The Thursday Show: What happened in Paris? Plus: Heimtextil highlights

25:21I think the idea is that, you know, as you pointed out in the intro, I think you tune out scents pretty quickly is what the thesis is. But if you vary the amount of scent that is kind of in the air, I think the idea is that you get around this condition, olfactory blindness, to sort of create a more pervasive sense of the scent. And now I guess my question is like, is that desire? Do you want that? You know, or like, is it a good thing to get around that olfactory blindness and always be smelling a scent? I kind of like there's something nice about sort of perceiving a scent quickly, having that shape your perception of a space that you're in and then moving on to just being in the space as opposed to constantly smelling it.

26:01But I don't know, Dennis, what's your perception of olfactory blindness as an impediment to your enjoyment of an interior? Well, it's interesting speaking to so many designers and I know that so many big luxury retail brands are so focused on their scent, what they want you to experience the moment that you cross the threshold. threshold. And it seems as if it's so important to capture you in that very first moment, you catch a whiff of something, and then it sets the tone for what the rest of the experience is going to be like. I remember Tom Kligerman, when he came on the show, talked about doing a big presentation for one of his clients who was doing some kind of Adirondack cabin or something.

26:47And he was so proud that he had this pine scent in the conference room. for it. He came up with a custom scent for what he wanted the project to evoke, which I thought was clever, but yeah. Yeah, exactly. And he thought that that sealed the deal in having that. So I think it often can. Designers actually are hugely focused on this. What I'm surprised about is you think of all the candles and all the scent sticks and all the many products that Estee Lauder makes. It seems like this new investment would sort of get rid of all of that. and just replace everything that they've made. I don't know. This seems like huge brand destruction for them in some way.

27:29Innovator's dilemma, Dennis. They have to disrupt themselves in the home scent space, I think is what this is amounting to. Well, that seems to be what's at the heart of it. But it's a huge industry, and they're obviously very keen to be investing in it. I wonder if it's going to become a part of every project going forward. Next up, some sad news to share. Last week, New York designer Amy Lau passed away at the age of 56, following a battle with cancer. Her impact was felt in nearly every corner of the industry, along with completing countless residential and commercial projects at the helm of her firm.

28:08She was the co-founder of the first edition of Design Miami, became the first designer to exhibit at New York's Salon and Art Design Fair, and opened her own gallery in the New York Design Center just last year. Her passing provoked an outpouring of grief and admiration from the design community, summed up well by a statement posted by her firm. A true visionary and an inspiration, Amy dedicated her life to creating warm and inviting spaces, touching countless lives with her passion and unique style. We will forever cherish her legacy and the impact she made in the design world. Yeah, this was a really hard one.

28:48I mean, I didn't know Amy particularly well, but every time I met with her, she's had such incredible, warm, welcoming energy. It's been really sweet to see all the tributes to her on social media. I don't think there was a single person in the New York design world who didn't absolutely love her and love her work and love interacting with her. And I was just really interested to see all this involvement she had in the art world and sort of bringing art and design together. It's clearly very instrumental in that. This is just, you know, it's a real heartbreaker. Absolutely. And I'm going to try not to get emotional.

29:22I've known Amy for more than 20 years, and she was just such an incredibly bright figure. I remember back in 2015, there was a wonderful panel discussion that she did at the New York School of Interior Design with Vladimir Kagan, with whom she was a close collaborator. And they had such a fun, humorous, chatty relationship. And you really saw Vladimir accused her of overthinking everything. And she said, no, you're the one. And there was a lot of back and forth. And he talked about how she challenged him in ways that he never would have challenged himself. And so many vendors and people that Amy worked with talked about that, that she just pushed you in a lot of directions that you might not have gone on your own.

30:16She had a spark. Exactly. And she was so kind to come to so many things. She was a great supporter of the future of home when I reached out to her to be a brand ambassador for the future of home when we were first launching it. She said, oh my gosh, absolutely, I'll be there and do whatever you need. She was incredibly generous, and I was enormously fond of her. All right, that's it for the news, but there's plenty more to check out on businessofhome.com, including a profile of a rug designer making waves in the trade and the coolest smart home tech debuts at CES. We'll be back in a minute, but first, a quick break.

