Teacher Retires Early at 45 Thanks to Strategic Living (FIRE in Paradise!)

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27:51Muteen. Adjective. Used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding, unconstrained. One who navigates life on their own terms, effortlessly. They do not always show up on time, but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions. They know the rules, but behave as if they do not exist. Mew Teen, the new fragrance by Mew Mew, defined by you. Thanks for sticking with us. Are you planning on moving to Australia? I know their real estate is super expensive. It is, and not anytime soon. You know, I mean, we're signing a 25-year lease because you cannot buy a property in Bali.

28:30It's always going to stay in the Balinese hand. So we're signing a 25-year lease on this fill in the rice paddies. But we do want to eventually, when we're much older, retire to Australia, when we're in our maybe in our 80s or I don't know when, but the healthcare is very good there. And so I think it's a good investment to get my permanent residency and my partner is Australian. So that's kind of part of our plan as well. I watched a Steve Irwin video recently where he discovers the top 10 most dangerous snakes. And luckily for him, all 10 of them are right here in Australia. That was terrible.

29:01But that's definitely a risk factor. I think it'll tell you about. A lot of dangerous animals, but at least they've got good healthcare. So if something happens, you know, you're covered. Going back to your portfolio and the design here. So you have a year of cash. You're de-risking your housing for the next 25 years with what sounds like a large upfront payment. And what, in terms of your annual spending, are you right at the 4 % rule or do you spend considerably less or more than that amount? I spend more like 3 % a year, roughly, I would say. Last year, I lost track of it. I mean, last year I had a horrible year.

29:40My father passed away. I would like, I've been very meticulous about, you know, checking my spending and tracking every day. But last year I completely lost track and I spent way more money than, than I normally would. But yeah, I would say on average, if you don't consider last year, probably more around the 3%, 3.5 % range. When you are in Bali and you're not having the other craziness you had to deal with last year, for example, what does Tuesday look like for you? Well, Tuesday, I wake up often and, you know, we have a beautiful place. We had lived in this villa in the rice paddies before, so I know exactly what that's going to look like when we move into it.

30:18We're renovating it as soon as we get it. But it's such a beautiful environment. So like just to sit on my balcony and have a cup of tea and look out at the cranes flying across the rice paddies, I'll often get on my scooter, go to, I love hot yoga. It feels so good. So even people say, you do hot yoga in Bali? But like, yes, I love you. It just feels so good to sweat it out. So I'll often go to hot yoga. There's so many events going on every single day. So I never get lonely because there's a lot of entrepreneurs who have moved there from Europe, from the US, Australia. So there's such a dynamic, inspiring group of people around me.

30:55I feel like it's the perfect place to fire in a lot of ways. It's a very nice lifestyle. and the quality of life I have and the quality of friends I have is so good. And then so mostly I'm doing something in the evening. I'm meeting with friends for dinner or, you know, there's I love to play games. There's a weekly like games activity I go to. So there's a lot to do. Amy, you mentioned some sabbaticals when you were still working. What led to you taking them? And what did you do during your sabbaticals? How long were they? So when I left Japan, I'd been working in Japan for four years. And I had, I think I had$20 ,000 saved.

31:32So this was 2005. And I spent mostly time in Southeast Asia and India, backpacking around. I mean, I was taking the second class sleeper train across India. I had the best time, you know, I was budget traveling, but like the memories I created were incredible. How much it opened my eyes to the world was phenomenal. I did also spend about a month in Europe during that time. So it was about eight months. And then I went back and started my grad program. And thankfully, because of the, you know, the$20 ,000, it went quite far because I was frugal. And then I was able to pay for part of my grad school with some money left over from that.

32:13And then I also got a job as a graduate student teacher. So I was able to that helped pay for part of my grad school as well. But so that was an eight, eight months traveling mostly, and then partially getting ready for grad school. And then my second sabbatical, I left India and I planned to take a year off. I was planning to go around Africa traveling. And I went to Bali for a personal growth course. And it really changed my life. I had been single in Asia for over 16 years. And that work helped me to heal a lot of my relationship with, you know, my father. I mentioned earlier, my father left when I was 12.

