From Classical Percussionist to £20M Immersive Empire: Eddy Hackett's Bootstrapped Business Story | Brave Bold Brilliant

0:02Creating connections between people, allowing opportunities for people to express themselves, both consumers, performers, allowing people to feel like the stories that are being told are stories that connect and resonate with them and help them to understand themselves better and understand the world more. All of that, I think, it means to me businesses that kind of intersect all of those in a very kind of elegant, authentic way.

0:32I'm here today with Eddie Hackett. Now, Eddie is the co-founder and executive producer of The Lost Estate. Welcome, Eddie. How are you? I'm very well today. Thank you so much for having me on. I really appreciate it. Looking forward to the conversation. Well, listen, we are going to have such an interesting chat, Eddie, because talk about transitioning, talk about reinvention. I mean, you have absolutely nailed that because here we are, And we're going to be talking about how you go from being a classical percussionist, a musician, to having created a 20 million pound business with the Lost Estate.

1:10So what how did you get into that? That's quite quite a journey you've been on, Eddie. Talk us through it. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you very much. I mean, the honest answer to the to the question is really muddling through. and it's like one foot in front of the other. I have to say there was no kind of grand plan. So I wish I could be able to say I had this like laser focused vision and I pursued it day in, day out and got to there. I think oftentimes, you know, there's kind of two paths that people tend to trod on. One of them is the, you know, I manifested this for myself. I had a clear vision and I just went for it.

1:51I think the other path is really about being naive and, dare I say, being a kind of dreamer and doing often like daft, crazy, silly things that take you, as I said, like from one place to the other simply by putting one foot in front of the other. So that's the kind of like the sort of top line kind of honest answer. But how I actually did it in terms of the granular detail at all. So, yeah, my background is as a classical musician. So I went to the Royal Academy of Music and I went to the Manhattan School of Music. So I did my bachelor's in London at the Royal Academy. I did my master's in New York at the Manhattan School of Music.

2:35I my dream was to be the principal percussionist of the London Philharmonic Orchestra that was my goal and it really I went to music college I started percussion relatively late so I was about 15 when I started playing the drums before that I I was a I was a kind of brick pop kid so I had played guitar in Oasis cover bands and you know sang terrible songs and all the rest of it so that was my that was my kind of background i played bagpipes for a while and so very eclectic very very random but always just doing it for fun and um i got into percussion because my um my school wind band needed someone to smack the bass drum and i just started playing drums and i managed to pick it up quite quickly and i was asked to play bass drum with the wind band and basically just loved it and then very very quickly within i would say the space of about 18 months, two years, just got very, just, just very quickly through being completely obsessive about percussion, just got really good at it, got to the stage where I had two options.

3:42So when I was applying for university, I was really into science and astrophysics, to be precise. So I applied to, got into a bunch of courses to do astrophysics. And then kind of just as a punt, really, I was like, I'm going to give this music thing a go. And there was three places in the UK at the time that did a foundation course so a pre-degree course um because you know most classical musicians it's a really it's a really elite industry and a lot of people start when they're very very young you know cattle players start when they're three four five years old so i was relatively late you know there's lots of stuff that i needed to catch up in and i didn't want to go straight to a degree course so there were three options um one of them was the academy i got into the academy, did this one year foundation course, did my bachelor's.

4:32So yeah, came out of training. I was very lucky, very quickly to get some incredible opportunities. And, you know, in my career, I played with over 30 professional orchestras. I played a lot with the London Philharmonic Orchestra. I did play principal percussion with them. Wasn't my job. I was doing it as a guest principal, but I did play principal percussion with them. I played a lot with the Royal Opera House. I was doing lots of tours. So I toured all around, you know, America, the Far East, Russia, Europe. I did a lot of West End. I did sessions. You know, I played on the soundtrack to The Hobbit, for example, you know, recorded a lot at Abbey Road.

5:13And what I would basically say is my link into becoming an entrepreneur is that as a freelance percussionist, which is what I was you're running your own business so the foundations are there already you've got this idea of um in order to be really successful like the the thing you have to strive for is being exceptional at what you do so the quality levels and being really high quality at percussion that was like fundamentally you that's the thing you have to hit but then there's a sense that as a freelancer your network and your relationships are the thing that you have So it's this mixture of like your reputation and your relationships and they come together.

5:56And I suppose I was really aware at a very early age about, you know, just what networking looked like and reaching out to new contacts, but also being aware that the thing that you need to do is like build your network and build, I suppose, like repeat custom. Wow. Well, you know what I think? I mean, huge congratulations on making that transition. But what I love about this is that it wasn't a straight line, you know, because I think so often you're right. You alluded to it. You know, we have a plan. We have a vision and we kind of manifest it and we take loads of action and we're laser like focused on the end result.

