7/1/26: Leaked Oct 7 Hannibal Directive Tapes, Colombian Elections, Major New Brain Discovery

1 Jul 2026 · 58 min · 26 chapters

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In short

The episode covers three news/science threads: (1) leaked Oct. 7 “Hannibal Doctrine” tapes and what they suggest about Israeli counterattack/hostage policy; (2) CPJ’s internal policy shift about when journalists can be counted as journalists in Gaza; and (3) a Colombian election analysis plus a separate science segment on a new brain/lymph discovery.

Guests and backgrounds

Ryan (Middle East/CPJ segment commentator, referenced as “Ryan” throughout). Juan David Rojas, columnist at UnHerd, reporting from Bogotá on Colombia’s presidential runoff. Shailen Bott from Georgetown Medical School, a medical student/author of a paper in Journal of Cellular and Molecular Neurobiology.

Key claims and notable examples

Hannibal Doctrine is described as preferring killing potential captors/hostages rather than negotiating exchanges; examples include a Hebrew video where Ben Gvir orders filming to stop and discussion of alleged shelling/hostage claims. CPJ debate: whether journalists affiliated with designated “terror groups” should be excluded; examples include comparisons to state media (BBC/NPR/PBS/RT) and ANC being once designated terrorist. Colombia: Abelardo de la Espriella (“Colombian Bukele” comparison) narrowly beats governing-party candidate Iván Cepeda; discussion contrasts Petro’s minimum wage/labor reforms with security failures, “total peace” negotiations, and climate/energy policy effects. Science: Bott argues CSF drains via lymphatic pathways (cerebro-lymph hypothesis) and suggests implications for autoimmune disease/Alzheimer’s; mentions dye + hydrogen peroxide dissection protocol and acupuncture/long COVID/lymphedema studies.

Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.

Chapters

Tap a time to open that second in VO

The Role of Independent Media

0:46 to 2:10

Discussion on the impact of independent media on elections.

“And I get into a bit of trouble along the way.”

Analysis of the October 7 Video

2:11 to 4:25

Exploration of new footage related to the October 7 events and the Hannibal Doctrine.

“A new video from October 7th, including this Ben Gavir, right?”

The Implications of the Hannibal Doctrine

4:26 to 6:32

Discussion on the ethical implications and political context of the Hannibal Doctrine.

“Now we have this footage of them basically saying just do it.”

Controversies Surrounding Journalist Safety

6:33 to 12:30

Examination of the challenges faced by journalists in conflict zones and the role of the CPJ.

“And meanwhile, Ryan, I'm eager to get your take on this because the publisher over at DropSite has been informed she's no longer a member of the Committee to Protect Journalists.”

Media Representation in Conflict

12:31 to 14:00

Analysis of how journalists are portrayed in conflict and the bias in reporting.

“modern conflict and i think that is a reference to cpj's numbers i think that's per cpj's prior reporting they have actually lower numbers than some of some other organizations because they You have a tighter definition.”

The Dehumanization of Palestinians in Media

14:00 to 16:28

Explore how media representations contribute to the dehumanization of Palestinians.

“But because we don't see Palestinians as fully human, we just see this flat portrait.”

Introduction to Colombian Elections

16:28 to 17:33

An overview of the political landscape in Colombia and the recent elections.

“Well, let's move to Columbia, Ryan, where Juan David Rojas is reporting.”

Analyzing Colombia's Political Shift

22:01 to 24:39

A deep dive into the recent political changes and the new leadership in Colombia.

“a month ago in May, and former president Alvaro Uribe.”

The Impact of Petro's Policies

24:39 to 28:00

Examine the successes and failures of Gustavo Petro's presidency and their implications.

“He raised the minimum wage around, like, 40 % in real terms.”

Colombia's Energy Policies and Consequences

28:00 to 29:08

Explore the impact of Colombia's energy policies under Petro and their economic consequences for citizens.

“He thinks that, you know, we have 12 years to save the planet.”
Show all 26 chapters

Comparative Analysis: Mexico vs. Colombia

29:08 to 30:55

Discuss the differing energy strategies of Mexico and Colombia and their effects on citizens' daily lives.

“Claudia is a climate scientist and she's actually expanding fracking inside of Mexico to shore up the country's energy sovereignty.”

Public Reaction to Energy Policy Changes

30:55 to 32:36

Understanding public sentiment and protests surrounding energy price hikes due to policy changes in Colombia.

“I think that an energy transition is important.”

Crime and Security Policies in Mexico

32:36 to 33:30

Examine the security policies implemented in Mexico and their effectiveness in reducing crime rates.

“the money that you're spending, the extra money that you're spending on energy prices.”

Political Landscape of Mexican Opposition Parties

33:30 to 35:13

Analyze the challenges faced by opposition parties in Mexico amidst a diverse political landscape.

“Claudia, and she has this superstar, they've been calling him Batman.”

New Discoveries in Brain and Body Interaction

41:41 to 42:00

Delve into the recent discoveries that challenge existing understanding of brain anatomy and its connections.

“And so when I was in, I guess my first two years in medical school, I was a TA in the anatomy lab.”

Discovering the Brain's Drainage System

42:00 to 43:15

Learn about a groundbreaking discovery regarding cerebrospinal fluid drainage.

“And so something that was really interesting, one of my buddies actually showed me a paper.”

Understanding the Lymphatic System

43:15 to 44:28

Explore the role of the lymphatic system in the immune response and its connections to various organs.

“Yeah, the long story short, I would say, is that it's just like immunology, right?”

Researching the Connection in Humans

44:28 to 46:23

Follow the process of researching and proving the lymphatic connection in human anatomy.

“Like, what kind of methods, you know, can we do?”

Cerebro-Lymph Hypothesis Explained

46:23 to 48:33

Understand the cerebro-lymph hypothesis and its implications for brain health.

“That's like a word that's thrown around a lot, I feel like.”

Implications for Alzheimer's and Autoimmune Disorders

48:33 to 53:18

Discover how the findings could change approaches to Alzheimer's and other disorders.

“CSF not only drains into blood, but it's blood and lymph, and there's probably different functionalities, right?”

Integrating Acupuncture and Western Medicine

53:18 to 55:43

Explore how acupuncture might support Western medical approaches to health issues.

“So how does something like acupuncture fit into this?”

The Role of Lifestyle in Brain Health

55:43 to 56:00

Learn how lifestyle factors like exercise and meditation might enhance brain function.

“If you keep the body in motion and you keep your nutrition.”

The Importance of Brain Health and Flow

56:00 to 57:29

Explore how exercise and meditation enhance brain function.

“So it's like your heart rate's going up, you're cleaning more of your perivascular space, which is just like the space that's right next to the blood vessels, right?”

Glympho-Vasomotor Field Theory Explained

57:30 to 59:34

Learn about a new theory that links brain fluid flow to consciousness.

“And I guess what all of you mean by that?”