32:49And I really had a wound there, just not really trusting men. and I always kind of felt like I'm strong and independent. I can go anywhere in the world. I can travel, you know, second class labor, as I mentioned, like I'm a tough independent traveler, but I really, it was a way to keep myself guarded. And that personal growth course helped me to realize that like deeply, I was also lonely. And through that work, I was able to release a lot of that unhealed relationship with my father and build a trust for men again. And I called in a partner. I met my partner there. So I ended up staying two years in Bali.

33:25I never went to Africa and traveled around as I planned. And I realized what I wanted instead of being on the go, seeing new places all the time, checking things off my list. That wasn't appealing to me anymore. So you asked about travel earlier, Scott. It's like, I'm happiest when I'm in Bali. I've got my routine. I've got my friends. I love having a sense of home. And I still do love travel, but I'm not as interested in being on the go all the time. So those two years, I was assisting that woman who was running retreats in Bali and just living my best life, really. That's how I feel about travel as well.

33:59I'm happiest at my home in the suburbs of Denver that backs right up to the mountains and I can go running on trails and biking around there. It's always like whenever I leave home, I'm like, I'm going somewhere that's how could it be quite like home on there? And I think it's just different. But for the for a lot of folks who do dream of that travel, for me, it's just different. Maybe maybe it'll change in 10 years and 20 years, 20 years. And I'll be like, nope, that's not what I want anymore. But love that. Love that perspective on there about it. And it sounds like you also got plenty of travel in, like you just described earlier, earlier in life.

34:35Yeah. Every time I leave Bali, I think I don't want to go. You know, I mean, even though I'm coming, I'm excited to come home to see family or, you know, those kind of things. There's a part of me that's like, I'm really enjoying my life in Bali right now. I don't really want to go. So yeah, it's a good problem to have, really. Yeah, you live in paradise. Why would you want... People go there on purpose. Why would you want to leave there to go to other places that are like paradise light? We have hot yoga in Denver, too. I just have to go indoors for it. Yeah, all yoga in Bali is hot yoga. There's a lot of yoga in Bali.

35:06That's a good thing. It attracts people coming for mindfulness and yoga. And so it's a really healthy lifestyle there. It attracts a lot of healthy people. So it's not so much a drinking culture, unless you go to the southern beaches that are party places. But generally, it attracts really good people trying to optimize their life. You reached FI in 2019. Or no, you discovered FI in 2019. You've been retired for three years. And that kind of coincides with when you started putting on the FI Freedom Retreat in Bali. But you were FI. Like you won. Why are you starting to work again? Why? What made you want to put on the FI Freedom Retreat?

35:43I think I wanted a sense of purpose and community is so important to me. And I think, you know, when I was in Bangkok and I was really facing burnout in the pandemic, I was really feeling lonely for community. And I was hearing about all the great events in the US and thinking there's such a need for that in Asia. You know, there's nothing on that side of the world related to the FIER community. So I wanted, I knew how much living abroad had changed me and opened my eyes to see how other people live. And so I wanted an opportunity to build a FI event in that side of the world for people who lived on that side of the world to be able to easily come to.

36:20And then I also wanted an event that people from the US could come to and, you know, see what it's like to live in Asia and maybe open their eyes to possibility to seeing how good life can be. You know, it's not perfect. I don't want to oversell it. But from my perspective, like the quality of life I have there is incredible. So it was, you know, a desire for community, really a passion project more than anything. Awesome. Where can people find out more about that? Yeah, they should go to five freedom retreats dot com. So that's five freedom retreats with an S dot com. And the last so I usually put on one event per year.

36:56So I put I've got one event in early September 2025 that sold out when I launched it. in eight minutes. So I couldn't believe that there were a lot of people who said I was on the website ready to buy and I couldn't buy it. So I went ahead and opened up a second event this year, which is happening in late September, the 26th through the 30th. And that will launch on March 1st. But if listeners are interested in attending, I would recommend that they're on the website at the time that tickets launch so they can make sure they get a ticket. So definitely check out the website and note that time and calendarize it because they will go go fast I anticipate awesome is there hot yoga involved there's no hot yoga there is morning yoga there's a lot involved I'm I wouldn't subject everybody to that because it's it's my thing but it's not everybody's thing but there is an optional yoga session every morning before the retreat starts and I mean it's it's longer than most five events it's also smaller than most five events a lot of people come over early.