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32:07And we're back. I'm joined now by my colleague, Business of Homes managing editor, Haley Chouinard. Hayley, thanks so much for being on the show. Yeah, so glad to be here. So glad to have you. And you just returning from Germany and the big Heim Textil show, which we're eager to hear all about. Tell us first, to refresh people's memory, what the show is and really who comes to this great big trade show. Yeah. So Heim Textil is a massive fair in Frankfurt, like you said. It happens every January and it is really anything textile. So they have like your base fibers and yarn. They have this really massive rug and carpet exhibition now.

32:52They do, you know, more traditional fabrics and you'll see a lot of emerging technologies. So like Canon for the past two years, the printing company has had these giant printers, live printing wallpaper murals and then cutting it and rolling it. And yeah, so it's really vast in what you can see. And they spend a lot of floor space and thought on what's next, I would say. So is it a show that a lot of interior designers go to? Or do you feel like it's more people that are working in the textile industry and who are looking for different partnerships and relationships? Yeah, traditionally not designer focused.

33:35It would be more like, you know, probably buyers from Target going there to look at, you know, where they're sourcing their in-house bedding or rugs and that sort of a thing. And yeah, company big, I would say bigger buyers. So was there a was there an overall mood or look or feel that they were trying to present this year? Was there a big statement being made? I think the carpet and rug haul really was a must see this year. It grew. I think they said they tripled their number of exhibitors. I think we've seen that a lot in the U.S., right, of the category of rugs just exploding. It feels like every week you get a pitch about like a new rug brand.

34:16It was like, yes, this is not unique to the U.S. This is globally rugs are really having such a big a big boom. Did anyone offer any insight as to why rugs have become such a big category? I don't know. I mean, I think there's been such a movement towards this idea of, I mean, not necessarily bespoke, but like wanting something that looks original or looks that's unique to your home. And I mean, especially when there were all of these, you know, beautiful Indian rug companies that were there. And people want, I think, more of that feeling of authenticity than maybe they can get when they go to a HomeGoods or something like that and just like grab something like they want to.

34:55I think there's such a story to be told with rugs. So I think they've really the team behind Heim Textile. I think they they noticed where that was going. And I think that was really smart of them. Yeah. I mean, they seem to have, as you say, had their finger in the air a little bit and saw that that was big. And it sounds like attendance was up and lots of people were there for it. I wonder, so thinking about some of the big things that felt different this year versus other years that you've been there in the past, it certainly sounds like the Italians had a bigger presence than in the past. Yes?

35:30Yeah. So to your earlier point, Heimtext Hall hasn't traditionally been design-y, I would say, for lack of a more official word. There is design-minded content, but it's not really ever been trying to capture the same sort of audience as a Salonity Mobile or M &O in Paris or anything like that. So this year, they kind of threw everybody a curveball. And they had these two very design-centric installations, one by Alcova Milano, and then the other by Patricia Urquiola. They had Alcova, the team behind Alcova, Valentina Chufi and Joseph Grima take over their trend space, which has been kind of the crown jewel, I would say, of Heimtextil over the past few years.

36:16And it was I think everybody was, you know, just had no idea what they would do. Right. Because they're pretty experimental. And they're for those who don't know, they usually take over these kind of interesting architectural spaces, usually like a little on the decrepit side, I would say, or like, like seen better days. But they take it and they fill it with beautiful objects and furniture and really make you think in a different way. And one thing that they kind of pointed out, you could take tours with Valentina Chufi and Joseph Grema, and they talked about the idea that textiles are one of the oldest forms of technology that we have.

36:53Like the craft of textile making was one of the first ways that we were innovative as a species and figured out how to weave and how to make these fabrics. And I thought that was really beautiful. And yeah, like I said, I've still been thinking about it like a week later. And then that was in Hall 3. And then way over in Hall 12, Patricia Urquiola had this really kind of otherworldly, colorful installation that she did called Among Us. It was these lovely ombre carpets on these big layers of foam. So your feet squished down on the carpet like it was just very tactile. and she had these upholstered sculptures that you could sit on that were beautiful and wall hangings that were just kind of you know suspended from the massive conference hall ceilings it was it was really lovely and thoughtful and I think that's really what Patricia was hoping to to create was a destination in this like space that really celebrated the art of textiles within, you know, this larger fair environment.