6:33Whereas actually life and business and careers are often a little bit squiggly, shall we say, you know, a little bit twist and turns along the way. And opportunities can actually come up when you don't necessarily expect them to. But the key is to decide, isn't it? Is this something that I want to throw myself into and give it a go? Or actually, do I just pass and let it go by? And I think the sign of a great entrepreneur, which you are, as well as being an amazing musician, of course, is entrepreneurs spot opportunities. they take risks they're prepared to do what maybe 90 percent of people are not prepared to do in order to you know to build a business etc and I think a lot of your journey incorporates those elements as well from what you've just described so Eddie obviously exciting plans ahead you know and I think that sensible rollout and growth that you've just described there is absolutely spot on And hey, if things actually go better than you anticipate, you can always speed up as you see the opportunities come.

7:42So I think that's really important. Now, as a business owner and founder, you pretty much bootstrap the business in order to get yourself going. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs do that. What do you think that made you do differently versus maybe a startup that might have gone for quite significant investment and external capital to help them grow? How has the bootstrapping aspect made you set the business up differently? And what has it helped you with, do you think, as business leaders? Yeah, yeah, great. So, yes, we bootstrapped the business actually all the way up to the end of last year.

8:23So at the end of last year, we took on our first bit of investment. Actually, it was a piece of strategic investment. Our non-executive director is a guy called Mark Fisher, who was the co-founder of Merlin Entertainment. They were the guys that owned All in the Nine. Yes, you probably know them well. So he's our non-exec. So he came on board as a minority investor, as did Nick McKenzie, who's the CEO of Green. Oh, I know Nick. Nick. I know Nick. That's funny. Yeah. Yeah, fantastic. So Nick and Fish came into the business as minority investors. So, you know, sub 10 percent. And it was as much a strategic investment, you know, for them as people as obviously it was for the capital.

9:11And I would say that, you know, bootstrapping has its pros and cons. The massive pro, obviously, is A, the flexibility and the kind of agility you can have as a business where you as the founders are like the single kind of gatekeepers and decision makers in the business. It also, you know, you really have to approach the business in an incredibly lean and resourceful way. And I do think in our business, you know, as creators, creativity, I think, is this combination of being, you know, incredibly resourceful. So, you know, doing amazing things with the limited resources that you have. But also, you're very kind of aware of your needs and resources.

10:02so when we were growing the business you know we we we had to simply restrict at all costs you know things like headcount and posh fancy offices and i mean you know for a long time we were just working on um trestle tables um you know for a long our office for the first probably three or four years of the business was um was a table at the panquatidia in london bridge and you know we went to the panquatidia in london bridge because it was like the local station to all of us and they never used to take your order and there's a plug point there so we can plug in our laptops they left us alone the whole day you know we can get lunch so it it is really fantastic from that perspective what i would say and this is um you know one of my great pieces of advice um for founders now is that the the business now you know as we expand we really realize that we need to properly capitalise the business and you know i'm in the process of um of looking for other investors into the business to help us on this growth journey and i suppose i i would definitely say that you should start that capital raising journey well before you ever need to do it um and and also that um often the best time to capitalize your business properly is the time and then you release the money.

11:27Because you want to be seeking capital when the business is at its most strong. And, you know, if you're able to present a business that's like bootstrapped and profitable and all the rest of it, you know, it's the right time to do that. So we're looking at investing, sorry, raising investments in the business. And we do realize that in order to both give ourselves headroom, considering these really exceptionally difficult market conditions that we're trading in. But also just because, you know, it's an unpredictable world. As you said, the growth journey, I can't remember the word. Squiggly. Squiggly.

12:09So, yeah, that's where we're at right now. I would definitely say a big piece of advice is just carefully consider the right moment to start capitalizing your business. And often it's well before you actually leave. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I work with a lot of founders. I actually do a lot of mergers and acquisitions and have done in my corporate life as well. And I agree. It's almost start with the end in mind and work backwards, but give yourself enough time so that you're not rushing it. And like I say, because, you know, it's like it's a negotiation at the end of the day because you'll be giving something away in terms of equity normally.

12:41And I think sometimes if you're desperate for the cash, you end up giving away too much equity too soon. And that that can be a danger as well. So but it's great. It's great that you've got Mark Fisher and Nick McKenzie with you because both, you know, big hitters, credible, bring the brand, bring the experience. And I think that's another another lesson for founders that are looking to raise capital. Don't just think about the money. Think about who you're getting in bed with and actually what skills, what, you know, can they bring what can they bring their network? What is it that actually people bring more than just cash?

