Arsecast Extra Episode 716 - 11.10.2026

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0:59We got there in the end. We did. Three weeks without football, but we're back. We got the three points. We won the game. Did you have a nice day out at the football? I did actually, mate. Yeah. Lovely day out. I mean, I don't love a lunchtime kickoff. No. I've got to say. Yeah. On a Saturday, it sort of feels like you have to get going pretty early, really. I mean, and respect to all the fans who do manage to do that, chugging their beers at 11 a.m. It's commitment. it's real commitment this is where the club needs to sort of step up a little bit you know this arsenalization of the stadium they need to give everybody like I don't know a wrap of speed with their membership or something for the 12.30 kickoffs yeah that's a great idea a little you know a little pill to get you going for Saturdays everybody it's 11 o 'clock you get an alert from the from the Arsenal app if it works which it doesn't really you know take your pill be ready for 12.30 and everybody will be everybody will be dancing I guess.

2:01Yeah exactly in fact maybe they you know stay out all night on the Friday you know what I mean then they arrive in party mood but um yeah look it took me a while to get going took Arsenal a while to get going but a lovely day was had in the end. Excellent excellent so you know this international break this interlull really did feel like a long one. I think I saw a story somewhere, I'm pretty sure I didn't dream it, about how the various European FAs are going, nah, we can't do this. This is a terrible idea, doing a three-week interlull. We'd much rather have the three two-week ones than one three-week one.

2:41But anyway, it is what it is. It was what it was, and we came back. And I think there is probably something to be said for, like you say, 12.30 kickoff. A lot of the players have been away on international duty, coming back in dribs and drabs, a couple of them injured, etc. That is, I think, a reasonable context to place the game in. Nevertheless, some people will say, well, you know, Leeds had the same issue and they were much better than Arsenal in the first half. Is it a case that, you know, getting going is an issue solely for us or do you think it's maybe to do with the amount of players that we had away in comparison to Leeds, let's say.

3:20Yeah, I mean, obviously, you know, we were without a vast majority of our squad for three weeks. So that is going to affect things. We also had players who travelled a very long way, right? You know, the likes of Gabriel and Bruno going off around the world effectively. I wonder as well, contextually, like, is there any relevance to our last Premier League outing, which is a long time ago, but was a pretty painful defeat. So there's kind of a, we've got that slightly hanging over us too. I think there's a multitude of factors really that might have contributed to this being a bit of a disjointed performance.

3:57Some absentees as well. I mean, Christos Olis has been a big part of what we've done in the early period of this season. Obviously, we were without him. But I guess there was some good news in the starting lineup in terms of Kai Havertz being back and available to start. Yeah, that was an interesting one because I think I'd made the point on our preview pod on Patreon and certainly in the blog on the day of the game, the preview that I did for the game. I was really expecting Victor Jokeres to start this game and I kind of felt like it was important for him and important for the team for him to start this game because he had a good international break.

4:34He scored four goals in four games for Sweden. We need this player. We need to get his season kickstarted. It hasn't really happened yet. So I was, I'm not going to say disappointed. I think I know what the manager's preference is, right, when it comes to his two strikers. But Havertz had a little injury when he was away and his break was cut short. So I was a little surprised, let's say more than disappointed, that Jacarez didn't start this one. Yeah, it felt like an opportunity to give him the game. I mean, obviously he had success against Leeds last season. We battered them in this fixture.

5:13He was a big part of that. It's a Jokeres game, really, you would think. Equally, maybe three centre-halves. Mikel Arteta's thinking, I want someone who's a bit more unpredictable in his movements, who pops up in the pockets and creates little overloads in spaces. And Kai Havertz is more that player. Yeah, I think so, yeah. The other thing to say is we are at the start of like a big run of games, including one as soon as Tuesday night. You know, I think Jokeres will get games in this period, but it was very, very clear, wasn't it, that if Havertz was available, he remains Mikel Arteta's guy in the Premier League.

5:54Yeah, the other big selection issue was who was going to replace Solis on the left-hand side. And again, I was a little surprised that it wasn't Eberachie Ezer because I felt like, like Jokerez, this was a moment where we kind of need to get his season going again. He hasn't started a game yet in the Premier League. He didn't get off the bench at all yesterday. And maybe we can talk a bit later. I think we might have a question or two about what that might mean for him more broadly. but he went with Nani Matueke on the left. As it was away with England, wasn't he? Matueke was at home training, and Arteta referenced how well he had trained and basically said afterwards that he trained so well, I couldn't not pick him.

6:32But it is not typical to see Nani Matueke on the left-hand side. I know he did play there occasionally last season for Arsenal, but not a great deal. So that felt like a fairly significant decision from the manager. Yeah, it was full of praise, wasn't it, for Nonny's training over the last 10 days. He said he was the best player in that period. I mean, admittedly, a lot of the players haven't been there. It's kind of like being the cleverest boy in the class during the school holidays. Do you know what I mean? It's like slightly faint praise, I think. But I was surprised he went with Nonny. I, like you, thought it would be, as I thought that was the logical choice.

7:14I wonder if, you know, against a Leeds team who liked to make the pitch smaller, was the natural width of Madueke appealing to Mikel Arteta? And maybe a way of introducing some pace into the team, because we've spoken already several times this season about how we've lacked that. And he is probably the guy who gives you that. And I thought actually, like on balance, I thought the selection of Madueke was vindicated. I thought he was, when you look back at our big moments in the game, invariably he was involved in most of them. I think that's fair. I mean, as ever, there is stuff he does that makes you, well, certainly makes me frustrated, right?

7:59Because it seems like there's simple stuff that he should be able to do that he just doesn't. But of the three attacking players, the three front three, anyway, he was certainly the most lively. I think your point maybe about width is an interesting one. He didn't massively go on the outside a great deal, did he? But he has that in his locker and he has that ability to go beyond players and get crosses in. But it was fairly disjointed from Arsenal in that first half, I think. A slow start, you sort of expect. 12.30 kickoff, post-interlouge, first game back. There is that slight expectation that you're going to grow into the game, that if it starts slowly, you're not particularly surprised, right?

8:48But as the half went on, I think we found ourselves deteriorating, I think. You know, we didn't really get going from an attacking perspective. I think there were a couple of headers for Havertz. Not exactly easy chances either, I don't think. They were both from Maduweke crosses. But certainly in that first period, Leeds were the team that grew into the game from an attacking perspective much more than Arsenal.

9:15Andrew Mangan: Yeah, I think once it got to around, was it around the half hour mark, something like that, they put together a little flurry of chances. there was that moment where a couple of Leeds players collided in the penalty area sort of inadvertently preventing what would have been quite a good opportunity there was that one where Raya came out and punched and then had to scrabble back to his own line to reclaim the ball, it was a pretty good header actually for the edge of the box that seems to be destined for the net I think he made a save from Bogle didn't he at the far post as well, crossed it, went all the way through the box and made a decent stop there so So we actually needed David Raya in that little period.

9:56Absolutely. Towards the end of the first time. Yeah, there was another one at the back post from Goodmanson, which he leathered right. I mean, it was straight at him, but he had to be there and he stood up very strongly to it. I mean, there was another moment as well where I think with the right pass, Leeds could have put Anton Stack straight through against Raya, but they overhit the pass and Raya picked it up. I was a little concerned, I have to say, about the center of the defense, that it felt a little penetrable. You know, we weren't quite decisive enough. That Bogle chance, for example, is a good example of it where I think the ball kind of squirted through to him and Raya had to make the save from close range.

10:39But it's the sort of thing that just gives you the jitters a little bit when you see it, because really somebody should be putting their foot through that ball. It can't be allowed to get through to that guy. Yeah, my perception of it was it looked like our centre-halves were quite preoccupied with Dominic Calvert-Lewin. And weirdly enough, not many of Leeds' deliveries actually found Calvert-Lewin. But he seemed to be kind of dragging our centre-halves into areas where there was space for others, like arriving at the far post on occasion. I mean, he won more aerials maybe than any other player on the pitch, Calvert-Lewin.

