Arsecast Extra Episode 655 - 25.08.2025

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0:50The mark of Giocheres, goal, goal, goal, goal, goal, goal, goal, goal, goal, goal. The first, the first, the first. Goooooool. Liberating all the attention, covering the doubts. Marca finally, Victor Giocheres.

1:12Victor. Victor. Victor Giocheres.

1:39This is Arsecast Extra. Hello and welcome to another Arsecast Extra as always with James from Gunner Blog. James, a very goodly morning to you.

1:50Andrew Mangan: A very goodly one, Andrew. A very goodly one to you and all the listeners. And all the listeners. There's a lot going on, isn't there? Sometimes, you know, we're like when we're about to do a podcast. Well, let's see what we can get out of what meager information the football world has provided to us. This one, I don't think we're going to have any trouble in, you know, finding our way. The first eight-hour Ask Cast Extra, incredible. I did someone said can you please make this a three-hour episode I don't know that we can but we we certainly have a lot to talk about yeah I guess we'll see we'll see where it takes us but there's a an awful lot to get into um I mean obviously you've done podcasts since our last podcast yes so but the the game on Saturday there was a vast amount in that but the few days leading up to it.

2:47Andrew Mangan: Pretty hectic as well. Yeah, and subsequently as well, you know, because of all the hashtag content that's come out. And obviously that surrounds... I'm going to let the man pronounce his own name. Here it is. Aberachie Ezza. Aberachie Ezza. Ezza. That's going to take some getting used to. It is going to take a bit of getting used to, but, you know, I think we have to... We have to sort of at least be humble enough to think that the man knows how to pronounce his own name. Is that fair? Yes, well, it's part of the Arsenal credo to stay humble. So, yes, you're absolutely right. I mean, it has been extraordinary.

3:25And before we get into all of that, and we will talk about the game, obviously, but I do think there's something, I don't know, a bit special about this deal, about this transfer, about the way it happened, about the way it has melted the other part of North London, maybe. but what it's meant to Arsenal fans is what I was trying to say there. I can't quite remember a transfer or a deal or a player whose story has created such emotional heft. It really is.

4:02Andrew Mangan: Maybe Mikael Silvestre.

4:08I remember you having quite a lot of emotional heft at the time that transfer went through. I immediately went to the toilet and had some emotional heft when Mikhail Sylvester signed. Yes, that's true. No, but sorry to cut across to you because you're right. You're right.

4:25Andrew Mangan: It's a hell of a story, isn't it? It really is. I mean, the interview between Ezra and Ian Wright, which was on the official site yesterday, and I'm sure people have seen it. But if you haven't yet gone and had a look at that, please do, because it is probably the best welcome interview I think I've ever seen. I was told, you know, obviously there was probably some scripted questions provided by the club. But Ian Wright being Ian Wright kind of went his own way with things a bit during that as well. Well, and it turned out beautifully, I think. It really is just very, very heartwarming when you consider the two players, you consider the pathway that they share, the age at which they arrived at Arsenal, Eze's journey from rejection to Queen's Park Rangers to Palace and now to Arsenal coming full circle, and even little small details.

5:29You know, I love the fact that his wife is an ICU nurse. just small things just added layer upon layer of feel-good factor to this. Yeah. I mean, you won't find anybody in football who's got a bad word to say about this player. I really do think that. He is known to be one of football's good guys, nice guys. and I think that little detail about his wife tells you about the kind of background

6:03Andrew Mangan: and the kind of grounding that he has and doubtless that will be one of the things that appealed to Arsenal, I think, his personality. But yeah, it is an incredible story. The content with Ian is amazing. I mean, I think there's such a value, isn't there, in having somebody that a player feels comfortable with in that setting. Yeah. Like they have so much in common and their stories share so much that you're getting a player who's totally relaxed and themselves in that environment. And I don't think we see that very often. No, and that's no slight on the people who do those interviews with, you know, with new players.

6:49I sat down with them. Yeah, of course, of course, yeah. But immediately you've got an Arsenal legend, you know, a beloved Arsenal legend and somebody who I'm sure Eze and lots of other players sort of look up to and see as a kind of an idol. And then, you know, he whips out Thierry Henry on the phone as well. It's like, you know, it's brilliant. They're buoying it at that point in the interview. That's what he said. But yeah, it is very touching.

7:19Andrew Mangan: And like, we do have an enormous amount to talk about because obviously, you know, another big narrative coming out of the game at the weekend was Max Dowman and this precocious 15-year-old making his first team debut and kind of how absurd and extraordinary that is. But there is this kind of poetic aspect of having that alongside Eberich Eze's return, who, when he was just a couple of years younger than Max, his dreams were being dashed. He wasn't the chosen one, necessarily. He wasn't the next big thing. He was being released from the club and having to leave the club that he'd loved his whole life.

8:08And so him returning and him regaining a dream that was lost is like an incredibly powerful thing to observe. And it was very moving, actually, to be in that ground and see him come out and sort of see that recognised by the supporters and see him take that moment in and what it meant. Yeah. It was pretty special, actually. No, I'd say so. And I think, you know, one of the things that occurred to me and people have said to me is the sort of last ditch nature of this because of where he could potentially have gone. When you look at how emotional he was about returning, how connected he immediately feels with the club and the fan base and all of that, that, you know, this isn't just a signing.

9:11It's like a vital rescue mission, you know? But you know what I mean? There's a professional. Saved his soul. Well, yes, something like that. But I mean, maybe you can fill us in a little bit because you did write about this last week in The Athletic. But for people who may not have read it or who aren't subscribers, you know, you report that there was a phone call. He made a phone call to Mikel Arteta on, I think, Wednesday night. We actually have a recording of that phone call. This is what he said. Help.

9:45He dialed 999 and the call went directly through to Mikel Arteta. He was like, yeah. They were like, no, no, no. He's like, emergency. I might have to sign for Spurs. They were like, don't worry. We'll put you straight. We'll patch you through immediately. Don't do anything stupid. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A siren goes off on the top of Tim Lewis's head. Yeah, I think they, I think they, yeah, he did call Mikel. Because they'd had dialogue. They spoke in June when we first were aware of Arsenal's interest. And they had a really good conversation. And I think Mikel was probably pretty keen on the player from that point on.

10:33There were obviously lots of reasons why a deal didn't necessarily progress. In fact, we've got some questions about those, but we might come back to those later. but yeah I think Geuze was probably prepared to sign for Spurs from everything I hear

10:46Andrew Mangan: he recognised that Champions League club was a good step for him in his career but before he did that he needed to know if there was any chance that Arsenal could still happen I think that he explained to Arteta I'm an Arsenal fan so before I commit to this I just need to know that I've asked the question. And his timing was good because Arsenal were in a position where Kai Havertz had had this concerning scan on the Tuesday. They recognised they needed to add something to their attack. They were prepared to do that before selling players, which was a bit of a shift in policy. and the pieces fit together.

11:36Andrew Mangan: And basically within a few hours, Eze knew he'd be joining Arsenal instead of Spurs. Yeah, amazing story. I mean, in his press conference on Friday, Arteta was asked whether it was about the Havertz injury that really forced, not forced Arsenal's hand, but pushed them into making a decision. And he said, we're not reacting to anything. We've been prepared and understand what we could do. we've decided that this is the moment to do it. I mean, look, you can take him at face value. I do think the Havertz situation played a part in this. It would be a hell of a coincidence, is all I would say. Yeah.

12:17But I mean, I'm not complaining, by the way. I'm just... No. No, I think...

12:26Andrew Mangan: Listen, I suspect that it was in Arsenal's mind that if they sold a few players, they might have come back for Eze at some point down the road, potentially. But he might have been a Tottenham player by then. I think what Mikel probably means is this isn't a panic buy in the sense of we've just plucked someone off the shelf. They did their diligence on this player. You know, they did the scouring reports. They did the research into his personality, his private life. they had a conversation with him. They had conversations with Palace to ascertain, you know, the parameters of the deal. And I think that's something Arsenal have done really pretty well this summer.

13:11You know, we've spoken about Andrea Berta spinning plates

13:15Andrew Mangan: and having different deals kind of on the table at the same time and knowledge of being across various different options. And presumably that played into Arsenal's hands in this situation. I think there's also a really good relationship between Palace chairman Steve Parrish and Tim Lewis, who's executive vice chair at Arsenal. I think they were probably able to say, look, where you're at with Spurs, we'll match it. And I think Spurs and Palace had been at loggerheads in recent days over the deal. I mean, it's actually, it's eerily similar to Mikhailo Mudrik in a way where Arsenal had done all the running.

13:58But in doing that running, they developed a bit of an angsty relationship with Shakhtar, who were then more than happy to turn around and sell the player to Chelsea. And I think Palace were pretty happy to do this deal with Arsenal after the experience of negotiating with Daniel Levy for a few weeks. So it all worked in our favour, hopefully, by the way, with a very different outcome to that deal. And yeah, I couldn't be more pleased. I mean, there are things about modern football that can make you a bit cynical or jaded.

