In short
Better Offline - Episode Summary: "I'm Mad As Hell, And I'm Not Gonna Take It Anymore"
Podcast Overview Title: Better Offline Host: Ed Zitron Description: A weekly exploration of the tech industry's influence on society, focusing on manipulations and growth-at-all-costs mentality prevalent among tech elites. The show combines storytelling, interviews, and discussions to critique industry practices.
Episode Highlights The Bubble is Bursting
- Main Argument: Ed Zitron articulates his frustration over the inflated expectations surrounding artificial intelligence (AI), particularly generative AI.
- Key Concept: The media has played a significant role in perpetuating the myth of endless growth in AI, leading to widespread misinformation and unrealistic expectations.
The Misunderstanding of AI
- Bastardization of AI: The term "artificial intelligence" has become vague, misleading the public into believing AI can autonomously handle tasks beyond its actual capabilities.
- Generative AI Limitations: Zitron emphasizes that current generative AI models are flawed, still hallucinate, and do not significantly improve over time.
- Media's Role: The media's obsession with generative AI has resulted in inflated user numbers and financial expectations, primarily benefiting OpenAI.
Critique of Google Search
- Decline of Google: Zitron argues that Google has purposefully degraded its search product to maximize ad revenue, creating a vacuum that generative AI tools like ChatGPT have begun to fill.
- User Experience: Users often prefer ChatGPT for search because it better interprets queries and provides coherent answers, unlike Google's less effective summaries.
Examination of Generative AI's Market Potential
- Bubble Burst Indicators: Zitron discusses signs that the AI boom may be faltering, such as reduced capital expenditures by major tech firms like Amazon and Microsoft.
- Revenue Concerns: Despite massive investments, AI-related revenues are disappointing. For instance, Amazon's projected $5 billion from generative AI is a small fraction of its overall revenue.
- Sustainability Issues: The podcast questions the sustainability of business models relying heavily on generative AI, suggesting they may not be as lucrative as anticipated.
AGI and Consciousness Discussions
- Artificial General Intelligence (AGI): Zitron critiques the discussions around AGI, asserting they are based more on speculation and hype than on reality.
- Media Accountability: He calls out journalists for failing to question the narratives pushed by AI companies, labeling some discussions as absurdly fantastical.
Key Takeaways
- Misinformation in AI Growth: There is a pervasive misunderstanding of what AI can and cannot do, driven by media narratives and corporate interests.
- Critical Reflection on Tech Industry: Zitron argues that the tech industry is trapped in a cycle of unsustainable growth models and needs a paradigm shift towards more meaningful innovation.
- Call for Accountability: Media and industry leaders must be held accountable for the unrealistic narratives they propagate regarding AI capabilities.
Final Thoughts Zitron's passionate monologue serves as a rallying cry for critical thinking in tech discussions, emphasizing the need for transparency and honesty about what the industry can deliver. He expresses a commitment to continuing this conversation through the podcast.
Additional Information
- Merchandise Promotion: Better Offline merchandise is available with a promotional code for free shipping.
- Social Media Links: Ed Zitron’s social media and community engagement platforms are provided for listeners to connect further.
Conclusion This episode of Better Offline serves as a critical examination of the current state of the tech industry, particularly the inflated expectations surrounding generative AI, and encourages listeners to approach these discussions with a more discerning eye.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00This is an iHeart Podcast.
0:30Thomson Reuters and specialized bikes have since they upgraded to the next generation of the cloud. Oracle Cloud Infrastructure. OCI is the blazing fast platform for your infrastructure, database, application development, and AI needs, where you can run any workload in a high availability, consistently high performance environment, and spend less than you would with other clouds. How is it faster? OCI's block storage gives you more operations per second. Cheaper? Better? OCI costs up to 50 % less for computing, 70 % less for storage, and 80 % less for networking. Better? In test after test, OCI customers report lower latency and higher bandwidth versus other clouds.
