In short
Joe Wicks (The Body Coach) discusses why people quit exercising in January and how to make lasting change through small, repeatable movement habits. He connects exercise to mental health, motivation, and avoiding ultra-processed food/sugar binges. He also shares his childhood experiences with addiction and OCD/mental health in his family, arguing that the “antidote to addiction is connection.”
Guest backgrounds
The guest is Joe Wicks, a UK fitness entrepreneur and former PE teacher known for “PE with Joe” and school-based workouts. The host is not clearly identified in the transcript.
Key claims
Don’t “transform your life in one day”; start small (e.g., 15 minutes, 3x/week). Expect delayed onset muscle soreness (DOMS) and push through the initial weeks. Exercise improves mood/energy and can be a first response instead of turning to ultra-processed foods. Connection helps addiction recovery; unconditional love matters.
Notable examples
Joe’s childhood: mother with severe anxiety/OCD-like cleaning and father with heroin addiction and relapse dishonesty. He used running/sports as emotional release. “PE with Joe” launched during UK lockdown after going live daily for 18 weeks, reaching hundreds of thousands to nearly a million live connections. He started his first boot camp with a bike trailer, flyers outside Richmond station, and small direct-debit growth.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOThe Importance of Exercise
0:30 to 1:33
Discover how exercise can positively impact your life and well-being.
“That's a really amazing medicine which you can use every day.”
Jo Wicks: An Introduction
1:33 to 2:54
Meet Jo Wicks and learn about his impact on fitness in the UK.
“Everyone else comes first in this life, but actually you've got to find time for yourself.”
Jo's Childhood and Family Dynamics
2:54 to 6:07
Explore Jo's experiences growing up in a challenging household and its effects.
“You've been getting the nation fit for years, way more years before me.”
Coping with Family Addiction
6:07 to 10:40
Understand Jo's journey of coping with his father's addiction and its impact.
Brothers and Their Bonds
10:40 to 14:01
Learn about the relationship between Jo and his brothers and their shared experiences.
“or the burden of their childhood, were you always like that?”
Understanding Addiction and Family Dynamics
14:01 to 18:00
Explore the complexities of addiction and its impact on family relationships.
“He was the first to handle it all, which in a way Caroline freed me up to be a bit looser.”
The Role of Exercise in Mental Health
18:01 to 22:32
Learn how exercise serves as a vital tool for mental well-being and connection.
“I'm like quite like this and even Rosie is and, you know, my brother.”
Overcoming Barriers to Fitness
22:33 to 25:14
Understand common obstacles to fitness and how to address them effectively.
Personal Stories of Resilience
25:15 to 27:22
Listen to personal experiences that highlight the journey of returning to fitness.
“And the only reason I knew if I'd worked out was if I had DOMS.”
Joe's Journey During Lockdown
29:36 to 32:10
Joe discusses the impact of lockdown on fitness and his live workout initiative.
“I want to quickly go back to lockdown for you as well and what that was like.”
Show all 28 chapters
Starting a Boot Camp: Joe's Early Struggles
32:10 to 35:13
Joe shares his experiences of starting a boot camp and the challenges he faced.
“I think the one thing I'll always be remembered for is pee with Jo in lockdown.”
The Evolution of Joe's Career
35:13 to 37:43
Joe reflects on his journey from personal trainer to fitness influencer.
“So he was just an editor doing this thing and a journalist.”
The Importance of Fitness and Authenticity
37:43 to 41:39
Discussion on the significance of fitness, authenticity, and personal experiences.
“I think you've just made me think about something there and it was interesting because um what Jackie and Mark who were my trainers and Jackie and Mark were married and Jackie was a gymnast, former gymnast.”
Encouraging a New Fitness Journey
41:39 to 42:06
Tips for those struggling with fitness and the benefits of starting small.
Starting Small: The Key to Sustainable Change
42:06 to 43:38
Learn how starting small can lead to significant changes in your health routine.
The Dangers of Ultra-Processed Foods
43:38 to 46:04
Discover the mental health impacts of ultra-processed foods and the challenges of cutting them out.
“food and what an enormous and profound effect that has on our mental health as well.”
Awareness Through Provocation: The Killer Bar
46:42 to 51:42
Uncover the implications of ultra-processed protein bars on health and public perception.
“and we're going to be talking a lot more about that in a minute.”
The Importance of Cooking with Whole Foods
51:42 to 54:57
Learn why returning to home cooking and whole foods is essential for health.
Reevaluating Protein Bars: A Personal Reflection
54:57 to 56:00
Hear a personal discussion on the misconceptions surrounding protein bars and healthier protein sources.
Rethinking Protein Bars and Processed Foods
56:00 to 57:50
Explore the misconceptions around protein bars and the prevalence of ultra-processed foods.
“I've eaten protein bars thinking, oh, it's fine.”
Struggles with Sugar and Treats
57:50 to 1:00:05
Discuss the challenges of managing sugar cravings and enjoying treats in moderation.
“But then if I've eaten that pudding that day, the next day, sugar is talking to me everywhere.”
Top Tips for a Healthy Start to the Year
1:00:05 to 1:02:30
Learn simple tips for improving health, including the importance of sleep and cooking.
“that I would immediately want to feed with more sugar.”
Snacking and Its Impact on Diet
1:02:30 to 1:04:25
Understand how snacking can derail diet goals and how to manage it effectively.
Finding Balance in Family Life
1:04:25 to 1:07:06
Hear about balancing family commitments while promoting healthy habits for kids.
“And you think, how many calories have I just eaten?”
Encouraging Active Lifestyles for Kids
1:07:06 to 1:10:00
Explore strategies to instill a love for movement and healthy eating in children.
“And I want to be, I want to be there for her.”
Encouraging Kids to Stay Active
1:10:00 to 1:10:59
Learn how to engage children in physical activity and the challenges of parenting teens.
Music and Movement for Kids
1:11:00 to 1:11:26
Discover the role of music in getting kids to move and have fun at home.
“is a brilliant way of getting kids moving.”
Reflecting on the Conversation
1:11:27 to 1:11:59
Hear a heartfelt reflection on the positive energy and respect shared during the chat.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:01Davina McCall:Not sure how to tackle your taxes? Are you sweating the small print? You may be experiencing FOMO, the fear of messing up. The answer? Using TurboTax on Intuit Credit Karma. They help you get your biggest refund and then we help you do more with it with a personalized plan designed to help you hit your money goals. It's time to take your taxes to the max. Start filing today in the Credit Karma app. Exercise and movement is the answer. That's a really amazing medicine which you can use every day. Don't wait for the perfect conditions because they won't come. You have to create that time. The only answer really is...
0:40Davina McCall:You have done so much for this country. You have helped us get fit. I had no money. I didn't have a van. All I had was a clip on trail on the back of my bike. And how would you try and drum up business? I had little flyers that I'd give out outside Richmond station. I was there like day in, day out, giving out flyers, hoping that someone would take one. Don't try and transform your life in one day and revolutionize everything because you'll end up falling off the wagon and you lose motivation. Whether you're two years old or 72 years old, you always feel better after a workout. And it doesn't solve all the problems in your world, but it's at least known that on those days, rather than turning to ultra-processed food and sugar to make you feel better or whatever, having that exercise as the first sort of thing to try, it can transform how you feel in the day.
1:19How can we enthuse people to start on that journey? Just know that everything in life will change when you start to take care of yourself. Yes. And your body and your mood and your energy, which really comes through.
1:31Davina McCall:Wow! If you want to live a positive life and live in a positive head, I think you've got to be moving the body a little bit. Everyone else comes first in this life, but actually you've got to find time for yourself. But I'll tell you what I'm going to do, Jo. First of all, I'm going to blow smoke up your arse because - You don't need to do that. I am absolutely going to do it. You literally are changing the world I mean, you, I see your soul, Jo I honestly do And you have done so much for this country You have helped us get fit And you have helped the nation get fit You have helped us help our kids get fit.
2:22Now very seriously trying to help us become better around ultra-processed foods
2:30Davina McCall:and lobby the government about that. And I'd like to also ask you how we can all help you do that in the future. But above all of that, I think you are just a really good man that wants to do good in the world. And we love you. and I'm so pleased you're here and I cannot wait to talk to you. That's a lovely thing to say, lovely way to introduce the conversation. I feel the same about you. I'm carrying on your work. You've been getting the nation fit for years, way more years before me. So I just love, you know, I love that part of what I do, but it's so nice to finally get to sit down. We cross paths and have a little chat in there, but to actually sit and have a proper conversation would be really nice.
