How The Top 1% Actually Invest (Not What You Think)

19:27Tad Fallows:And so, you know, still very happy to hire him. I think when you get outside of that and into, you know, really the entrepreneurial world, nobody cares at all where you went to school, right? It's how good is your product? How charismatic are you in the sales process? How good are you at spotting talent to hire on your team? Also, I mean, I'd love to hear what you guys think. My perspective is this matters a lot for your first job. I think it matters much less if 10 years on, you're trying to say, hey, should I hire this guy? Whether he got a great score on his SAT, whether he went to, you know, a great prep school undergrad, that sort of, or, and then a great undergrad, I think that is a lot less relevant.

19:58Tad Fallows:You're going to look at what's he done in his last five or 10 years working at GE or working at Facebook or whatever it is. I think that's really how people hire. So it might help get you on that right path, but I certainly, you know, won't keep you there forever if you're not performing. Well, the reason we're so fascinated and enjoyed this conversation and your answers and truly interested, we don't know the, the, these items here. We've, we've studied data sets at large, But our podcast, Figure Pockets Money, doesn't really talk about or to or for people in the top 1 % of wealth, well past$10 million in personal net worth, well past$500 to$1 million in annual income in any given year.

20:35I mean, maybe some of our members will have a year like that sprinkled in every once in a while when they sell a business or something like that. But that'll be rare. That'll be a lifetime event for them. And so that's where I think we don't talk to a lot of people that are in this level of wealth and how they get there. And so that's where I think we're more asking these questions and more interested. On that note, one last question in these buckets. How important is the concept of carried interest in this group of non-entrepreneurs in terms of their creating large amounts of wealth and joining the community?

21:08Tad Fallows:I mean, I guess it depends what you mean by carried interest. If you're looking specifically at the investing terminology there, where a typical private equity fund might say, we've got a two and 20 model. So two means, okay, if you put in a hundred dollars, I collect a$2 management fee from you each year. And then the 20 is I get 20 % of the profits. And so that 20 % is the carried interest there. That really is only going to apply to people who work in private equity, in venture capital, in a hedge fund, in something where they are the general partner there. That certainly, at least in our community, is a very small fraction.

21:40Tad Fallows:I'm not saying those people don't exist, but that is 5%, 10 % of the path to wealth. So in specific, if that's where you're working, that's just kind of, okay, that's how you make your big upside. You may pay the bills on your 2%. And then the way that you hit a home run is you get a 10x in your portfolio and you're collecting 20 % of that upside. But if you think about carried interest more generally is, hey, how much is equity the path to root? So how much of it is just coming from I'm making a salary of whatever it is,$50 ,000,$100 ,000,$200 ,000 a year versus how much is I am creating value in some other way and getting to share in that equity value.

22:14Tad Fallows:There's sort of a selection bias of our community where it tends to be first-generation wealth creators, often on the younger side, so in their 30s, 40s, 50s. To get a really significant outcome there, it's almost impossible to get that on a salary basis. Now, okay, maybe you're a professional athlete. We've got some of them. Yes, you can make$10 million a year. You'll get a lot of money after a few years of that salary. Or maybe if you're some special kind of retinal surgeon doctor, you're making millions of dollars a year. But in general, there's not a lot of jobs out there, W2 income, where they're going to pay you a base salary in the seven figures.

22:47Tad Fallows:It's great for those that exist, but that is not common. It is much more common that to get really millions of dollars of outcome, it is some form of equity. Again, it could be working at a job where my example of NVIDIA, if you went to work at NVIDIA and you got options worth 100 ,000, and then the stock went up 100 fold. Now your options are worth$10 million. But that is really, you're an employee, but that is equity exposure. That's what your options were. Similarly, if you're an entrepreneur, most of them are taking outside venture capital. So you're getting equity exposure, and you're having some leverage of other people's same thing, real estate, as you guys know.

23:21Tad Fallows:So I'd say carried interest, if you really mean I'm driving equity value from the work that I'm doing, that certainly represents the significant majority of it, because there's just not that have any salaries that are that high. All right, this is our final ad break. We've got more than 1 % of the show left after this. I'm skeptical of a lot of financial products, but life insurance isn't one of them, at least not term life. For the vast majority of you listening, term life is simply the right answer. And the smartest way to buy it isn't one big policy, it's a ladder. Your need for coverage isn't flat.

