Spencer Matthews: The Real Reason I Push Myself So Hard...

0:28This episode is brought to you by Jack Daniels. by a monster, we're talking about kitchen dreams. And there are IKEA products and solutions for all of them, whether it's a whole new kitchen, a statement glassware set, or just new cutlery. If you've got big dreams or small dreams in any size of budget, IKEA can help you bring them to life. Visit ikea.us slash dream kitchen to learn more. Dream the possibilities. There were unusual circumstances surrounding my brother Michael and his death. We certainly felt that his death could have absolutely been avoided. And so I carried a lot of hatred towards people.

1:01Marrying an amazing woman who I want to be better for has been very helpful, but I could just see the relationship slipping if I didn't make an actual change. Before you tell me about that, could you just explain to us what you did? Two world record Iron Man attempts, and we went from London to Arizona, to Cape Town, to Perth, to Dubai, to Rio, and finished in Antarctica. These things make me feel really alive. Cape Town, it was the first time that the challenge felt very dangerous and that it could come to an end. Shock city, isn't it? Heart thumping, hyperventilating, lost sense in my arms and legs.

1:38I was just thinking about my kids. What a stupid way to die. But, you know, I've been incredibly lucky to have people that I admire in my own family, especially my brothers, Michael and James. I want my family and friends to know that I could handle this. What is your next journey? I think I love you. Nearly cried. I was so nearly there and then I thought, how can I suppress these feelings?

2:05And firstly, we've got to talk about Project 7 because I, well, well done. Thank you. I mean, what, December the 4th you got back? Got back just a few days ago. I think we finished around then. Been back for 48 hours or something. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. I mean, how are you physically feeling? I feel much better than I thought I would. It's not so much a physical feeling, but very proud. And for me, that hasn't always been a given. You know, I've carried a fair amount of shame through my 20s and, you know, regretted a lot of my behaviour. and so for me to be able to express myself in this way is really meaningful to me.

2:53It feels like real progress. It's a big difference to where I feel I've lived before

3:03and I'm just really proud of the team and what we did. I feel, and it's not so much for me to say, but I feel that we have done a really good job, you know that we did something special that we've made hopefully a bit of a difference and you know the whole thing feels really worthwhile and I'm really happy with it it's a nice feeling it's so good isn't it I mean I can't even begin to imagine the level of training and input that you must have had to put in beforehand before before you tell me about that Could you just explain to us what you did and the countries that you did it in? Sure. So Project 7 was two world record attempts, one being the fastest time to achieve an Ironman distance triathlon on every continent.

3:59So seven Ironmans. We were aiming for 21 days and then also the fastest Ironman in Antarctica as a kind of double headed thing. for those that don't know an Ironman a full Ironman is a 3.8k swim which is roughly 40 football fields followed by a 180k bike which is a cycle from London to Manchester followed by a full marathon and that's kind of that's back to back as a single event seven times and we went from London to Arizona to Cape Town to Perth to Dubai to Rio and finished in Antarctica and only two people have ever done an Ironman in Antarctica before. I was the third and the fastest, which is great.

4:45You know, actually, it never really, that second record was a bit of a cherry on top. You know, I never really spent too long thinking about that, but obviously nice to have a target and a bit of friendly competition. I managed to speak to the guy who inspired the whole journey, Connor Emane. He's a triathlete from Toronto. and he was just incredible lovely heart very kind man you know just just really helpful gave me loads of great advice um and you know we were we were doing this for a number of reasons which i'm sure we'll get into but it was yeah i want to talk to you pretty pretty pretty special time in my life again and you know just delighted to be home kids surprised me at the airport and did they yeah it was it was an incredible feeling um obviously my my gorgeous wife you know vogue uh was doing the jungle at exactly the same time it's unfortunate timing we've never gone that long without speaking to each other obviously they take your phone um so not being able to share the experience in real time with her was quite a strange feeling kind of you felt a bit isolated um i mean you must share everything right you're on the phone to each other all the time every day so not being able to do that must be so weird just yeah also you know when you have tremendous highs and lows in your life It's lovely to talk about it with the people you love the most.