Artificial Intelligence and Consciousness

59:35 to 1:02:09

Delve into the debate surrounding AI and its consciousness potential.

“Because they sit right next to each other, right?”

Turning Discovery into Therapy

1:02:10 to 1:04:25

Discuss the potential for new therapies based on recent discoveries.

“Do you start in the fall again with your third year?”
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Transcript

Automatic transcript. May contain errors.

0:00This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human. I turned off news altogether. I hate to say it, but I don't trust much of anything. It's the rage bait. It feels like it's trying to divide people. We got clear facts. Maybe we can calm down a little. NBC News brings you clear reporting. Let's meet at the facts. Let's move forward from there. NBC News, reporting for America. I'm Mungesha Tikalur, and I'm back with a new season of my podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I talk to scientists, biopunks, curmudgeons, blues owners, super seniors, and Goa's top cryotherapy lab to try to understand this obsession with living forever and what it means for all of us.

0:51And I get into a bit of trouble along the way. I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive, How to Live Forever on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Michael Rappaport, and my podcast, the I Am Rappaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike any one you've ever heard. If you're looking for strong opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture, and whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson.

1:29Listen to I Am Rap Report on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hey guys, Sagar and Crystal here. Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show. This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else. So if that is something that's important to you, please go to BreakingPoints.com, become a member today, and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad-free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

2:01We need your help to build the future of independent news media, and we hope to see you at BreakingPoints.com.

2:09Let's talk about Israel, Ryan. A new video from October 7th, including this Ben Gavir, right? Right. Ben Gavir is showing up in this video. And we'll kind of read some of the, because it's in Hebrew. So there's a documentary crew or news crew who's in there filming on the morning of October 7th as the army is putting together its plan for a counterattack, for a defense and then a counterattack. So let's roll this, and then we can kind of read it for you. Right now, one person says, I would bomb the entire Gaza border, hit them with a blow so they'd have a real problem. It looks like they're on it, somebody else says.

2:48I wrote this to Amir. They're not even getting fighter helicopters. He says, no, on Gaza, break it all apart, along with the soldiers who were abducted. And the helicopters were then were dispatched, and you see a lot of the result of what those helicopters did. and then Ben Gavir comes in and says, wait, wait, are you filming me? You could film when I give you permission. Please take this out. So that's when they shut that down. We know we have other evidence of there being hostage situations in a kibbutz where they tank, shell everyone in there, killing the Israelis inside as well. There's all these infamous photos of cars that were fleeing the Nova Rave just completely burnt to a crisp.

3:43And we also know that the Palestinian fighters came across the border with AK-47s. The Hamas guys, yeah. Not the kind of thing that could torch an entire row of cars. There was shelling in the morning, some shelling from Gaza could, if a shell directly hits a car, okay. But an entire highway filled with cars and there has been some footage from the Apaches of them hitting cars unsure blowing them up, unsure whether or not there were hostages inside. I thought the government actually admitted or seeded that in a small way. In a small way. Now we have this footage of them basically saying just do it.

4:30and if you hit the people who, the Israelis who were abducted, that's part of it. This is the so-called Hannibal Doctrine, which says that it's better. Explain that because that's what's up. The Hannibal Doctrine says that if there is a potential of a hostage situation or a prisoner of war situation, that it is better to kill all the Palestinians and the Israeli they're trying to take hostage than get into a place where you're negotiating a prisoner exchange. So it is more important, according to this doctrine, for the Israelis to continue to hold men, women, and children in administrative detention in torturous conditions than it is to let an Israeli live and then enter into negotiations in which some of those people that you're holding without charge and torturing on a daily basis are released.

5:32And this is, of course, as Israel elections are heating up as well. Yeah, and in 2016, they said they were no longer, that the Hannibal Doctrine is bad. We're not doing that. It's terrible. Clearly, they're still doing it. Again, we're coming up on three years since October 7th, and now that there's an election around the corner in Israel, I don't think it's, I would be surprised if it was a coincidence this was dropping at this time because of that. Because, I mean, Netanyahu's coalition is the, including Ben Gavir and Smotrich and the like, is one of the biggest complaints about Netanyahu. And so it seems like that would be timed in a particular way to hurt the election.

6:12Yeah. I don't know the background. I would imagine this will be a problem. You would hope. There are people on the Israeli right who support this policy. Certainly. Yeah. Yeah. But, I mean, Netanyahu has a lot to answer for on October 7th. Right. Yes. Focus on October 7th is not great for him, period. No. Not whatsoever. And meanwhile, Ryan, I'm eager to get your take on this because the publisher over at DropSite has been informed she's no longer a member of the Committee to Protect Journalists. We can put the next element up on the screen. And a lot of this is going, once again, right back to Israel, Palestine.

6:54what the heck is happening here? So the CPJ has been under a lot of pressure to redo the way that it counts journalists who've been killed in Gaza by Israel. And so there was this internal debate over how they're going to do this. And at the core of the the core of the debate is what about a journalist forever the way that CPJ has done it and they're more restrictive than other organizations has been to say what you do is what matters if you are performing journalism you're not fighting you have a video camera you have pen and paper you're writing or producing video for a news outlet or for freelance you're a journalist And we are the committee to protect journalists and we are here to protect you.

7:53What Israel has been arguing is that there are certain news organizations that are linked to what they say are terror groups and what the U.S. and Israel designate as terror groups. So pretty much every political faction in Gaza is designated as a terror group by either Israel or the United States or both. and pretty much every party has a news affiliate, just like Israel has state media. Israel has Israeli Army Radio, which employs a lot of journalists. The BBC is owned by the UK. There's NPR and PBS, but I guess there's state money going. Maybe the federal government doesn't fund them as much as they did, but you get the idea.

8:44There's RT, for instance, Russia Today. There's Turkish state media. Like the idea of state media or affiliated media is a very common thing. And so organizations like CPJ have always drawn a very bright line that have said just because you have a problem with Turkey or with Britain or with the United States or with Israel does not mean you have license to kill a journalist who works for an affiliate of the British government or the American government, Israeli government or Hamas or Palestinian Islamic Jihad or PFLP. or like said Palestine today, like just because you write for a news organization that is affiliated with Palestinian Islamic Jihad or in Southern Lebanon, you recently had several journalists that were killed because they said, well, you're working for a news organization that's affiliated with Hezbollah or has sympathies with Hezbollah.

9:47Terrorists, right. Yeah. And the distinction has always been no. If you're a journalist, it doesn't matter if you work for RT. Like Ukraine, for instance, would not be allowed to kill a journalist for RT simply because they work for RT. You can disagree with that and Ukraine might try to kill them. But if you're the committee to protect journalists, your job is to protect the journalists, not to defend what they say, who they say it on behalf of, whether or not their columns that they write are good or fair or even accurate. Like, it's not for CPJ to determine. It's like, it's that, was it the Voltaire quote?