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25:20All right. Thanks for sticking with us.

25:22Mindy Jensen:My story is a lot like the first one that Tad mentioned, investing strategic but bigger bets in the publicly traded markets, specifically the tech stocks starting in the late 90s. And I think with our audience, we're going to start seeing people who are – their net worth is growing such that this is going to be something that they have no experience with. You know, people are always coming through Longmont and I'm talking to them. I'm super nosy. So I'm asking them about their money situation. And, you know, I always give the caveat that they don't have to tell me if they don't want to. But we talk a lot about money and I'm noticing a lot of people with the three, four or five million dollar net worths in the FIRE community simply because we've had this growth in the stock market since what, 2012, 2013?

26:11Tad Fallows:You know what I'd say, Mindy, though, is this doesn't just have to be tech stocks. I think one can look at today and say, well, I didn't study CS undergrad, and I didn't go to Carnegie Mellon, and I wasn't early in Facebook, and so I've missed that train. And while they say history doesn't repeat itself, but it rhymes, I would say it's that same thing in public equities. That has been what's delivered really outside returns for the last one or two decades. But if you look back over the last 50 or 100 years, it wasn't always tech stocks. And if I had to place a bet, it's not always going to be tech stocks.

26:44Tad Fallows:You know, if you look at you probably know this, but the number one returning stock of all time, if you'd owned this for the past 100, 120 years, Philip Morris is up something like 200 million percent. And, you know, the number two is, I think, Vulcan Materials, which is like a paving and aggregates company. So it's not all, you know, Google and NVIDIA. And even if you look more recently, you know, if you looked at the the stocks that delivered exceptional returns in the 70s and 80s, Walmart, you know, and you think, okay, well, that's not a tech stock at all. It's, you know, running these stores, it's from rural Arkansas, etc.

27:17Tad Fallows:So I think the point is more finding exceptional companies that are exceptionally well run. And I just wouldn't want people to feel like, okay, this was a one time thing, or this is a one industry phenomenon, it has been tech, it could well be something else, you know, next on, for example, remember, when Russia first invade Ukraine, I certainly don't want to look at that primarily as a financial thing. But I have this bad habit of having a good idea, but not being willing to overpay on it and end up missing it. So I said, Okay, you know, it looks interesting here. I bet those German defense stocks are going to do well, because somebody is going to have to, you know, pay the bills to and produce the munitions to help defend against the Russians.

27:53Tad Fallows:This company called Rheinmetall, which is sort of the Lockheed and Barton of Germany, that stock is up tenfold in the last five years since Russia invaded Ukraine, all you had to do is look and say, what's the biggest German defense stock and kind of think a little bit of where this might go. Again, I saw I was up 20%. So I waited for the pullback that never came and missed out on that 10 bagger there. But I think the point is these things can continue to happen. And it doesn't have to be part of some one off bull run. There can be these little, I think Jim Cramer, who I enjoy more than most says, there's always a bull market somewhere.

28:22Tad Fallows:So I think that really is true. Let me ask you about a mentality item here, because I think Mindy's spot on. We have plenty of people in the bigger pockets community who have gotten to that three, five, maybe even seven or 10, maybe even approaching 10 million. We've met a few people worth well more than that. Typically, when we find folks who come through the W-2 earner path who make that much money, it's because they were at a FANG or they invested in a FANG very early on and really saw that carry through. But there have been exceptions even to that. In this world of very high net worth individuals who got there fairly early in life, typically self-made to some degree, you're talking a lot about stocks.

29:00Here's an idea for this concept, and I'm putting a lot of money into that. Is this a common theme? Are folks really spending a tremendous amount of time looking for that next high leveraged investment position? And if so, are they doing this with major portions of their net worth? Or is there a very defensive core portfolio and small allocations with a lot of brainpower dedicated to these types of investments?

29:23Tad Fallows:Yeah, that's a fantastic question. And I want to make sure I'm not giving the wrong impression. I think partly the reason I'm talking about these, hey, big bet on Tesla or big bet on Nvidia, something like that, is that is how you could make a 100x return and with a lot of money there. But that is not the typical portfolio. We actually do once a year, we do this asset allocation survey where we ask all of our members across 60 or 100 categories, hey, how's your money invested here? And I'd say a few interesting things there. It is first very heavily in stocks, certainly not entirely in stocks.

