Radio Better Offline: Andy Richter

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28:32Taxes and fees extra. See mintmobile.com. So here's a fun story for you. So twice on the show, I've talked about just another instruction for any anti-trans people listening. Just another update on my instructions. You should be in the garage. The door should be closed. The car may not be started yet. Rev that engine, baby. Rev the engine. Now, if you're not getting sleepy, get the tube, go to the exhaust, and then put that bad boy in the window. That's the sleepy juice. You need more of that. Now, I got several emails from people saying, you can't say that. You can't suggest anti-trans people kill themselves.

29:06And the answer is, watch me. And I think the whole fucking who's the Joe Rogan of the left thing doesn't make sense. And I think if you break it down into what it is, it's everything you're talking about, which is there is no like insane propaganda unity across the left and also the left. I fucking hate the term as well because it's like the left, depending on who you talk to, it refers to like CBS news. Or Marxists. Or Marxists. It's a complete milieu of different things. But ultimately it's because people actually have beliefs that they stick to and those can change within distinct groups versus the right way.

29:42Yeah. And they also, too, don't walk in lockstep on every single issue. You know, people have like, you know, you can think that socialized medicine is a wonderful thing, but you also are, you know, because you're Catholic or for whatever reason, you know, you're, you know, anti-abortion. And that – so there's like – there's too many varying issues within the liberal whatever you want to call it, the not right world that it's never – you don't get lockstep. Which is inconvenient. And also the right wing are really on lockstep with what they hate. Yes. And that's – the thing is you can hate them.

30:24Like, I just feel like there is a certain degree of meekness with it. And also when Pod Save America is one of the largest, that's also never a great start. Also, another really simple thing is, and you and I have been into this as well, and others have as well, where it's like, there's also not multi-billionaires backing every single leftist podcast. Right, right. Which would be really funny. That would be awesome. It would be really funny. If there was just like billions of dollars going into guys just doing like 18-hour seasons of podcasts about why Medicare for all is necessary. Yeah, yeah.

30:53Sadly, we don't have that kind of unity in any way. And it sucks. And it sucks as well because I think that there is this, getting back to comedy as well, there's this assumption with comedy as well. It's like it has to be rude to be funny. It can be tragic. There can be... And one of my favorite things that made me laugh, and I'm not laughing at the event. You're going to know where I'm going with this in a second. A guy did a wonderful stand-up thing, not funny, describing like post-9-11, how he was a muslim was horribly mistreated and he was i'm going to look this up and get the length he's like talking about how people hated him hate other people of color anyone who was brown with was treated horribly and how it really pushed him towards his faith and unity in his community and he stops at the end of about a minute and a half he goes did 9-11 work and it's just like fucking amazing just like perfectly done because yeah someone could scold him if he was not describing his actual experience right and it's just i feel like the future of comedy is going to be so fucking weird because both the subject matter and the speed at which things work and happen is so different to how it used to be used to actually here's a question how did you prepare for the show just a very basic like an for for the show how much work did you have to do Oh, like day-to-day?

32:10Day-to-day. Well, earlier on, you know, like back in the late night days, I was a writer on the show and was expected to do, for the first few years, as much as any other writer. Like, you know, we had a board that had five, you know, five columns, which were the days, and then act one, act two, act three, act four, act five, act six. And you had to fill them. And, you know, some of them were filled with guests. or a guest band and stuff. But you had to fill those spots with bits that you came up. So they'd put a card in there that would be like, you know, whatever, you know, zoo detective. Right.

32:48And it would be up there with your initials, you know, down on the corner. So I was expected to do that. And then there were also like just different bits that kind of were handed to me that they'd come up with a new one. They'd be like, here, you write this because you're good at writing this particular kind of thing. um and then there was also too uh i started i was the first one to do remotes because robert smigel who was running the show um didn't want to send conan out on remotes because that was very much a david letterman thing like the host going out and being the host out in the world whereas i was kind of going out and being this naif you know this kind of you know boy man boy out in the world And so I was doing remotes, and I would have to edit those.

