5/29/26: Bessent Threatens Kinetic Action, Jill Biden Gaslights, Spencer Pratt Surges, Dr. Adam Hamawy

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27:07Saagar Enjeti:Emily, we have one Dr. Jill Biden here, who now is chatting about her time in the post-debate of Biden. Is there anything that you would like to set up here before we listen to Jill? Yeah, well, again, let's set this. She has a memoir coming out. This woman had the audacity to write a memoir because I think the Biden family, this is my like Freudian read if I put them on the analyst couch for a moment, has always wanted to play with the lobbyists and the consultants that if you're a politician, you run with. And it's true, Biden had one of the lowest net worths in Congress for a really long time.

27:47But I think they want to get paid. And so Jill Biden, I should say, as her husband is per Hunter Biden, dealing with some tough cancer. We all know that. It was diagnosed, I think, stage four. But Hunter Biden was on Soft White Underbelly recently talking about how it makes him have a hard time sleeping. And there are all kinds of issues with it. Jill Biden is out on a media tour to promote her memoir. And had the audacity, Griffin, to say this in a preview of an interview that's going to drop this Sunday. on CBS Sunday morning. So this is Jill Biden's explanation for what happened on the debate stage when we were all sitting in the studio watching the debate with fried chicken or whatever you ordered, Griffin, that night.

28:34And this is what Jill Biden, people can go back and watch the clip of like Crystal and Sager's jaw dropping during the Trump-Biden debate that made Biden drop out. This is what Jill Biden said she thought. ever see signs that he was falling into cognitive decline? No, no, no. Truly, no. I mean, people were saying he wasn't the same Joe Biden. Well, I don't think that's true. He was the same, the essence of the same Joe Biden, but yeah. The essence, the concept of the plan of Joe Biden. I mean, we all observe that. You know, it's a very intense job. I think it ages you quickly. Then we got one more here.

29:21Saagar Enjeti:We'll play these back to back here because that was not enough for my taste. It gets better. Were you horrified as you saw it unfold? I wasn't horrified. I was frightened because I had never, ever seen Joe like that. With the COVID, excuse me, with dealing with everything we have to do with, look, if we finally. I hate watching this. Thank you, President Biden. Before or since. Never. Or since. Yes. Or since. You've never seen him like that? Never. No. What happened? I don't know what happened. I mean, as I watched it, I thought, oh, my God, he's having a stroke. And it scared me to death. Joe, you did such a great job.

30:14You answered every question. You answered every question. You answered. Joe, you graduated kindergarten. What did Trump do? Why?

30:25Saagar Enjeti:Not lie. I mean, she was so hyped for that moment after an hour before. Apparently, she thought her husband was having a stroke on stage. These are the lies that Joe that Jill Biden is peddling to sell a memoir. And I heard the Podsafe guys making an interesting point about how they were reacting to Zedgelani, who posted on X that people underestimate how much there's a trust problem in the Democratic Party because so many top Democrats and pundits that are Democratic leaning or outright Democrats spent months saying that Joe Biden was fine. and then even some after the debate. Someone was circulating the New York Times' scoring of the debate, and I think it was, there were a couple of people who had rated it a draw.

31:15And again, there were some people spinning after the debate that it was fine. And that's a serious problem for Democrats, not in the narrow sense that people are going to go pull the lever one way or the other, as I think it was Jon Favreau was making this point, because they were lied to about Joe Biden. No, that's not what was happening. It's that Democrats are digging out of a deep trust deficit specifically in some ways because of this. And so then to have Jill Biden going out, I mean, all of the sources to Alex Thompson and others are coming out of the woodwork now, not still not by name and saying this is not true.

31:50Like she did not like none of this, none of what she is saying is true. And people, Ryan, I'm curious what you're hearing in Dem circles, if anything, about how this is just incredibly unhelpful for Democrats in the middle of a midterm cycle.

32:06Saagar Enjeti:Ryan, let's get your reaction to this. A former senior Biden campaign advisor tells me Jill Biden's comments are revisionist history. She and a handful of other close advisors around President Biden kept gaslighting us, telling those of us on the campaign we were the ones who were wrong, and that he just had a bad night. I think she saw the reputational harm this caused her and is therefore taking a new position. What do you make about that? Reminds me of how Hoover, President Hoover, former President Hoover, appeared at every Republican convention for like decades after he was out of office. He was former president.

32:44He's like, I want to speak at the Republican convention. And people are like, Hoover again? Jesus. And I think things move much faster now, but I think people are like, oh, no more Biden, no more Joe Biden, no more Joe Biden. We need to just move this back into the past. Let the river of time, you know, wash this out. Doesn't help that like, because it's like, yeah, sure. She has her own motivations, but also like, no, there's nobody left kind of in the party establishment that has any motivation to help her with this. project. It's fine if she wants to do a project of restoring her self-image.

33:24And if a publishing house thinks that they can move some books based on it, I was wrong about the Kamala Harris book. I didn't think that would sell. It sold a ton. Maybe this will move. But nobody in the party, including in the party elite, has any real interest or motivation to play along. I think a difference with the Kamala Harris book is that she still has people in the party elite who were willing to do bulk book buys for events and that type of thing. That's my impression of how that book, because she went on a tour to sell it. She actually went and did all of these live events. And when you do that, you get bulk sales.

33:59And there were people who were willing to sit down with her, like very prominent people who did these interviews on her book tour. I don't think there's anybody like that with Jill Biden remaining, especially after now saying she thought he was having a stroke and you have this juxtaposition that everyone remembers really viscerally. It just seems, and the Biden family, This is another I mean, it's kind of sad and tragic in the way that the Biden family is tragic, but they can't give anything to anyone anymore. Whereas if Kamala Harris one day runs for president again, who knows what happens, whatever.

34:29She may be in a position to scratch other people's backs. So they have incentive to scratch her back. The Biden family doesn't have that anymore at all.

34:38Saagar Enjeti:Yes. And to Ryan's point about Democrats desperately wanting to leave this in the past, but we are living in the current present of the wreckage of both of their decisions, Jill and Joe Biden, to stay in this race for so long to not have a primary. and we're all living in the reality that occurred from that to this day. And I guess it's like with Trump, you know, he wants to be in office to do all these deals, to enrich himself, all this corruption. But like, what did Jill get out of still wanting to stay in the White House longer? Is it just like ego? Like, you know, like, it's not like she was cashing in a ton at all.