14:35Andrew Mangan: But seeing Ebeze back at the Emirates Stadium, slapping that cannon on his chest, knowing that he is an Arsenal player. The thing his family prayed for when he was released 15 odd years ago has become a reality. it's very difficult I would say borderline impossible not to be caught in the emotion yeah you've got to have a heart of stone not to not to feel emotional about it and to see him come out on the pitch and the smile on his face taking it all in that return I think when we did the arse cast on Friday with with Ryan and Musa Musa described him as a man on a mission and I think there's something to that as well you know beyond the extraordinary emotional side of this being an Arsenal fan returning to the club almost joining that lot then getting rescued and coming in and providing everybody with this incredible feel-good sensation right we won 5-0 on Saturday our new striker scored twice our right back scored twice and got an assist and we saw an amazing debut from a 15-year-old, but still it feels like we're just talking about a Bereza, you know, because of what it means.

15:53But I think aside from that, you know, he is 27. He's earned his status in the Premier League with incredible performances for Crystal Palace. And I think there is a sporting side of this as well, which is really interesting, you You know, that he is coming to Arsenal in his prime years and needs to be and wants to be, and we need him to be part of what pushes this team a little bit further than previous iterations of this team have been able to go. So from that perspective as well, I think it's really, really exciting on top of all of the warm feelings we get simply because it happened and the way it happened.

16:40Andrew Mangan: Yeah, there's a huge kind of tactical component to it. I mean, I feel like he seems like an antidote to many of our issues. And I think as well, like the spirit with which he plays the game, you know, this idea that he's conscious that football is entertainment in some way. You know, don't get me wrong. He wants to win, but he wants to do it in style. And I think there is something that many Arsenal fans identify with there or chime with there. You know, I saw a headline and you'll have to forgive me who wrote it. I think it was in the Telegraph. I can't remember who wrote the piece. But it said something like, Ebereze feels like an Arsene Wenger signing more than a Mikel Arteta signing.

17:29And I think there's something really true to that. You know, for those of us who were reared on squads filled with about 12 number 10s, none of which we knew how they would fit into the team. There is something that is kind of vintage Arsenal about this.

17:45Andrew Mangan: And he in this squad maybe is a bit of an outlier in that he is as powerful as he is, as tactically intelligent as he has shown himself to be under Glasner. He's a flair player. He is a flair player and he will bring showmanship to this team. And that's what I get really excited about. I'm like, I can't wait to see this player on the pitch, especially given how driven and how determined he is to make an impact, given everything we've already spoken about. And I know, and when I say I know, I don't mean I know journalistically or as fact necessarily, But I feel in my gut that his story and his desperation to return to Arsenal, to be an Arsenal player, I am convinced will have been a factor in the recruitment decision as well.

18:46Andrew Mangan: If I think about the way Mikel Arteta has spoken about previous signings, phone calls he's had with them, conversations he's had with them, even as recently as Victor Jokeres, the degree to which it was so clear that he wanted Arsenal above all else. I think the likes of Mikel Arteta, Andrea Berta, Tim Lewis, they will have listened to Eze and thought, yes, this is a brilliant footballer, but it's someone arriving with an almost otherworldly degree of motivation. And it's incredibly exciting to think how that might play out. It really is. And like, I know we're sort of speculating a little bit here because we can't really know.

19:31Although I did see Declan Rice say that he and the squad were buzzing at the arrival of Eze. I think as well, we have to recognize that for the players, for the squad, when you look at the games that we've got, when you look at the task that lies ahead this season, I think it's going to be a signing. that lifts everyone internally as well, because we're all feeling amazing about it, right? We've been floating on clouds all weekend or since the end of last week, basically, when we enjoyed the fun side of them not getting him and him coming to us and what that meant, and then the weekend's football and the result and the goals and the performance and then the presentation.

20:19Andrew Mangan: Let me just be clear, that will be funny forever. Oh, yes. No two ways about it. It is. That phone call goes into Arsenal folklore along with Emmanuel Petit's taxi. You know what I mean? Yeah. Help. But, you know, this is, we as fans have been like in sort of cloud cuckoo land, dreamland, if you like, because it's sort of, it's taken the transfer window, which I think generally speaking, most people were really pleased with. It's taken it to a different level. and I think internally as well for the players and for the squad I think that has an impact too you know and I don't want to bring anybody down but but we had the conversations on this podcast where would he play where does Eze play maybe we don't need to worry about that too much maybe we just you know with the injuries that we're we're picking up this season so far maybe we just relax, take it easy and realize that there is going to be room for him in a number of positions.

21:26And I'm fascinated to see, really fascinated to see what his role is going to be over the course of this season and beyond. Yeah, can't wait. Yeah, it really is exciting. So look, we're 20 minutes into a podcast about a game, ostensibly about a game we won 5-0 and we haven't really mentioned that game yet. So shall we pivot to football? I suppose we should. Yes. I suppose we should.

21:53Andrew Mangan: Yes. Arsenal versus Leeds United. Starting line-up, Andrew. Nani Maduweke. Yeah, on the left-hand side. I wasn't surprised. I predicted that in the blog on Saturday morning. I just had a gut feeling he would start Maduweke on the left, and he did. And then the only other decision was about who was going to play left-back, and he stuck with Ricardo Calafuri. And it was an interesting opening to the game where you could see that Leeds didn't come to sit deep and play with a low block. But within about 10 minutes, the way Arsenal dominated possession and territory kind of forced Leeds into that, which as we know has been like our Achilles heel for a little while.

22:43So I did think that was quite an interesting aspect of that first half where I thought we were lively, we were quite bright, didn't really create a lot of chances. There was a couple of shots from Martin Odegaard, one not too far wide. But the way we played force leads into sort of sitting deep and that sort of causes us problems. Yeah, I don't know what you thought of that sort of opening half an hour or so. I thought there was a relatively big moment in our own box I must say

23:14Andrew Mangan: David Raya made a save, was it Strauch's header, is that how you pronounce his name? I'm not entirely sure and there was another moment actually where Raya was hurt wasn't he, at the near post preventing, I think is it Ganoto or Noto? I don't know how to pronounce any of the Leeds players, that's what we're learning here Nonto I think is how you say it Lovely So, you know, they did have a couple of moments. I'm not saying that, you know, that we were under the cosh or anything like it, but those would have definitely changed the dynamic of the game. Yeah, I sort of thought we were okay at the start, good tempo.

23:53Andrew Mangan: I think Odegaard getting hurt as early as he did took a bit of the life out of us. I think that's right, yeah, because he got treatment initially and then went down again and got more treatment. it did look like Ethan Reneri was going to come on and then Odegaard continued and then he went off again. So it did make for a little bit of a stop-start first half or certainly that 15 minutes or so after Odegaard picked up the injury. Yeah, definitely. I mean, as soon as Odegaard first went down, Arteta called Reneri over and it was like a change is going to be made. He played on, obviously, but I don't think he was quite the same.

24:33Andrew Mangan: I mean, there were moments I thought, you know, I remember a couple of moments of Nani Madueke going down the left-hand side and looking a bit of a threat. But ultimately, how did the breakthrough come? I mean, as was the case frequently last season against these low-block teams, it was a set-piece. Yes, a set-piece. I think Calafiori was involved. Down the left-hand side, we won. It could have been Calafiori and Madueke. We won a corner. And look, you know, when you do face these low blocks, there are ways around it. You can produce a moment of magic, some creativity, some craft. You can sort of bulldoze your way through.

25:08Or if you're Arsenal, you find a way through with a set piece. And the consistency of Declan Rice's delivery from the right-hand side, or from that side, rather, taking those corners is, listen, maybe people won't like this, but I would say, and I say this as a real compliment, that it puts me in mind of David Beckham. That is a hell of a compliment, in my opinion. Because Beckham's corners and set piece, like he was a guy, I think, who maybe not the most naturally gifted footballer in the world or most skillful footballer in the world, but somebody who honed his set piece and dead ball ability to an extraordinary level during his career.

25:56I don't think there was anybody who put in corners with more consistency than David Beckham when he was playing. And I would put Rice's delivery in that bracket over the last, you know, 18 months or so, as long as he's been taking corners from that side.

26:11Andrew Mangan: You know, it's interesting. I mean, obviously, I'm sure people would prefer an Arsenal name as comparison, but it's not easy to think of one. I mean, in the last 20 years, do I remember someone who was sort of consistently a great crosser of the ball, Arsenal? I don't think stylistically we've almost been set up for that. Maybe you would say like a Van Persie on set pieces, but I think Rice is perhaps better than that. I agree. Certainly from the corner situations, the degree of consistency is incredible. and you know I guess one change in the starting 11 we didn't mention was Julian Timber coming in from then White was White not in the squad he was absent yeah he was absent completely so yeah really yeah sorry to cut across no no he did really I mean great day for Julian Timber what a day what a day it's a really smart header you know it's it's one of those where it sort of comes at him quite late because it's got to come over a number of heads.

