Thanksgiving Edition: We Ignored “Never Work With Your Spouse” — And Built an Empire Together

0:00It's just a bunch of ideas floating around that you can just pull these pieces in and now you've got a whole system that works that you didn't have prior. I can see tomorrow better than most people can. So many people say that working with your spouse is difficult. It's not difficult, but in any relationships, you have your ups and your downs and you have your difficulties and really easy paths in life. Seeing it, doing it, messing up, normal day, right? But how you get up and how you make it perfect is what makes you different.

0:41Welcome back to The Build Pod, where authenticity trumps authority. My name is Mara Dorn, and I'm your host. And if you haven't already, do me a favor and hit that like and subscribe. And obviously, I want you to share it with me. Today's episode is something that is very near and dear to me. First of all, as we get closer to Thanksgiving, it always reminds me of my childhood. For those of you that don't know, I actually lost my father on Thanksgiving. So the Thanksgiving holiday is always a memorable one, obviously. And rather than I don't want anyone to ever take pity on me, it's more of a celebration of life.

1:18And it gives me an opportunity really to reflect on what I'm thankful for, the many people, the many things, you know, just in life. And I feel so thankful this holiday season. But I'm especially thankful because I have a very special guest on today. This is my husband. He happens to be my business partner, my best friend, and obviously the love of my life, Mr. Seth Thorne. Welcome to the Build Pod. Thank you. It's a pleasure being on this side of the camera, this go around. Yeah, the set that he actually built. So if you guys haven't noticed, this is a brand new set. This is obviously my husband because the one thing about my husband that people don't know is he is usually behind the camera making me look good.

2:01But he is my greatest fan, my biggest cheerleader. And it's just been quite a ride together, babe. What do you think? It has. It's been a long umpteen years, 11 years. Yeah, I know you a long time. We're married. How many years are we almost made? You know exactly the amount. How many? Like nine? Going on nine. Yeah, nine years. Going on nine. Yeah, so much you know about me. It's so much fun. It's been so much fun. He doesn't even know. I know a lot about you. Now, the us thing, it's been, we've gone through a lot together, you know? Yeah. So that, time flies. Time definitely flies. But I really wanted to not only talk about why we're so thankful, but I think a lot of people in general have asked me, you know, for those that know me really close, they know that Seth and I work together.

2:46We've built a business together. We basically do everything together. And I know that sounds kind of sappy, but it's not what you think because we are individuality, even though everybody pairs us together. But, you know, let's take it from the top. You know, our journey together has not always been easy. There was a long lay of friendship and then we got married. But I want to dig into the point where when we started building our business And I'll tell you this, I've heard many great thought leaders talk about their income rising or, you know, just everything started to turn around when they started to go into business or they had a partner that believed in them.

3:26And I would never admit this to you, but it is absolutely 100 % true. Before I met Seth, I was doing okay in life, but my income probably two to three X when Seth walked into my life. And I could say it was attributed to many things. But the truth is, is when you have a vested partner and obviously two heads are better than one, everything just went exponential for us. And we were able to build an incredible empire together. And that's kind of where I want to start where that, you know, that turning point where do you remember when we got married? We had like we had like we had like$30 ,000 about right.

4:02And then we were moving into our building that we are currently in. And I remember, tell me if you remember this, I remember being so scared because that was the only savings or money we had. So I remember being so scared about building this dream that we wanted to, we wanted to fulfill. And you were the one that, that was the risk taker. I was the visionary. You were the risk taker. So let's talk about that because I'm sure there are people out there that have, you know, money in their savings account. They want to open up a business or they want to do something. So let's talk about that and how that felt for you and what you kind of drove us to do.

4:39I mean, it is true. If you build it, they will come. And that was the mindset I was in, you know, and prior to making a big leap and opening up our own real legitimate office goals and 10 ,000 ordeal, but we knew it was working because the prior place that we were working in, we were, we were blown from the seams every which way, you know? And so we had people working in the hallways outside because there wasn't enough room inside the office. Making that leap of faith and jumping into here was kind of the fishbowl mindset where, you know, you get a bigger fishbowl and the fish will grow. And they'll fill up more space.

