7/16/25: Trump Says Bad People Care About Epstein, Alex Jones Meltdown, 3% Satisfied With Epstein Handling

21:11Emily Jashinsky:Yeah, that's well said. I mean, I think it's because, first of all, current for current potential foreign policy implications of this. Secondly, you have this is completely like roiling the administration. So there's questions about what's happening behind closed doors and whether the attorney general is long for this administration, all of those things, completely important conversations. And the story matters to people as a sort of proxy question of trust, that a lot of people, this was one of the issues that brought them along to place their trust in Donald Trump. It's not everyone, and it wasn't anyone's top priority for the most part, but it was one of those things that said you're an insider versus an outsider, and now Democrats have all kinds of political incentives to start pursuing a question that they will be rewarded by voters with trust if they do a good job holding the Trump administration's feet to the fire.

22:09Emily Jashinsky:Shortly after I enrolled at Rasmussen, I was diagnosed with breast cancer. It was like a bomb had just been dropped in my life. I reached out to Rasmussen. They immediately were like, Rosa, take what time you need. You can come back when you're ready. We are cancer-free today, and I'm just so grateful for Rasmussen for all of their support throughout my journey and for my own village. Rasmussen University. Find your seat and start now at rasmussen.edu. We know kids don't hold back and I wouldn't want them to. Get in there, make a mess, slide for home, bring on the stains. I've got OxyClean Versatile Stain Remover.

22:48It works on over 100 stains and it's America's number one stain fighter additive brand. It's color safe and chlorine free. So I use it on whites, colors and dark fabrics. And OxyClean isn't just for laundry. Mix it with water for use all around the house, kitchens, bathrooms, and even floors. When my kids go all in, I say go for it because I've got OxiClean to get the stains out. It's not clean unless it's OxiClean. Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. Now, I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited premium wireless for$15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made$15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal.

23:25So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch. Upfront payment of$45 for three months,$90 for six months, or$180 for 12-month plan required. $15 per month equivalent. Taxes and fees extra. Initial plan term only. Greater than 50 gigabytes may slow when network is busy. See terms.

23:41Emily Jashinsky:I actually want to roll A7, Crystal, because I mentioned it. It goes along with Mike Johnson. When Benny Johnson asked House Speaker Mike Johnson whether or not Ghislaine Maxwell should testify, he basically said everything people heard. He said everything should be out there. I'm all for transparency. Attorney General Pam Bondi should come forward and explain herself and tell us what happened. Mike Lee also talked to Benny Johnson yesterday and said Ghislaine Maxwell should testify. Let's roll A7. Would you be in favor of Ghislaine Maxwell testifying? Absolutely. Absolutely. I've posted on this.

24:14And if she were to testify, I think she could answer a lot of questions that could help put all of this in perspective. Yeah, I know a lot of these players, some of them are disagreeing with each other. Dan Bongino and I have been really good friends for the last 14 years and good friends with Cash Patel and also with Pam Bondi. I like all of them. I think there is a way to draw a straight line between all of them in a way that will satisfy the public's both curiosity and legitimate demand to know what happened.

24:45Emily Jashinsky:OK, so Republicans control the House and the Senate and, of course, the presidency as well. So ball is in their court. It's in the court of Republican leadership to make some of this happen. Yeah. And there's some interesting things going on with Ghislaine Maxwell right at this point, because she had an appeal all the way up to the Supreme Court that had gotten sort of pushed off till now, where the government had to respond to how they were handling this appeal. And basically, I mean, it's like this woman is a horrifying sex criminal and implicated in every way in this web of, you know, like a pyramid scheme of pedophilia and molestation.

25:27she should just justifiably spend the rest of her life in prison. But what she's saying is, hey, you guys, the government, made this sweetheart deal with Jeffrey Epstein down in Florida under Alex Acosta, who of course ends up being Trump's labor secretary. Part of that deal was that all of the co-conspirators of Jeffrey Epstein are off the hook forever. And I was one of those co-conspirators. So how can you really prosecute me? How can you throw me in prison? when you guys agreed to this deal that said anyone who was affiliated with Epstein and implicated in these crimes was off the hook. So that's the appeal that she's making in the Supreme Court.

26:07We got an interesting statement from her family that we can put up on the screen here. They say, Our sister Ghislaine did not receive a fair trial. Her legal team continues to fight her case in the courts and will file its reply in short order to the government's opposition in the U.S. Supreme Court. If necessary and due course, they'll also file a writ of habeas corpus in the U.S. District Court SDNY. This allows her to challenge her imprisonment on the basis of new evidence, such as government misconduct that would have likely changed the trial's outcome. Following the government's response, David Oscar Marcus, counsel of record for our sister in her petition to the U.S.

26:38Supreme Court, had this comment, quote, I'd be surprised if President Trump knew his lawyers were asked in the Supreme Court to let the government break a deal. And this is in reference to that sweetheart deal that Alex Acosta made. He's the ultimate dealmaker. And I'm sure he'd agree that when the U.S. gives its word, it should keep it. With all the talk about who's being prosecuted and who isn't, it's especially unfair that Glenn Maxwell remains in prison based on a promise the U.S. government made and broke. These are sentiments, the family says, with which we profoundly concur. So a sort of direct appeal there to Trump himself, who, of course, we played some of the footage from yesterday whenever he's gotten asked about Ghislaine Maxwell and what he wants to happen for her trial or for her being in prison.

