Lindsey Vonn On Why Winning Must Come Before Money

0:00Getting in the starting gate at the Olympics, there's nothing that I will ever do in life that's anywhere close to that. Lindsey Vonn. It's 90 seconds in a lifetime. The time is set right here. Oh my goodness! No! And she is down heavily. When I crashed again, it wasn't like I'm scared of what's going to happen. There's a lot of risk in downhill skiing. It's a very dangerous sport. I felt so sad because I was losing my team. You're going to have to be more than an athlete. And so I hustled. I prioritized the winning. I won, and then the money followed.

0:36What's up, everybody, and welcome to Boardroom's Mental Wealth. My name is Rich Kleiman, and I'm sitting here today with Jack Howard, the head of money wellness at Ally Bank, our partner with this show. And our guest today is the one and only Olympic champion, iconic athlete and friend of mine, Lindsey Vaughn. Lindsey, welcome. Thanks for having me. Of course. Thank you so much for being here. Before we start, would you do me a favor and define mental wealth for us today? Yeah, so mental wealth, and Lindsay, this is for you too. So when we think about money, we often think about the numbers. It's your net worth.

1:11It's your credit score, how much debt you have. But for most people, it's bigger than that. It's the emotions. It's the mindset, the things you learn from your parents about money. And most importantly, your values and how you use those values to help you to use that money for fun stuff, which we're going to get into. So we want you to use money as a tool to live your life today, tomorrow, and someday. So that's mental wealth. Amazing. Do you remember the first time you even understood what money was or how money played a part in your family or your childhood? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I'm the oldest of five kids and the youngest three are triplets.

1:49So it wasn't easy for my family growing up. And with my career as a ski racer, skiing is not a cheap sport either. And when we moved to Colorado from Minnesota, I definitely realized at that point, you know, the value of money and why it was important for us. And we couldn't afford to do the things that we necessarily wanted to do. You know, my dad had to stay in Minnesota, continue working as a lawyer. My mom moved with all of us kids out to Colorado. You know, we had a small condo and things were really tight. And, you know, my mom really had to manage. And, you know, my dad was coming back to Colorado as much as he could.

2:28But it was difficult to be able to do what we wanted to do. And my family, like I said, made a lot of sacrifices for that. And I think that ultimately played a part in how I perceive money as well and my goals and how I move forward in the world because I didn't want to have that type of anxiety. and worry that my parents and my siblings had. So Lindsay, what you just talked about is what I call your money story. And it's really those early memories about money. It's your personal narrative about money. So my early memories of money is, I have a twin brother. So you got triplets, I got a twin too.

3:05So it was a lot of us. And I remember my twin brother and I, my mom, we would go to the credit union. My mom was a teacher, my dad a police officer and pull out a hundred dollars. And we would go shopping or to the movies. And it taught me that money is used to create experiences and have fun. And it really shows up in my life today of I'm going to take my kids. It could be a dance party in the living room to Disney World. Right. But I want to have experiences with my family. So when you think of your earliest memory of money, what is it and what did it teach you about money? um I mean my earliest memory um was really like when I think about a physical dollar bill is my my grandparents like when I went to my grandma's house every summer in Wisconsin my grandma was really the only one that ever gave us any money and she didn't have any money to give so it was very special for us and she gave us like a couple dollars and we'd go down to the gas station and buy these slush puppies.

4:06Um, but it was like kind of a family experience. And I think similar to you in that way. Um, but other than that, like my parents didn't give us money for chores or anything. Um, I made my own school lunches. So like I didn't physically have a lot of money, um, in that way, except for my grandma. And again, you know, my money was tight for them too. So when I got something from them, it was special. And it was something that we all did together. I'm also the oldest of 13 grandchildren. So we, you know, like we went to the gas station. It wasn't like just me. It was a lot of us. You were deep going to the gas station.