5:15You can get more fish. That's exactly what we did here. We gave them an opportunity to blossom. And our one office that we created has probably turned into more than 1 ,500. all because we were willing to take a leap of faith that no one else would. Yeah. And I also want to point out something that, you know, really kept us very humble. Well, you because I was super pregnant at the time. But one thing that Seth did do as we were doing this, keep in mind, we had thirty thousand dollars and it was a lot more money to get this started because we had first last security. Plus, we had to pay for cubes and electric and all the other odds and ends that came with it.

5:52But one thing that will never I will never forget and you still continue to do is you remain humbled. And he was literally taking like, what is it? A jackhammer? Is that the name of it? And jackhammering the floors. And he was there putting together cubicles. And I think that always kind of kept us humble that like, you know, from the beginning. It was humble or we had to just do it because we didn't have the money to do it. But we recently got married. And then right after getting married, we wanted to open up an office. And, you know, basically our life savings was put into the wedding and then put into the office.

6:26We had to take a chance, but we knew we knew we'd be OK with spending all that money. We knew that we had enough money coming in and, you know, offset, you know, our living expenses. So it was a smart risk and it steamed a path to the future decades. What would you say was like the biggest life lesson during that process? You can teach yourself anything on YouTube. And now ChatGPT, you don't even need YouTube. Literally, this whole office was built, not the office we have currently, but the office was built with my hands. And because I didn't have enough money to even afford any cheap labor whatsoever and had to do it myself.

7:06And some YouTube videos, I hung up 30 TVs later, built cubicles, desks, ripped out carpet. it. And then I remember for our second build out, our second office build out, I required all of our leaders to help build that office out, tear out carpet, get dirty, get a little bloody. Just because I knew what it did to me, it creates a self of pride, a sense of pride to where even if you're walking into the bathroom in someone else's place of business, I'm there picking up toilet paper off the floor because it looks bad, you know? And so having that sense of pride and this place being yours and what I had and what I instilled in others, a very valuable asset.

7:47Yeah, I think it definitely doesn't go unnoticed. And still today, like we still are no, we're definitely no strangers to coming in and picking things up off the floor or, you know, cleaning up the kitchen in here or whatever it takes. And you're absolutely right. One thing that Seth did bring to the table is that people saw from the beginning that Seth never felt like he was above anybody or above any task in the office. If Seth was willing to do it, everybody else was. And that's kind of where our culture started to really become stronger because everybody had a vested interest. Even that summer, or maybe it was like two years later, do you remember when the air broke here and there was this huge part and there was like, we have, what is it, five stories and we needed to get this part all the way up.

8:32But it was like virtually impossible. We couldn't do with a crane because the stairs are enclosed. and everybody, because the culture was so strong and everyone had already seen Seth do so many menial tasks or not even menial, just tasks in general, everybody went or anyone that could took a helping hand to bringing that part all the way up so we can have air during the summer. It just goes along. Maybe. Do you want to go with air all summer or do you all want to pick up this 2 ,000 pound pole and shove it up? Either way, they like air conditioning. Yeah, they definitely do, especially in the Florida heat.

9:06But, you know, just kind of going back to that and what that looked like for us, you know, so many people say that working with your spouse is difficult. Would you say that working with your spouse is difficult? Did you just kick me? No. It's not difficult. But in any relationships, you have your ups and your downs and you have your difficulties and really easy paths. You know, the way I view it is not that working with my spouse is not at all. It's I'm living with my loving every moment of it. And yeah, I mean, we get on each other's nerves, but then we make up after. That's all we really know, though.

9:43Also, we don't really know working without each other because we've worked together since you started. So there was no there really is no Seth without Mara, Mara without Seth. And people are, you know, I mean, better. We just have different. You wanted me from day one. And so I basically was. So I felt like I was. And, you know, maybe that's what it was. I'm glad you told yourself that story. It's not really how the story played out. But we'll just for this, because I'm feeling very thankful. We'll just, you know, go with that. But I will say that working with your spouse, people ask me about it all the time, what it's like.