27:25He always says, well, I wish her well. And we also have reporting that allegedly he was considering a pardon for her because he was concerned about what potential information she may have.

27:35Emily Jashinsky:Yeah, this is a really interesting development because if she can successfully make this case and people have questions, I think rightfully, about the way her trial was conducted, not because it was too harsh on Ghislaine Maxwell and too focused on locking her up, but rather in the other direction. So either way, if she's able to get this taken seriously, this opens up a lot. And it actually comports with the story in the Daily Mail that we covered earlier this week, Crystal, about how Ghislaine Maxwell is telegraphing through an anonymous source to the Daily Mail that she would be willing to talk.

28:14Emily Jashinsky:Again, you have to take it with a giant grain of salt. But it seems more and more like this is actually plausible that we would start to hear directly from her. Yeah, well, I mean, if if she does have some damaging information about the president, it's an intelligent chess move because if she's she's obviously looking to posture to try to get that pardon from Trump. And so this is sort of the threat of, hey, I could I could testify to Congress. And, you know, right now, sure, Republicans have control of the House and the Senate. But very, very, I would say likely after the midterms, Democrats are going to at least have control of the House.

28:51so um you know that opens up a whole other world of possibilities and so i think there's some you know some some tactical chess playing going on here from the galane maxwell side and the last thing i'll say about this is just underscores how absolutely absurdly outrageously disgusting that sweetheart deal was that it would even be theoretically possible that this woman could get off the hook because of this deal that was made and just so people recall i mean epstein got a slap on the wrist. You know, it was the charges were pretty minor charges. He served a sentence out being able to leave on quote unquote work release for 12 hours a day where he was able to go and do whatever he wanted.

29:35I think he served about 13 months on that cushy work release situation where his cell door was open. He had a TV. He could come and go. And then after 13 months, He just was out. I mean, he reporting suggests that even though he was supposed to be just in his house, like under, you know, home confinement, he was traveling the world and right back to doing everything that he wanted to do. And when the law enforcement like maybe that I'm not sure if it was the FBI, I don't want to implicate the wrong law enforcement agency here. But when they were told, hey, this guy is leaving, he's not staying on home confinement, they were like, yeah, he's a celebrity.

30:11What can we do? He's a celebrity. What can we do? Many such cases.

30:15Emily Jashinsky:Indeed. Many such cases, sadly. So let's take a look at A9. This is Scott Jennings. Crystal, we were talking about how some people who are sort of in situations where, yeah, I feel like you can tell people who just don't care about Epstein, like they think it's a weird conspiracy theory and it's not something that's on their radar that they've spent a great deal of time thinking about. And now they're forced to kind of talk about it a lot over the course of the last week. on TV or radio or wherever. And I think maybe you could put Scott Jennings in that category. And here's where Scott Jennings and other Republicans are landing.

30:53Emily Jashinsky:This is A9. I think it is an article of faith for many years that... What was? That, you know, the idea that there's information that we're not seeing as the general public. And people said that, bought into it. And so Donald Trump wins the election. He appoints Pam Bondi. He appoints Dan Bongino. He appoints Kash Patel. These are all people that this same audience has confidence in. We trust their judgment. And I think it's just hard sometimes to believe something for a long time and then be told, you know what, what we believe is not the case. There are certainly people that have legitimate questions about what happened.

31:26I mean, I've heard now two lawyers, both your guest tonight and Arthur Ayodala, who I was on with Friday night, both raise questions about whether they believe he even committed suicide. So you can see they're actually, you know, in the know people who are still raising legitimate questions about this case. You can see why the general public would also have those questions at the same time. You know, if you vote for Donald Trump and you have trust in his judgment and the people he's appointed at some point, you have to trust their judgment. I mean, you put them in charge of this. And I think what Doug said is important to know.

31:54The Biden people had this stuff. If there was something incriminating about Trump, it would have come out. And also now the Trump people have this stuff. And if there's something incriminating about, you know, Bill Gates or Bill Clinton, it would certainly have come out. And so I guess at some juncture, if you trust the people that you voted for, you trust the people that you voted for.

32:11Emily Jashinsky:And just quickly on that point, Crystal, I've heard it a couple of times that if the Biden administration had something on Donald Trump, don't you think it would have come out? That's a line actually that a lot of Republicans have used in recent days. And I think you can logically, it's like, okay, maybe there's something to that. But then it's like actually they're I mean, these political elite circles are fairly small and it's possible that whatever implicated Donald Trump would also implicate Democratic donors would also implicate power brokers who are in Dem circles. Donald Trump himself was in like Dem power broker circles in the 80s and 90s like he was somebody who was giving money to Democrats.

