From Law to the BBC: How Sian Lloyd Reinvented Her Career and Became a Top Broadcaster

0:01So it's largely a case of having experience, being as prepared as you can, but also be willing that sometimes you are going to make a mistake and it's how you respond to that at the end of the day that's so important. So today we are excited to welcome Sian Lloyd, a highly respected Welsh television news presenter, journalist and former solicitor. Now, with over 20 years in journalism, Sian has become a familiar and love face on BBC Wales Today, BBC Breakfast and Crime Watch, alongside appearances on S4C programmes, as well as features on Channel 5. Now, Sian's career journey from law to broadcasting, it really demonstrates her passion for storytelling and her commitment to connecting with audiences across television, radio and live events.

0:59Now, beyond screen, she supports several charities. She mentors young professionals and advocates work life balance for those navigating demanding careers. so in this interview we'll explore Sian's personal and professional journey we're going to uncover her inspirations and learn the lessons that she's gathered while reporting on some of the UK's most high profile news stories so let's get into the episode so welcome to Breakboard Brilliant Sian nice to have you with us well thank you very much for inviting me honestly it's been i've been looking forward to this for a very long time been a couple of months that we first spoke and um and here we are absolutely well busy people and i guess the summer as well so it's lovely to actually meet you now in person i know i know we're going to talk about all things tv we're going to talk all about things business because you're doing a huge amount at the moment so obviously you're very well known from being on tv for many many years right yeah 30 years now 30 years yeah I know it's incredible to think about it things have changed over that time as well in terms of technology but yeah 30 year career in journalism this year actually amazing but you didn't start out in journalism did you no I started out in law that's what I read my degree in law degree and I qualified as a solicitor well trained as a solicitor certainly so I did the postgraduate the law society finals as it was in those days and two years articles with a corporate law firm in London and six months in their Hong Kong office so we're going back a long time now Jeanette when I was in school I didn't really know what I wanted to do but I had a passion for the news uh loved watching all the programs from John Craven's news round even you know as a child grew up with that but I think at the time journalism in terms of career progression there wasn't so much information around certainly growing up in Wrexham as I did I didn't really know anybody in journalism nobody in my family did and there wasn't an awful lot of career advice at the time so thinking about what what was I going to do when I grew up didn't really know my dad said well why don't you become a lawyer so I thought well why did I become a lawyer and actually the law degree I loved was absolutely fascinating and did enjoy my time as well training in the law firm but it was at that time I thought I'm not sure if this is what I see as my long-term career so going back now to the early 90s it was really exciting took so much learning from those years especially having the international experience as well working in the Hong Kong office of the law firm which was a much smaller setup but really interesting to be in Hong Kong which was actually before the handover as well at that time a big cultural shock for me I guess being from Wrexham to working in the Far East absolutely loved it but when I came back and finished off my training I think that's when I decided looking at my long term future and either become a solicitor or perhaps I'll follow my dream and now is the time to become a journalist.

4:24So that's what I did. So that first move into journalism how did you break in because I'd imagined back then well even now I mean it's competitive it's you know there's a lot of people trying to make a move into it and when you switch industries as well which I've done as well over a few times in my career how did you get a lucky break or was it just grinding it out and just knocking on doors and saying, come on, I'm here, I want to get into journalism. How did it work out? Well, I moved back home, back to Wrexham, and I did get some work experience at the local commercial radio station. And from that, they offered me a job because they were pretty short-staffed.

5:02It was very much starting at the bottom, helping out with anything that I could. and they put me on the MCTJ journalism course one day a week at the local tech in Wrexham so after doing my degree in the postgraduate in law effectively went back to school one day a week to get the journalism qualification and it was a great learning ground I was very lucky that there were people there who were very generous they were very very experienced very small team so you did have to roll your sleeves up and get involved and that really appealed to me because I liked working in a team and they were very generous with the advice that they provided as well so I learned very quickly and got a lot of experience actually through doing the job in the workplace which was was very very interesting to have so perhaps from having that academic background with law to actually now being in a job where very practical really journalism and you do learn as you go along Of course, there are many degrees now in journalism, postgraduate degrees in journalism as well.

6:10But, you know, we're going back quite a long time now. And that's the way that I learned truly on the job. Yeah. And the shift from radio to TV then, because that's quite, again, another move, isn't it? Instead of being the voice, you're also the face. Was that a conscious choice for you, Sian, or did that just evolve? I think it evolved. It was a small setup, the commercial radio station. Absolutely loved it. But they were dealing in sort of very short, snappy news bulletins. And I felt that I wanted to learn more. So that's really where the jump into looking at TV journalism came in. because I thought well I've had some great experience here really work enjoyed working in the team but felt perhaps it was my time to spread my wings a little bit and you know I was interested in the visuals as well and tv journalism is different to radio journalism you know you're telling a story through a different medium because you're telling it through pictures as opposed to the voice and I absolutely love radio but also love tv and wanted to start learning about tv so And I think that's really where it came from, just a desire to learn more.