10:15And number one, I like I said, I really don't know anything other than working with Seth. But the other thing is, is that it's working with someone that's ride or die. You know, even sometimes when I think I'm getting pushback or he's not on my side or I'm getting a little sensitive. I know that at the end of the day, no matter what, he's going to stand next. And when you have somebody that's equally vested in what you're doing, you know that the results are just going to show for themselves. The results undeniably are going to be amazing because you have two people working together for a common goal.

10:48And regardless of what's happening in between, I mean, I just think two is better than one, honestly. I mean, it's not like we're out here unraveling in front of people. We never do that. We kind of keep our stuff. If something's going on, we'll bicker, but nothing like. It's a business, whether it's a power couple, a power dude, more than one person is better than one. Yeah. So for Seth, you know, I've watched you evolve in this business. And, you know, Seth does not, he actually doesn't have a background in tech. His background is actually similar to mine. He has a criminal justice and legal studies degree, right?

11:24It's criminal justice with a minor in legal studies. Whatever, you know, whatever. I got how much she knows. I know a lot about you, whatever. But my point was, is that our business is a business. I think any business is very innovative. And I think a key factor in keeping up with your business is being innovative. And one thing that Seth does bring to the table, that's super important. So if you don't have somebody that's innovative or somebody that is not keeping up with the times, I would definitely suggest you find yourself a Seth or, you know, hire one. but one thing Seth has been able to do that's revolutionized our business is to stay up with the time and where did I mean I kind of want to know like where does that come from like your brain works on a different level babe I you think about things like I wouldn't even know to know that how do you know that just makes sense there's no you gotta elaborate what do you mean I mean I can see tomorrow better than most right and so how do I make someone's life easier tomorrow knowing the information.

12:26And so whether I hear something in passing and I'm like, oh, that's a good idea. It's basically stored in my memory pretty much for good. And then, you know, let's say it's just an idea. I want to accomplish this thing. And I'm like, that would be really great. I just don't have the way to do it in between. Right. I don't know how to get there yet. But a few weeks, months or even years later, that in between is like, oh, shoot, I can use this to do that. I remember that idea from way back. And then I implemented and bam. So it's just a bunch of ideas floating around that you can just pull these pieces in.

13:03And now you've got a whole system that works that you didn't have prior. So I would say for you, you would prefer to work smarter than harder. I think there's a good equal. I like to work hard and I like to work smart, but I like to do it to where I'm not working aimless. Stuff that I do and the stuff that gets done is done to fix problems moving forward so i don't have to having those so can you explain to everybody why systems because i'm not a systematic person at all no you're not zero zero systems i'm an idea i am i'm an idea an idealist not an idealist but i'm a i'm a visionary blurter yeah i am an idea blurter i am a visionary um i definitely can't execute so one big piece of advice is you hire for your weaknesses.

13:48And I definitely am not going to attack any of that. But how would you explain the importance of having systems and understanding why systems are so? System creates structure. System creates. And just like building a house, you can't build a house without. You can't build a house without a plan. You build a house without foundation and without a plan, ain't going to be there for long. So it all comes down to how you execute. And I'm sure you're not going to execute on that same thing over and over and over again and doing it differently. If you are, that's a complete lack of system. You know, our job and our days are so monotonous and we do the same thing over and over again.

14:30Why not make that a little easier every day and to where you've got systems that make that same process, you know, cutting down on your time. Third, can you give some examples of maybe some systems that would be useful in a work organization? whether it's a CRM or a project board, something that people, maybe something inexpensive would help organize something that you like, one of your favorite. Nothing's going to make sense. You can name a work board, a job board. Let's say we have a workflow. Let's say we're running job at, we're just placing job ads out, making sure we keep track of what the job title is, right?

15:06And how many applicants we got from that job. What was in the body of the job? What was the compensation? What was the CTA or the call to action on it? What was the benefits of that job? And then seeing how many applicants you got from that job. Keeping a tally of all of this over and over again, you're going to start to see trends and job titles that work and compensations that work and benefits that work. But failing to keep track and just posting this as you feel like you just think it's going to be better because you did this one cool thing in there but really it might not have done anything at all and so the lack of keeping track of all of that and actually understanding your numbers is going to lead to you just thinking you're doing the right thing meanwhile you're really hurting your business you know and that's just data right and then with the data you can create actionable automation all right we got to post jobs every day to post a job every day.