38:02I always get the sense that Heim Textile is a show that's all about the future. And you were talking earlier about the giant Canon printers going and showing us digital printing in a big way. Did it seem like there were new, meaningful innovations? Like what was the new cool thing coming out of the world of digital printing? Yeah. So yes, the Canon machines were very cool. And they had basically this like display where you could take different samples of different materials that they had printed on. So it was like Lyocell and these kind of things. Because I mean, at least in my mind, I think of digital printing as very like on a single source material, right?

38:44Like you think of cotton or something like that. You don't really think of like more sophisticated fabrics than digital printing. I mean, I don't think maybe that's naive of me. But so they had that just like right there where you could take it and you could feel it and you could see the quality of the print, which was really interesting. And then in another area of the show, they had this brand Cornet Digital, which is based in Israel. And they sell a lot of printers worldwide, but then they also are kind of moving into their own collections. So they had their first furniture collection with another Israeli brand called Niso Furniture.

39:21and they had their booth furnished with it and it was so cool and I mean they had leather that they had printed on and these like boucle kind of material that I mean and they have booklets of different I mean they had alpaca wool and like a gauze kind of material and they use this pigment based dye and it just kind of sits really right on top of it and um it's fascinating and and it It looks really good. And yeah, and I mean, there's a sustainability factor to it as well, where they aren't using water in their process. I mean, in traditional textile making, you're using water in the dyeing, and then you have to rinse at the end and all this stuff.

40:02So they were very focused on the print-on-demand aspect, where you're not printing all of this stuff that then maybe doesn't sell and ends up not being used, or you're using all of these resources to make stuff that might not get used. Which is often a big theme at Heim Textile is the whole discussion around the carbon footprint and sustainability. Although I understand this year, not quite as big a theme or a presence, but you tell me. Yes. Several of us in my press group, we were kind of walking around looking for the sustainability pavilion before we realized that there wasn't one this year, which was really surprising because last year they had this incredible exhibit by Franklin Till, the British futurist design agency.

40:45that talked a lot about all these regenerative kind of textiles. I mean, they had like sequins grown from algae and like all this sort of really innovative. I mean, it wasn't necessarily stuff that was ready for market, but it was the ideas, right? We're all there. And so, yeah, they didn't do that this year. And I'm not really sure why. I sat with somebody from the Heim Textile team at dinner one night and she seemed really surprised, frankly, that we noticed. But yeah, Yeah, no dedicated sustainability space, which yes, personally, being a sustainability nerd, I was a little bummed about. But otherwise, it sounds like a very forward-looking show in general, yes?

41:25Yeah, no, there was so much and it's so dense. It's kind of crazy that it's only a three-day fair because there's just so much to really see and take in that you could definitely spend five days easily just wandering. But yeah, I'm really glad that I got to go back and that I got to kind of see this new era that maybe they're moving into. Fantastic. Well, Haley, thanks so much for the recap. I'm so glad that you could join us on the Thursday show. Thank you. Always great to come on the Thursday show. I'm happy to be here.

42:00I am joined now by BOH Editor-in-Chief Caitlin Peterson. Caitlin, welcome to the show. Thanks, Dennis. Great to be here. Welcome back from London, Paris, many ports of exotic call. I'm eager to talk about it all with you. I caught a glimpse of you on a Paris street corner ever so briefly. And we shared a little bit of time at the crazy crowded Pollock-Weizner party. But otherwise, I didn't get to catch up with you a lot. So let's start with Paris. And I won't put you in the position of having to come up with one magical word to describe the whole vibe over there. But tell me what your sense was of how people were feeling on the ground.

42:45I think the energy at the show this year was enthusiastic. It was eager. It was excited. I mean, Paris is my favorite way to start the year. Who doesn't love Paris? I think everywhere you went, people were so excited to soak it all in, discover new things, see as much as they could. it felt great. What did you think? How was it for you? What was the energy on the street for you? Yeah, I always love bumping into people who are there for the first time, and they're so excited and wide-eyed to see everything and can't believe that they're getting to have this experience. And we talked a little bit before going over about how eager people, especially eager people, were to see one another after the terrible fires in LA.

43:35There was so much of the L.A. community that we knew was going to be on the ground in Paris, and we were eager to come together and just be with one another. But I completely agree with you. There's an infectious enthusiasm and excitement about starting the year this way, and I'm always excited to be there, as cold as it is. As cold as it is. In January. In your bones cold. Well, the lack of sun is something that one has to adjust to. It was sunny in London on Tuesday as I was preparing to leave. And I was like, I haven't seen this sun in two weeks in Europe. What's funny, you know, you mentioned first timers.