27:15You don't know necessarily if that ball is going to reach you, but you still have to try and react when it does. I think it's a really, really smart header. Great delivery, like huge problems for the Leeds defense and a smart header from Jurian Timber. And that's 1-0 and the game sort of opens up a little bit. Can we talk about, I know it's a great day for Jurian Timber, but can we talk about Declan Rice's role in the second goal as well. How does he make up quite that much ground that quickly? Because, you know, the Leeds guy picks up the ball, the ball breaks in midfield, the Leeds guy picks it up and literally within a second, Rice has made up three, four, five yards to sort of win a tackle, plays it to Zubamendi, Zubamendi to Timber, Timber to Saka, and then Saka smashes it home to make it 2-0.

28:11But I think Rice's, you know, how alert he was and how quickly he reacted to the Leeds player getting on the ball is a perfect illustration of, you know, how if you're caught in possession in your own half, it can very often lead to big, big problems. Absolutely. And something that was focused on a lot after Old Trafford was maybe how Arsenal didn't necessarily capitalize on those moments of transition. transition. This is a slightly different one where Arsenal have won the ball high, but Zubemendy plays a really nice forward pass. I thought basically, actually, that, you know, it's a good time to say it.

28:51I thought the partnership of Rice and Zubemendy was really promising again in this game. And I think it is looking much more like a partnership than maybe many people envisaged. Or maybe the way our team is laid out in the pre-match graphic might lead you to believe. They really do look like they are working in tandem at times. And I think it was a Mendy's pressing as well earlier in the half that created that chance for Victor Jokeres, which, you know, he missed. And the narrative might have ultimately been very different. The second half really turned things around for him. But yeah, nice little move.

29:29Timber is involved, plays the ball down the outside. And we've seen that finish from Bukaya Saka before, haven't we? Yeah, I saw you on the whistle video sort of say the goalkeeper might not be particularly happy. I don't really know what any goalkeeper can do with a shot like that. I know it's close to him, but I think that's what makes it extraordinarily difficult. Like it could smash him in the face and he wouldn't know a thing about it before he got his hands up, you know? And it sort of whistles over his shoulder. the pace and the power of that finish makes it pretty much impossible. So I think it's really all about the finish there.

30:10And you know what? When we score that goal, obviously going in 2-0 up at halftime is a nicer place to be, gives you a bit of a cushion. But I really felt like that was a goal that not only we needed as a team, you know, to score that goal from open play and to score a really good goal as well, It felt like something the team needed after a couple of set-piece goals, but also it really, really felt like something Bakayo Saka needed. Because he came back last season, I don't think he was 100%. I don't know that he could have been 100 % after the injury he had. And getting off the mark this season was going to be really important for him.

30:52So it was a really, really pleasing goal. But that, of course, was compounded, not compounded, but how happy I was for Saka. You know, five minutes into the second half, he goes down with an injury which felt as poorly timed as it can possibly get. Yeah, I think so. I mean, that was the blot on the day, wasn't it, really? the injuries obviously Odegaard went off in an area in the first half and then Saka succumbed to I think what we can probably assume at this stage is a hamstring injury I mean that's what it looked like yeah yeah and there's a report from Sammy Mockbell this morning saying three to four weeks potentially absent you know that that would tally with a kind of grade one hamstring strain um you know i know that it feels like every time our players get a hamstring injury it's six months but historically hamstring you know so you used to say oh that'll be at least three weeks yeah yeah well that's the reporting this morning isn't it that it's going to be three to four weeks yeah so so i think arsenal are relieved by that as an outcome i know that given the fixture list it's far from ideal but I suppose given the injury given the situation last season where Saka had to undergo surgery and miss months and months and months on the sort of range of outcomes it's in the good portion yeah um and I have to say like he is a hugely important player and I I don't for a second uh underestimate like what he offers and

32:39Andrew Mangan: what he brings and how crucial he can be. But for the first time in, I don't know, maybe since Kiyosaka became a regular first-team player, I do feel that Arsenal have built a squad that is equipped to deal with this situation. I mean, this is exactly why we have bought the likes of Nani Madueke, Eberichese. You know, we've got a matchday squad in which Gabriel Martinelli did a single minute at the weekend. That's how much of a stronger position we are in. So I'm not saying we won't feel it, but I feel like we're far better equipped than we ever have been. Yes. Yeah. I mean, you don't want him or Odegaard being injured at all.

33:29But there is some reassurance that the work we've done this summer to build a squad allows us to deal with injury setbacks and injury issues in a far more prominent way than we have been able to in the past. I suppose what we should say is that just before Saka went off, we had a landmark moment, I guess you would call it, when Victor Jokerez scored his first Arsenal goal. and some are saying it's like his trademark goal, but he does enjoy that space, doesn't he, when he can run into it down the inside left channel and drive into the box. He scored a lot of goals like that for sporting. This time it came with a sort of first-time ball over the top of the defense from Ricardo Calafuri.

34:21Jokeres took it on, and it was one of those where you're going, okay, let's see what he can do here. and what he did was drive into the box, step inside and plant the shot into the bottom corner. A really good way for him to get off the mark, no? I think so, yeah. I think so. Especially after what happened in the first half where he did slightly snatch at that chance. And I wasn't watching, obviously, on Sky because I was there, but I gather Gary Neville was kind of chirping away about the sort of need for him to get off the mark. oh listen don't get me started on Gary Neville he was like he was going ah it's only two games whatever but like immediately putting that pressure on him by the way there was a moment in the first half about 10 minutes in 11 minutes in the first half where Leeds switched the ball out to their right hand side and it was Dan James facing up against Ricardo Calafiore and I don't know if he like just lost his mind or forgot to turn his mic off you can hear Gary Neville very clearly in the commentary going go at him go at him it's like what the fuck are you talking about you're you're mentioned you're supposed to hate Leeds properly hate Leeds well he did he got caught on air didn't he the other day did you see that where he thought Sky were on a break and he was talking about the Leeds fans oh really yeah and he was like yeah I'd go nowhere near them they're one set of fans they're the one set of fans in the league honestly oh wow Maybe he's trying to curry favour with the Leeds fans.

35:55Maybe he is. I mean, yeah, he's got a way to claw back. I don't think they're too keen to hang out with him either.

36:04Listen, when you arrive with the fee, the expectation, I think more so, that Jocarez does arrive, there is going to be focus and analysis. And he is in a slightly unfortunate position of having to be the guy because Havertz is out looking very sad on the touchline, slumped over a railing. Oh, God, he did look so sad, didn't he? Yeah, like a very sad, very lanky puppy. And, you know, he's got no choice.

36:36Andrew Mangan: He's having to play himself into match fitness, into adaptation, into an understanding with his teammates. But this goal was a demonstration of what he is capable of. and I think the thing about it that really struck a chord with me was the total single-mindedness. I don't know how many players, and by the way, I don't think it's coincidence that Calafiore plays that pass and it's a first-time pass and it releases him over the top. Like, that's what we have to get better at doing, playing early into space, early into the channels. But I don't know how many Arsenal strikers we've had over the past decade or so would race into that channel, pick the ball up, you know, 30 yards from goal, stuck out on the left and think, I'm scoring here, you know?

37:27Yeah. Like there were several opportunities for him to look up, find a teammate, you know, try and play the pass. It wasn't even in his mind. He thought, I'm going to get past this guy. I'm going to get inside. I'm going to shoot. And he did it. Yeah. So it's that bloody mindedness that I think really adds a different dimension and something we've not had in the front line. Sure. No, I think you're absolutely right. You know, we have been a team which can sometimes overcomplicate matters when we get around the box, that we are looking for that Goldilocks moment, right? It's got to be just right.

38:13Sometimes you need to heat up your own porridge, to put it a weird way, I guess. That's what he did. He heated up his own porridge and finished at the near post. And I think, obviously, it's a huge moment for him because, you know, there is that spotlight. There is that pressure. All of that narrative about how he has to score a goal this weekend. He must score a goal. Otherwise, the pressure will increase and increase and increase. I mean, it's nonsense, but it's also true at the same time, isn't it? Because of the world we live in and the way the media works and, you know, the sort of online narratives, which he appears to be quite aware of when you look at his celebration for the penalty as well, which we might come to, you know, that is there and you can't escape it.

39:04And you can say, well, it's only two games and it took probably better players than Victor Jokeres more time to get off the mark for Arsenal. and it turned out all right for them. But at the same time, when that spotlight has been on you all summer and you've been brought in as this, the answer to Arsenal's goal-scoring problems, the sooner you can lift that burden, the better. And I think he made that happen. You know, he had plenty of work to do. When you look at where he picked up the ball and where he finished from, he still had work to do. You know, this wasn't a tap-in. It wasn't, you know, a right place, right time, finish at the back post.

39:39He did that work himself. And yeah, it was a big moment. And obviously the game from that point was pretty much won. We got the fourth goal, Jurian Timber again, a good corner from Declan Rice. Leeds didn't deal with it properly. And it's 4-0 after about, what, 60 minutes? Which of course then, yeah, 58 minutes, I think, 56 minutes when we scored that goal. So it's 4-0. Game's won. Everybody knows the game has won. And Mikel Arteta then, knowing that he only has one more opportunity to make changes, by the way. Yeah, because he had to make two enforced. Two enforced substitutions. So there was only one more substitution slot, for want of a better word.