11:17So I think he did pretty well in that sense. And he is a handful, you know, when he's fit and when he's in form or, you know, got some game rhythm. He is a handful of a player. He is definitely. And the other thing to say, and I don't know how big a factor this would have been, but, you know, Gabriel, we mentioned the Brazilian boys have been on this kind of world tour. And if you could forgive anybody for being a bit fatigued or a bit jet lagged or whatever it might be, it would certainly be him given the schedule he's had. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair. But it wasn't a good first half. at all from Arsenal, was it?

11:52It was kind of worrying. It felt like whatever we were trying to do wasn't working. Leeds, you know, I think they deserve credit as well. You know, we can talk about Arsenal being off the pace, but I think like Brighton in the previous game, you also have to give credit to the opposition for the way that they played. And they are very difficult to play against. They're very, very hard running, very physical. And they make it difficult for you with that five at the back, you know? So the concerns, I think, though, for me, where we just looked a little bit toothless going forward. We didn't quite have the penetration you would like in our passing.

12:29We seemed a bit pedestrian in midfield. It felt to me like Declan Rice looked a little bit leggy at times. I could be wrong here. Maybe he ran more than anybody else in the game. I should look that up at some point. But it was a bit of a worrying one. We did have a chance early in the second half. Martin Hodegaard set up by Matawake. I think it's one of those where he's trying to guide it into the bottom corner, but didn't really make contact. I think it's quite a good chance this. And in the form he's been in, Martin Odegaard, I would have expected him to do slightly better. Calafiori does really well in the buildup to this.

13:03Wins a big 50-50, sort of strides on. And yeah, Nonny, you know, on that left-hand side, I did like the sort of simplicity of a lot of his delivery, you know, it's kind of get it out in front of his feet and put it across the box into a dangerous area. Finds Odegaard here. And yeah, I think he could have done better there, the captain. Yeah. Just looked at the distances. 11.7 kilometres from Declan Rice. 12.1 for Martin Odegaard, who was the most distancy guy. Is that how you say it? He did the most distance or covered the most distance for Arsenal. That's true. Although I think the distance covered is obviously an indicator of a player's output.

13:43But like often with Rice, when he's really fresh and really on it, it's kind of the intensity of that movement, you know, the explosiveness. And I know what you mean in that he was covering the ground, but I'm not sure he was sort of eating it up as much as he sometimes does. That's a good way of putting it. And I think there was, generally speaking, a sort of sloppiness about Arsenal to second balls, sloppiness in possession until the time that we got our goal. but obviously we fell behind to James Justin. We scored a couple of goals for Leicester against us a few seasons ago at that end as well, I think.

14:24This was... How do you analyse this one then? Because Leeds worked it down the left-hand side. The cross came in. Raya decided to go for it, missed it. It came to Justin and he was there. It's a decent finish. Are you looking at Matuweke here? I think you have to be and I think Mikhail Teta you presume will be I also think it's a little bit too easy the way they get in down our right hand side it's kind of a ball into the channel I think it's Declan Rice trying to get back and Ben White who's kind of overtaken I think it's almost a little bit it's a little casual from Arsenal's perspective good finish from James Justin good contact He likes playing against us at that end, as you say.

15:14But, yeah, we just switched off. And to be honest, there'd been a couple of warning signs around that, you know, from Leeds. It wasn't exactly one-way traffic. I think they curled one just past the post. David Ryer had tipped over. Is it Tanaka? Tanaka, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So they were knocking on the door. And I have to say it was one of those sort of sharp intakes of breath around the stadium of, well, we might be in trouble here. Yes, it did feel like that. And I think, you know, the fact that the manager was lining up, they showed on TV a triple sub or a double sub about to happen. Then it was a triple sub.

15:53Then they thought it was a quadruple sub about to happen. But it seems, as I was told to go and sit back down, having originally been in the frame for coming on, I don't know how much the goal might have changed that. But it wasn't too long, actually, before we got the goal that got us back into the game and really, in many ways, just completely changed the energy, not just within the stadium itself, but of the game and of the Arsenal performance. And I think, you know, we'll talk about the subs and the influence that they had in that as well. But it was a very timely goal from Riccardo Calafiori.

16:33It was, yeah. Yeah, there were actually five subs warming up at the moment. I think Leeds scored and then they very quickly sort of put that into action. But, you know, Calafiore's goal is really the thing that changed the game. And on your Noni Madueke bingo card of output, not too many people would have had right-footed cross being the thing that led to the equaliser. But there you go. Good ball, actually, to the back post. Nice movement from Ben White. And actually, the movement from Calafiore is super smart, really sharp. You know, he really does anticipate that ball falling there like a centre forward would.

17:14You know, if your number nine scored that goal, you go classic number nine, right place, right time. Calafiore's instincts in the box, I think we know already are pretty sharp. But this was really good. Really good and really smart from Ben White as well, just to kind of get it back into his path. and you've got your two full backs within what, about eight, nine yards of the goal combining. You know, we were in a position where we had to kind of take the handbrake off and go for it. And evidently, when you look at the positions of those players, we did. I think Trafford might be a bit disappointed.

17:47It takes an awkward bounce for him, but I would expect David Raya to save that, I must say. Yeah. No complaints from me though. No, no, no, no, no, no. I think any goalkeeper would be a bit disappointed if they get hands to it like that. It's not exactly an emphatic finish from Calafuri, but it's in the back of the net. Having David Ryan's haircut does not make you as good as David Ryan. I think it's what we learned there. Yeah, it's quite similar, all right, isn't it? He's doing his best. He's doing his best. That made it 1-1. That obviously changes the mood in a big way. You were there, and I'm sure there was a lot of anxiety around the stadium when that goal goes in.

18:26And it's sort of at a point in a game where, you know, if it goes another five or ten minutes, you're really wondering and worrying about where we're going to get a goal from, aren't you? So the timing of it coming quickly after the Leeds goal, it's sort of assuaged a lot of the nerves, I guess.

18:44Andrew Mangan: Definitely, definitely. And I think there was a feeling of, okay, you know, this is very much back on and we should be able to turn this around and get the win. Especially with all the quality we had coming off the substitutes bench. And that proved decisive. So a triple sub it was. Bruno Gimaraich on for Myles Lewis-Galley. Victor Jokerez on for Kai Havertz. and Jury and Timber on for Ben White, who had just provided the assist for the equalizer. But still, I think nice to see that we can manage the minutes of those two players. And hopefully that's something we have available to us going forward, you know?

19:26If Timber starts, White can come on and vice versa. And that's the way it was yesterday. Bruno Gimaraes is the guy who will take the plaudits for the goal. I just thought he brought something a little more to midfield. And I thought Myles was fine. But I think you can see from the way he influenced the game, not just with the goal, that that's kind of why we brought this player into the team. You know, immediately, I think very, you know, maybe his first action was to sort of get between the lines. I think he fed a ball down to Matueke on the left and they blocked the cross out. But, you know, it was a positive impact from him on the ball before we get to the goal.

20:06yeah he's so forward thinking isn't he every time he receives it he's looking for a runners ahead of him or he's seeing if he can get the shots off um there is that intent behind everything that he does and i think he immediately made a difference he's a very different player to miles so you'd naturally expect that to change the dynamic of the team and we had our tails up at that point which I think helps but good to see Jurian Timber involve playing minutes contributing and yeah Jokeres got his chance as well from the bench so I thought they were changes that really were a bit of a flex to be honest that showed the great depth that Mikhail Tet

20:47Andrew Mangan: has at his disposal yeah I mean the the chances we had we there was another one for Calafiori wasn't there from the edge of the box not long after he scored and he sort of tried to smash it and really slice it well wide um then we score this really lovely goal and i think what's fascinating about this is the the positions that the arsenal players are in as this goal comes about you know but kaiosaka's come in from the right hand side and he's sort of like an inside left forward or maybe even where a center forward might be uh you have declan rice between the defensive and midfield lines popping up like a number 10 Odegaard has dropped deep to pick up the ball and try and dictate play and he plays it into Saka continues running plays it to Rice Rice has come across and then Bruno who's sort of like the anchorman in midfield just sees this develop in front of him and and the flick from Rice is absolutely perfect but you know Gimmaras has to be there he has to recognize what's unfolding in front of him I think he does that really well and the finish into the bottom corner is fantastic.

