The Smash Burger Smackdown | 5

0:04Let's step behind the counter for a second and into the fray of a busy kitchen. Can you hear the sizzle? Smell the charbroil? See that smoky haze? Well, today we're talking all about burgers. A hamburger is about as American as it gets, despite its German name. The first burger was served at Lewis's Lunch in 1895 in New Haven, Connecticut. That's according to the Library of Congress. But the classic sandwich has come a long way since then. For many years, bigger was better when it came to burgers. Bigger patties and toppings piled high. But recently, a new trend has been sweeping the nation. You know the one, the Smash Burger.

0:42Devotees rave over its crispy exterior, which they say protects the juicy interior. Their chain Smash Burger led the charge in 2007, but it's taken a while for the technique to catch fire, if you will. This thinner, crispier burger is now making its way into high-end restaurants, according to the Wall Street Journal. And another burger that's been trending? The meatless kind. Plant-based patties on the rise, popping up in everything from fine dining to fast food. And we are going to bite into all that and more and determine how popular burgers stack up in our very own Business Wars taste test.

1:18We're joined by three guests who get to eat burgers for a living. Eater LA's Mona Holmes and Josh Scherr and Nicole Inaity of the YouTube channel Mythical Kitchen. Hope you're hungry, because all that's coming up.

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3:45from Wondery I'm David Brown and this is the Smashburger Smackdown today you're gonna get hungry don't say I didn't warn you we're talking all about burgers and joining us Josh Sher and Nicole Inaidi their YouTube channel part of the super popular brand Good Mythical Morning where hosts recreate fast food dishes among other things Also joining us, Mona Holmes of Eater LA. All right. Rapid fire round. Don't think, just blurt it out. Favorite burger place in Los Angeles? Mona. Chris's Burgers in La Puente. Aha. Josh. Pie and Burger in Pasadena. Mmm. Nicole. Gold Burger. Gold Burger. All right. I'm wondering if I should get you each to justify your answers.

4:32Mona, do you want to go first? Sure. I have no idea how long Chris's Burgers has been there. Probably many, many decades. And also, anytime I go there, I ask them questions. They have no time for me. They just cook. And it's just a solid burger that is meaty, but not too meaty. It's got a great ratio of lettuce and tomato, melted cheese. The ratio is amazing. And I truly love them. It's just one of those great independent burger stands. Josh, what about you? So Pie and Burger is a super, super old school diner and pie counter in Pasadena. I believe they've been operating since 1961 or so. They kind of half claim to have invented the cheeseburger, but I love them because they have the thickest, coldest iceberg lettuce in the game.

5:21Oh, that's nice. Nicole, how about you? So Gold Burger started during the pandy, also known as the pandemic. It started as a pop-up and they now have two brick and mortars. I think one in Highland Park and one in Silver Lake. And their burger is just phenomenal. Their meat lace is unlike any other meat lace I've ever had on a burger. I'm sorry, meat lace. What is that exactly? So I'm so glad you asked. It's a delicious combination of fried lacy meat that kind of sticks together in this gorgeous pattern once it's like slammed on the grill. And it mixes with the fat from the cheese and that hot, hot griddle.

5:58And that's what I call it. but they have a phenomenal sauce that goes on it. It's an aioli. It's like a mustard garlic aioli that they put on their burger and it's just so phenomenal. The sauce is better than any burger sauce I've ever had. And yeah, it's number one in my book. Yours sounds like the most fancy pants of them all. I mean, you know, gosh, that's pretty swanky. I want to ask you all about the more famous spots. I mean, you know, obviously burgers are a big part of when someone comes from out of town, you want to take them to grab a burger, show them a little bit of the local action.

6:31Where would you take them for that classic L.A. burger experience? Anyone want to volunteer? I love Apple Pan. Apple Pan. Tell us why Apple Pan. There's something about sitting around the counter that makes me feel like I've been transported to another time. And I just love the little hats they wear at Apple Pan. And the burger is a really solid burger. I mean, you can get the Hickory Burger. What's the other burger called? There's the Hickory Burger. It's like the burger. The burger. I think their burgers are solid. They're delicious. Surprise, their tuna melts, actually, my favorite thing there.

7:06But I just think it's a solid, delicious burger, great produce, great vibes. Josh, you mentioned Pasadena claims to have invented the cheeseburger. City of Pasadena actually says it dates back to 1924 at a whopping 15 cents, a cheeseburger. You think Pasadena is still holding it down on the cheeseburger front? I think they still are. And I think for the same reasons it was invented there. I believe it was invented at a place called The Right Spot. I believe it was originally called the Aristocrat Hamburger. But L.A. has actually invented a lot of burgers. The pastrami burger was invented in Los Angeles.