6:06And, you know, I'm closest to her in my life. And so having that blackout in communication was unfortunate, but also made the reunion that much better. What was that like at the airport? Oh, lovely. You know, I just... Did you cry? No, I didn't. We'll talk about this. Yeah, I know. It's my friend Jamie and I had an interesting conversation about crying. it's not something I actively suppress I don't do it on purpose I'm just not it takes it takes more than a normal situation I suppose for me to feel a huge amount of emotion I don't suppress it purposefully and I don't really know why that is what was the last thing that made you cry I teared up on a number of occasions throughout the challenge when i was really depleted and a certain song came on is a real thing is yeah a certain song comes on and you're looking at something you know incredibly beautiful and when i did um a tv show called pilgrimage we learned we learned about thin space which is this idea of a moment in time between heaven and earth type thing like an incredible sunset or a gust of wind that reminds you of someone or something like that you know and this project was was full of those incredible things that you'll probably only ever see once you know like Antarctica being an amazing example but yeah there was an there was there was a really phenomenal um sunset in Arizona but like something that you couldn't quite believe was was was happening you know Tom Beard who directed Finding Michael was documenting this journey with us and we agreed to kind of climb this hill together early evening the night before the Arizona Ironman so that we could get a good look at the you know landscape and where we'd be going and around the time that we got up to the top of this hill there was a big group of people on top of you know this viewpoint that we were off to and and and um quite hard to describe it there was this incredible uh beam of light kind of cutting through the clouds that was just beaming down into arizona but bright bright orange kind of you know pink orange purples uh and then the clouds kind of gradually cleared and it just revealed this insane uh sunset and there are people there that go and look at the sunset all the time and said they've never seen anything like it and it's obviously the only night that we're there so it felt lucky and I immediately think about my brother Michael and you know sent a picture into the group and family group and everyone literally was like that's Mike you know straight away because it kind of felt that way so that felt like thin space to me Antarctica is such a kind of threatening but also beautiful place you know it's somewhere that you'll see you know I'll probably never see it again potentially uh but but also very threatening very very frightening there's something um uh kind of tremendous about it you know what i mean it's it's a it's it's very barren and and seemingly dangerous but also very beautiful um honestly there's there's so many moments you know there was um i opened my curtains in space yeah yeah it's good yeah i open sorry you open your curtains no i opened my curtains in punta arenas which is uh uh the stop between rio and antarctica and it was just before we left the hotel to catch our flight to antarctica and open my curtains and at the time i opened the curtains the sun began to appear from behind the the sea horizon but like out of nowhere just the tip at the very time that i literally i could have got up at any time, like, and opened the curtains, and it was like something out of The Lion King, just the sun, just went, I was like, I couldn't believe it, because if it was 10 seconds earlier, I wouldn't have seen it, and if it was 10 seconds later, the sun would already be up, so kind of it, curtains, sun, it was like the start of a play or something, massive, great, big, you know, it was just, and I remember then thinking, like, wow, what are the chances of that, you know, just like random flight time.

10:32So I don't know, there was a fair few moments like that. And sorry, you asked me when I cried. I think I shed a tear in Cape Town at the end of a really long, difficult day. It was probably the first time that the challenge felt very dangerous and that it could come to an end in the water. I felt a tremendous sense of fear and was overwhelmed with what I can only describe as potential panic. Are you talking about Cape Town here? Yeah, I was in the water. The water in Cape Town. It's nine degrees. I mean, also it's just shark city, isn't it, Cape Town? It's in the back of your mind, yeah. You know, I think you have to try and rationalise all of it in real time.