40:25He made a triple change on the hour mark or just after the hour mark where we saw Miles Lewis-Gelly, Christian Mosquera come on for his debut, and eye-catchingly 15-year-old Max Downman come on for his debut. Game State, I think, played a significant part in allowing Arteta to give Downman that much time, right? I think so. I mean, it was interesting. So he was with the squad at Old Trafford, but not selected. And I watched him kind of, he was on the touchline in trainers. He had a couple of Arsenal heavies around him on the touchline and he was watching the training session. And he looked every inch a kind of frustrated teenager.

41:17Do you know what I mean? He was like, oh man, like, you know, he was watching, but he was sort of like not watching, you know, fiddling with his hair. You could tell he was desperate to be involved. And then obviously before the game this weekend, there was a bit of buzz around that maybe he was going to be named on the bench.

41:35Andrew Mangan: A couple of injuries helping his case, I suppose, in that respect. But I think Mikhail Teta probably had it in his mind. If we're in a good position, you know, it would be appropriate to reward him for the progress he's made and what he's shown in pre-season. And a much, how can I put it, healthier place to make a debut maybe than an away game at Old Trafford on the opening weekend. Very high stakes, very hostile potentially. But even so, for all his ability, for all his talent, we mustn't lose sight of how extraordinary it is that Mikel Arteta, who is trying to win a Premier League title and knows that every goal could be precious in that pursuit would turn to a 15-year-old.

42:29Yeah, and let's remember as well, as you said, Gabriel Martinelli was on the bench, didn't get off the bench. You know, Mikel Marino on the bench. You know, he didn't get off either. There are going to be some senior players who I'm sure are delighted for Max Downman and can see the talent and the potential, but who internally are probably smarting a bit at that decision, you know, because they want to play. Everyone wants to play. And I think what was really interesting about it was the enthusiasm, because everybody knows the story. And, you know, whenever he got the ball, there was like, there was a buzz, wasn't there?

43:03There was a bit of a murmur of hope and expectation that he might do something, he might produce something. There were a couple of shots. One, I think, went wide, one went over. but there was this sort of will, collective will from 60 ,000 people in that stadium for Max Diamond to produce something. Tangible, end product, goal, assist. As it turns out, what he produced was a penalty for Arsenal and a piece of skill inside the box. He was fouled. He went down. The referee pointed to the spot. and, you know, it is, I suppose, a continuation of what he's done throughout pre-season in that he came off the bench and had a positive impact.

43:47Yeah, absolutely. Listen, I don't want to go overboard in terms of his performance. I was a little bit surprised after the game, like at Sky's coverage of it and like the degree to which they were sort of laying on the height. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised. No. But I just think the very fact that he was playing is really the extraordinary thing here. And the courage with which he played. You know, the first thing he did pretty much on the field was kind of dribble inside and take a shot on. You so often see 18, 19-year-old players when they make that breakthrough deferring to teammates. and it's just mad to see a 15 year old not doing that and thinking now i'm going to take this on actually i mean the degree of confidence is sort of supernatural um that that's something arteta mentioned after the game because he said something about you can tell the way the other players react to him because they give him the ball all the time yeah and i think rice really tried to give him a goal i think at one point in the game as well he did yeah i saw people actually talking about well Were you a bit upset about Jacarez not giving the ball to Max Downman for the penalty?

45:05And no, I absolutely was not upset. But there was that level. I watched that exchange. I was like, because basically the penalty was awarded, potentially generously, I would say. But anyway, no complaints. And we, Declan Rice immediately picked the ball up. And this was minutes after Declan Rice had sort of embarked on a 30-yard run and then tried to set up Max Downman. And I thought, is Rice going to kind of pull rank and give that ball to Daumann in a sort of sentimental maybe decision? And it was never really an option. I mean, Jokeres was over to him pretty quickly. You could see in Jokeres' eyes almost that they lit up at this possibility of a second goal.

45:50He doesn't really miss penalties. And he had that hair celebration in the locker as well that he had to get out. I actually think it is important. It's more important for Jokeres to score a goal there than it is for Max Dowman. It would have been nice for Max Dowman. It would have been nice for everybody. But I think it's important for Jokeres because there is this level of expectation on him. And, you know, strikers are judged by their output. You know, they can be all kinds of things. But if you don't score enough goals or if you're perceived not to score enough goals, then that is something that's going to be, you know, an issue for you.

46:31Are you going to be criticized for that? So I do think it was important. We had a question. Actually, I thought this was quite funny from the Discord. Craggy88. He said, how were James's nerves with Jokarez on the penalty instead of Saka? We know he wasn't the most confident with Starboy taking the penalties. This was an emphatic finish from the spot from Victor Jarko, is that right? Yeah. He's got a kind of firm, again, not a comparison people will love, but a sort of Harry Kane technique on them, hasn't he, where he just puts his foot through it, puts it right in the corner. Nerves, well, it was 4-0 by then.

47:08So nerves were pretty low, not really registering. But I do think that's got something to do with the taker. If Saka is going to be out for a few weeks now, who knows? Maybe Max Down comes on and wins us another penalty sometime soon. And if Jokovic scores a couple, you know, it'll be hard to get him off those duties, I would say. But yeah, I think it was really important for him. Really important. And I think maybe that bit of mischief in his celebration showed that he was relaxing a bit. The reference for people who don't get it, there was stuff going around online, you know, probably from some absolute wanker Twitter banter account.

47:49which said that Jacarez had more touches of his hair than the ball at Old Trafford. And this was him giving a bit back in that regard. Whether it's healthy for him to be that online, I don't know, but... I think most of them are, to be honest. I know, they're young men and yeah, this is the world we live in, so... They've got social media, so they've got access to it. And yeah, I think it's unavoidable to a certain extent. But I was pleased and relieved for him. I think, I don't think it would be right to be like, well, case closed. He's going to win the Golden Boot and it's all going to be fine and amazing.

48:27In the same way that I think it'd be wrong after Old Trafford to be like, oh, there's an issue here. There's a problem. I think that there's really positive signs, but there's clearly still a bit of a way to go, I think, in terms of him and the team kind of meeting, meshing stylistically.

48:45Andrew Mangan: But if you score in two goals while that adaptation process is ongoing, I think we're in a good place. Averaging a goal a game now. Exactly. You know? And also maybe worth saying that like, I think a lot of his critics maybe looked at this sort of game against a deep block as one where he might have issues, where he might be, you know, it's not like he's a high touch player. It's not like he's getting involved in a ton of buildup or anything like it. Sure. But in these games, when the margins are fine, when the chances are maybe few and far between, he can be lethal enough to take them. And he was.

49:26So a really good day for him. And Max Dowman, he's got the best part of a season to break that youngest goal scorer record for the Premier League. So he's got time on his side. Time is on his side. Yeah, that tends to happen when you're 15. You've got time on your side. I kept thinking, what must it be like for the lad who was playing left back for Leeds.

49:50Andrew Mangan: What was his name? I think he's Icelandic. Gudmundsson. Gudmundsson. I think he's like mid-20s, but like it must be fucking surreal to be like, okay, I'm up against a child now and he's pretty good. Yeah. Like it must be a weird combination of emotions, of sort of, yeah, it must be a very, very odd experience. Yeah, I think you, you know, in that situation, you probably want to use your seniority, if that's the right way of putting it, you know, your physicality as a grown man to sort of remind this kid, you know, where you are, where you're playing and what the level is. And there was one moment, wasn't there, where Downwind just sort of ran beyond him or they were in a race together.

50:43The guy ended up getting booked. I think it was probably a bit harsh to get booked for that. But, you know, physically, he was not able to bully Max Downwind, even if you could see that there was a physical gap between the two, right? Yeah. It's interesting because like in the crowd in the North Bank, like every time Max was fouled or brought down, fans were all sort of shouting he's a kid mate what's wrong with you which was quite a fan he's a child leave him alone which was very enjoyable like with a heavy sort of very much of a tongue in cheek sure sure sure sure yeah a great day for Max Dam and obviously a debut an impactful debut at that part of a 5-0 win two goals for Jokeres two goals for Timber an assist for Timber as well.

51:39So a really, really good day for him. Obviously, if Timber had been on the pitch, he would have taken the penalty, right? Well, maybe, who knows? I doubt it. I doubt Yaccaraz would have let him. Again, goal's not quite as important for right-backs. I mean, Mosquera came on, looked very comfortable. So that's good. He's got his debut. At right-back as well, which isn't really something we,

51:58Andrew Mangan: you know, we saw it in pre-season, but when he was signed, not many were saying, oh, he's also right-back cover. So I think that's quite an interesting dimension to Muscara. Potentially, you know, shades of Tomiyasu touching wood that there are no similarities in terms of injuries. I did want to just mention, by the way, it's kind of understandable that he's flown under the radar a bit, given everything else that was going on on the day with the players we've mentioned and the debut for Dowman and the Eze stuff happening around him. But I really liked Ethan Wenaire's performance when he came on from Art Nodegaard.