21:57It's just a really nice team goal this. Yeah, I think particularly that flip from Rice. I mean, obviously having the awareness to try it is one thing, but the execution of it is perfect. The weight on it just plays the ball into Bruno's path and sets up a shooting opportunity that I think everyone around me kind of anticipated he would take. I mean, even Nonny Madueke on the pitch has kind of got his arms up in celebration before Bruno even strikes it. Now, in fairness, Noni also had his arms up in celebration when Bakara Saka went through in stoppage time, but there you go. Yeah, it's a beautifully worked goal and interesting, I think, to see that midfield three, which I think we think probably is Mikel Arteta's preferred midfield three, all involved, all combining.

22:45And another big, big moment for Bruno after Sunderland. And, you know, he's had a sort of stop-start beginning to his Arsenal career, no pre-season injury, but he's already made a couple of really, really big, really important contributions. Yeah, well, I mean, look, the winner yesterday wasn't the only goal of the game against Sunderland, of course, but we scored, what, was like the penalty for Saka in like the last minute of injury time? Yeah. You know, so ostensibly you're looking at two winning goals already from Bruno Gimaraes. two winning goals from midfield as well. I think when we had discussions about how this Arsenal team improves and how do we get better and how do we cause the opposition more threat, how do we score more goals, all the focus typically is on what you do in the front three or who you've got in the front three or maybe who you don't have in that front three, right, as it pans out.

23:40But I think the decision to bring in someone like Bruno Gimaraes wasn't just about, right, we need to bolster our midfield with a tackler or a distributor. He is a guy who gets quite a lot of goals and did get quite a lot of goals for Newcastle. And so far, it's really, you know, paid dividends for Arsenal. It has, yeah. And I think it just shows why we were prepared to part with quite so much money to get him. I mean, he's a player who can be impactful, can be decisive. And it's exciting to think we're going to see more of him as he beds properly into the team. Yeah, there could have been more goals for Arsenal and probably should have been more goals for Arsenal.

24:26Declan Rice, in their box, sending the defender to the shops with a little shimmy. It was like doing it in a phone box. There was that little room, but he certainly produced something really special there. And I think it's just a touch from the defender that prevents Martin Odegaard getting good contact on it. So that was an opportunity. I think we were really dominant, actually. You know, from the time we scored that second goal, I think we had 60 % possession. We had six shots to Leeds as one. And maybe the scoreline is probably fair enough as a reflection of the game and how it panned out. But I do think Arsenal could have scored more.

25:05You know, that moment there, that ball could easily deflect in off Odegaard and make it 3-1. But there was an opportunity then for Jokeres I have to say in real time, I was a little more frustrated by this than, than I am this morning, having watched more replays of it. I do think there is an opportunity for him to get the shot off quicker, but I don't think it's quite as clear cut as I thought it was at that time. You know?

25:33Andrew Mangan: No, I think I feel the same having watched it back on, on much of the day in real time. It seemed to me that he got, he almost got the ball kind of stuck under his feet. at one point, but I'm not sure there was ever a great angle to finish there, even though Trafford was kind of caught in no man's land. I think when he gets to the edge of the box, that's where it begins to get a bit clumsy, you know, where he sort of steps on the ball a bit and the leads get players back. But as a, you know, I don't think the clear cut opportunity to smash it from 45 yards was quite there in the way that I thought it was when I was watching in real time.

26:13Andrew Mangan: No, no, I don't think so either. But, you know, the Saka one, that is a great chance. It is. Played through by Jokeres in the last minute. It's basically the last kick of the game. He should score. He should score that, I think. He didn't really look confident, did he, in front of Golder? No, and he's got a few goals this season and got a couple with England, didn't he, just before coming back. So it's a player in decent goal-scoring form. but I think it's a good save, to be fair to Trafford. I think he does well, and he's quite good in those one-on-one situations. But yeah, of course you expect Makai Saka to score.

26:55And Nonny was convinced he would, but there you go. So yeah, I mean, to sort of round it out, I guess, is the discussion about how you frame this particular performance. Like, do you see it as something to be worried about because we didn't play particularly well until such time as we did? Or do you have to recognize the context of the game and the fact that we went behind, but still had what we needed to get three points, to come back, to win the game, to use the bench, to, you know, produce the moments that we absolutely needed to get the goals? Is it a show of character and determination and this is the first step to, you know, an improved performance in our next game?

27:42Or do you harbour some concerns that there are things about the way we're playing or have played in the last couple of games that give you a bit of pause for thought? Yeah, it's a good question. I mean, I think there is a lot of mitigation in the performance. And we've talked about that a bit. You know, the rustiness coming off the back of a defeat, one or two of the absentees potentially. but do I see, I suppose the first hour of the game, I was thinking, do Arsenal have the kind of code breaker that they need to unlock these deep defences? You know, the three at the back situation, do we have what's required?

28:23And is there enough ingenuity there in that front line? Something that we said a lot last season. And I was kind of looking at it again and thinking,

28:32Andrew Mangan: you know, that transfer window does feel somewhat like an unfinished job. What I would have to say is that Bruno then comes on and the winning goal that we score is absolutely everything I think that we want to see from this Arsenal team and that maybe we haven't seen enough of over the past 12 months. That is really skillful, intricate, attacking football, dismantling a defence. So while the first hour or so worried me, Some of those worries were assuaged by what we produced in that final half hour and our capacity to turn it around and win the game. So that sounds like I'm sitting on the fence a little.

29:11Andrew Mangan: Yeah, you'll be absolutely right. I've got splinters right in my ass at this point in time. What do you think?

29:20Sort of similar to you in that I think there are obviously things we can do better and things we need to improve on. but I'm sort of holding fire until I see how this next period of the season goes. You know, we've got that first sort of trench of seven games, eight games, whatever it was. I think it was hard going, you know, particularly after a long summer for some of the players. So I'm a little concerned by certain elements, But at the same time, you know, when you look to your bench and you can bring on Gimaraes, you can bring on Timber, you can bring on, you know, a striker like Jokeres.

30:06You also had Eze available to you if you needed to change the game. You had Max Dahman available as well, who obviously didn't come on. There's certainly enough depth. I mean, Mikel Moreno came on right at the death. He's a guy who got, did he get three goals for Spain in the international break as well? You know, so there's a lot of quality on the bench to offset performances which aren't quite working. We couldn't do that against Brighton. We didn't do that against Brighton. I think that creates a certain amount of anxiety about, you know, how we use our bench and maybe how the manager rotates the team in general.

30:43But I think for me, you have to apply the context of post-interlal and reacting well. You know, reacting to the fact that we went behind and still having enough to come and score the goals and win the game. So I think I'm more in the camp that this showed kind of why we're champions and why we are a team to really take seriously, even if there are certain aspects of the performance that are a little bit worrying. Yeah. And I think, you know, certain individuals were below their best. You know, we spoke about some promising signs from Nonny maybe, but I didn't think Kai Havertz had his best game.

31:22I don't think Bakary Saka had a particularly good game. And I also think Leeds, you know, they're recently promoted to the Premier League. It's quite easy to think of them as sort of a team we should blow past. But this was their first defeat in the Premier League this season. They've started really well. They're much stronger than they were. They've recruited very well. I don't think they're going to be in relegation trouble this year. So, you know, we were against an informed, confident team, a bit like when we came up against Brighton. You know, this is probably as bad a time as you could get to play Leeds, given the start they've had.