3:09Davina McCall:I knew that we shared the same passion around health and fitness, but I had no idea until I did a bit more of a deep dive into you about your childhood and I don't want to dwell on it for too much and I know you've talked a lot about it you know on Diary of a CEO but I I would like to um touch on what it was like growing up in your in your house as a kid because it did have such a profound effect on who you are today yeah of course yeah I've shared this story a few times now because I did Desert Island Disc I think was the first time I publicly spoke about um my childhood because people often see you as this person and they think that this is a story and this is all they don't really know the backstory and then so when I did that podcast I sort of opened up the conversation around you know growing up as a child in a home of addiction and um you know I won't sit here and pretend I had a really miserable unhappy child because I have lots of fond memories but there's lots of also blank spaces and sort of chaos and this dysfunction I lived in, which comes with living with two parents of mental health.
4:12So my mum essentially had extreme anxiety and OCD around housework and cleaning and, you know, eating disorders, all that sort of stuff, quite manic in the sense.
4:23Davina McCall:What did that look like? What did the OCD look like? How does that manifest itself for anybody that doesn't really know what OCD is? Yeah, so I didn't know at the time my mum had OCD. I just thought my mum was obsessed. and like cleaning i just thought she just would love to clean house but it was like you know i couldn't make any noise we couldn't like bring friends home and we couldn't make mess and everything had a place it was like living in an ikea showroom you know everything had its own little spot and you know my mum would be deep cleaning like every day it wasn't like once a week it was like the cupboard to be emptied out she'd be scrubbing things and there's a story behind that and understanding that and it's one of those things you don't know at the time this is just normal this is like normality it was only when i went to other people's houses and i could wear my shoes in the house or you know walk in and make a bit of mess and their parents weren't you know really really anxious and upset by that that I realized oh things weren't as normal at home but you know even being a young kid I remember having to make my bed and that's me really tightly pulled really tight like it was in a hotel you know so it had to be like really really neat and we had what I remember one room had black carpets right and she would make us hoover the hoover our bedroom but not with the wide part yeah yeah yeah part like we always a A little bit that you do for upholstery.
5:31Yeah, because she wanted to see the lines because she needed to know that it had been cleaned. So it was just like, yeah, it was just normal, but it was also stressful because I would be like, you know, effing and blind and wanting to like revolt and say I don't want to clean my room and don't want to be a part of this. But it was just really, it was really sort of chaotic living in that environment with her. And then couple that with my dad, who was, you know, in and out of my life through addiction from heroin addiction. It was like, you know, he was there for six months, then he's in rehab then he'd be in Bournemouth for a couple of years trying to detox and do rehab there and it was like I had these moments of sort of spending time with him but it was just it was always like I knew I knew it wasn't gonna last forever and so quite I suppose just unstable that was the feeling I felt like he's there and then he's not and it was like this sort of like secret that is he using is he not and so a lot of guilt and shame and a lot of dishonesty like there's a lot you know when you and even to this day like if I ever catch my dad on a relapse or something's going on he'll never admit that he's using you know he'll just deny it he just he has this inability to be honest in that moment and even now I say dad I'd rather just be honest like I'm a fully grown man I'm an adult now like I want to talk to you but he still really really finds it almost impossible to admit that he's using until there's a proper like moment of breakdown where I say look like what's going on and you know he might tell you half the truth but you never get the full
6:48Davina McCall:truth did you become very good at reading people could you just know it was more of a sense of like the energy would shift and like the smells you know around using like the smells and him sort of being asleep all the time because obviously I was very young and I have I have different memories my brother Nicky was 18 months older than me and so he remembers and sees and sort of has recollection things probably more than I did but you know there was things like you know police would knock on the door and the house would be raided and stuff and it was like I'd be taken next door and I'd put with the neighbours for the night and stuff and just just madness but again I had to just get up in the morning and go to school in my little school uniform and be a normal kid and not talk about these things because I felt like although this stuff was happening I knew in my heart I couldn't publicly speak about because I suppose the fear of like social services and they would have intervened like taking me away from my mum and dad was too was too much so I suppressed a lot of that and just sort of bottled it up and somehow managed to sort of get through the day you know I was fascinated to hear you say that because when I used to go and stay with my mum and things would happen in Paris and like she'd take me clubbing at 13 dressed as like total lolita because I could wear anything I wanted and then not look out for me and I'd get into like dodgy suit.
8:13Davina McCall:I mean, really mad stuff. But I knew that when I came back to the UK, I couldn't tell anybody here because they'd stopped me going. Right. And even though I didn't feel safe, I didn't want to stop seeing her. It's so funny for a kid, isn't it? You wanted that relationship, yeah. That you wanted to stay there and you didn't want to leave your mum and dad even though you were having to cope with an extraordinary amount of stress really for someone your age. It's only now as a parent to young kids, you know, I've got four kids under seven, that I realise how much love and care and affection and gentleness they need.
8:56That I think, how did I get through that and come out how I am? And like you said about the care, sorry, about the did I get to learn to read people? I learned how to care for people. So I think, you know, even now, like I'm quite a caring, empathetic person. I think about people's emotions a lot and I worry about people a lot. And that probably comes from this fear of like my dad getting caught relapsing because, you know, then we kicked out and then my mum's issues. It was it was definitely something that I learned I was aware of. And I think it made me sort of I don't know. And then you sort of question, is it me?
9:29I remember having conversations like, is my dad used in taking drug because, you know, we're not enough and he doesn't love us. but I've now learned to understand actually he loved us in spite of his addiction and and I always felt safe even though there was madness like that stuff about the police knocking the door down and stuff like and I have visions of you know we had these because we lived in a council flat it was like cheap plywood doors with like honeycomb inside like cardboard because there'd be holes in it I only knew that because there was holes in it because you know maybe my mum and dad had an argument and there was a punch through the wall you know so these little things aren't normal I remember those moments but again I don't have like loads of really really sad memories because I I just I just chose to be positive and chose to block out that negative stuff and I sort of think even now I wouldn't change anything like because everything I've been through in that childhood and that environment you know it's shaped who I am today and it's made me Joe the body coach who really wants to help people if I didn't have that experience and that would I still would I really be who I am today and I don't think I would have been so I only see positive in my journey really I don't want to sit here and be resentful and angry about the past.
10:35I really, really just focus on the future, really.
10:37Davina McCall:Can I ask you, for anybody that might be carrying some weight or the burden of their childhood, were you always like that? And how were your brothers? Did they grow up with the same sort of vibe as you or are you a kind of lone wolf in in your family of positivity well I'm one of three boys my older brother Nicky is 18 months older than me and he's the best friend and my little brother George is 10 years younger so he came along same mum and dad they're separated now um and you know my little brother you know bless him he's actually in recovery himself so he kind of experienced two lives really where he had my dad on the weekends and my mum during the week and he ended up you know experiencing those addiction those addiction i think it's because he had a lot more freedom and flexibility to just like be do what he wanted on the weekends whereas my mum although although it was madness she was so strict with us and we we knew the boundaries we had to if she said you're home at 10 o 'clock on a friday night would be home at 10 o 'clock you know we we really had she she knew that if she didn't rein us in we would end up you know like other kids down the street down the pub well not the pub you know down the park drinking smoking weed and so she really kept us at that on on rains um but i think for me i was always the really hyperactive kid you know energetic i didn't bottle things up i think for me i knew like if i if i was introvert and withdrawn and held that then the emotions would probably overwhelm me a little bit but my brother nicky was definitely more reserved much more introvert a lot quieter didn't talk about his feelings as much he's much better now as an adult but i was just like this kid that yeah i just sort of just took it in my stride crazy hyperactive obviously that links to like the sport and exercise and the movement side of things I do think movement was how I released it if you like rather than sitting there sort of thinking about and ruminate on these feelings I'd run around I'd climb trees I'd be you know running to school playing sports releasing all that sort of stress if you like from the body so I do think I always exercise was like my sort of like therapy if you like even from a young age um but to anyone that's got like you know trauma or kind of addiction in the family like first thing is to know that you're not alone and don't feel guilt and shame around it the reason i think so many people struggle is because there's so much guilt and shame around addiction and and it's like actually you can although it feels really difficult at the time you can work through these things and you can have a much better relationship one day but it does take a lot of work isn't it i'm i'm quite not knowledgeable and wise now because my dad's been through the 12 steps and i understand addiction and connection and i've listened to gabor martin you know maté and I've listened to loads of wonderful authors and podcasts on this thing of addiction.
13:18But some people don't have this information, so they're sort of trapped in the past a little bit. But there is a way you can work through things and you can let go of that resentment and have a really good relationship with someone today.