10:31You know, I don't agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to say it, but applied to journalists. I don't. And so what they're what what Israel is saying? No, no. If they're affiliated with any of these terrorist organizations that we call terrorist organizations, non-state. That's what they would say. It's different than Russia or Ukraine. It's a non-state terrorist. Well, I think Ukraine would say it's not. They consider Russia to be terrorists. Right. Right. So why should then Russian journalists be. Which is what's hairy about CPJ then. And the other, Nika made the point internally that the ANC was considered a terror group.

11:10The African National Congress, Nelson Mandela's group, was designated a terrorist group until like 2008 or something like that. And of course, they had a journalist, they had a media wing. so if the you know white south africans consider nelson mandela's organization to be a non-state terror group should they then be able to kill journalists like bomb a journalist tent um kill everyone in it because there's one person that writes for the anc linked organization. The civilized world has settled this question with a resounding no, no, we're not doing this. And so now there's real pressure on CPJ.

11:55Nika asked for a vote on this internally. That's, and then they responded by saying, oh, by the way, we have, your term is up. And she's like, well, I resign in protest anyway. Convenience. You can't, can't fire me. I quit. Right. Right. Right. So, you know, and good for Nika for, you know, standing up for the kind of essence of what CPJ is supposed to do. Protect. It's in the name. It's a committee to protect journalists. and as we can put what middle east monitor is reporting here this is going to be uh yeah d3 uh this comes obviously as they report israel has killed more journalists than in any other modern conflict and i think that is a reference to cpj's numbers i think that's per cpj's prior reporting they have actually lower numbers than some of some other organizations because they You have a tighter definition.

12:51Now, if somebody wants to say this particular journalist was actually a fighter. Right. And they want to present evidence to that. Okay, fine. Which they have in certain cases. And then go ahead and present that evidence. That's different than saying all journalists who work for any news organization that's affiliated with somebody you don't like are fair game to be killed. Some people have responded by posting photos of Israeli journalists sitting on tanks, wearing military uniforms, holding weapons, because almost every Israeli journalist has served in the IDF at some point. some are in the reserves as they're doing it and others have on air participated in firing weapons and detonating civilian homes like they'll they'll film themselves like pressing the button and the contrast between that and what they what they then accused the palestinians of is so stark there's also something about there's also a dehumanizing element to it like one of the journalist that they killed who was legendary journalist for 20 plus years um he visited a a i think it was a hamas kind of training camp and with a bunch of other journalists reported on it and while there took some photographs like with a bazooka that's the kind of thing that every american journalist when they go to visit a military base they do that go look at any american journalist like twitter is like they'll like sit on a tank they'll like pose with the soldiers like it's almost childish like they think it's kind of cute and cool to like get these little souvenir photos of themselves like sitting on a tank yeah but we understand because we understand that they're human that that's that's just what it was they were in their journalistic capacity they were visiting an american military base took a picture on a tank that does not make them a tank commander.

15:02But because we don't see Palestinians as fully human, we just see this flat portrait. If we see a Palestinian on a tank or we see a Palestinian holding a weapon, we say, oh, terrorist, obviously terrorist. It doesn't matter when they held it, why they held it, what's going on, because there's no full portrait of the person as a person. Right, right. It's just, oh, Palestinian, probably a terrorist. oh, now we have a picture of them with a gun. And then you'll have these, like Eitan Fischberger and others, like we'll post that picture of the person on Twitter until they are hunted and killed. With, you know, just completely decontextualized.

15:41And then when they're hunted and killed, they'll repost that photo and be like, look, we got another terrorist. It's like, no, you didn't. You killed an unarmed civilian journalist who at one point in his life was near a weapon. That's all. Of course, it's been hard for us to even know what's happening in Gaza because the journalists that are there, people are observing it there. Yeah, of course. Of course. And it's the goal for us to not know what's being done. Yeah. I mean, at this point, unfathomable lack of access that's also inexplicable from just a if you really cared about people having the ability to document and observe and see what's happening on the ground because you think it suits your purposes.

16:22you think it makes your argument look correct, then this decision makes no sense. Well, let's move to Columbia, Ryan, where Juan David Rojas is reporting. I'm Manga Shatigular, and I'm back with a new season of the podcast Skyline Drive. This time I'm diving into a rabbit hole of peptides, organoids, blood boys, blue zones, and brain replacement to try to understand what this longevity obsession is all about and what it really means to live forever for all of us. I learned about some rad science. I can make a brain for you, and then we can test what draw is the best for your brain, as opposed to his brain.

17:04Here are some hard truths. I would expect Indians to age faster, but I did not expect it to be almost a four to five year acceleration. And get myself into a world of trouble. I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive, How to Live Forever on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

17:34Mainstream media is full of crude depictions of the unhoused. Stories that shame and blame and paint the unhoused as a monolith. We the Unhoused is the podcast that's changing that. I'm Theo Henderson, creator and host, and for years I've created a space where the Unhoused and their advocates can tell their own stories. In the last few months alone, I've interviewed Unhoused parents, immigrants, mutual aid organizers, veterans, the LGBTQIA plus community, and the policymakers who make the laws that impact the Unhoused existence. We do Unhoused as a two-time Webby and Signal Award winning show with many exciting guests on the horizon.

18:16Tune in this week for my interview with Dr. Jill Wittler, a street doctor turned influencer whose work with the Unhoused community has made a huge impact online and in her community. Listen to We The Unhoused on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Michael Rappaport and my podcast, the I Am Rappaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike anyone you've ever heard. We're a variety show, and if you're looking for strong opinions, funny opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture, and whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid, Jafar Jackson, is as good as Rami Malek, as Freddie Mercury, and it's as good as Timothee Chalamet, as Bob Dylan.

19:06And I say that with love and respect for both of those actors. And I don't know how many Oscar nominations they give out. I don't know if it's five, six for best actor. 150 % this kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely, positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson. Listen to I Am Rappaport on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I Am Rappaport Podcast.

19:36We're joined once again by Juan David Rojas. He is a columnist at UnHerd, as am I, by the way. So that's a fun little UnHerd reunion here. Juan David Rojas, thank you for joining us from Bogota, where you have been covering the Colombian election, although we just asked you what the vibe is like in Bogota, and you said World Cup. Yeah, a lot of excitement about all the games. Everyone watching every single game, so it's exciting. Yeah, I'm sure it is electric down there. Now, Gustavo Petro obviously is on his way out in early August, August 7th. Here's just a little clip of Gustavo Petro from recent days.

20:17He's, let's just put this, I'm just going to roll it. Let's roll this. This is E1. There he is. You can see him looking like he's a rapper, I guess, right? Which is oddly appropriate because the man who's going to be replacing him, And Abelardo de la Espriella has some of his own music videos that we would be remiss if we didn't also show. Yeah, this is E2. You can see the new incoming Colombian president who defeated Petro's would-be heir in his own music video, looking as Colombian as I think a person can look, it's fair to say. So Juan David Rojas, what the hell is going on? And Petro obviously, Petro's party obviously loses.