29:55Tad Fallows:There's a lot more in the private market assets among our community than there is in the general population. So things like private equity, but stocks being the biggest component of it. But actually, most people are not heavy stock pickers. Overwhelmingly, people are believers in index funds. So an S &P index fund, a total world index fund, etc. That's probably going to represent 50 % to 60 % of the typical portfolio is going to be an index fund. And as you know, as of today, that is probably more technology heavy than I'd be comfortable with. You've got 30 % or 40 % of that coming from your top tech companies.

30:29Tad Fallows:But also one other interesting thing there, which you might not expect is the significant majority, 60 % to 70 % of members totally self-manage their portfolio. I think there is this sort of narrative probably coming from the wealth management industry that if you get over a million dollars or over$10 million, it's just not responsible to manage your own portfolio anymore. You need professional help. And one thing I can say definitively is that is definitively not true. Most people with more than$10 million, at least in our community, are managing their own portfolio. And largely, they're doing the math.

30:59Tad Fallows:And they're saying, okay, you can call it 1%. 1 % of$10 million is$100 ,000. And that's not tax deductible. So that's$100 ,000 after tax. That's the same as earning almost$200 ,000 if you're in a high tax bracket. So they say, well, that is well worth my time to do. And also, I can be responsible. I can do the research. I can figure this out. So maybe an interesting aside. And then outside of public equities, probably the thing that is most different from conventional 60-40 portfolio sort of advice is going very light on the bond and other credit type instrument sides. So I would say bonds represent probably 5 % of the total portfolio, because I think people look at and say, okay, with stocks, I don't know what the returns will be.

31:41Tad Fallows:That's the nature of equity. But historically, 8 % to 10%, if you look at the US market, maybe you say the US has been unusually good, but saying 5 % to 10 % is probably not crazy there. With bonds, I do know what it will be. It really can't exceed the interest rate, unless I'm talking about some distressed Argentine bond that might recover, but just conventionally buying a treasury that pays 4%. If I hold that to maturity, I'm just going to make 4%. And most people just saying, hey, that is not an attractive way to go. And so they're only holding a few percent there. Heavily in stocks, and then outside stocks, real estate equity, primarily in the form of their primary residence, and then a lot of private market investments, whether that is in private equity being the biggest one, crypto, venture capital, wide variety of other more esoteric private market things, be happy to talk about.

32:25Mindy Jensen:What I heard you say a moment ago when you were talking about those German defense stocks is that there's always opportunities out there, but you have to be willing to take the bet. You have to be really willing to, you know, take that risk on. And, you know, you're thinking outside of the box. I didn't look at the start of that war and say, oh, let me take into account where German defense stocks are going. I looked at it and said, I hope this ends quickly. It's a different thought process. On the other hand, I have taken outsized bets on technology stocks because that's what my husband knows.

33:03Mindy Jensen:And he will bring up, what do you think of this stock? What do you think of this stock? However, my Chipotle stock is returning great. I think it's a 400 % over the last five years or something like that.

33:17Tad Fallows:The key thing you're saying there, and I think this is equally true in public stocks and also private things like real estate or private companies, is making a bet in something you actually know about. And I do think that's a big part of the reason that if you look at a lot of people who've made a lot of money, it may be in real estate or in company they started because they were heavily concentrated there. So if you look at the richest people in the world, Elon Musk, super concentrated in Tesla and SpaceX, or Mark Zuckerberg, super concentrated in Meta, same thing, Larry Ellison, super concentrated in Oracle, part of that is, okay, they picked a great tech stock, but a lot of that is just their concentration.

33:49Tad Fallows:And so I think that's the reason you've got people who can make millions, tens, or hundreds of millions in real estate, is effectively, they're taking a very high conviction bet where if I'm buying a single family house, nobody just reads a 10K, thinks about for an hour chats with their spouse and says, okay, I'm going to buy this house here. They're really doing deep diligence. They're looking at the comps. They're building a model about what might the rental returns on this property be. They're trying to think about, okay, what's the property tax structure here? Is it California with Prop 13 treatment?

34:19Tad Fallows:When was the roof put on? People generally don't do that level of research on public stocks. They're just kind of, hey, I like the look of it. I'm going to put some money there. And then they're making smaller bets. But I think something like real estate, it kind of forces you to make a more concentrated bet. And And it forces you, therefore, to think about more deeply. And same thing, if you're going to start a company, you're not just going to think about it for an hour one evening, talk with your spouse and decide to start a company. You're really going to do research. You're going to talk with potential customers.