1:12This is the cloud built for AI and all your biggest workloads. Right now, with zero commitment, try OCI for free. Head to oracle.com slash strategic. That's oracle.com slash strategic. Wells Fargo announced a new$20 million program in 2025, teaming up with nonprofits to support small business owners. That's how Wells Fargo is helping strengthen small businesses and communities. Wells Fargo, the bank of doing. Learn more at wellsfargo.com slash say do. This week on a very special episode of Health Discovered, we're taking a closer look at a condition that affects hundreds of thousands of men each year, prostate cancer.
1:54I first found out about my cancer at the age of 45. Anything with cancer, you just think death sentence. In this episode, we'll explore the science behind detection, along with the practical steps men can take to protect their health. Listen to Health Discovered on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app, search Health Discovered, and start listening.
2:25I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore.
2:36Better Offline. Welcome to Better Offline, I'm your host Ed Zitron. Now this is the second part of a two-part series about how OpenAI's stupid bloody growth myth has conned the entire media ecosystem, forcing people who really should know better to repeat absolutely insane things as though they're actually perfectly reasonable. Now, if you haven't already listened to the last episode and come back, just go. Just go. I'll need you to listen to it. Otherwise, let's talk about why this bubble actually inflated. And I realize I did a monologue about this, but it's so obvious that I needed to do a longer episode.
3:12But let's start simple. The term artificial intelligence is bastardized to the point it effectively means nothing and everything at the same time. When people hear AI, they think of an autonomous intelligence that can do things for them, and generative AI can do things for you, like generate an image or a text from a simple prompt. As a result, it's easy to manipulate people who don't know much about tech or even try it in the first place into believing that this will naturally progress from it can create a bunch of text for me that I have to write for my job just by me typing in a prompt to it can do my job for me just by typing in a prompt.
3:45Basically everything you've read about the future of AI extrapolates generative AI's ability to sort of generate something a human would make and turns it into a it can do whatever a human can do, all because some tech in the past has sometimes been bad at the beginning and linearly improved as time drags on. This illogical thinking underpins the entire generative AI boom, because we found out exactly how many people do not know what the fuck they're talking about, and are willing to believe the last semi-intelligent person that they talked to. Generative AI is kind of a remarkable car, a just good enough version of human expression to get it past the gatekeepers in finance and the media, knowing that neither will apply a second gear of critical thinking beyond, huh, guess we're doing AI now.
4:26The expectation that generative AI will transform into this much more powerful version requires you to first ignore its existing limitations, believing it to be more capable than it is, and also ignore the fact that these models have yet to show meaningful improvement over the past few years, unless you're looking at, of course, the benchmarks that they are built specifically to pass. They still hallucinate. They're still ungodly expensive to run. They're still unreliable, and they still don't really do that much. Worse still, ChatGPT's growth has galvanized these people into believing that this is a legitimate, meaningful movement, rather than the most successful public relation campaign of all time.
5:01Think of it like this. And some of you really don't like this argument, like, something couldn't be this big just because of the media. It really could. If almost every single media outlet talked about one thing, this thing being generative AI, and that one thing was available from one company, OpenAI, wouldn't it look exactly how things look today? You've got OpenAI with hundreds of millions of monthly active users, and then a bunch of other companies, including big tech firms with multi-trillion dollar market caps, with somewhere between 10 and 69 million monthly active users. And I don't count Gemini because they're cheating.
5:31You can't slap it on Google Assistant. That's unfair. What we're seeing here is one company taking most of the users and money available, and doing so because the media fucking helped them. People aren't amazed by ChatGPT. They're curious. They're curious about why the media won't shut up about it. And we have to realize and recognize and accept that part of the reason this bubble was inflated was the failure of Google search. Everyone I talk to that uses ChatGPT regularly uses it as either a way to generate shitty limericks or as a replacement for Google search, a product that Google has deliberately made worse as a means of increasing profits.
6:05Listen to our award-winning episode, The Man That Destroyed Google Search. I'm going to say that forever. And by the way, that's absolutely what you should listen to. It's Webby Award winning, the best business episode. We won it, folks. Anyway, I hate to say this. I really don't like saying this. I don't like to give it to them. But ChatGPT, if I'm honest, is better at processing search strings than Google Search, which is not so much a sign that ChatGPT is good at something as it is that Google has stopped innovating in any meaningful way. Over time, Google Search should have become something that was able to interpret searches into kind of like a perfect result, which would require the company to improve how it processes your requests.