16:06We got to go here, there and do this. So why not we create an automation that can post that for us, right? Why don't we create an automation that can grab that data for us? How many applicants, things like that, you know, just you can have auto forwarding from your email go into a parsing system. And now you can keep track of how many applicants you get from this job post versus that job post and then tying that all back into a Google sheet to post all that information there. Hence why we're so profitable, because if it was up to me, I would just post and just hope for I'm like, go by the seat of your pants.

16:40But he's absolutely right. Understanding your KPIs and your ROI is super important. And the only way to do that is to have real data and real data comes from keeping track of whatever system you're using and then going over it and then trying to perfect it. So you understand what's coming in versus what's going out. Because a lot of times one one great way to bankrupt yourself in business is to just put a whole bunch of money, throw it out of problem and not understand the KPIs, what's coming, your ROI in return. So that is a big thing that Seth has brought to the table. But I mean, you've brought so many innovative, different aspects of the business and keeping up with the times is hard.

17:19So how do you how are you able to continuously keep up with the times? You know, anything that's innovative or new? I know you're working on AI things. How do you know to even do that? I mean, social media has played a big part into it, following people that do the things that you'd like to do and emulate. Luckily, nowadays, if you just watch a video too long and knows that you liked it or you watched it and they're going to show you more of it, you don't even have to like it. So I got a weird social media formula that I'll watch stuff a certain amount of time so it knows I'm watching it. I'll like stuff and I want to see more of that stuff.

17:54I'll follow if I want to see that specific niche over and over and over again. I talk to ChatGPT a lot. My new thing is just talking to ChatGPT and not typing it because I can just have full-on conversations in my headphone talking to myself. But at least I'm getting a lot of information in pointless times. I'm driving home from one office to another office. It might be two, three, four hours to get there. Might as well just talk to myself. Not really myself. I'll talk to ChatGPT and keep asking it questions. And honestly, the most I get from ChatGPT is when I prompt it to ask me questions. When I prompt ChatGPT to ask me questions, like beat me up about this idea, I end up getting so much more out of it and creating bulletproof systems.

18:44Is that why you've been so much more talkative lately with me and asking me questions? Have you been talking to ChatGPT about me? Asking ChatGPT to ask you questions about me? Or so we can have a conversation? Because you're not very talkative, but you haven't been lately. Usually I just ask it how to process your emotions a little bit better. One thing about you that I do know, and I've learned from you, I've actually taken it from you, is you have great ideas, but you also have no problem, and this is going to sound terrible, is taking other people's ideas and making them. And explain, I would say explain, because I think a lot of time ego gets in our way and we're like, oh, we're not gonna take that from that person.

19:23But it has helped us tremendously in our business. In fact, one thing that I will give you credit for is Seth was instrumental in taking our sales team from, I don't know, we were doing like a few hundred thousand to a million dollar team within like a six month timeframe. And he did that because he went and listened to the way somebody was doing something via phone because we used to do face-to-face sales. He took that, brought it back, went above my head. That's a whole other story. But he took somebody else's idea and just perfected it and ended up being, I mean, still today, he is the leads guru, but completely changed the trajectory of our team.

20:03So let's talk a little bit about the importance of doing that and why it's not shameful. I mean, every day, if you're not learning one new thing a day, you might as well stop doing whatever. I think that if you're not learning one new thing every two hours, you're, you're doing, you're focusing on the wrong things and just picking up one nugget, right? That one nugget, whether it's a conference call with your colleagues or a conference call with a company you work with, or, you know, even just scrolling endlessly on social media, you should be able to pull one thing in that you're like, Oh, wow, that's cool.

20:37That's a different way of doing it. And again, You just store that in the memory database and hope that one day you find something else that makes that whole seamless process. Yeah. I mean, you're an observer. I guess that might be where I'm suited. I observe. I can see things and then I can pull that one item in and be like, oh, wow, now that all makes sense. Seeing it, doing it, messing up, normal day, but how you get up and how you make it perfect. What would you say that your greatest accomplishment so far or one of your what has yet to come? Have one single one, not one single moment, like a or even a defining moment.