33:33I'd come back from the Arkansas State Fair and go to bed and then go into the work the next day and start cutting that piece. And working sometimes until 3, 4 o 'clock in the morning, getting that ready. Was this physical media or was this? It was video. Okay. Yeah, it was video. It was all on big three-quarter inch tapes. That was kind of what? Yeah. It was not digital back in those days, in the 90s. Because that's the thing. The speed of iteration there and the speed of things happening, it sounds like several days, if not more. What's fascinated me, have you ever seen Josh Johnson? Incredible stand-up comedian.

34:13The name's familiar. Maybe. Lots of J's in comedy, though. He's on The Daily Show. He's fantastic. African-American guy. One of the funniest guys has this amazing kind of slow draw to everything he does. but I think he might be the future of comedy for one reason he's I can write really I've never seen anyone who writes that fast other than me and I write newsletters and they swear and all he will have a new bit about something that just happened immediately yeah he will have like a 10 minutes fucking material yeah yeah and it will be about Elon Musk or something he did he had this amazing thing about damn it there was a lawsuit with a rapper and I can't remember the name now with just this insane long thing where like a lawyer nearly got censured or like sanctioned I mean by the judge because he would not reveal something that he shouldn't by law.

34:59Nevertheless, it's insane watching these comedians have to go from this thing where they, I don't know, I'm not a stand-up, I know a few of them, that would go up and prepare material and they'd workshop it a bit in open mic nights and they'd try it and then they'd have a real show where they'd do it. Now it's just, you have to just fucking burn material all the time. You have to keep it relevant. And it almost feels like it's going to breed in a different kind of comedian, one that can respond just way faster. Well, yes, absolutely. And also, too, there is the real thing with comedians, and I'm – you know, it's one of the reasons that I'm not a stand-up comedian, and I'm glad I'm not a stand-up comedian, is that because you can't – well, there's kind of part of me that's like, really, can't you?

35:43Like if you tell a joke on – what I was going to say is if you say – if you're – there's a bit on Instagram, it can't go into your hour. Why not? Because that joke has already been heard and been seen. Is this like industry? Yeah. It's just sort of a, what do they call it? Common wisdom or whatever you call it. Conventional wisdom. That's the phrase I'm looking for. And I've always kind of been like, really? And it's the same reason that they're so protective about people filming them while they're working on stuff. Like in a club, somebody releasing. Because then the jokes will be out there. which it's kind of, I mean, there's a, yes, I understand it.

36:23But on the other hand, I also think like, I mean, I'm just probably more casual with material and, you know, and because I come from more of an improv background and never had to like guard, you know, like guard my words, my precious, precious words. But they, so they can't do that. That's why you see so much crowd work because crowd work is disposable. Right. And that's why – and you do find like there's some really fantastic crowd work comedians that you do see. And they will also sort of – I mean the best ones, the funniest ones – and this is the main point that I want to make about this whole thing.

37:08The best ones, the funniest ones, you'll see them doing crowd work, but you'll also see a little bit of their act. Like they're not afraid to give you a little bit of their act. Right. And the reason is, is because they're artists. Right. And the difference between the people that are bitching about like, I can't say difficult things anymore is because they don't know how to do it artfully. And the people that are good at it are artists and they do it artfully. And you can hear the most uncomfortable shit from an artist because they will know how to tell you it in a way that resolves itself. And it's not inherently exploitative or mocking.

37:44Yes. Because that's the thing with all of these comedians who are like, oh, you can't say this anymore. Then find something fucking else funny. Isn't this your goddamn job? The notion that you can't do comedy is just demonstrably false. There's comedy fucking everywhere. What are you talking about? And life is more absurd than it's ever been. I mean, doing this show, I'm not a comedian. I'm funny in the other way. But even within the tech industry, it's just like right now, you're not a techie guy. you've got just like multiple multi-billion dollar companies trillion dollar companies chasing AI in this direction where like they all lose money and no one really wants it right it's inherently fucking hilarious it's also very grim to watch but watching these kind of like damn little weirdos and freaks walk around and say stuff that no human being should believe about making calls it is funny and there's so much I don't want to say joy because there's a lot of misery right now but there's so much different thing there's so many different things that you can make material from i choose josh johnson because he's even moved into some tech stuff because guess what everything is approachable from a human position even if you don't know well and it's just like oh if i can't be racist or sexist anymore i'm out of things what do you fucking do with your day man yeah you just go around just like dropping slurs and insulting yeah i mean now that i think about it probably that's what those guys do.