13:30Davina McCall:Quite interested in, you know, you were talking about Nicky being your best friend and that he was... It's often the way with first and second-born siblings. and even though I didn't live with my sister, I had a very similar relationship with her. She was actually a bit older. There was a bigger gap, it was six years, but more sensible, had to kind of deal with a different dynamic in a weird way because of her age, a bit like probably Nicky did. He was the first to handle it all, which in a way Caroline freed me up to be a bit looser. you know you said you dealt with it with exercise how did Nicky deal with it we've had conversations because I think yeah like how I see things and how he saw things can be quite different sometimes and he was aware more of you know the conversations around addiction it was always conversations up oh daddy's got to go away because he's got um a bad back you know and he needs to go to get help but he knew and he understood addiction I think much quicker than me which I think I was just too like busy and distracting myself and just being a toddler and running around to sort of really process those emotions but yeah Nicky was definitely more introvert he's very sensitive he's very caring very loving and I think we're both quite we're both carers in a sense and we're still worry and care about our kids and our you know our parents a lot but you know we um we work together now at the body coach he's the CEO yeah we're so nice and but he does I do describe as my guardian angel because I think he protected me and there was times when he said to me like he knew my dad had been using and relapsing but he didn't want to let my mum know because he told my mum me get kicked out and so i think he was living with a lot more like anxiety than i probably was um and yes it's sad that he experienced that but as an adult now like he's an amazing dad and one thing i'll say about my dad right is that i've learned to be a really really good dad and be really present and really kind and caring and you know i didn't experience that because not because my dad didn't love me and it's because he wasn't able to you know when you're using heroin you know like you're just like a zombie you're just like so sedentary and it's not like it's manic like he's doing coke and running around and being all fun like it was just like the opposite it was just like he was there but he wasn't he'd be asleep and I couldn't you know I couldn't sort of depend on him with any consistency and and that was the hardest thing and I feel sad for him that he missed out on so much you know as a parent now and I'm there for my kids like I feel sad on what it's not even what I missed out and it's really what he missed out on through all those years of addiction but you know I just have much more understanding right now and where I went through those years of like resentful and angry and fucking pushing him away and i can't deal with this so now actually when he's having a tough time and i can feel him pulling away i know he's slipping into those sort of behaviors and not going to meetings and stuff then i sort of ring him and say come around come and spend time with the kids just sort of like bring him back into it but that's taken a long time to come to this point of understanding addiction and the connection is really important because otherwise they just feel more more lonely more and they just want to go and smash it and go on a binge again you know and cane it i mean it's amazing that you are still caring really at the end of the day for your dad and trying to make sure that he's okay it's quite it feels like a lot to keep trying to keep everyone all right yeah you know what i've what i've come to realize he even now like my dad's gone to the real sorry not real he's gone to the convention in Spain it's like this constant fear and not constant fear it's this constant feeling feeling of like nothing I do can make my dad happy do you know I mean it has to come from with him and so I can support him financially I can help him in that way but it's like with addiction it's such an internal thing and it's such a it's just a thing that he's going to carry his whole life and I you know my dad's in his 60s now but it's like he's not out the woods although he's not using hard drugs I still I'm constantly just thinking a relapse is coming oh we haven't spoke to him for a few weeks so he's pulled away and it's like this constant up and down so yeah like there's there's definitely this i i shouldn't have to parent my parents but i do so i'm looking after four kids and my mom and dad and it's not necessarily a bad thing but it is this constant thing that's that's on mine and my brother's shoulders i'd say on both of them because we're always like have you heard from dad no all right you know what's going on and i've sent my dad around the world to do yoga go and santa mona go and stay at the house going like but it's like Like, you know, addiction is this thing that it's always with you.
17:45And it's like, it's never an easy thing. So, yeah, it's just something I've come to live with now and accept that I have to love him unconditionally. I can't love you just when you're clean. I have to love him unconditionally. But it's definitely been the hardest part of my life because I'm consistent. I'm like quite like this and even Rosie is and, you know, my brother. But with my dad and my mum, it's just they do struggle with their mental health and they're up and down a lot, you know. I just I never forget this term I heard. And I've said this once before. you know, it's understanding the antidote to addiction is connection.
18:16Yes. So where you want to push someone away and just, I can't be around you right now. And I definitely felt that at times as a teenager, as an adult, it's like, actually, if I do that, I know that he's going to feel more lonely. You know, he's got, he's going to feel more depressed and more, you know, more isolated. And actually like what he really needs is me to say, I love you, dad. Come and spend some time with me. I want to be around you. Let's talk. Let's, you know, how are you doing? And just have a workout. I want to jump in the ice bath. Just little, little things like that, that bringing back to the reality of actually life ain't that bad dude like you've got you're comfortable like you've got grandkids and kids that love you like you're not alone and yeah you know it's it's hard because I can't relate to that feeling you know I don't understand what that feeling is like and to want to feel a void so much and use drugs to self-medicate that I use exercise to self-medicate I physically smash myself in the gym and I love that how I feel afterwards but you know my dad has used you know drugs and my mum has used you know eating disorders and and sort of control through housework and tidying and keen to deal with her sort of childhood stuff as well.
19:13But I'm just blessed that I had a really great PE teacher, you know, and someone that inspired me when I was young. Is that what it was? I think so, yeah. I think it was just my PE teachers, they loved me. They never kicked me out of class. I was there in the class. They wanted me to be there. And I just remember thinking how I felt at the end of a workout or doing some sort of sport. And that is really today why I still love doing what I do because people need to feel that and they often don't. And I've got to just remind them and get kids moving and get parents thinking like actually you might be on a tough day but exercise and movement is the answer that's a really amazing medicine which you can use every day I love that I love that
19:47Davina McCall:phrase I've never regretted a workout yeah you don't want to do it but then you do it you never get at the end of it go god I wish I hadn't done that workout I think you know okay this is the first of January today 2026 and this is when people think right I'm resetting my life I've absolutely splurged at the end of last year I want to be the person I believe I can be and fitness is often a big part of that yeah how can we enthuse people to start on that journey how can you encourage somebody to find it in themselves to want to do it yeah this is the biggest challenge isn't it if you if you are an adult and you're sedentary and you really had a really negative relationship with sport and fitness as a kid and you find it really really difficult it's gonna be really hard for you to get moving and so I always say to people like we've got to try and get our kids you know our youngest possible kids that from the earliest age it's possible like moving and exercising and feeling good so I've done a lot of work this year with um I've done an animation called activate it's like an animated series activate is amazing do you like it oh my god it's like an animation of myself for little workouts for kids it's so good and what is clever is that you don't have to be doing it all the time so you can you've freed up time to do something else but it's you yeah because I do love you know I love my animation and I love visiting schools and I love doing workouts with kids and I went to a school the other day and I love I can't visit every school in the UK but the reason PE was a big moment for me because it taught me that actually whatever's going on at my in my head and at home I could deal with that emotion those feelings with movement and exercise so you know when I visit schools I I don't talk about so much the body and physical.
21:29It's more about the mind. It's going to give you energy. I want to make you feel happier. We're going to get you feeling good. These measures are really important. So I do so much work with young people because I think if you're not doing it and they're not learning at school, they're not being taught at home and inspired to move, we're going to really struggle with their mental health in the future. And so to anyone listening that is feeling like, I don't believe that or it just doesn't work, you've got to be willing to take the first step, haven't you, and get beyond that initial couple of weeks where it sucks, where you feel sick, you've got a headache, you've got DOMS, everything hurts, you know, and you don't...
21:58Just explain to people who don't know what DOMS are. DOMS means like delayed onset muscle soreness. Basically that cramp or that pain or that deep muscle ache when you've done a workout, like first time in a few months and you feel like you can't walk down the stairs or you shake as you sit on the toilet. And that happens sometimes if you do a new exercise or if you do a new form of exercise or you lift heavier weights and things. Or it could just be because you haven't done anything for a while. But, you know, you have to be willing to overcome those initial... difficult months or weeks where it's like I just really only enjoy this because eventually once you get past a certain level of fitness you will like the endorphins and those sort of post-workout high it will come but you know you don't have to be doing it every day it could just be three workouts a week for 20 minutes like start small don't try and transform your life in one day and revolutionize everything because you'll end up um falling off the wagon then you lose motivation
22:47Davina McCall:that's exactly it I think especially January the 1st that people go all guns blazing and then you can't maintain it you know like people have got to really think what can I keep doing every week what can I really afford to give and also if if you do work out so hard that you can't sit down on the loo for five days you're not you're not going to want to do it again so what are the things that you think because i know that for me personally music motivates me oh yeah for sure in terms of exercise yeah yeah i think well i'm a big fan of home workouts like you've always said this like if you can remove the friction and the barriers between you and the workout let's say your dream is a gym membership and a personal trainer but yeah that's hard it's not expensive right not accessible and you might do it for a month but it's really hard to maintain whereas actually getting two pairs of dumbbells or a set of resistance bands and turn your little bedroom or your kitchen into a little workout studio and like look you know we've got millions of trainers around the world sharing amazing workouts so obviously i've got my fitness app and there's the body coach youtube channel but there's also amazing yoga pilates bar there's loads of great content on social media and youtube that you can tap into without any money so you've got to remove the the barrier of money out of the equation for now and then the second barrier the biggest problem we face is time and you don't have to have an hour a day it would be a dream to have a perfect one hour a day workout but you know if you started off with a 15 minute workout a day three days a week that is the that is taking the right direction it's a positive change um and that might shift and eventually you know what i can do 20 minutes a day and then before you know it you sign up for a 5k run or you're doing a marathon you know the transformation from being sedentary you know zero to one is is so amazing but you have to be willing to just like go for a bit discomfort to start with and accept that you know it's going to be things that get in your way there's always barriers isn't there I mean there's kids there's work there's stress there's pressure there's illness colds catching the flu but actually you're always gonna have these challenges but you've still got to find that little bit of time to take care of yourself you know and I think exercise is an essential part of happiness now yeah I used to think it was like this thing that you do to stay fit and not only a certain amount of people do but actually if you want to live positive life and live in a positive head I think you've got to be exercising you've got to be doing something you've got to be moving the body a little bit it is an essential part of happiness I love that.