21:03De las Prio, now referred to as the Colombian Bukele, who also has, I think, a pretty interesting melee streak tossed into the Bukele streak. What is going on in Colombia? Yeah, so Colombia just had its presidential runoff like a week ago. And it was the closest election in Colombian history. The difference between both candidates was about 200 ,000 votes. and de las priega narrowly defeated the governing party candidate iban cepeda close ally of petro and oh boy yeah where to start with this guy in a way yeah he's kind of a right-wing version of petro he's really eccentric he's actually they're both from the caribbean columbia's caribbean coast um this guy you know where to start like he's a mob lawyer he made millions representing like drug dealing right-wing narco paramilitaries, Maduro loyalist businessman Alex Saab, who was extradited to the U.S.

22:03a month ago in May, and former president Alvaro Uribe. Actually, he represented the leader of the AUC paramilitaries, Salvatore Mancuso, who said that him and Abelardo were childhood friends. He was also extradited to the U.S. and served time abroad. So, yeah, this guy, like, you know, I've compared him. He's clearly taken influences from three people, Trump, Millay, and Bukele. So with Bukele, it's like his appearance, the tough on crime stuff. You know, crime is a serious problem in Colombia. From Trump, like the fact that he's an outsider businessman. He says as soon as he's sworn into office, he's going to, you know, put it.

22:46He has a raft of executive orders that he's going to put through to deregulate and privatize a bunch of stuff. But from Millet, I think he's most similar to Millet because just like Millet, before he ran for president, he was an elite libertarian. He's very socially progressive on a lot of issues. He's in favor of abortion, euthanasia, adoption for same-sex couples. He was an open atheist. But then he had to conservatize himself because that only appeals to a narrow slice of the population. so like now he's like uh an ultra catholic colombian patriot uh his slogan was firm for the homeland which is kind of farcical he's a tri-citizen of italy the u.s and colombia and hasn't lived hasn't lived in colombia for the past 10 years so uh it's uh yeah it's pretty sad didn't his wife say something like the best part about this is if we lose we just go back to miami Exactly.

23:42Yeah. If they lose, they can go back to their mansions in Florence and Miami. He loves Trump. He said that he donated Maria Vida Salazar's campaign, the Miami representative. And he says he's a registered Republican in the U.S. and voted for Trump. So it's like, wow, this is a lot. I've called him literally a U.S. asset. So, right. So, OK, so how on earth do if you're the Colombian left, you lose to this guy and compare it to the Morena Party, Compare it to the Mexican left, which is dominant, which has one huge swath of the middle class over to its side. Claudia Sheinbaum's popularity is stratospheric.

24:24Why is she doing so well compared to the Colombian left, which lost to a gangster's attorney from South Florida? Perfect question. It's going to take me a while to get through. So I will say, like, Petro did a lot of things that I think were objectively really good, and they're similar to what Amlo and Scheinbaum did. He raised the minimum wage around, like, 40 % in real terms. Actually, this year, in nominal terms, the minimum wage has raised 23%, the most for a single year in Colombia's history. And this created a panic from the media, the opposition, that this would spike inflation and create unemployment.

25:00None of that happened. and Petro is actually due to leave office as the most popular Colombian president since Udiv. His approval rating is close to 50%. Now, admittedly, there's a low bar, pretty low bar for recent Colombian president. He passed the labor reform, reduced the work week to 42 hours from 46. Workers also have more overtime. Before, Udiv cut that so that on holidays you only got 70 % as opposed to 100 % of overtime. there's an agrarian reform to like restore land lost to people from the armed conflict that were displaced by violence i interviewed a guy with clips were posted for dropside this petro supporter was a former soldier actually and he said that his hometown in rural columbia had really been transformed by petro's government which i found really inspiring so that's the good what's the bad well uh we'll start with security uh i like to make a difference they're related but there's a difference between like common crime you know just like muggings burglary cell phone theft stuff like that in like big cities and like organized crime dealing with like these militarized cartels insurgent groups uh right-wing paramilitaries in the countryside uh and so on like the common crime front petro like really came at this from like a progressive like criminal justice reform um ideal which i think is a little dumb like he condemned building prisons because he didn't want to perpetuate mass incarceration and it's like dude you're the president of the you know the land of pablo escobar for the love of god you need to throw prison you know criminals in jail there was this youth influencer west cold who uh asked him and they last play a day if like a you know criminal broke into your house what would you do petro gave this long philosophical answer that you know criminals are victims of society and you know he has a family like whatever and the last video was just like do with him as he's t-fit so it's like anyway on um on like organized crime uh he had this interesting idea i i supported at the time i just think the uh execution was terrible total peace which is that you know the government would negotiate peace deals or terms of surrender with multiple armed groups at the same time the ELN, FARC dissidents, offshoots of the AUC.

27:22And there were a lot of problems with this. The follow through really wasn't there. A lot of these armed groups just kind of took advantage of the government to fortify themselves. And Cepeda actually was the architect of this policy. And unfortunately, on the campaign, he was like, I'm the peace candidate. I will never say no to peace, which is fine, but, you know, he never said, like, if he'd really make any changes to the policy, take a harder line with some of these groups that really haven't shown an interest towards peace, like the ELN. And then the other important thing, in my opinion, is on energy.

27:58Petro is what I call a climate fundamentalist. He thinks that, you know, we have 12 years to save the planet. And so he completely destroyed the state-owned oil company, Eco Petro, which is the number, with the largest company, the single largest company in the country with the largest union, too. And I've argued this actually caused, like, stagflation. In his first few years, there was really high inflation and really low economic growth. You know, it would make sense because this is a huge driver of growth in the country. Around half of government revenues come from the oil sector. And Petro just said there will be no more novel oil exploration.

28:39He put a bunch of like climate academics and like degrowth types, this super corrupt crony as the head of the Ecopetrol's board. And so this was just a complete disaster. I talked to like one taxi driver who was like, he's destroying the jewel of the republic. And it's like, dude, you're a leftist. You're supposed to defend state companies, not destroy them. And so that's a really important difference with like Mexico. You look at like what Amlo and Scheinbaum have done. Claudia is a climate scientist and she's actually expanding fracking inside of Mexico to shore up the country's energy sovereignty.

29:17Petro has called that a crime against humanity but look like the data is in it's been you know there's a lot of fears about water understandably so but if you do things correctly contamination of water tends to be pretty minimal it's just a lot of like environmental propaganda, in my opinion. So another thing of all, this is the last thing. Shane Baum actually and her security minister, Hartfuch, they've taken a really aggressive policy against crime. Mexico's incarceration rate has wound up a ton. Let's get to that crime in a second. Let me get to that in one minute. So unpack what you said about the energy policy.

