Why The Modern World Is Breaking Your Body, And How To Fix It! | Roger Frampton

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1:29I just want people to realise the truth. Studies have proven that regardless of age, you can make phenomenal changes to your body. Where do we start going wrong? Well, we know if we want to live longer. I got scouted as a model and then someone said, you never wear a white T-shirt, sort your body out. But that literally changed my world because then I started exploring body weight and it's eventually led me to movement. a kid in terms of their movement. Don't fidget, sit still. That's decades of change away from moving naturally. Decades. All right. Decades. Did you know what I'd say that? I try and test every single potential movement that I could possibly do apart from the one where my body says no.

2:12And it really gets people attentive to feeling their body. You've slightly given me a light bulb moment. Yeah. You You can train your body to do anything. Anything. Wow. Step one is... So I'm here with Roger Frampton, who is going to talk to us about mobility, flexibility, and the importance of that, and how really from when we are born, we are almost immediately learning bad habits that then can just give us enormous problems in the future and how to combat that in quite a simple way, really. But in a funny kind of way, modern exercise really is doing us a disservice and there are many things that we can do to help.

2:58And he's got the answers. I don't have all the answers, but I have some. Quite a lot. I have some. I have some. Yes. Not just from my own experience, but from what I have observed in the world. And, yeah, I'm more than happy to share them with you and chat to you because you are so in this space. Your space is helping people in their midlife. And this tends to also cross over with being a time where people really start to be aware of how they're feeling and how they're moving and achy joints and noisy joints. And they start to be, oh, hang on, what's happening here? I mean, I'm hearing that from everywhere.

3:39Everywhere I look, everywhere I listen. I see it, I hear it. It's really interesting. I call this kind of time of our lives being in Sniper's Alley. Something's coming for us and we can feel it. And there's a lot I want to talk to you about. There's in particular an amazing French woman who I don't know is 100, 203, something like that and still doing yoga. I can't wait to talk about her. But I'd like to start off when you were talking about how you realised how important posture and your body was. And actually, you started life and career as a male model. And I particularly love that because I was a male model agent.

4:21So how did you come to be a model? Like, how did you get discovered? Was it you and your brother at the same time? No, I was, well, I was a carpenter when I was younger, like Jesus. And just saying, just thrown out there. That's a great line. Just like Jesus. Just telling you. I also had a part-time job in a bar yeah not like Jesus no no and yeah I just I got scouted and so I was just doing an mbq in in carpentry that was my world I was working in building sites it was you know years ago when Canary Wharf was first going up wow and that was my world and I also wanted to have a spare time job and then yeah I got scouted someone came in they were like uh we think you do well as a model and I was like okay cool and then I went into I was with select models and went in there.

5:12There was no digital. Polaroids made me a little book of black and white pictures, gave me an A to Z and sent me around London into this weird world of people taking pictures of you in different outfits. And we all know that obviously there is an expectation on you to look good. But when you were when you were younger when you were young young who was your pin-up then um well i grew up around 90s movies right so john claude van damme these are these are the names john van damme arnold schwarzenegger sylvester stallone right these are the kind of yeah these are the kind of people that i look up to they're the hero they got the girl they run off into the sunset and they all happen to have six packs so what i'll do is just work on my body so i mean so my whole fitness thing you know before I was into modeling it was just you know go to the gym bicep curls back day chest day leg day yeah get as big as you possibly can but that doesn't really work for the modeling industry like they they want you to be in a like a 38 suit at the time now it's probably vastly different but yeah if you want to walk down the catwalk they want every silhouette to look the same they did and so the owner Tandy I remember her so well so she said you never wear a white t-shirt like you tandy never wear a white t-shirt right and stop lifting weights now thank you tandy because you literally changed my uh world because i then i started exploring body weight and that's how the whole journey yeah we were just saying before a criticism all right when you know and at the time you know imagine imagine a girl the same age as me 18 19 and someone saying, you, sort your body out, right?