37:56So they're hiking the volcano, they're biking through the heartlands of Bali, you know, we go rafting afterwards, we go to an island afterwards, we go snorkeling, we get scooters, you know, you can take scooter lessons and get scooters and ride around the islands together. So the event is five days long. But in reality, we're spending more like two weeks together. And the relationships go so deep, because it's a smaller group, it's an international group. We get a lot of people from Australia, New Zealand, the UK, Canada. So it makes it really fun to meet people from different parts of the world in the FI community and doing all these fun adventures together.

38:33It's just naturally a bonding experience. And then I really want my event to honor Bali as well. So I show them like we go to unique things in Bali that you wouldn't necessarily see as a tourist. And this event sold out and would sell out otherwise here. So what I want to call out and observe here is, well, you'll talk to a lot of FI people and they'll have something like this. Twice a year, you put on an awesome event. Does that disqualify you from retirement by the early retirement police that are all over the internet talking about this? I believe no. You just really love that and you put it on a couple of times a year and you're compensated for it because it's a lot of work for it.

39:13But it's not really the end story. Many, if not most people who fire will, after a period of years, do something to that end, I believe, over time. And that's just a byproduct of the reality of being FI. Just an observation I wanted to make here, because I don't think you're not coming on here to promote an event that would otherwise not sell out for this. It's just, this is an actual piece of your FI story that is very common to a lot of people in this space. Yeah, it definitely gives me a lot of purpose. And, you know, a lot, part of my purpose is also just to benefit the Balinese people. So, um, you know, I know Mindy knows about this and you and Carl generously donated.

39:52Um, but you know, we were raising money for, you know, domestic violence shelter there in Bali. And I was just incredibly impressed with the FI community and just so honored. Um, I raffled off a free ticket last year or for the first event. And, you know, we raised$22 ,000 in two weeks for this domestic violence shelter, this woman, she's phenomenal. And I have her speak every year, like I always want to have a Balinese speaker there. But you know, when you hear her story of what she's been through in her life, and then how she's used that to help, and this makes me emotional, but how she's used that to help so many women and children escape domestic violence, it's so inspiring.

40:30So whatever I can do to bring people together, to create, you know, an incredible life changing transformational experience that people are going to remember for the rest of their lives. And then also to really honor and benefit the Balinese people and culture. You know, this is part of my purpose. I would get bored otherwise. You know, there's only so many hot yoga classes I could do. Well, this is why I get so passionate about what we do at Bigger Pockets Money is because, you know, folks like yourself that go on to become financially independent typically are creative, smart, disciplined, have a decades-long time horizon.

41:04And once retirement happens, there's an intent to live modestly, and well, and then the itch to somehow give back or create good in the world creates surprising, really positive societal benefits, like what you exactly what you just described there, which is so awesome. Like that's really the, you know, we dangle the Bali and the margarita on the beach thing out there as the carrot. That's like, it gets people motivated. They want to leave their job and do that. But really the reality is that as decades progress and people become five, they do, they tend to do much more of the things that you're talking about here on an overall basis.

41:40And it's just so wonderful to see that. So I love it and grateful for all you're doing in that part of the world. You said you had a really hard year last year for this. Can you tell me a little bit about how financial independence eased that or made it more tough? What was it like to go through that as someone who's fired? What would it have been like for someone who wasn't? Have you ever thought about that or have any thoughts in response to that question? Yeah. Well, just to give listeners a little bit of a context, you know, it was a lot of tough things that kind of piled up at once. So I mentioned that my father passed away and I was in the US a lot of time, you know, caregiving before he passed away and then dealing with his financial matters and his personal belongings and funeral and grieving and all of that.

42:25So I got back to Bali with two and a half months to plan a wedding. And I thought, well, I'm an event organizer. I can do that. And then my mom decided, you know, with my dad's death, she wanted to come, but she's 84 and chronically dizzy and, you know, rheumatoid arthritis. And that was going to be a really difficult journey for her. So I was already anxious about the wedding. And then her coming added a lot, you know, I was spending a lot of time trying to get her in business class, get her a mobility scooter and all of those things. And then I got dengue fever before the wedding. And I wasn't yet done planning the wedding.