6:41It should be how Google used to feel, magical. Instead, Google search has become dramatically worse, mostly because the company's incentives changed from help people find something on the web to funnel as much traffic and show as many ad impressions as possible on google.com. It does little annoying things like ignoring random words in the search string, even though those words were there for a reason, and Google doesn't know better than you what you want. Ideally, though, they should when it comes to a search product. That's ideally what you get someone to search something for you. You want them to bring back the best thing.
7:14And by this point, Google search should have been far more magical, more capable of taking a dimwitted question and turning it into a great answer with said answer being a result from the internet, right? Note that nothing I'm saying here is actually about generating a result. It's about processing a user's query and presenting an answer. The very foundation of computing and the thing that Google at one point was the best in the world at doing. Thanks to Propagar Raghavan, the former head of ads that led a coup to become the head of search, Google has pulled away from being the meaningful source of information on the internet.
7:43It really is actually quite sad when you think about it. And I'd argue that ChatGPT filled the void left by Google Search by doing the thing that people wanted Google Search to do, answer a question, even if the user isn't really sure how to ask it. Google Search has become clunky and messy, putting the burden of using the service on the user rather than helping fill the gap between a query and an answer in any meaningful way. Google's AI summaries don't even try to do what ChatGPT does. They just generate summaries based on search results and say, uh, mate, is this what you want? I don't fucking know.
8:16I only make, I only make like$10 billion a quarter. Give me a fucking break. But one note on Google's AI summaries, they're designed to answer a question rather than provide a right answer. There's a distinction that needs to be made here because it speaks to the underlying utility of search itself. One good illustration came earlier this week when someone noticed that you could ask Google to explain the meaning of a completely made-up phrase, and it would dutifully obey you. Two dry frogs in a situation, Google said, referred to a group of people in an awkward or difficult social situation. Not every insect has a mortgage, Google claimed, is a humorous way of explaining that not everything is as it seems.
8:50But my favorite is, um, sorry, I haven't read this back since I wrote, um, Big Winky on the Skillet Bowl is apparently a slang term that refers to a piece of bread with an egg in the middle. Very funny, sure, but is it useful? No. And it's also really cool that this company just makes billions of dollars off of this. With all its data and all its talent, Google has put out the laziest version of an LLM on top of its questionably functional search product as a means of impressing shareholders. And I'd like to say the results speak for themselves. Now, I must be clear, none of this is to say that ChatGPT is good.
9:26Like, it really isn't. It's just better at understanding a user's request than Google search. Yes, I fundamentally believe, by the way, that 500 million people a week could be using ChatGPT as some sort of search replacement. And no, no, I do not believe that's a functional business model, in part because if it was ChatGPT, OpenAI, they'd have a functional business. And to be clear, that's a load-bearing because I know that 500 million people aren't using ChatGPT as a search replacement. It's hypothetical. We actually don't know, and we cannot trust what comes out of them. Not that they share.
10:00It's not just that OpenAI is a shambles of a company. It appears that Google's ability to turn search into such a big business was because it held a monopoly on search, search advertising, and pretty much the entire online ads industry. And if it was a truly competitive market, and Google wasn't allowed to be vertically integrated with the entire digital advertising apparatus of the web, it would likely be making much less revenue per user. And that's bad if your Google replacement costs many, many, many, many, many more times more money than Google to run. As an aside, by the way, if you're wondering, no, OpenAI cannot just create a Google search competitor.
10:33Search GPT will be a significantly more expensive product to run at Google's scale than ChatGPT, both infrastructurally and the cost of revenue itself, with OpenAI being forced to create this massive advertising arm that does not exist. And by the way, another great critique I get is like, OpenAI can just hire a bunch of ads people. Why do you think there hasn't been another competitor to search? You realize that there are lots of other companies with lots of other money that could just do this, and indeed they've tried. Why do you think that hasn't worked? Is it because of the monopoly? It's because of the monopoly.
11:06It's because of the monopoly. Look, people love the chat GPT interface. It's the box where you can type in one thing, get another thing out, because it resembles how everybody has always wanted Google search to work. Does it work? Well, who knows? But people feel like they're getting more out of him.