13:12Because cash is one thing. But actually, it's often those other elements that's really where the value and the gold sits. So I think that's it. That's yeah. And actually, I would just add one other thing onto that as well, which is that, yes, you know, the strategic side to the investor is really, really important. The other side is what I would call the emotional side to the investor. You know, with Nick and Fish, I feel that they are emotional investors and we're looking for emotional investors. And what I mean by that is those are people who are who just love the business. They believe in the business.

13:48They believe in us as founders. So yes, it's about the skills and the network and the experience that the investors themselves can bring. But it's also like their emotional connection to you and the business. And all of that has to be this kind of, in an ideal world, this perfect symmetry of like capital and strategy and emotion. And it comes together in this wonderful package. And I would say that Nick and Fish, in our instance, like we're blessed to be working with them. They're absolutely the perfect fish. Yeah, no, fantastic. And that's right. And it's like building a team, you know, it's the culture who you hire, you know, but especially when you're when you've got, you know, you've got a shareholders agreement that that binds you together.

14:27You want to make sure that you're going to get along. You don't have to agree on everything, but you want to get along and enjoy, you know, being in business together and on all the highs and the lows, especially when the times are tough, because that can really stress, stretch people's kind of personality profile sometimes when under pressure. so that's great we should get Mark and Nick on the podcast actually we should do that yeah they would love it I'm sure if you ever wanted to they would love to come on they're also both individually and together because they've worked together at Merlin for quite a long time they've just got all the amazing war stories which is an incredible wealth yeah we should make that happen let's do that Eddie that would be amazing yeah because the more you know as I say Brave Bob Brilliant is all about sharing real life business journeys business stories but not just that actually human human stories you know and and the highs and the lows and it is always amazing to get a perspective from larger organizations smaller mid-sized entrepreneurs because at the end of the day you know business isn't easy but life life is important we've got to enjoy the ride along the way and I think sometimes we can get too wrapped up in you know what's not really important and so to keep it real is is is great i think so yeah we'll definitely make that happen so i've got as we're talking about money i've got one more question before we're going to come towards the close so if someone gave you a million quid eddie today and it might be you might need more than that so you know i know i don't know what your number is but you might need more than that but if someone gave you a million today to start again would you do anything differently yeah i would say the one big thing that i think we would do differently um at the business i think is about brand so what we i think are are i guess like what we're what we're starting to feel now is in this climate where we've you You know, you've got challenging economic conditions, challenging kind of geopolitical environments that the people are living within.

16:42I mentioned previously the idea of a discretionary purchase on a special occasion, something that people have kind of been trained to cut back on. What that basically means is people are going out fewer times, but they're spending more than they go out. and I believe that the natural kind of logical conclusion to that is you're going to spend that hard-earned cash on something that you know and trust and believe in and at the heart of that I think is brands the brand promise the brand equity the brand values and what we've done at the Lost Estate is over the years we've we've just I say just but the strategy was always to market the child brand you know we were doing shorter runs um of you know you know we were a smaller business particularly in the first two thirds of our life and we never needed to talk about the lost estate we just needed to talk about the product that was right there and it was having a limited run and was available uh right now with you know highly limited stock

17:49so before we continue i want to speak directly to those of you who are listening and thinking i know i'm capable of more but i need structure i need some help because here's what i've actually learned after gosh more than three decades in business you know ambition without clarity creates frustration. And motivation without structure, it really does fade very, very fast. So that's exactly why we created Rise Academy. And Rise Academy, it's not theory. It isn't fluffy motivation, although you will be motivated. And it certainly isn't another online course that you never finish. It's actually a fully structured growth environment for ambitious entrepreneurs, leaders and founders who absolutely are ready to do all of these things, sharpen their strategy, elevate their leadership, increase revenue with intention and build businesses that actually support the life that they want.

18:55And inside Rise Academy, we focus on the foundations most people skip, leading yourself, leading your teams and leading the business. It's about clarity, standards, decision making, commercial intelligence and execution. Because scaling, it really isn't about doing more. It's actually about doing the right things and doing the things right consistently. So if you're serious about stepping up into your next level of your leadership, your business life, and not just consuming content, but actually implementing it, then Rise Academy was absolutely built for you. So you can find all the details on our website.

19:36Go to www.brave-bold-brilliant.com. And now, let's get back to the show.