39:04And it's also just like it's people that want to recycle old tropes, like about fucking women or these cross-dressers or whatever. They're not coming up with anything new. They're just regurgitating this sort of zeitgeist that guys with backward baseball caps are going to go woo at. And it's inherently also kind of regressive because it's not really – all it says about them is, man, you know what would be funny? If I said something hurtful and I'm not meant to do this, which is what makes it funny. What was weird, though, is you wanted to have a really horrible experience. Try watching Family Guy.

39:49It is insane that that show aired. Just to any listeners, I don't really recommend watching it. But Family Guy was insanely sexist, racist. They say actual slurs on there. yeah it's crazy what used to be and i have to wonder if some of these right-wing comedians or even just kind of like people would wouldn't say that that was their identity are just like watching family guy and things that i'd be like we used to be able to just do entire episodes about peter griffin being mexican yeah and that is an actual episode of family guy by the way there is an entire plot where he's an illegal immigrant it's fucking insane yeah yeah it is insane what used to be considered funny and aired on tv yeah in fact there is a show called black white have you heard of this there was a show on fox in like 2005 where a white family got blacked up like full blackface it's insane and then a black family got whited up and it was called black white the world is insane the world is actually insane like when you look like we have it may not feel like we've come far but we have yeah on that snl the let that 50th thing you know they did sort of what I found to be a very interesting little segment and also sort of, um, you know, sort of, they didn't have to like air their dirty laundry, but it was just a little montage of their incredibly rate past racist things.

41:10Oh my God. Asian, Asians and, you know, Latinos and just really great. And, and sexist stuff, you know, I get why they did that, but I personally wouldn't have, I would, I would have probably not, not put that up. I mean, I liked it because I thought like – like I said, it seemed – it's like – It acknowledged the past. Yeah. It was like somebody saying, I used to make mistakes and I learned from them and I don't do them anymore, which I always – I can accept that. And also too – Is that what they said though? I think so. I hope so. I think that's what they meant. I haven't watched SNL in a while.

41:47I don't think they were saying like, we can't get away with this anymore because it's so – these bits are so shitty. I think more what I'm suggesting is what frustrates me with things like that, and I have not watched it, so I'm sure someone will email me saying I'm wrong. It happens. Even when I'm right. If it's just them showing it without making any commentary, that pisses me off because it's just like, oh, we shouldn't do this again. Well, they did preface it as like, can you believe we used to do this kind of stuff? That's kind of cool. I like that. So somewhat subject change. So AI. Yes.

42:18Have you used any of this? I have not. I keep thinking like, oh, because I'll hear people, you know, because there are aspects to, say, chat GPT that are interesting to me. Right. Like I have spaghetti, a green pepper, you know, tamarind sauce. What do I do with it? Right. And it'll give you a recipe and, you know. Sure. Like that's like, that's pretty neat, you know. And then, like I was just listening. I'm a Howard Stern listener. And he was messing around with it, and he asked ChatGPT, because he's learning guitar, and he had some new guitar, and the strings were making his fingers black. So he asked ChatGPT, why is my new guitar making my fingers black?

43:06And ChatGPT says there's an oil that's on there from the factory that's a protective oil to keep the strings from rusting. And so if you wipe it with a dry cloth, it should be good. And I thought, okay, that's pretty cool. You know, like to ask a question like that. I don't want it to write your fucking papers. That's the thing. I don't want it to, yeah. I don't want to watch a movie that just was made up out of a machine mind. And I don't, I just have to believe that it won't be like that. And if it is like that, that is a long, long, long way away. And that's the thing. I am very anti, and as part of the show, I have dug into OpenAI a great deal and bad company and all that.

43:55I think what's funny about all of these descriptions is I try and ask people who are not super technical about this all the time, what do you use it for? And every single person describes Google search if it worked. It's like, what if Google search answered? Absolutely. What if there was a website where you could ask it something? Or maybe if Siri wasn't stupid. Yes. Yeah. And what's funny is they've added, you've got an iPhone. Yeah. So you've seen Apple intelligence then. I mean, I have not attempted it because I've heard so much bad stuff. Oh, you've turned it off? I don't know if I've turned it off or not.