25:09Davina McCall:That is exactly how I feel. I started working out after I'd had my brain tumour removed, but it had really badly affected my short-term memory. And the only reason I knew if I'd worked out was if I had DOMS. Oh, really? So you could tell? So I'd wake up the next morning and I'd be like, oh, God, wow. And I think, oh, I must have worked out yesterday. But I had no recollection of it. Really? So mad. I bet you like the feeling of DOMS. I love it. Yeah, some people love it. I sort of like it, but not every day. But it's, no, and it's not, it wasn't every day. I'll tell you what I did do twice last year.
25:48Yeah, go on.
25:48Davina McCall:And that was start from scratch and how humbling that is. Because you just stay at a level of fitness where you can just go and do a workout and you won't have terrible DOMS or find it hard to sit down. but I had to stop for three four months with my brain tumor and I had to stop again with the breast cancer at the end of the year and it's been a really good lesson in how hard it is for other people to start again I can imagine how hard was that for you because you love exercise that's a big part of your fit like your identity your energy your mood how did you deal with that Were you completely sentry?
26:30You couldn't do anything?
26:31Davina McCall:Well, after the brain tumour, I didn't remember. I just wasn't aware of how hard it was because I didn't remember I wasn't doing it. But I was walking quite a lot. And nature helped me a lot, being in the wonder of nature. I didn't need to remember nature. It was just there and beautiful. so that helped my mental health walking and seeing nature and I mean you recommend that you know be active yeah can I just say how amazing and strong you look and how healthy you look you've been through you've had such a tough time and you just look amazing I mean that's a testament to how hard you must have got back and worked at it and built that strength back up do you feel good?
27:18Davina McCall:can I be honest I feel bloody great you know 2025 end of the year You know, it was a year of ups and downs, but the outfits were pretty consistently good. Connie, you did such a good job capturing these. They're really, really nice. I love Mel Schilling. I love these. Like, I want to re-share them in some way. You know what I learned from the One Better Guide than Adobe Express? Yeah. Sometimes some of your best assets aren't the new ones. They're often just sitting in your camera roll. You know what you should do? You should make it into a GIF. Oh, great. Yes. And then you could send it in the broadcast channel for Begin Again.
27:55Davina McCall:How do I do that? Shall I show you? Yes! Great. It's really easy. Yeah. Search image to GIF. And then if you just drop in all the images that you want, and then here you can just adjust the timing of each clip. Once you're happy, just click Export, and then you can share it anywhere. Oh my God, that was much easier than I thought. Yeah. If you want to try building GIFs for your business or for your channels, check out the One Better Guide of our sponsor, Adobe Express. It's free and Connie's in it too.
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29:15Davina McCall:New friends. Gary the snake. And your last name? The snake. Dream team. New habitats. Zootopia has a secret reptile population. You can watch the record-breaking phenomenon at home. Zootopia 2, now available on Disney Plus Rated PG. Right now you can get Disney Plus and Hulu for just$4.99 a month for three months with a special limited time offer ends March 24th. After three months, plan auto-renews and$12.99 a month terms apply. I want to quickly go back to lockdown for you as well and what that was like. because when the whole nation was, I was, I don't know what it was like for you, but I know that, you know, obviously it was terrifying for everybody, but especially for people who did kind of workouts or training or gyms, gyms shut down, you couldn't go to any social areas to do anything.
30:06Davina McCall:How long did it take you to come up with this idea of working out online for people? It was days, wasn't it? And interestingly, that Monday, the day the lockdown started, me and Nicky were supposed to go on a UK tour. I do these visits to schools and it's completely like, not sponsored, it's unfunned. It's just me and Nicky, we get in a mini, we drive from Scotland down to London, we stop at different schools at two or three a day. How long had you been doing that? I've been doing that for like four years before that. So a lot of time had been sort of, you know, put into this idea of pee with Joe.
30:36But then that Thursday night, obviously, Boris Johnson announced this, you know, we're going into lockdown. So I remember I was laying in bed and I text Nicky, I said, I've got an idea. I'm going to go live on Monday. And I had done live workouts in the past, but you're talking like a thousand people took part. But I knew this sort of idea of 15 minute workouts or short kids workouts where these silly little exercises worked. And so I said, Nick, I'm going to go live on Monday. I'm going to call it P with Joe, see what happens. Let's just, you know, get the camera set up and I'll do it from the house in Richmond.
31:05And, you know, lo and behold, I've got Nicky in the AirPod in my ear. He's on the phone and I couldn't see the screen. Sorry. And he's like, Joe, this is mad I was like what he's like there's 400 ,000 live streams 600 ,000 700 there's nine there's nearly a million live connections so I'm about to step in front of a camera in front of millions of people right and I was so nervous but jumped in front did my thing half an hour late I was like wow that was pretty crazy and I did that every single day for um for 18 weeks but I can't say to you that I I knew it was going to be so successful but But what I did has a sense of that the schools already knew that I was doing it.
31:45And they sort of trusted that I would deliver like a really fun session. And they trusted me live, you know, on air with their kids. So that took a lot of trust. And I built that over years before that. So it wasn't this, it didn't just blarp overnight. But it was obviously, that was the moment it really kind of took off. And everyone really, because the schools were saying, look, schools are shut. Joe's a PE teacher. And so every kid pretty much for that first few weeks had a go and did a couple of workouts. But yeah, it was my, it's my proudest achievement. It always will be. It's my legacy.
32:10I think the one thing I'll always be remembered for is pee with Jo in lockdown.
32:15Davina McCall:I am quite interested in often people start at the beginning of the year thinking, I want to start a business, I want to do something, and I do want to go back. We were just talking about you trying to start off. Was it Rumble in the Park? Yeah, that was my first ever boot camp. Yeah, and it was your boot camp. Now, how did you start that? Because I love that. You got some money. Yeah, so I basically started as a personal trainer, but you know I've realized it was really hard getting personal training clients so I thought start a boot camp it might be a bit easier and then from there maybe I can get some personal training business um so I borrowed about 1500 pounds off my mum to get all the equipment um that was like you know kettlebells and boxing pads and things it was because it was a boxing for fitness class and I borrowed two grand off my dad which you got to understand my dad was a roofer like that was like probably like three or four weeks work for him it's a lot of money and I said dad I need to borrow this money because I need to do a personal training qualification and he was like yeah I can sort it out and he you know he gave it to me and I'll never forget like months had gone by and I was sitting like you know um in the flat one day because I lived in Surburn I said dad I don't remember and I got really upset I don't I'm gonna ever pay you back that I can't even get like one or two good to this boot camp and he was like don't worry Joe like as long as you're happy it's not the end of the world it's not you know but it was a lot of money to him at the time you know but he just wanted to give me a chance to do something I loved and you know luckily I managed to pay him back one day but you know like it was hard at the beginning when you start a business you know no one was turning up I didn't I didn't so what was it like talk me through like how what did you do but in reality like I had no money I didn't have a van all I had was a trailer so I had a clip-on trailer on the back of my bike I lived in you're on a bicycle a bicycle yeah okay on trailer which could load stuff up and I'd cycle from Serveton to Richmond I launched it in Old Deer Park so I thought that's a lovely place I'd love to live there one day yeah funnily enough i ended up living in richmond but took me a long time to get that but i i thought right i'm gonna set up the boot camp build the business and maybe one day like i'll rent a little flat in richmond i can live there it'd be amazing and most of the time you'd get there like one person be there or no people would be there and how would you try and drum up business well i had little flyers i'd give out outside richmond station so i was that's quite a busy station and people are just in a rush they don't want to fly and they're just like get out of your way they always found me quite annoying but i was there like day in day out you know every day of the week giving out flyers hoping that someone would sort of take one and give me an email and maybe come along and it was like one of those things it took months and months for it to build but eventually because I kept showing up to flyering and the boot camp that you know eventually there was like 15-20 people direct debit nice little business and then from there I had another one in Surbiton and off those two boot camps I had a really lovely business I had a nice business for boot camps maybe like 10 or 20 hours of PT a week and I was really happy you know 45 pound a session I was like made up I'm getting 45 pound an hour to be in a park training people this is amazing like and and I loved it and I just from that point I just I just I just carried on with it obviously until social media came along I sort of switched to digital but it wasn't my plan I really just wanted to be a personal trainer in a local park and have a couple of locations that was as big as I could visualize my life to be honest so when social media came along was that when you and Nikki forged a sort of like business no was it before that Nikki was working as a a journalist, he was an editor of magazines and things.