7:24Yeah, and I think it's funny because before we started pressing record, Luke, who was with us, amazing videographer who was helping us, you were saying, oh, what's it, a dirty tooth shot over my shoulder? And I was like sitting there going, oh my God, it's very technical. And Sian knows all of this, that you've learned your trade from being in it for so long, right? Yeah, absolutely. I started in production as well as being in front of the camera so really I have literally done every job in terms of TV journalism so I had no experience when I started in TV yes I knew how to put a story together for radio but I had no idea how TV worked so it was learning all over again and there is a lot involved in terms of the terminology people do talk sometimes in jargon and you get that in anything don't you and whichever sector you're in there's almost a different lingo attached to it and i suppose there is really with with radio you'd be talking about doing a radio two-way perhaps or a donut even whereas in tv you'd be perhaps talking about oh let's are we going to be on a mid shot we're going to be on tight we're on a wider we're on a dirty two shot you know are we doing the down the line here so it's all different lingo that actually now I enjoy explaining to other people who may be going to be in front of a camera being interviewed because demystifying the process can really help people and I learned about the process through doing the job really but again surrounded by people who are very generous with their time and learned a lot from picking it up you know working with experts at the end of the day and I think so many jobs involve that don't you as long as you want to listen and you are keen to learn you can learn so much just from people oh 100 and when you take us back to that very first time when you were actually in front of the camera you know was it terrifying was it that you were excited and you were totally cool what was it like that very first time because a lot of people have this fear of being in front of the camera or standing on a stage or public speaking I'm going to talk a little bit around how you help people in the organisations you work with today but take us back to that very first time was it nerve-wracking it was terrifying absolutely terrifying and it did come around really by chance because I was initially working when I moved over to the BBC so from commercial radio I didn't get a job in with tv straight away I had no experience at all on TV, so I was working in radio with the BBC, but an opportunity came up.

10:09They were trialling a new technology called Satellite News Gathering, which we all take for huge granted now that you can be live from wherever you are, wherever the story's happening, and you see journalists live from across the world, of course, including war zones, as we've seen more lately. But it was a new technology that was emerging back then, and they were trialing it out and I had the opportunity to to be part of of the trial but wasn't working in the medium so somebody thrust me a microphone in one hand and an earpiece in the other and I was told to to interview someone it was it we weren't going live luckily we weren't broadcasting to the nation it was just testing it out but that was my first experience and that was just terrifying but the first time that I presented a news bulletin was was an amazing experience looking back at it because it was yes very very scary because my main fear was would I you know make a mistake um but when you're in a supportive environment and you know I'd had some training so it wasn't as though I was just told to to sit down and get on with it so when you feel I think that you are comfortable as much as you can be in that situation then you just want to do the best that you can but you know as with many many people you do get that little voice saying what if we make a mistake and everybody's going to be watching including my mum yeah so the main thing was just to get through it clean as they say without any mistakes or hiccups but of course you never know what's going to happen in my television and over the years all sorts of things have happened because you're working with technology and technology can go wrong you're working with people and sometimes people can make a mistake we all do including presenters so it's largely a case of having experience being as prepared as you can but also be willing that sometimes you are going to make a mistake and it's how you respond to that at the end of the day that's so important and you're working in a team so you've got to get on with things yeah yeah so I mean there's a lot going on in people's head I think isn't it you know that little voice that gremlin that sometimes we have and say oh you're not good enough you're gonna get found out or you know whatever it may be yeah you label it imposter syndrome you know I think a lot of people have this fear of judgment fear of failure fear of missing saying things wrong as you say and how did you get over that I know you said you got the supportive team you had some training but was that there for a while for you you know that sort of come on deep breath yeah definitely absolutely I mean I think it never really goes away and I think in a way that's quite a good thing because you want to be aware that things can potentially go wrong that you can be going on air for a half hour program and it might not turn out as everybody expected because certainly in news something might happen in that half an hour you know and if there's a big story that breaks when you're on air then you're going to deal with that as part of the program so you're always looking ahead and I think that's really good training that I had over the years you know I started on the short or the tins so they would be just three minutes and your biggest concern is you've got to get everything in that three minutes and not go over or you're going to get chopped off because they're returning to another program but generally it's be having a sort of mechanism in place that if something's going to happen how are we going to deal with that so you have to really foresee quite a lot and realize there's something you might not be planning for that might happen while you're on air and that you've got to be able to cope with that but other people behind the scenes in the gallery they're aware of lots of other things happening so they're going to be giving you that information to which you then need to be able to react to and of course you're the person that the viewer at home is seeing they're not seeing everything that happens behind the scenes but you are very much part of a bigger team when you are in front of the camera and when you're behind the camera then you're realizing that you're part of the team with the person in front of the camera as well so having the knowledge of the production is really important I think as a presenter because if you can understand what everybody else in the team are doing and what their jobs are and how you fit in then I've always felt that that's when you can really have a great impact because you think well I can help them out in this way because they're making a call they're trying to get this guest i might need to conduct this interview i'm on at the moment for that bit longer time because i know they're trying to do something else behind the scenes so everything fits together as a jigsaw really lots of different parts to make a tv program work yeah so i mean it's it's not dissimilar to to business and life is it really at the end of the day you can have a plan the best laid plans but we know the plan never normally works out exactly as we want but having that ability and that I suppose this comes with confidence as well to be able to kind of quickly calibrate and go right okay this has happened I need to be able to deal with it in the moment and not always being able to go get frozen yeah I think that's a real talent but it probably comes with experience doesn't it I would have thought it does come with experience and that's what your role is as the presenter it is to be the front of house person effectively and it's a really privileged position to be you know you get to interview fantastic people with really interesting stories and sometimes you get to to travel to really exciting places on stories as well and then other times you just feel hugely privileged because you're speaking to somebody who's done something phenomenal or been through something absolutely phenomenal and they've decided to share their story with you so it can be a really really rewarding job but I think just dealing with a changing situation is something that you really do have to be prepared for definitely yeah I mean my career has been in the travel industry and you know totally different environment obviously but dealing with a 9-11 dealing with an ash cloud dealing with you know covid yeah or you know we've lost someone in a in a terrible accident in resort or someone's jumped off a balcony and you have to deal with you know so all the time and i always say when you're in resort it's not just about being on holiday and if you're a holiday rep back in the day you know actually they have to deal with a lot you know have to deal with anything that can happen at home can happen overseas and on holiday you have to be able to deal with that and sometimes it's really difficult situations you know that you have to be able to adapt so you're in the emergency room you've got i remember 9-11 aircrafts stuck all over the world first of all are our guests safe are our customers safe are our teams safe is anyone who was in new york you know all of this kind of stuff so it's totally different but that ability to keep calm yeah keep calm and kind of carry on yeah is is key and of course it's really interesting dynamic that you were explaining them because of course we were looking at it from being journalists and trying to find out what's happening in that type of situation yeah so that's where you're liaising then perhaps with comms teams to get the information out to a wider audience aren't you to be able to say well you know what we're doing as a company is x y and z and you know we're doing this because we're hoping to get to this solution and then obviously the journalists are there to reflect what the emerging story is and how it's developing to a wider audience so yeah it's really interesting to hear your perspective on it there yeah i know i've been through a few crises in my time that's for sure i personally and professionally