52:40Clearly, this is the plan now for him is to not deputize necessarily, but that's the role that they're looking for. Because I was wondering when Odegaard went down, I was going, who will they bring on? Might he bring Trossard on and shift things around a little bit? You never quite know. Could he bring Marino on? that wouldn't have surprised me massively but I was glad to see Weneri get the nod and I thought while not necessarily spectacular I thought it was a really really tidy and efficient performance from Ethan Weneri, he didn't misplace a single pass, I thought he kept it moving quite nicely, grew into the game in the second half and I think, you know, I don't want to say he's been outshone by a 15 year old at the you know the ancient age of 18 but I think we forget he is just 18 and he's asked to come on and play a very specific role I thought he did it really really well yeah uncles Ethan and Miles

53:40Andrew Mangan: to young Max Denalman I thought it was really good and I thought it was significant that that he was entrusted with that role you know a year ago we lost Odegaard for best part of two months and Ethan wasn't really getting those minutes right and it would have been easy for Arteta to bring on Mikel Moreno say if not necessarily a complete stylistic match I've seen him do things like that before or even Leandro Trossard but they gave Ethan his chance and he was good he was good so yeah I think that was a big day for him as well Well, I mean, listen, it was a good day all round, Andrew. I think, you know, Riccardo Calafiore's performance was interesting again.

54:29Andrew Mangan: He had something really unique, I think, to this team. Zubimendi looked a bit more settled. Didn't have the splats before the game, so that's probably a good thing. That does help. That does help. We saw Madueke being used on the left. front to back it was a good day with the injuries maybe being the only thing you'd say worked against us yes of course of course would you say maybe it was a great day I think I might Andrew ok well why don't we enjoy what was a great day as we go into part 2 we'll come back with your questions and more in part 2 right after this

55:19It's a great day.

55:45Thank you.

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57:32Welcome back to the ArseCast Extra. This is part two of the show where we answer the questions that you send to us on bluesky at gunnerblog.bsky.social and at arseblog.com. Also on the Arseblog Discord chat server, which you get access to if you are an Arseblog member on Patreon. James, before we get into the questions, it appears that there is some breaking transfer news. I kind of thought after signing Eze that we were done. We're finished. We shot our load. That's as much as we had in the coffers. Turns out, I could be wrong, and it also turns out that we could be signing another player at the expense of a certain Tottenham Hotspur.

58:19It's possible. It's so funny, by the way. Less than a week ago, I think it was Tuesday, I did the story about Leandro Trossard's contract being amended. Oh, yeah. I hope you're happy with yourself having decided that. Received a flurry of responses from people saying, well, that's it. Checkbook closed, I guess. Thanks for that, McNicholas, you fucker. Yeah. And yet here we are with Eze in the bag.

58:52Andrew Mangan: Potentially one more. And by the way, a top Irish prospect. Yes. On his way to us too. From Shamrock Rovers. Can't join until 2027 because of the new rules or the rules that have been in place because of Brexit. So well done, everybody there. But there you go. Yeah, that's going to be an interesting one. Make Arsenal Irish again, right? Yeah, that's it. That's it. That's what we've got to do. But anyway, so the big news is about Piero Incapier. I hope I'm pronouncing that right and pronouncing the word pronouncing right. That would be good. so if Arsenal are able to sell Jakob Kivior most likely to Porto then they are going to try and move for Pierre-Eincapier it's a player they've looked at for quite a long time he's at Bayer Leverkusen he is a left-sided defender who can play at left-back and centre-back by all accounts a top player really, really good player Spurs have indeed He'd been looking at him for most of the summer and were reported to be in talks as recently as today, I think, by Fabrizio Romano.

1:00:10Arsenal really like him. He's got a 60 million euro release clause.

1:00:15Andrew Mangan: Arsenal would want to pay less, unsurprisingly. But, you know, sometimes it doesn't work out like that. I mean, they wanted to pay less for Eze and they ended up paying basically the same value as the clause.

1:00:30Andrew Mangan: I'll just ask you for your reaction to that news. I mean, are you surprised to hear that? Slightly surprised, slightly surprised, but I kind of understand it as well because, you know, as much as I like Califuri and I really do like Califuri, is there the track record with injuries that gives you pause for thought in that regard? Yeah. I mean, it does give us a very, very strong squad defensively. If you look across the back line, you've got Saliba, Gabriel, Mascara, Ben White, Jürgen Timber. We have versatile players. Timber, of course, can play at centre half and also has played at left back.

1:01:18Louis Skelly, Calafiore, Incapier, who would he become the first Ecuadorian to ever play for Arsenal?

1:01:26Andrew Mangan: I think very possibly. Can't think of another. I'm going to ask a search engine, but it'll probably just give me some kind of nonsense of what they do. Yeah, I mean, it would be... I just asked Google, have Arsenal had an Ecuadorian player? And this is the reply that Google's AI overview has provided, right? Yes, Arsenal have had Ecuadorian players, with forward Carlos Vela being the first. AI is taking over, guys. Carlos Vela, that famous Ecuadorian. Don't tell the people of Mexico. They'd be devastated to hear that, all this time he was actually from Ecuador. Yeah, I mean, our squad would be sort of monstrously big, I would say, and deep at that point in time.

1:02:25I mean, Kivio was an unused sub, wasn't even on the bench, I think I'm right in saying, at Old Trafford.

1:02:31Andrew Mangan: Correct. When Ben White was fit. And Nkappie is kind of a top-level defender. I mean, he's won the Bundesliga with Leverkusen. He's an international. He is a starting quality player. I would compare it, if we were to do the deal, I would compare it to when we had Ben White and we bought Jurian Timber. Like, or arguably, you know, several of the signings we've done this summer, having Kai Havertz and buying Victor Yokras or whatever it might be. Like, you're adding another first choice level, tier one, to use the terminology, player. And he wants to come. That's the other aspect to all this. They all do.

1:03:20They want to come. Yeah, I heard actually, I heard he rang Mikel Arteta last night. And this is a recording of the phone call he made. Help! When he heard Tottenham were interested. He's got limited English, but he knows that word. Ayúdame! Yeah.

1:03:41Andrew Mangan: So, I mean, Matt, I mean, if Arsenal signed this player too, that would be what, eight signings? Eight first team signings? I remember Sammy Mockbell writing an article at the start of the summer saying that we were looking potentially at an unprecedented summer. And there was a point last week where people were screen grabbing that rather cruelly. You know what I mean? Which I think would have been a bit unfair given the six signings anyway. Sure. But if they do this deal too, I mean, that will truly have been unprecedented. I don't remember anything quite like that in my time covering Arsenal or perhaps even as an Arsenal fan.

1:04:25Andrew Mangan: Yeah. Sammy Muckbell can screenshot the screenshots. Yeah, he can rest easy. Just fill up his fucking online bullets. Take that, you cunt. He's too good a man to do that, I suspect. Maybe privately. I'll encourage him. But I think, yeah, it would be a great signing. It would be hilarious to beat Spurs. But I mean, I can tell you now, I've just had a text from a Spurs fan friend of mine saying, James, you have enough defenders. Please leave us alone. So for that reason alone, I hope it happens. Absolutely. I just text him back. Just no mercy. That's all you text back. I mean. It's not a hijack.

1:05:12It's rescue operation. Yeah, that's it. So, yeah, let's see how that one plays. out. It surely means obviously the departure of Jakub Kivior. He needs to go and play and if he's going to be that far down the pecking order now with another arrival, then there's no choice for him, but I think the best thing for him to do is to leave.

1:05:37Andrew Mangan: This deal won't happen unless Kivior goes. That's what I would say. It's one in, one out. And I think probably I imagine financially if nothing else, Arsenal have to secure Kivio's exit before they can progress. Yeah, talk of a loan to Porto with an obligation. That would count, I think, within FFP terms as a sale this year if there's an obligation in the deal. So that would be viable, perhaps. What else could happen? Like players who weren't on the bench this weekend included Rhys Nelson, Alexander Zinchenko, Fabio Vieira, Albert Sambi-Lukonga, Carl Hain, by the way, has left. He's joined Werder Bremen on loan, I think.

1:06:27It's a loan, yeah. Yeah, it's a loan deal. But there is still work for Andrea Berta to do in terms of outgoings. And look, I could be wrong, but it also feels a bit like outgoings are not just necessary for those players and to sort of trim the squad a little bit. But financially, you know, if this goes through after the Eza deal, you're probably looking at a summer of what, north of 300 and something million pounds from an Arsenal perspective. I know it's not all gone out in one big chunk, but that's the commitment that Arsene have made to these transfers. You know, when you add up all those signings from Zubimendi through to Incapié, if he arrives, then you're looking at something in the region of 300 million pounds or maybe more.

1:07:21So to balance the books, you know, is it a case maybe Arsene are doing like three transfer windows worth of business in one window?