44:12And I think there were so many first timers at the show this year. I thought that was so interesting. There are so many people who had heard that Deco Off and Maison et Objet are super cool. They wanted to figure it out. And they were sort of boots on the ground like, all right, so how do I walk the show? You know, what do I do? How do I get in on all the great discoveries here? I mean, I think it was very well attended. I think people, as you say, heard how fun and exciting it is and made the trip. And what I love is when whole offices come over. I spent some time with a design firm in Portland and the whole group seemed to all be there and just sharing the experience together.

44:51And I got the sense that for many firms, this was their treat. This was their big adventure and a reward for, as you've suggested, perhaps a challenging 2024 for a lot of people, right? Absolutely. So let's talk about some of the buzz and some of the big things that people were talking about while they were going around and what really stood out for people. I mean, I think we've got to start the conversation with Pierre Frey. Just full stop. Let's do it. They always have a stellar presentation. I mean, usually they're sort of presenting their fabrics one by one in this extraordinary sort of moment for the design industry.

45:30I don't know about you, but I think this year they outdid themselves. They rented the Hotel de Guise and created this immersive installation showcasing their new collection, which was all inspired by deserts from around the world. I feel like whenever you ran into people on the street and started talking about, what did you like? What have you seen? What was the thing that was most exciting to you? everyone started with Pierre Frey. And so I think that's worth shouting out. You were there too. What did you think? I completely agree. And you know, and it's funny because Patrick was taking the lovely Mrs.

46:00Scully and me around. I said that it was, it was funny when people first heard that he wasn't going to be doing his usual presentation, right? People were so concerned and up in arms. And what do you mean? That's one of the highlights of the trip. But he, the whole team obviously wanted to do something very different. And as he talked about, they don't do show houses in Paris. So what if we took this space and basically created a show house in this hilariously dilapidated building that was completely falling apart? But perfect, right? And I think perfect with their collection. There was the one room where there was this insane kind of rust colored water stain on the ceiling.

46:38And it was perfect. You couldn't have art directed it better than sort of this crumbling shell and, you know, this beautiful use of their fabrics inside. What else sort of made a big impression on people did you find? I went to a wonderful dinner at Fayot Boiserie out in the 16th arrondissement. And, you know, it's this it's this magical repository of some of the most extraordinary rooms and paneling and boiserie for from the last, you know, several hundred years. the company you know uses all of those both you know you could buy an antique room you can work with them to create a reproduction you can work with them to kind of study the greatness of the past and build something that is sort of extraordinary for today they were celebrating a big anniversary they're also celebrating that they're about to move into the dnd building this spring fingers crossed fingers crossed right right right um a lot of space too um yeah they they hosted a dinner that sort of it was magical it was so immersive and i think you know it was a great mix of designers and kind of industry folks and press.

47:41And it's a good example to me of, I think, what makes sort of some of this entertaining in Paris so special, really creating these moments that you can't replicate in settings that are sort of beyond your wildest imagination. And then you're seated next to some really interesting folks at dinner that you wouldn't have met otherwise. And you learn a lot more about how they work or the industry as a whole or just kind of something exciting that's on their radar. That was maybe kind of the sparkling jewel box evening of the trip for me. But there were so many events like that that I heard about that I saw on Instagram and that I think make Deco off so special.

48:24While we're talking about parties, I mean, you hosted a standing room only. I could hear it from down the block as I was walking up kind of event with Pollock and Weitzner. I mean, I think that's worth celebrating here too, because that was a really fun time. Yeah, no, that was a great event, and I'm so thrilled that so many people were able to turn out for that. It was really quite fun to cram so many people into that apartment. I hope we didn't disturb others in the building with that, but that was a great experience. What else jumped out at you? I think one thing, you know, there's a lot to say, you know, in terms of the product itself, in terms of trends, colors, textures, where there's demand in the industry.

49:10But one thing that struck me in a lot of presentations of fabrics was this interesting kind of polarization into two kind of sides of the way that we talk about performance fabric. Also, I took this really serious. I went from parties to performance fabric. But I think more brands than ever were showing interesting, innovative, elevated performance fibers, this kind of indoor, outdoor, different ways of using treatments and plastics to create something durable, lasting, but that feels great. It's interesting. That was really exciting from kind of a technological innovation perspective. I think on the other hand, there were just as many people who were saying, why do you need that?