6:59Because essentially that's what happened, right? And I was like, oh, right, I guess I should go and do that. Stop lifting weights, you know, start. But then I found body weight and gymnastics and it's eventually led me to movement. So that was probably the most beautiful thing that ever happened. But at the time I felt pretty stupid. You talked a little bit about the fitness kind of ideal then of being the Van Dams, the Schwarzeneggers, and that that was training in a completely different way to the way you train now. Can you just talk to us a bit about the old school way of training back then?

7:35If you wanted to be massive, what was it like, the regime? Yeah, I guess now as well, you could do with like, you could also, you could just talk about intentions, right? So when I did it, it was like you train your biceps because you're trying to get this to look big because you're trying to show off or you're trying to find a mate or you're trying to attract another, right? So even now when I'm at the gym, There could be an 18-year-old, 19-year-old next to me. And they're focused on bicep curls because they have a different intention. They have a different objective, different goal. I'm all about long-term ability.

8:05So we could train next to each other, be doing things completely separate. But it's because my intention is that I'm here and they're there. But yeah, it was just legs. Everything that you can see, right? Especially the front. That's the most important. Don't give us a mirror. That's so true. Chest. Chest and biceps. You never miss those. Men are always big on shoulders. Yeah. And shoulders are hard to do. And yeah, you're just trying to essentially simulate like an image, a visual, right? And you're just copying what everyone else is doing. What seems to be working for the other guys. Exactly.

8:40So you don't really consider anything else. And it's quite quick. It's quite quick to see. It's quicker to see results with muscles than it is with joints. When you work with joints and tendons and ligaments, like they take many years to develop. which is why people quit flexibility because you don't see quick results. You can learn running really quickly, but with joint work, I did this viral video ages ago and it was like, this is why you're going to quit. It's because you won't see results quickly. You have to measure it over months, even years, which is why I'm always saying to people today, I train this morning and I'm training for 51-year-old me, me in 10 years.

9:22yes I'm not training for me today because I won't see any change yes so my visual is just like I'm doing this for him and he's going to appreciate that but he's going to train for a 61 year old me and yes that's how the chain moves on that's a really nice idea it's the only idea you should have in 10 years time with this work with joint work yes it would be crazy to assume that you can see results quickly and if and if you do you try to get results quickly you'll probably get injured because you know the ligaments don't adapt that quick so you'll get injured you get set back and then you go oh you know there's something wrong um you know there's something wrong with me or you you know they might go oh it's this might be because of my age but it's not it's just that you need to do it really slowly and repetitively this is this is boring as broccoli what are you talking about i love broccoli what i mean is that if you eat some broccoli today you won't go oh wow that broccoli really uh did it but if you eat broccoli all over your life right then you'll go oh it's actually you know it's good it shouldn't this work shouldn't be exciting yeah yeah i mean i think the other thing that i like um sorry just destroyed dreams on broccoli what i love the broccoli not in a soup what i mean i want to get everywhere but i'll start off with what happens as we age to our joints our tendons and our ligaments where do we go start going wrong okay should we start at the heart yes all right in the 70s you were taught that your knees shouldn't go over your toes yes that rounding your back was bad for you that there was such a thing as like certain exercises are good and certain exercises are bad we should avoid if you get injured you just tie it up do you remember those cartoons where everyone's just wrapped up right we literally thought that if people got injured we should just wrap them up and keep them really fragile like a piece of glass.

11:14And it was also common in the 70s that age equals decline, right? I would say that went on into the 80s even and 90s. Yeah, even further. And it wasn't just from your peers. This was from science. Yeah. This was from your local doctor. This was from everyone growing up, your parents, your guardians. Everyone had the same message that as you get older, your body declines and there's nothing you can do about it. Yeah. And this is just real. It's just happening. so I mean this is now we know and studies have proven that regardless of age you can improve the movements of your joints of course people have certain limitations but within that joints can be improved regardless of age the reason one of the reasons that people think is age is because the amount of time that they haven't spent working on their joints yes because from like if you look at any three-year-old they're moving beautifully yeah and that's almost the epitome of natural movement.