31:57So, you know, there are no gimmies, really. Not many gimmies in this division, in this league. And you've got to work for those three points. And we had to work for them yesterday.

32:09Andrew Mangan: but we showed, as you said, the resolve of champions to get over the line. To what extent do you think that might actually be a factor, the fact that we are the champions, that when teams come to play Arsenal, it's not that you raise your game. I mean, obviously you want to go out and you want to win every game, but I think there's something a little different when you are playing the team that won the league the previous season that are the champions, the reigning champions. You know, you want to show that you can beat the best, right? And that does perhaps, maybe I'm getting this wrong, but I think players are motivated in different ways and they're always going to be motivated for a game, but there's something a little bit extra special when you're playing against the best team in the country.

32:50Mate, I mean, Herzl has been on the media tour, hasn't he, since he beat Arsenal? I can't move for that bloke. He's given interviews about it left, right, centre. I think he's been on every TV and radio station that's going. so thankfully thankfully i have uh that's passed me by oh well let me tell you he's doing the rounds he's he's showering it from the rooftops i beat arsenal i beat michael arteta and that's because we're the champions of england so yeah i think not just players coaches too they are actually motivated we're a scalp now it's a feather in your cap if you beat arsenal and that's something um something we're gonna have to get used to dealing with yeah and well i guess we dealt with it we dealt with it pretty well um where do we go from here in terms of discussion about who played maybe the discussion is more interesting about who didn't play or who didn't get onto the pitch are you worried for Eze that he didn't start this or are you worried that he didn't get on or do you feel like as you said there are a lot of games to play um you know we've got a Champions League game at home on Tuesday.

33:56It's a quick turnaround, you know, from players who've just come back from the international break. There is a need to rotate. There is a need to recognise the physical limits of the players and also recognise the fact that you've got a really, really big, deep squad that you have to use as a manager. So are you worried or do you think we need a bit more time on this one? Yeah, I mean, I don't want to give too much away. We all know I've got my names in my envelope, Andrew. I don't want to tear them open at this early stage. We're only in October. But I am a little bit worried for it. I think it'd sort of be odd not to be really, you know, given not just this occasion, but really it's time at Arsenal.

34:43Andrew Mangan: I do think he's, I think there've been enough kind of question marks at different points and different moments. Unfortunately, those have been offset by some absolutely outstanding goals and contributions and writing his name into Arsenal folklore, frankly, with his Derby heroics. But unfortunately, you can't play Tottenham every week. And yeah, I did think it was interesting that he didn't get on here. I still think he'll get minutes in this period. I still think he'll be used. But is he one of Nicola Teta's favoured options? Right now, it doesn't look like it, does it? No, it doesn't really.

35:28Are you worried? Yeah. Yeah, I am a little bit, I have to say. Because I don't really think that the left-hand side is his best position. Like, I think he's a player who can play out there. And I think he is capable of delivering from out there. You know, he's good enough. The technical quality is more than good enough for him to be able to play out there and to score goals and make assists and help Arsenal play well. But in the middle, right, he's got Bruno and Odegaard, maybe Marino and Myles Lewis-Gelly, who look to be ahead of him in that particular pecking order. And I felt like with Solis being out, that was the opportunity for Eze to get, you know, a little run of games, to kickstart his season and to sort of hopefully get him going.

36:21Because in the end, that's what we all want, right? We want all of our players to play well. I know that's a pipe dream, but that's what you want, you know, for players to come in and do well and give the manager a problem, give him something to think about. So I, yeah, I'm a bit worried that he didn't get that start yesterday. Maybe it was just tactical, as you say. Maybe, you know, he wanted that left-footed player on the left-hand side to stretch the pitch a little bit. Still think you can do that with a right-footed player. Doesn't necessarily have to be a left-footer who hugs the touchline.

36:54We asked Gabrielle Martinelli to do that for years, right? so so on that basis yeah I'm a little concerned about you know where his season is going it's it's certainly um yeah I don't know what the word I'm looking for here is but it really hasn't got started yet no and I do think in that central area you know what what would Eze's I mean Martin Odegaard's form and fitness is a bit of a problem for him you know he's clearly first choice as that kind of creative midfield player. But then you would think, well, Ethan's gone out on loan. Really, that role backing him up should be Eze's beyond question.

37:38But I think looking at the pecking order right now, I think Mikel Arteta has Mikel Marino ahead of Eze right now. I think he's using him more frequently, more comfortably, more confidently in those central parts of the pitch because I think he sees him, like Martin Odegaard, as more of a two-way player, you know, more of an all-round contributor. So it's a little bit sticky for him at this point in time, but he has got this little window with Solis out. You know, Matuweke played the full 90 against Leeds. Is he going to play again against Lille on Tuesday night? I don't know. Maybe there'll be a chance for us out there.

38:21Yeah, it does feel like the kind of game, Lille on Tuesday, where, listen, I think I made the case about starting Jochrez and Eze in this one, and he decided that wasn't the way he wanted to go. I think if they don't start, if neither of them start, or if only one of them starts against Lille on Tuesday, I think we can get a little bit more worried about what's going on with those two in particular. But it is that kind of game, isn't it, where we continue to have these discussions about Mikel Arteta and how he uses his squad and how he rotates. And the inclination, which seems to be, you know, fairly obvious now that this is how he works, is that he does not want to rotate as much as maybe we think he should, right?

39:12We're learning that, right? Yeah, I mean, if we haven't learned it by now, we probably never will. I do think it's so funny. We have these games and we predict the changes and what you might do. And then it's the same old guys, isn't it? Yeah. What's our best 11? Yeah, well, I think Mikel knows probably. And that influences his selection a lot of the time. He certainly seems to know about certain positions. so yeah I mean when it comes to rotating or not rotating I wouldn't put anything past him but he has done it this season he has made changes here and there particularly in other competitions so yeah it'll be interesting to see

39:54Andrew Mangan: what he does on Tuesday night yeah there seemed to be or there were reports of an injury to Piero Incapier after the game I think they had like a warm down session and a small sided game apparently and the jeopardy for Arsenal players getting injured does not end at full time. Remarkably. Incredible. Scenes of him being sort of piggybacked off the pitch, but I think it's Elan Melier who's got him. That's kind of worrying, right? Yeah, he looks to be in some pain. I mean, ankles are funny. It seemed to be his ankle. Ankles are funny in that they can, you can have a very acute response that's actually not too bad, you know?

40:36Andrew Mangan: sometimes you get away with it um but you know i don't know if you've seen the video clip but yeah i mean he looks he looks gutted that's always what worries me is when a player pain is one thing but sort of when it's disappointment etched on their face or sort of you know fear of an absence or how long they might be out which is kind of what i saw there you know he clearly was like, ah, shit, I'm going to miss some games. Yeah. That alarms me. I mean, obviously we're, you know, we're blessed that we've got Ricardo Calafiori, he's fantastic. But one aspect of Calafiori is that it's great to be able to protect him and great to be able to rotate him or even bring him off as we did in this game.

41:26Andrew Mangan: Because we know, obviously, he's got history of injury issues too. So, yeah, let's hope. Let's hope it's just a scare for Incapio. Yeah, fingers crossed. I mean, it might even open up miles at left back if required. Yeah, we've seen it already this season, haven't we? He's done it. Did he do it in the League Cup, I think. And then, you know, you have those midfield options. Like on Tuesday, Tuesday to me seems like a great day to rest Declan Rice. Like you've given him three weeks off, played him on Saturday. He's done the full 90. Now you've got a home game against Lille and you've got Marino, you've got Gimaraes, you've got Eze, you've got Zubimendi, you know, all looking to start a game.

42:11And, you know, if Miles is at left back, you still have a huge amount of midfield depth.