18:23if you're enjoying this conversation with sean lloyd make sure to subscribe to brave bold brilliant and it is by joining our community that you'll gain access to powerful conversations with leaders, innovators and entrepreneurs who they don't just talk about success, they absolutely live it. So subscribe now and keep learning how to lead with courage, clarity and confidence.

18:52So just in terms of the people you've worked with and the situations you've reported on or being in front of the camera what's the most impactful story that you've worked on can you think of I mean it's probably been loads over the years Sean but is there any any sort of standout where you think oh my god that was like really important or it was very meaningful or it was particularly difficult to deal with you know just to bring it to life a little bit because you've done so much yeah I suppose my career has developed from you know presenting those short bulletins to start with to presenting the national news here in Wales for many years and then moving on to sort of longer form documentaries and current affairs where you know you get the opportunity to dig a little bit deeper to do more of the investigative stories as well to then joining national news team and of course then being part of you know the national set of the senior correspondent covering Wales and then a different role as covering the Midlands so they were all quite different roles that carry different responsibilities as well as you know presenting breakfast news at the weekends from Salford and national programs like Crime Watch Roadshow so it's very difficult to sort of pluck out one thing I would hope that really on a day-to-day basis as journalists what we're hoping to do is always to make an impact and to have that connection with the audience that they will be learning something from whether you're doing a short one and a half minute news report or whether you're making a half hour an hour documentary that particularly them that they might also want to find out more as well from what you've been able to present in your report so in terms of making impact I don't know if I can pick out one story I suppose there are there've been experiences that I've particularly found rewarding perhaps personally or enjoyed because sometimes they're a lot of fun yeah I mean I remember we were challenged with technology going back to the London Olympics and in the run-up I don't know if you remember we had the torch relay around the UK and it went to all sorts of places and it was going to be going up with Val Snowden and that was going to be my job of live presenting that on the news channel literally all day from the start right through to actually Sir Chris Bonington taking the torch to the summit so we had helicopters up there were hundreds of people on the summit and in terms of you know broadcasting all day live from the highest peak in England and Wales on a technology firm yeah that's quite a headache that's a lot of planning for the team of which I don't understand a lot of that side of things but my role was obviously to cover the particular moment but also the run-up to it talking to people who were going to be there drawing out their stories about what it meant to them and it was a beautiful day I mean it could have been in cloud couldn't it yes it was in cloud but you could see for miles and it was just one of those days where everything seemed to go right which doesn't always happen and it was just an absolute joy because the pictures looked beautiful everybody had smiles on their faces now inside I was slightly terrified because I was on my spot with obviously a sheer drop on the side people in in gallery weren't going to know exactly where I was we had someone holding what looked like a giant coat hanger which apparently was involved in getting the signal there was a producer there obviously a camera crew were there and sound crew as well because you know we didn't know what was going to happen but I couldn't see what was happening lower down but the producer who was talking to me in my earpiece was in a satellite truck I think about four miles away that could see where the other cameras were so they had the whole picture and because I was looking just to an empty camera um but telling the nation what was happening so that's very much where the teamwork came in because she was telling me oh so Chris Bonington has just arrived now at this point so I was able to relay that although of course I couldn't actually see that happening so obviously trusting very much what I was being given as the information that was coming into me but it was quite momentous and that was just I think a great feeling at the end of it that we'd had some lovely stories technology worked and you felt that it was quite a moment that it was much part of a bigger event but it was it was a really nice positive new story so it was quite uplifting really no amazing I like you say what goes on behind the seeing is because someone watching that you know on the tv and seeing you you know present and talk about what's going on there's no idea you've got this army army of people and the whole team behind you yeah no because they can see what shots that uh they were getting from the camera on the helicopter they could see you know what shots the the camera crew sort of around the corner to where i was had got so and you know somebody's mixing all that in as perhaps i'm doing an interview with somebody and it comes together and you know that's how you make great television at the end of the day with everybody in the team playing their part and it is producing isn't it it's production um and it does involve an awful lot of planning uh but for the weather to play ball as well we couldn't have asked for any more on that day yeah very very lucky indeed absolutely yeah so so when you're in in front of the camera and you have spent you know an inordinate amount of your career in in front of the camera as well as behind on the radio side of things do you feel did you feel the pressure in terms of how you look how you dress how your makeup is and all of that side of it because I think there's even more pressure now with social media as well and but was that was that difficult or was that quite easy for you and you know the whole personal branding and image because people can be brutal aren't they let's be honest people can be really brutal and you are on the show you are you absolutely are I think yeah I mean everybody would I imagine would think a little bit about you know how do I look as a journalist I always I never felt any pressure to look a certain way however you know you need to look presentable because you're there to present the news and to tell the story and it's probably not to detract from that story and so be easy wouldn't it for somebody perhaps to latch on to something so yeah absolutely making sure that I popped into makeup to check that sort of my hair hadn't gone you know I don't know all over the place or and you know it's just the general things really to have a bit of dab a powder on the nose you know when I started we couldn't wear checked jackets or things with very narrow stripes or certain colors because of how technology was it could strobe it could cause literally just just issues like that so that's moved on and I think you know styles move on as well don't they because if you're out on location telling a story you you dress for the part and that's what I always tell people now with media training coaching the most important thing is that you feel comfortable because if you feel comfortable you're going to feel confident at the end of the day and if you're freezing because you've thought oh I you know I really love this coat but if that coat's not going to be warm enough for the situation and you're shivering you're going to be thinking about feeling cold as opposed to thinking about getting your message across and also you know if you are doing an interview out in a rural location you want to sort of be dressed for for your surroundings if you're in a studio it's a slightly more formal setup then you might be thinking about you know wearing a shirt or a blouse or something like that but ultimately and I think it was always the way with me if I I would always give a bit of thought about what I was going to be wearing at the start of the day or you know knowing where I was going to be going the next day and then just planning accordingly it's just always worth putting in a little bit of time about thinking what I'm going to wear and having perhaps a plan b as well because there's always the time you're going to throw coffee on something yeah absolutely so you've got you know there were sort of favorites that you'd go to a bit like anything like the sort of favorite little black dress or whatever you're going out to an event that you always knew would work and however you were feeling you'd always feel good in in that particular item and I think it's the same really when you're working in a visual medium as well it can be the same if you're presenting to an audience in a company or in a business if you're presenting to your colleagues if you're pitching for something if you're at a business expo it's feeling comfortable in what you're wearing and as well you know dressing to something that you feel yeah you know I'm not going to be worried about what I'm wearing today and that's just one less thing to think about yeah that's great advice actually because like you say whichever situation you're in whether you're in a business environment or you know you're in a social environment you want to feel good about yourself yeah absolutely it's if you feel if you feel good about yourself and that confidence then you can focus on what you're really there to do you know if you're presenting a news bulletin you're there to present the news and that's your main job it's not necessarily what you're wearing is important but of course people will notice that yeah yeah and that can be what you do get comments on and it's you know it's great I always think to have interaction with the audience and sometimes people would we're going back years ago people used to write in and say where did you get that dress from I really like that jacket of course now it's so easy isn't it because it's instant it's either an email or somebody will say something on on social media but at the end of the day you might not be dressing to everybody's taste but i think if you're dressing to the situation to the job in hand and you feel happy what you're wearing that's really all you can do yeah i had a great mentor actually a few years ago rob moore who's really big on social media in fact i wouldn't have the podcast if it wasn't for rob because he said you know you must start a podcast and i said okay rob let's do it um but he he advised me when i came out of corporate because i was in corporate you know i was very guarded about social media because what you say can affect the share price quite frankly you know and i would be stood up in the city presenting the annual results to the analyst you know all that kind of stuff so i was very nervous about and i was media trained and how to deal with a crisis and all of that good stuff but when i decided to come out of corporate and sort of set my own businesses up.