49:55Wool is the original performance fabric and really kind of moving away from those are my people you know what i felt i think maybe the reason that i picked up on it so strongly this year was that i felt the real push and pull of going in one showroom where someone says you know here was our vision people have kids and dogs and you know you're gonna have sticky toffee pudding in your sofa and then you know the other canthus said like who needs that Let's go back to Raw Fibers, kind of the original performance. And you could ping pong back and forth between them and walk out a true believer in both places.

50:34I think there is such interesting innovation happening kind of on both sides. And what struck me, I think, was that there wasn't anybody sort of lingering in the middle anymore. So I didn't get over to Maison Le Objet. But I mean, I know that Caroline Biggs was there. And it sounds like she had some thoughts of what she saw. Absolutely. So I checked in with her, you know, throughout the show. And I think she wouldn't toot her own horn this way. So I'm going to do it. She had a great surrealism story in our print issue about six months ago. And I always joke that we should have a section on the site called Caroline Biggs told you so.

51:13Because surrealism was huge at Maison et Objet this year. The entire kind of theme for the fair was called Surreality. the Maison Rouge designer of the year was Faye Tugood and she did an exhibit called Womanifesto so like woman and manifesto but it was this very like landscape driven retrospective sort of an installation looking back at an array of her archival works but that was very kind of trippy surrealism inspired they also had sort of a what's new in decor installation that featured a ton of surrealist motifs a lot of stuff from Jonathan Adler, Cece Tapas a staircase sculpture by Norm Architects, kind of this omnipresent force moving through the design industry.

51:59She really took note of that and said, wow, this is definitely showing up here. She also said sustainability was actually a really important conversation at the show, which I think is great because I didn't have that many conversations about sustainability at Paris Deco Off. And so I'm glad that at least that was sort of in the mix and in the conversation at sort of some of the bigger exhibitions at Maison et Nommetier. Okay, let's get into brands that you saw and what really made a splash and an impact. This is going to be a rapid fire round because we've got a lot to get through. There's so much that I can't shut up about, to be honest.

52:39I will say that one of the most exciting moments for me was I was in the Schumacher showroom on Thursday morning, and I was the first person to see a beautiful tapestry get unrolled. It's based on an amazing Flemish design document. And they went to an amazing American mill, one of the few that's still able to do this technique and have really replicated it. It was also amazing to be in the showroom with everyone from the brand as they gasped seeing it for the first time. It was really fun. Samuel and Sons had a great, colorful, exuberant collaboration with the British pastmentary artist Elizabeth Ashdown.

53:16It's called the Kaleidoscope Collection. There is a colorway that's totally bonkers in a way that's really fun. There's also some more muted options. But I think just the way that she's playing with traditional form, shapes, techniques, and motifs, and then making them a little more playful, updating them for today, I think the artistry of that was just mind-blowing. Karen Robert at Oza Bree debuted the Alchemy Collection. It was amazing. It was also her first time doing kind of her own pop-up. She partnered with Pagani Studio, a Brooklyn lighting brand, and they had their own kind of standalone pop-up for the first time.

53:51She had a collection called the Alchemy Collection of beautiful sort of metal leaf wallpapers. She also, I think, is a great proof point that, you know, popping up in Paris can really transform your business. I know she got a lot of leads for some international representation, but I think there's also so much international opportunity that maybe brands aren't thinking about when they show up at Deco Off for the first time. Yeah. And I think as you and I have talked about in the past, I think people are in just such a different mindset when they're over there in Paris. It doesn't matter if you've met them in America before, you want to meet them in Paris.

54:25It's a transformational experience. Anyone who's on the fence about it, I think you and I both feel the same way. Get there. Get in there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So who else stood out in your mind? I loved my appointment at Rubelli. They hired the kind of avant-garde design studio Forma Phantasma to oversee their creative direction in 2023. And I think seeing their sort of continued influence on this year's debuts was maybe one of the most showstopping moments for me. It's like everything luxurious that you've always loved about Rubelli, but it's also kind of weird and playful and joyous and irreverent.

55:02And it was in color. It was like the pitch perfect encapsulation to me of the colors that we were seeing kind of all throughout the show emerge. Forma Phantasma, like we wrote about them in the magazine years ago for making furniture out of like recycled like office trash. And so it's an interesting pick. It's this really kind of funky studio. And I think that energy paired with sort of the tradition and the rigor of Rebelli is is a really exciting kind of meld clash and result. Liberty had 150th anniversary installation that was just like eye candy if you love classically British design. Sean Leffers, the California designer, did a kind of a pop-up of some of his new fabrics that will be coming to a Needler Fauchère showroom near you.