35:18Saagar Enjeti:So she could rearrange the floral arrangements at the White House. Yeah, I guess. I think you're totally underestimating the potency of just being in the White House. It's the most powerful position in the world. And if he's only working from 10 to 4 or whatever, somebody's got to be fielding requests and calls. She was becoming an increasingly central part of that administration, and that would have only increased in a second term. so yeah that I don't think any mystery there and there's this like refrain that she keeps saying that this was the only moment that this was just like a snafu in fact some of the reporting from the Atlantic says that Jill thought that he was drugged that someone had drugged him before was another claim that she made but I mean just yeah McKay Coppins got an early copy of the memoir and wrote a piece based on it and apparently that as actually part of Joe Biden's claim.

36:19And she thought, wow, maybe he was drugged. Maybe he had like cough syrup or something is what, yeah, it's crazy.

36:25Saagar Enjeti:I mean, maybe he was drugged for years because, I mean, there was clip after clip before this debate even happened. And I would like to play just my favorite one, the classic we all know as Earth Rider. Here, it is used to make the brew beer. Oh, Earth Rider, thanks for the Great Lakes. Oh, Earth Rider. That's from the Great Lake. I mean, this is in the 2020 election. First of all, in the 2020 primary, people didn't want to say this. Other Democrats that were running against him really didn't want to say this. It kind of harkens back a little bit to Bernie and Hillary on some of Hillary's obvious vulnerabilities that Trump took advantage of in 2016.

37:09But people did not want to talk about the fact that Joe Biden seemed senile then. And they didn't want to, media didn't give it a lot of coverage in the lead up to the 2020 presidential election. People just didn't want to talk about it, though. I think it was pretty clear. I mean, some of these clips were going very viral at the time. And what we watched was over the course of his first year in office, then his second, third, fourth, it was getting so much worse in front of everybody's eyes. And it became really hard to deny. But if you're Joe Biden, you still have Joe Scarborough coming out on one of the most watched news shows in D.C.

37:46and saying, this is the best Joe Biden I've ever seen. Talking to Joe Biden, then going out on a media platform and saying that is the best Joe Biden I've ever seen. And so if you're Joe Biden, that stuff is meaningful because it shows that people are buying it. They're still kissing the throne. They're sucking up to power. And, I mean, it's just you can see how, as Ryan said, how intoxicating that is if you're Joe Biden in this situation. Yeah. What I wonder is how did Medicare get beat by that guy?

38:21Well, the Dem Civil War broke out on his watch. So because he was he was not capable of being the leader of the Democratic Party, despite being the Democratic president of the United States, he couldn't lead the party. And he couldn't understand what was happening internally with the backlash to his Israel policy. He just couldn't. He was not capable of understanding that. And the party is in disarray, as is the Republican Party, of course. But that's in no small part thanks to Joe Biden being a poor steward of the position that he was in as the leader of the party.

38:55Saagar Enjeti:Well, I think we can all say we're so sick of talking about these people. So why don't we move on? Emily, let's move our lens, our perspective over to the sunny city of Los Angeles, where there is an L.A. mayoral and gubernatorial race occurring June 2nd primary in just a few days. Emily, from an outsider perspective, break it down for us for a second. What are you seeing over here in L.A.? Well, first, if you haven't watched Griffin's interview with Tom Starr, he did a fantastic job. It was a great interview. So go and check that out. But a Berkeley poll came out yesterday. A lot of people remember when Michael Schellenberger, as sort of an online phenomenon, launched a bid for governor.

39:41I forgot how many years ago that was. And he was getting a ton of attention on the Internet. But people were curious how that would actually materialize, if it would materialize, into votes. And it didn't. I mean, it was – he got a very, very minor percentage of the vote at the end of the day. But there's a Berkeley poll that came out yesterday that had Bass at 26 percent, Nithya Raman at 25 percent, and Spencer Pratt at 22 percent. And that was of likely voters in the city of Los Angeles. Pratt responded, as Griffin has up on the screen, as a Trojan, I would never go off a UC Berkeley poll fight on.

40:21And my strong guess, I'd have to go look at the margin of error, but I would guess that they're all clustered. I mean, that between Bass and Ramen, that's almost certainly margin of error territory. And Pratt is probably close to margin of error territory. But all this is to say, we can see he's not purely an online phenomenon. We can see that he's not just at what, like 1%, 2%, 3 %? He's not to sound like Dr. Seuss, but he's actually at 22%. So we now see this is a serious candidacy as the election is on Tuesday, right, Griffin? And Griffin's based in L.A. And Griffin, you're also, what, DSA adjacent or full DSA in L.A.?

41:06So you've been following this as close as anyone. That's coming up in just a couple of days. So this poll is a little bit of a wake-up call, probably.

41:17Saagar Enjeti:Well, I identify as a political podcaster that calls balls and strikes, and I'll be doing that on this segment as well. And this segment, I do think, is designed to make, I think, no matter what you say about the L.A. race, someone's going to get really mad at you. So I will try to take this from a neutral what's going on in the race perspective. But, yeah, I mean, it is really surprising to see someone that a lot of people view as MAGA-coded, like Spencer Pratt, rising so much in the polls. And it does seem like there might be a silent Pratt voter that maybe doesn't say they're voting for Pratt, but is going to.

41:54Saagar Enjeti:And you said he's not just an online sensation, but it is quite an online sensation what he's been doing. Some people are making fun of his AI slop ads. Some of them are created by fans of the campaign. Some of them are billboards that he puts up around town, which people think is very funny to put up AI slop in a city of creatives that are about to all lose their jobs to AI slop. But regardless of that, he's also really making actually a lot of compelling videos of him all over Los Angeles, you know, grabbing a lot of attention in a very Trump 2016 way against a unpopular Democratic incumbent.