32:51Emily Jashinsky:So it's actually there's I see why they're rolling with that line. But if there's a bunch of information in the files that are devastating for the Clintons at the same time that they're devastating to Donald Trump potentially, that to me actually doesn't make a lot of sense. Well, not to mention if it is, in fact, a Mossad blackmail ring operation, then, yeah, Joe Biden is not going to be part of exposing that because he's a dyed-in-the-wool Zionist. So I think there are— Even if, and this is the point, even if it is what they always thought they had in the Steele dossier, even if it's like Trump doing something disgusting and whatever, they're still, we've talked about this, they're still being asked to say, if you're Biden and you are an establishment Democrat and you are thinking you protect Mossad and protect the state of Israel or you expose Donald Trump doing something sexually horrifying, they're going to choose in one direction over the other, even though that seems insane, given all of the different political maneuvers they took.

33:59Emily Jashinsky:It's just a question of like their personal cost-benefit analysis. And I actually feel like we know where they come down on that when we're talking about like potential nuclear war and world affairs and foreign policy. Joe Biden was willing to lose his reelection in order to continue backing Israel's genocide. There is apparently nothing that he's not willing to do for that country. And so I don't think it's hard to, you know, I don't think it's hard to imagine that if that in fact is the truth of what's going on here, that yeah, he would not be the one to expose that. And it's also worth remembering too, I mean, Joe Biden was in Washington for a long ass time before he was president of the United States, including in the capacity as vice president of the United States.

34:42So it's very plausible that he, you know, has known the truth of what is going on there for a long time and also wouldn't want it exposed that, you know, nobody has ever like he didn't show up in the flight logs or anything, but perhaps he's implicated in terms of knowing for a while that this was the truth of what was going on. Now, this is all, you know, now I'm really getting out there in terms of speculation land, but I'm just trying to make the point that it's not hard to imagine a set of circumstances in which Joe Biden is also not interested in exposing the truth of what's going on here and where he would himself take on some political damage for doing so, or at the very least undercut his favorite national ally.

35:24Emily Jashinsky:I have been with Rasmussen University since 2013, all virtual. All of my professors throughout the entire journey have been nothing but supportive of making me reach my dreams. Rasmussen professors, they want to see you grow so that you can be what you went to school to be. I'm so thankful for Rasmussen University for being able to make it so easy and seamless. Rasmussen University. Find your seat and start now at rasmussen.edu. We know kids don't hold back, and I wouldn't want them to. Get in there, make a mess, slide for home, bring on the stains. I've got OxyClean Versatile Stain Remover. It works on over 100 stains, and it's America's number one stain fighter additive brand.

36:07It's color-safe and chlorine-free, so I use it on whites, colors, and dark fabrics. And OxyClean isn't just for laundry. Mix it with water for use all around the house, kitchens, bathrooms, and even floors. When my kids go all in, I say go for it, because I've got OxyClean to get the stains out. It's not clean unless it's OxyClean. Apple Vacations, where your story starts. The Friends and Family Sale is here at Apple Vacations. Book by September 24th and save up to 50 % on all-inclusive vacations with instant savings. Whether it's a getaway with friends or a family vacation, there's always a reason to make more memories with your favorite people.

36:43Travel through August 2027 and start planning your getaway today at AppleVacations.com or with your trusted travel advisor. Apple Vacations, where your story starts.

36:56Emily Jashinsky:Joe Rogan reacted to this fiasco from the Trump administration in recent days where there's just been a seesaw ping pong back and forth what is actually going on what they said was going on and let's take a look at how Rogan reacted to the chaos in recent days we can roll this a 10. They've got videotape and all of a sudden they don't you know you have the director of the FBI on this show saying there's no tape. If there was, nothing you're looking for is on those tapes. Like, what? Why'd they say there was thousands of hours of tapes of people doing horrible shit? Why'd they say that? Right. Didn't Pam Bondi say that?

37:36Are you talking about Epstein or Diddy? Yeah, Epstein. Yeah, she said it literally, I think a week before you had the FBI director sitting here telling you there was nothing, right? She said something about that there was like thousands of hours of tapes of people doing horrible crimes. There is. And didn't the FBI dude say that there was nothing? Cash Patel said there's nothing you're looking for. Oh, okay. Okay. I mean, what am I going to do? I'm going to push back. No, of course. I understand. Obviously, he's saying what he has to say. Right. Mystery surrounds the Jeffrey Epstein files after Bondi claims tens of thousands of videos.

38:07Tens of thousands. Jesus Christ. I'll tell you what. Oh, my God. Was reviewing tens of thousands of videos, the wealthy financier, with children or child porn. The comment made to reporters at the White House days after a similar remark to a stranger with a hidden camera raised the stakes with President Donald Trump's administration to prove it has in its possession previously unseen compelling documents or just bomb Iran. And everybody forgets about it. Just bomb Iran. Yeah. Everybody forgets about it. Crystal, what do you make of that? Well, that last piece, I'm fearful he may be correct about because, you know, I think it's entirely possible that Trump does do something wild, like potentially bomb Iran or something equivalent.