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35:26So he was just an editor doing this thing and a journalist. And I just started sharing silly recipes on Instagram, you know, the Lean in 15 recipes. And it cut through the noise of like social media, just like it, for some reason, people really tuned into these wacky videos where I was shouting out, and that's Lean in 15. And obviously that led to my book deal, but it was one of these things I always say like, I've had success, but very unintentional, very much just putting stuff out in the world, you know, sharing a thousand recipes, I got a book deal, sharing 500 workouts on YouTube, I had a DVD deal you know sharing hundreds of of daily stories and videos and suddenly you know you've got a tv show or documentary like but these weren't intentional steps that I thought of because I was a marketing expert I just I just genuinely like really got a buzz out of like sharing a recipe on on on Instagram and then a few hours later someone was making it and tagging me and I was like that's pretty fun but this is long before you were getting book deals and influencers and social media like, you know, entrepreneurs.
36:22I just loved sharing stuff. I really did.
36:27Davina McCall:What's quite interesting for you in a way, you were forging the format, whereas now people follow the format. You know, they think, oh, well, if I want to get a book deal in this, I've got to go on social media and I need to do this and I need to do this many videos. But you just didn't know what you were doing. you were just doing doing it for the love of it genuinely genuinely before I knew that you could get a book deal because you know celebrities and tv chefs got book deals not yeah influencers yes I came around at that time where like deliciously yellow was popping and she got a book deal and she smashed it and then that obviously I got my book deal and there was a girl in Australia called Kayla who was huge on fitness on Instagram yes I remember Kayla yeah Kayla was huge so yeah there was a few people like doing things and then obviously now it's obviously there's loads of were doing online fitness but it was definitely the earlier stages and I didn't see this opportunity coming I I just I built a community basically I just I built a community by sharing stuff and really being passionate about recipes and movement and cooking and exercising but it wasn't like this this really like thought out process and even now I still think how have I done what I've how have I sold five million books when I've never been on tv I'm not a chef amazing I don't know how it happened but you know like you with a dvd like you don't know how you sold millions of dvds it was just you and your energy and your personality that people warm to and they they committed to like supporting you because they trusted you and they thought you were an inspiration and that's the same with what I've done I suppose in food and fitness.
37:55Davina McCall:I think you've just made me think about something there and it was interesting because um what Jackie and Mark who were my trainers and Jackie and Mark were married and Jackie was a gymnast, former gymnast. Right. And Mark was a former Royal Marine and they were married. And I met, Jackie and Mark were trainers in Oxlade, which was the local village nearest to where I lived. And I found them in a magazine and they came and helped train me. And if Jackie couldn't come, she'd send Mark, which I would dread because he'd have me yomping. This is when you first got into fitness. Yeah. Before I did any DVDs or anything, I was just trying to get fit after I'd had a baby.
38:35Davina McCall:and they changed my body I'd never looked as good ever um with um three minimum of three workouts a week um but I'd never felt so good up here I was buzzing like it just changed everything and changing the way I felt about myself and feeling strong not necessarily about how I looked so much but the feeling of it. Yeah, it feels great, doesn't it? Yeah, changed everything. And I was like, I want to tell everybody about this. So I called my agent. I said, I want to make a workout DVD. And he went, it's a bit naff. It's a bit like people just, you know, it's a bit fake. I was like, no, no, no, no, you don't understand.
39:24Davina McCall:These guys actually did change my life. So I wasn't a PT. Are they in your original DVDs? Yeah, they did the first 10, 15. I'm such good friends with Jackie and Mark now. Did you do 10 DVDs? More. I did 15. Wow. And Jackie and Mark are friends of mine. Their daughter is like, shows, she's a bodybuilder. She's a professional. She's amazing. Alex. They completely changed my life and that's why I got into it. Because I was like, I've got to show them. And so I think it's that thing of you are genuine. You know, everybody's always talking about authenticity and how important it is. Yeah, what does it really mean in this world?
40:09Davina McCall:Well, that's why you're successful because you live and breathe it. You totally... I love that your experience, genuinely, had a knock on effects. And you would have met millions along the journey who said, you transform my life, your DVD or your workouts and your energy. like and it is it sometimes just one meeting one person has a massive effect you know like a butterfly effect isn't it and obviously yeah I always put it down to my PE teachers at school you know sports coaches people that really like nurtured me through fitness and sport and stuff and then even joining the gym when I was 16 I joined the gym and I was like I love this why don't people love this why aren't why is not everybody doing this why is everyone down the pub like but you know a lot of the lot of the world don't see a lot of people don't see the world we do because they really struggle with fitness and they're the ones I want to get to the most the ones that are super fit why do they struggle because it's like if they don't have that connection between like their body and mind and they don't have that feeling of like confidence and progression of getting stronger and stuff but I always say like you might not love the gym and that feeling of being in an environment where there's loads of people that really fit but you might really fall in love or connect with like a really great youtuber and have a great home workout and have a good vibe yeah and build and build fitness through that so I just think people just need to give it a try and like actually whether you're two years old or 72 years old you always feel better after workout and it doesn't solve all the problems in your world like it is you're still going to be stressed but it's at least known that on those days rather than turning to food and ultra processed food and sugar to make you feel better or whatever or drink or drugs whatever having the exercise as the first sort of thing to try it can transform how you feel in the day for sure so just to finish on on exercise for a moment so say we've got somebody that really struggles today's the first we want them to get up and do something that the the points that we want to make are you will never regret a workout yeah you will always feel better afterwards start small you were saying like how long even i think like just start with a walk you know go for a walk get some fresh air put your phone down for half an hour you know get in nature like you said that that can be a pivotal thing and that can be a big mindset shifter um but again don't have to do everything all at once just focus on 15 minutes a day can you focus on that today or even just once and then maybe say you feel tomorrow have a break and a rest and maybe the following day but just know that everything in life will change when you start to take care of yourself yes and your body and your mood and your energy which which really comes through sleep you know nutrition and exercise the basic fundamental things we need as human beings it's self-love yeah it's self-love and it's finding time because everyone else comes first in this life actually you've got to find time for yourself you know it's hard when you've got kids and you've got you work in shifts and you've got lots of stresses on your body but because of those things this is why you need to exercise not instead of like don't wait for like the perfect conditions because they won't come you have to create that time find that little window to to meal prep on a weekend or to put you know put yourself to bed an hour early or like you know do a little bit of exercise and when you do that suddenly all these stresses and all these feelings you've got in your mind and especially if you're going through you know things like perimenopause all these moments in life that affect your mood it can really help it's not like gonna save and solve everything but it's really it really is powerful powerful yeah it shifts the mind i think another way and i know you are so hot on this now and I can't wait to dig into this with you and that is about ultra-processed food and what an enormous and profound effect that has on our mental health as well.
43:48Davina McCall:Now I, similarly to you in a way I guess I was brought up on convenience food because my granny grew up, my granny brought me up and she looked after her children in the war, there was no convenience food and so when it came out nobody knew what was in it yeah everybody everybody just thought oh packet chicken noodle soup brilliant 10 minutes wow used to take me you know a whole day to make the chicken stock and then put it in the soup and add the noodle um oh tinned ravioli amazing um so that's basically what i was brought up on it was like kind of a luxury for me. It felt like a treat, yeah, it was a convenience.
44:34It was sold as a kind of healthier, sort of quicker option. Yeah, for sure.