42:37Saagar Enjeti:So, you know, I think that he's probably going to get into the top two of the primary or it might be likely. But for those who don't really know the stupid California system we have here, it is a jungle primary. So essentially, Republicans. Which sounds fun. Which sounds fun. Yeah. Sounds fun as hell. It was designed apparently originally to try to create a system that would create more moderate candidates. But essentially what occurs is Democrats and Republicans all run together. There's not a Democratic and Republican primary. They all run together. And then whoever gets the top two goes on to a general.

43:13Saagar Enjeti:Now, often in California, that means it could be two Democrats running against each other. Or it could be, you know, it could be in the governor's race, two Republicans running against each other, which seems unlikely now. But there was a moment where we thought Steve Hilton and Chad Bianco might be the top two for California governor. or that doesn't look likely anymore. But yeah, here we are here. And Ryan, what is your perspective? You know, we covered the Zoran race in New York for a long time. And Zoran's videos really did put him almost on a national stage in a way that Spencer Pratt seems to as well.

43:53Saagar Enjeti:What do you make of all that? Yeah, I mean, he was already a national figure from his reality TV days, right? You know, if the videos, the kind of pop culture linkages kind of line up with your politics, then it works together. And I think that's the case with Pratt. Like, he's going for this, like, what, upper middle class, every man kind of vibe? I don't know. Like, what? I don't know. I guess I think that's how he's, like, himself. But I also feel, and Griffin, actually, you too, Ryan. Like, there's something I would imagine that people missed with Trump and like working class Hispanics, where if you are hitting on the biggest vulnerabilities of Karen Bass and some of these Democratic candidates and just talking about cleaning up the city, helping people who are homeless recover from their addictions.

44:49Like, it just seems as though he's perfectly positioned to take on those very serious grave vulnerabilities, not just with the upper middle class, you know, like Democrats who are sick of, you know, paying so much in taxes and then walking in, walking over needles, but also the kind of like every man who's like, whoa, why was the mayor gone during the fire? Like, what the hell's going on? It's certainly the kind of candidacy that you can imagine appealing to people who are just like kind of at the end of their rope and just very frustrated at how things are. You're like, let's this is totally crazy.

45:27Let's just try this. Yeah. So, yeah, it certainly seems seems plausible. I saw that Nithya was trying to get another left wing candidate to drop out. Like if enough, if Democrats were really kind of strategic about who was in the final race, Griffin, would they be able to box him out? Is it really the kind of like candidates who are gobbling up like 20 % of the vote all among them that is kind of giving him the shot at squeaking through? And then once he's in, then he has a one-on-one shot.

46:03Saagar Enjeti:Yeah, so right now it's a tight three-way race between the incumbent Democrat mayor Karen Bass, who I would describe as kind of like a center-right liberal-ish kind of former Cuban terrorist, right? Spencer talks about all the time that she was training terrorist tactics in Cuba, which is great. She says she wasn't. Oh, OK. Well, maybe she should admit to it. Might help. but maybe not maybe not and then we have Nithya Raman who is technically DSA coded but the DSA did not endorse Nithya for like a medley of reasons including sort of her work on the LA City Council where they found her to be a little lackluster so there was a little bit of drama about not endorsing anyone for the primary.

47:01Saagar Enjeti:So, but Spencer does seem to be really into coding all of the problems of LA on the DSA. And I think maybe that's because Zoran has made the DSA more of a national topic. So now more people know what that was. I don't think this would have worked even a couple of years ago, but let's take a listen to a recent video of Spencer calling out both Karen and Nithya Rahman. I'm Spencer Bratt. we're here at the 6th street bridge in downtown Los Angeles. It is beautiful. If only you could see it, but all the lights have been allowed to be stolen from our taxpayer money because Mayor Basura and Nithya Ram and the DSAC council let criminals run the streets.

47:47But don't worry, Mayor Basura is planning to take 200 more million dollars of our tax money to get solar power lights. Oh, because the criminals won't steal those. But don't worry. Nithya Rahman has suggested putting cages around the lights. That's right. Cages. That'll stop them. So if you're sick of your tax money getting burned by these criminals, you better vote for Mayor Pratt. The ballots drop May Ford. All right.

48:16Saagar Enjeti:So, yes, he loves to call her Karen Basura, which which people find very funny. It's very Trumpian in coming up with nicknames, if you will. And I do think that to Ryan's question of if the Democrats could consolidate around someone. But unfortunately, I think that Nithya Raman has stumbled during these debates. Nithya has not been able to cut videos that are, in my opinion, very charismatic and engaging and hasn't been able to really own the media environment, which has led the Democrats to be in this kind of standstill where they're like, well, people really hate Karen Bass. I mean, she has an insanely low approval rating, but Nithya really isn't getting out there and grabbing the moment and doing mic drops and capturing people's attention either.

49:05Saagar Enjeti:So it's this area where, you know, these people want to run for these positions, like L.A. mayor and stuff, But we're in a new realm where if you can't cut a vertical, if you can't talk to the camera and make constant, interesting 60-second videos that grab people's attention, you really can't win as mayor. And maybe she still will. But I do think we're in this new era now where you have to be able to be a confident media content creator to really grab people's attention. Well, I was going to say two things on that. First of all, I don't think anybody wants to be in this era where you have the reality television stars who can master media, being able to kind of dominate conversations because institutional trust is so low.

49:52But we are in that moment. I'm sorry, but there are a whole lot of people in this country who are just going to say or in our cities who are just going to say, screw it. Karen Bass, you're telling me like you're appealing to my institutional trust and what you've done as mayor? or Nithya Raman, who I think was tasked with, on the city council, the homelessness issue, Griffin, correct me if I'm wrong. That's a huge, huge vulnerability for both of them. And you can't just appeal to expertise or authority when people think your expertise and authority is failing. So we are in that era. And I don't know anybody who particularly likes it or loves it, but it's what we're in.

50:28And secondly, that does become a really big problem because Mamdani was very clever about how he dealt with his past on criminal justice reform, right? Like, it's been pretty interesting to watch him navigate that. And I think he's done it just about as well as anybody could. But that's a real problem for Nithya Raman and Karen Bass, because people want a new, especially I think working class people, if you look at polling, want a new approach that isn't just the progressive criminal justice reform experiments that played out in some of our cities. Even in California, what did they, they recalled a couple people who were, like it was San Francisco.