55:51CMO Paris, kind of a funky natural wall coverings company, had this wall covering installed on a wall in their showroom that was literally just like pressed water lilies, like giant ones bigger than a dinner plate on the wall, kind of this, they looked really embossed and interesting. And it was just graphic and fun. And then they're like, no, that's actually the plant. That is the plant on the wall, like in a flower press, a really big flower press. I thought that was showstopping. And de Gournay, you know, I took some designers along on my press appointments for an afternoon. De Gournay was one of our stops.

56:26And I think it was the highlight of the tour for a lot of them. They have a new collection inspired by the works of the couturier Paul Poirier. But they also had this like showstopper pattern. It's hand-painted birds and flowers on silk. But it's called Pietradura. And it's designed to look like kind of a marble inlaid pattern. And so when you look up close, it's all these hand-painted kind of imperfect walls of marble. and it was a beautiful kind of on the roll. And then you saw it installed in their showroom, sort of behind their little spirally staircase. And it was just everything. It was just amazing.

57:04And so that was a real showstopper for me. Last person that I was so excited to meet was a woman named Tigger Hall from Nine Muses. She's an Australian textile brand. It's her first time exhibiting at Deco Off. I think she said she's the first Australian to exhibit at Deco Off. and she just has a wonderful, colorful collection. Her brand is almost 10 years old. So she has a very deep collection to kind of debut for the first time with, but it's all based on her, her paintings. And I think what I love about her is that she's, she's digitally printed. So she's, you know, truly print on demand, which I think has made her fearless about the colors that she puts in her book.

57:41Like if no one buys it, who cares? Like we won't print it, but it made for a really incredible presentation and it allows for sort of a commitment to kind of funky color ways that was actually just truly delightful in the showroom. So I was so excited to meet her, to see her brand for the first time and to kind of learn more about her business in Australia. Dennis, what were your highlights? I want to know what caught your... Ooh, I'm using a Thursday show word. I want to know what caught your eye to go off. Well, I mean, as we were saying earlier, I mean, there's something so magical about the Paris background for any event, right?

58:18So, I mean, you can go to Holly Hunt in New York and be impressed, to be sure, or you can go to the Hotel Crayon and see one of the most fun presentations that Holly Hunt does. There's a great team that does the presentation there. And it was brilliantly done. And you saw the new fabric collections and you saw the new wall covering collections. And that was endlessly fun and really enjoyable. You also get the privilege of seeing the DADAR presentation with Catherine and Rafael Fabrizio, who, again, funny, cute, fun together. They had great names for all their textiles this year. The names were as memorable as the textiles themselves.

59:01I mean, they were really very fun. And I think also the Invisible Collection does a brilliant installation at Feo, which combines all of these several hundred year old installations with the very contemporary looking furniture that they bring into the display. So that's always very fun. Watts, an English company that comes over, does a Paris pop-up and always has fun things on display. Another one that is showing a heritage brand, but in a very contemporary way. So, I mean, I think everybody who shows their lifts, elevates their brand and their presentation. That's why I just think it's so worthwhile.

59:44And so, I mean, there are so many that just make you feel like you're seeing something really special. And as you were saying earlier, like you're just having this incredible experience. But enough of us doing an ad for Deco Off and coming over. But what I'm curious about, and you spent a lot of time with designers, and I love, and so many of the designers that went with you, Caitlin, talked about how special it was to actually get to go on appointments with you. And they felt like so excited. And I want to talk about the field trips in general, because the designers got so much out of that. And I want to talk about it.

1:00:18But let's talk quickly about what your sense was of how people's business was doing. And was there a big feeling of turning the calendar over and now it's 2025 and a different feel to things? What do you think? Or is it post-election? I was just going to say, you said turning the calendar over. And I was like, actually, I think it started on November, whatever day it was. But, you know, I think so many people pinned kind of the turnaround that they're feeling to a couple days after the election, my phone started ringing. You know, and I had heard that sort of anecdotally before. I think we talked about that a little bit at kind of the end of year show.