12:10If you just watch it, if you observe a three-year-old and you just leave them alone and you just obviously take their phone away and just leave them, right, you will see beautiful movement and they'll go, they'll squat, they'll get up, they'll sit cross legged, they'll kneel, they'll hang, they'll love to go to the playground, they'll twist, they'll climb and they'll do it without their parents teaching them. Their parents don't go, here you go, here's your little squat lesson today, right? No, this is just beautiful and natural. And then you get to like four years old. And now it's like fidgeting is now naughty, right?

12:41Don't fidget, you need to concentrate. But it's been proven now fidgeting is actually helpful when you're, you know, when you're trying to learn. Don't fidget, sit still, look at the adults sitting at the table nice and still. And so we teach these little beautiful movers, right, that to be an adult, to be a grown-up. If you want to be like them, you have to slowly learn. So if I'm 50, and since four years old, I've been told that, you know, it's all about stillness. And in school, I don't get taught sport. I don't get taught movement. I get taught a specific sport with specific roles in a human-made concept, then suddenly I'm now 46 years away, right, from where I was moving naturally.

13:29So then my brain's going, well, it must be my age. But it's not. It's 46 years, if you were 50, of course, depending on your age, of not doing natural human movement, of potentially not spending many hours on the floor, squatting, hanging, kneeling, etc. So then we have this association that it's age but it's not it's fascinating when you just said we teach kids sport but not movement and i suddenly thought that's so true it's like i mean it's great obviously for cardiovascular it's great for team building and fun if you enjoy a certain sport or whatever but but we're not taught how to move properly for our bodies at an early age which would be fun you'd still enjoy it would be good for you what are what are the biggest things that we lose in terms of ranges of movement that are completely second nature to us when we're little um man walks into a dentist yes dentist says i need you to floss every day yes okay which which do should i floss and they go the ones you want to keep you can oh my god yes okay it's the Same with joints.

14:45Which joints do you want to keep moving well? Okay, your ankles, your knees, your hips. So the ones that you keep moving well, they're the ones that you're going to get to keep. So that's the analogy of move it or lose it. If you don't, and you can apply that to a joint movement, right? If I don't put my wrist through its full ranges of motion and I teach my body that I need that motion, my body would assume I don't want it. If I don't squat on the ground, my body goes, well, I guess we don't need to squat anymore. I'm an energy efficient machine. I'm not going to keep squatting for when you get older.

15:17I don't care. So I start to just shut down. And I will, because I'm about survival, I'm talking as a body, I'm about survival, I'm about energy efficient. So I'm going to close down everything and I'm going to keep shutting it down. And unless you're constantly working on trying to restore those movements, but this will apply to any joint, to your toes, to your ankles, to your knees, to your hips, to your shoulders, to your spine. So the practice of mobility is keeping those ranges open. And the more we work on those ranges and keep them, then we get to keep them. But if we don't, our body will just go, no problem, no problem, I will get rid of them.

15:56And I feel like people feel that we're going to get to save it. We get to keep it for a later day. And it's, you know, I always use a teeth analogy. It's just like, as long as you're eating you need to brush your teeth right and as long as you're living in a modern world full of technology and conveniences and chairs and comforts you need to have a practice where you're moving your joints on a daily basis and if you don't your body will just shut them down do you know an area that i've really noticed that happening for me and i would like to consider myself quite self-aware in terms of my body and i'm i'm quite flexible i enjoy moving but is my wrists right so the plank i am okay at the plank but if i go for too long this range of movement is shortening and i've i've made a resolution this year i want to make a commitment i don't want to say resolution because it's actually could be a year-long thing and i i'm going to need to work on it spend time on it but my partner has spent the last year and a half learning how to do a handstand again.

17:02Love it. And he's got really, really good at it. So much that the other day I looked at him and it was like 16 seconds, 20 seconds. I was like, wow. And it looked so beautiful. I could see his fingers working and his elbows were bent. And I thought, I don't think I've ever been able to do a handstand, even when I was a kid. And now I feel like this, my forearm is so tight, I will really struggle. So I'm going to commit to trying to find the mobility in my wrists and my forearms again. Fantastic. That is where I can feel I'm snoozing and I'm losing. But you've already achieved step one. You've noticed it.