30:20He was like, oh, come on, you need to get with the programme. You've got to get on social media. Oh, God, really? Do I need to? I'm quite sure, you know. Anyway, and he said, listen, people are going to judge you anyway, Janette. They're going to judge you anyway. So you may as well put good out in the world, you know, that's important to you in a way that's congruent with your values. And thereafter, okay, you might not be everyone's cup of tea and that's all right. And I was like, I think you're right. You're not going to please all the people all of the time. So being true to your own self and your own values is what's important.

30:57But it's largely, I think, it's dressing for the situation, isn't it? Yes. That can be key. And styles change all the time. I look back and that's the problem when you've worked 30 years in news or in TV. And there's 30 years of archive for people to go through. so my show reel I always say to people yeah just see how many different hairstyles yeah yeah you can see over the years you know you spot the trends from the big shoulder pads right through to uh to different types of looks over the years yeah I love it and have you ever had any situations where people have been quite vicious in terms of saying things on social media you've had to deal with you know trolls or haters or anything extreme like that because you know when you're in a public eye as much as you've been i guess there's a small proportion of that that can go on well i don't want to jinx it actually i don't want to jinx it on your podcast um i have to say i i think i've been very very lucky yeah and you know i know some people have had have had issues uh but i think i've been fortunate over the years and long may it continue i'm sure it will i'm sure it will i'm sure it will and so obviously big career in tv big career in radio and then moving out of that in terms of what you're doing today and you've been doing for quite a number of years now because when was it where you actually did your last your very last front of camera tv so well i'm still doing i'm still working in tv now but on a freelance basis yeah so i guess the big change uh was from you know working for an employer for 26 years yes to then deciding to to spread my wings and and be freelance so that was i suppose another big change so yeah looking back there was the change from dick my toe into to train legal training to actually thinking this was not necessarily what I wanted to do as a full-time career to going into journalism to another change which now is using my journalism and the skills I built up over that sort of 26 years plus in in a different format really which is as a freelance so I still do some freelance broadcasting and um out of my challenge I'm saying yeah out of my comfort zone another challenge I've been working quite a lot in Welsh for S4C which has been really exciting because you know Welsh wasn't language we spoke at home it was I learned in school and you know that was when we moved to Wales so I was quite young but it you know when it's not perhaps your mother tongue I've never felt quite as confident in Welsh as I did in English but It's been brilliant to be able to focus on that.