21:16I think I've had a lot of amazing moments in the business. You have. And I've had a lot of amazing moments in life. I don't know. I cherish what can happen in the future more than what I'm not going to sit here and live in the past. Yeah, I've had some great awards and built big teams, grown an amazing family now. And all of that is stuff that I love and cherish, but I'm not thinking about it all day and not sitting here and thinking, oh, I've done all of that before. I don't need to really do it again. How do I make it to where my life's easier? My family's life is easier. And how do I make tomorrow better than today, which ultimately just makes me work all damn day.

21:57But that's a whole nother time. So let's kind of switch gears for a second. You know, you talked a little bit about family and I taught, I don't know if you listen to what I say. Who knows if you really listen to any of my, he never read my book. Never. Let me ask you guys, you live with your spouse. You work with your spouse. Your spouse talks all the time. I mean, we, we have a conference call together, like a full hour, two hour conference call, me, her, a team of people together. and she calls me back right after the conference call to talk about the conference call. I thought that's what the conference call was for, right?

22:33I just want to rehash the conference call. So let me ask you a question. With all the talking, do you really think I listen to all your podcasts? No, I think you listen to none of that. Yeah, I kind of want like the silence. Okay, so I talk. Okay, I don't even remember where I was going. Oh, so on one of my reels, I talk about, no, you've definitely heard me say this is I don't think that work life balance is a real thing. I don't think that that is. I just don't think that's a real. I don't think it's real. I think it's work life compromise, not balance, because nothing is ever evenly balanced.

23:09You can't. I don't think that, you know, sometimes there. And I think you would agree, like sometimes things take precedence. Sometimes our work is going to take precedence over our marriage. We've put our marriage on the back burner many times. I think we've gone on maybe a total of three dates by ourselves ever in our entire relationship. That's because you do not ever. OK, but that's not what we're talking about. Get back on. No. But my point is or where I was going with this is, you know, family life and work life is hard. And I know a lot of people want to know how are we able to prioritize or juggle, you know, being spouses, having three kids at home.

23:46And we are hands on. We do go to the basketball games, the wrestling matches, which was horrible. Don't ever suggest that for any mom out there. But how are you able to kind of how are you able to do what? Juggle? Yeah. Just cut down on hours of sleep. There's nothing else to it, really. I mean, it's just life. It's every day I wake up for it. I go to sleep for it, whether it's my wife or my kids or my work or anything else I want to do. It's throw it in there and prioritize it, of course, and get it done. What would you what would you give one piece of advice to a man that is trying to juggle it all?

24:22Juggle what? Juggle work, life, everything. Spouse, you know, trying to do I mean, trying to be a jack of all trades. It's not always easy, but I think you do a pretty OK job. Not the greatest, but you do. No, you do a good job. You do. You show up when it counts. But, you know, in our house, I will say that we do have gender roles, especially in our house. Not so much at work because I like to lead, but there is a very defined gender role in our home. And I like to keep it like that. Call me old fashioned. I, you know, I'm all about the woman empowerment. I do feel like in our house, we do have specific roles.

24:55At home, I am the mom and I am the wife. And at home, Seth is the dad and he is the husband and he is the one that takes out the trash, you know, does all the manly things. But I think there are a lot of men that struggle trying to juggle everything. And you do a good job of that. How are you able to do nothing? No. You don't know how? Do you feel like you do a good job at that? I feel like I can never do it. I feel like we're always like that, right? Like our boat, I always say like we're in a boat and like when one thing is going good, like we're plugging the other one. You know, we have one kid going on the right track.

25:29Like we're in second grade listening to why our kid can't do something or why he's inappropriate or it's just constant. But, you know, I will say for the parents or the spouses that work together or just moms and dads that don't work together is allow yourself some grace. You know, it is about work life priority and doing the best that you can. Kids don't come with a set of directions. Life doesn't come with a set of directions. And I don't think there is a right or wrong way to do anything. And I think for the most time, we're just winging it. You know, I'm going to tell my wife that after this, you know, we're just winging it most of the time.