51:06I'm trying to remember exactly who it was. Yeah. Right, and it's, his name is escaping me. Another terrorist. Yes, Chesa Boudin. Yes, yes. Yeah. That's, yeah, very bad timing for him. And I'm joking about terrorists, but his parents were in the weather underground. That's what I mean. But yeah, I think that's a problem.

51:26Saagar Enjeti:Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there are serious issues with Los Angeles. And yeah, people don't really care about this experience line that both Nithya and Karen are touting as the reason that you should vote for them. Spencer's been really smart, I think, about saying, oh, if this is their experience, that's no good. And I also think that, I mean, listen, this is like a very long shot thing. This is liberal L.A. So even if Spencer makes it through the primary, it's unlikely that he would win in the general just because the odds are simply stacked against him. But he was doing this really smart thing early on of saying, I'm not Democrat.

52:06Saagar Enjeti:I'm not Republican. I just care about the city, which I thought was really smart. But in the recent weeks, he's like going on Gutfeld. He's going on Fox News. And it's like, brother, that's not going to help you. He was in New York clearly the last couple of days on a media. He needs to be going on Pod Save. He needs to be going on Alana Glazer. Like, he needs to be going on those. And maybe they wouldn't have him. But honestly, I do think there is a certain charm to him. I mean, I personally find him to be a little bit of a reality TV show huckster, much like Donald Trump. But, you know, there's a charm to him.

52:42Saagar Enjeti:And I do think that he would win over some of these liberals if he went on and talked about the things he's going to do. Trump kind of did a soft endorsement. Erica Kirk did an endorsement. It's like, guys, you are not helping him. And I know we got, I think we got to move to Dr. Hamill in a second. But one other federal related point is that assuming he does get into the general election, that's actually very good then for Republican House turnout in the Los Angeles area. A lot of these California races are often decided by, you know, 5 ,000, 10 ,000 votes or less. And so if there are two Democrats on the gubernatorial ballot and two Democrats on the mayoral ballot, then Republican turnout in the general election just plummets.

53:27Because Republicans are like, why bother? And then the House candidates deeply suffer as a result, the Republican House candidates. But if there's Pratt and gives Republicans a reason to come to the polls while they're there, they're also going to vote for the Republican House candidate, which could actually, you know, which could potentially matter in some of the further out, depending on how the districts are drawn races. He's running a good campaign and his opponents are running bad campaigns. That's my assessment of it. Like a really good campaign juxtaposed with a couple of really bad campaigns.

53:59Saagar Enjeti:So yes, and he is already plotting a reality TV show that is following him around for the race. I don't know if that would start in the general, but it was leaked that it could potentially continue rolling if he becomes mayor. Very cool. So, yeah, there's that as well. And yeah, I guess it's just kind of an example of the very deeply Democrat city not really having strong Democratic candidates or a Zoran of their own. And in some ways, just structurally and aesthetically, but not politically, Spencer Pratt probably is the closest to the Zoran of L.A. in terms of his ability to create media and videos that people are reacting to, regardless of politics.

54:49Saagar Enjeti:Right. And that happens every once in a while in these like deep one party areas. I think it's partially what happened in Texas in the Senate primary. Like you end up with two really bad candidates of the party that has such dominance in a particular state or city. So there's a little bit of that probably happening too. When it comes to advancing your education, you have more options than you think. At Rasmussen University, we find ways to remove barriers, not build them. Like a new laptop if you're eligible and enroll in select online or on-campus programs. That means flexible and engaging online courses and resources, tuition savings options if you qualify, exceptional student support, and much more.

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56:37Saagar Enjeti:And with that note, why don't we bring on our guest. Ryan, will you introduce Adam Hamaway? Joining us this morning is Dr. Adam Hamaway, a plastic surgeon from New Jersey, who is running in New Jersey's, is it the 11th district? It's the 12th district. New Jersey's 12th district, kind of a crowded field, replacing the outgoing progressive congresswoman, Bonnie Watson Coleman. People might remember, Dr. Hamaway was on this program maybe a year plus ago when you were a guest of Representative Watson Coleman for the State of the Union. she brought you because you had volunteered in multiple war zones throughout decades, but most recently had done a rotation through Gaza.

57:25Actually, during this war, have you been there multiple times? Yeah, I've been to Gaza twice and to the West Bank twice in the last two years. Got it. Now, so you also kind of came to prominence in Congress. like, oh wait, this is the guy who actually operated on Tammy Duckworth when her helicopter was downed. You were an Army combat surgeon. Can you talk a little bit about when you joined the military and what your experience was like? Because that also, I think, then flows into this, the attacks that you're getting recently for some of the volunteer work that you did while you were enlisted?

58:06Sure. Yeah. I enlisted in the New Jersey National Guard and I guess it was 1989. I was like right when I just got into college. And then I later got a ROTC scholarship and was commissioned as an officer and served in the regular army active duty for eight years. After, you know, I got an educational delay, was an individual ready to reserve for a while. And then after completing my medical training, came in on active duty and served in the Iraq war as a combat trauma surgeon in 2004 and 2005 and for several years after that. Got it. And so that leads to one of the more kind of shocking articles I've seen written by a news outlet and in all of the time that I've been kind of covering politics.

58:56And this was published by Jewish Insider. Let me share this here. Leading New Jersey Dem congressional candidate, Adam Hamaway, volunteered with Al-Qaeda-tied group in Bosnia. You read that headline, you're like, what? What on earth is going on here? So can you give us a little background about what this Bosnia volunteer effort was that Jewish insider is now turning into allegations that you're linked to Al Qaeda. Yeah, I mean, things are getting more absurd as we get closer to elections. I've been volunteering now for almost 30 years with medical missions around the world. And that was one of my earlier ones.

59:43I was a medical student between my second and third year. And the genocide in Bosnia was happening at that time. I reached out to the Bosnian mission and said, listen, I got a summer and I'd like to volunteer. And they directed me to the UN, who directed me to one of the organizations working with them. And I spent the summer delivering medical supplies with the countryside. And that was it. And apparently now, like, they're grasping at straws and we got crazy allegations because they have nothing else to talk about. Yeah, and Emily or Griffin, if you have a follow-up question, so about a decade after you were there, one of the organizations that the UN directed you to was raided and accused of or found to be operating as a front for Al-Qaeda, which I think in 1994, probably a lot of people may not even have heard of except for maybe this CIA.