29:54So what was the effect of Mexican energy policy on what middle class and working people in Mexico paid for energy and what was the effect in Colombia of Petro's energy policies on what people there paid? Because I think that that's what probably matters to people in the end is what they're seeing kind of flow out of their accounts. Yeah, exactly. I mean, you know, there were points during AMLO's term where there were Americans going to Mexico to fill up across the border because it was cheaper over there. And, like, Mexico used to import all of its gasoline from the U.S. That's actually gone down a ton, like 50%.

30:35Unfortunately, natural gas around three-fourths of Mexico's natural gas still comes from Texas, and that's a big reason to expand fracking, you know. And Shane Baum says she wants to do that responsibly, which I laud. But in Colombia, on the other hand, you know, gas prices have gone through the roof. And look, I believe in climate change. I think that an energy transition is important. And I think that's good. It's good that Petro has, you know, invested in like solar panels and stuff like that, but it can't come at the expense of workers. And so I would just say that, you know, both sides of the political spectrum, especially in the U.S., don't demonize a particular like energy source.

31:15Don't demonize renewables. I think what like the Republicans did with the IRA was completely dumb, especially after like invading Iran. At the same time, like don't demonize fossil fuels and like try to shut down pipelines. We need energy, period. And think about this holistically. So what happened in Colombia, like to energy prices? Yeah, that's another thing. Petro, he restored them towards the end of this term, but he also cut energy subsidies. So gas prices shot up. He actually said something like, oh, the poor don't drive. So what does this matter? And there's this thinking that it's like if you make driving more expensive, then people will be forced to buy electric vehicles.

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31:57There's some truth to that, but you also cause a lot of pain to people. so feels like similar to the mistake that macron made um in france that exactly a yellow vest protest where they were they kind of led with led with the climate um and told people to kind of suck it up for the for a good purpose saving the planet um you know saving you know the place that humanity will you know needs to thrive um but in the short term i think most people as the yellow the Vest protests and other protests around the world showed, people don't necessarily believe, I think, that you're actually saving the planet.

32:35They think people are just getting richer with the money that you're spending, the extra money that you're spending on energy prices. So is that, to you, is that how significant a distinction between Mexican left-wing success and Colombian left-wing failure, is it to say that under the Mexican left, they drove down, they made things more affordable for people, and Petro, at least in some circumstances, did not? Yeah, I think that's absolutely correct. It's undeniable. I mean, actually, you look at energy prices overall, for instance, for homes, and they've been pretty stable in Mexico, which is rather remarkable.

33:18Okay, so then you wanted to talk about the crime difference between kind of Mexico and Colombia. So when I cut you off, go ahead. On security, yeah. Claudia, and she has this superstar, they've been calling him Batman. It's funny, in Mexico, they're like selling towels with like Omar Garcia Harfuch's likeness on like these shirtless muscular bodies. They like sell dolls of him. I mean, he's actually talked about as a contender for Mexico's next president. He's extremely competent, probably the best security minister that Mexico's ever had. And I mean, Mexico's homicide rate has gone a ton, but not just that.

33:59Like, Mexico's incarceration rate, the country's prison population has gone up a ton. And to quote a mutual friend of ours who will remain anonymous, the problem is, like, the progressive method just, it doesn't work. incarcerating people if it's of criminals, like, you know, not of minor offenses, but like actual criminals is a good thing. And so, in my opinion, at least. And you actually see there's a progressive opposition party in Mexico, Movimiento Suyano, and they criticize the government a lot because they think that, you know, they've gone too hard on crime, if you can believe that. No, I can believe that.

34:36So what has been, politically, how has that party fared with that criticism? You know, the Mexican opposition, they're really screwed because it's just kind of this octopus that's extremely incoherent. There's MSC, Movimiento Ciudadano, which I just mentioned. There's the right-wing PAN, and there's the centrist PRI. And so like the bond wants to go even harder on crime. MC wants to go softer on crime. The PRI is just corrupt. And so they don't really know what to do. They're really in a difficult bind. And that also helps the governing coalition a lot. All right, Juan David Rojas, always a pleasure to have you.

35:18We'll put the piece in our newsletter, which you should sign up for at breakingpoints.com. I'm talking to you directly, but also to the audience watching, breakingpoints.com. Get the free newsletter. It's great. Thanks, Juan David. We'll take any one. Last thing I'll say really quick. The De La Sprella, this guy, he's certain to fail. Similar with Groupthink on Energy on the left and stuff like that with progressives. He's completely beholden to market fundamentalism. He wants to privatize most state companies, who knows, maybe even Ecopetrol, and fire 40 % of state employees. This is going to lead to mass protests in a few months.

35:54How do I know this? Because this is exactly what's happening in all the other right-wing government countries. And in the meantime, U.S. taxpayer money will be bailing him out, and U.S. oligarchs will capitalize on the privatization of those assets. So thanks, Juan David, for telling us what both is happening and what will happen. Exactly. All right. Talk to you later. I'm Manga Shatikular, and I'm back with a new season of the podcast Skyline Drive. This time I'm diving into a rabbit hole of peptides, organoids, blood boys, blue zones, and brain replacement to try to understand what this longevity obsession is all about and what it really means to live forever for all of us.

36:32I learned about some rad science. I can make a brain for you, and then we can test what draw is the best for your brain, as opposed to his brain. Here are some hard truths. I would expect Indians to age faster, but I did not expect it to be almost a four to five year acceleration. And get myself into a world of trouble. I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive, How to Live Forever on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

37:14Mainstream media is full of cruel depictions of the unhoused. Stories that shame and blame and paint the unhoused as a monolith. We the Unhoused is the podcast that's changing that. I'm Theo Henderson, creator and host. And for years, I've created a space where the unhoused and their advocates can tell their own stories. In the last few months alone, I've interviewed unhoused parents, immigrants, mutual aid organizers, veterans, the LGBTQIA plus community and the policymakers who make the laws that impact the unhoused existence. We do unhoused as a two time Webby and Signal Award winning show with many exciting guests on the horizon.

37:57Tune in this week for my interview with Dr. Jill Wittcheron, a street doctor turned influencer whose work with the Unhoused community has made a huge impact online and in her community. Listen to We The Unhoused on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Michael Rappaport, and my podcast, the I Am Rappaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike anyone you've ever heard. We're a variety show, and if you're looking for strong opinions, funny opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture, and whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid, Jafar Jackson, is as good as Rami Malek, as Freddie Mercury, and it's as good as Timothee Chalamet, as Bob Dylan.

38:46And I say that with love and respect for both of those actors. And I don't know how many Oscar nominations they give out. I don't know if it's five, six for best actor. 150 % this kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson. Listen to I Am Rappaport on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I Am Rappaport Podcast.