1:07:34Andrew Mangan: I don't know about that I mean Arsenal had a pretty even net spend last year didn't they where they actually had quite a good year in terms of sales I imagine that gave them some flexibility famously they didn't buy anyone in January Andrew or infamously I should say so I don't know I know that they've gone out on a limb this summer I mean this is huge expenditure lavish expenditure I would say on a scale we've not really seen before and you know it's pretty clear to me that Arsenal feel that this is their moment this is their time to step forward and take that final step of winning things credit to them as a fan because they've kind of been as good as their word in that respect you know I think there were some programme notes from Josh Kroenke at the end of last season about the ambitions.

1:08:35I think Mikkel Arteta spoke after that final Southampton game about having goosebumps at what Arsenal might be able to do in the market. And I think those words feel justified right now. So big credit to them on that front. Are there going to be repercussions down the line? Potentially. my own feeling is that yeah Arsenal need to get those players that you mentioned out of the squad I mean it's an unwieldy squad at this point in time it is too big I would say we need to shed some of those players do I have much confidence we'll achieve the fees we would like on them with a week or so to go not massively not massively I feel like, maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like the advantage is with the buying clubs at this point.

1:09:27No, that's true. Particularly at this point in the window. They know we need to ship them. Yeah, of course. So if you're a buying club, you're going to go to Arsenal and try and get the best deal possible for yourself. And that's just kind of the way it goes. And I also think it's kind of the way it goes with players of that profile. You know, with the Rhys Nelsons and Zinchenkos and Sambi Lukongas of the world. There isn't a huge, huge market for them. So it's inevitable that it is going to go to the final week of the window, which is where we are. It closes on September 1st, which I think is next Monday.

1:10:03Is that right? Yes. Yes. So there you go. So we'll see what happens. I have a question, though, because we've got to get to our questions. This one is from the Discord from MiniShadow5. Again, I watched your video. I like sometimes to try and, you know, read between the lines of what you say. And when you mentioned Gabriel Martinelli in that video, a little part of me kind of went, ooh. So Mini Shadow 5 says, do you think Martinelli will be sold? I don't think he will. but do I think Arsenal would sell him if a good offer materialised in the final week of the window? Quite possibly. I mean, whether the Saka injury changes that at all, I don't know.

1:11:00But I haven't, you know, I've said all summer really and I think others have said it too that Arsenal would kind of entertain interest in Martinelli and that they were open to sort of renewing their options on the left-hand side. I mean, I'll ask you, he didn't get off the bench on Saturday. Is that just a consequence of the injuries that we suffered?

1:11:29Andrew Mangan: Do you think there's any sort of message there? Does it say something about his place in the pecking order or is it just coincidence? Maybe a little bit of coincidence. As we said, the game state was really made it easy for Mikel Arteta to bring on Max Dowman. What if that game is 1-1 with 30 minutes to go or 20 minutes to go? Does he bring on Max Dowman or does he bring on Gabriel Martinelli? And I suspect he would probably bring on Gabriel Martinelli because he's the more senior option. I just think the injuries we suffered and the fact that we were 4-0 up allowed him to, A, make two protective changes, which I think in Calafuri and Timber, we have to recognize that those were two changes where those players are being managed with those substitutions, right?

1:12:18because Ben White's out, Timber, as Arteta alluded to in his press conference before the game, they were managing him. He wasn't part of the training on the open day last week. So they're managing his return from ankle surgery at the start of the summer. So those two changes were protective to bring on Mosquera and to bring on Lewis Skelly. Great changes to have, which meant he had one change that he could sort of do what he wanted with. And in that circumstance, I think the right thing to do was bring on Max Dowman, to give him his debut, because it was a low-pressure situation. In as much as playing a Premier League game at 15 can be low pressure, but it wasn't a case that he was being brought on to try and rescue a game for us.

1:13:06I think if that game was in the balance, I don't think Dowman comes on. So it's just a consequence of what had happened earlier in the game and the fact we needed to manage Timber and Calafiori. And it was just a nice moment for Daman. So I didn't read anything into the fact Martinelli didn't come off the bench as a sort of message, we don't want you, you know, start looking elsewhere. I didn't really see it like that. I just think it was a question of circumstance. I mean, he literally started, you know, six days earlier at Old Trafford. So, yeah, I think he still has a place in the plans. If you ask me for a dark horse bet, you know, on like a surprise development in the window, it would be maybe a Martinelli sale.

1:13:56But the reason I say I don't think it'll happen is I just don't know where it'd come from. There's not been sufficient interest really in him this summer. Bayern Munich had a sniff, but ultimately went for Luis Diaz. There was some talk of Aston Villa, but they've got big issues with PSR that I think would severely limit their ability to buy him. So I don't quite see it happening, but yeah, it would be my sort of outside bet.

1:14:22Andrew Mangan: Okay. And I do think that sooner or later down the line, I mean, Arsenal are going to have to sell some players who have real value. surely like yeah you can't keep uh just selling players who you don't want like players not very much money yeah like maybe kivu is a slight example of that where he's a player that arson would be happy to keep but you know the the way the summer has played out and what he wants means okay we'll we'll sell this guy plus it means michael arteta gets to do the thing that he loves to do the most which is sign a left back it's interesting as well like a lot of people there was some chat online i saw some buzz about a left back um over the last few days a lot of people were expecting maybe an overlapper do you know what i mean like a traditional fullback um because they were envisaging maybe as it plays on the left wing and then he's going to go inside so do you need someone to go outside whereas this guy is more of a i guess he's more of a kiwi or calafiore type he's kind of a an inverter well interestingly i just saw lewis mention um on blue sky he just said one thing i would say for in capier is an option at left back he's more likely to hold the width and overlap than the players we currently have so maybe well there you go so maybe I'm making that assumption based on the fact he plays center half you know but yeah Lewis will know better than me from watching the the Bundesliga so he says it might suit the idea of Eze playing on that flank if you're playing with this guy but listen it'll all come out in the wash it will um I do wonder as well like having lost as a like how how hard might Spurs push on this one?

1:16:22You know what I mean? Like how high might they drive that prize? Don't know. Don't know. I don't, you know. When a player generally gets what they want. So you have to assume we've got a good chance, but it's going to be interesting.

1:16:40Andrew Mangan: And yeah, the next few days should be busy. obviously there's the incapia thing but outgoings there is a lot of work to be done for sure

1:16:55Andrew Mangan: questions questions what have I got here Adam Martin, Ellie questions same as you I thought this was for Nathan who said should match day squad sizes increase from 20 to 22 with the sheer number of games in the modern schedule two in each position is required yet there is always discourse around those that miss a matchday squad it seems unfair on the player and the club i mean it's gone from five to seven to nine then you ask the question like well if you can have how many do you get on the bench in europe 12 is that right so what's the difference yeah why why do you get more in europe than domestically Is it because of travel?

1:17:43I don't know. I don't know, you know.

1:17:45Andrew Mangan: I don't know. I mean, it's the same international football, isn't it? You get a ton of subs. Yeah. I suppose if it's a squad game, what I would say is like, if it's nine, it might as well be 11. You know what I mean? Sure. It ain't five anymore. It's basically everyone else who's fit is on the bench. Except in Arsenal's case, because our squad is so big. We'd still have five or six, not in the squad at all. So, yeah, I would support that. I think that that's how the game has changed. It's no longer about the first team and a few replacements. It's just a 22 or 25-man game. Yeah, I mean, you are mandated to provide a 25-man squad, so it's not as if clubs will be scratching around.

1:18:36It's not that it's more beneficial to, well, some people might say it's more beneficial to, you know, the big clubs who can stockpile a lot of talent. But, you know, it is a squad game and every squad, every team has 25 players named on the Premier League website. So why shouldn't they be involved? So I don't, I would have no issue with it either. But I don't know how it changes or who would petition for that change to take place. managers might just as a way of ensuring everybody stays happy what's worse not being named in the squad at all or being named in the squad and not coming off the bench for a player what do you

1:19:15Andrew Mangan: think i think a lot of time they're expected to be there anyway so i think they'd rather be on the bench okay and rather have a chance because also like what if there's an injury in your position You know, you never know. It also creates the opportunity to have maybe a couple of academy players in there later in the season when injuries inevitably bite. I just think the degree of investment that the club are doing in having such a complete and deep squad, it would be to our advantage. I would say that. Sure. If we were allowed to have more of them on the bench. It would help us sustain a squad of that size.

1:19:53Okay. All right. We've got a couple of questions about injuries, both from the Discord. Schwa says, what do we need to sacrifice to which god in order to remove this unrelenting injury curse? And Alex, in a slightly more prosaic way, says, I can't help but feel like the Arsenal curse has carried through to this season. Havertz, Saka, Odegaard, all out. Ben White, too. Don't forget, he missed the game at the weekend. Why are we so unlucky with injuries? Do we need a new physio? a new physio will fix everything I imagine but that's it you know and of course we sacrificed the old one to the dark gods I think is it coincidence do you think that when you look at the players who've been injured in the early part of this season you've got Ben White you've got Kai Havertz

1:20:45Andrew Mangan: you've got Bakayi Saki you've got Martin Odegaard they're all guys who missed significant periods last season I think maybe it is maybe it is coincidence Maybe not, but I mean, yeah, it's easy to sort of draw a through line there. Yeah, I feel like Odegaard, maybe, like that was a long time ago, his absence, and it's completely unrelated. Saka and Havertz, you know, they're both in this year, hamstring surgeries, big rehab. I think that's well within the realms of possibility that there's a connection there, that there's a bit of a hangover from those previous injuries. just players getting used to regular competition again, what that does to their body.