1:00:42And so I guess you would have had a time machine to know that this was going to happen a decade later. And can you talk a little bit about what you saw while you were in Bosnia and what the situation was like? And I'll just build on, so sorry, I was just going to build on Ryan's question a bit because John Schindler, the national security journalist, built on the Jewish Insider Report and said that at the time you were in the Zeneca area, it was crawling with foreign jihadists. many of them followers of bin Laden, including the infamous al-Mujahid Battalion, which BIF, Benevolist International Foundation, supported with funds and logistics.

1:01:19Those terrorists committed numerous crimes against Christian civilians and prisoners of war, including decapitations on film. Many notables in the global Salafi jihad movement, including Osama bin Laden himself, spent time in Bosnia during that troubled period. What was the good doctor really doing in Bosnia, Schindler writes, in 1994 as a guest of BIF and bin Laden? So just, I wanted to add that to Ryan's question, doctor, as well. It's almost laughable just kind of like hearing you talk about this. I've been talking about my mission to Boston since I was a medical student. And when I came back, I mean, it was one of the things that highlighted my time in medical school that I was able to volunteer.

1:01:57And what I saw is initially when I was in Sarajevo is snipers shooting people in the street, and then to different clinics and hospitals throughout the countryside that were short on medical supplies. I flew in on a chartered UNHCR United Nations flight into Sarajevo, got into an armored personnel vehicle that a Ukrainian force that was there, UN force, picked me and the workers up from the airport and took us downtown. and, you know, every day we would go to a warehouse that, again, run by the United Nations and we would deliver supplies around the countryside. And that's what I did for the summer.

1:02:39And that really what's prompted me to do many of the missions that I've been doing since then. That's the extent of it. Yeah, and something that, and I've been, you know, kind of fighting back and forth with the reporter on this Jewish Insider piece, because while the reporter linked to a federal document that included what I felt was like something that should have been included, he did not reference that thing. And that is that an envoy to President Bill Clinton, the same year that you were working with this organization, visited a separate office and, quote, appraised BIF and its efforts to provide humanitarian relief.

1:03:25So this is kind of a UN-recognized organization where the special envoy to the White House visits and finds to be doing impressive work. And they're somehow raising questions about a medical student, that a medical student should have known more than the United Nations or the White House at the time. And so I'm curious, just from a personal level, as somebody who has spent so much time kind of serving the country, eight years active duty and a lot more IRR and National Guard, and spent your life doing volunteer missions around the world, what's it like? What's it been like to get into this partisan politics and have even your Democratic future colleague, Josh Gottheimer, raising questions about your loyalty to the country?

1:04:17I can't imagine what that must be like after 30 years of a life of service. This is not new for Muslim candidates. Jumping in on day one, I knew that I was going in as someone who was a witness to the genocide in Gaza and that I would be facing a lot of resistance. I've been facing criticism for several years now since I came back and I've been speaking up to my practice, to my person. We've been getting attacked and I've been getting attacked now and it's just increased. It's not a new narrative. You know, calling a Muslim a terrorist has been a go-to, you know, backstory for years. I've been called the anti-APAC candidate since they won.

1:05:03The last person in Congress that they want is someone who's actually been there and has been speaking up boldly and is not afraid. And so to have these attacks come in the last, you know, few days is just showing their desperation. They have nothing else to talk about. You know, my service to the country is clear. I've served in uniform I've taken care of hundreds of American Men and women in combat In battle, I took care of A US sitting senator I was at 9-11 On ground zero on that day Helping first responders And actually climbed on the rubble To help someone that was trapped there So they have nothing to say Except grasp at straws now And start making up stories And connecting dots that really don't even exist So that's the only thing they got to say.

1:05:54And again, let's look at the narrative and what I'm talking about. I'm talking about let's stop war. Let's stop atrocities that we're funding. You know, let's save lives. And what they are pushing is increased funding to a foreign country that is breaking international human rights law, that is breaking U.S. law by us supporting them, that we want to continue a genocide and killing children, innocent civilians, that is continuing on to this day, despite a ceasefire. and they're calling me the terrorist. So, you know, I think it's very clear for anyone who looks past the sensational headlines about where the truth is.

1:06:33Saagar Enjeti:Yeah, and it does seem like a tactic that has been used for many years, especially right now during the Gaza genocide, you know, labeling human rights workers or aid workers at the Red Cross or World Central Kitchen as Hamas. and I don't think that stuff really is gaining a lot of traction anymore, or we hope it's not. But we solved that, because that stuff seems ultimately a distraction from your campaign. So could you tell us a little bit about the core tenets of your campaign, what you want to do in New Jersey, and a little bit about the opponent you're running against? So I'm running in a crowded field, so there's multiple opponents, and I've been running on basically as a doctor, as a physician who works here every day in New Jersey and has seen war, you know, working in uniform and also as a volunteer around the world that we should be funding healthcare and not bonds.

1:07:27We have a healthcare system that's falling apart. We have insurance companies that are really pressing our patients every day, you know, denying surgeries, denying like, you know, tests, and at the same time making a profit off it. And we're told that we can't have Medicare for all because we can't afford it. And yet we could see all the wars that we've been funding over the decades and the one continuing to go on right now. I've been saying that we need to abolish ICE because they've been terrorizing our communities. And I was just at Delaney Hall a couple of days ago as, again, they're gassing senators and representatives and the people are being like attacked and kidnapped by like, you know, mass stormtroopers, which is, you know, really strange to see in my own country right now.

1:08:10and that we need to unrig this economy that's being run by corporations, billionaires, and corrupt special interests and really make it work for working people. That's been my message since day one, and apparently that makes me a radical because I'm saying that.

1:08:28Saagar Enjeti:And you said you were an anti-APAC candidate. Have you noticed APAC get into this race at all yet? Surprisingly, no. I mean, they've been working through, again, their right-wing media and obviously Jewish Insider has been putting out an article on me every other day attacking me. But I think they've been busy around the country. We just saw their$32 million race against Massey in Kentucky. And they're fighting a battle on multiple fronts. Maybe they didn't see me as big a threat as what they're beginning to notice right now. But I'm happy they didn't jump in. And it's a few more days to go. oh, it's not over yet.