33:51And actually for one year, I think I worked more in Welsh language than I did in English language. So that was really, really interesting. So I've been working on a true crime series for them, which I was involved with production as well as presenting. So that was really exciting, bringing the journalism in because we were able to speak to people who'd actually never shared their stories before. So crime stories that the audience would have been aware of at the time, but then, you know, disappeared from the headlines and gone back to revisit some of those and to speak to people who actually are at the heart of the story.

34:29That's been really interesting. And some other bits and bobs as well in terms of broadcasting for them. So, yeah, still broadcasting, but not, you know, the nightly news programmes anymore. so that's been a change so that's whether that's actually exploring how journalists work how do you get your message across helping people get out of their comfort zones as i did many times along the way but actually embracing it because the best thing is for that to be a positive experience for people because it can be so rewarding but i think if you don't have a positive experience there's a type of thing that can put you off yes and you're more reluctant to do it again so that's really how I've been using my skills more lately in that freelance setting yeah yeah it's really sort of spread my wings but still stories at the heart of what I do so you know I've told people stories over the years in journalism and now I'm helping other people tell their stories well I mean you've reinvented yourself but you've built on top of foundations and then layered on and layered on and everything you bring now is is not you know i often say to people that i work with or businesses say you're not buying my time you're buying 30 years of business experience you know and what's an all that comes with that the highs the lows all the mistakes everything yeah and i think it's the same same for you so it's this constant layering on and reinvention and you're really passionate about wales and we're very passionate about obviously what you're doing and still on the on the sort of the you know the tv and production side of things but you're also passionate about business in Wales aren't you and you know food hospitality I know you do a huge amount in that space so do you want to just talk about that because it does feel like a bit of a calling I think from what I've read and what you've said you've got this real deep-rooted passion for the country and for helping businesses in that sector in particular so maybe just explore on that a little bit yeah absolutely just picking up what you were saying there Jeanette in terms of mistakes I mean that's how we all learn isn't it yes so I would you know I've made mistakes along the way and as you were saying that's then what you what you can bring to other people because you've perhaps been in that situation and you can share that so that they don't have to be in it yes but yeah I was really interested when I became freelance to do something completely new so to found something really you know I've interviewed great founders and entrepreneurs over the years and always really been in it in all and thought that business is such an exciting sphere because people who are in business they're there because they have a passion for it generally aren't they in particular founders because they believe in their product they believe in the service that they're providing which they have to and quite often they're making huge sacrifices as well in order to get that success Yes.

37:25So I found that always really, really interesting when I was a journalist and really interesting in the stories behind perhaps a business or a product. And yeah, I love Wales. I love food and drink. I love Welsh food, Welsh drink. So I also love researching. And as part of that, I was looking into some of the awards that we have in Wales. and for many years I've worked with some great companies presenting awards always enjoyed it because it's a really positive experience it's a good news story isn't it yes people are there to celebrate and to celebrate their hard work hard-earned success and sometimes it's people's you know moment in the spotlight which is really richly deserved so as a host of awards over the years my role is again being you know drawing on those experiences from live live tv over the years bringing it to live event space but I was interested to think about what about growing and awards you know from the grassroots up and actually being involved in in the other side of it and again you know wanting to learn a little bit more so rather than coming in and and helping a team you know on the night or with a breathing in advance to to bring what I bring to their their awards to actually create something and be a creator so I teamed up with the co-founder of the awards who runs a really successful events company and I'd worked with her on some of her events over the years and it was just during COVID walking around as we could only meet outside and saying well you know what are you thinking about doing in the future and what are your plans and that's how it hatched really and I said well what about a national awards for the producers of Wales we both sort of came up with it at the same time thought it was a great idea and now we're heading we'll be heading to the fifth year of the Wales Food and Drink Awards which we've successfully grown over those five years showcasing the amazing food producers and drink producers that we have here in Wales who are you know putting so much into the Welsh economy as part it's much more of a sort of business awards and a networking project and here's some amazing stories have come out from people networking on the night who then are going into business and collaborating because it's a really exciting sector in wales we've got large businesses we've got small businesses but there's a lot of collaborating going on in the welsh food and drink sector and you know we've had some success stories from the night where people have met up and then have gone to collaborate on on a product so how fantastic is that you know from an awards night that you might actually have got somebody in a conversation for the first time who then go on to to develop something so that's just you know one of one of the benefits really of people who vented the awards we that's been a passion project and it still continues and that's sort of what we're doing every year in terms of looking where we hold the awards we move them around wales because it's a pan whale sector so this year we're up in clandignan next year we'll be holding the awards in south bj i can't tell you where it's not in the public domain that's to be revealed uh but you know so people have got to travel haven't they and we we found that it's working well moving the awards around the country and also you know showcasing what's available locally as well to the areas that where we hold the awards yeah i think it's brilliant i mean like you say you're bringing businesses together you're learning a new you know a different another sort of string to your bow around the commercial aspects of business and what it's like having a p &l and all the risk and investment cases and all that kind of good stuff you know which uh oh i love a spreadsheet i do charter in my career i've had to do i've had to be very good with numbers but it is a different a different approach and like you say with entrepreneurs and founders especially they're taking the risk and you know a lot of business a lot of small businesses don't make it you know a portion of of numbers that fell in the first or first second or second year is really high so i think a lot of it is right you know you're right it's about networking it's around meeting people that you can work together creating you know something special and you never know who's in a room no never absolutely and that's what's been quite an eye-opener to me because when you're actually there as a co-founder that's when you do hear the behind the scenes yeah obviously when you go in as a host just on the night then you're chatting with people but it's more of the superficial level but when you're actually a co-founder of something and you're seeing it the whole year-long project yeah that's what's really exciting and that's where you see oh now how are we going to grow it how are we going to develop it because you don't want to stand still you always want to take it to the next level and that's what I found really exciting but yeah the passion the energy you know really exciting some of the things that are happening and of course you know you leave feeling on an absolute high at the end of the night because yeah there's been the energy in the room from that but also because you know that it's something that's got longevity and is continually adding to and contributing so yeah keeps the momentum going doesn't it 100 % I mean, we're here in Morgans, you know, okay, our wonderful Gia has been very kindly hosting us.