42:15Andrew Mangan: Yeah. Yeah, I think that's not a bad shout. I would be thinking, I think I would give Jokeres the game. Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean, listen, Havertz got the nod yesterday, but, you know, he didn't do anything to say to the manager, you must start me in the next game. Do you know what I mean? Like, I think if Jokeres had had that game from the start and played like Havertz, we'd be talking about how, well, Havertz needs to come back into the team, you know? so I think fair is fair in that respect like if Havertz had put in a blinding performance maybe it's a different question or a different discussion with regards to Tuesday you know but he didn't score he had a couple of headers did alright but you know beyond that not particularly great so I think you know you have to look at is holistic the right word here like in terms of making sure that you get everybody going and getting the team and the squad to the level that you want, you've got to play these guys.

43:23You've got to give them the chance. Whether they take it or not, that's a different thing. But, you know, I find it, you know, we talked about being worried about Eze, and that's fair, but we can't be critical per se of Eze because he hasn't really had the minutes to warrant that kind of a discussion. The same with Jokeres. Like whatever you might think or whatever you think of him as a player, I don't know that we can necessarily, at least in Premier League terms, be critical of him this season because he just hasn't had the time on the pitch. And this is kind of where you want to see these players given that chance and hopefully giving the manager something to think about.

44:02Definitely. And I think he had a bit of success in Europe, particularly in this initial league phase last season. So I think it's an eminently sensible swap, especially given the fact that Kai's coming back from an injury, right? That was kind of the big surprise that he went in from the start. Is there anything else you want to touch on, part one? I don't think so. Oh, I do want to give a shout out to our friends at the Tollington, by the way. Oh, yes. They had a fire in their basement. I believe they had to close for the game. I don't know when they're going to be back open, hopefully as soon as possible.

44:40But thankfully, I think everyone's all right. There's nobody hurt, thankfully. But, yeah, damaging fire in the basement means they're closed for a little while. Yeah, sad news. Wish them all the best and hopefully they can reopen very, very soon. Yeah. Where the hell did everyone go yesterday? I don't know, actually. It's a good question. Who knows? Maybe even the stadium of all places. My goodness. I think there was some sort of deal if you were in there an hour before the game. Right. Your 10 a.m. pints, you know, they were at a good price. just pop your pill and start swinging pints that's exactly it alright well listen I think we'll leave it there for part one no I'll ask you this question in part two because it is a question so we'll leave it for that so we'll take a little break we'll come back with your questions and more in part two right after this

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47:48Welcome back to the Arscast Extra. This is part two of the show where we answer the questions that you send to us on bluesky at gunnerblog.bsky.social and at arseblog.com. Also on the Arseblog Discord chat server, which you get access to if you are an Arseblog member on Patreon. Before we get into the listener questions, James, I did want to ask you, are you full of anticipation for this afternoon's encounter between Liverpool and Manchester City?

48:16Andrew Mangan: I am, mate. It's the Michael Jackson popcorn meme, really, isn't it? I do want to see the reception that they get. And I want to see how it impacts them because, you know, they've had a good start to the season. Obviously, this is incredibly disruptive and distracting. And we talked a bit last week about what sort of effect that might wreak upon their campaign. It will be very depressing if they just go to Anfield and win anyway. That will be mightily depressing. But yeah, I'm hopeful that they get the reception that they deserve and the outcome that they deserve as well. Yeah. Did you watch Mareska's press conference?

48:58Andrew Mangan: I couldn't. I tried, Matt. I've seen clips. Yeah, it's painful, isn't it? Just dismal. Absolutely dismal. I was pretty disappointed generally, I must say, across the board in the Premier League. Like, you know, we suspected the managers might kind of play the game and keep their mouth shut, and probably they're all advised to do that. I did sort of hope there'd be a bit more condemnation about, but maybe that was naive of me. A few more Ian Holloways. Get Holloway back in a top job, yeah. That's the answer here. He was brilliant. He was very good on it, yeah. And by the way, Paul Merson, very good as well.

49:40Andrew Mangan: There's a good clip of him. I think it must be on Soccer Saturday. Yeah, I didn't see that. Was that good? Yeah, he's just letting them have it, you know, and sort of saying that they cheated players out of sort of those golden moments. And his thesis is basically, you know, because it's a counterargument to the fact, well, they still had to win it on the pitch. He's sort of saying, yeah, but they won it for them upstairs in the boardroom. I mean, without that, they don't get to the point where they can win it on the pitch. Yeah, I mean, you can't separate the two, can you, you know? No. No. By the way, I had a question on this for you from Cat in the Wall on Blue Sky.

50:21And they said, do you struggle at all with not knowing how high the stakes are in games now? I don't think there's a legit title challenger besides City. And I expect a severe punishment for them, but it's obviously not a given. Are we even in a title race? I mean, yes, obviously. You look at the table, Liverpool could be, what, three points behind us if they win today? I'm beating this season as well. It's too early to say that there's nobody else in this title race apart from Arsenal and Manchester City. Way too early, you know? So, yeah, I don't struggle with the stakes because I think that's evident.

51:09Whenever you play, it doesn't matter if you're playing Manchester City or you're playing Leeds or you're playing whoever's bottom of the table, which is Fulham. Wow. We feel those stakes in every game and every performance, you know? So, yeah, I don't struggle in that sense. I think the need for a speedy resolution is not the right word because we kind of have a resolution, right? They're guilty. Of 114 of 115 charges. That is the resolution. Now it's about the sanctions and the punishment. But I do think for the, and we discussed this, we need the Premier League's verdict to happen sooner rather than later.

51:56because this is, it's not an elephant in the room, but it is a thing that's hanging over the Premier League and it kind of feels absurd. You know, Manchester City could, they could go on a run and win five or six more games and maybe they're five or six or seven points clear at the top of the table. And we're all looking at it going, but this is bullshit though.

52:19Andrew Mangan: Yes, I mean, there's been a lot of talk about asterisks, but there is a legitimate asterisk against the Premier League table right now. Yeah. And the quicker that is cleared up, the better. I understand where this question is coming from, that we're sort of looking at a landscape that feels false right now. But are we in a title race? I think we have to absolutely treat as if we are, because do I have 100 % confidence that City won't wriggle out of a massive punishment. I can't be 100 % confident of that. You know, I think there is always a chance. So, you know, we have to compete as if that's in play until such time as this is finalised.

53:09Andrew Mangan: So, yeah, but I am very intrigued to see how they get on and I'll be watching this afternoon for sure. All right. Well, look, we had a lot of questions about Bakayo Saka. So let's just do this one. They're all, you know, of a similar kind of theme. A non-flying Dutchman on the Discord says, would you take Saka out of the team for a game or two? If when Martinelli was here and he put in those performances, he would have been on the bench for a few weeks. I love Saka, but his form is a little worrying. Maybe it's physical decline. Maybe this is just who he is now, but maybe a spell on the bench is the kick up the backside that he needs.

53:48Do you think he needs a kick up the backside? No, probably get injured. You or him? Both.

53:59Andrew Mangan: I think there's, yeah, there's been a lot of talk about Saka, a lot of sort of kind of unflattering compilations of his performance yesterday around on social media.

54:14Andrew Mangan: What do I think about it? I might be tempted. I might be tempted to bring him out on Tuesday. I do wonder if sort of, you know, could you flip Nonny to the right, play Eze from the left, take Zaka out, give him a breather, allow him to come on for the last 20 minutes or so in a hopefully low pressure environment.

54:39Andrew Mangan: I mean, we had some, yeah, lots of questions that were not particularly flattering, to use that word again, to Saka.

54:51I have this feeling about him this season that I kind of feel like this debate

54:57Andrew Mangan: or this conversation is going to rumble on. And my gut tells me that he's going to pick up pretty decent numbers along the way. Like, I think we'll get to May and people will be like, is Saka what he used to be? and he'll have a decent number of goals and assists, but people won't be quite convinced. And part of me wonders, is that just what comes with the territory of being a big star and the highest paid player and being seen through that prism of the expectations being substantially raised? I also think he probably, I think physically, explosively, he probably isn't quite where he was, but I'm not sure that's ever what made him great.

55:42You know, I don't think his pace has ever been his defining attribute.