19:47Where I think we're at now is that people believe in brands and they believe in the brand story and what the brand, what the kind of identity of the brand means to them. I think people, you know, you see this a lot of like health and fitness brands, that people's identity gets caught up like in the brand. I mean, Gymshark is a perfect example of that, right? You know, Gymshark is a lifestyle to many people as much as it is like a piece of clothing. So the big thing that I would do differently is something that we're now focused really heavily on in 2026. And you'll start to see a lot of this over the second half of 2026 is bringing to life the top brands.

20:27So bringing to life the loss of state. And the Lost Estate being this incredible place that builds these extraordinary worlds made of art, filled with hospitality, incredible design and cosplay and all the rest of it. And it's a place that people can go to to celebrate the key special occasions in their life in this extraordinary, artistic, humane, interesting way. so if I had to do anything differently over the course of the Lost States journey it would be like building that brand and telling that story from day one and you're right I think people do business with those they know, like and trust and people buy from brands that they know, like and trust and they've got an affinity and an emotional connection and I think you've got a great opportunity because what you do is very human to human and I think that's becoming, ironically the new currency in the world of digital and tech, which is a bizarre thing to say, but I see it.

21:31Yeah, the interesting point on that, because you kind of hit the nail on the head there, is that we're going to be in a place towards the end of 2026 where AI will be able to replicate UGC. So whereas previously UGC and UGC content was exactly the thing that kind of separated you know digital artificial from like real human that's going to be indistinguishable towards the end of this year so i spoke previously in in a conversation about like being a creator-led brand so the idea of like what is the thing that only you can do that is going to be your currency and your brand in the future so what i would be you know encouraging your listeners to consider is when you're building your brand, like what is the thing that's completely authentic and quintessentially you?

22:24What is the thing that only you can do? What is that story? What is that approach? What is that product? What is, you know, whatever it is, that's the thing that you need to lean into and focus. And all of the content that you create needs to be based on, like what is this amazing thing that essentially, because it's the thing that only you can do, allows you to build a unique fan base that is, you know, completely bespoke to you, which, sure, you can then start to leverage and start to monetise, but fundamentally, you have to build this connection between you and your audience based on this incredibly unique thing.

23:00Yeah, great advice that is, Eddie, and yeah, I totally agree with you. So exciting year ahead, exciting journey, and, you know, you talked about the advice that you've shared, and you've done absolutely a phenomenal job in this conversation, Eddie, in terms of sharing your journey, but also through that jam-packed full of advice for others that may be also you know going through similar scale-up scenarios so when you look back through your career and it could be as a percussionist and a musician it could be in the business world or personally can you think of the best piece of advice that you've received yeah so i i again there's probably people in in at work who are fed up with me talking about this but the single piece of advice i'm talking about to people across the years is my teacher when I was at the Manhattan School of Music, he's an amazing percussionist called Chris Lamb.

23:53He's the principal percussionist of the New York Philharmonic Orchestra, you know, widely regarded as like one of the greatest percussionists of all time. And he had these two unbelievably kind of obscure bits of advice that he just repeated all the time and were things that he said it would take you years to understand what they mean but when you understand what they mean you'll totally get it. So he used to say Eddie you've got to be a racehorse and he used to say Eddie you have to pass through the details. So those two bits of advice at the tummy I think that often perplexed me he used to say Eddie you've got to have that racehorse mentality and like you know I'd be playing something i'd be getting bogged down what i'm doing and you just need to pass through details if you were to describe this year in one word what would it be and why challenging challenging yeah for the reasons that i've previously mentioned we're we're we're in uncertain times where for consumer businesses um you know there's a huge wave of um headwinds that are against us just through the setup of everything from national assurance, minimum wage rises, business rates, all of the kind of fundamental building blocks that the business is required to be in a great place.

25:26But also coupled with the leisure hospitality sector is in a really challenging environment. So I would say challenging. The caveat is, I would say that we are, I still do believe in the idea of human connection being absolutely essential and critical to people's lives. And even more so as we go forward in this kind of like new dawn of like AI and AGI, imminently coming world that we live in people are gonna they need experiences and places and people that you know connect them to the human experience so I have hope and optimism that in amongst these very challenging market conditions people making that kind of work will be successful yeah 100 % and you're right sometimes when the chips are down actually ends up being the time when we grow the most and we become more relevant.

26:29And so I think it's going to be... Grow through challenge. Yeah, definitely. Grow through challenge. Yes, exactly. So what do they say? Grow through it. Don't just go through it. Grow through it. Something like that. Excellent. So it's going to be an interesting road ahead, but an exciting one. And there'll be twists and turns, Eddie, for sure. And, you know, you're a musician. so music, energy bringing all of that to everything you do every single day is absolutely critical and we are looking to have a fabulous playlist on Spotify all our wonderful guests we always ask them what's a favourite song and artist that we can add to our playlist so what would yours be Eddie?