42:55But, you know, to start the awards around COVID, you know, because hospitality, retail, travel, leisure, you know, these are tough industries that were really knocked for not just one year, for many, many years, and arguably still feeling some of that kind of lag. So I think it's great. and also the area you're in around you know buy local you know produce sustainability it's very much front of mind and and i think it's a it's a hot sector actually because it's not just around you know it could be a farm shop or it could be hotels or it could be corporate where your clients in the supply chain to extremely long it's gonna love it you know so it's so dynamic actually when you you know as you were talking i was thinking yeah i can understand why you're so sort of into it and fascinated by by everything yeah it's really cool because all each of the sort of categories are designed to appeal to different types of businesses so for example we've got an exporter of the year now that's really interesting because you know exports are continuing to grow in this sector in wales and food and drink which is you know fantastic so you know you'll have very different businesses perhaps entering that to we have a startup category so it's great then to see the smaller businesses coming through we have the overall food producer of the year of all drinks producer of the year but innovation you know there's some great stories to tell around innovation so we have a category designed to tell and focus on those stories sustainability definitely that's such an important area and you know we see how seriously businesses are taking that because the amazing things that they're doing and how they're constantly trying to make their companies more sustainable again is you know another great story to tell so we're just there really as a platform yes to tell these stories yeah yeah well they do all the hard work yeah it links back to what you were saying really right at the beginning everyone's got a story you know that that's sort of been the world you've been in but i think as a business when you apply it to a business one understanding your why why do you exist what's your purpose how do you make the lives of your customers better you know more into whatever what's your why and how do you stand out in the market it's such an important part of business you know the mission the vision and all of this and obviously you do a lot of work with corporates with businesses helping them almost get that out of them yeah purpose is absolutely key yeah because you want to be thinking about you know what is who are you talking to who's your audience and what's the purpose of why you want to be communicating in that sphere so to understand your purpose and then to be able to to keep on message is so key as well and that's some of the increasing work I suppose that I have been doing Jeanette which is me around helping people to focus because sometimes you know too much don't you yeah yeah you know so much and it's actually boiling it down to so what do you want to get across at this particular moment in time to this audience and it's linking those three things you know the why and the why now as well which is so important and that's something that's always at the heart of journalism the why now you know why is it timely to tell this story now and that's the same really I think in with a lot of communication strategy about why now would you be talking about this yeah it might be because that's what you're particularly focusing on but you might be also playing into a wider why now as well that's even going to take it to another audience who are interested because of a different reason of something else that's going on so knowing who your audience can be absolutely key yeah yeah and tapping into them and understanding and what they need from it because you know it's always you know what's in it for me yeah at the end of the day yes and sometimes when you know so much you're not thinking of yet it's what's in it for me of why the people are listening and what they want to know from it so sometimes working backwards can be quite helpful yeah absolutely and you've got to think of all those stakeholder groups you know what's in it for the investor what's in it for the founder what's in it for the customer what's in it for the team what's in it for you know the farmer what's in it and you're absolutely right because that is a fundamental human human thing isn't it what's in it for me you know it sounds a little bit kind of brutal but it does sound brutal it does doesn't it when you play it back but that's the reality you know and i always say you know you have to be able to know who your stakeholders are and how you serve them you need to be able to speak in their language if you're going in to do an investment case you're going to be using a language that these guys speak whereas that's very different if you're talking to your team in a call center that's answering you know sales calls and that choice of language is that something that you would work with clients on around those different stakeholder groups and how to message using the right language and terminology yeah absolutely i mean language is key at the end of the day i think we started talking about jargon didn't we yes about tv jargon and it's very easy for people to slip into jargon but then people can feel very uncomfortable quite quickly and people also be looking out for certain words because that's what they're expecting and you might start with something that they're expecting but then you can take them to somewhere else but it's taking them on a journey through language but without getting flabby and actually losing the call because people can sometimes not quite know when to stop and that's another key thing where to stop yeah and but just because they've got so many thoughts i think it's a natural human trait and especially if you're a bit nervous whereas sometimes taking that pause having that think slowing it all down can be very very effective so part of the messaging sometimes can be knowing when to stop and if they want to know more they're going to ask a question just take you down that that route but always start with what you want to get across in case they don't ask that question and then you turn around and say oh I never got my point across yes yeah exactly what I always say as well what what's the if you want someone to walk out of the room or in the meeting what's the one or two max three messages you want them to be walking away with yeah or what's the decision that you you are looking to you know be really clear on your purpose what what's the why of the meeting what's the ask yeah um and like you say you might go down a couple of different avenues but you don't want to walk out of there not having got really what you need yeah and the feedback