, the podcast I'm currently obsessed with. One person's in that podcast? Well, Aaron and Sarah's podcast. Yeah. Uh, they're friends with one of my new friends.

1:45:29Okay. And it's so strange. Are you going back unless you are, you're how many, like, what's your routine? I don't know. It's like every night or. I feel weird about it. Yeah. I like don't want this to get back to them, but it will. Cause we speak clear freely, but. You're like peak obsession right now. And I know what I know, this is no offense to Aaron and Sarah. The podcast is great. Very, I mean, obviously, I find it extremely enjoyable. Yeah. But what I think is like, oh, I'm self-soothing somehow, and I don't know what, I don't know why. Like, I don't know what's causing that. Yeah. And why that's the salve.

1:46:11Yes. I think it probably has to do with moving into this big house and being by myself. Okay. Maybe. Yep. That like I have friends around in quotes around my house, you know, just like makes the house more lively. So you have it playing throughout the house and you walk from room to room. I have that ability. I have speakers, but I just do carry my phone. I do know how. Oh, OK. But I have found myself. I just carry my phone around. Have you ever put the speaker? Yeah, I do for music. I do when I have friends over and stuff when I'm entertaining. For your new friendship group. Yeah, but maybe because it doesn't feel like they're with me if they're in the wall.

1:46:52If you're not holding them. Yeah. And it's interesting. I think it's an old salve if I could. And I don't know the show. Oh, yeah. What I know is. And I say salve. But I just. Salve. I say salve. I know you make it the L silent. So I don't know what's right. Probably you. No, probably you. I always defer to you. So I know Aaron and Sarah. I've known Sarah for 22 years, I guess. And I like both of them so much. And so just let me say that. Yeah. I've never listened to the show. So I don't really, I have no position to have this opinion, but I'm going to have it anyways. You know, they're very popular girls.

1:47:31They're like hot popular girls. And I think your Sav was like, Friends, Friends is very hot popular kids. Yeah. Well, you mean people who liked Friends or the Friends? The Friends. I mean, they're hot and popular. The whole America loves them, and they have got great style in the new hairdos. They're also weirdos. Like, Phoebe's a weirdo, and, like, Ross is a paleontologist. Yeah. Hot one. I think they represent very popular. Okay. It's certainly not Seinfeld where it's like you've got Costanza and Richardson, whatever his name was. Yeah. Kramer. Kramer. Okay. Here's the, here's, I don't think I agree with you, but I tangentially agree with you.

1:48:21Okay. In that what I was so attracted to with the friends is their intimacy, how much they loved each other unconditionally, how safe that group of people was. And I wanted that so badly. Potentially, Aaron and Sarah are doing a similar thing. I mean, I'm coming up with this real time. Maybe because they're sisters, right? So there is this just like deep bond, intimacy that nothing, I mean, they're mean to each other. You know, they're really like kind of sometimes I'm like, oh my God, this is wild. Yeah. They talk to each other like siblings talk. Yeah. And I don't have, I mean, obviously I have a younger brother, but I don't have a sister.

1:49:05And I definitely, I always wish I had that. So maybe it's a little bit of that. Like, oh, I wish I had this. I mean, I have friends, but it's not the same. There's a lot of things you'll have in life. you're not gonna have a sister that's the thing there are a lot of things i can make happen for myself yeah i don't want to limit you but i do want to tell you you're not gonna have a sister that's your age unless what could happen separated at birth reunited yeah what if nermie called you like i heard you and i guess monica hey that was pretty good thank you whoa that was pretty good I don't want to hear anymore.

1:49:44I know. I knew you didn't want to. Weird. Going home to see her for Mother's Day weekend. Oh, nice. Yeah. Oh, one last thing. Last Friday, Lincoln had the day off school. Uh-huh. So we went to the go-kart track, and we were on our way home from the go-kart track, and we were on Los Feliz Boulevard, and I said, oh, look, here. I go, oh, look, here's Monica's. We're coming up on Monica. I spotted your car from, like, 100 yards back. so we were definitely coming up to get next to you and it was what timing the the universe smiled on us because right as we were catching you an ambulance was coming through the intersection so you were trying to get over in the right lane but i just slid into the right lane and the look you gave me real time and uh link and i were both staring at you and you like turned and you fucking you're like what the hell look with your eyes yes and we were laughing hysterically No, and then it was you guys.

1:50:41And then I laughed, but I was still like, go! Like, the ambulance is trying to come. Yeah, and it was fine. The ambulance went in the other lane. It really stressed me out. It wasn't in our lane. It was in our lane. I know, but still. You were doing what you're supposed to do, but I was there. And I was like, who is this fucking asshole not getting over and getting, also preventing me from getting over? And it was you. How much do you think seeing her little face smiling buffeted? Of course it happened. If it was just me and I was waving. No, I also knew, I mean, once it was you, I was like, oh, they're fucking with me.