1:09:10And as we see, the attacks are continuing and I'm going to keep pushing and giving my message till the last day. And people have different visions for what it would look like to abolish ICE and do immigration enforcement in particular cases. What do you think immigration enforcement would look like without ICE? Well, there was life before ICE. We had the INS before and what we need is an orderly system that respects human rights, that respects civil liberties, that allows people to enter this kind of country legally and, you know, bring their talents and abilities that have really made this country what it is with, you know, generations of immigrants coming in here.

1:09:54And, you know, it's not like we have to reinvent the wheel. I mean, this exists in other countries. And we have to, you know, look at like just around us. We are surrounded by immigrants that are neighbors that, you know, have, you know, you know, pay taxes and really provide services that we really need here. So let's go back and stop pointing fingers because both parties have dropped the ball about this. It's not just Republicans. It's Republicans and Democrats. And we need to, you know, get this system so that we don't have these long lines waiting for a lottery system. Or, you know, I have, you know, neighbors that have been waiting like over a decade to be to have family members join them because our process is so broken.

1:10:38So it doesn't mean that we need to have this rogue, you know, force that is going and terrorizing communities and kidnapping people and drop broad daylight. You know, even in this district, Trenton, you know, they've been there have been over like 30 abductions in the streets in broad daylight. Trenton is not the southern border. They're not protecting anyone here. What they're doing is attacking black and brown people. And, you know, we are every day moving towards a fascist country and losing our democracy. And we need to, like, get our heads on straight about, you know, which direction we are heading for and what we want this country to look like for our children.

1:11:23And last question for me, you know, without kind of AIPAC coming in and spending, you know, millions of dollars, articles like the ones that have been, you know, targeting you, I don't think reach, you know, can reach people in the same way. But I'm curious, has like, as you've been out on the doors or a campaign stops, has anybody come up to you and said, wait, I read somewhere that you're Al Qaeda? Not yet. Not yet. So, you know, I've been knocking on doors, you know, greeting people at train stations, standing at coffee shops, and I'm getting a lot of positive feedback. So I don't think, you know, people have heard it, and I know they've, I've heard more words of support saying, I've seen that garbage that they're saying about you, and it's ridiculous.

1:12:10so people, I'm happy I live in a district that is as diverse as we live in here and is as intelligent where people could see through the garbage and know that what we need in this country is bold new leaders and not those beholden to AIPAC that funds their campaigns and have put them in office and keeping them in office.

1:12:33Saagar Enjeti:It struck me that you mentioned earlier that you were at 9-11 rescuing people. And of course, there was a mass explosion of Islamophobia post-9-11. Tell me more about that day, your experience trying to rescue people, and the weeks and months after. Well, that's a day I will never forget. I was a resident at New York Presbyterian in the Upper East Side. And, you know, in the morning, we all reported to the emergency room. We had a rush of patients that came in from the initial collapse. And after, I think, 11 o 'clock, everything stopped. And the NYPD asked for some volunteers. And some of the doctors and nurses, like myself, jumped on a bus.

1:13:25And under police escort, went all the way down to ground zero. We set up a field hospital in Stuyvesant High School, which was down there at the time, and worked through the night. you know, taking care of mostly first responders who were, you know, getting injured and had like smoke inhalation as well and eye injuries. And then it was around midnight, they said that there was someone trapped on the rubble. They needed some surgeons up because they were thinking that we might have to amputate to extract them. Thank God we didn't have to do that, but we did climb up onto the rubble to help and we were finally able to get him up and down.

1:14:05So that's a crazy night. At the same time, my wife was in our apartment and I called her and it was hard to reach because the signals were all down that day. Told her to stay in the apartment and she didn't leave the apartment for about two weeks because of the anti-Muslim hate that was around that time. And even I, on that day, got yelled at and screamed at by some of my doctor colleagues telling me it was my fault, even though I was physically there. Other doctors. Other doctors, yeah. I would say doctor. It was one doctor. It wasn't all my colleagues. And living in New York was tough after that.

1:14:49We lived in the city, walking through the streets. People spit at me and my wife and called us names. and would shove and push us in the street. That's the environment that we lived in. And unfortunately, some of that still exists today. Most of it is gone, but you could see that some of the attacks right now are trying to pull on that fear and pull on that hatred that is really a right-wing tactic about whether it's fear of immigrants, whether it's fear of Muslims, whether it's fear of some foreign threat that's going to, you know, that we need to go into another war. That's how they work. And when all else fails, that's what they're falling back to.

1:15:39Yeah, I think for people who didn't kind of live through that period, those first weeks and those months and then those first years, it's very difficult to probably put yourself there. But there was a profound shift in that moment. I'm sorry that you experienced that from other New Yorkers, but it's not surprising given what the mood was like at the time. I also wonder if, in a way, the field experience that you had at that point, doing volunteer work, not just in the Balkans but around the world, by then prepared you in a way that maybe some other American doctors weren't prepared because we hadn't had, you know, an attack on continental U.S.

1:16:30you know, since, unless you count some doc attacks in World War II, you know, since, you know, for 200 years or so. So in order for an American doctor to have experience with a field hospital in a crisis situation like that, you would actually have to go overseas. it's going overseas and and uh working with mass casualties uh you know a mass casualty currently in the united states is usually you know a car or a bus accident that happens you know thank god very rarely um and to actually have like more injuries which uh include a combination of blast burn you know penetrating injuries on a mass scale and uh to be able to triage it besides field exercises where you're simulating, it's an experience that most people, thank God, don't have.

1:17:26And that's, again, one of the reasons that I keep going is because I feel I have this experience. And even though, for example, in Gaza, we've had several hundred doctors from the United States now volunteer, for most of them, it's the first time. and going there with a team and being able to lend a hand and give my perspective about this is how you triage in a situation where you have very little resources and you have to move a lot of people through. I think it's important. And I think those hundreds of doctors that have been there now and have come back and are working now all over the countries in ERs and hospitals and cities and rural settings, they're a huge asset now to the United States because of the experience that they've had over the last few years.