11:18And this is something I'd love to talk to you about, fear. You know, you can you can having experienced it quite intensely recently it's interesting how it comes into play and how you allow it to affect you and i think you know i've certainly taken some lessons away from how i managed certain elements of the fear throughout the challenge because in that moment it was it was game over it was kind of you felt like how you might imagine a panic attack to feel i've been fortunate to have never suffered a panic attack but sort of felt like a heart attack and I've read before that panic attacks feel like you might be having a heart attack and heart thumping hyperventilating lost sense in my arms and legs felt like a you know if the support boat wasn't there that I certainly could drown so pretty fear inducing and um you have to begin to kind of rationalize it and just say what it what you know what danger am I actually in here because you know I'd spent a while panicking about um you know the idea of being bitten by a shark and stuff that is actually somewhat irrational you know the the let's be honest though cape town the water there it's not that irrational i did don't try this at home i don't know if you remember this it was a tv entertainment program back in the um 2000s i think um and um one of the things was to go shark great white shark diving and we went to Cape Town.

12:48Yeah, I think shark attacks happen but they're not common, if you know what I mean. That's what I mean by it. So, you know, there's always a chance but also it's unlikely. So it's kind of... And then you're tackling... It was pitch black, so not to drag it out, but... It's black! Arrived at the beach at 4.40 in the morning. Everyone's sleeping. It's dark. Dark. No light of any kind. Sand feels really cold. I'm freezing in my wetsuit which is unusual normally you're kind of quite warm yeah till you get in the water felt cold going into the water which you know again just doesn't sit well um our driver had told us about a an issue with rabid seals in the area um and that they had attacked someone days before and he was like i you know it's it's it's probably not a not a problem you know i don't worry about it i was like well of course i'm worried about it you know like why would you tell me that um and sure enough i've been in the water for half an hour seals start kind of diving over me uh and you know you can't see anything so i can feel these things in the water with me don't know what it is uh so it's just a generally a a kind of a pretty negative experience where your your mind just floods full of dread and fear and you have to you have no choice but to just handle it right so you have to calm down you can't continue to operate in in that in that space so you breathe you think about your kids and nice things and you know food that you like whatever it might be you know you just relax and try and try and imagine you know a song that you love uh and just just really try and um grind it out of your mind and then um you know then i lost sensation in my arms and legs and stuff as I think I mentioned and it just it was a bad experience you know got out the water and then it that just felt wow that felt a bit risky for my liking as a father and you know a husband yeah I mean you know you wouldn't necessarily care so much before and I've always been a bit gung-ho but that was you know I came out of the water and I was like you know why have I put myself in that position you know um and it felt risky and dangerous and And then coming back to the tier, we had a nightmare on the bikes in Cape Town as well.

15:10Huge headwind, 70 kilometre an hour. Can I just say? Ten hours. In a much smaller way, I had that on my sport relief challenge. Headwind. The headwind. It's the worst. I was peddling downhill. Yeah, yeah. And I was so angry. It's awful. With the wind. Yeah, yeah. I was screaming obscenities. It's the worst. Just going, forgive me. I would rather cycle in very heavy rain than any kind of headwind. Headwind is just... The flip side is that ordinarily you get a tailwind because you go one way then the other. But we had about 140 kilometers into a headwind. We were on the bike for nine hours and 45 minutes.

15:53You know, it's just a long old ride. And then you've got the marathon to run. So about halfway through the marathon when I knew that we'd get around and I knew we'd get around in time. I had an 18 hour cutoff for these races to count. the normal cut off for an Ironman is 17 hours they gave us an extra hour because we have traffic lights and you know hills and stuff to contend with that you probably wouldn't have in a normal race and no I shed a tear then Johnny saw me wait wait there's a witness you're literally just skimming over this I want details so you were running you were half way through and you thought I am going to make it where did it start the feeling I had an old Nickelback song playing really loudly and it was quite a kind of old like rock and roll-y.