1:51:18So it was, I would have still been, I still would have laughed. Okay, okay. But I also was like, man, but like, what if they don't get to, what if someone dies, you know, because the ambulance didn't get there because Dax wanted to say hi to me. Yeah, that didn't happen. Nothing happened with the ambulance for the record. I love how rare your car is because I always know if it's you. Yeah. Do you know my license plate? No, I don't need to. Oh, okay. Yeah. Because no one has. I've never seen your car in that color. Really? No. I've seen it a couple of times and I always like, I like, I like that.

1:51:54All right. Well, I mean. Do some facts? Well, let's do some facts. Okay. Yes. This is for Chase. Chase Crawford. Chase Crawford. What a likable fucking guy. Very likable. Oh, so likable. You can tell, no wonder he's gotten along with everybody. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Got a lot. He had a lot of endorsements, like, from people. Mm-hmm. Tell the audience about your— Okay. Act? Wow. I thought that would be something you would share for sure. Fine. Okay. There's a scene in Gossip Girl. I forget what season. And it's not, like, that sexual of a scene, but he's in a car. well they're they're making out and like they're obviously like they're either post quid or free or just they're just they're just messing around yeah in a car him and this older woman oh maybe that's oh wow i predicted that i'd be a cougar one day anyway when i when i used to watch the show i loved that scene and i would watch it multiple times because i thought it was so hot that he was so hot he had like his hands on her and i thought it was really hot you like tell us what his hands were doing.

1:53:02I love hands. Yeah. What are you going to do? What can you do? What can you do? Yeah. Anyway, speaking of, when was Zegers, your friend Zegers, Kevin Zegers on Gossip Girl? He was on from 2009 to 2011. He was in 10 episodes across seasons three and four. Damien Dahlgaard. Sounds very rich. Yeah, he was a bad boy. Was he playing a rich bad boy? Drug dealer. Zekers is now a full-blown cowboy. Do you know this? From his show, right? Well, I think that's where it started. But now he's genuinely, he was just gone for like four days. Not for the show. Not for money to help another rancher. Oh. He was castrating bulls and roping and doing the whole thing.

1:53:46He loves it. The whole thing. He's doing like the shit that's gnarly. Wow, good for him. Castrating? No, thank you. Yeah, actually not good for him. I don't know. That sounds yucky. Ugh. Pulling balls out and stuff. Ew. why does he want to do that? You think he's like, I need to be more rugged. No, I think he got a bug for it. Like I think he enjoys it. He was, he got invited, I think from Taylor to go do this, like showing cutting horses, you know, cutting horses, they can separate out one cow from the herd. So they're really agile and they kind of get into this back and forth. They pick a cow, they try to separate it from the herd and the cow's trying to get away from that.

1:54:23So the horse is constantly going left, right, trying to outflank them. Like he's covering them in basketball. So to stay on that horse is pretty wild. Like it's, you gotta be a good rider to be riding a horse cutter. And so there was showing horse cutting horses. I presume to sell at some auction or something. And Zegers was demonstrating the horse cutting on this horse. And I watched the video. I was like, by God, he's really fucking doing it. Horses are having a moment. Oh yeah. You rode horses. And I caution people to use. Yeah. Yeah. Be careful on them. And Zegers, I guess, is a cowboy. And that untold on horses.

1:55:01Uh-huh. And Clooney's beer is all about horses. Yeah. And Sarah Foster has a horse. She does. Yeah. I know that its name is Rolex. How much did Pepperdine buy that property for? Pepperdine University's main 138-acre Malibu campus land was donated in night. Take one second. 138 acres on the PCH? I know. Okay, go ahead. Donated in 1968 by the Adamson-Ringe family. Mmm, that's the best way to get property. Exactly. Okay. Wow, 138 acres right there. That's worth$400 million or$500 million if it's just flat. I mean, there's nothing even on it. Wow. How many deaths per square mile on the PCH? It says, while traffic safety data for the PCH is generally measured in fatalities per mile or total crashes rather than per square mile, the 21-mile stretch of PCH through Malibu has experienced a high concentration of fatalities, with roughly 61 deaths reported over the 15 years leading up to late 2024.

1:56:11for and no one cares but i i said it briefly in the episode the problem is is people are parallel parking on either side of this six lane right there's a there's a middle turning lane there's two lanes people are going 60 miles an hour and people are making u-turns across all five or six lanes to find the beach parking spot yeah it's a bad motorcycle in particular it's like probably the worst stretch for motorcyclists oh my god um the movie that chase shot in turks and Caicos. I'm not sure. But it was probably Riptide. That would make sense. And then there's also Long Lost Son. We went to Turks and Caicos.