34:43Tad Fallows:You're going to figure out who you want to hire for it. You're going to have to justify it to investors, etc. So I think a lot of the reason that you see wealth outside of the public markets is because it does force those big conviction bets. And again, that's certainly been true for myself. Most of the money from starting a company, because that was all I did for 10 years was just building this one company here, but that could apply to crypto, could apply to almost any asset class. If you're willing to do that much research, you'll probably never understand Apple better than your average analyst because there's so many smart people trying to understand Apple.

35:14Tad Fallows:But if you get to things smaller than that, like you spend a few million dollars to buy a piece of real estate, you're not competing with some hedge fund in Connecticut where they've got all these PhDs and warehouses full of servers, writing algorithms, trying to understand what's the proper price for that house. Or even if you look at microcap stocks, what's interesting is that I've got some friends who've done very well running hedge funds for microcaps. And they say part of the issue is there's a stock that has a$40 million float, they just cannot invest enough money in it to make it worth their while to do the research there.

35:43Tad Fallows:So if you as an individual, for us,$100 ,000 is a very big investment and the market can easily absorb it. But if you're running a billion dollar fund, at most you can put a couple million dollars to work in this thing, It's just not worth your time to do. So I think if you get outside of really the large public companies, that's a place where putting in the sweat equity of really trying to understand what the good investment is. Or if you look at private markets, something like private equity, really doing the research, okay, how do I build the right relationships or how to get access to the fund?

36:10Tad Fallows:I'm really interested in there. You can kind of see the returns for that effort. We've talked about a lot of things around the investment approaches of this. I'm going to the top 1%, maybe even a little bit higher than that on average in this community, the average of the 1%. And it sounds to me like the theme is almost all of these folks got there through entrepreneurship or some form of carried interest, likely relating to technology or finance. And once they're there, they almost all go to a more defensive, diversified approach with the index as a major part of the portfolio. And that's a theme.

36:43That's not a rule, but it's a theme that I've heard you observe today. Is that correct? Is that the way we're going to take away from this?

36:48Tad Fallows:I think everything says, right. It's funny, though, to hear you say it that way, because I wouldn't have thought of this as defensive. Because I think if I compare it to if you go to a typical financial advisor, and I know I had this exact conversation with Goldman after I'd sold my business, said, okay, you know, that's how much money I have. And they said, okay, great. Here's what we can do for you. We can get you half of the market return for a quarter of the risk. And I was saying, well, I'm in my 30s. Like, why does that make any sense? How about you give me four times the return for twice the volatility.

37:17Tad Fallows:And, you know, they looked at me like I had two heads. I looked at them like, why would anybody ever want this? So clearly, we didn't have the same objectives and I didn't hire them. But I do think, you know, there's a spectrum of defensiveness. I think you could say, hey, I, you know, made all my money in a t-shirt printing company. I don't want all my money in perpetuity in one t-shirt printing company. But I think the flip side is what, you know, conventional wisdom would say with these or conventional financial management advice with these Monte Carlo simulations, etc., is to have a portfolio that is not optimized for maximum long-term expected return.

37:49Tad Fallows:It's optimized for sharp ratio, which is expected return divided by volatility. And so I would say a lot of our members are less concerned with the volatility. They might say, hey, if there's a crash tomorrow, there's another COVID and general markets fall 50%, they're willing to accept that 50 % drop to be in asset classes that have the maximum long-term expected returns. So it is diversified, but it's not... Peter Lynch, the famous guy from Fidelity, called it de-worsification of buying stuff that is no longer your best three or four or five ideas. So they don't really de-worsify into things, as I said, like bonds that are reduced volatility, but are almost guaranteed to drag down returns.

38:29Tad Fallows:They diversify among things that all have high expected returns. And so again, some of the stuff I've mentioned, public stocks, private equity, crypto, venture capital, real estate with appropriate leverage, if you want credit, maybe private credit, all these things have, you know, somewhere from call it eight to 20 % expected returns. And you're not able to get probably as much dampening of your volatility, as if you just went into cash, or if you went into bonds, but you get some reduction of your volatility, because you're finding things that are less correlated, but you're not sacrificing your long-term returns.