38:52in order to get people to change focus because that is his that is his approach. But yeah, I mean, someone like Rogan, I think the the bro podcasters, they are not going to be on board for this level of gaslighting on something that they also, you know, were were focused on for a long time. Now, does that make a full turn on Trump? We know that Joe just had dinner with Trump and expressed some concerns about the direction with regard to the immigration policy concerns that were apparently immediately ignored. But, you know, I think people who are diehard MAGA Republicans are likely ultimately going to buy the like, we just got to trust Trump because he's Trump and that's who we voted for.

39:32And this is our guy. But I think people who are more in the sort of like independent and they voted for Trump for the first time or, you know, whatever are less like diehard MAGA cultist. I think this really does speak to this administration's not going the way I thought. This man is not the man I hoped he would be. This cuts so hard against his I'm the outsider posture, which, of course, you know, I've always thought his positioning himself as an outsider was sort of preposterous. But that is the way that he positioned himself. And that is the way that he was able to gain so much traction. And this, for anyone who has their eyes open, just utterly destroys that positioning.

40:16We played with Sagar on Monday. I don't know if you saw this guy at the TPUSA conference who was talking to Steve Bannon. And he was like, Trump is the deep state now. He is the deep state. And Bannon was like, what? But there are going to be some number of people who just feel completely jaded. And I think it probably gets channeled into a significant amount of nihilism if there isn't a competing political project that people really can believe in.

40:40Emily Jashinsky:You know, I have a couple of thoughts on that. One is there are, I mean, yes, like some hardcore MAGA people, we played the Scott Jennings clip earlier. I wouldn't consider him hardcore MAGA. He comes from McConnell world. Yeah, he's a Mitch McConnell guy, but he's just going to do what he needs to do. Yeah. So like normie Republicans who embrace MAGA now, either just be like, we're moving on. It's about trusting Trump. Like a Mike Johnson, Scott Jennings, those types of guys moving in that direction. On the other hand, I don't think we should discount that some of these podcasters, I'm not talking about Rogan, we have a Candace Owens clip that we're about to play, but I think some of these podcasters have put significant personal, like, personal reputational stakes on the line for years about Epstein.

41:29Emily Jashinsky:They know there's hours of them talking about Epstein on the internet. And even just like from a cynical calculated perspective, they are like aware that they have to keep on the same consistent point about Jeffrey Epstein. Otherwise, I mean, it's just, it's too glaring of, it's too glaring of a contrast. So I think there is something to be said for that. I think even like Benny, Benny is an example who has been on the Epstein case, like a dog with a bone for years. And let's just say from a cynical perspective, Benny was like, this is bad for the Trump administration. I really love Donald Trump.

42:15Emily Jashinsky:I've always trusted Donald Trump. Now there are like weeks, months, years of tapes of him talking about how serious the Epstein case was in very specific terms about why Democrats and why the FBI, why the feds don't want more information to come out. So it just also is like, I just don't think people on the outside should underestimate how powerful that is because it has been such a fixture of the podcast world. And that's also why in substance, it matters to people because it has been seen rightfully as the ultimate proxy issue of the insider versus outsider dynamic. And NBC News talked to a girl at the Turning Point Summit who said it exactly like that, basically put it exactly in those terms, just saying, I thought he was the outsider.

43:06Emily Jashinsky:Now it looks like he's protecting the insiders. Trump pitched himself as this outsider who was the most compelling outsider because he was also kind of an insider who knew where the bodies were buried and would know where to look and would be able to direct people to say transparency here, transparency there. And again, you and I can debate whether or not that was ever plausible or legitimate, but people who work in jobs that don't involve doing what we do and obsessing over the stuff because they have normal, wonderful lives are like, OK, this guy is right. He tells me that I shouldn't trust any of these other people.

43:48Emily Jashinsky:And that's correct. He is correctly saying you can't trust the Clintons, you can't trust the Bidens, you can't trust the Bushes. And because he earned people's trust by saying correctly that they couldn't trust those people, some people just by default put their trust in Donald Trump. and this is something that actually undermines that very pitch from him about why you should trust him and not them well and that's why i call it as another sort of humiliation ritual it really is another test how far will you go do you have any principles do you have any consistency you know here you've got hours of tape out there of you saying this is a big deal and this is a cover-up and we have to get to the truth of what's going on and there's you know this is an elite sex crimes ring where powerful people have been, you know, skating by and we need accountability and we need justice.

44:40Can I get you to over the course of a week, just turn on a dime and repudiate all that and say, I trust Trump. The other thing it makes me think of, Emily, and I wonder if you see any parallels here as well, is go way back to grab her by the pussy where Republicans at that time had been posturing for years, really going back to the Clinton impeachment of like morals and character in a presidential candidate matters. You know, we are the ethical party of family values. And you've got Mike Pence on the ticket, who is like the emblem of that sort of, you know, evangelical Christian coalition and the, you know, importance of family values.

45:25And they go to all these family values conferences every year. And it's like, all right, here's your guy. What are you going to do? And there was turmoil. You know, I mean, this is at a time when it looked like Trump was going to get walloped by Hillary Clinton. That's what the polls suggested was that he was going to go down in flames. And so that was, you know, OK, well, are you going to push aside your decades long supposed commitment to like morals and ethics specifically around family values in a presidential candidate, are you going to suck it up and get on board and say, this is a locker room talk and there's nothing to see here?