17:51Right. And then you have two choices. is like, well, I've noticed it. Am I going to go into it, right? Or I'm going to get away from it. Yes. And it's very tempting. It could be if you say, oh, my wrist is tight. When you go to your training, you might want to kind of avoid that because you're like, oh, there's something, there might be something wrong there. Whereas we want to go into that because obviously we don't want to injure it. You don't want to cause pain there. But we want to read those signals from the body. You literally said, I feel, right? You're sensing it. You can feel it within.

18:24And so, yeah, it's lovely that you're going into that. And a handstand is, I mean, an expression of wrist mobility. Yeah. Sure, yeah. I did some yoga a year ago with a girl called Rasheen. She's on my platform and she was doing handstand preparation. And I fully went into it going, I'm not going to be able to do this. You know that thing where you tell yourself, oh, I can't do this. And I did a little thing where it was like a little, we'd gone through 20, 30 minutes of stretching and, you know, doing things that are going to prepare us for a movement. And we did a little movement and she said, so just try and do a little jump and see if you can get any kind of balance.

19:14Not put your legs up or anything, but any kind of balance where you feel that your arms are taking. It said try again, try again. And the third time I did it, I found a one-second moment. I burst into tears. Really? Yeah. I think what you're teaching people at our age is quite an emotional thing because I think we believe, like you said, that we are shutting down and actually that's not true we don't have to for sure i feel that i got an email it's probably a couple of weeks back there was a guy guy called tim he said he was sat on the beach he's 66 and he was sitting there and he had the sun blasting on his back and he was looking out and he's just watching these little kids making sun castles and they were squatting and they were playing and they were doing kid stuff like cartwheels and handstands and throwing themselves about and falling over and get up.

20:19And he said something to me that really hit deep, really just, you know, from what you just said, he said, I'd love to get up and just move my body just for the sake of moving it, but I would feel embarrassed. I would feel it, it's not culturally acceptable for me just to get up on the beach. And that cut deep for me. And I I was like, imagine if instead of him sitting on the beach and observing this beautiful movement that we're all born with, imagine he was sat on a park bench in a park in Shanghai. And instead of your little kids running around, there was 70 and 80 year olds squatting, hanging off bars, dancing, playing, right?

21:03Being human movers. he would suddenly see people older than him, his age, his peers. Suddenly he would be the odd guy. He would be the odd one out on the bench, but he would feel free and open. So this is not about that Tim didn't know which exercises to do or how to get started. He's a born mover, but he didn't have permission. Permission has been taken away from movement since we were four years old. It's been taken away. But this is so cultural. This is really about the West being behind in terms of what is happening. You can go to China, you can go East Asia, Southeast Asia, Japan. You will go through most parks and you will see people getting up before breakfast and doing their movement on building sites.

21:52They do some kind of practice before they start. And it's just, when you see that, The house of cards completely, for me, collapses. When anyone talks about age and movement, it's just like, take a trip to Shanghai. Just go there. You don't even have to go to Shanghai. Go to freaking YouTube or whatever. Just put old people training East Asia, whatever. But look and observe. And the theory then collapses about age. You go, well, what about these millions of people? What are they doing different? What they're doing different is their culture said, movement's important movement's important and here we said education is more important so we're going to kind of skip that bit we'll do you a little bit of PE and teach you a little bit of sport but get your head down and focus pay your taxes yeah it's really a story about permission and do you mean I live in Gloucestershire right if I walk down the road all right and I where Where are all the, where are the 50 plus, 60 plus, 30 plus?

22:58Where are they? They're not in the streets, dancing, playing, moving, practicing. They're not there. So what am I going to think? There's just, I would be the odd one out to even get involved. There's, it's not even like an age problem, right? It's like, this is a cultural issue. Yeah. Divina, you can be moving beautifully. like that you have nothing to fear about getting to your 70s and get into your 80s in terms of mobility and movement right you can adapt regardless of age yeah and the messaging from the 70s was out of date I wish they'd just gone to China and just walked for a park instead of just throwing this messaging out um but yeah this it's something that can't be unseen and uh yeah i think a lot of people need to tap into that and uh when you do you suddenly go oh oh i can i can change i can improve it's not too late it's not i mean there's so much wrapped up in that because um i'm always looking for um some kind of uh inspiration for me as a woman in terms of physicality, positive, fun, mental attitude, disgraceful ageing, fun.