44:28Well, I do get a thing where it makes that sort of like purple glow around it, like wanting to do something AI. And I just ignore it, you know. That's the thing, though. And it's suggesting me texts. Which are not good responses. No, they're not. They're almost never. I had a friend telling me about a really bad relationship thing, and it said, that's disappointing. It's like, I don't think that would have helped him. You fucked that up. You moron. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it does feel like they're just selling us back something that works. Because the Siri does not work better. It works worse now.

45:06I used to be able to. I think so, too. My big thing I used this for with Siri was just reminders. And I used them constantly. It'll be like, I will think of something at 11.30 p.m. and I'll mutter it and it'll work. Now it works like 80 % of the time. Oh, really? It used to work 90 % of the time. But everything we're describing has been here for 10 years. Other than maybe the, no, no, the string thing. I'm sure if he Googled that, it would have worked too. Yeah. It's just, it's very depressing because. Oh, yeah, absolutely. If you Googled black residue on guitar strings, it would come up. Yeah.

45:42Yeah, yeah. And the things I've found it useful for, and my listener is going to beat my ass for this. I don't even use chat GPT because fuck that shit. But large language models, when I've used them, have been like, break down this complex paragraph of financial crap. Explain it in plain English. I will then have to go and verify that independently. Right, of course, because they're wrong a lot. Because I do not trust this shit. But it's interesting how the long and short of it is, is what if Google search was slightly bad? What if we had a website for questions? Yeah. And it worked. And then Google's idea is they're doing AI overviews now, and they just added a new kind.

46:17And now Google's idea is what if we worked, kind of, and it was way more expensive? Would you like that? Oh, you hate it. We don't care. Profits up. Yeah. And what if it used all the energy on Earth? Yes. What if it boiled small lakes and required us to steal from every person forever? It's just – see, this is – and that's the thing. it's frustrating to watch because this whole the whole thing with the show that's doing this show has been like what hoping things would get better and watching them get worse and putting aside doge and all that crap happening in the real world yeah it doesn't feel like the tech is doing stuff to help us anymore like it doesn't feel fun do you you're not a technical person but you like gadgets i assume you still dick around with computers and such a little bit yeah yeah i mean Not so much as I used to.

47:05When did that stop? Just as I got older and I got divorced and then got remarried and I have a five-year-old now. I have a 24-year-old, a 19-year-old, and a five-year-old. Nice. Five-year-old takes up a lot of time. Yes. So, I mean – and also too, I'm 58 now and I – it's like nobody wants to watch my shows. You know, and my shows are very dad show, like the CIA spy shit. Not Reacher. Reacher is just basically about, like I've heard it described, like what if a guy was really big? What if a giant was Sherlock Holmes? But the new season, they have a bigger guy. I know. You've got a real big fella.

47:50I saw that. But I mean, but I, you know, like The Agency and Paradise and those kind of shows. And then also to things like Traders, but Traders I'll watch with my wife, but she won't watch these other ones. They're too stressful. So once everybody goes to bed, they go upstairs about like 8, 30, 9 o 'clock. I'm good for maybe an hour of watching something. So I'm not going to be playing video games. Right. Because A, I'm a little too old. And this isn't exactly right. I just never got good at them. Right. And I don't know whether I just didn't have a facility for them. And I did have an experience because I was given, and I don't even remember.

48:37I think it was an early Xbox possibly, maybe a PlayStation. And it was early in my time in New York City, a couple of years after I'd been living there. And there was a game called Road Rash. Oh, yeah. Do you remember that? I remember the year. Yeah. A motorcycle race where you could hit each other with stuff. And this is – we're probably talking 1995, 1996. Oh, no. Okay. So that was the original. I'm talking the original one. No, so that would have been like probably a Sega Genesis or a SNES. Maybe. I don't remember. But it was something – it was swag. Right. I don't think I'm – and I don't mean to be a dick.