was the purpose of that yes i'm sure we've all been in situations over the years where perhaps we've been in meetings and you're thinking oh yeah what was what actually was the purpose of that i'm not quite sure how that went yeah you know that's not really the situation that you want to be in because as well you know time is precious isn't it yeah so it's getting the value out of everything by again i think planning you know planning is key planning is key if you're going to be doing a media interview yes you know you can't rehearse everything and I would always say don't rehearse everything because then it looks yeah rehearsed yes but just thinking about the areas that you want to cover and being prepped on those you know putting prep time so many times I hear people saying oh yeah I'm gonna wing that and I'm like please don't you know don't wing it exactly no 100 % with that you might want to boil it down you know so you end up with just a couple of bullets or a framework of a stitch but you really need to have taken yourself from the detail from the detail down it's a hundred some of the people I always think anyway yeah they say don't play the best ad libs unscripted ones there you are you see and and how do you how do you help people get in state so you might be going into a big meeting you might be walking onto a stage you might be presenting an award ceremony and you know there might be nerves or a lots of steak it could be millions of you know on the table with a particular situation that you're dealing with how do you how do you help people or the advice you would give for someone in any scenario where that it's quite a big deal and how do they get themselves mentally and physically in state prepared to go in and have whatever conversation or to deliver whatever speech or message how would you recommend people do that well i guess it is a different for everybody for each individual and it's getting to know that individual a little bit in advance I don't think there's a sort of one size fits all certainly not in the type of coaching or training that I give because the important thing to understand I think is what people's experience has been so far what their concerns are and everybody has different issues that they are concerned about some people it might be you know I'm afraid I'm going to lose my voice I'm going to dry up I'm not going to be clear on where I'm going to so the concerns that people have can be so different understanding those concerns and then working with the individual around addressing those in advance is really key yes there are lots of generals around tips and passing on things that I've learned the hard way over the years and different situations that can arise and you know quite often it can be even a practical thing about not realizing what the lectern is going to be like at a venue it which are you know those basic things about getting somewhere early looking around asking the right questions sometimes about you know what the microphone people don't mind if you ask questions and i always feel if you have a burning question it's really important that you ask that and you get the opportunity but it does come down to the preparation again and it's it's quite often a practical a simple thing that can throw you off yes and that can then you know set you right back to a situation where you don't want to be in so I would say there's general tips that you can do think about the situation but really it's knowing what people's individual concerns are and then working with them in advance and helping them particularly around those because everybody has different concerns everybody has different strengths and different weaknesses at the end of the day and what you want is for people to play to their strengths that's all you want to showcase is people's strength and for them to feel confident and for them to come out feeling that it was positive okay there may be some room for improvement people aren't going to be perfect first time life's not like that yeah but you can be as near perfect as you can be yeah or to feel that you've delivered on your goals yeah yeah knowing your goals and being realistic about those i think is really key and that can be for whatever situation that you're in but it's understanding where people where they're starting and where they want to get to be yeah because i mean you're what you will do people that are complete beginners right away through people that very experienced in front of the camera but maybe they're in a different environment or a new business or something so you're right I love that no one size fits all I remember one of my major gaps I was doing a presentation I was giving a speech and it was it was quite a big audience you know good probably a thousand people in a room and it was on imposter syndrome and I had a flip chart and I was like you know imposter is a very negative word and let's reframe the word you know and each letter stands for you anyway so i got to the air and my o was it's okay to fail right um and i i flailed my arms around knocked the entire flip chart off the stage i was like oh i said see it's okay to fail but in that moment you know it could really have like totally thrown me yeah and he was sort of trying to bring in as maybe this thing of your personality whatever your personality maybe a bit of humor or whatever and just go you know hey we're not as perfect oh you know and then just try to carry on yeah perfect example of what I'm talking about I remember a similar thing happened to me during covid where you know a lot of events were obviously cancelled some organizations took their events online and that was quite nerve-wracking for me because I'd never done sort of a conference over zoom and people talking about the waiting room and I'm thinking how am I going to know and the messages are coming through and where I'm going to be looking on the screen and I like to maintain eye contact but it's just the camera or you could just see people tiny little thumbnails of people where they were on their location but the particular talk I was giving was about resilience and you know drawing on some some of the stories over the years and oh my internet just went it just completely went so my camera went off I was thinking oh my goodness I'm halfway way through this presentation and then wondering where I've gone and it was quite nerve-wracking because I'm thinking what am I going to do yeah so you know went to the hub nothing was happening with the hub and I am not really great on technology I work with fantastic people and team who really you know that was that was their job that was their strength my strengths yes I knew a little bit about it but it was a great skill of theirs so I was trying to think right what am I going to do quickly, what am I going to do quickly, think in the moment.