46:02It's a great point. And we know ultimately where they all fell. Now, here's one thing I will say to your point about what is a little different now. First of all, the media landscape is completely transformed from that moment. It is not the same media landscape whatsoever. Right. Second of all, Trump may be a lame duck. We don't know. But I think many people probably assume that he only has a few more years in the presidency And then there's going to be some post-Trump Republican Party. I personally think that's actually foolish to think that that's the case, but I'm sure many people think that that's the case.

46:32Number three, you have now a lane sort of like the, you know, the Jimmy Dore lane on the left of like, I'm just going to be critical of everyone all the time. In fact, like sort of like a nihilistic lane that is opened up on the right as well. And Fuentes is a perfect example of that. And I think Candace is flirting with that lane as well. And so in terms of just sort of where can I go and get an audience, they have demonstrated, Fuentes in particular has demonstrated, and I think Tucker also is starting to demonstrate that as well, although I question his actual independence from Trump, but we'll put that aside for the moment.

47:08one does this demonstrate like oh you can have an audience you can make money and you can be you know influential and have clout without always towing the line and so that opens up a new like sort of business possibility for the podcast the right-wing podcaster world that didn't necessarily exist before where it really was just sort of like you have to support whatever trump does and that's your best way to make money have power have influence have clout etc so those things do create some different dynamics than we saw back in 2016. But that is what it reminds me of, is that, you know, grab her by the pussy moment where Republicans were forced to completely do a 180 on their, you know, vociferously held purported longtime values.

47:55Emily Jashinsky:What's interesting about that, too, is it I think goes a long way towards explaining Trump, who's a very media savvy man landing on this new line of defense, which is the files were cooked up by the Biden administration, by Comey, by the deep state, essentially, because the effort there is to muddy the waters. A lot of these podcast world people are very sympathetic to Trump in that sort of quest to take down people, or let's just say in his war against the so-called deep state. And some of this is for legitimate reasons. Like there was a lot of funny business going on and we've covered a lot of it here.

48:36Emily Jashinsky:So they're already kind of primed to see that as true, to believe that is true because of the last decade. And that means if Donald Trump just sort of he thinks he can plant that seed, money the waters and say, hey, maybe actually this is all coming from the deep state. It's something that Alex Jones was talking about a little bit last week, saying that he saw and we're going to get to Alex Jones in just a moment. He saw a possibility and evidence of the situation where Trump was in control of the Epstein dirt and using that to control the deep state. He was sort of reverse blackmailing the deep state with his Epstein information.

49:21Classic 8D chess move from Trump.

49:25Emily Jashinsky:Let's actually get to A12 here. This is more reaction from Alex Jones, who has really been going through it in the last week. I'm getting really concerned here at this point because the flip-flopping and the 180-ing and the going back and going back is just the biggest train wreck I've ever seen. And it's not in character for you to be acting like this. So we want your agenda to succeed. I've done deep research. I ever saw you involved with Epstein-E and criminal activity. So why are you acting like this? Have you made a deal with the establishment to leave you alone? Have they rolled over? U.S.

49:58intelligence we know is involved. Assad, CIA, MI6, we already know that. But instead, you just continue to say nothing to see here and move along, though go ahead and release information, but there's no information to release. Contradiction for contradiction, flip-flopping after flip-flopping. 180s on 180s on 180s. Jesus, I'm on a roller coaster here. And then, oh, it's only fake news is concerned. Oh, like MTG and Tucker Carlson and myself and Joe Rogan and the American people. This is something that finally got our attention. People finally woke up to this. People finally understand, you know, a window in the deep state with all this.

50:33And so you signing on to this and flip-flopping is just self-harming. I mean, please, President Trump, stop. If you want it to go away, just be quiet. it. It's like there's a gun to his head saying, you better come out and say, no, this exists or we'll release it. It's bad. It's getting worse by the minute. And I support you, but we built the movement you wrote in on. You're not the movement. You just surfed in on it. And I'm telling you, man, the Democrats, we know we're pure evil. My God, they promote pedophilia and everything openly. So why the hell are you acting like this? Please stop now.

51:09Emily Jashinsky:So Crystal, let's go ahead and roll Candace Owens as well, and then break down what we're seeing for both of them. This is A11. Nothing to see here, Jeffrey Epstein. You see, we're not saying that you're guilty, but you are right now guilty of gaslighting the public. We're not saying that you are in the files. And again, I would like to stress, I certainly don't believe that, but it is very clear that you are not calling the shots on the Jeffrey Epstein debacle. And you're essentially being used to try to control the public reaction to those files not being released. what is happening now is it seems like you think your base is stupid.

51:45That's how I feel. I feel like Trump thinks his base is stupid or again, because I don't think he's pressing send on these messages, the people around him certainly think that Trump is stupid. And that shouldn't surprise you given the fact that all of these people were never Trump. And they think, as they thought, that Trump was too stupid to be president, that his base is too stupid to see through the lies that they are telling right now. And so what are they going to do? What is the last thing they're going to do now with the Epstein stuff while we're still reacting to it? Oh, Operation, just give them more war.