42:55And then I think there were some things going on, you know, with hormones as well, because I'm perimenopausal. So there was just there was just a lot of things and I wasn't sleeping and I basically, you know, had high anxiety attack. So I had to cancel the wedding right before my mom flew. So, you know, during that, it was a really a dark night of the soul, really, really the most difficult year of my life. You know, fire, just knowing I didn't have to go into a job was huge. It was huge. And I'm so grateful to the to the five movement to being financially independent, you know, because it's helped me on two occasions, you know, when my when my father had a stroke, and when I was able to walk away from my job in Bangkok and say, you know, I've saved a lot these two years, but I want to go back and spend more time with family and have location and time freedom, you know, and then during this mental health crisis to not have to go in, I physically physically couldn't have gone into a job, you know, wasn't sleeping for prolonged periods of time.

43:54And I think part of the anxiety was also it's like I couldn't show up for my own wedding. And then I worried about, can I show up for my retreat? Because you know, that had sold out quickly last year. But I thought maybe I can't even show up for my retreat. So even after the wedding passed, I was still thinking like, when is this going to end? You know, because it was hard for me to know in that dark place, if I would ever come out of it. And I've never been in a place that, that low where I wasn't able to actually function in a lot of ways. So it was really challenging. So I think having that financial security, you know, I was doing a little bit of tutoring online before and I had to let that go.

44:31But just knowing that I didn't have to worry about paying my bills and I was in Bali and I had all these incredible, it's the number one place in the world for personal growth and development. So I had a lot of amazing therapists from all over the world there. And I was able to get help and just throw money at the problem and not have to worry about a wedding that I fully funded that I couldn't attend. So it was an expensive year for me last year. So I'm really grateful to FI for that. It would have been a lot more challenging without that money. Yeah. So many people that I've spoken to about the concept of financial independence and, hey, you can retire early or you're saving in advance for your retirement to give yourself more options.

45:08They say some variation of, I love my job or I don't want to put restraints on myself and my spending, or even I'm young, I'll think about retirement early. And they're so missing the point. You are not even close to the first person that I've talked to who said, there's no way I could have gone back to a job while I was dealing with this particular situation. If I hadn't been financially independent, I don't know what would have happened. And the point is not to retire so that you never have to work again. The point is to give yourself so many more options in the future. And I hate that you had all of that everything piling up on you at once.

45:46And then at the end, how about one more thing? I didn't even know you got dengue fever. Yikes. But to keep piling and piling, I don't want to make it sound like you're the only person that's ever had to deal with a lot. You're not. But then on top of all of that, you have to go to a job every day or risk the income that you have that allows you to live your life. So I just think that financial independence is so much more than just quitting a job you don't like. I am totally unapologetically pro-fire for the reasons you just discussed there. And when people say like, live your best life, all that, or even Ramit's thing, live your rich life, the fact that you're making smart decisions and piling up a lot of money over here gives you the option to defray future risk.

46:33I mean, that could be way more valuable to someone than whatever that 10 % or 15 % or 20 % extra spending right now could mean. So I think there's a lot of advantages and very little risk for future regret to pursuing FI relative to what kind of some of the mainstream pundits have begun to say. And I think, Amy, your outcome here is just so important from several different from several different angles here. I mean, it made the worst year of your life less bad. It makes most of the days way better. It allows total freedom and optionality. You are giving back to the community and you are allowing your creativity and your passion to come through with what is essentially now a very small business that could, if you ever wanted to, probably be much bigger at some point.

47:27And so I just think it's awesome to hear your story here. the good and the bad for inspiration for other people. Thank you. And I guess I would just say to listeners, no matter where you are on your financial journey, whatever you do to build up your emergency fund, to save your first 50 ,000 or first 100 ,000, you are giving yourself so much more freedom and flexibility. And we always talk about the sexy side of five, maybe like travel or time freedom or location freedom or all those kinds of things. But it is really for the tougher times in life. And I, you know, I'm so grateful for, for this community, for, for all the support I've been given.