49:16It's just like when you're on TV, people just give you free shit. That's fun. And when you're not on TV and when you really need free shit, nobody's there to give it to you. Right. But that's – so I had this game system, played Road Rash, and my sister-in-law, my ex-wife's younger sister was living with us at the time. And she and I would play Road Rash and I would think like, well, we've been playing for about an hour. And it would be five hours. Hell yeah. Four or five hours. The magic of gaming. And I just was like, this is not good. Oh, so you felt you would get addicted. Yeah, yeah. This is just like that much loss of time for me because I already – one of my lifelong self-critiques is you're not doing enough.

50:06Like why the fuck don't you do more? Same here. You lazy fucker. Get off your ass and do something. Your life would be better if you had more initiative. so to introduce a like just an actual time suck yeah i i was like no no this i cannot do this i mean and i you know and i you know i i haven't i i quit now but you know i throughout my life have smoked weed too and that was enough you know that was like enough it's like to me it felt like like weed crack that's what the game like what gaming felt to me it's like this is because weed is such kind of like a little vacation from yourself at least that's what it was for me oh yeah yeah and and the game was just like this is a vacation this i don't i'm i don't exist and road rash absolutely ruled yeah yeah it was really fun because when you said playstation xbox they did remake it at some point the gate you see you get given free shit i get given emails emails from people correcting me about when road rash came out no i love my listeners i deeply love them

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53:26Actually, that's an interesting thing. It's a slight different thing. So I was having a conversation with someone. Eric Silver, he's over at Multitude Productions, used to be a client of mine, he's a production podcast student. He brought up a thing about podcasting. I'm actually quite curious to run by you. How do you feel about, with podcasts especially, you seem like a more positive guy. It feels like there's this weird thing within podcasts of just hating the audience, like a derision for them. Is there? Yeah. Okay, so maybe not. No, I mean, I am not a very good podcast consumer. And as I already mentioned, I listen to Howard Stern and that takes up a lot of my podcast.

54:02And that's since the early 90s. Right, right. I've been listening to Howard Stern. So it's my ongoing soap opera comedy show, peeping Tom, voyeuristic, look at all these weirdos. So it takes up a lot of my time. And so I don't listen to a lot of podcasts. And again, I think that's kind of like I'm kind of older and I just – I will listen to some. Like there's some that I do listen to occasionally and enjoy. But it's usually like I just recently was listening to Jamie Loftus is doing something called The 16th Minute. We're on Cool Zone Media. Oh, is she on this? She's a co-worker. Oh, wow. Oh, cool.

54:52Yeah. And, you know, because it was just, well, she's really great. Yes. You know, and she's an incredibly talented person. And it is really interesting. Like, it's an interesting topic. Yeah. And almost all of them are of interest to me. Whereas there's lots of other podcasts where it's like, oh, that's, you know, sort of like the old Hollywood kind of ones. There will be one that I'm like, that is fascinating. And then another one that like, I don't give a shit about that one, you know. So it's, you know. And that does actually lead somewhere far more interesting than my original question, which is it feels like the format of podcasts has kind of – it's actually growing into something far more interesting because 16th Minute started a few months after Better Offline, I think.

55:34And what Jamie does for the listeners who haven't heard, and I assume you have because she's advertised on here and so on and so forth, is Jamie will find like an internet celebrity of the day like a dress or – Like Ken Bone. Yes. She got Ken Bone on the show. Yeah. And then she'll do kind of like Better Offline Listeners, when I get extremely pissed off at OpenAI, imagine if that was about something that mattered. Oh, it was fun, neither of which. And it's interesting watching this format because it's changed comedy in the sense that now Instagram is basically you have to constantly hit them with the highlight reels.

56:07With podcasts, it's people feel trapped in these different formats that really do them at disadvantage. Because Jamie does great things in her show. Molly Conger as well with Weird Little Guys. Cool Zone has got this cool format of kind of just talking through a script and a story with a guest, sometimes not with a guest. But I almost feel like podcasting could return to something like Howard Stern. I think like having you in studio is so much better. Oh, yeah. As a pro remote work guy, I feel bad saying this. It almost feels like we do need to get back to perhaps not exactly what Howard Stern does.