11:46We're taking a closer look at a condition that affects hundreds of thousands of men each year, prostate cancer. I first found out about my cancer at the age of 45. Anything with cancer, you just think death sentence. In this episode, we'll explore the science behind detection, along with the practical steps men can take to protect their health. Listen to Health Discovered on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app, search Health Discovered, and start listening. This is Jason Timp from Hoops Tonight. Toyota is moving forward to a more sustainable future by giving you the freedom to choose from an incredible lineup of trucks now available in both gas and hybrid models, including the legendary Tacoma, the powerful Tundra, both available with the iForce Max hybrid powertrain and backed by Toyota's legendary reputation for reliability.
12:40More choices, less compromise. Visit buyatoyota.com for a great deal on an efficient Toyota today. Toyota, let's go places. This message comes from Greenlight. Ready to start talking to your kids about financial literacy? Meet Greenlight, the debit card and money app that teaches kids and teens how to earn, save, spend wisely, and invest with your guardrails in place. With Greenlight, you can send money to kids quickly, set up chores, automate allowance, and keep an eye on what your kids are spending with real-time notifications. Join millions of parents and kids building healthy financial habits together on Greenlight.
13:17Get started risk-free at greenlight.com slash iHeart. But before I go any further, I'd like to talk to you about AGI, artificial general intelligence. Artificial bloody general intelligence, the conscious computer that does not exist and is entirely fictional. and this two-part by the way has been a break from my usual onerous tortured punished and analysis and it's because i needed to have a little fun i think you've kind of heard that in the episode i'm like a little flexible i'm all all like limber and excited and it also comes from a place of frustration none of this ai stuff has ever felt substantive or real because the actual things that you can do with generative ai never seem to come close to the things that people at sam altman and wario amade seem to be promising nor do they come close to the bullshit like people casey newton and kevin roose are peddling none of this ever resembled artificial general intelligence and if i'm honest very little of it seems to even suggest it's a functional industry and when cynical plants like kevin roose of the times bumble around asking theoretical questions such as do you think that there's a 50 chance or higher that agi defined as an ai system that outperforms human experts.
14:27Eventually, all cognitive tasks will be built before 2030. I think when we're reading people saying that, and that was Kevin Roos at some little AI panel thing surrounded by just venture capitalists and the senior officials of Anthropic, when you've got the lead columnist of the Times saying this, we should all be terrified. We should be terrified, but not of AGI, but that the lead tech columnist at the New York Times appears to have an undiagnosed concussion. Roos' logic, as with Casey Newton's, is based on the idea that he's talked to a bunch of people that say, yeah, yeah, mate, AGI is right around the corner, rather than any kind of like tangible proof or evidence, just line going up.
15:06Do you see it? The line's going up. Which line is it? Get out of my house. Look, I will say, I've been a little mean on Kevin Roos. I've been saying that he's written the worst shit about artificial intelligence that he is a credulous buffoon or at worst a cynical plan that he kevin roos at the new york times is regularly pushing things like nfts and crypto and getting basic things wrong like the helium piece in which helium lied about their about their customers uh i've said that kevin roos regularly says things that don't make any sense and he has indeed written the worst tech criticism out there criticism being the wrong word take analysis out there and i want to just say that I've been wrong.
15:47I've been wrong the entire time. What I should have said is that he's written the worst stuff yet. And I should have said that because he's recently published one of the dumbest fucking things I've read in my life and I can't wait to tell you about it. His most egregious example of credulousness came in late April when he published this thinly veiled puff piece about what to do if AI models become conscious in the future. Now this piece, this piece is possibly the dumbest tech piece I've read in my life. I really mean this. I've read some dog shit. I've gone on Telegram groups for the smallest ICOs you've seen in your life.
16:19I'm doing the Rutger Hauer speech from Blade Runner right now. The things I've seen with your eyes, different speech, I realize. This piece from the New York Times is called, If AI Systems Become Conscious, Should They Have Rights? And the subhead is, As Artificial Intelligence Systems Become Smarter, One AI Company is Trying to Figure Out What to Do If They Become Conscious. I'm going to give you exactly one guess what company he's talking about. And here's a clue. It's the company Casey Newton's boyfriend works at. That's right, it's Anthropic. Kevin Roos interviewed two people, both employed by Anthropic, with one holding the genuinely hilarious job description of AI welfare researcher, who said nakedly insane things like, there's only a small chance, maybe 15 % or so, that Claude or another AI system is conscious.