39:17I don't really know how to describe this segment that we're about to do other than that it might change the way that you think about a lot of different things. Yeah. Let's go with that. This is Pete Grangrim. If you look at the bottom bar today, it says MKUltra Hannibal Brains. So joining us is Shailen Bott from Georgetown Medical School. You did two years of medical school since I've even taken a couple years off. because of a discovery that you made as a medical student, which was just now published in, what is it, the Journal of... Cellular and Molecular Neurobiology. Which Ryan reads every day.

39:56I read... That's how this... I'm thumbing through this. I'm like, this is fascinating stuff. But it's shaking up our understanding, I think, of the way that the brain interacts with the rest of the body and has some interesting, raises interesting questions about Western versus Eastern medicine even, that you may have, that some of the things that you've discovered may actually suggest that those Easterners might have been onto something more than we thought. And they've been doing it for thousands of years, not because they're crazy. Like maybe we're the crazy ones. So first of all, welcome. I know you've been watching the show for a long time.

40:40We've been communicating for a couple of years now because when you first discovered this, you reached out. You're like, I can believe what I found. I'm like, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but you've successfully explained it, I think, over the years. So it's a pleasure to have you on here. Thanks for having me on. Yeah. So you brought some props, too. Yeah, I have. So what I found fascinating was that for the most part, science and medicine kind of believes they've discovered everything about the body that there is to be discovered. Yeah. You found out that that's not exactly true. Yeah.

41:13So the thing is, is that a lot of what Western medicine is built on is, at least in the anatomical sense, it's what a lot of anatomists did like way back in the day, right? Like especially like in Europe, you know, where they just had the cadavers out onto tables and they just dissected. And so for the longest time, we just kind of thought like we know what's in there. You know, people have gone through everything. You would think so. Yeah, you would think. You would think. I don't know. I have a tendency for hyper-curiosity, I guess some would call it. And so when I was in, I guess my first two years in medical school, I was a TA in the anatomy lab.

41:52So there's a bunch of cadavers, but we use the term donors just to be respectful. There's a bunch of donors already in the anatomy lab. And so something that was really interesting, one of my buddies actually showed me a paper. and it was a discovery I think in I want to say 2024 January 2024 and it was in rats they found this drain that sits like right behind your nose and it drains cerebrospinal fluid which is just the juice that your brain sits in but it doesn't drain it into blood which is like the you know the notion that medicine is kind of built on it actually drains into these other vessels that are called lymphatic vessels.

42:36And so the... So they thought it drained into blood. Yeah, right. But what it was found in the rats is that it was draining into lymphatic vessels. Exactly right. So the... That's significant. Yeah, right. Yeah. And so the idea is like, oh, like medicine's built on this idea that there's no quote unquote lymphatic connection to the central nervous system. And so, yeah, that's where it kind of all started from that paper. I was like, I'm really interested in this. My friend was like, bet you can't find it. And And like, you know, we just like went on from there. So this gets into the autoimmune world.

43:08So what's the lymphatic, like describe for us, what's the lymphatic system and what is its relevance to how our body functions? Yeah, the long story short, I would say, is that it's just like immunology, right? Like it's where your immune cells travel, right? Like I would say like if your immune cells like had some kind of freeway to hop on to get from one point to your body. Literally osmosis Jones. Yeah, yeah, exactly. They would use the lymphatic system. And the lymphatic system has a bunch of connections to a bunch of different organs, like your spleen, your gut. That's probably a significant one, like gut-associated lymphatic tissue, GALT for short.

43:49The potential idea of immune connections from your gut to your brain, the gut-brain axis, all these kind of emerging ideas might be related to this. And so your buddy says, okay, we found in rats that the brain is draining to the lymphatic system. Yeah. I bet you can't find it in humans. Sure, yeah. And so... You took that challenge. You took that challenge. So how'd you go about looking? Yeah, so it started off... There was a lot of trial and error kind of ways to look for exactly, is this connection real or not? There's a lot of, like, research, like, background research you have to do online to see, like, all right, what did these anatomists do back in the day?

44:33Like, what kind of methods, you know, can we do? Basically, the long story short is, like, after a bunch of trial and error and, like, a lot of help from peers and a lot of help from, like, mentors, you know, we developed this, like, dissection protocol that really just boils down to, like, dye and hydrogen peroxide. You know, there was this idea that like, oh, you can't inject stuff into formal and fixed donors because, or I'm sorry, you can't inject stuff into lymphatics in formal and fixed donors because the vessels are like super tight. But we just used hydrogen peroxide because it like bubbles, right?

45:13So it just like opens up the vessel a little bit and let the dye kind of just like travel up to the brain and see like, all right, where is it going? Like you held like the body's like upside down a little bit? Like there was like a block underneath the thorax, right? And so like once that injection's in, the head's like kind of back a little bit. And so the dye just like travels back. You just, you know, leave the dye overnight kind of thing. And it's just like gravity does all the work, if that makes sense. Obvious question, but why hadn't anyone else probed that potential connection before?

45:43And what response did you get as you said, well, we're going to look into this? Yeah, that's a really good question. So I think there's two kind of aspects to this, right? One, these vessels are like super tiny, right? Like if you were to operate on them in real life, like literally that is called microsurgery, right? And I just, I don't know, I like dissecting small stuff, right? Who among us? Right. So, yeah. So I think that's the first thing, right? Is that like when you're like looking at stuff in a human body, right, there's really small vessels and there's stuff that you can miss, right?

46:19that's surrounded in this like adhesive tissue called fascia. That's like a word that's thrown around a lot, I feel like. What was the second part of your question? Just what response did you get? As you said, I'm looking into this. Because what's interesting to me about that is there was this sense that we knew. It wasn't we don't know what we don't know. It was that we kind of thought we knew how something worked. And you said, well, actually, maybe it's different. Yeah. So I think, yeah, there's two different responses, right? I think people who are interested in this area, they found it like extremely interesting right they were like oh wow this is this is like really interesting stuff and like i don't know it's kind of like an emerging space right so people are like excited about it so that was on one hand um on i guess like another hand uh probably a lot of like people being like i don't know maybe this med student's getting a little too excited which is like reasonable i am pretty excited about this stuff right i'm not going to deny that um but But, you know, there's always, and this is something I'm still learning, like, right, like to not like over claim anything and stuff like that.

47:20And so, like, I don't know, at someone at my age when you're like, oh, I think I found something. It's like, is this kid okay? Like, we don't really know. And yeah, so, yeah. So you've got some props here for us. Yeah, I do. So originally, people believed that the blood drained into the, it's the real fluid into blood vessels. Yeah, just that. Which has particular implications for how we would treat all sorts of brain-related and immuno-related disorders. Yeah. Now you find out that's not true, that it drains into the lymphatic system. Is there a way to demonstrate this with what you brought in?