44:37Davina McCall:So for me to make those healthier choices was quite difficult, but I was amazed to hear it was the same for you. Yeah, this is an interesting topic because I was, did you do a book, I Quit Sugar? Yeah, yeah. So I've tried. Five weeks to sugar-free. Yeah, we talk about that a little bit, about in terms of like, have you managed to sustain that? Because one thing I struggle with is sugar. sweet stuff you know i had a cupboard full of chocolate and sweets and candies i could just have unlimited access to as a kid coupled with you know my mom didn't really know how to cook and it was very much ultra processed frozen microwave dinners and stuff so when i do consume these foods i find it really hard to eat with moderation but i also understand now from doing research that most people struggle because the foods are designed to be addictive you know the way they're designed like the engineered and scientifically like manufactured to be really delicious consumed really fast so you buy more as quick as you can yes and you know it's really hard to sort of put it back on you as a consumer you need to just have a bit more balance have a bit more moderation it's just really really hard when the mesh is so like it's it's everywhere all the time and it's really hard to avoid so when I yeah I'm basically all or nothing with it you know I can be really disciplined and be like you know having no ultra processed foods or I'm on the road and traveling and suddenly I have a couple of chocolate bars and a can of coke and then the whole week I'm just at it.
45:56Davina McCall:I am exactly the same. And I really, the more I have it, the more I crave it. Yes. The less I consume, your brain and the sort of noise and those sort of cravings around sugar, having something sweet every day, it starts to pass a little bit. But it's not our fault. No, it's not. The food system has failed us, and it really is about the marketing and the convenience and that sort of promise that this is cheap and quick and healthy and simple. But, you know, the only answer really is cooking more. So the solution, which brings me back to, like, you know, my cookbooks and my recipes and things like i need people to get back in the kitchen and cooking because that's the only way we can take we can take control of our diet you know is by doing it at home and enjoying the process as well look before before we dive into um because i really want to talk to you about that documentary and the bar and everything but i'm going to quickly mention this so this is out now and um protein in 15 obviously protein buzzword yeah for everybody and we're going to be talking a lot more about that in a minute.
46:54Davina McCall:But what I love about this book is it genuinely is, and we were talking about Lean in 15, because I was talking to a couple of girlfriends of mine here, and they were going, you know what's brilliant is the prepare time and, like, everything is really 15. It's not a lie. Speed's important. Speed's important, Jo. Yeah, you can't mess around. You need to be quick, and obviously people have less time than ever. So this book is about, you know, high protein meals that are relying on actual protein sources as opposed to like the ultra process sort of, you know, because there's so many products in the market that have that lovely branding of added protein.
47:28But, you know, it's masking a lot of other stuff. And to be honest, if you can just get back to whole cooking, you haven't got to really think about your protein intake because naturally it's just going to be taken care of, you know. So it's all about whole foods, family cooking, you know, batch cooking recipes that you can have. Batch cooking's amazing, right? Yeah, you want to have a bit for this evening, a little bit for lunch the next day. Yes. But yeah, it's been really well received and I love the photos and all the recipes. There's a really good selection in there.
47:52Davina McCall:And I like the funny names. Yeah, you said you might have an idea. I did. So you've got here crispy tempeh. How do you pronounce that? Tempeh, yeah. Crispy tempeh. Tempeh. I've come up with when you're doing a reprint, you don't even have to name check me or anything. I'd just be pleased to help you. I thought tiny tempeh. As you were saying, I was thinking, I should have said that. You're going to say tiny tempeh. That's so much better. Tiny tempeh, that's a brilliant name. So I'm just going to gift you that. Well, I've got Silly Dilly Salmon Burger. I mean, I love the aubergine. Yeah, aubergine.
48:28And there's one that said, what did a chicken satay eat me? It's silly, but it makes you laugh. Yeah, but it's like there's joy in this book.
48:38Davina McCall:But it is 15 minutes. It's easy. It's delicious. Thank you so much. So I'm, this is my copy. I'm going to take this. But really, really brilliant, Jo. I love that so much. I like it. And I want to kind of stay on that subject of protein because you made this bar called... Killer Bar. The Killer Bar. And can you just talk, because I thought that was quite edgy of you. It's quite a thing to actually bring something out that people can actually buy that is terrible. It was very provocative. Yeah, it was provocative. It's provocative. Disruptive. The documentary was on Channel 4. It's called Joe Wick's Licence to Kill.
49:28It sounds like a James Bond movie. But it's about the regulations around marketing, labelling, health claims, and potentially putting health warnings on certain foods that we know are harmful. So it was always going to be quite provocative. I chose a protein bar because I'm in the fitness industry and it felt like the right thing.
49:45Davina McCall:I think they are almost the worst. I mean, it's one of many products that you could say pretend they're a health product, but actually contain pretty nasty ingredients. And they're not that great. It's not like it's not really going to kill you. But it's the it's the it's the kind of it's the compounding effect of having a diet, a high in ultra processed foods, which really is happening. You know, 80 percent of a child's diet in the UK and like a low income family is coming from ultra processed foods. So I wasn't attacking protein bars in itself, but it's about raising awareness and helping people understand what's in our food.
50:17How is it affecting our health? Because some of these, you know, ingredients are linked to an increase in the risk of stroke, you know, Alzheimer, dementia, depression, you know, cancers and things. So we have got to talk about it. It's hard to accept that the foods we're eating could really be affecting us in that way. But I think like with the cigarettes in the 50s, we didn't know the harmful effects of smoking. And it took a long time for that to change.
50:37Davina McCall:in future years everybody's going to go god can you remember when we used to eat that yeah well there has to be a shift because we can't we can't continue as we are like but aside from the increase in type 2 diabetes and obviously obesity and in children and around the world it's the health implications well like the increase of risk of cancer and things that we have to like look at our diet we can't just say it's because we're moving less and you know we're yeah on our screens and it's like we have to the environment and the food we're eating is It has a massive impact. You know, you might say I got massive pushback and backlash when I announced that bar because essentially I sold the bar, only a limited amount of bars to prove that I can create something and pretend it's really healthy.
51:18But actually within this is really unhealthy ingredients that by law I can sell. But ultimately, like this is this is about raising awareness and getting the government to enforce the food companies to change the formulations or to put health warnings on the products. And will it stop people eating it? no but it might reduce it by 10 % and that for me is worth it even if I reduce that by 10 % and you start to tip the balance a little bit back towards whole foods but at the moment we're consuming way too much of it and it's it's really really affecting us not just our physical health but our mental health you know it food affects our mood yes you know that you know when you've had a binge and a black like how do you feel and imagine doing that every day repeating that and seeing how quickly you can get into a rut where you just feel low and depressed the whole time and so I'm really passionate about but I wasn't prepared for the backlash I wasn't emotionally oh like loads of fitness coaches and nutritionists and people like you know saying you're demonizing foods you're you're demonizing sugar you're stigmatizing low-income families you're promoting eating disorders it's like I'm trying to help people cook healthier food at home that's what I'm trying to do so it's quite intense that first week before the documentary came out I was really like getting attacked left right and center but when the documentary aired you know it's a really positive response and i actually went to a um a talk the other day with dr chris van tulik and he's the doctor that helps me he wrote the book ultra process people yeah and it was at this place called um it was the royal college of physicians and it was the the lancet which is a medical paper yeah so there's been a three-year research paper that done by all these amazing academics and scientists on this on this ultra process foods and our health and the graphs are just like this going up so like you know the increase in ultra process food the increase of type 2 diabetes obesity all these illnesses like it's so positively correlated that we can't deny the evidence anymore like it is it's there and it's about you know how we can put pressure on the government and food companies to change it but truth is it might take 20 30 years for food companies to change but the one thing we can do today as as as people in control of our health is to just cook one meal today one healthy meal at home and reduce the consumption of these products and that way you know you're just going in the right direction it might not be you might not win every day but if you can reduce it we're going to be in a better position with our health and that's really the end goal isn't it of everyone so I just wasn't prepared for it you know but it's part of it you're going to upset some people not everyone's going to agree what you're saying but one day people look back and go that documentary like when he said all that stuff like it was it was right and here we are and now we can agree with it you know and the more research
53:46Davina McCall:that's done on ultra-processed foods and all these different, I mean, the things that replace things that we think that are bad for us, like sugar, things like aspartame. I was amazed to hear sucralose, xylitol. Yeah, so basically, in order to reduce sugar, they have to put artificial sweeteners in them. Some of these have been shown, and the question is, how can they prove it? Is it really substantial evidence? But whether you think it's the additives, emulsifiers, gums, you know, E numbers like sweeteners or you think it's like calories and it's the salt, fat and sugar. Yes. Either way, when you have a diet high in ultra processed foods, it displaces the it displaces a diet of whole foods.