4:44Everybody had$2. So you were like cashing out at the gas station. That's a good time. That's an experience right there. I can't bring up skiing without asking you how you're feeling, obviously to start. How are you feeling? And obviously it's been a whirlwind of a year for you. Yeah, I'm good. I mean, I'm a lot better than I was. I'm starting to weight train and like do things that make me really happy, push myself. And I'm walking better. I think actually, honestly, walking is the hardest thing that I do. And I actually just found out yesterday my right ankle is still broken. So my left leg is healing really well.

5:25My right ankle, not so much. So I'm trying to like manage all these things at the same time and still live my life. But I'm focused. I'm more focused, I guess, on probably living than my rehab, like for once in my life. More focused on living. Yeah, I'm like trying to heal both emotionally and physically. Tell us more about that because you look stunning. I was telling everybody I love your suit. You look amazing. and the healing journey. You walked in and you said your ankle is broken, but you still have on cute shoes. Tell me what is happening here and just more about this healing journey of something that you've lived for so long and now transitioning to find a new place of happiness.

6:08What does that look like? I mean, it's interesting because I was retired for six years, so I was really happy in life. And I think I never expected to come back to the Olympics. I never expected to kind of go on the path that I did. And I really enjoyed it and I loved it and I do not regret it at all. But now, you know, I have to kind of go back into retirement and figure out what it means. Or, I mean, honestly, I haven't even entirely decided if I want to go back to retirement. I have to figure that out. But I think this injury was so different because it was so much pain. I'm normally really good at managing it and I know my body really well, what I can do, what I can't do.

6:49but the prolonged amount of pain that I had was really difficult to manage. And so now, you know, like in this kind of phase of my rehab with my ankle still broken, I'm like managing it in a way that I'm not pushing myself too hard. I'm making sure I'm doing all the right things, but I'm also prioritizing time for me, which I haven't really done very much of in my life. I went to Africa for two weeks, which was amazing. I spent a little bit of time in Europe and I'm just kind of trying to equally balance mental and physical well-being. You know, you talk about this like time for yourself and the freedom.

7:31It's probably one of those things that even beyond the injury to perform at the level that you performed at, it took 100 percent commitment from you, mind, body and soul. And I would imagine growing up from your family. And you always hear about how youth sports can be so costly for a family. And skiing, I would imagine, is at the top of that. Do you remember understanding, like, what type of commitment it would take from your family to support your dreams and, you know, the cost that it would take from your family to be able to, like, move you to Vail and follow something that was so important to you?

8:06Yeah, I knew the cost and I knew it was a heavy cost, especially because we couldn't necessarily afford for my siblings to do exactly what I was doing. So, you know, when we went to Colorado, their ambitions were not to be ski racers. I had one brother that liked it, but wasn't quite sure. But the rest, you know, they're like along for the ride. And so it wasn't just that it cost money. It was also, it cost my siblings a lot emotionally to move their lives to Colorado for me. And so, you know, the goal of making it to the 2002 Olympics when I was 17 was a huge one. And when I made the team, it was like, okay, all the money we spent, all the sacrifices we gave up for this are worth it.

8:53And then as soon as I made the team, my family moved back to Minnesota. Like, okay, we're, you know, the kids don't really want to be ski racers. will go back and they finished high school. And I think they were happy to do that. But yeah, it was not just money, but emotional costs as well. And you were talking about your siblings with the relationship you have with them, understanding the financial commitment, the emotional commitment. How did that show up for you? So I know for your siblings, they probably, we, they obviously want to go home, but that's a lot for you to carry. Pressure. Pressure.

9:30Yeah, that. I took it more as, I guess, a responsibility to my family. You know, if they're going to sacrifice their money and their time and where we live and, you know, how they operate their lives so that I can fulfill my dream, I have to be serious about this. You know, like I was, not that I needed that much motivation, but, you know, I'm a kid and all my friends are going out at night and they're, they're being kids and I'm in bed at eight o 'clock and training, you know, at 7am and really making sure everything I do is 100 % effort. You know, that there's nothing that I've done that would waste any of my family's money or time.