16:42Nostalgic. Yeah, just but like a really cool kind of love song, you know. And my music choice is really lame. Like I'm super. That's good. Super commercial kind of like I'm not cool when it comes to music at all. But this song just really got me and I kind of started blubbering and I just loved the feeling of it. you know as i say i don't i don't try and suppress these feelings when they come out it's wonderful yes um i just struggle to be able to draw on them when i would like to almost and actually i think there's there's there's incredible strength in in men expressing um emotions and vulnerability and i think that this challenge in many ways was was full of that for me you know i think when you're depleted when you're short on sleep and and you know you've been going for hours and hours and hours and and you know your body and mind really want a break but you don't afford that for yourself you just you just carry on it takes less you know to to get you going um and uh yeah for me those feelings are really welcome I like feeling that way I mean I think it's an enormous release yeah and a really important one because it's real feelings being felt in real time and there's something about what you were just talking about feeling depleted and you are just empty um and unable to fight or to suppress because you've just not got the tools to do it because you're you're done yeah i don't even know you know i think as i mentioned earlier i had this conversation with Jamie and he said to me you suppress your feelings and you you know he he essentially implied that he felt that I thought that crying was was weak and I don't I don't think that at all I just you know if I could burst into tears now I would you know I just I I don't really know don't say that because I feel like that's a challenge now I'm gonna be like I'm gonna be like thumbscrewing you the whole way through this interview I don't know I don't I honestly I don't I don't really know I don't really know what it is I feel feelings of elation I feel extreme feelings of joy.

18:51I'm a very happy person. I feel extraordinary love in my life. But, you know, I'm not a crier, really. I just don't really do it. And, you know, I grew up in... My father's a very proud Yorkshireman. My brothers were, you know, born up in Sheffield, which I realise isn't fully up in the north. I think it's fair to say that my brothers and dad at least would consider themselves Yorkshiremen, Northerners. And we always just grew up in a... Not that crying was negative or weak, just that it wouldn't help you. And that was the reality of... I would cry and my dad would say, crying won't help you. There's no point in crying.

19:35It's not going to make you feel any better, which could be wrong, but maybe it will make you feel better. But I just I grew up in I grew up just. And again, I do want to reiterate that we don't we didn't think it was weak. It just wasn't. It's kind of like it's not going to get you from A to B. Yeah. If you're on your way to from A to B and, you know, you're crying along the way, you know, it's not going to help you get there. Essentially was how how it was what I grew up with. But, you know, I don't regret or resent anything about my life and childhood and love my parents. And we have a wonderful relationship.

20:10You know, I think it's that's been slightly misconstrued in the past when I've said that, you know, my father wouldn't let me cry. I think, you know, he was kind of indifferent to whether or not I was crying. You know, it just didn't I didn't gain anything from it. I didn't get any additional attention. I get exactly what you're saying and I get exactly what you mean. I think one of the things that I really like about you it's funny because I don't really know you that well we spent three weeks together up in the Alps on the jump which I loved so much and of course it was where you met Vogue and I want to talk to you about that later but I really like you as a person and I think it's all of, I feel like Spencer You are on an incredible life journey of self-discovery and you are very open to learning and discovering new things about yourself.

21:08And I loved hearing you talk about the fear and how paralyzing the fear felt and how you overcame that. But how you were able to identify it and go, OK, this is a thing. I need to get over this thing if I'm going to complete. And this is important to me and I want to do that. But what was the run up to Project 7 like in terms of handling fear? How was your, did that start then in the lead up to it? Yeah, I feared the Antarctic swim for nine months. Really? In a very real way as well. You know, I didn't share it much with people because I didn't want to worry my family. Could you talk to Vogue about it?

21:50I told her that I had some concern, but again, I kind of, I want, I want her and my mum and, you know, I suppose women in life, in my life, but also, you know, the, the two main women in my life, but also, um, the rest of my family and friends to, to, to know that I can handle this, You know, like I think it's I think that, you know, worry and fear to me just mean that you're more likely to do the work to get to a place where you're comfortable taking on a difficult thing. Yeah. You know, I think if you don't fear anything, then you're perhaps, you know, not setting your targets far enough. You know, things should feel big and frightening.