17:04And it seems that if you find yourself in a situation of bringing some new class of being into existence, dot dot dot, then it seems quite prudent to at least be asking questions about whether that system might have its own kinds of experiences. Well, I'm experiencing brain damage reading this article out. And what makes this article so appalling is that Roos acknowledges that this shit is seen by most level-headed people as utterly fantastical. He describes the concept of AI consciousness as a taboo subject and that many critics will see this as crazy talk, but doesn't bother to speak to any actual critics.
17:37He does, however, speculate on the motives of said critics, saying that they might object to an AI company's study and consciousness in the first place, because it might create incentives to train their systems to act more sentient than they actually are. Yeah, Kevin, wouldn't it be really bad if a generative AI company deliberately did something to convince someone that their systems were sentient? You know, someone really credulous who would accept whatever narrative said AI company was pushing, such as that they created a special job just in case AI was sentient. Genuine question, Kevin. When you walk past the mirror, do you start barking at it because you see another guy?
18:10Anyway, nothing about anything that OpenAI or Anthropic is building or shipping suggests that we are anywhere near any kind of autonomous computing. They've used the concept of AI safety and now AI welfare as a marketing term to convince people that their expensive, wasteful software will somehow become conscious because they're having discussions about what to do if it does so. And anyone, literally any reporter accepting this at face value is doing their readers a disservice and embarrassing themselves in the process. If AI safety advocates cared about, I don't know, safety or AI, they'd have cared about the environmental impact or the fact that these models train using stolen material or the fact that these models don't really deliver on their promises.
18:49And if they did, it would shock the labor market and it would hurt millions, if not billions of people. And we don't have anywhere near the social safety network to support the ones we have right now, let alone in this completely fictional future. These companies do not care about your safety, and they don't have any way to get to AGI. They're full of shit, and it's time to stop being honest that you don't have any proof that they do anything that they say they will. Also, by the way, I think the bubble might actually be bursting. Yeah, remember in August of last year, I was talking about the pale horses of the AI apocalypse.
19:21Well, one of the major warning signs that the bubble was bursting was big tech firms would be reducing their capital expenditures. And this is a call I've made quite a few times, and there was one in alarming clarity from April 4th, 2024. And I'm going to quote myself here. While I hope I'm wrong, the calamity I fear is one where the massive overinvestment in data centers is met with a lack of meaningful growth or profit, leading to the markets turning on the major cloud players that stake their future on unproven generative AI. If businesses don't adopt AI at scale, not experimentally, but at the core of their operations, the revenue is simply not there to sustain the hype.
19:55And once the market turns, it will turn hard, demanding efficiency and cutbacks that will lead to tens of thousands of job cuts. Well, we're about to find out if I'm right. On April 21st, Yahoo Finance reported that analyst Josh Beck said that Amazon's generative AI revenue for Amazon Web Services would be$5 billion. $5 billion this year. A remarkably small sum that is not profit, by the way, and also a drop in the bucket compared to Amazon's projected 105 billion dollars in capital expenditures in 2025 it's 78.2 billion dollars in expenditures in 2024 or it's 48.4 billion dollars in 2023 and is that really fucking it are you fucking kidding me are you fucking kidding me i have had jack holes for years telling me this was the next big money driver five billion dollars five billion goddamn are you fucking kidding you'd make more money auctioning dogs this is a disgrace and if you're wondering yes all of this is for ai all of that capex from the yahoo finance article the wonderful laura bratton wrote well this is a quote by the way from the article ceo andy jassy said in february that the vast majority of its this year's 100 billion dollars in capital investments from the tech giant will go towards building out artificial intelligence capacity for its cloud segment amazon web services aws well shit i bet investors are gonna love this better save some money andy what's that what's Andy?