52:17Yeah, war as a distraction. Nevermind, we can't talk about Epstein because guys, guess what? Look at this headline. Trump announces an aggressive, or Trump is to announce an aggressive Ukraine weapons plan. Yeah, he already indicated that in that same press conference that there's just going to be more weapons sent to Ukraine. They're going to attack Russia. We're just going to have to have a world war and another reset, I guess. So you guys just stop talking about Jeffrey Epstein. And I am telling you that I will be the very last person that will stop talking about Jeffrey Epstein. When it comes to children, I'm telling you guys, the left and the right, we have definitely got to come together on this and not let it go.

52:55Emily Jashinsky:So there you go, the very last person who will stop talking about Jeffrey Epstein, one of Donald Trump's daughter supporters. Yeah, and it's interesting she and Rogan both come to the same, like, oh, I guess they're just going to start another war or escalate some of the wars we're already involved with to distract from this. And it's a clever point that Candace makes there to say that's already happening. And we covered, of course, the Ukraine escalation yesterday and Trump's plans to ship these long-range weapons and the fact that apparently he asked Zelensky and it was leaked. He asked Zelensky like, hey, can you hit Moscow?

53:29Can you hit St. Petersburg? so um i think that's a that's a savvy point that candace is ultimately making there i can't help but notice so emily she's still like he's being controlled like it's never him who's the actor it's who's controlling you and same thing with alex jones like alex seems genuinely tortured you know we played that video where he was crying and he said he was gonna puke like i believe him i believe that he probably vomited and is like genuinely tortured over what the fuck here because he is the conspiracy is the og conspiracy guy right and so for trump to completely flip on epstein and say you are a bad person if you still are talking about this and to put out there this most outlandish explanation that it was obama who wrote the epstein files which just doesn't even make any sense um alex is trying to reckon with this in some way that doesn't lead to the conclusion oh, Trump is implicated in these files.

54:27He always says the same thing of like, I did deep research and I know there's nothing there in terms of you and kids. But you know, if it was any Democrat, actually, if it was anyone other than Trump, even another Republican, he would come to the obvious conclusion, you're trying to cover something up that must look really bad for you. And that's why he's so tortured and wrapping himself around this thing. Because how do you look at the fact pattern and not come to the conclusion as Ann Coulter was hinting at like, oh, maybe there is some there there because otherwise, why are you behaving in this completely preposterous way?

55:02And Alex Jones is begging him not even to, this is also interesting to me, he's not even begging him at this point to release the files. He's just begging him to stop. Stop talking about it. Stop doing what you're doing. Like, just please stop. Which is kind of wild. You would think that, you know, he would be calling for the release of the files, but you know, just please stop talking about this. You're just drawing more attention. You're just making things worse. Like, just stop everything that you're doing right now. And so it's it's pretty wild to it's pretty wild to behold. But there's no doubt if it was certainly any Democrat, he, Candace, you know, the whole cast of characters would immediately go, oh, they're guilty.

55:41That's why they're behaving this way. That is the most logical explanation.

55:44Emily Jashinsky:I mean, people are getting closer. People not side of it are getting closer and closer to thinking that. And your point about Sagar saying, you know, I never thought there was any there there. With Trump and Epstein, I still think it's probably likely that Trump is covering up for someone close to him rather than him himself. But the more that he talks, this is what Alex Jones is getting at, the more absurd and desperate he looks. And that is suspicious. Of course it's suspicious. I mean, everything around Trump and Epstein is already suspicious enough. But yeah, I mean, it's just, it's going to get the Donald Trump that they're painting a portrait of, whether it's Alex Jones or Candace Owens or Joe Rogan, actually, it is so incredibly dark.

56:34Emily Jashinsky:This idea that you would have a president who says he's going to drain the swamp and purge corruption, who is hiding, covering up for political elites in the case of a sex predator in order to protect himself and then deflecting by sending more weapons into a conflict that he also said he would get elected to end. I mean, that is what they are. The portrait that they're painting for their listeners is an incredibly dark and powerful one. Sixteen years ago, I started working as a CNA in the hospital. I loved it. On the day I decided to enroll in the nursing program at Rasmussen University, it was afternoon, my 35th birthday.

57:20I was hanging out with a friend, and they had just questioned me what I was going to do with this next chapter of my life. I immediately had said, I want to go to nursing school. So I actually had contact information from an advisor at Rasmussen, contacted her, and actually ended up starting like three weeks later. My name is Cherish Adams, and I'm a Rasmussen University graduate. Learn more at rasmussen.edu. We know kids don't hold back, and I wouldn't want them to. Get in there, make a mess, slide for home, bring on the stains. I've got OxyClean Versatile Stain Remover. It works on over 100 stains, and it's America's number one stain fighter additive brand.

57:53It's color-safe and chlorine-free, so I use it on whites, colors, and dark fabrics. And OxyClean isn't just for laundry. Mix it with water for use all around the house, kitchens, bathrooms, and even floors. When my kids go all in, I say go for it, because I've got OxyClean to get the stains out. It's not clean unless it's OxyClean.

58:35Apple Vacations, where your story starts.