48:00And then what does it tell us about medicine in the body? What possibilities does this open up for people with autoimmune disorders? Sure, yeah. or Alzheimer's or anything else? Sure, yeah. Yeah, so the first thing is that, you know, this entire kind of, I don't know, bit, it's still like, like CSF still drains into blood, right? This idea that I introduced called the cerebro-lymph hypothesis, right? It has this idea of like CSF not only drains into blood, but it's blood and lymph, and there's probably different functionalities, right? Like one set of pipes is for one thing and one set of pipes is for another thing, right?

48:47So yeah, I introduced a hypothesis in the discussion of this paper and it's called the cerebral lymph hypothesis and it's just essentially like the anatomical network of where CSF is produced all the way to draining out into the body. It's the spinal fluid. CSF is the cerebrals. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. So go ahead, say that again. So what's the hypothesis? So the hypothesis is called the cerebral lymph hypothesis. It's basically an anatomical framework for where CSF is produced, right? So it's actually this thing right here, right? So this is the ventricular system. It's produced in the choroid plexus, which is this like little red streak, right?

49:29So there's right here, and then there's like right here, and then right here, and then down here, right? So CSF is produced there, and this is essentially like the deepest part of your brain, right? And this looks like a structure, but realistically, it's not like, it's walls of a pocket of juice, right? So it's produced here, and then it exits kind of down here where we call the median and lateral apertures. That's just a fancy term for holes, right? So from the holes, it goes into this space that's like around here, right? And that's called the subarachnoid space. And where does that map onto the form?

50:04Yeah, so this is actually where it drains after the subarachnoid spree. Okay, so flip that around and point on the head towards the bottom. Yeah, okay. So that makes sense. Yeah. I guess the significance is that before the CSF exits here and then, you know, drains into here, it goes through this system that was recently discovered by Dr. Mike in Nadergaard. And this system is called the glymphatic system. And the glymphatic system essentially just cleans your brain. It, like, runs through your brain and cleans the entire thing. And then this is what drains it. Okay. Right. And the, like, the pictures that I sent, right, like the pictures of the fountain, right?

50:51Oh, yeah. Let's put that up. Yeah. So this is just cup one, right? And then it exits into cup two, right, which is the subarachnoid space and glymphatic system. And then the meningeal lymphatic vessels, which is also a recent discovery, that's this prop, right? This prop that is just like an open head. And then the stuff that we found in anatomy lab is the fourth one, the nerve-adjacent lymphatic vessels exiting foramina. We didn't show any proof of like CSF exiting, right? So this is literally just a hypothesis. But from there, you have your peripheral lymphatic circulation, which is like all that stuff I was talking about earlier, like your gut-associated lymphatic tissue and whatnot.

51:34So, yeah. And to Ryan's question about how this might open up frontiers for autoimmune treatment, what is that going forward? What were we doing that might change, whether it's – you were talking about Alzheimer's as well. Yeah, Alzheimer's is probably the biggest one. So Alzheimer's is built on the amyloid and tau hypotheses, right? And these have been hypotheses for decades. And a lot of the infrastructure for research is kind of built around these things. The thing about amyloid and tau is that they describe the protein buildup that occurs in your brain, right? So they just describe this protein that just appears in your brain and then causes the neurodegeneration.

52:16That's their theory. Yeah, exactly, right. So a lot of money has been going into that. A lot of money has been poured into that. The thing about, I guess, those hypotheses is that they explain the proteins really well, right? And it's like there's been a lot of really great work that's been done about Alzheimer's. The issue is that there's not a lot being talked about the flow of those proteins and the drainage of those proteins. And the idea of introducing something like cerebrolymph is if we look at both the protein buildup and the drainage system, we might be able to get somewhere closer to Alzheimer's.

52:58Like something crazy like plastic surgeons doing surgeries for Alzheimer's in the neck, right? Why is that? Just because it's traveling in different pathways? Or not draining effectively. Exactly, right. And it's just like improving that kind of like connection. Like that's the dream essentially, you know, is that for something like that to be a possibility one day. So how does something like acupuncture fit into this? Yeah, that's a really good question. So acupuncture is really interesting. And I think it's kind of emerging too. A lot of the stuff we do is like we look at like traditional practices and then we just like validate them, even though people knew about them, you know, for a long time.

53:36But there's two really interesting peer review studies. One about like acupuncture helping long COVID patients. And long COVID has a lot to do with like, you know, brain stuff, right? And it also coincidentally, it helps with like things like lymphedema and like the brain fog that comes up like during lymphedema. So there you have like two completely different things, right? Like long COVID and lymphedema, right? Which is just like your limbs like swelling up because you're not getting good drainage. but it kind of goes back into the hypothesis of like alright maybe there's just like a build up in this like fountain you know I don't know does that make sense yeah yeah cause you know eastern medicine is always talking about the body's flow yeah exactly right and you're like you're like actually quite literally this stuff needs to flow and if it's not flowing that could be producing the brain fog and also like Alzheimer's is like an extreme form of brain fog.

54:36Yeah, it's like protein just building up, right? It's like the sink is probably just clogged. So then the idea would then be, so acupuncture and others, somehow it works to help unclog the sink, but then Western medicine could come in and say, well, here's how we're going to brute force clean this sink. So what are the potential therapies that could come around? I think realistically it's like, you know, sometimes in life when, you know, people have already gone to a certain point where it's like, all right, this protein's like building up, right? These like Western interventions are really important, right?

55:14Really important to make sure that like, all right, like we got to fix your drainage. We got to fix whatever's going on, right? But there's something to be said about maybe a lot of these practices may be preventative, We talk about things like exercise and exercise and good diet. Obviously, that's good for you, but maybe the reason that they're good for you is something about improving flow. Maybe. That's just a hypothesis. If you keep the body in motion and you keep your nutrition. it's like if you if you um let's say for example if you exercise you're literally getting your blood pumping right and then you know if we put that fountain back on the floor it's like the reflecting pool right like you need to keep the water circulating to prevent the algae bloom right throw that one back on that that little fountain this is the algae bloom yeah it's like if you're exercising right then like that's good for cup two right because you're getting blood flow into your brain.

56:17So it's like your heart rate's going up, you're cleaning more of your perivascular space, which is just like the space that's right next to the blood vessels, right? The whole point of it is like saying like, okay, well, exercise improves flow. Meditation, for example, increases flow in cup two, perhaps, right? How does meditation do that? Yeah, it's a really good question. I don't know, except I saw a paper on it. Okay. But it does. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mindfulness meditation, It does increase the flow of cup two from my understanding. I could be wrong on that. You get things moving. Yeah, you just get things moving.

56:58A lot of people will say that they feel better if they have worked out that day. And some people say, well, it's the endorphins or whatever. But what you're saying is that it could also just be the general, your body's just getting cleaned, cleaning itself out in a way that's less cluttered. Right. This flow mechanism is literally like cleaning your brain out. Right. And so a lot of what, you know, medicine has been built on and it's don't get me wrong. It's incredible work. Right. But it's been very neuron only. Right. Like neuronal focused. Right. And I guess what all of you mean by that? But I guess what I mean is when you picture a neuron, you picture the electrical currents of a cell.