10:13You know, I wanted to capitalize on what I had and the sacrifices they were making for me. So if I did fail, it was because I just wasn't good enough, not because I didn't try. Is there a moment where you make it financially when you're a skier? You know, like there's obviously for an NBA player when they get drafted, it's like their life has changed. And even more so now when they're younger and in college and you get paid through NIL. But when you make the Olympics for the first time, what does that mean for you monetarily? Like what does that start to mean for the business of being a professional skier?

10:48I mean, at 17, it really didn't mean much. Ski racing is a really difficult sport. our sponsors like our main sponsors that we have in the World Cup aren't really our sponsors necessarily at the Olympics because we don't have any any capability to showcase those sponsors so normally in the World Cup we have our helmet and mine's always been Red Bull but you can't have a Red Bull helmet in the Olympics so it's a it's a bit challenging for us because that's our main way of getting paid. Um, I would say for me, it was more of a slow progression. Um, and a lot of people, a lot of athletes, you know, ask me like, how did you, how did you make it?

11:30You know, I, I don't have these big contracts. I'm like, well, you haven't won yet. It took me really, I would say until I won the Olympics. And I, at that point I had won, I don't know, 45 races of what's now 84, I didn't really start to earn the kind of money that would really make a dent for my life long term. You know, I was making good money, but I mean, even now you can't compare it to what basketball players make or I'd say most professional athletes, you know, Olympic athletes, generally speaking, make a lot less money. Most, I don't know what the percentage is. I think it's a crazy percentage, but most Olympians have second jobs.

12:13Um, so I'm lucky in that way, you know, but my dad always told me since I was young, you know, if you want to be, you don't want to be working after ski racing, you're going to have to be more than an athlete. And so I hustled, I hustled really hard. Um, I always worked hard on my interviews. Like I watched my interviews. How can I be better? Um, we had media training for the Olympics in 2002 because it was in America and I really took it seriously. No one else took it seriously, but I wanted to get better and all those things add up. So over time, you know, I build relationships. I build respect, not just on the mountain, but how I show up as a professional.

12:52And that allows me to build, you know, bigger and bigger contracts that get me to a point where I'm okay. Rich, she mentioned that you have to win first to get that type of acknowledgement in the money. And I know within your sport, you were saying that a lot of people don't make a lot of money. What do you see in Lindsey and then just in other athletes that you've worked with to where you're able to make that transition to not just the player who shows up and isn't ready for the media interviews to what Lindsey has done? Yeah, I mean, it's interesting because some Olympic athletes that even succeed at the highest level don't even go on to make real money or build a real business for themselves.

13:36And in most cases, winning will translate into some version of that. But I think Lindsay is an anomaly. I think you've become synonymous with like a successful Olympic athlete cross sport, winter, summer. And that is a testament to you. A lot of it, and I think sometimes people kind of gloss over this, is like this level of likability, like true likability. And you see when an individual has a relationship with a brand, when it really connects and works, it's not always the most famous person in the world. But it's somebody that connects with a consumer because of their likability. And then you couple that with like her curiosity.

14:15And she's smart. You know, like being a businesswoman, you have to have a level of understanding that no one in your team can teach you. You have to have that instinctually. And I've always known that about Lindsay and talking to her. She has the instinct of any entrepreneur, anyone successful. And then you couple that with winning at the highest level. You know, that's really like a rare error to be in. So, Lindsay, you've started. Thank you for the show. So, Lindsay, now we're at the place where you're making money, you're winning. What is your relationship with money at that point? I mean, I always felt like my performance will result in getting the money that I'm looking for.

15:00I always put my performance first. And I think at certain moments when I got bigger contracts, when I would win, I'm like, oh, yeah, okay. Well, I'm telling the numbers in my head. I'm like, okay, okay. Maybe I can get a new car. You know, like I think about things in the sense of like that's a momentary reward, but not in the sense of I have to win because I have to get money. And I did need money, you know, in the beginning part of my career. But again, like I prioritize the winning. I won and then the money followed. And I think that's an important distinction. Like I said, a lot of people are asking me, you know, why don't I have these big deals?