54:33And it's that lack of fiber. All those things that you're not getting is also having an effect. So it doesn't matter what's causing it. The fact is we need to get back to cooking again. real whole food because we know when we do that we can you know reduce to consumption these foods and hopefully increase our health but the numbers don't lie and it's not a positive direction at the moment the balance is tipped in favor of ultra processed foods yes somehow bring it back
54:57Davina McCall:and it's really hard i think making it easy which is what you're so good at for everything you know exercise food kind of motivating yourself it's like you are like I'm going to make it so easy for you to do it I think the the the frightening thing for me knowing um that sugar I'd slightly kind of demonized sugar because when my sister had cancer um the doctor had said to her try and like lower your intake of sugar because sugar can feet it didn't give you cancer but it can um encourage accelerate yeah uh your tumor growth and when i talked about that i got shot down in quite a major way but when i got cancer i was also like i had you know sugar is like cancer loves sugar so just be careful with that and But I saw protein bars as having protein in, not real sugar.
56:08Davina McCall:I've eaten protein bars thinking, oh, it's fine. Like, it's good. Yeah, I have too, yeah. I have thought, had that mindset. Now, for me, I wouldn't go anywhere near them because you've totally reframed the way that I look at them. and I want to try and get protein from fish and like white meat in more, you know. And vegetables and grains. There's loads of... And other things like grains, like chickpeas and... Yeah, I think it's one of those things that with protein bars, it's like, it's just like, it's become like this alternative to a chocolate bar. But with a chocolate bar, you know what you're getting right.
56:46But with a protein bar... It's honest. You think it's like, yeah, it's like a healthy option. Exactly. It's just a plate and a bowl full of white powders. There's no real food in it. So, yeah. And again, I'm not trying to attack and just dig out.
56:57Davina McCall:No, but the reason why I'm saying that is because I am a healthy fitness person and I too was doing that. And I'm not saying that the odd protein bar every now and again needs bust if you're somewhere and you fancy a chocolate bar. But it's the fact that we're sold that as health. Yeah, that's the challenge. And that's the mistake, I think. I want people to just like, you know, just maybe question it and look at the back of products a little bit more. because it's not just look it's cereals it's wraps it's every condiment you can imagine it's every single like you know sauce and ready-made pre-packaged goods in the supermarket which is the predominantly like what we're consuming and that you know it's just it's having it in the if we were just having 10 or 20 percent of it fine but an adult's eating up to 60 percent and a child up to 80 percent nothing wrong with a little bit of it like that's the thing the the argument is not we're trying to like you know ban ultra processed foods and get it out the diet and out your system because it's just not going to happen but can you focus more on home cooking and can you like get back to like the basics of like whole ingredients so you know rather than like an ultra processed chicken nugget can you just use the chicken and make you know your own chicken burger at home or something like it's just trying to go back to the source if you like and it's all the other things that are added to the products that make it and obviously the high salt fat and sugar content affect your weight and you know could lead to type 2 diabetes and things but ultimately like it's a real challenge and you're not going to get every day perfect don't try and remove it all from your life story because that's quite difficult and I don't know how are you with it now are you all or nothing with the sugar do you still have a little bit and enjoy a treat you know what happens um to me is that I am um I can be quite good um but I have these little um things so say I go to a dinner somewhere at someone's house I um will eat a pudding if someone's made it.
58:47Davina McCall:But then if I've eaten that pudding that day, the next day, sugar is talking to me everywhere. You're craving it, yeah. Yes. If I have it once, it is just... So now I'm thinking, I don't know if I can even do that. I think I just need to try and... I am all or nothing once I start. So I used to do this thing on Christmas where I'd go, I'm taking Christmas Day off. and I'd literally put a Quality Street on my bedside table, wake up in the morning, put it in my mouth. Yeah, yeah. Right, like the fudge. Like, do it. Pick the fudge of all of them. Yeah. That's your favourite. Oh, yeah. What's yours?
59:29That's the worst. What? Joe! Are we talking Quality Street or Celebration? Quality Street, what? I like the big purple ones. That's way better. Not the Brazil nut. Yeah, that's the best. What? Or the triangle. Oh, God, Joe, you know what I was saying about seeing your soul?
59:44Davina McCall:It's just like... I do eat the fudge if I'm desperate at the very end. Do you know, we'd be great together because, look, I could give you the purples and you give me the fudge. It's amazing. But then it would kick off just a day of obscenity. I would wake up, like you said, the next day feeling hungover. I don't drink alcohol. I would have a chocolate and sugar hangover that I would immediately want to feed with more sugar. Yeah, I'm the same. it's like and i think there's a link to the gut as well in terms of the bacteria in the gut but you know it's like don't forget it is a reward system like they're designed to be really really delicious and so it is like lighting up the brain the same parts that drugs do and so what what they've done with research is like they you know engineers and scientists like create the products have this bliss point where it's not just the sugar it's the fat salt and sugar together you go oh my god why can't i eat why can't i eat one oreo why have i got you the whole package why can i only eat like you know one chocolate it's because it's designed to be like this so you know as you're eating these things remind yourself like is it a treat do you really feel good at the end of it does it make you feel bloated and tired and grumpy like I feel like food affects my mood a lot I get a bit irritable and next day like you said I'm thinking about going to the shop and getting another chocolate bar but you know I've tried the whole the abstinence thing works but the second I have a little blur again I'm back to square months so I don't know whether it's better to I'm still trying to find my way with it yeah I'm still trying to find don't have it in the house if you have it in the house all the time it's hard But when you go out to the restaurant and you have a milkshake and an ice cream on the way, I'm like, that's all right.
1:01:15But don't depend on it for every day. Because it's really, really hard to stop when it's there. You know, it's in your face.
1:01:21Davina McCall:Okay, so it's the 1st of January and people are trying to reset. Can you give me your top tips for like the really simple ones? Because this is the first. We don't want people to fall off the wagon. Yeah, okay. First tip, prioritize sleep, right? Because without good sleep. Oh God, I'm amazed that that's your first tip. No, talk to me about sleep then. Without the sleep, you know, it's the foundation, isn't it? If you are not getting enough sleep and you know this going through perimenopause or when you have kids, it's really hard to wake up with energy to exercise if you've had a really rough night.
1:01:56Yes. So do whatever you can, humanly possible, to get an extra half an hour or an hour of sleep a night because it really compounds and it adds up. Sure. That means the next day you've got that little bit of energy to like, do your workout, put a bit more energy into it, put a bit more effort into it and get better results. And the third thing is, you know, it's like somehow falling in love with the process of cooking again. Plan your meals for the week, you know, maybe get a cookbook or follow an Instagram account. They like take control of the food you're eating. Batch cooking as well really has a huge impact because if you don't do that, you're only going to rely on food on the go and convenience food, isn't it?
1:02:30So it's like if you just get used to making a massive batch of something, put a bit in the fridge, you've got a couple of days worth of food yes you know it's easy for you and the kids when they come in from school it all it all kind of makes things a bit easier yeah and with those three things like remember that you're not going to get them all right every day but as long as you're doing one of those i think you're on to a winner so if you're just doing your exercise and not eating that great or you're not doing exercise there but you eat really well or you just think i can't i've got no energy to train but i'm going to commit to going to bed an hour earlier tonight they're the steps that it they're the steps you need to take to actually create any change in your life and it works you know it really really starts to build up and it starts to compound and get a bit easier but you can't wait until you know don't wait don't wait till Monday just
1:03:13Davina McCall:today you know start today yeah why not start today and also you can't start halfway through a day I don't think you like starting in the morning I think you gotta wake up you gotta a night is a great reset you reset overnight yeah and you start in the morning but I do think that sometimes people get to 11 they fall off the wagon 11 p.m or a.m a.m oh no like 11s you have a biscuit oh sod it and then bang for the whole of the rest of the day this comes down to the breakfast you choose and if you're gonna have a really high high sugar high source carbohydrate breakfast you're probably gonna have a little dip a bit later on whereas if you have a higher protein breakfast or higher protein or higher fat and protein you know it keeps your blood sugar levels a bit more consistent and you have a bit more energy so don't eat like a rabbit or don't eat like a low calorie yogurt with low calorie granola and stuff like as you'll be hungry yeah have some proper food yeah have a proper bit of breakfast that gives you energy and you're not going to be thinking about food two hours later but the snacking is where most people go wrong i think it's not the meals it's mainly the snacking in between all those little bits that were you're grazing all the time that's what that's what adds up and helps you know stops people from reaching their goals i think i love nuts you know i love almond butter but i eat it by the spoon and I can do a whole jar of it.
1:04:26And you think, how many calories have I just eaten? I have no idea, but it's thousands, isn't it? Like thousands of calories in nuts.