1:18:18And I was just going to ask, I mean, you've been getting tons of questions for years, not before the campaign, about obviously Omar Abdel Rahman, known as the blind cheek. And I was in the Midwest on 9-11. And after 9-11, of course, I can't imagine what it was like to be there in the area in the days and weeks and years after 9-11, how sensitive people were, what it was like to be Muslim in the area, what it was like to feel like you were in danger in the area. And I wanted to ask just how you sort of have dealt with some of those, what I imagine are difficult conversations. One quote recently, as you said, he did speak about violent things.

1:19:00This is in reference to The Blind Sheik, even though you say that I think most people disagree with and most people condemn, including myself, but it wasn't the only thing he spoke about. And I imagine that you've had conversations about your association with him over many years with many different people and just trying to kind of get along with your fellow Americans. What has that been like in this campaign and before this campaign? Well, you know, at that time, there was very few, you know, religious figures for Muslims in New Jersey, New York area at the time. And he was a well-known figure that was basically everywhere.

1:19:39I mean, you know, he went to different mosques and different, you know, locations and people, you know, you know, saw him because he was just around. And when I first met him at that time, again, I was, you know, just, you know, I was already in the military. I was already serving and he was in the area. What I was called to testify on is There was a last minute carpool. I joined not just him, but it was several community members and other religious figures at that time. And what I was called to testify on is a particular time, what I saw and what I heard. It was not as a character witness. It was not anything.

1:20:18I've been condemning the violence for years. I've been condemning what he said and any violent actions. And the reason I was called as a witness is because I had nothing to do with it. I was never accused of anything at the time before or after. It was a small 15, 20 minute testimony in a very long trial. I went and gave my testimony and left and really no one said anything about it at the time because it was so insignificant. And again, it's one of those things about grasping at straws and trying to make something out of nothing because they have no other story to talk about. All right.

1:20:57Saagar Enjeti:Right. Well, Adam, where can people learn more about your campaign, race, follow you? We'll put a link in the description. Well, the race is almost over, so it's crunch time right now. The second is just four days away now. You can learn that at Hamowy4NJ.com, H-A-M-A-W-Y-F-O-R-N-J. And you could volunteer. We need canvassers. We've been knocking on doors every day now, and we have phone banking all across the country. So whether you're in California or all the way to New Jersey, we could put you to work. And in New Jersey, if you're in the district, the polls are open. So early voting is happening right now until Sunday.

1:21:36And please, if you haven't filled out mail-in ballots, fill them out, put them in the mail. It's not doing you any good on the kitchen table. All right. Election is Tuesday. If you live in New Jersey's, well, wherever you live in New Jersey, elections are on Tuesday. Go out and do your civic duty. We'll stay in touch. and we'll talk to you soon, Dr. Hanwit.

1:21:55Saagar Enjeti:Thank you very much for having me. It wouldn't be a Friday show without some questions from our audience. Now on supercast.com. So let's see what we've got here from the people who have put on our new thread here at the top. And it will also be a link in the description if anyone ever wants to submit a written question here. I'm just scrolling through some of them right now. Sagar, can you make another I will eat my sock prediction? Listen, you got to save these for the live stream because that's the only one that Sagar does. All right, this one from Walter Zikonowski. Why do you think AOC avoids alternative news shows slash podcasts like Breaking Points?

1:22:40Ryan? I think she doesn't see the upside and only sees a downside. That's my kind of sense of it. she does do you know she answers questions fairly very openly on Capitol Hill you know for anybody who comes up with a camera whether it's mainstream or drop site or anybody else yeah she talks to Julian all the time yeah and she'll talk to Pablo and she'll talk to literally anybody on Capitol Hill trolls anybody else and she'll do what you know cable hits that are shorter her um you know the independent media hits i think they they generally significantly longer more room for something to be like clipped and cause problems but i don't but i don't know it's a it's a it's a good question um you know she she's always had this like i'm gonna i'm gonna create my own audience and you know she's got what 12 million twitter followers and millions on instagram That's a good point.

1:23:45So she has this ability. She does these Instagram lives where she's creating an intimate, direct parasocial connection to that audience. Selfishly, I think that independent media is a good place for all politicians. And it's a good place to hone the ability to have longer conversations. But yeah, that's my sense. And to build trust with those audiences. But yeah, it is interesting. I hadn't thought about the fact that But if you come up to her with a camera and a mic, it doesn't matter if you're the daily caller or drop site. She will talk to you on Capitol Hill. So the risk aversion, I get it.

1:24:21Actually, I do understand that you're going to get a really tough interview on independent media of people who are maybe more connected to the grassroots where there has been a lot of fighting about some of this stuff and best tactics and the like. But it is kind of interesting that she takes the Capitol Hill questions.

1:24:39Saagar Enjeti:I've changed my mind a little bit since the last time we all talked on our Friday show about this because, you know, getting... I don't know if you get tougher questions on independent media. I think there's only like three places that do confrontational interviews, like adversarial interviews. Like us, maybe Mehdi Hassan. But like, you know, like we... But like, you know, people are like, oh, well, Trump went on all the podcasts. But those podcasts were not adversarial. They were meat-riding Trump on all of them. Like none of them were adversarial. Well, she did Alana Glazer, and that's not going to be adversarial.

1:25:14Like, it wasn't at all.

1:25:15Saagar Enjeti:Yeah, exactly. So I think there's this confusion where it's like, oh, you need to go on independent media and you need to go on podcasts to have these adversarial conversations. But that doesn't really exist in the independent media sphere either. Like, if AOC goes on Pod Save America, it's not going to be adversarial. They've been doing some decent internecine demo reviews. It's not going to be adversarial, though. I assume this question was about us and like Medi, Zateo. But we are unique in the independent media space that we ask hard questions to even people that we may be politically inclined to support.

1:25:51Saagar Enjeti:And I think that makes us like unique and different and kind of makes sense why people don't want to have an Alyssa Slotkin moment or something like that. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they're not going to go on podcasts because I think most podcasts are not going to be like us. I don't know. My assumption is Alyssa Slotkin probably saw that as a success. I think we've talked about this before, but like just being in front of the audience and looking like you can do it. Yeah. I just think that there's like, honestly, in the independent media landscape or in the podcast landscape, you might get tougher questions on CNN or with sometimes like.