22:36I think if, you know, you spoke about self-discovery. I'm fascinated by personal development, growth, becoming the version of myself that I've always wished I could be. I think it's really important. I personally gain a lot from attempting to do difficult things. I think a major point, and there's a massive turning point for me in Project 7, which was completing the Antarctic swim. however you cut that part of the challenge it's life-threatening it's dangerous it's hardly ever been attempted by anyone before for good reason you know and you you you know why as soon as you're there it's it's overwhelmingly scary and we had we had a briefing the night before specifically about the swim and it made it worse you know there was 20 people there Russian guys, Chilean guys, everyone's super serious no sense of humour whatsoever seven leopard seal spotters two boats you know, a person Why leopard, talk me through the leopard seals Leopard seals are, yeah so again, there haven't been a huge amount of leopard seal attacks on humans but humans are very rarely in the water in Antarctica so there have been there have been deaths by leopard seal, apparently they come at you from the side and they drag you underwater as fast as they can to drown you.

24:05And they're big apex predators. They weigh between 300 and 600 kilos. Big, huge, they're nine times the size of me in terms of weight, right? So one of these things gets a hold of you, good luck. You know, you're gonzo. Yeah. They kind of appear like a big dog, you know, like a really sharp tooth, aggressive thing. I'm sure they're also probably just curious animals that, you know, perhaps, take a bit of a negative turn if they feel like it, but you know, you're in their world here. Yes. And so as well as the zero degree water that you'll be in for between an hour and a half and two hours, and the very serious threat to actual dangerous wildlife, your mind, if allowed to, will just wander into all kinds of hell, right?

24:56And that's before you're even in the water. So you have to take a, again, a kind of logical view on what's happening. A lot of trust gets placed in the kit. I had the choice between a wetsuit that would keep me warm in kind of six degrees in which I'd be able to swim fast or a bigger, more heavy duty wetsuit that would almost certainly make the swim a massive struggle. but I probably wouldn't be that cold. I opted for that just because, you know, going hypothermic at that stage in the day would be a big problem for the rest of the day. And, you know, the night before it, I was in all kinds of, you know, negative headspace.

25:37It was just, it felt dangerous, unnecessary, stupid, foolish, risky. I was just thinking about my kids. I was like, you know, what if, what if I actually do get taken by one of these things? What a, what a stupid way to die, right like nobody's forcing me to be in this water um and and then you know at the risk of sounding overly confident or even arrogant which i hope it doesn't come across you have to remind yourself that you're the guy you know for this you know i know i can do it you know look at what's been achieved in the last 19 days this is the person i've always wanted to be you know of course it's going to be hard but don't be too surprised that's why we're here you know and be calm and focused one stroke after the next and and just handle it you know if you're not going to handle it nobody's going to handle it for you and you can choose to suffer for two hours worrying about all kinds of stuff or you can just try your absolute best to be calm and that's really hard How have you become this guy?

26:45I've no idea Marrying an amazing woman Who I want to be better for I think has been very helpful Oh my god I've always wanted to No but genuinely The person I used to be Isn't good enough for my wife You know I believe I watched you two fall in love And it was clear As clear as day I saw you laughing together and standing next to each other and supporting each other. And I saw you see something in her that it felt like you'd never seen in anyone before. You were, like, looking at her in wonder. Like, wow, there are girls like you? Like, she's so real and funny and naughty and hot. And, like, all the things, like, that would be good for you.

27:40like honest she she's she's honestly um you know i don't mean to sound overly soppy she's got it all you know she's a very special person and she lights up rooms that she walks into she's immensely popular she she kind of i've never met anyone really that doesn't immediately warm to her you know incredible sense of humor um and very beautiful and you only have to spend you know a few hours with her around her kids to just see what a special mother she is as well you know completely selfless and and and very special and and i i made a very conscious effort to become better when i first met her in what way um i had big problems with alcohol you know i was i think you'll probably remember on the jump i was a very heavy drinker my bar bill at the end of the jump was like nothing short of astounding i think i spent the majority of my fee i think on the bar bill i was pretty generous back in the day as well with uh with everyone i was like in order to entice people to drink with me more I would just pay for everything and I hope the generosity has not changed too much but I drink an awful lot less so it's far less expensive but I essentially I went sober for her initially it then immediately almost became for me as well I just wasn't I had no idea the profound impact that that would have on on my life but initially it was it was you know I don't mind saying for her, not at her request, by the way, I could just see the relationship slipping.