56:40Perhaps not exactly. But getting back to what made broadcast actually good, which is narrative style shows or in studio fucking actual conversations that are well produced. Yeah. That have guests that know and like each other. Yeah. And actually are ready to do an interesting show. It's the only reason Howard Stern's. He's actually a good broadcaster, however you feel about him. Oh, no. Well, there's no question. Yeah. I mean, the proof is in the fact that he's still here somehow. He is still the biggest broadcaster there is, really. The more things change, the more they stay the same. How are you finding podcasting, though?

57:17How is it different to what you've been used to? Well, for me, it's... And I don't mean to be whiny about my career. I'm not acting enough. How do you mean? There's just not a lot of work out there. Oh, right. You know, and when the Conan show went off the air, you know, there's things here and there, but there's just not enough stuff. There's not enough work. And especially, and again, I'm not like, I'm not complaining about like the state of woke Hollywood. I'm a 58-year-old white man in comedy. Yeah, there's a few of them. Yeah, there's a few of us, you know. So it's like you just – I don't doubt that I am going to be working for the rest of – until I want to stop basically.

58:11And I do believe that like – I always believe that somebody hires me. That's a good thing. Yes. I mean for them. For them, yeah. For them. No, I mean I will give them value for whatever they're paying. Right. um and but i started doing podcasting sort of cuz you know like just cuz and have material out there or what just you know conan well honestly uh the way that it happened i had had people uh on my team um which i love saying uh because my team yeah we're it's quite a team we haven't met in years but they still exist I guess but I've had people say you should do a podcast you should do a podcast and there is something to it because I am when I think about you know the fact I am in comedy that's my main thing and one of the ways that I am funny is in conversation and that's hard to you kind of saw it on Conan but in just like sort of little pieces But like in a longer conversation, I can be funny, you know, and I, you know, know how to keep a conversation going.

59:30So they were telling me, you should do a podcast. And I felt just sheepish about it because I have friends like Scott Aukerman who does Comedy Bang Bang and Jimmy Pardo who does Never Not Funny. And those guys are real. Like I did their podcast and I was like, what is a podcast? When I was doing their podcast, they were, you know, very early. pioneers of whatever this thing is so i felt like i would just be like the dilettante-ish fucking you know tv boy coming in with it you know sort of fancy tv yeah like built like i can do it too kind of thing um so i just was kind of embarrassed to do it but then you know it was the first white boy to be embarrassed by podcasting but i just thought there was a certain point where I thought, you know what?

1:00:19It would be good. And also, too, it was like a point in my life when I just was trying to try. I just I had a big moment where I was like, I need to say yes to things. I need to try things. And and so I thought, yeah, let's do a podcast. And I came up with the concept for my the three questions podcast. And and I started to do it. And I listened to it and sort of corrected and studied myself and thought about the things that I didn't like that I was doing and the things that I did like that I was doing. And eventually over the six years I've been doing it, I got better at it. And now I feel very confident in my ability to do an hour-long interview that is very much listenable, funny, interesting, thought-provoking sometimes even, and very much worth people's time.

1:01:24And it's not always comedy. It's not always comedy. Yeah, it's not always comedy. and there's part of me and this is just because my old TV brain there's part of me that's like wow I've gotten good at this one thing I'm not going to be Charlie Rose what the fuck is it like you know like I know how to interview people well so what well no I know but I mean but it's like you know I know how to interview people but it's at the same time like literally thousands of other people have learned how to interview people and I mean I'm not and I'm it's just like it's not, and I don't mean to, I enjoy it, it's a fun thing, but if I got busy acting, I would put podcasting aside.

1:02:10And that's just the way it is. And that's just my preferences. That makes sense, and it's interesting though, because it's like you moved into this little broadcast career because there was space, and it's what the internet is about you to do. And I'm doing a radio show now. Yeah, actually I was going to ask, the radio show do you go into studio every time i do i do and and it was originally sort of like the conception was and also because doing something live in the serious studios is it like technically it's a much more complicated thing than just going in and recording something um so when we when we first came well they came to me and they were like we want to do more we want the Conan channel to have some actual sort of radio content.

1:02:56Right. Rather than just be old clips of the show and podcasts. And radio content being like interviews and stuff. Like a call-in show. They said, do you want to do a call-in show? And I was like, fuck yeah, that sounds fun. That sounds like, you know, I get to play radio, you know? Sounds amazing. And then so they came to me and like, we want you to do something. And I was like, and they said, you know, like they were like, maybe more of the three questions. And I was like, I don't want to do more. You know, I do like. Yeah. Once a week is plenty of that podcast. Right. And but then they said call and show.