1:56:50We did. Loaded. The Haunting of Molly Hartley. I'm just reading a lot now. Like a lot of his credits. But I kind of think it was Riptide. That makes a lot of sense. What would make sense is a movie called The Mountain Escape. That would be, but you never know. You don't know, but that would make no sense. You never know. Okay. Um, now not to do this. I know I don't love doing this, but I do feel like I have to. Okay. Actually, I don't have to. Yeah. I'm not going to. Go ahead. Okay. So it's Abercrombie and Fitch. Oh, that's fine with me. I actually am happier. I don't know the real. Well, no. Now you know it right.

1:57:29You can say it right. What is right? Fitch. Fitch, not Finch. Well, now I'm worried. I mean, I'm wrong. Oh, my God. Finch is a bird. Yeah, Fitch. But what the fuck is Abercrombie? Abercrombie and Fitch. Yeah, it's great. But what is an Abercrombie? They're probably people's names. I don't even say, I'm saying it right now, but normally you should know. I don't say Abercrombie. I say Abercrombie. Oh, you do. You're right. I do. I say Abercrombie and Fitch. No, and Finch. Abercrombie and Finch. It's a Scottish surname. Okay. Okay. Well, no disrespect to that family, but just what a comical name.

1:58:07I think it's cool. Abercrombie? I just am impressed. Someone was like, yeah, we'll call it Abercrombie in French. Well, no one's calling it that because that's not what. And everyone's like, what? And I'm like, yeah, it'll work. And it did. Yeah, I was obsessed with it. That's why I knew I was right. But then I second guessed. I'll tell you when it backfired. Zathura. Like, it's dangerous to name something people can't pronounce. But most people can pronounce Abercrombie. I'm sorry. I don't know. I've not seen the data or the data. Me either. Yeah. I know Zathura was a real struggle. Zathura? And part of the whole ad campaign was they had bought like a whole episode of The Apprentice where the task was to get people to know how to pronounce the fucking name of this movie.

1:58:47And I was like, this is not great. Oh, that's bad. Yeah. That's not great. Well, also because Zathura is like, well, could it be Zathura? People are saying Zathura. Exactly. And then once they found out they were saying it wrong, they're like, fuck it. I can step up to the ticket window. There's six movies. I know I can say the name of this one. I'll say that. I know, but part of me is like. Get over yourself. Just like, just say, I want that Z movie. Like, why would you let it stop you? People have such big egos. Okay. Married guys, you said live 11 years longer. I said that? I don't know what, I was being facetious.

1:59:23They live longer. Yeah. Studies show on average, roughly two to eight years longer than unmarried. Then you add daughters into that mix. You could hit 11. Huh? Oh, that's different. Only for men, not for women. Every daughter that a man has on average adds 1.7. I don't know what the crossover, I don't know. Like if that data is affected by people who have daughters, yeah. Okay. Now, he accidentally, now I'm going to do it to him, Abercrombie and Fitch. He accidentally said season two twice in a sentence, and I think he meant season three when he was talking about the octopus. Yeah, that sounds right.

2:00:02I mean, the epic octopus scene is in season three. There you go. So, yeah. Oh, who did they end up hiring for Footloose? So, I think Kenny Wormald. That sounds right. He played, yeah, this is him. Kenny Crombie and Fitch. Yeah, he's a real professional dancer. Kenny Wormald, or Wormald, and the director's Craig Brewer. He might have said Craig Brewer, but I think he said Craig Bryce. Oh, okay. A lot of thanks in this fact check. Oh, one thing I want to make clear. My mouth looks kind of weird in this episode. Oh. That's because I have a lozenge in my mouth because that was during my cough attack period.

2:00:46Oh, okay. The season of coughing. Mm-hmm. Your coughing era. So that was lozenge-based. Okay. I don't want people to think I had like weird Botox. Right. One of our episodes just aired where my sty was very, very evident. I was like, oh yeah, that was quite evident. Yeah, you could see it. Yeah, for sure. But you know. I mean, I don't, I'll live. I just don't like the connection with pink eye. I know. Because pink eye makes you think of poop in your eye. And I don't have any poop in my eye. And I didn't then. And I don't now. Yeah. I had a sty from stress. I know. But also, like, I don't think I would have thought it was pink eye.

2:01:22There was a moment where my eyeball was, like, beet red. I know. Okay. And it screamed pink eye. I even think someone said, I think my sister said, hey, oh, you got pink eye? Oh. I was like, no, I wiped my butt with toilet paper, not my hand, TT. Yeah, but sometimes you still could get poop particles. I couldn't, but yeah, other people could. You're the one that sticks your finger up your butt when you shower, okay? I don't know anything. Yeah, you've said that aloud. Okay, that's it. Love you. Love you.

2:02:03Thank you.