1:04:32Davina McCall:I like actual nuts nuts. Oh, like a full handful of nuts. Like a handful of nuts. But then I'm like, oh, just have one more handful. And then, you know, the same thing. It's just ridiculous. Can I just, I'm going to finish on. I just want to very quickly talk to you about Rosie. Yeah, okay. You met Rosie at Glastonbury, didn't you? You're so cute. Have you met her before? No. It's just a brief little moment. I've seen her, you know, obviously, and I look at your socials and stuff, so I see her there. Not that I'm stalking her or anything, Jo, don't worry, you're safe. No, I stalk you, don't I?
1:05:05Davina McCall:She seems lovely, but I love this idea that you knew of her and then you went to a party knowing she'd be there. Yeah, so... I love that. So Rosie's quite private. The ironic thing is, Rosie used to be a page-free model in The Sun, but she's very private. She doesn't want to be on social media. She'd rather not be on my Instagram. she's quite private but you know I knew of her because I was obsessed of her like she was this girl like you know Rosie Jones like page three girl and she was in like nuts and zoo magazine and I was like you know buying these magazines I was a fan of her a basic fan of her and I thought she's beautiful and then when I found out my mate was going out of her friend they were they got married and he was a DJ I found out she was at this club and I don't I wasn't going raving I'm not a rave around but I was like I've got to go meet I really wanted to meet her to see what she's like you know see if she's nice and you know i went up to london it was pissing pissing with rain it was what did you wear i mean i was just wearing like jeans and a t-shirt and a big warm jacket but you know once you're in a rave you get rid of your jacket yeah yeah sweating and you got the bod out t-shirt no like a little bit clingy no baggy t-shirt just probably just like a standard like i don't t-shirt on top man nothing okay no okay i'm not the most stylish man and i shut up oi you look great always okay carry on and i went and met her and obviously i got introduced to her and she she she hadn't known she didn't know I was this is obviously years ago before just before I sort of blew up as the body coach and um you know we we met we became friends and obviously like fast forward today we got four kids and we're married but she is you know she's my best mate and I she is like the other side of me like we're so similar in a sense like you know we love traveling we love food we love being parents we like teaching our kids without homeschooling you know like we are really our kind of values are aligned you know and yes and And I like that.
1:06:45And I suppose being from a child of a family that never got, well, never stuck together and never got married and not committed in that sense. I really want to be like a committed husband. I really want to be a present father. So these are the things I almost like, I'm glad I learned that from my childhood. I'm glad that those things I learned, those values I've got in me now, really come from like the lack of what I had as a kid. And I want to be, I want to be there for her. So, you know, she's for sure like the most important part of my life because she's given me what's really important, not fame and success and book sales.
1:07:17She's given me a family and a home and like kids that I love. You know what I mean? And that's, if everything went tomorrow, I've got that. And that's what keeps me, I suppose, knowing everything's okay. You know, I'm really content in that, that if the body coach and Joe Wicks and the whole like Instagram, everything just fell apart and the business fell to the ground. Like I've still got the most important thing, which is a family, you know?
1:07:39Davina McCall:You're safe. Yeah. That's how I feel. so it's a nice feeling isn't it wow so nice you know what's funny as well i think that you now can understand how hard it is to train with kids oh yeah and cooking like and trying to find and trying to find time and everything else it's like giving all of your and they work a new meaning right you kind of want to like let them get involved but you also i just want to have this hour to myself and you're like i'll come in there and let's do a few press-ups and stuff but i also understand the importance of that role model so when they do ask me i really i don't want to say no I want to come and end like and get them involved a little bit but yeah it's always a challenge when you've got four kids under seven they're running around like lunatics and just for any parents out there because um there's a lovely thing in um the anonymous fellowships about it's attraction rather than promotion you know don't go and tell everybody they got to go to a na or aa but like live a life of somebody that would appeal to someone and go I want I want to that life yeah I love that concept.
1:08:42Davina McCall:How do you raise your kids to want to be into good food or working out because forcing them to do it is going to make them want to run in the opposite direction. Yeah, we have this conversation around food at the moment because I'm trying to educate them. I don't want to be a dad that's always saying, no, no, no, no. But you can't say yes all the time because there's chocolate everywhere. There's sweets in every vending machine, every soft plate. Yes. Every leisure centre. It's everywhere. And so I'm trying to teach them, like, look, we can enjoy these things but there's a reason i'm not saying yes to you every single day because i'm trying to protect your health i'm trying to help you feel good and so i'm asking them you know have you had enough like you can have a little bit of ice cream but do you really need two scoops and i'm like getting them to sort of read their their body a little bit more but it is a challenge because i know that when they're out there in the big world when they're teenagers like they are going to be experiencing the same environment that we all are and it is really hard isn't it when all your friends are eating these foods and like i said i'm not like completely militant we still love a treat we love we went away and we had an ice cream every day and we're having like treats and stuff but it's not in the house it's not in their lunchbox every single day so that's that's one thing i'm trying to navigate and it's not easy the second thing is around movement i want my kids to be active and to love exercise so it's really a case of creating as many opportunities where they can be at you have to facilitate the exercise have fun so yeah so sometimes we'll just go for a little bike ride sometimes we're going for a little little run other times you know i just stick on one of my activates and we do it in the living room together but yeah but they also wait yeah we do it together I love that we just stick it on five minutes we do it for a laugh the kids they work out to their cartoon dad cartoon dad yeah and they think it's hilarious but they also would love to just sit and watch Disney Plus all day you know and have screens and stuff but I have to really fight against that and work and give them opportunities because if they don't it's going to be really really hard to engage them as teenagers I just hope that it's in their DNA you know and it's just a case it's multiple exposed to different sports you know let them try a little bit of gymnastics they're maybe maybe they're trying a bit of football and but you know they're gonna love maybe they'll love a sport maybe they'll just hopefully just enjoy the the movement of just like being active and you know running around and playing hide and seek and things but it's easy you know i can't talk about experience until i've got teenagers of how hard it's going to be i can control their world a little bit more now but i know when they're 13 14 15 it's like i bet it's really hard getting teenagers moving in this world we live in now?
1:11:00Davina McCall:I find house music That helps. is a brilliant way of getting kids moving. Just having a dance at home? Yeah, dance. Are you a cool mum? Are you listening to house music then? Oh, well, I mean, I ran clubs in the late 80s, early 90s. I'm like rave queen. Do you like modern house? Well, I love modern music, but they are the ones that keep me posted with everything. Like, they send me tracks all the time, which I absolutely love, but thanks to them, you know. so protein in 15 um absolutely amazing um thank you joe wicks it's been such a pleasure thank you it's been like a therapy session i i i absolutely um i think the best thing i could say about you is that i really respect you thank you so really really really it's a testament to who you are you know you're always so positive and like you you've had such a great energy thanks for having me love you thank you love you thank you so much oh what a great chat okay guys so me and Jo are going to do a 10 minute workout and it's going to be on the YouTube channel on Sunday I'll see you there
From the publisher
Rest Month Episode 1: MOVE!
In this episode of Begin Again, fitness expert Joe Wicks joins us for an inspiring conversation about building the perfect exercise plan for 2026. As part of Reset Month, Joe breaks down how to create a sustainable fitness routine, the importance of movement for both physical and mental health, and how to stay motivated long-term.
Joe opens up about his own fitness journey, the challenges of staying consistent, and how he’s helped millions of people around the world find joy in movement. Whether you’re new to fitness or looking to reset your routine, Joe’s advice is the perfect motivation to start fresh in the New Year.
This episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to move their body, reset their fitness goals, or build a stronger, healthier future. Don’t miss out on Joe’s expert tips and the chance to transform your fitness journey!
Don’t forget to like 👍, comment 💬, and subscribe 🔔 for more episodes. Click the bell icon to stay updated on new episodes! 🌱
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(00:00) Intro
(00:02:39) Joe’s Chaotic Childhood & Addiction Guilt
(00:14:42) Loving Someone Battling Addiction
(00:18:19) Why PE Matters for Kids
(00:19:47) Finding Motivation & Pushing Through DOMS
(00:27:54) How Lockdown Changed Everything
(00:31:34) Starting the Bootcamp Journey
(00:31:45) Adobe Ad
(00:34:21) How Joe Landed a Book Deal
(00:37:07) Prioritizing Health & Wellbeing
(00:41:46) The Truth About Ultra-Processed Foods
(00:43:26) Why Sugar Is So Addictive
(00:45:05) Joe’s New Book: *Protein in 15*
(00:47:08) The Killer Bar & Rethinking Processed Food
(00:59:35) Joe’s Top Healthy Living Tips
(01:03:17) How Joe Met Rosie & Built a Family
Sponsored by:Adobe - https://Adobe.Ly/Davina
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