1:03:29I was like, oh, fuck. Yeah, absolutely. And I was like and I would just have it be silly topics that like, you know, cocktail party conversations, you know, like. Yeah. We just recently did like, you know, when's the last time you shit your pants kind of stuff and or dating disasters. Or medical nightmares and just, you know, meant to be sort of – and there's some people like, why do you focus on all these dark things? It's like, I don't – because that's how I'm made, you know? Yeah. Yeah, and it's like, what do I want to talk about? You know, like when's the last time you were inspired by someone's good deeds?

1:04:05Fuck that. I don't care about that. I want to hear you shit your pants. Or if it's like – fun – like happy fun stories can be fun. Yes, you can laugh about, you know. There's actually vanishingly few of them. I've been working on an article for my newsletter at the moment, which people are going to do really thrilling stuff about data sentence. You're going to love this, Andy. No, but one of the most magical experiences I'm going to tell is work. So one of my dear friends, Casey Kagawa, who I'm actually seeing tonight for drinks, I finally got to realize where he comes from because he will go down these rabbit's holes with me.

1:04:37Rabbit's holes? Jesus Christ. Rabbit holes. Rabbit holes. There we go. Rabbit's holes. And he will go down these rabbit holes, except he's like, you should email my mother. and his mother's in some sort of finance. So I've now got both his mother and him sending me links about the same thing. See, that's a kind of lovely, fun story that can be told. Yeah. However, the funniest stories are things like me moving the arm on my toenail and smacking myself right in the nutsack. Yeah, yeah. Going, ugh. See, that's funny. Or like, when you shit your pants. How'd you done that? Like 20 years ago? Anyway, less about that, the better.

1:05:09But it's something that strikes me of all this that's really funny is, despite all of the technology, despite the fact that everyone can podcast and broadcast all the same. What we are describing is basic broadcast fundamentals seem to actually be very fucking interesting. That's what people really come to. We want connection. We want to hear the absurdity of life. As the radio died, all of what the radio was filled with just came over here. Yeah. People talking about stuff, learning about, you know, you being a listener, learning about stuff, you laughing, you know, You crying, you hearing creepy stuff, gossipy stuff.

1:05:48It was just the radio. And now it's the radio over here. And it's – the one thing I think about it, it's the same thing with streaming. TV, network TV is – I mean who fucking watches network television? I watched some of it the other day. It's astounding sometimes. I think Blue Bloods is on every channel now. It's just there. Except it's really fictional because the police appear to solve crimes in it. There's all kinds of cop shit. There's so many cop shows. Network TV shit. It's just like cop worship. And they solve crimes in it. It's like grown-up Paw Patrol. But TV moved to streaming. And somebody pointed out because streamings aren't – these companies pour a ton of money into streaming and then they go, okay now how do we get that money back out and they all go i don't know i didn't think of that more subscribers yeah there's a bazillion people on here so they don't know how to get the money back out so they start talking about advertising right so we're just like okay we're just back to television then but like somebody i don't even remember who i should have remembered who because it was an excellent point we've gone back to the broadcast model advertising paying for it except all the worker protections have been blown up.

1:07:11And all of the money. Yes. All of the money is going to like very small places. You know? Yeah. And it's the same with podcasting. Yes. Radio died. You've got podcasting. And podcasting is surviving on advertising dollars. Don't I fucking know if the emails are going, oh, did anyone? By the way, you're one of the listeners who emailed me about the AI ads that run after the app. I know. 150 of you email me every extent. Did you hear the AI ad? I know. You are not the first person to tell me. Right, right. I'm now going to get 30 emails being like, hey, did you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like that they think that you're so, like, royal that you don't even know who's advertising on your show.

1:07:54And even if I didn't know, I would know now because I also get a fair amount of very nice emails, so I can't complain. But you do. Yes. It's very evident that you do. But it's, I think what it is is like what you're saying with podcasting, it's the advertising has to drive it. I know people who have started podcasting like, shit, I can't make this work because like, where do I get the money from? I've read the pledges and it's like, what a surprise. There's not actually that many people will pay for stuff. Right. And I think that that's one of the bigger problems in media right now. There are things that people will pay for.