48:05You know, this is the most caring, supportive community I could ever imagine. Just really people who think outside the box and, you know, they've sat down and looked at my spreadsheet with me and, and helped me with my numbers. And that's given me so much more assurance and feeling of security around my numbers coming from a place of scarcity and childhood. Do you feel secure about your numbers? I do a lot, you know, and I honestly have to say, Like I'm grateful for everything that happened for me that happened to me this year. You know, I'm grateful for that mosquito that bit me and gave me dengue fever.

48:35Because one thing was I learned a lot about my psyche, you know, and I really had to dive into, I guess it put it in perspective, you know, like I've always been so frugal, but when, when I was really just trying to survive and I didn't really even know what was going on with me, I couldn't even articulate there for a while. I totally cut myself off from everybody because I felt so much shame. You know, I knew I could just throw money at the problem. And so I did. I threw a lot of money at the problem. And it really was good for me. So yeah, I feel like I did a lot of work this year. I spent a lot of money this year.

49:12So I wouldn't trade it. You spent a lot of money because you had the money to spend and you got such a reward out of it. And that's another aspect of FI. When you are living paycheck to paycheck and you don't have anything saved up, you can't handle an emergency or a crisis or any of this. You just have to keep go, go, going and hope for the best. But instead, you have the ability to stop, put everything on hold, even if you lose your deposits, even if you lose money while you're doing this, now you can focus on you. And that's really the best part of this whole journey. Yeah. Thank goodness for Fi.

49:49That's all I can say in this community. Thank you for all that you do as well. Thank goodness for Fi. It's absolutely the best choice I ever made was to not spend every dime and instead start investing. Amy, what is the biggest mistake you have made on your financial independence journey? And what advice would you give to others so that they could avoid that same mistake? My biggest financial mistake was probably being so obsessive about my savings and investing and looking at my monthly net worth. I mean, I had an unhealthy relationship with money for a lot of years. And I think there were things I missed out on.

50:27I mean, luckily, I still traveled a lot. But there were a lot of things that I didn't do that I wish I would have done. So I think I would encourage listeners to balance more. And even if it takes more time to get to FI, if you're enjoying the journey, I think that's more important than getting to FI faster. I love it. and also feel way seen there, Amy. So thanks for calling me out too. I didn't mean to call you out. I was calling myself out. No, that's probably one of my biggest mistakes as well is not having a healthy relationship with money. And I think as more people talk about that, the more people realize, yeah, that's me too.

51:09And let's start changing that because that doesn't go away overnight. Did your financial relationship go away overnight? Did you all of a sudden embrace spending money? Definitely not. And I think it's taken me some time really to be fired to see like, oh, my money still grows. Like even though I'm, you know, spending more on eating out and going to more events like and traveling, you know, coming back and forth to the US and Australia, you know, my money is still growing all the time. It's still my net worth is increasing. So yeah, it takes time. It takes time, but you will get there. All right, Amy, this was super fun.

51:44Thank you so much for your time today. I really, really appreciate you. And where, again, can people find more about you and your five freedom retreat? They can go to fivefreedomretreats.com. And again, tickets are launching on March 1st. So if they're interested in coming, I would love to have them. They can go and watch videos of what we've done on the previous retreats. It's a really, really fun time together. Great people. In-person five events are so important to helping you stay on the journey or explore what your life after you've reached financial independence looks like based on conversations with other people who are in it, who speak the language, who understand all the things that you have had to go through and just want to help you out.

52:23It's such an encouraging community. All right, Amy, thank you so much. And we will talk to you soon. Thank you. Appreciate you. Thank you, Scott. Thank you, Mindy. See you later. Okay, Scott, that was Amy Minkley. And that was her amazing financial independence journey. As a teacher, what did you think? Well, Mindy, I think that the Internet Retirement Police should go to town in the comments of this YouTube video because she was single income, no kids, and because she did it internationally, because she had some benefits there, and because well after she fired without any plans whatsoever, her relationship with her estranged father came back into play and allowed her to get a small inheritance.