39:01Tad Fallows:And not all can't make generalization about everything, but most of our members say, hey, I'm willing to accept continued volatility because maybe if I got 10 million now, I'm still earning money. I'll be fine if that goes down to five in the interim, if I know that 20 years from now, it's going to double to 20, as opposed to a very linear path from 10 to 15. It makes perfect sense, right? Why would someone who got very wealthy in their 30s, 40s, or 50s have a high concentration in bonds in 2025 when the yield curve is inverted and they're likely still in a high income tax bracket and likely don't have access to large amounts of taxable retirement funds.

39:35You're just not going to put your money into a 4 % safe yielding bond fund that's going to then, you're going to get taxed at 30 or 40 % for most of these people. It would be ridiculous, right? It's a form of insurance. So surely an alternative to that in your community will be cash. Do these folks have larger cash positions than you might

39:53Tad Fallows:otherwise expect? No, probably smaller than you expect. It's interesting. Their investments are high on the risk end of the risk curve. So low on cash, much more equity-like exposure. But I think what they do do to mitigate that risk is they're also very low on the amount of leverage that they're taking on and debt, where your typical member, for every$100 of net worth they have, they only have about$10 of debt. And that's typically just a 30-year fixed on their primary residents. So what they're not doing is saying, with the exception of maybe that's how they made their money, as I said, taking out the mortgage to buy Tesla.

40:27Tad Fallows:But the typical thing is saying, hey, I'm going to put into stocks, but I'm not going to take out big portfolio loans to be 150 % long. I'm just going to buy straight up stocks there. They don't carry much debt. And then flip side is don't carry much cash. And I think you could make arguments of, hey, you want to have a cash. And when I say not much, if you're carrying 5 % cash, but you're worth$20 million, dollars, well, then you have a million dollars of cash. So it's a large and absolute number, but not large in a percentage number. You do then probably miss out on some of the opportunities to opportunistically say, okay, if there is something that I think is a flash crash, like a COVID, now I can't, quote, go all in on buying stocks there because I was already all in.

41:04Tad Fallows:But I think people look at and say, private equity, venture, any of these things, on average, they go up over time. So rather than trying to time the market, it. They just try and be invested in the market or the markets, plural, these multiple markets that are expected to go up. Tad, this has been really fascinating to get a glimpse into the practicalities of at least one group of very high net worth individuals, how they got there, what they're doing differently now. Obviously, I have some assumptions. You challenged and changed some of those assumptions today. And I learned a lot and I really appreciate it.

41:33So thank you very much. Where can people find out more about you and Long Angle?

41:36Tad Fallows:Well, really appreciate you having me here. It's a very fun conversation. If anybody wants to learn more about Long Angle, they can go to our website, longangle.com. I should mention it's a totally free community. We don't charge any membership fees. So anybody who thinks this sounds interesting to them, I would love for them to check it out and then apply there online. And that would put you in an interview with a current member where they could tell you more about it and see if it seems like a fit. I also am pretty active on LinkedIn. So Tad Fallows, if you want to follow me or connect with me there, it's a real pleasure to speak with you here today.

42:05Well, thank you for all you're doing for the community here. and congratulations on a wildly successful career. Can't wait to see what happens next for you.

42:12Mindy Jensen:Thank you, Tad. And we will talk to you soon. Thanks, Scott.

42:15Tad Fallows:Thanks, Mindy.

42:15Mindy Jensen:Okay, Scott, that was Tad Fallows, founder of Long Angle. And that was a lot of fun. I really enjoyed that conversation, especially right at the end. What did you think of our chat? I thought it was great. I had a number of biases and assumptions about the top 1 % based on our time doing BiggerPocketsMoney that I think were to the large part validated with a couple of really fun surprises that are going to change my worldview and evolve it around there. And I think some of the things that were confirmatory for me were things around, hey, there's a large number of ways that we can get into the top 1 % here in America.

42:51It's not exclusively private schools or these kind of elite careers or whatever, although there is a bias towards entrepreneurship and opportunities that allow you to get access to equity as a form of compensation to some degree. I was expecting a very concentrated bet to get somebody into that top 1%. And I was expecting a shift in mindset to a more defensive strategy for folks that are in the top 1 % to begin, you know, defending, keeping that wealth, right? There's a getting rich and staying rich. And I imagine that, you know, all these folks had to take some kind of risk or have some kind of really outsized economic outcome concentrated in one area to get there.