15:40Why don't I have the magazine covers? And it's like, you have to win first, you have to put in the work and then those things will come. You have to build it over time. I think everyone wants a quick fix. How do I get a quick contract? It's like, that's not how it works. My contracts, you know, I'm 20 plus years with Red Bull and Under Armour and Rolex and these people that have supported me forever. And that's a long-term build. It's, it's not, I'm looking for a one-year deal with a lot of zeros behind it. I'm looking for a 20 year deal, 30 years, lifetime deal. deal. You're a very humble person.

16:16I've realized that about you. And I think that's another reason why, you know, people gravitate towards you. You talked a little bit about like some of the guilt you may have felt in having to disrupt your family's life in some way to follow your dreams. What about when you achieve that success and you start making money and you're now somebody that people know all over the world. Is there a bit of this like discomfort in being that person within your family and to your friends and knowing that you've changed and not understanding how people may be looking at you or how you deal with people now that you're so famous and so recognized?

16:54I do think there's a bit of a disconnect. And it's with my family and but also my friends. And I don't have that many friends. I have a very tight circle, but it's because they understand me as a person, who I am, and what I do and what I've done has nothing to do with our relationship. But just people don't understand, and it's really hard to explain the pressures that you feel as an athlete, as a businesswoman, and everyone says, oh, you have enough money. You've been so successful. Why don't you just chill out? I'm like, that's not how I'm wired. And I'm a worker. I like working and it's I'm not working for money.

17:37I'm working for me. And I don't think people really understand that. And my my family, like I love my family. My siblings don't treat me any different. And that's why, like, we're still really close. You know, they came over for the Fourth of July and we're barbecuing. And, you know, I live in a great house, but it's not something that we really talk about, you know, And everyone contributes in my family. I don't pay for things for my family. They all come on their own free will or their own money. But they understand what I'm contributing and I understand what they're contributing. And so there's no tension in that way.

18:18But at the same time, again, understanding my life in general is just really overwhelming to a lot of people to understand. And there's a small group of people that do really get it, which is probably where friends. Yep. You said, I'm not doing this for the money. I'm doing this for me. That's got to be like the gym mental wealth quote. We got to like write that down somewhere. But I think it really embodies what mental wealth is of the why are you doing this? You're doing it because you love it. Yeah. So as you think about your retirement, the injuries, all of that, and you've come back, you're healing now.

18:56how do you do that? And then when you think of your identity being tied to that, money is being tied to all of this. How are we managing it? It's a lot. It's amazing to even think of and to see you sitting here smiling. You're giving me so much joy because I can see how much you love it. Thanks. Yeah. I mean, I think that's one thing that people don't really understand about me. And on the comeback, they're like, why are you doing this? This doesn't make any sense. I'm like, no, I love it. I love what I do. I make decisions based on what gives me joy in life. And I do find joy in working hard.

19:33Like I love going to the gym. It really makes me mentally and physically well. And so working hard enough to get back to number one in the world wasn't a problem for me. it was more could I physically do it because of my knee and my injuries but I've never felt like my injuries were a hindrance or it's like I pay I do pay a huge price for doing what I love to do but I don't feel like I have you know I feel like it's kind of a part of the job and you have to love all of the aspects of your job you know there's a lot of risk in downhill skiing it's a very dangerous sport. I understand that. And that's part of it.

20:16And that's also why I love it. And again, it's like, no, I can't really explain it to people and it's hard to understand, but everything I do is based on my passion and love for, for what I do and working hard in all aspects of my life is also something that gives me passion, not just ski racing. But I will say, I definitely, when I retired the first time, I'm not a skier. I'm Lindsay, and I love to ski. But it's a very, there's two different aspects of me. I'm not, my identity isn't tied to ski racing. And I think for me that was a really important distinction to make. But skiing has filled up so much of who you are, right?

20:57I always talk about this with athletes. You know, I represent an athlete who's towards the end of his career. and I never have to retire if I don't want to. I don't see you retiring anytime soon. He has to retire at some point. And no matter how much money he has or how much money you have, that can't, for some people, fill that void. And you've built this incredible career off the mountain, and you'll walk into that when you do stop. But how scary is that to think about? And did that play a part or come up more so than ever when you're laying there emotionally, physically, obviously you were hurting.