55:46Andrew Mangan: It's his intelligence, his decision-making. And I think he's still perfectly capable of executing in those moments. So, yeah, without wishing to kind of brush the concerns off, I'm not overly concerned myself. What about you? I thought he was poor yesterday. I have to say, I did have a discussion about him, whether it was a preview pod or on the Arsecast, I can't quite remember, where I felt more encouraged by what I've seen from Mikai Osaka this season than I did last season. To me, last season, he looked very much a shadow of his former self. Yeah, I agree with that. I feel the same. But I thought this season we're seeing a bit more from him, certainly in terms of getting in front of goal, getting shots away, some of the positions that he's taking up, you know, that kind of six yard box thing where, you know, he's there for the tap ins for those kinds of goals, which I think is an interesting development in his game.

56:55but I also think there were moments where you know his finishing has really let him down this season a couple of times the game against Napoli in particular that one where he blasted over from the penalty spot he should score I think he should score that goal yesterday if he scores those two goals are we having the same kind of discussion about him I don't think so but I do understand why people looked at that yesterday or looked at his performance yesterday and had worries. I don't quite get the anger because I've seen that question and some of the comments about Saka framed in a very different way, right?

57:35I don't think he needs a kick up the backside. I think he just needs to start finishing the chances that he's getting. If he wasn't getting the chances, I'd be more worried. But I have seen people really, really angry with Bikai Osaka.

57:49Andrew Mangan: Is that the contract, do you think? Yeah, I think so. I think so. The idea that we've been scarred maybe a little in the past by players who've got big contracts and haven't really delivered after that. But I think there's a slight difference with Saka in that a couple of those players were towards the later stages of their careers when they got those contracts. so we're perhaps more inclined to feel comfortable than somebody who's still only 25 years of age you know um so i think it is i think it might be you know a key factor in the way people are reacting i don't get i i understand not being happy with the way he's playing i understand maybe wanting somebody else to get a go whether whether it's nani maduweke or max damon or whatever it might be I do understand that but I also think you can be critical of a player's performance and maybe worried about where he is and where his game is without you know without going two-footed in on a player who has given this club a lot and if he's not quite the same player that he was physically if he has lost something physically and I tend to agree with you by the way pace was never his strong suit but i think maybe that little burst over the first yard or two to get him away from defenders isn't quite there it didn't happen because he was out fucking water skiing in his spare time it's because he played every fucking game every minute of every game for arsenal um in the previous four or five years basically right yeah it's a running Boots it off the pitch.

59:33Exactly. If he wasn't being played into the ground, he was being kicked into it by opposition defenders. And there was a time where when that subject was broached and maybe the idea of Saka getting more protection was being broached, I remember one of Mikel Arteta's answers being, well, that's what happens when you're one of the best players. You're going to have to learn how to live with that. And that's true to an extent, right? But let's not ignore the fact that any physical impairment that Bikai Osaka might have now is because of him being available, playing, putting his body on the line to the point where his hamstring fucking reefed in half, you know?

1:00:21No. So I think people need to remember that.

1:00:25Andrew Mangan: Yeah, I think that's right. I do wonder if some of the anger as well with the contract, it's not solely a case of sort of, does he deserve it? Does he justify it? It's also maybe people thinking, well, that means Arsenal have really committed to this player in this position. You know, that's resource that could be applied to, you know, I don't know, a new signing. And they haven't, they've really, you know, Clearly, they feel Saka is absolutely the man for that position. And therefore, there's a kind of anxiety around his performances. You know, is he good enough? Is he going to deliver what we need him to?

1:01:06I'm really intrigued by some of these central positions he's taken up. And by the way, some of the positions on the left-hand side he's taken up too. Well, I mean, we talked about his role in the goal, that he played a part in that. He was poor yesterday, but he played a part in the goal, you know, by drifting into an area where the opposition don't expect him to be.

1:01:28Andrew Mangan: Absolutely. And that's something that I think Mikel Arteta's Arsenal teams have maybe not done enough off, is that kind of doubling up, swapping sides, creating overloads in that less predictable fashion. But also the central areas he's taking up. I mean, lots of players go through a period where they lose some of their explosiveness or their acceleration. Maybe it happens typically a bit later in their careers than 25, a Saka is, but bear in mind, he's already been playing pretty much week in, week out at the top level since he was about 17, 18.

1:02:04Andrew Mangan: Can he adapt his game to be a kind of big contributor, produce good numbers for Arsenal? I think he is smart enough and I think Miklard Terry is smart enough to find a way to utilise him that makes him effective, that is maybe less reliant on that blistering speed. But look, no one's trying to tell you he had a good game yesterday. That's for sure. And I think, yeah, if he didn't play on Tuesday night, I'd have no issue with that. What about you as regards to Tuesday?

1:02:45Depends what he does on the left, you know.

1:02:51I wouldn't have an issue, like you said, with Maduweke on the right and Eze on the left on Tuesday. If you're going to play Eze on the left, Maduweke seems like the right decision to fill in on the right-hand side if you want to rest Bakayo Saka. Or, I don't know, is it too much to ask Max Dowman to start a Champions League game? I don't know. I did find myself wondering how close Max Dowman might have been to getting on yesterday, especially at 1-0 down.

1:03:19Andrew Mangan: I was thinking, I wonder if Mikel is tempted by that particular roll of the dice. As it turned out, you know, we kind of managed it without him. But, yeah, he's pushing and pushing and pushing for first two minutes. So it wouldn't surprise me if he got some on Tuesday night. Yeah, yeah, fair enough. Question, question. Here's one from Chargwee who says, were much more creative, quick and efficient from open play this season. And Bruno Gimaraes' goal is a good illustration of that. What explains it in your opinion? Is it a mental thing as in, we're not carrying the weight of the title anymore? Is it Odegaard being fit, a broader tactical change, a change in midfield profiles with Bruno and Lewis Skelly or all of the above, or maybe something else?

1:04:11Andrew Mangan: I think Odegaard's a big part of it. I think he's a really big part of it in terms of his availability, his form, his confidence. I mean, obviously Bruno brings a new dimension to our midfield. He's a new signing. I think Myles is a bit more inventive, ambitious in his range of passing than maybe Martin Zubemendi. I think he looks forward more, looks through the lines more. but I think really, yeah, Odegaard and Bruno being available adds something. I mean, I think it's been true across the season that we've looked better in open play. We've carried more threat. We've created more open play opportunities.

1:04:59Andrew Mangan: You know, we look strangely, despite not a massive summer rebuild or anything like it, we look quite a different team. And I do think those psychological components like having won the Premier League, taking some of the pressure off. I think they factor into this as well. But primarily, I think it's about, yeah, profile of players. Having a centre-forward as well in Kai Havertz, who's maybe a more natural combination player. I think that changes the kind of football you play as well. So I think there are lots of factors, but I think it's an encouraging development. I don't really have anything to add to that.

1:05:33I think you've covered it, but I did want to ask you another one if that's okay. It comes from Tola on the Discord, who says, It's clear our finishers had a big impact on the result, but could the issue actually have been the significant left-footedness of our front line? Five of our six starting midfielders slash forwards were left-footed, and it did seem to contribute to a predictability in our attack. Is this something Arteta might have failed to consider when deciding not to start Ezey Ockerez and Gimmaras, etc.?

1:06:03Andrew Mangan: Yeah, it's really interesting that, isn't it? He loves a lefty, Mikael. but the interesting thing about left-footed players and tell me if you think I'm wrong on this and this is partly experiential like of my own life is that I think left-footed players do tend to be a bit more one-footed like I think with right-footed players there's a real focus on oh you know use your weak foot and develop that part of your game but I think when players are left-footers they're sort of specialists and there's less emphasis on that in their development. So maybe that's a bit of an issue. I mean, it was interesting to see the left-hand side with two left-footers.