1:26:28Saagar Enjeti:Bullshit. I think that, wait, what's her face? Who's the main? It depends on if we're talking about like podcasts like Alana Glazer or podcasts like Breaking Points. Well, look at like even like the question, obviously like Sean Hannity glazes Trump all the time. But like Sean Hannity is going to ask real questions that the Nelk boys are not going to ask, right? Like I feel like. I don't know. I mean, sometimes Trump's best interviews are the ones that aren't adversarial because he just starts riffing. and he's had some of his best moments on Hannity, actually, because he's so comfortable with him.

1:27:04But sometimes then the Nalc boys are Rogan. Maybe it would be an Ilana Glazer, but because they don't really know what they're talking about, they also don't know what the third reels they aren't supposed to touch are. So sometimes they stumble into those conversations that they don't mean to be having. So I don't know. I think it could go both ways. But I also think the good indie shows, I agree with you, are very distinct from the bad indie shows. And the bad indie shows, it is possible they may be worse than cable. That's probably true.

1:27:36Saagar Enjeti:That's at least my view on it. Okay, next one from Kevin Najedli. Ryan, if Ro Khanna wins presidency in 2028 and wants you to be his secretary of state, okay, two crazy things have to happen there for this to work. Would you do it? I hope this is not just fantasy world. It is. I think you'd be great choice for secretary of state. Only if I'm also a national security advisor, head of UFD, and also head of the Pentagon. They're not giving you clearance. Roe could give the clearance. He can wave it right through. What else? I mean, I want no rivals. You know, unchecked. Yeah, right, right, right.

1:28:18I would definitely put you in charge of the National Archives. We would know immediately what happened to JFK. Oh, DEA. I want DEA, too. some heads are going to roll in there

1:28:30Saagar Enjeti:alright so he will be the everyman Marco Rubio of the Ro Khanna administration and our final question comes from Nicholas El Salvador I'm going to be the viceroy of El Salvador alright Ro Khanna get to work so from Nicholas Jurista not a supporter of the Ron Wardall but you guys used used to do an amazing job on having multiple viewpoints. Now it appears to me one-sided. Again, I don't agree with the war at all, but it would be nice to have others on that have a difference of opinions. Truly appreciate all that you guys do. Now, I have asked before, should we get some pro-Iran war people on the show?

1:29:15Saagar Enjeti:But, you know, that will just turn kind of like a shouting debate, right? I don't know. I think that's good and we were also talking about internally booking the proactive booking takes time to set aside time to think okay, three days from now because it takes a little bit if you want Mark Dubowitz, you gotta reach out and schedule him and he's not gonna come on the next day necessarily but I think I think that's a fair point, actually. Yeah. Yeah, I agree with that. The show's premise has been, it's not a both sides show. It's like the views from regular people who disagree on some things, but are just regular people.

1:30:09It doesn't mean you have to then carve out space for the donor class to get their say. Yeah. So in the Iran war, like there's not a whole lot of grassroots public support for it. So that segment of the population is not really being ignored. The population that's being ignored is the like donor class that loves the neocon class that loves the war. We never really promised to give them a voice. Well, I like what you just said about how it's not a both sides show. because what the show is really about is what we all share, the foundation that we all build the show off of is that the establishment is corrupt and broken.

1:30:47And so our job is not to do what everybody else in the quote-unquote mainstream media does, which is take them credibly and seriously. But we, from the left and from the right, approach everything through the lens of that the political establishment is corrupt and broken and the system isn't working. So sometimes that means on the tax code, for example, I'm going to say that we should have a flat tax and you guys are going to say, no, we need taxation to be more progressive. But what we're not going to do is be like, actually, we need more corporate carve outs for the sake of GDP. And that then applies to, if you apply that to foreign policy, it means we're really not going to have the type of pundits on and treat them credibly, unless it's really adversarial in a debate, that they don't buy into the premise of our establishment being corrupt and broken and the like.

1:31:38But I actually agree with the viewer who submitted this question that it's not a bad idea to have debates when it makes sense. And so there are people in MAGA, because I do a SiriusXM show where I take calls every day from right-leaning people. And there are people in MAGA who make arguments that we really disagree with, but they feel like it's actually the corrupt elite who hasn't pushed back against Iran since 1979. I don't agree with that viewpoint, but they feel like the foreign policy establishment has actually been cowardly when it comes to Iran. And so that's a viewpoint that I think might be worth debating because none of us agree with it.

1:32:17But that's the type of thing that we probably could set up with someone. So I think that's more work.

1:32:24Saagar Enjeti:okay well it's a fair criticism and now I am booking Mark Levin for Monday so everybody get excited for that I would love to hear his reaction although we can get it Saturday night on Fox Ryan Grimm Ryan Grimm alright well that's going to do it for us this Friday again for those who are still dealing with struggles connecting their Spotify account to their new Supercast trying to get into Supercast trying to get your daily show email and it's not showing up, there's a few reasons that might be happening. It might be going to your promo or spam folder. You may have notifications turned off in your settings, but regardless, we are here to help.

1:33:06Saagar Enjeti:Support at supercast.com. I'm working very closely with all those people and I know it's annoying. I'm so sorry that you're going through any technical inconveniences for the membership and your hard-earned money that you give us to support the show. We really thank you and are grateful for your support. And honestly, it's stressful getting so many emails saying things aren't working. But it's also nice to see people really care about the show and care about getting the show every morning. It means that you guys care a lot. So I am going to spend the rest of this weekend making sure as many people as possible get access.

1:33:44Saagar Enjeti:And support at supercast.com is there as well to help you. And by next week, this whole ship should be smooth sailing. And again, we're working on something behind the scenes that I think all of you are going to like, that we are going to announce sometime next week or the week after. And yeah, big stuff in store. We're going to continue to book big people, maybe some Iran war debates in the future. And if anything breaks over the weekend, someone will be here to inform you of what happened. And we hope you all enjoy your weekend. Bye-bye.

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