24:27I need people out there being their funniest, naughtiest, most flexible, strongest, living their best lives so that I feel a responsibility in a way to be that for younger women. Yeah. That, ladies and gentlemen, is the sound of our new sponsor. No, it's not a chiropractor business. It's Lint Excellence Dark Chocolate, expertly crafted by the Lint Master Chocolatier. I absolutely love it. And when I want something delicious that isn't so sweet that I feel like I've face planted a cake, this is what I reach for. Lindt Excellence Dark Chocolate is made using the finest quality ingredients so you get a richer, smoother and more flavourful dark chocolate experience.

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27:07So thank you. Small, consistent rituals. That's how you'll feel good. Move freely and live fully. This is your fix. I am your host, Stassi Schroeder. Welcome to Tell Me Lies, the official podcast. What's the most unhinged thing of season three? Steven, because he's so evil. I do think he is misunderstood. You see everyone face consequences. It's intoxicating. The writers just know how to trick you. There's always a twist in this show. Tell Me Lies, the official podcast, January 6th, and stream the new season of Tell Me Lies, January 13th, on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+. You know you need fiber for a healthy gut, but do you actually know how to get it?

27:49Quaker's been serving up fiber since 1877, with over 100 great-tasting, good source of fiber options to choose from. Whether you like old-fashioned oats, instant oatmeal, granola or oatmeal squares, Quaker makes it delicious. Mmm, so good. Get your fibre with Quaker. Shop Quaker's good source of fibre products at a store near you. And here's the thing, when people think about flexibility as well, right, they think about the splits. Because that's how it's like, oh cool, you get the splits. That's almost like how I judge flexibility. The split. And I think that becomes a problem. It's like, for me, I don't really care about the splits.

28:28I just want to be really, really good at the basics. So tell me, what are the basics? Think of the basics. Because I really don't want to add and give people more to think about and more to add. The basics of what people did as a three-year-old, right? To sit on the floor, to get up and down with the floor with ease. Yes. Which happened, just happened, to be loads of longevity tests. So a good few one, get up and down off the floor cross-legged. It's a perfect example of mobility. it's got the flexibility component let's do it let's do it together it's actually a really good example of mobility so flexibility is like you sit on the floor cross-legged and the mobility is can you get up from that position so then you have strength within your flexibility so then that's how i would refer to is like a mobility piece and you're talking about you need both it's not just flexibility it's mobility and flexibility and strength to help you execute together yeah so it's the blending of the two so you wouldn't like so for example i don't have this strength thing that i go and do over here and then this flexibility thing that i go and do over here my training combines the two yes like as i said that cross-legged one is a beautiful example because as you get up from the ground like you want to be like a bamboo tree right you want to be able to to bend but not break right is the example as if you you cannot talk about mobility in eastern practices yeah i have bamboo trees no that's just exactly it's a must it's a must i don't get that you've got to have that you know i know that i've always thought of it as flexibility but i've never really thought of this idea that those two things must be together otherwise there's no point in having it and also that you could be flexible and sit down on the floor but not be able to stand up because you don't have the mobility because you don't have the strength to back up the stretch yeah because a lot of people will see it as i was going to say people come down or whatever to come to my training and they'll go you know i'm doing strength and now i just need the flexibility it's like well you're strong here right and now you're flexible you're trying to touch your toes in terms of flexibility but i'm not really trying to get you to do that i'm trying to get you go can you combine these two together like balance is but you know balance is a good one there's loads of tests around balance in terms of longevity so standing on one leg standing on one leg with your eyes closed for those for those who find that easy it is hard isn't it Standing on one leg with your eyes closed is really hard.