57:38You just picture the electricity, all these networks, these neural networks. But none of this is really neural networks. This is like a structure. Yeah. This is all just flow. This is, I think, for the first time giving flow way more defined structure than it has in the past. Instead of just saying, oh, there's a pool of CSF that your brain just sits in. This is more saying like this is a flow that starts here and ends here. And I don't know. Let's see if it's right or not. Does this raise any questions about consciousness or any new frontiers in that question of what it means to be consciously thinking?

58:15So consciousness is really interesting because a lot of what consciousness science is is built on neural networks. Right. And like it makes sense. I actually published a theory a couple of months ago. Right. It's like it's such a it's like a long name that I kind of laugh at now. but it's called Glympho-Vasomotor Field Theory, GVF for short, right? I just want to say GVF. I look back at that, and I'm like, I don't know if I wish I had named it that. But GVF theory is essentially just a theory that people can read it if they're interested in it, right? But the long story short on that theory is that when you have fluid flowing that has ions in it, right, those ions will make a current, right?

59:00And this is just like outside of, you know, outside of brain stuff, right? So all this is really saying, all the GVF theory is really saying is that if you're having ions in CSF, right, and that CSF has a structured flow, then maybe, maybe there's an electromagnetic field, right? And maybe those fields affect the neurons. Maybe, right? It's just like a theory slash hypothesis, right? Like, who knows? And that could be the production of consciousness. Potentially. It could affect it, right? It could scaffold it. It could scaffold those, like, neural networks, right? Because they sit right next to each other, right?

59:39Like, all these, like, drainage systems, like, they all sit very, like, close to each other. And that's what EMF is measuring? I don't know. Okay. Yeah, I'm not sure. Yeah, yeah. Who knows? How does that interact with artificial intelligence? Yeah, that's a really good question. So this is something I could go on hours about this. Artificial intelligence is neural networks. That's all artificial intelligence is. It's neural networks that are learning and building on themselves. There's ongoing debates about whether or not AI is conscious or not. We have no idea. And some people say that AI is conscious and then other people say AI isn't conscious.

1:00:25This framework, I think, if validated, right, would be a significant step in saying that AI probably will not be conscious, right, because consciousness is more than just neural networks, right? Like there's an inherent flow that is present in our bodies, right, that not just, you know, humans have, like all of biology has, right, that AI can't really replicate, you know? So I would say that's probably the biggest thing. Why couldn't it replicate it with some type of fluid that has electromagnetic? We put rock into here and then synthesis. Some ionic intervention. That's a question for people much smarter than me.

1:01:09I don't know. I have no idea. I mean, at the end of the day, it would still be, I suppose, like a synthetic version. if you tried to recreate a human network. It's a good conundrum, though. Yeah. It's an interesting... I see what you're saying. It's a fascinating what if, but... I don't know. It's also kind of scary. So I don't know. Maybe we shouldn't talk about it. And so what are the... Have you talked to anybody yet who is exploring how to take this discovery and turn it towards therapies for anything, long COVID, Alzheimer's, autism, anything? Sure. Science is a relatively slow institution.

1:01:58And I don't know, the reality of my situation is now that this is kind of all published and wrapped up, I have to be a medical student. I have to study for boards and do things like that. Do you start in the fall again with your third year? March. Starting in March. Yeah, starting in March. So, like, you know, realistically, what I'm hoping is that this, now that this paper is published and people can, you know, see the hypothesis, the, like, scientific community can, you know, see, like, whether or not this is, like, a reasonable thing. And then go from there. I think ideally, though, in the perfect kind of world, you know, scientists look at this and clinicians and physicians look at this and kind of a new emerging space like comes out of it.

1:02:49That would be like, you know, the dream. Seems like it might. Have you heard from Huberman or any of the other popularizers of this kind of thing? No. No, no. Maybe he watches. We'll see. He's watching. We'll connect him. we really we really appreciate you coming in here and this all started because you were emailing back and forth with ryan yeah right i appreciate you guys having me and like just being able to to share all this because i think at the end of the day this stuff is um it's really important i think but it's also kind of slow you know and so it's like one of those things where like to have you know people out there care about this it's um it means a lot i think it also brings people to trust uh like medicine science when you're here explaining to us how you arrived from point A to point B.

1:03:36It's super interesting, and I think it gives people an insight into the process. That means a lot. Yeah, that really means a lot. Thank you. Thanks for coming. Thanks for coming by. Yeah. All right. In our newsletter, which everybody should sign up for at breakingpoints.com, we'll put links to the paper, but also the more digestible for a lay audience is a neurodaily, I think it's called. Yeah, daily neuron. The daily neuron. We'll put that article. Regular. Yes. reading it every day, obviously. And so, yeah, fascinating stuff. And we'll keep up with this because I hope that some money starts flowing to this area because it seems to be ripe for serious breakthroughs.

1:04:22You know, that's the dream. Yeah, I'm getting old, so hurry up. Well, thank you for joining us. We appreciate it. Of course. Yeah, thank you for having me. All right. That does it for us on today's edition of Breaking Point. Ryan, it was a hell of a show. We went on a journey. We did indeed. All right, well, Crystal and Sagar are back tomorrow? Crystal and Emily. Crystal and Emily tomorrow. What do you guys call that? It's the gardening show. The gardening show. The home show. Come back for the gardening show. I guess I'll see you guys on Friday. Sounds good. See you guys then.

1:05:12I'm Mange Shatikular and I'm back with a new season of my podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I talk to scientists, biopunks, curmudgeons, blues owners, super seniors, and Goa's top cryotherapy lab to try to understand this obsession with living forever and what it means for all of us. And I get into a bit of trouble along the way. I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyline Drive, How to Live Forever on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Michael Rappaport and my podcast, the I Am Rappaport Stereo Podcast, is unlike anyone you've ever heard.

1:05:50If you're looking for strong opinions about sports, entertainment, politics, pop culture, and whatever else catches my attention, then subscribe now. This kid Jafar Jackson should absolutely, positively get nominated for his portrayal as Michael Jackson. Listen to I Am Rap Report on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Betrayal Weekly is back with brand new stories. From threatening text messages disturbing a small Midwestern town. It was from an unknown number. Who else is getting these messages? Why did it start with us? to long cons and stolen identities. Who lies about being this sick?

1:06:33This was the last time I ever believed a word she said. Listen to Betrayal Weekly on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.

From the publisher

Ryan and Emily discuss leaked Oct 7 tapes on Hannibal Directive, Colombian Bukele takes power, Med establishment shook by new brain discovery.

 

Juan David Rojas: https://substack.com/@rojasrjuand

Shalin Bhatt: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/42249196/ 

 

 

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