21:14What? Oh, you're saving money already. How? Oh, shit. Oh, uh-oh. A report from Wells Fargo analysts published at the end of April called Data Centers, AWS Goes on Pause, says that Amazon has paused a portion of its leasing discussions on the co-location side. And while it's not clear the magnitude of the pause, the positioning is similar to what analysts have heard recently from Microsoft, that they are digesting aggressive recent lease-up deals pulling back from a pipeline of LOIs or SQQs. Now, some arsehole is going to say LOIs and SQQs aren't a big deal, but they are. They are. Go listen to the PowerCut episodes.
21:48Go listen. Go back and listen to them right now. Get off my... How'd you get in my house? Anyway, digesting in this case refers to when hyperscalers sit with their current capacity for a minute, and Wells Fargo adds that these periods typically last 6 to 12 months, though they can be much shorter. It's not obvious how much capacity Amazon is walking away from, but they're walking away from capacity. It's happening.
22:18Parking shouldn't slow you down. ParkWiz gives every driver a shortcut. Book ahead, save up to 50%, and skip the hassle of circling the block. Park smarter, park faster. ParkWiz. Download the ParkWiz app today and save every time you park. This week on a very special episode of Health Discovered, We're taking a closer look at a condition that affects hundreds of thousands of men each year, prostate cancer. I first found out about my cancer on my birthday at the age of 45. Found out my cancer has spread to my pelvic bone. And from there, life just changed. About one in eight men will be diagnosed with prostate cancer during their lifetime, and the risk increases with age.
23:06Anything with cancer, you just think death sentence. And the only thing I could think about was, who's going to take care of my family? You have to go out there and build your support system. You got to build your team. In this episode, we'll explore the science behind detection, along with the practical steps men can take to protect their health. Listen to Health Discovered on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app, search Health Discovered, and start listening.
24:01Visit buyatoyota.com for a great deal on an efficient Toyota today. Toyota, let's go places. Residents at Brightview Senior Living Communities enjoy enhanced possibilities, independence, and choice. Brightview, Dulles, and Great Falls offer vibrant senior independent living, assisted living, and memory care services through various daily programs, chef-prepared meals, safety and security, transportation, resort-style amenities, and high-quality care. Take financial possession of your apartment by December 31st, 2025 and save. Discover more at brightviewseniorliving.com. Equal housing opportunity.
24:42But what if it wasn't just Amazon? Another report from a friend of the podcast read, People I email occasionally asking for a PDF. Of course, referring to analyst TD Cohen put out a report last week that, while titled in a way that suggested there wasn't a pullback at all, actually said that there was. It was called like, Hyperscala Demand is Up. Let's take a look at one damning quote. Relative to the hyperscaler demand backdrop at PCC, which is a conference hyperscaler demand has moderated a bit, driven by the Microsoft pullback and to a lesser extent Amazon discussed later, particularly in Europe, there has been a broader moderation in the urgency and speed with which the hyperscalers are looking to take down capacity.
Read the full transcript
25:17And the number of large deals, i.e. 400 megawatt deals in the market, appears to have moderated. In plain English, this means demand has come down, there's less urgency to build stuff, and the market is also slowing down. Cohen also added that he'd observed a moderation in the exuberance around the outlook for hyperscale demand, which characterized the market this time last year. Brother, my brother in Christ, isn't this meant to be the next big thing? We need more exuberance, not less. Worse still, Microsoft appears to have pulled back even further with TD Cohen noting that there has been a slowdown in demand, and that it saw very little third-party leasing from Microsoft this quarter.
25:54and most damningly in our boat and i'll be kind of i really want you to like take this let it ring through you these deals in totality suggest that microsoft's run rate demand has decelerated materially for those of you wondering it means that they're not getting any fucking revenue demand for generative ai well at least meta and oracle aren't slowing down right well um td cohen also reported that it received reverse inquiries from industry participants around a potential slowdown in demand from Oracle, leading to the analysts to ask around and find that there had been a near-term slowdown in decision-making amid organizational changes at Oracle.