1:08:27There's four media in tech. There's Defector in sports. Like there's some really great publications out there. and Flaming Hydra as well another great one but at scale it doesn't exist I don't think it exists for podcasts like you have like 30 podcasts that can make money on the reader thing yeah and it's just for it's frustrating and also I don't know if it's fixable I don't know if there's a way of making the patron model work even though it's the one that's the most honest I have no input on those things i have that is so oh me neither beyond me and i don't i'm terrible with business and stuff i mean i understand making things entertaining right and i and that's that's it for me and that's whenever i've been approached about a television show and they're like we wish more young women would watch i'd be like well i don't know i mean i guess i mean one of my shows That was an actual note.

1:09:23And it just seemed to come out the other end of just like lots of scenes of the characters telling each other how much they liked each other. Which I just at a certain point. At a certain point I was like, is that it? And it just seemed like. What the woman do? Just throwing shit against the wall and hoping it sticks. Woman have emotions? Yeah. No, when we did the. Because a lot of what we're talking about is just kind of broadcast fundamentals at some point. and so we did a long 13 and a half hours in five days at CES big consumer it's called the consumer electronic show yeah I know a big thing we got I did a remote there oh if you're ever in you'll join us for one yeah no please um but the big thing I did was we talked about loving everyone like the fact that we had friendship and all this thing we got so many emails being like it's so nice to hear people saying they like each other oh absolutely yeah and you have to wonder if some of these shows the big problem is they're like how do we get young women to listen to listen to this have you tried fucking asking one have you tried asking a woman you're like no no no no you can't do that yeah we have to focus group it and there'll be a bird in there i think it's just it's and then even with podcasts that don't do well and they're like why is this not doing well does it suck yeah is it boring because the other side of it is there are a ton of podcasts that don't bother to try they just they saw that i don't know a chapa trap house or something like oh there's just a bunch of guys talking but when you get down to the core of it it's like It's actually people who like each other and enjoy being around this chemistry.

1:10:49Yes, yes. And they're good talkers. Yes. Yeah, yeah. They do good talking and words and such. Well, Andy, it's been such a pleasure having you. Oh, thank you. Thank you. It's been really a fun and interesting conversation. So where can people find you? My podcast, The Three Questions, which is available at your podcast store. I will put the links in there as well. And in the same feed, you will get replays of my call-in show, which is on SiriusXM, Wednesdays, 1 p.m. Pacific. What would that be? 4 p.m. Eastern. Usually live, sometimes to tape, but lately it's just been live because we've been able to and I've been getting – I have a guest host, usually somebody really funny.

1:11:35Cool. And it's somebody that I want to be there. That's the nice thing about my show, too, is there's never somebody that's just like, you got to talk to this person. So it's one of the most fun hours of my week, which I have always felt that if you have fun, your viewer or listener will have fun, if you genuinely have fun. So that's on SiriusXM channel 104, which is the Conan channel. And I love I and I mean, honestly, I am an early adopter of satellite radio and I love satellite radio. I have it in my car. I listen to it on my phone and not just because of Howard, but it's like it's great. There's very, very sort of niche specific music channels.

1:12:25And that's totally up my alley. Hell yeah. Yeah. Well, I've had a lovely time and you're going to get this thing after this where it's a recording that I recorded at the beginning of the show. and I lacked my swagger and boldness. I will then promise that I'm going to re-record this. Matt Ossowski, my producer, will hear this and he'll say, oh, Ed's going to do it this time. I probably won't. Nevertheless, I love you all for listening. Thank you so much.

1:12:55Thank you for listening to Better Offline. The editor and composer of the Better Offline theme song is Matt Ossowski. You can check out more of his music and audio projects at matasowski.com, M-A-T-T-O-S-O-W-S-K-I.com. You can email me at ez at betteroffline.com or visit betteroffline.com to find more podcast links and, of course, my newsletter. I also really recommend you go to chat.wheresyoured.at to visit the Discord and go to r slash betteroffline to check out our Reddit. Thank you so much for listening. Better Offline is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1:13:55We'll see you next time.

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