1:00:55But I think now definitively, everyone I was talking to said, you know, I think my clients were just frozen amid all this uncertainty. And kind of having clarity about the future meant that they were ready to get started with their new project. And so I think people were obviously excited to be in Paris, but there were a lot of people I saw who were like, I'm so excited. This is so inspiring. I need that for my client next week. Can I get a memo of this? People were shopping this show in a way that I don't remember in recent years. I felt a resurgence in energy, in projected output. Certainly, it felt like people just had more projects to talk about, more on their plate again, and a lot that they were really excited to get started.

1:01:43I heard so much. I just had a call. We just had our kickoff call. We're just getting started with design. It really does seem like a time of sort of new beginnings for a lot of people in the industry. Yeah. No, I definitely got that sense as well. You got to Paris even before Deco Off, right? Because you were taking people around on some pretty remarkable field trips and people were thrilled to... It looked like there were several people that went to all of them. Yes, we had some almost perfect. I think we had some almost perfect attendance, which was very fun. And new friends, right? Well, absolutely.

1:02:21And big fans of yours. I mean, they were so excited to get to go around with you. So tell me a little bit of where you went and what you saw. Absolutely. I mean, so our field trip program is for our BOH Insider members. And I think one of the interesting things as we've evolved this field trip program, one of the interesting things is to create access to extraordinary spaces. is. I think we've spent a lot of time thinking about the fact that as a media brand, sometimes you're able to raise your hand or send an email and say, hey, would you open this up to us? Hey, would you lead this tour? Hey, can we see this part of your archive?

1:02:57And if you were one person asking, maybe the answer is no, but somehow there's an opportunity to sort of open some of that up and let people see something kind of in a more intimate way. That's been really exciting. And so I think this year was a really great example of that. The Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday before Deco Off, we took, you know, smallish groups of designers to the embroidery workshop Atelier Le Bousson. We went to Faye Boiserie and kind of got a tour from Guillaume of the archive there and sort of some of its extraordinary contents. we went to the straw marquetry studio atelier Lison de Cône and got to see you know here's the original piece of straw here's how we split it open here's how we make it shiny here's how we glue it just the the time the detail the the kind of hand work we also we went out to Sevres kind of just on the edge of Paris and and walked through every step of the porcelain manufacturing there.

1:03:57So, you know, how they're making the paste, you know, the turning process to make the shape, how you fire it. I didn't predict this, but after spending all of that time watching people at sort of the peak of their craft, making things with their hands, I think you've kind of, you open up something in your brain to see the fabrics differently, to see the handwork differently, to appreciate construction and feel and sort of all of the details that go into what everyone in our industry is creating. And it was just sort of a great, like mind opener ahead of diving into 50 some odd appointments in two days.

1:04:36Well, I think for so many, that was worth the trip alone. A couple people said that they were like, we could be good now. And I was like, no, no, the rest of the show is awesome too. Yeah, no, no, no. But that's the thing. And so, I mean, I know that you want to do even more in the way of field trips and and and get more people aware of it i mean i think it's worth coming to paris for caitlin's field trips alone oh by the way i can't take credit for them we have an incredible team behind the scenes making all of that possible too that wasn't just me but well i mean you're you're leading the way on all of them obviously the entire boh team behind the scenes uh puts them together but i think that it was this was really special and and again so many people got so much out of it.

1:05:23And I think that's sort of a fun segue. Should we talk about London real quick? Because no sooner do you wrap up Paris than you quickly jet over to London for Lauren Hudson's amazing design trip to London. So set it up for us first and kind of tell listeners what this trip was. To tell Lauren's story for her kind of really quickly, Lauren Hudson has the Wells Company, so Rose Cumming and Classic Cloth. She's also got the Wells Abbott showroom network in Texas and Chicago and coming soon to 200 lives in New York. So an expanding empire there. The first iteration of Design Destination London was really primarily focused on her brands and the brand she represents in her showroom last year.

1:06:09It was kind of an invitation only thing. It was about, I believe, 100 designers who came to London, sort of take the train up from Paris, you're already in Europe, come see some of these great British brands where they live, where they make their home base. This year, it was even bigger and better. It was, you know, in partnership with, you know, Lawrence Company, but also Design Center Chelsea Harbor and the Grosvenor Estate that owns Pimlico Road. They all kind of came together to host, I think it was about just under 250 designers this year with some contributing brand partners. And really everyone there was there by invitation and were some of the top customers of all of those partner brands.