56:20And you all think, I can't believe you've never done this before, but I've never actually tethered to my iPhone. You know about it now, though. Like, all right, which is what I did. And managed to get it back up. And they were saying, oh, we thought it was our connection. You could have gone away with it. God damn it. But I said, well, actually, you know, this is just showing a little bit why I was talking about resilience, because I was in a blind panic. what on earth am I going to do now? There was about 50 people on this call. But we got the signal back up. So very sort of simple, basic example.

56:55I should have probably known in advance how to turn it to an iPhone, but I certainly learned very quickly. Yeah, you don't make the same mistake twice, do you? That's the thing. Yeah, absolutely. So it's been a fascinating kind of journey you've been on with your life. And, you know, what are you most proud of, Sian? doing it's a really difficult question because there's probably loads of proud things you know it could be personal it could be professional but you know when you kind of look back over this amazing career that you've had and all the impact you've had in the world with the messages the people you've met the businesses you're helping now is there is there something that you just kind of are really proud of that i think there've been some stories where actually you know you've seen a result or where I've told a story at a particular time it's led to a particular result so obviously that's very satisfying.

57:44From really starting at the beginning of my career what I've really enjoyed doing the most is constantly learning and constantly wanting to learn more and to get out of my comfort zone and just challenge myself so I think the career has allowed me to do that quite naturally but I you know I've had to go out and find the opportunities they don't come to you you've got to go looking for them and that's always something that I've wanted to do and it's something that I really respect in other people as well so for me it's always feeling about what am I going to learn next and how am I going to challenge myself that little bit further but then how can I use that in a good way by perhaps passing it on to someone else you know I've really enjoyed along the way mentoring that's why you know I've mentored some younger journalists and really that I found that so rewarding you know and I love working with young people as well because gosh you know they're so energetic and just to have that different insight and how other generations are really enjoy working with young people but I've yeah I've enjoyed that mentoring because then I feel that's a sort of the passing on yes the learning yes as part of that mentoring you're also learning as well yeah it's inspiring isn't it yeah yeah so I think in terms of being proud I think was the question of what I've done in my career I think it's always wanting to learn that little bit more yeah it's the kind of person you become on the journey isn't it you know it's how you evolve through all of this and it doesn't it doesn't come easy you know you have highs you have lows you have mistakes you take risks you know and kind of the the sphere you're in now is much more in that entrepreneurial kind of you know innovative yeah nobody knows it all no and there's always room to learn and sometimes it can be in circumstances you wouldn't necessarily expect it to come from but just being open to that learning and particularly you know listening is so key to that but listening is always something I've enjoyed doing as being a journalist because you're you're curious about what somebody's got to tell you so it's about them as opposed to being about you which is why I find this quite unusual for me actually being interviewed you know because that's normally what I do yeah exactly so you could cheat me later I'm learning I've had much work in progress but you know it's about having a real conversation yeah I think that's it if you're interested in the person and you can learn something for me that's that's what it's all about really um and and if you can help others through that and hold your hand down for the next generation and give them a pull up pull them up the ladder really important i think especially for you know other female business leaders as well it's really important to be giving back um so it's a fascinating journey but i'm excited about the future for you though i think you've only just scratched the surface oh thank you it's so it's gonna be so cool and i'd love us to do some stuff together yeah that would be brilliant yeah there's lots happening there's lots collaboration is key you know i enjoy working yes i'm a freelance person who's sort of on my own my own brand i suppose but what i really enjoy is collaborating with others as well because there's so much strength in that and i believe you can achieve more with other people in partnership partnerships and team working is really really important so yeah i'd love to do that watch this space people i heard it here first um amazing so sean best piece of advice you've received through your illustrious career uh be yourself uh is the best advice i was given and that was by a very seasoned presenter when i was taking on a new challenge at a national level and felt slightly out of my even though I was experienced broadcaster at the time but just be yourself and it was a timely reminder actually it's something that I you know had learned along the way but sometimes you need those timely reminders and be yourself is so important because that's when you're when you're authentic that's when you make the most impact great advice everyone listening remember remember don't be yourself everyone else is taken but no it's true it's absolutely true but sometimes we try to fit in don't we to a situation or what we think other people want us to be or yeah across and you're right actually no one's better at being you than you yeah at the end yeah and everybody's got something different about them as a strength as well and by being you that will come through 100 no i love that great advice it's obviously stayed with you so that's uh that's wonderful so this year you've had a lot going on yes if you were going to describe this year in one word what would it be Sian and why it's a bit of a basic word but I would say busy and I think busy is great because sometimes people can say busy and you think what exactly does busy mean is it you know busy doing not much or busy doing something that is valuable and does make an impact or brings value to other organizations or people but it has been a really busy year and And that is how I want it to continue.

1:03:05Because having worked in a newsroom environment, you are always busy because you're always on a deadline. So you're always working towards that. And I do like to be busy. Excellent. Well, I think that's probably going to continue. If I ask you next year what you will, it'll be interesting to see what it is. Maybe still busy. Busier, maybe. So music, Charm. I did give you this little tip before we press to record because we're building our Brave Bobblin playlist, which is a wonderful way to capture the energy of all our guests. So standout song, artist for you, what would you go for? Well, I'm going to go with Rain in the Summertime by The Alarm, the late Mike Peters, who sadly we just lost this year.

1:03:48But being from North Wales, it's nice to have a North Wales band, I think, in your playlist as well you may have already got one but you know rain in the summertime is a really interesting title as well because most people would say oh we don't want rain in the summertime do we but actually rain in the summertime can be pretty cool and can be really good yeah and i really like this amazing well that's a perfect addition so thank you for that and then the final question charl if i may what does brave bold brilliant mean to you Brave, bold, brilliant means everything really. I think look for it in everything.

1:04:28Try to be bold, try to be brave and you will become brilliant. What a perfect way to end. Thank you Sian. It's been lovely. Oh thank you for having me.

1:04:41Well I hope you have absolutely enjoyed hearing Sian's story today from Wrexham to BBC Network news and for giving us insight into what it takes to really thrive in journalism while balancing life's demands. You know, and Sian's experiences remind us that following our passions, embracing change and telling stories with integrity can really make a huge difference. And for all of our listeners and viewers, remember, you know, success comes from pursuing what inspires you, being brave enough to take risks and telling your story with authenticity. Now, stay tuned for more episodes and continue exploring the journeys of the people shaping our world.

1:05:23And whatever happens, remember, stay brave, stay bold and, of course, stay brilliant. I really hope you've enjoyed this episode of Brave, Bold, Brilliant. Remember, check out our new website, www.brave-bold-brilliant.com. You're going to find loads of resources on there that's going to help you with your leadership journey and with the businesses that you're trying to scale up and grow. So take care, everyone. And remember, there are no limits to your growth, but it is by being brave and bold that you're going to unlock your brilliance.