58:42Emily Jashinsky:Crystal, that's probably a good note on which to transition to the politics of all of this. We have numbers. So let's put A5 on the screen. This is new polling data. Should the government release all documents related to the Epstein case? This is from YouGov. Yes. 79 percent. No. Five percent. It's not even close. Those 79 percent, all bad people, Emily. Bad people. The only noble ones are the five percent who say no, and most of them are apparently like in Congress, Republican members of Congress. Yeah. And here's Harry Enten going through some polling numbers on CNN, A6. Take a look here. Epstein case, amount of info release.

59:26The winner here, 50 percent dissatisfied. Doesn't matter. 29 percent, not heard enough. 17 percent. But look at the bottom of your screen. The percentage that are satisfied is just 3%. That's one, that's two, that is just 3%. I feel like the count on Sesame Street, just 3 % of Americans are satisfied so far with the amount of information released. The clear winner in this particular case is 50%, half of the public is dissatisfied at least so far. You see this 50 % dissatisfied, and let's break it down by party. Okay, Epstein case, amount of info released. Look at this, you get 43 % of lean GOP, that's Republicans and independents who lean towards the Republican Party who are dissatisfied.

1:00:07Look at this. Just 4 percent satisfied? My goodness gracious. When you only have 4 percent that is with Donald Trump on a particular issue, that is ridiculously low. I've never seen anything quite like it. How about lean Democrat? 60 percent dissatisfied. Compare that to 3 percent who are satisfied. Again, 4 percent, 3 percent Republican, Democrat. You rarely ever see this type of agreement. Whites with a college degree, whites without a college degree. But in this particular case, we see agreement. What are we talking about? This Epstein case, amount of info released, dissatisfied, 55 % of white college graduates and 53 % of white non-college graduates, Donald Trump's historic base, yet the majority are dissatisfied.

1:00:46Look at Donald Trump uniting the country, healing the grand education divide. Look at that, Emily.

1:00:53Emily Jashinsky:One of the numbers that Anton didn't mention specifically, but was on the screen, you could was most interesting to me, 29 % of people saying that it doesn't matter, right? So if that number were higher, then Trump would be able to get away with this, right? Like Trump could, there are all kinds of things that don't matter to voters. They might disagree with the president on, but it doesn't really matter. You know, we're not talking right now about Donald Trump's position on abortion at all. It's not like the high priority for many voters at this given moment, or let's say Donald Trump disagrees on like the Jones Act.

1:01:28Emily Jashinsky:You can show all of these scary poll numbers about how voters are in total disagreement with Donald Trump on the Jones Act. Nobody cares about the Jones Act. So when you have - AUKUS. Are you an AUKUS voter? Yes. Yes. You know, Sager probably cares a lot about the Jones Act. But 29 % of people saying doesn't matter. Wow. Like that's, that number is a bit low for the comfort of the Republican Party. I'm actually curious for some more polling about how closely people have been and are following the Epstein case. Because in some ways, it does feel like kind of an Internet phenomenon. And certainly it has been podcasters who have most focused on it and delved into it and explored the various avenues, you know, mainstream media.

1:02:14Basically, once he was dead, just sort of dropped it like a hot potato and there wasn't a lot of additional reporting, etc. Some may say that was the point. In any case, it has been largely a sort of podcast phenomenon. But because it touches on some of these core themes of just like, do you trust this guy? You know, did he is he a con man? Which, of course, I think he is. I've always thought that he was. But, you know, he presented himself as this outsider. Is he really that or was this all just, you know, a giant con of the American people and most directly of his own supporters? So because and also, look, it's, you know, it's sort of tawdry and those things also grab people's attention.

1:02:57So I have a feeling that there is a lot of significant normie public interest in this. And I but I, you know, I don't have a strong feeling about I'm curious to see more numbers as to just how closely people are following this, just what they make of it, just how important they think it is. And we'll see over time how it impacts his approval rating. You know, like I said before, I don't think that this causes MAGA to the MAGA base. Right. I think they'll still be there. I think you know Dinesh D'Souza and others who have this like oh but let's focus on the great work he's doing like you know imprisoning people in alligator Alcatraz or whatever I think that will probably be successful with most of his base because it's certainly not the first time he's been caught in a blatant hypocrisy it's not even the first time like this month that he's been caught in a blatant hypocrisy but for independence you know I think he'll probably start rapidly receding towards his floor, like the type of numbers that we saw, you know, after January 6th, for example.

1:04:02I don't know if it will get quite that low, but I think we'll start heading more in that direction. I know that I saw already poll numbers of his approval ratings declining significantly on this because it just does really cut against the identity that he's tried to forge for himself in politics.

1:04:16Emily Jashinsky:Yeah, there's one final thought I have. Some smart analysts of the Biden presidency were looking at his favorability and his numbers. And after the botched Afghanistan withdrawal, which, by the way, in principle, most Americans agreed with getting out of Afghanistan, Biden's poll numbers never really recovered from that moment. That's sort of like when things in terms of politics started to go downhill for Joe Biden. And you could potentially make the case that this is possibly a parallel moment for Donald Trump. It's one of those things where you just lose trust. And once you lose trust and you look, I mean, it's, we were talking about the humiliation rituals that Donald Trump likes to put his deputies through, but it's humiliating for Donald Trump to, and he doesn't see it this way, of course, but to talk such a tough game about the deep state and transparency and draining the swamp.