43:32What I think is interesting is, and I want to dive into this in the future, is how are folks applying to that concept of staying rich in this community? I imagine that my question around bonds and cash was not a satisfying answer to many people in that community. And they're trying to get that safety somewhere else, right? Unlevered real estate, perhaps. Those are questions that I want to dive into more with this community. And it's surprising to me that a larger percentage of that population is not more kind of safely invested, for lack of a better word, in a way that I could instantly probe at.

44:07Mindy Jensen:Scott, you said the word risk multiple times during this conversation, and so did I, and so did Tad. And I think that's the key there. The top 1 % have seen firsthand that risk equals reward. So they're willing, because they have the experience with risk working out, they're willing to take calculated risks. Absolutely. And so that's the piece that I think I need to continue to wrap my head around is 50 % to 60 % allocation to stocks makes perfect sense, right? Very consistent with a lot of things that we talked about in a retiree or a financially independent portfolio. What is that other 40 %?

44:46What are the rules that people apply to that? How do they think through it? That's what I'm really interested to learn from more people that are at that level of net worth over time.

44:56Mindy Jensen:Well, I think that there's a lot in private equity, private opportunities that may not be available to somebody with a lower net worth or just aren't available to people who aren't willing to take those risks. I'm not surprised to hear that a lot of that wealth is in index funds and that most of these portfolios are actively managed or at least self-managed by the investors. That makes perfect sense to me. And I think you're going to see very small percentages of elite wealth in America giving that money to other professional managers to manage as a portfolio outside of specific small allocations, at least in each individual instance, to private equity funds or targeted bets that they're making in a specific category.

45:38Mindy Jensen:So Scott, I was surprised that people of this net worth are not giving their portfolio over to a professional manager. There's the idea work on your business and, you know, make the use your time where it has the most return and you're only returning, you know,$100 ,000 on 10 million. So you could just hire that out. So I was I was actually surprised that that that isn't being hired out. On the flip side, Carl and I manage our portfolio 100 % by ourselves. Do you manage your, not your real estate part, but your stock part? Do you manage that yourself? I manage all of my investments myself, other than a small percentage of my portfolio that I've handed off to syndication sponsors or funds in that regard.

46:24And that's for very targeted, specific theses in the real estate space.

46:27Mindy Jensen:And I don't know why I'm so surprised that other people just like me are not acting just like me. It's probably just who we associate with in the world of finance and the groups that we join or whatever. But I just rarely come across people who have their money actively managed with like a traditional financial advisor. Because I think that, you know, I guess the folks that we associate with are largely DIYers, largely, you know, big savers, big long term investors, those types of things. And the math is just so not compelling to hand it over to these active managers for folks of that mindset.

47:01So I think that was not surprising to me. I would have been much more surprised to hear that, hey, we've all got this manager over here who does this. That would have been news to me and caused me to change my worldview a little bit more.

47:13Mindy Jensen:I see what you're saying. All right, Scott, should we get out of here? Let's do it. That wraps up this episode of the BiggerPocketsMoney podcast. He is Scott Trench. I am Mindy Jensen saying we're on the run, skeleton. I think that filing my taxes is among my least favorite activities on earth. That's why we've partnered with a new tax planning firm here at BiggerPocketsMoney. They're a tech-forward, AI-integrated CPA firm that works with high-income business owners and professionals year-round, helping you find tax savings and plan ahead instead of just showing up when it's time to file. If your income is getting complicated, but not so complicated that you can justify$10 ,000 in accounting fees every year, our new partner in Gelt is worth a look.

47:51Go to biggerpocketsmoney.com slash FIPRO to learn more. That's biggerpocketsmoney.com slash F-I-P-R-O. The further you get along financially, the more you realize how rare it is to find people who are both at your level and asking the right questions. Dan and his son Adam noticed something unique about Long Angle. The people here all seem to be curious and interested in others. That's hard to find in people who are successful. I started for the financial angle, but the non-financial pieces, whether it's relationships, trips, family, wellness, that's brought me a lot of value. Long Angle is a vetted community of 8 ,000 or more entrepreneurs, executives, and investors who came for the financial conversations and stayed for everything else.

48:32Membership is free for those who qualify. Apply at longangle.com slash money. That's longangle.com slash money.