1:06:56And there to have just the most extraordinary experience. And each morning you sort of went off to an immersive workshop. I toured Christine Vanderherd's studio for just exquisite custom rugs and embroideries. And she was walking us through some of her projects and how they collaborate with clients to create really bespoke textiles. And then in the afternoon, we were in Design Center Chelsea Harbor to connect with the showrooms there for some great panels and presentations. And then for a big dinner with like 350 people in the central atrium, which is pretty magical. and it was just, you know, it was funny.

1:07:34In her toast at dinner, Lauren Hudson said, you know, basically that, you know, all of the brands who had come together to put on this experience never really get to meet their clients, right? And so, and you have these people who love your work, who love these brands you represent, who are such enthusiastic supporters in their work of your work. And she really just kind of ended by saying, well, this is all to say thank you. You know, we want you to have an experience with us And just thank you so much for supporting what we do. And it was just a really extraordinary way to discover or just to get to know better a lot of those partner brands.

1:08:10So come to Paris, come to London seems to be our big takeaway. Yes, wouldn't you say? I think for anybody questioning the return on investment of, you know, a week in Paris, a week in Paris with your whole team. I mean, I think that's amazing, the people who are bringing their teams. I can't imagine not feeling an immense return on making that investment in yourself, in your staff, just to grow and learn and explore and expand together. And I really think, I don't know, I really think that's what both of these experiences provide an opportunity to do. Okay. I'm glad you're home. Welcome back. My plants aren't dead.

1:08:48It's a small miracle. That is, they look flourishing from behind you from what I can see. So, but thank you so much for making the time to come on and chat. It's great to catch up. Thank you, Dennis. It's always such a delight to be here.

1:09:08And we're back. We're getting to the end of the show here. But before we go, we'd like to take a second to highlight anything going on in the industry that might have caught our eye. Fred? IKEA caught my eye, and not just because I had to go there over the weekend and drag along to two kids in the process, which was fun. IKEA is making a$1 billion investment in recycling across a couple of different categories, a couple of different companies. You know, IKEA, of course, is like the biggest furniture company in the world, and they certainly, you know, churn through a lot of wood. They don't necessarily have to invest in sustainability.

1:09:43And I think that it's admirable that they do. And I think it's cool that they spend, you know, they put their money where their mouth is. I do think we need, you know, I don't doubt their sincerity towards, you know, sustainability. And I think that like putting a billion dollars towards recycling furniture is a great idea, especially when you yourself are, you know, a huge producer of fast furniture. So I don't know. The debate over that is complicated, but I do think it's good that IKEA is doing this. And I hope that, you know, we're getting closer and closer towards real circularity in the furniture and design industry.

1:10:13And hopefully this billion dollars will go that way. and I myself am obviously guilty of it because I went shopping there. So I'm hopeful that I myself will be recycling some of that furniture in a couple years. Dennis, what caught your eye this week? Well, you know, we've talked so much on the show about the dupes, Fred. The dupes. Yeah. And, you know, while I was in Paris, I had the privilege and opportunity to visit the Royer apartment, the designer Jean Royer behind the polar bear sofa, which is one of the most copied and imitated pieces of furniture that ever existed. And so it was striking to sit upon the actual, the original, the real thing and see what it really feels like and how substantial a piece it really is.

1:11:03They told me the wait time is about 10 months to have one made. So you can't churn them out very quickly, but it's well worth it. But it was so interesting to learn more about Jean Royer, who, as a designer, did something like 1 ,300 projects over the course of his career. And there's a huge archive of his work, which I would love to learn more about. But he was really an original and somebody who still continues to make an impact with his work. So I was very impressed with both learning about the French craftsmen who make the pieces today. They have a pop-up in Soho, and I think that they're trying to service more designers in the U.S.

1:11:52But really interesting, again, to see one of the most widely knocked off pieces ever to spend time with the real thing was very impressive. That's super cool. Maybe next year. Maybe next year I'll make it over. I hope so, Fred. I hope so. All right. That's all the time we have today. Thanks so much for listening. If you want to keep up with the latest news, browse job listings, or take a workshop, visit us online at businessofhome.com. If you want to get in touch with the show, write to us at podcast at business of home.com. This episode was produced by Fred Nikolaus and Caroline Burke and edited by Michael Castaneda.

1:12:31I'm Dennis Scully. Have a great weekend and we'll be back with you on Monday.