30:46It's a good long-term goal for people to work towards. Of course, you would scale that back. Yeah, you would start being comfortable with a wall, right, before you even do balance. Then you would learn to balance with your eyes open. Then you can learn to balance looking up at the ceiling. It's just looking up, you'll find your balance is harder. Yes. Yeah. But, I mean, it's a good one. It's a big one for fools as well. You want to be able to train both sides equally as well. For fools, did you say? Yeah. I thought, you know what? not fools fools i was like you can't call us fools if you're a fool you should do balance but the eyes shut thing i find frustrating because i think why can't i do this i should be able to do this oh i would just yeah can you do it for a second that's probably the way to start yeah and can i do it for two seconds i know it sounds ridiculous but in in 60 days then you're you know you're working towards so you've just said 60 days is that how long you think it takes No, I was literally just basing it on like if you wanted to get a one minute balance, but you would just try and do one second every day, the next thing you know you're at a minute.

31:49But I mean like if any goal seems like quite far, right? For example, you just said, you know, standing with your eyes closed is difficult. Is it difficult for one second? Shall we try? Could you? So, hang on. Go on. I'm gonna stand behind. I know you can't hear me. One second balance. I can do that. Okay, close your eyes for one second. You ready? Okay, hold on. One.

32:18Four. Five. Six. Seven. Eight. There you go, eight. So we literally went from you can't balance to you can balance for eight seconds with your eyes closed. It's the longest I've ever done. Congratulations. You're here. I'm like, he's here. Don't lose the plot now. Okay, we've got one minute break and then we're back. 60 seconds we've got 10 sets I've got well if teachers prep you get a hug in between and then you get told that in one minute you're going again I love that really? okay like I'm just sad no but you literally but what you just demonstrated it's beautiful you literally went standing on one leg with your eyes closed is difficult and then you just said well actually I can do it for 8 seconds so I would write that eight seconds and then next day you know you're doing big things this year so next day it's going to be okay what did i get maybe it's less maybe it's five and the next day what is it maybe it's a little bit more it's nine i'm not that tired that day i had a better sleep whatever so should you notice things like that like fatigue sleep because again i think something that happens to particularly um perimenopausal menopausal women is um sleep disturbance and it does have a massive kind of knock-on effect on everything, really.

33:47Right. How important is it to mobility and flexibility sleep, do you think? Yeah, well, I'll say that I love to measure. Whenever I'm training, I love to measure progress. Do you write things down? Yeah, say, for example, what you did with the balance. I would definitely be writing stuff down. So you could do that hanging from a bar. you're trying to get maybe you want to hang through a bar for one minute because you want to improve your grip strength because you want to live longer I don't know just throwing it out as an idea I've just bought a squeezy oh right okay to help with the grip yeah oh get on a bar hang yeah I've got to find a bar like where do you there's one I'd get on one of these yeah here you go here you go round two but at home like it's quite hard to find somewhere you could put a bar do you know what I mean yeah you'd have to go to a gym really adult playgrounds They're more popular.

34:40There's a calisthenics app that has loads of adult playgrounds in the UK. Wait, there's a calisthenics app? Yeah, I can't remember what it's called. It's there. But basically you put in your postcode, it tells you your nearest place where an adult can go and train outdoors. It's probably more popular in London. I train a lot in Primrose Hill. Yeah. They've got a little adult thing with loads of bars that you can just go and hang from. But yeah, if not, you can get something that you can put on your door frame at home. Oh, yes. You've got a door frame bar. To pull up. Yeah. To pull up. Yes, I've seen that.

35:07So it doesn't matter if your knees are bent. No, I mean, when you start, you can even have your feet on the ground. You just want the benefit of, you know, it's like someone pulling your shoulders above your head. It's like someone stretching you, but then you're also building strength at the same time. Another thing that I thought about when you were talking about you snooze, you lose was an enormous issue. I mean, I know it to be one for women, but I don't know about men. I think you'd probably know better than I do, is frozen shoulder. Right. that lots of women later in life get frozen shoulder, which is really painful and difficult and just seems to get worse and worse.