1:06:46Andrew Mangan: In Calafiore and Madueke, we haven't seen that too frequently at Arsenal for a long time. You know, Mikel tends to like more balance than that and more of a natural kind of interplay of players who want to go on the inside versus the outside. I really do think while Maduweke and Caldwell, they both like a run in field, don't get me wrong. I do think that was about trying where possible to stretch the play against the Leeds side who are pretty organised and pretty adept at making the pitch feel quite congested. But yeah, I mean, we must be as left-footed a team as there is out there, really. Yeah, I think so.

1:07:26I think so. I think there is a balance issue, to be honest. I do think there is a balance issue. That said, Matuweke right-footed cross, you know, to bring about the goal for a left-footed Calafuri to score. And then maybe there is something, you know, that we have Saka and Odegaard combining two right-footed players in Rice and Gimaraish combining for the goal. I don't know. I mean, it was actually a very,

1:07:51Andrew Mangan: it was a very sort of Arsenal right-side move on the left side. You know, if that was Bakara Saka ducking in field or Martin Odegaard and crossing to the far post, you wouldn't bat an eyelid, would you? But we don't expect that from Nonny on that flank. There has been a nice balance on that side for the most part with Solis and Calafuri, and they've had quite a promising partnership. So, yeah, it'll be interesting to see how we cope without him. I mean, you know, Eze does feel the more analogous player, but, you know, Matawaki doesn't, I don't think he'd, He doesn't really deserve to lose his place per se after his performance on Saturday.

1:08:31Andrew Mangan: So it's going to be interesting to see how that one goes. But yeah, we've got a ton of lefties in that front line. Yeah. And Max Dowman, another one. True.

1:08:45Here is a question. Yes, this annoyed me a bit in the game. How did you feel about this? Sly Horse said, how many times does Raya have to sprint to the edge of his box, arm cocked and ready to unleash a lethal break before the rest of the team realises they're actually allowed to run forward? Yeah. Yeah, I know the exact moment he's talking about in the game as well, because I recognise that.

1:09:10Andrew Mangan: I think there were a few, to be honest, from being sat behind the goal. Several times it felt like Raya, you know, he's almost that cheat code of being able to come out and claim stuff and regain possession, but it just felt like we didn't have the direct sprint speed to capitalise or the movement wasn't there or the opportunity to play the ball. I don't know, but there were several times where he went to release it and nothing was quite on. Maybe he's just saving us, you know, because we're so bad on the counterattack that, you know, if we did actually get the ball up the pitch and get players running towards the opposition goal, We'd make a mess of it and we'd all just be really frustrated by it.

1:09:51I mean, there was one, wasn't there, a really good kick, I think, to Havertz over on the left-hand side. But, yeah, I know that feeling where you're just looking for Arsenal to really stretch and really sprint. I'd need to examine those scenarios again a little bit, whether you've got players who've just sprinted all the way back and are taking a breather and aren't ready to go forward again. I don't know. But it is a bit of a running theme, isn't it?

1:10:25Andrew Mangan: Yeah, it is. And, you know, I've said before, but the sight of Gabriel Martinelli herring off towards the corner flag to chase after a long ball, that was, you know, a big part of his game at Arsenal. So I think that is something we maybe slightly missed there. But I think it's also about, it's not just about like the forward line. It's about the midfield players being available for that quick throw. You know what I mean? I just feel like we don't seem particularly smart in those moments. We don't seem like there's a clear plan of how to attack in those moments or what we're trying to do. So, yeah, it's definitely an area for potential improvement.

1:11:13Here's a question. I thought this was interesting. from Wcampo33, who says, in his post-game press conference, Arteta, who seemed irritated, said that he's spoken to Declan Rice about his role this season, saying he's no longer a lighthouse. He wouldn't elaborate on any new metaphors, but said Rice needs to go up a level. And Wcampo is asking, if not a lighthouse, what metaphor do you think he has in mind? Some kind of De Bruyne or Rodri hybrid? But the question was about Rice's role and whether it's changed this season, Arteta said, I went to him and said, and it's a private conversation, and then he told us what he said.

1:11:53Yeah, it's not that private. Not that private. But you are not the lighthouse anymore. You are something else. At the end of the season, I can tell you what and where I want to take him, but he's not the lighthouse anymore. He's something else, and he needs to prove that on the pitch. what kind of structure by the sea with a gigantic bulb is Declan Rice now, if not a lighthouse? I can't wait for us to get to the end of the season so Mikel will reveal that Declan Rice is now a windmill or whatever it is.

1:12:29Andrew Mangan: You know what I mean? You are a cathedral, Declan. I mean, the lighthouse thing, I think, was part of the initial pitch to Dek, to come and play for Arsenal. This idea of like, we see you as this beacon, what you transmit to others. Probably with some sort of like chat GPT AI thing of Declan Rice as a lighthouse, I imagine. I think this was pre all that AI slop. Okay. He just got Albert Steubenberg to draw it for him. Yeah. Or Michel Arteta himself, as we know, is a keen doodler and a very fine doodler. Yes, that's true. This is you as a lighthouse. And Deck is looking at it. And underneath the lighthouse, there are two big rocks.

1:13:25And it's supposed to look like a lighthouse. Ignore what you're seeing there.

1:13:31Andrew Mangan: yeah exactly um i don't think that's what he's saying declin rice now is for the record no um it was interesting i mean look rice's performance changed i think in the course of this game it was interesting because early on when he was playing with miles he was while they weren't in fixed positions he was a little bit more over towards the right hand side and then once bruno came on He had those two moments in the box in that kind of inside left, left date channel. You know, there was the flick for Bruno and then that lovely bit of skill to leave the Leeds defender stranded. So, and they were a little bit more familiar in terms of positions we've seen Rice kind of charging into before.

1:14:23Yeah, I don't quite know what Mikel meant there. Maybe he meant it's less about what Dek transmits to others now and more about what he individually can contribute and be more of a match winner. Can he be that kind of Gondwan figure at Arsenal? I have to say, I think Bruno is sort of stylistically the more natural fit for that. But yeah, I mean, he likes his imagery, Mikhail. So I look forward to finding out what inanimate objects

1:15:02Andrew Mangan: Declan ultimately is. What kind of building is he? Well, I mean, yeah. You're a feed barn.

1:15:12Andrew Mangan: Exactly, yeah. And Dexter sat there going, okay, sure. Whatever you say, boss. whatever it is I liked what it kind of unlocked in him you say three assists I think he's got this season I think they're predominantly open play assists as well well we haven't scored from a set piece yet so they have to be well there you go once we start doing that it'll be away be on for the record do you think it's about goals do you think there's an element of of wanting to get more goals out of Declan Rice I feel like we should I do too, yeah he's such a good ball striker yeah, like he really is and he's quite composed in those situations so yeah, maybe that might be part of it I'm intrigued because I kind of think with Declan Rice he can kind of do anything really like he can sort of be whatever you need him to be so the question really is what does Mikel Arteta need him to be this season?

1:16:15that might depend on you know various contexts of games opposition availability who he's playing with i suppose the the pleasing thing from arteta's point of view you know above and beyond obviously bruno coming on and scoring the goal was the fact that it was a rice assist for him and he spoke after the brighton game about relationships you know and how these these players need to get used to playing with each other and i think that will be a very positive development in that sense

1:16:41Andrew Mangan: Well, don't worry. Declan Marse will be signing his contract soon. Then he'll be terrible and we can all kill him. His performances will nosedive and we can slag him off every week. Yeah, that's how you do it.

1:16:55Here's a bit of a different question from AaronM94 on Discord. They said, what kind of reception do you think Olivier Giroud will get in midweek? Do you think his Arsenal tenure will be tarnished because of the Chelsea spell? Or do you think he'll get a warm welcome given the player he was for us. That's an interesting one, isn't it? I have to say, despite the Chelsea spell, despite maybe some injudicious comments he made while he was at Chelsea, I don't have a big issue with Olivier Giroud. I think he was a guy who performed pretty consistently for Arsenal. We got basically as much as you can get out of Olivier Giroud.