29:11I could see that she would lose interest in me and, you know, put me on some scrap heap somewhere if I didn't make an actual change to my own health. In a way, it's like she triggered an awareness in yourself of you and your behavior and an awareness that if that didn't change, you might lose the same. But that wasn't you before. You were just kind of plowing through life, enjoying yourself slightly on self-destruct with the alcohol. Yeah, I think it was the fear of losing her was quite real. Whereas, you know, I hope I'm not offending anyone, but I've never felt that before in previous relationships.

29:55You know, I was quite selfish. And I would do, you know, I'd go out and drink and stay out all night and do whatever I wanted, really. And, you know, if it didn't work, it didn't work. And that was that, you know, I've never considered marrying anyone but Vogue. Thoughts never crossed my mind, you know, and I was young, obviously. and, you know, I'm not sure all the Made in Chelsea stuff helped me much. You know, it was all quite, I thought it was fun for a while and then really kind of begin to almost hit self-destruct on purpose, you know, for like, you know, to dramatise situations. And obviously that sticks with you for a while.

30:26So that's a big part of what I, you know, like to try and put in the rearview mirror. You know, I describe that person as my former self just because I've got nothing in common with him. um and it's quite mad looking at you now and i felt like the change started happening on on the jump i could see you i don't know you felt a bit different to maiden chelsea spencer to me i went a bit i went sober for two weeks before the final so uh just just you know i was drinking very heavily when we were yeah um and then when i made the final i thought let's give this a really good chance i'd love to win this you know i'm naturally quite competitive and went home and didn't drink and by then vogue had uh injured herself so she was in hospital um and i would go and visit her every day and you know we'd spend time together and she joked that you know if i won that she would she would go out with me um and and i said okay great that's why you won yeah well you know i'd like to think i would have won anyway but it was it was in the back of my mind i was up i was up at the top of the the ski jump louis smith uh bless him who probably deserved to win you know he was a fast superior athlete to me uh and and won absolutely everything in the lead up to it you know i i i basically won nothing until that final jump um he did 21 meters or something and graham bell i think his name is on the thing was like spencer matthew's notes he's either gonna crash or win you know type thing because i i had to give it you know i don't jump 17 meters or something before so i had to really go for it did it knew that i'd won like in the air just because i popped off this thing and and really enjoyed it and landed quite far and i was just i was really excited you were there i've got goosebumps it was amazing it was such a cool moment i loved that show for a number of reasons it was amazing and uh and one and one in the end obviously and uh and the rest is history We've been together, you know, ever since we've been together eight and a bit years, possibly even longer.

32:29And probably one of the biggest adventures of your life, right? Yeah. What? Marriage? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, absolutely. It's and, you know, I hope I'm not coming across as like we are, you know, we have the perfect relationship because I don't think that exists. But one thing we are is, I think, proud of each other. We love each other. We support each other. We, of course, have our moments like every married couple, particularly with three young kids. You know, it can be quite exhausting. But I do believe our relationship is special. I feel very fortunate to be in the position I'm in with her.

33:10I'm really proud to be her husband, you know, which I think is a wonderful thing. She lights me up, you know, and I love it. You know, one of my most favourite things, and in fact, it is a comment that we have had on this podcast a lot when we've had other men on here. Richard E. Grant came on and talked about his little part. I loved him. in the most wonderful way. But to hear, I mean, without blowing smoke up your ass, you know, like you are a proper man's man and you live a sort of man's man life and you go and do these big challenges. And yet here you are saying these wonderful things. And rather than being seen, I think what's nice is for other men watching to see this as a strength.