1:21:34Andrew Mangan: Is it a curse? I don't know. I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong, Andrew. Maybe I'll be proven to be wrong. I am more relaxed about these absences than I would have been at any point previously because of the degree of depth we have. And if Bakai Saka is being sort of sensibly set to one side for a few weeks, but it means he'll be able to contribute in the longer term over the course of the season, I think even given the difficulty of some of the fixtures we face, that is worthwhile.

1:22:14Andrew Mangan: And I'm not saying we couldn't use Saka at Anfield next weekend, but I think we have enough to go there and get a result without him at this point in time. And I'm not sure I would have said that last season. Yeah. I'm just looking at the sort of, there's a Premier League injury, premierinjuries.com, there's an injury table there and there are six players on the list for Arsenal who are being looked at because Christian Norgard, by the way, is injured as well. He missed the first two games. games and Gabriel Jesus is a longer term injury. So there are six players on this table from an Arsenal perspective.

1:22:57White, Havert, Saka, Odegaard, who we've just mentioned. And I'm just looking across all the other teams. Brentford have six, Burnley seven, Chelsea six, Palace six, Manchester City seven, Sunderland seven, Tottenham eight. They obviously deserve more, but you know it we're not a complete outlier in Premier League terms when it comes to the amount of injuries that we are are dealing with at this moment in time so I don't know maybe Arsenal have looked at it Mikel Arteta spoke about looking at it last season didn't he they're going to have to investigate your why it happened or why these injuries have happened but I suppose the best way as you say to be able to deal with injuries is to have a squad that's big enough to cope when you lose important players do you have the quality the numbers first of all but then the quality of player to be able to step in and do a job and I think you're right you know this season more than any other season I can remember if we were missing Saka Havertz Odegaard and Ben White two years ago or 18 months ago, we would be in very, very big trouble going to Anfield.

1:24:17And I'm not saying it's not going to have an impact, but I don't feel as panicky as I would if this had happened last season or the season before. And that's because of how we've built the squad. So it's up to the players who are going to come in to take their chances and to show what they can do. This is an opportunity. This is how it's going to work throughout this season when players are injured. We need others to step up, and it is a chance for them to come in and show what they can do.

1:24:46Andrew Mangan: Here's another transfer marketee salesy question from Sammy, who says, Goodly morning, gents. On James' On The Whistle podcast. It's not a podcast, actually, but it's not a bad idea. He mentioned Arsenal potentially listening to offers for two out of three unused outfield subs. Give your word on Martinelli. What about the third, Mikel Marino? It's hard to see his position in the squad. And you'd have to guess that if Eze had been available and Norgaard fit, he wouldn't have even made the bench. Given his age, it feels like it would be difficult to offload him if we don't do it this window, unless we're keeping him to be our backup striker.

1:25:23Andrew Mangan: And to be honest, I think that might be a big part of it at this point in time. Yeah, I don't see. I can see exactly who asked the question. Sammy. Sammy. Not Sammy Mockbell. It doesn't say that it's Sammy Mockbell, just it's Sammy. Okay. All right. Sammy Mockbell in disguise. I can see where he's coming from completely, but I also think you have to look at the context. He only arrived at Arsenal last summer. I think he's very happy at Arsenal. You know, he seemed very pleased to be there. He seems like a really nice guy as well, a very popular guy around the squad. we can talk about injuries and depth and i think he gives you that in a couple of positions you know um central midfield um he can be a guy who can play up top as we know another option up there if you you know let's say if we've got an efl cup game if kai havertz is not back we don't really want to play victor jokeres in in games like that i suppose you know um this is where you want to use the full extent of your squad.

1:26:30So he could fit in there. I don't see, unless there is an offer, a decent offer from somewhere, I don't see him moving at all, despite the fact his chances might well be limited and are probably more limited now that Eze has come in. But I don't see him wanting to move. And actually, I don't see Mikel Arteta wanting to sell him either. Do you?

1:26:53Andrew Mangan: No, I don't see it. and I understand the question. I think certainly in the long term, you know, you can debate, you know, what his role in the squad will be. But I'd ask you this, and I know it's not something any of us want to contemplate. If Victor Jokerez picks up an injury this week, who's playing centre-forward against Liverpool? I think it's Mikel Marino. Yeah, him or Trossard, I think. Yeah. And I think given the success of the Mourinho experiment last season, I think there's a very, very good chance it would be him. I think, you know, Arsenal knew they had to do something when Havertz was injured.

1:27:35Well, they've bought a player in Eze who potentially frees up Mourinho, frees up Trossard to be those kind of supplementary strikers. I don't think with such a lack of clarity over the timescale for Kai Havertz

1:27:50Andrew Mangan: that Arsenal can let him go. No. Maybe if you were offered a real, you know, if someone came in and said his 40 or 50 million for Mikel Marina, obviously, I think you've got to take it. But is that happening? I'm not sure I see that. So I think he'll be here after the window closes for sure. What about this one when we're talking about strikers? A slightly forgotten man, even though I mentioned him just a couple of minutes ago. D Smith 421 on the Discord says, Gabriel Jesus posted yesterday that he's back out on the grass, working out and building fitness. Does James have any timeline for his actual return?

1:28:26All going well. And do you guys think there's a way back into contention for him by the end of the season? Because there is a player, I know, who's been really, really badly affected by injuries, but as another striker option, and certainly somebody who can play on the wings as well when he is fit, Gabriel Jesus ticks those boxes. So he's probably still a little bit away from making a return. But yeah, what do you think the future holds for Gabriel Jesus? It is the final year of his contract, I think. I'm not sure if he got four or five years when he signed from Man City. But...

1:29:05Andrew Mangan: Not sure. I'd have to check that, actually. I'll have a look at transfer marked while you're talking. I think it was maybe five. But... Yeah, 27. 2027. 27, yeah. I have been, I don't know if guilty is the right word, because I think this was sort of the right thing to do, but I've been guilty of kind of forgetting about Gabriels Etus in my thoughts about squad building and squad composition. To the extent that when I saw his social media post yesterday of him doing work out on the training pitch, I almost did a double take, you know. It's kind of that thing of like, oh, yeah, that guy. I forgot about him, yeah.

1:29:46Andrew Mangan: Yeah. I think he'll probably be targeting. I mean, when are the early rounds of the Carabao Cup? He might, you know. September, yeah. Yeah, first involvement in that or second involvement in that. If we go through, he'll probably be looking at that and thinking that could be a chance for him. He might have a role to play. I mean, I just asked you, you know, who's our second choice number nine at this point in time? and currently it's two guys, neither of whom you say are necessarily a number nine. So he's got an opportunity, especially if Kai Havertz turns out to be absent for kind of, you know, on the longer side of fears currently.

1:30:31Andrew Mangan: So, yeah, I think of him as a bonus player. Let's put it like that. But he's another player who in your conversations about squad size and who gets on the bench and the 25-man squad rule and max 17 non-homegrown players, he's another player that you have to factor in. Because I think he's certainly another player that will be here September 2nd. I think he is probably in and around the period where he can start thinking about playing again. because it's normally about nine months, somewhere between nine and 10 months when a player. Yeah. Mid-January went down, right? Mid-January. So you're looking at mid-September as the nine-month period.

1:31:20And then it's sort of around that time where they start to make their tentative steps, you know, to a comeback. I remember doing a post on Ars blog, looking at all the cruciate injuries that we had with Bellerin, Holding, Chambers was another one, wasn't he? Elneny, I think. And there was a sort of an average number of days there or thereabouts. Some players are a little bit closer or a little bit sooner. Some players a little bit beyond that. I'll have to look it up and see exactly how many days that was. But it does strike me that Jesus is around or certainly coming up to that period where maybe he gets a run out for the under-21s.

1:32:03and then starts to make his way back into full contact training and that kind of stuff. So yeah, I don't really see him moving between now and the end of the window. It would be quite atypical, wouldn't it, for a club to have a player of his seniority and his stature suffer an injury like that and then just sort of move them on. And you could make the argument maybe a loan move somewhere for six months might be the way for Gabriel Jesus to go because he might not play that much given the state of the squad. But maybe it also... It's a big risk, isn't it, for the blind club there? Yeah, of course.

1:32:45Yes, of course. Maybe it also plays into the Martinelli thing as well, that if Arsenal are open to selling Gabriel Martinelli, part of that is the fact that Gabriel Jesus might be back from injury and gives you a bit of cover on both wings as well as up front.