27:10Mine would be Fast Car by Tracy Chatman Yes what a classic and you know we've not had that it's an amazing song i think it's it's not only it's an incredible song um it's got an incredible story behind it as well and tracy chapman like her her rise to fame was also very there's a there's many layers to that song been really incredible um if you haven't already checked it out there's an incredible um podcast called soul music on bbc and there's a really amazing episodes on the fast car trace channel which is very inspiring to listen to excellent we'll add that in as well so and before adi i'm going to ask you a last question but where can people find you where can they kind of check out check you out personally but also you know if they want to get involved in lost estate maybe as an investor or they want to actually get tickets and enjoy an experience with you how can people find you yes cool so the lost estate the best place to go is the lost estate dot com um that's our our new central uh website where all of the shows will cascade from and then in terms of finding me um i'm you know relatively active on linkedin so eddie hackett eddie with a y um hackett with two t's find me on there i'm i always love to connect with new people and have really interesting conversations so yeah come hit me up excellent that's great so last question what does brave bold brilliant mean to you yeah i think brave bold brilliant brilliant to me um is about creating work that's um both authentic to yourself but also is about creating work that kind of contributes to um connection and humanity and um creativity and you know bringing people together ultimately i really believe in this idea of like business having purpose um and you know sometimes businesses that purpose can be philanthropic it can be purely commercial i feel like the best businesses are businesses that kind of um intersect all of that wonderful commercial businesses that provide um you know they contribute to economies that provide jobs that contribute to the taxes and you know the really important like finance structures that underpin our country the businesses that support people's growth you know professionally they're businesses that may have an element of like philanthropy to that whether that's like in a commercial sense whether that's you know giving time or resources to people and then ultimately businesses that contribute to um what it means to to be human live in human experience as i said in a ever more digital world um creating connections between people um allowing opportunities for people to express themselves both consumers performers allowing people to feel like um the stories that are being told are stories that connect and resonate with them and help them to understand themselves better and understand the world more and so yeah all of that I think it means to me businesses that kind of intersect all of those in a very kind of elegant authentic way fantastic what a great way to end Eddie I've really loved our conversation I'm so excited for everything you've achieved already but all the everything that's to come with the lost estate so yeah can't can't wait let's keep in touch and let's just you know go for it make this year amazing yeah thank you so much for having me on I'm yeah humbled and and you know really delighted to have shared the lost estate story live my own story and and obviously just like wishing all the best to all your listeners any founders out there who might be early stage late stage you know it's a wild wonderful exhilarating ride and it can often feel lonely at times and that's what's incredible about a podcast like this is you build a community you connect people together and the more brilliant entrepreneurs we have in our society the better society it is so it's a really amazing thing that you're doing congratulations oh thank you Eddie perfectly said what a fabulous episode with the wonderful Eddie Hackett and what really struck me from chatting with Eddie was how he has gone from being a classical percussionist to actually being a co-founder of The Lost Estate.

32:00So what a journey that has been for Eddie, you know, to really shift from being an incredible musician into business, being an entrepreneur. But actually what really struck me as well was how they've actually created a very unique proposition in the market. You know, we're talking about a whole theatre experience, which is so, so different. and actually, you know, that whole immersive experience, you know, when you walk into a production at the Lost Estate, you feel like you're being taken back into the world of where that play is being staged. So it's a fully, fully immersive experience and no one else is doing that in the market really, you know, and they started that business, the co-founders of which Eddie is one, started the business, you know, with zero and they bootstrapped it themselves.

32:55in order to grow it. And it's now turning over 20 million pounds in revenue. That is phenomenal from a standing start of zero. And actually to build something new and unique, it takes guts, it takes resilience, it takes having a big vision, and it takes patience. But these are the qualities of being brave to make the move in the first place, being bold to create the impact. And of course, the brilliance is the experience that you know people that go and enjoy the show really feel and of course throughout all of that you know Eddie's leadership journey has also been an interesting one how he's developed as a person so if you enjoyed the episode with Eddie please do you know share it with your friends share it with colleagues with fellow business people that can really learn something about how to actually shift from being an expert in one field to becoming a business founder that not only creates a unique experience in the market, but actually does it in a way that creates sustainable growth and profitability.

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34:45You're going to find loads of resources on there that's going to help you with your leadership journey and with the businesses that you're trying to scale up and grow. So take care everyone and remember there are no limits to your growth but it is by being brave and bold that you're going to unlock your brilliance.