26:30Though it adds that this might not mean this is changing its needs or the speed at which it secures capacity. And if you're wondering what else this could mean, you are correct in doing so, because slowing down traditionally refers to a change in speed. Yeah, even the analysts are kind of like trying to dance around this. It's kind of sad. TD Cohen also adds that Meta has continued demand, which means that they're buying more stuff, albeit with less volume of megawatt signings quarter over quarter, then adding that Meta's data center activity is historically being characterized by short periods of strong activity followed by digestion.
27:02In essence, Meta is signing less megawatts of compute and has in the past followed these kind of aggressive build-outs with fewer build-outs. It doesn't sound good, does it? It doesn't sound like we're cooking. And now we're going to get to, and the whole thing's been kind of defensive, I don't care. I mean, I've yet to receive an email that meaningfully changes my opinion on any of this stuff, but a little bit of defensiveness in this. It's not because I feel self-conscious, it's because I'm tired of hearing the same fucking questions. But I'll ask you if you're a critic, or a hater, or one of the many people who would like to see me punished, put me on the cross, set me on fire.
27:38It's what you would love, wouldn't it be? You'd love it if I was dead. Putting that joke aside, I will ask my haters a question. If I'm wrong, how exactly am I wrong? i don't know man all this seems all this stuff sure seems like the hyperscalers are reducing their capital expenditures at a time when tariffs and economic uncertainty are making investors far more critical of revenues it sure seems that nobody outside of open ai is making any real revenue on generative ai and they're certainly not making a profit it also seems at this point it's pretty obvious that generative ai isn't going to do much more than it does today if amazon is only making five billion dollars in revenue from the literal only shiny new thing it has sold on the world's premier cloud platform at a time when businesses are hungry and desperate to integrate AI, then there's little chance this suddenly turns into a remarkable revenue driver.
28:25Amazon made$187.79 billion in their last quarterly earnings, and if only$5 billion of that is coming from AI at the height of the bubble, it heavily suggests that there may not actually be that much money to make, either because it's too expensive to run these services or because, well these services don't have the kind of addressable market that aws generally has microsoft has reported that it was making a paltry 13 billion dollars a year in annualized revenue so the equivalent of 3.25 billion dollars a quarter selling generative ai services and model access the information reported that sales force's agent force bullshit isn't even going to boost sales growth in 2025 in part because it's pitching it as a digital labor that can essentially replace humans for tasks.
29:07And it turns out that it doesn't do that very well at all, cost$2 a conversation and requires paying Salesforce to use its data cloud product. What if anything suggests that I'm wrong here? The things have worked out in the past with things like the internet and smartphones and that surely that's going to happen with generative AI and by extension open AI, that companies like Uber lost money and eventually worked it out. And I've actually written a thing I'll link to about that. You can get it in the episode notes. Is it that open AI is growing fast and that somehow discounts the fact that it burns billions of dollars and does not appear to have any path to profitability, do you think that agents will suddenly start working and everything will be fine?
29:45It's a fucking joke. I'm tired of it. I'm really, I'm just, I've tried to be like intellectual. I've tried to explain it nicely and I'll probably still continue, but I'm just kind of fucking tired of it. I'm not going to stop doing this by the way. If anything, I'm more galvanized by my rage. My aura ring is going to claim I did a workout these episodes. it's great, I'm burning calories in real time. But large language models and their associated businesses, in my opinion, are a$50 billion industry masquerading as a trillion dollar solution for a tech industry that's lost the fucking plot. Silicon Valley is dominated by management consultants that no longer know what innovation looks like, and they've been tricked by Sam Altman, who's kind of a savvy con artist that took advantage of their desperation for growth.
30:30Generative AI is the perfect nihilistic form of tech bubbles, a way for people to spend a lot of money on power on cloud compute because they don't have anything else to do. Large language models are boring, unprofitable cloud software stretched to the limits, both ethically and technologically speaking, as a means of kind of keeping tech's collapsing growth era going. And OpenAI's non-profit mission has been fattened up to make foie gras for SaaS companies to upsell their clients and cloud compute companies to sell GPUs at an hourly rate. The rot economy has consume the tech industry. Every American tech firm has been corrupted by the growth at all cost mindset, and thus they no longer know how to make sustainable businesses that solve real problems, largely because the people that run them haven't experienced them for decades.