1:05:09Emily Jashinsky:And then to be a guy who comes out there and can't get tough on the Epstein case, the case that most people want, the case that's most important to people who want toughness from an outsider president or an outsider president who pledged to take on the swamp. So that, I actually think that is sort of a humiliating moment for Trump. And I do wonder if it causes trust with, you know, 5 % even of people who generally give him the benefit of the doubt. It's one of those things where it's a proxy issue. It just, I sensed actually, the Republican Study Committee did a new media row yesterday. And I was talking, so I was talking to a bunch of members and I got the sense from them that they know their districts care about this and they know people are going to ask them about this.

1:06:02Emily Jashinsky:They know they're going to have to answer questions about it. And so Trump is not really going to be able to hand wave it away, not just because of how Alex Jones and Candace Owens are reacting, but also because it's going to stick in the minds of regular people. Yeah. And, you know, Trump is a political Teflon and is able to write out a bunch of crises and already has written out a bunch of crises. But there's been massive blowback against the Republican Party in midterm elections in particular as a consequence of things that he has done that has sunk the party's chances. So when you think about the midterm elections, which is still a ways down the road, we're going to have 85 more like scandals and outrageous things happen, wars and whatever the hell we're going to see over the next year and a half.

1:06:47But between now and then. But this is the sort of thing that contributes to apathy amongst your base where, you know, they may still say, yes, I approve of what he's doing and I'm glad he's in there and I trust my guy. am I going to go out and vote for this Republican member of Congress who voted against the release of the Epstein files? Maybe not. Maybe I'll just maybe I've got other things going on that day. It only takes a couple points of depressed turnout on the Republican side to really remake the landscape in terms of, you know, what those midterm elections ultimately look like. Yeah.

1:07:17Emily Jashinsky:And, you know, nobody really agrees that Jeffrey Epstein like that. There's no there there. I mean, everyone pretty much is like, yeah, this is this is suspicious. So it's not like there are people in Trump's camp who were like, you know, I bet it's all in the up and up. And, you know, like that just doesn't even, that doesn't make sense. And now Trump has introduced this other scandal like that he was framed by the Biden administration, you know, James Comey to be implicated in Epstein, which is, that's a significant allegation. So he's open. That's why Alex Jones is like, dude, stop. Because now there's this basically fabricated out of thin air new theory that Trump is using to kind of muddy the waters.

1:07:54Emily Jashinsky:And maybe there's something I mean, maybe they did. If you were a partisan operation and you knew that there was stuff on the other guy to prevent it from being released, if Democrats are implicated, you might point the fingers at him and leave the files in such a way that points right. Like there could be truth to it, but the idea that they're the only ones who cooked up the Epstein theory is obviously not true. So, and also it's not what the administration was saying five seconds ago when they were like, There are no files and there is no client list and the case is closed and we need to move on.

1:08:26If you uncovered this giant conspiracy where Democrats wrote you into the Epstein files and deleted themselves or whatever the fuck he's arguing, even then why don't you reveal that instead of saying there's nothing to see here and everyone should move on and you're a bad person if you don't. So there's that glaring problem with that theory as well. And the last thing I'll say about this, Emily, is the people who are backing him up the hardest are like the Ben Shapiros. are the pro-Israel neocon types. And that concerns me because, not only because of potential implications there, but it concerns me because of who may gain influence through this.

1:09:03And we all know the people who come through as like the most loyal servants of Donald Trump are more likely to get access and favor and have their viewpoints listened to. And so the fact that it's the pro-Israel, pro-war faction that may be gaining more power and credibility and access, through all of this is also really concerning to me.

1:09:36Some people use ChatGPT to answer questions. Others use it to get real work done. With ChatGPT work, you bring the goal, plus real inputs like briefs, notes, files, feedback, data, and project plans. It can help turn them into an analysis, tracker, deck outline, prototype, or workflow you can review and keep shaping. You stay in control, giving direction and choosing the final output. Put ChatGPT to work on your most ambitious ideas and projects. Get started at ChatGPT.com by selecting work mode. Available on Plus and Pro plans. There are exciting things happening at your local CVS. Shop new extra big deals with extra care every two weeks.

1:10:16No coupon needed. Plus, get access to exclusive sale prices, personalized deals, and more as a member. Extra Care is the way to save at CVS. Join for free, online, or in-store and start saving. Visit your local CVS store or cvs.com slash extra big deals for this week's deals. Okay, laundry stinks. Literally. I mean, you could just keep buying new underwear. Not that I've ever done that. Or maybe sort your clothes into piles based on how re-wearable or filthy they are. Or just use Arm & Hammer Deep Clean. It's made for real-life stings and stains. So even if you don't do laundry the, quote, right way, Deep Clean will knock it out.

1:11:01I mean, it is from the number one liquid detergent brand that tackles more loads than any other. Come clean with Arm & Hammer Deep Clean. Number one claim based on total wash loads sold. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.