1:17:39He was mostly, what, a 20-goal-a-season striker pretty much every season thereabouts. And I know he had some spells where he was a bit barren in front of goal. And there was always that sense that he was good, but we need somebody better, you know. But I don't know. I don't have a big problem with him. Do you think memories of his Chelsea spell will color the reception he gets? He's playing for Lille now, so he might start the game. He might be on the bench. Who knows? Yeah, he's 40 years old now, Olivier Giroud, remarkably. It's elder abuse. I think that he will get a decent reception. I think that the Chelsea spell is kind of just about long enough ago now that I think people will let him off.

1:18:30Andrew Mangan: 2021, he left Chelsea five years ago. He's played for three clubs since then, Milan, LAFC and Lille. you know he had six years at Arsenal three at Chelsea I think he'll get a decent a decent welcome but I might be wrong about that and to be honest I don't really judge anyone who's like I can't forgive him you know the fact that he went to another team in London and well I mean he kind of it was part of the the reason why we brought in Aubameyang right yeah it was part of that merry-go-round yeah so we we needed him to go yeah to make it all add up so yeah we told him to basically and you know yeah yeah so what was it it was alexis to united bamian to arsenal girou to miktarian to chelsea miktarion had come in as well now i seem to remember there was a three maybe it was bachua as well was involved on deadline day did he go to Dortmund or there was something like that yeah yeah yeah yeah that freed up a Bamiang to move and then we had to move Giroud on um yeah listen I'm sort of over it to be honest but um okay others may not be uh let's see what else have we got uh boom boom boom boom boom we We talked about Eza.

1:20:04We've done that. I'm sure I had something good here.

1:20:11Yeah, we've done a lot. I had a few Saka ones. I had a Nkappie injury one. One about what building is Declan Rice these days. So, yeah, I've sort of done the main ones. We've done that. Okay, here's one. A is for Arsenal on Blue Sky. bit of an off-field one, but the Gothic Arsenal A has got a revamp unveiled at the Design Museum. Do you agree the current badge slash crest, which I always thought looked quite childish, this is what A is for Arsenal said, not me, do you agree that it feels outdated and should also be redesigned? Well, yes, I mean, it's quite a, it's a relatively, so when was that badge changed, Andrew?

1:20:59early 2000s maybe yeah i think so i think so and i i would say as a piece of design it hasn't aged particularly well that crest um it looks a bit microsoft powerpoint or something doesn't microsoft paint yeah i think it's might be the font or i don't know but it yeah it's not It's 2002 when that happens. It feels quite 2002, I would say. Now, what I would say is credit to the club because they've not been wedded to it.

1:21:35Andrew Mangan: You know, if you look at the kits in recent seasons, some of our most popular shirts, match shirts, have not actually featured the crest. They've just had the cannon emblem. And similarly, the catalogue upon catalogue of merch the club puts out, uses many variants of the Arsenal logo from the Canon to the A to even the old crest, which I love, by the way. I love the imagery of the old crest and the text and the kind of coat of arms look of it. Um, apparently I have asked about this before. Apparently changing the legal mark of the badge is a protracted and very expensive process. Why do we know?

1:22:37Not sure. Not sure. Um,

1:22:42Andrew Mangan: whether it's actually the process of the redesign and the sort of consultancy involved in that, or I suspect maybe more so on the legal side and what it means for your kind of branding across the company and how you have to implement it. But I think, yeah, I would love to see a bit of a, yeah, I would love to see the crest. I was going to say brought up to date, but really what I mean is brought closer back to its origin. and its roots and the crest I grew up with. Equally, at the same time, I'm like, well, at the moment we get to kind of have our cake and eat it in that we can have the cannon on a shirt and that's absolutely fine.

1:23:30Andrew Mangan: And the Premier League allows us to do that. And I think it keeps everybody happy. I mean, the other thing I would say is that when I sort of raised this with the club and spoke to them about it, something they said to me was like, You've got to remember you're part of an older generation of fans. And there are a lot of people for whom this 2002 crest, they have a really positive association with it and it's all they've known. And so, yeah, you know, I see it from a particular angle, but that is individual to me. What's your feeling about it? I mean, I do think it is a bit tired. Yeah. it's not particularly I like just the canon on its own you know I think that that stands out on its own but the sort of badge around it I don't know it even at the time it was like is that it really that's what we're doing here I think it could be improved for sure quite how though it's one of those things that you know it's like kits People come, a kit gets released and everyone's like, I hate this.

1:24:43This kit is terrible. I fucking, and other people are like, I love this. You know, whatever little design flourishes, whether it's a collar or whether it's stripes around the arms or whatever it is, people are going to be divided on it. I don't think you're going to get something that everybody unanimously is going to love. But I do think that that 2002 crest or badge does feel a bit kind of jaded at this point.

1:25:08Andrew Mangan: you know yeah and you know we're we're blessed with a fleet of talented arsenal fans who will all have ideas i mean there's a exhibition i think sadly it ends today sunday at the design museum in london about the new typefaces that have been created for the club and the sort of history of the club's visual identity um there's a few like videos about it on instagram and other social media, which are worth a look if you are interested in that stuff. But yeah, I think Arsenal are so conscious of their image and their brand and they market their brand as well as anybody in football, I think. I'm sure these discussions are being had.

1:25:59Yeah, I mean, that was the rationale, wasn't it, for the change was that they couldn't protect it, protect it by which, you know, it means exclusive use for the club that they can sort of crack down on anybody who's using that crest in a way, you know, I mean, you had experience of it, didn't you? You know, the, the way, the way they protect it because of. Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I had a cease and desist back in the day. Yeah.

1:26:32Andrew Mangan: and I think eventually you know Did you cease or desist? Which was it? Bit of both but I think as far as I understand it if you kind of if you hold copyright and you have legally kind of defensible marks you have to be seen to be defending them right? Like it's part of an exercise so the club ultimately kind of let it go. But, you know, I had the Canon mark included in the Gunnerblog logo and things like that. And that was a bone of contention at one point in time. I mean, a big thing for a lot of people of a certain generation is the idea that the Canon is pointing the wrong way in the current badge.

1:27:18Andrew Mangan: That's something people say a lot. Yeah, you can tell what era you're from as an Arsenal fan, depending on how you feel about the direction of the Canon. Yeah. Well, you know, can't be too many fans from the 1920s left. I mean, what's your, like, what do you, do you have like a preferred Arsenal mark or logo that you particularly strongly identify with? I guess it's just the Canon, the one that was on the Cup Final shirt in 1979. So it's just the Canon. And that's the one that I think I like the most. you know I think that represents when I see that I just think of Arsenal you know and that's even true of the new Canon um but that's the one I I really like you know that I wish we just had that on our shirts rather than some version of the badge even if it's a stencil or a cutout version as it seems to be this season isn't it certainly on the home shirt it's that kind of stencil I just think the the sort of the badge bid is kind of redundant do we need the word arsenal on the shirt i think we all know who we're looking at um so we don't need that above the bar i think just the canon would be great but you know those i must say i really like not not for a match shirt but for you know uh merchandising and things like that i also really love the gothic the gothic yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:28:51A for Andrew. That's what it's for, actually, you know. A for us, blog, man. That's also very, very true. All right. I think we'll leave it there and get this podcast out to everybody for some Sunday listening, if they're listening on a Sunday. If not, if you're listening later, hopefully you've been entertained by the mayhem that happens at Anfield a bit later on this afternoon. But nevertheless, we hope you've enjoyed the show. We will have an episode of The 30 for you tomorrow over on Patreon. That's looking back at all the weekend's Premier League action. So you can join us for that, patreon.com forward slash rsplug.

1:29:24And we'll talk to you during the week, of course, because we do play Champions League on Tuesday against Lille. So for now, folks, take it easy. Have a great Sunday. And we will catch you on the next one.

1:29:33Andrew Mangan: Bye-bye.

1:30:03We'll be right back. reporting that tracks every win. Let's redefine what's possible together. Get started for free