21:37But the idea that you may not be able to do this again, how scary is that for you? And do you think you could fill that void with something else? I don't think you ever fill the void. I think you find other things that you're passionate about that you enjoy doing in your life. but there'll, there'll be nothing that's even close to the same as performing under pressure, you know, when the world is watching and, you know, when it really counts, like standing in the starting gate at the Olympics, there's nothing that I will ever do in life. That's anywhere close to that. And it's hard because interestingly, you build a skillset.

22:13I worked my whole life to build a skillset and managing pressure and, and performing under pressure, all of those things I've become very good at, I don't really, I won't be able to use them anymore. Like I have a whole number one in the world's bucket of skills that I'll never be able to use. And so it's, it's really weird. And it's an interesting transition. I think I figured it out over time when I, when I retired the first time. And I, I think it was more of processing myself and, and what I wanted out of life. And, you know, again, like, What do I feel passionate about? What do I enjoy doing?

22:52And so when I crashed again, it wasn't like I'm scared of what's going to happen. I know what's going to happen. I did it for six years, and I had an amazing life, and I love it. But what bothered me the most is, like, I was number one in the world. So, I mean, I guess you could say I went down at number one, but it's not the way I want to end my career. But as a lot of athletes have experienced, oftentimes you don't get to end the way you want to. I wanted a storybook ending, but I don't know if that's going to happen. Probably not. But I accept that. And that's what we do as athletes. That's the risk we take.

23:29And I'm happy with that no matter what. I think not just athletes, but everybody. Sometimes the life you've pictured in your head, it does not turn out. The life I thought I was going to have at 20 versus now, you're like, okay. But what I think is the key factor to still finding joy in the pivot is resilience. It's the resilience. It's the, okay, I'm not that person anymore. What version of me will be next? So when you think of that in the version of you that is next, that when you retired the last time versus the person you are now, what's fueling your joy? And then on top of that, how are we using money to help fuel all of that, to pay for it?

24:09Well, things like going to South Africa, like I think those experiences in life I haven't done that much of. You know, I was so focused on skiing and it takes up so much of your time and energy. I really haven't traveled the world outside of mountains and hotels. And I think with my injury, you know, I always look for positives. Like, what can I find that's positive, this shitty situation? And I would never have gone to South Africa. I would have lived a totally different life had I not crashed in the Olympics. And so I'm looking at it as, okay, what is this teaching me? It's teaching me to slow down and to experience more.

24:48And I've really leaned into that, and I need money to be able to do that. So I'm lucky that, you know, I've lived my life in a way that I've been responsible, made good investments, and I don't have to work anymore. And that will never happen. I will always be working. But I do want to enjoy those experiences. I want to live in the moment and travel and enjoy. And I think I can manage that and working at the same time. But I'll find my way. Like, that's one thing I'm never worried about. You know, it's like you said, resilience. You just have to have the right attitude. And it's all about perspective.

25:27How you view things makes all the difference. You could wake up and say, oh, my life is shit. I can't walk. I'm in a wheelchair. What am I going to do with myself? Or you can say, what can I learn from this? What can this do to make me move forward in my life? And I definitely have learned a lot. And I am a better person. I'm not, I wasn't entirely happy being in a wheelchair. But now, you know, I'm in a great place. And I wouldn't be here if I hadn't, I've had that injury. But I bet you learned lessons in that wheelchair. Oh, yeah. I learned not to run into doorways. Okay, here we go. I spent a lot of money fixing my house.

26:05because I ran right into those doorways so often. You also were like instantly publicly very vulnerable afterwards, which knowing you, I wasn't surprised, but I also was surprised a bit because it felt like you deserved to be completely in your own world if you needed to at that point. But as someone that cared about you, it was almost comforting to see you talk about what you were going through and allow people to understand that like you were going to be okay. Cause I remember I texted you, um, after your ACL before you had, um, you know, the second injury and you responded fairly quickly. And I was almost like, wow, I just had assumed that like, maybe you had gone off the grid, but it felt like you were okay.