53:06and, and, and, and no, come on. This is the best. This is like, this is fire. This is what it's all about. This is, this is someone who is a great example of like creative, interesting approach that was different. You have to take a different path. You think that the person who is earning a median income with no advantages in a high cost of living area who does not have the ability or means to invest is not going to achieve fire. Every fire story or almost all of them will have a unique path that they're charting and many of them are highly compatible with lots of fun lifestyle engagements lots of fun opportunities and lots of creative ways to to end you know find yourself in your in your end state in your in your retired state uh like in a place like valley so huge inspiration love the fact that she lives what is a what sounds like an awesome lifestyle love her tuesday and um the fact that she's involved in the community starting to give back and starting a small business um it's just a passion project for her.

54:04I mean, it's just perfect. If we can make this outcome more achievable for even just a few more people, the work we're doing here will be worthwhile at BiggerPocketsMoney. Yes. And Scott, you make a great point. I love that she's honoring the Balinese culture and including the Balinese people in her retreat to kind of introduce people who aren't from Bali into what Bali is all about and what makes Bali so amazing. But yeah, her story is super incredible and totally repeatable. She's teaching English as a second language to schools in Asian countries. You can do that with adults. You can do that with kids.

54:44This is a repeatable path. You are taking your housing expense out of the equation. Isn't that the biggest expense people have is housing? Now you're just food and travel. But if your housing is provided by your employer, you're probably going to be really close to your job where you could walk. You could take low-cost public transportation. You could ride a bike. You could do something to get you there very low cost. So now out of your three big expenses, Scott, you've taken away two and you only have food. But again, you're in – Southeast Asia is a lower cost of living place. So now you've got – that is kind of like in half.

55:23Well, I should have done that with a different finger because I can't show my thumb halfway. But you've got so little expenses, you can just take all the money that you're making and plow it into your investments. Amy discovered the concept of financial independence in 2019. And two years later, she was retired. One of the things that was going through my head is just like how replicable is that story for a U.S.-based teacher who earns less income, likely doesn't have the same benefits there. I mean, I think it's much I think it's way harder, Mindy. I mean, I think I think you can you can bridge to it with, you know, some smart planning.

55:58You know, maybe maybe if you incorporate real estate, for example, in the summers or some sort of side hustle, I can get going there. But, you know, wow, it does seem like at least for those who are capable of getting the jobs in that kind of elite tier, these elite private schools, potentially abroad, that that is definitely a game changer there and something worth considering for some folks. Well, how does an American-based teacher repeat this? Simple. They repeat it. They move to Bali. They move to Japan. They move to Singapore. And they do the same thing that Amy did. American teachers are criminally underpaid.

56:36Yeah, well, I do want to challenge that one. I think that that's another good one for us to investigate with future episodes with teachers in the U.S. because I think you can do it. I think it'll just be much harder and you really have to supplement what's going on with the base case with some extracurriculars in the summers and during some of those break periods that are available. But yes, it will be harder for a U.S. teacher. But there's also a potential pension that vests after, you know, 10, 20 years. So around that same time, 43-year-old age mark, maybe there's an opportunity to create a similar outcome.

57:09So just food for thought, something I want to explore with U.S. teachers that are pursuing FIRE. Reach out to Scott at BiggerPockets.com or Mindy at BiggerPockets.com if you want to share your story or, you know, think through some of those things. Because we'd love to learn more about how teachers in the U.S. can do that. But if you have a problem with Amy's story specifically, I think Mindy cited the email address we're creating for that. If you want to report her to the Internet Retirement Police, you can email idontcare at don'tbotherme.com. Right. Is that it, Mindy? Or idontcare at tellsomebodyelse.com.

57:40Yeah, there you go. That's it. Thank you. All right, Scott, should we get out of here? Let's do it. That wraps up this episode of the BiggerPocketsMoney podcast. He is Scott Trench and I am Indy Jensen saying so long, King Kong. Rinse takes your laundry and hand delivers it to your door, expertly cleaned and folded. So you could take the time once spent folding and sorting and waiting to finally pursue a whole new version of you. Like tea time you. Mmm. Or this tea time you. Or even this tea time you. So did you hear about Dave? Or even tea time, tea time, tea time you. Mmm. So update on Dave.

58:19It's up to you. We'll take the laundry. Rinse. It's time to be great.