1:33:02Andrew Mangan: Yeah, I'm just looking now. The Carabao third round is week commencing 15th September and then the following week, 22nd of September, there's some games too. That doesn't feel implausible for Jesus. I wonder if that might be a target. And Arnold Martinelli, just a kind of final word on that. I think if Arsenal sell Jakub Kivio in this window, you can make the case that they're doing something they haven't done for a while, and that's selling a player at the right time. Like, he had a really good run-in. His stock is high. It's a good moment to cash in. Martinelli's stock, I would say, is probably not so high right now, generally in football, but it's, it's, you know, he's started at Old Trafford.

1:33:46He's part of the plan. I do feel like, you know, this may be the opportune moment

1:33:53Andrew Mangan: if, if, if the opportunity arises. And that is the big if I think for the final few days. Okie dokie. I think it's your question. Done that one, done that one. We've actually sort of ended up covering a lot of the ones I picked out. Have you got any in front of you? I'm sure I do. Let me have a little look here. Okay, here's one from Snooner Gunner on the Discord. He says, there's a possibility that next week we're going to Anfield with a front three of Eze, Yacarez and Madueke. Do you think this will give us an advantage because all three are so new and opposition teams haven't figured them out yet?

1:34:35Very possibly. I mean, they might also have some teething problems of their own,

1:34:39Andrew Mangan: learning to play together. What did you think of Maduake on the left versus on the right? I think he looked more comfortable on the right. I think he did quite well on the left. Yeah, he was all right. But I'm guessing he's going to be the guy to step in for Saka, right? Because he's played basically most of his career as a right winger, even though he gives us a little bit of something different on the left-hand side because he's left-footed and he goes outside rather than comes inside. But he is going to be the guy who's asked to step up. Yeah, Saka Potatoes asked who starts if both Saka and Odegaard are out against the Mug Smashers.

1:35:19I mean, is it as simple as Madueke on the right,

1:35:25Andrew Mangan: Warneri in central midfield for you? Warneri or maybe Eze? Who knows? Or Eze on the left, potentially. Yeah, certainly an option. We've got options. You know, Mikel equally, he might say he might go with a more workman like midfield. You know, he might pick a Marino and say a draw is a really good result for us and we're going to dig in and get it. You know, there's lots of things he could do potentially. Well, that's true. And that's what I think is interesting about the way we've built this squad is that if you were going into this game last year, there's probably a very good chance that you could predict Arsenal's starting 11, you know, a week before the game.

1:36:05I don't know that that's the case now. Not least because we've got a couple of injuries. You don't know if Odegaard will be available or not. The suggestion is he might well be available for Anfield. But we'll wait and see on that. But there are elements to our front three that you probably don't quite know who's going to play or the setup of the midfield, the construction of the midfield could be something completely different because of the options that we have. And we've spoken about full-back being very closely fought, contested in those positions.

1:36:36Andrew Mangan: We might have another player to add into that mix as well. Here's a question from me to you, Andrew. Okay. If Arsenal do sell Kivior and do buy Piero and Capier, do you have any concerns about Myles Lewis-Skelly's role in the squad? if you add another left-back potentially who clearly Mikel Arteta thinks a lot of it and is more senior? It's a good question. Do I have more? Do you think, I don't know, could we start to see Myles in midfield? But where? Do you think you'll have consequences? Yeah, where in midfield? When you look at the midfield and you've got Zubamendi and when Norgard's free, you've got Norgard and you've got Rice, you've got Marino, you've got Ezza, you've got Warneri, you've got Odegaard.

1:37:26Where does he play in midfield? It just seems quite, it's interesting, isn't it? A player who were nailed on, really, first choice in the second half of last season. And, you know, I'm not trying to, I'm not ringing any alarm bells or saying it's a crisis or anything like it, but it's interesting to imagine how that might all intersect. Yes, I agree. I agree. I mean, we're talking about how do we fit the players in at the top end of the pitch. I think if they do bring in this guy as another defender, he's going to want to play and somebody's going to miss out because of that. Maybe they just think there's so much football to go around this season that they can keep everyone happy.

1:38:09Maybe. Maybe they, as a way, James, of trying to prevent injury, you're looking at timeshare sort of situations for certain positions you know um making sure that nobody is overburdened making sure that the load on individuals is not so high that you increase the risk of injury so maybe we see more 60 minute substitutions in games rather than being tactical per se. Triple stubs at 60 minutes. Maybe they're not tactical per se, but as I said earlier, when it came to Timber and Calafuri coming off, a way of protecting players. I don't know. I mean, it's hard to work it out. It's hard to work it out.

1:38:53Maybe he wants that increased competition. Maybe he sees that level of competition within the squad as an ingredient to raise the levels and to get everybody pushing really, really hard for their play. So when they do play, there's this extra motivation, if that's the way you want to put it, for players to perform and to sort of copper fasten their position in the first team, you know?

1:39:18Andrew Mangan: There's ways of looking at it. He's spoken quite a lot about that. Yeah. He's spoken quite a lot about the buy-in that's required on part of the players in terms of recognizing I might not play every game. Sometimes I might not even make the matchday squad in the Premier League. and yet I need to accept that and play my part and contribute in whatever way I can. I think he uses two terms, collaboration and competition. I think I might be right in saying that he even at one point internally kind of fused those words. Collaboratition, I think that might be an arteterism. Jordan Campbell, I think, had that in an athletic piece.

1:40:04Right.

1:40:04Andrew Mangan: And as soon as you hear it, you're like, yeah, that does feel like something Mikel might do. Collaboration. That is the spirit, right, that will be required. And again, I'm fascinated to see if that's maintainable. I'm not sure I've ever seen an Arsenal manager sustain that without players becoming disgruntled. Yeah, somebody's going to be unhappy. That's human nature. But, you know, if it takes... Yeah, sorry, I was going to say. Yeah, they want to play, don't they? Yeah, they want to play. And if it takes some LinkedIn energy for us to win the title, so be it. I guess we all have to live with that along the way.

1:40:45Imagine if Mikhail's on LinkedIn, what that would look like. My God. My God. Yeah, Carlos Cuesta feels like he's got big LinkedIn vibes. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I can see that. What about this one from mb273.bsky.social? He says, why do you think it appears our academy is better at developing left-footed players than right-footed ones? It can't be coincidence that the four featuring for the first team are all lefties. So that's actually very easy to explain. Is Damon naturally left? Yeah. So Damon, Warneri, Lewis Skelly, and Saka.

1:41:23Andrew Mangan: It's very simple to explain. we had Jack Wilshire in our academy. And he planted one of his seeds in the training ground. He used him as the kind of gene father of a Hale End crop. He went into a side room. I don't think you need to take that one any further. No. Everyone has an imagination. I was originally sort of saying, you know, it's because he's like a guru of left fitted play and he coached three of those guys at any rate um but yeah i don't know i don't know here's a magazine with liam brady in it exactly

1:42:08and from a little test tube they created a fleet of left-footed wonder kids i Hey, here's an idea.

1:42:19Andrew Mangan: I don't know. Maybe left foot, we know about left footness being prized in the market at times, having a premium attached to it. There are left footers around. Maybe it is cheaper and better to make your own. I don't know. I don't know. I think it's probably coincidence, but maybe it's easier for left footed players to stand out. It really made me laugh. Yeah, I think probably it's all, what you're saying is all bullshit actually. and it was very fair it was very okay but yeah it is a cool little quirk isn't it yeah and there's some precedent you know Brady yes for sure there's also one here from I'm a Celebreche I like that he says following the signing of Eze we now have an unprecedented five players with a Z in their surname This accounts for 15 % of all such players in the Premier League.

1:43:19So there you go. The armory will be stocking up as we speak. Yeah. That was actually, I think, Eze's phone call to Arteta, wasn't it? I'm a celebrecce, get me out of here, basically. Yeah, that, of course. and so there you go alright listen I think we need to get this out and get this podcast out to everybody because they'll have been waiting we've gone longer than we normally do so not quite a three hour one but plenty for people to get their teeth into who knows we might have a new player podcast for you over on Patreon we've done one of those for every signing that we've made so far this summer it's a bumper crop talk about value for money for your six dollars a month over on Patreon If you fancy joining and getting on board for that, it is patreon.com forward slash arseblog.

1:44:15We will have an episode of The 30 for you tomorrow. We're waiting, of course, for tonight's Monday night football game, which is certainly going to be an interesting one, James. Newcastle against Liverpool. Could be quite tetchy, that one, hopefully, anyway. You looking forward to that one? I am. I am. And I think it will tell us a lot about this Liverpool team as well. and probably having a bit of a knock-on effect for our game against them. So, yeah, should be a spicy one. Yes, let's hope so. The Alexander-Ezek saga, debacle, whatever you want to call it, hangs over that one like a bad smell and hopefully continues right until the death of the window anyway.

1:45:00For now, though, we'll leave it there. Thank you so much, as always, for being with us. Thank you for listening. I hope you've enjoyed this show and obviously you've enjoyed the last few days as an Arsenal fan. Well worth just soaking it all in because it's not always as good and as fun as this. For now though, take it easy and we will catch you on the next one. Bye-bye.

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