34:03you know, not a weakness, to be your partner's cheerleader and to support them and to, it is a strength, not a weakness. And it's so nice to see a man comfortable enough in his own skin. Well, thank you. To be able to do that. It's just the truth. And look, I know that it's, you know, marriage can be a difficult thing. And, I'm not here boasting about my happiness, hopefully. We're lucky in many ways. And I'm just, yeah, I'm very proud of her as well. I think she's a very special woman. I can't say it enough. No, but I think the other thing I think in life, and again, it's something that I see in really successful relationships, is when you can be each other's cheerleader.

34:57and sometimes if there's competition in a relationship where someone is maybe a bit jealous of somebody else's success or they they want they wanted that in their own lives or they're somehow not happy in their own life then they can't cheerlead their partner yeah and um there was there was an element of competition i think at some point in our relationship when we first you know we're getting going because i think at the time we did a very similar thing as well um We had a podcast together. And so you're kind of, as well as trying to make a good product, you are sort of competing. You know, we did an awful lot together.

35:32We had a TV show together, then a podcast together. And I've actually found it's been far easier to be fully behind each other with less on our professional plate that's together. with our own directions and our own careers. We want different things and we weren't, that wasn't clear to begin with. We kind of, I used to want to do a lot more in TV and she's always wanted to be a television presenter, but that was sort of in the back of my mind. And it took the 30 marathons in the desert last year for me to really understand who I want to be. Yes. You know, and just, and it was a wonderful realisation.

36:11You know, I had a few little things going on that were, you know, semi-successful in entertainment. And I just realised I don't really want to entertain. I'm not a comedian. I'm not an actor. I'm not a singer. I haven't got discernible kind of talent in that space. I'm just, I've done a bit of TV and, you know, hopefully I've made a few people laugh from time to time. But who am I? What is it? I'm really enjoying watching you on that journey. Why is it so important? And this is what you're putting on television. It's like I'm watching you find out who you are. And it's brilliant. Tom Beard at the very beginning of documenting Project 7 said, why are you doing this?

37:00I said, I can reel off three or four reasons that I think I'm doing it. But I think that will become clear when we're out there. You know, I think it's for such a simple question, it's a really hard question. Yeah. You know, it's because it's easy to look at something like Project 7 and go, you know, why? It's not a it's it's very hard to answer that question. And things started coming to the forefront of my mind during it that I found really interesting. But it's, you know, again, your podcast being called Begin Again is really is really interesting to me. you know that's something I feel like I've done a few times you absolutely that's why you're here you recreate yourself and you and you and you constantly try and change uh and and grow and be better uh which is why I'm so happy we're here talking the one better guide from adobe express says if you want to get fresher social ideas get outside go somewhere different so with the help of our sponsor I need fresh ideas on how to fix this video.

38:07Are you any good at TikToks? Hmm?

38:12Hi I'm Oli Alani Peckin and being outside nature beats any brainstorm. Get inspired by the sounds, the birds, the trees, the people.

38:25Oh banger! Oli! Guess what just happened? What? Somebody just walked past playing something and I know I've been stuck on this bit of socials for ages. I'm going to put music to it. This is what I'm saying. Get outside, be inspired. It's more than just the birds and the trees. It's the people, the buildings, the sounds, the smells, everything. Yes, Ollie, I love you. If you want to see more of Ollie, which I strongly suggest you do, go to the One Better Guide on Adobe Express. I love you. Bye, I'm back to the studio. Thank you. Head to adobe.ly forward slash onebetter and lock your guide for free.

39:02It is really the most wonderful time of year. And you know what? Just a few weeks ago, my Begin Again team gave me a Carver Matte frame made by our sponsor, Aura Frames. And it reminded me that I still hadn't sorted gifts for Tilly. So I'm going to give her her own Aura Frame. Don't tell her. I think it's hard when you're on the other side of the world or in a different country, you know, when you're not with your family. So I hope this is really going to help her and remind her a bit of how much we love her. Oh, I look quite pretty. They're all of me. I've got the wrong album, haven't I? Okay, easily fixed.