31:14As a result, none of them were ready for when Sam Altman tricked them into believing he was their savior. Generative AI isn't about helping you or me to do things, or even about replacing workers. It's about making new SKUs, new monthly subscription costs for consumers and enterprises, new ways to convince people to pay more for the things they already have, used in slightly different ways that oftentimes end up being worse. Only an industry out of options would choose this bubble, and the punishment for them doing so will be grim. I don't know if you think I'm right or not. I don't know if you think I'm insane for the way I communicate about this industry.
31:48Even if you think I am, think long and hard about why it is you disagree with me, and the consequences of me being wrong or right. There's nothing else left after generative AI. There are no hyper-growth markets left in tech. SaaS companies are out of things to upsell. Google, Microsoft, Amazon, and Meta do not have any other ways to continue showing growth. And when the market works that out, there will be hell to pay. Hell that will reverberate through the valuations of, at the very least, every public software company, and many of the hardware ones too. I have no idea how this ends, and I can't see how any of it works out well for anyone.
32:23In any case, I'll be here to tell you whether it does or not. And I must say, I love doing the show so much. And thank you for humoring me when I experience brain madness every week. I'm not going to stop. I really enjoy doing this. And the emails I got around the Webby were genuinely wonderful. The people on the Reddit, people over email messages, just you're all so wonderful. I'm going to keep doing this. I mean, I'm contractually agreed to as well, but I love doing this. And I genuinely feel very lucky to be able to.
33:02Thank you for listening to Better Offline. The editor and composer of the Better Offline theme song is Matt Ossowski. You can check out more of his music and audio projects at matosowski.com. M-A-T-T-O-S-O-W-S-K-I dot com. You can email me at ez at betteroffline.com or visit betteroffline.com to find more podcast links and, of course, my newsletter. I also really recommend you go to chat.wheresyoured.at to visit the Discord and go to r slash betteroffline to check out our Reddit. Thank you so much for listening. Better Offline is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
34:06We'll be right back.
34:24On the hunt for designer steals that'll turn heads and leave a trail of envy? Uncover Gucci, Valentino, Versace, Stuart Weitzman, and more. With new arrivals dropping weekly at prices too good to stay confidential. Lux layers, statement boots, and tailored essentials from Saks Off 5th will put your wardrobe on the most wanted list. Head to SaksOff5th.com or a Saks Off 5th store near you for a style lineup you won't want to miss. Hey, it's Jonas Knox, and Toyota is moving toward a more sustainable future by giving you the freedom to choose from a full lineup of hybrids, plug-in hybrids, regular gas, and 100 % electric vehicles, including stylish cars like the Camry and Corolla, as well as efficient and spacious SUVs like the RAV4 and Grand Highlander, all backed by Toyota's reputation for reliability.
35:11No pressure, just possibilities. Visit buyatoyota.com for a great deal on an efficient Toyota today. Toyota, let's go places. Residents at Brightview Senior Living Communities enjoy enhanced possibilities, independence, and choice. Brightview Dulles and Great Falls offer vibrant senior independent living, assisted living, and memory care services through various daily programs, chef-prepared meals, safety and security, transportation, resort-style amenities, and high-quality care. Take financial possession of your apartment by December 31, 2025 and save. Discover more at brightviewseniorliving.com.
35:47Equal housing opportunity. This is an iHeart Podcast.
From the publisher
In this episode, Ed Zitron walks you through all the signs that the bubble is bursting, and how hysterical boosters continue to desperately keep it from doing so.
YOU CAN NOW BUY BETTER OFFLINE MERCH! Go to https://cottonbureau.com/people/better-offline and use code FREE99 for free shipping on orders of $99 or more.
You can also order a limited-edition Better Offline hat until 5/22/25! https://cottonbureau.com/p/CAGDW8/hat/better-offline-hat#/28510205/hat-unisex-dad-hat-black-100percent-cotton-adjustable
---
LINKS: https://www.tinyurl.com/betterofflinelinks
Newsletter: https://www.wheresyoured.at/
Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/BetterOffline/
Discord: chat.wheresyoured.at
Ed's Socials:
https://www.instagram.com/edzitron
https://bsky.app/profile/edzitron.com
https://www.threads.net/@edzitron
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