7:40The chili cheeseburger was invented at Tommy's in Los Angeles, which is another classic spot I'd go to. I love eating out of the trunk of my car. Shout out to the original Tommy's. But I think Pasadena, it's still where a lot of very old school stuff in L.A. lives. That's why you can go to a spot like Pie and Burger and still have that old school experience. Mona, your job involves reviewing restaurants and staying up to date on everything in the L.A. scene. In fact, folks should know you were nominated for a James Beard Award for some of your culinary reporting. So now I'm curious, how would you characterize the local burger space?

8:10I mean, it seems pretty iconic. You know, burgers are to Angelenos maybe what pizza is to New Yorkers. That sound about right? Yeah, I would characterize it as that. I'd also suggest that it's big, it's diverse, it's dominant. That's what the burger scene is to me. And I think it's pretty telling that when people come into town who haven't spent a lot of time in Los Angeles, that there are burger stands and donut shops everywhere. And mountains, and huge mountains. They get shocked. That is so true. And it's like, yeah, we got all those things. I know you all thought that we don't eat meat or gluten, but we like our meat between buns and we like our deep fried dough.

8:55Take that, America. Take that. And also, as someone who grew up here, I just thought that burger culture that we had was everywhere. So I study it every time I visit a different city and the levels are just not the same. And, you know, which is why I lean towards these wonderful independent burger stands like Jim's and Tam's and Astro Burger and Super Burger, who all make solid burgers. You know, they they and they throw pastrami on top of it, too. It's like the best thing ever. Josh, Nicole, I know y 'all spend a fair amount of time in the kitchen recreating famous fast food orders, but also cooking up burgers.

9:38I understand there was a burger cooking face-off that went down a little while back, and Nicole has bragging rights. What actually happened there? That's right. We made an oxtail burger. So we made a delicious burger patty. We smashed it down. We added some smoked gouda on there, some braised oxtail, maybe like a 24-hour braised oxtail. And then we made a scotch bonnet aioli in between a beautiful brioche bun. And I totally deserve that W. That was a good dub. I agree because I remember what I made. Yes, you made a wet dream burger. Please expand on that. I won. Mona's talking about fried dough and burgers.

10:14I combined them. I made savory beignet buns. Yes. And then I made like a Cajun seasoned pork patty and then put like butter and garlic sauteed shrimp, an ode to the actual Viet Cajun classic of the shrimp boil. There's definitely a lot more going on in this burger than the last one. Sorry. Oh, I'm sorry. All right. All right. All right. All right. frankly nine too many ingredients on that burger should have cut that at least in half braised celery right there is something like it was like pickled celery celery i don't even know anymore mona i i need you here when you're judging burgers what do you look for in the perfect burger because honestly when you're talking about shrimp and all these other ingredients when is a burger not a burger anymore just a sandwich you know that i because i I sit in a room with four other food writers all day.

11:08We've probably been debating that for about four years now. Is that right? Maybe longer, actually. But I am not picky. The criteria for me for judging a burger is juiciness of whatever the protein is because it can be beef or turkey. Turkey burger is delicious. So are chicken burgers. The amount of fat that's in there is where most of the flavor is going to be and the juiciness. You know, it's got to be tender. No one likes an overcooked piece of meat. And then, again, you know, the balance of ratio for condiments. But to me, that's for a traditional thick burger. For smash burgers, it does vary a little bit and actually quite a bit because, once again, you know, that – how did you describe it again?

11:57The lacy goodness. Did I call it lacy meat? I think meat lace. Meat lace. I'm glad you asked because that's freaking me out a little bit. I got to be honest with you. It's so good, but what they do is they smash it on that griddle, and they have to be super careful. It doesn't take very long to cook, obviously, because it's super thin. But when it's overdone, it's overly chewy. It's rough, and the flavor just isn't there. So, you know, and then they've got to sprinkle whatever they've got to put on that. So it really does take some skill to put together the perfect smash burger. But you'll know because there's a slight crisp and just really good flavor and also really good quality ingredients.

12:40Like you can't go cheap on a smash burger because you can taste it right away. Speaking of smash burgers, it's time for a break. But when we come back, we've got our very own burger taste test. Stay with us.

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15:59Hey, welcome back to Business Wars. My guests are Josh Sher and Nicole Inaidi, kitcheneers on the YouTube channel Mythical Kitchen and hosts of the podcast A Hot Dog is a Sandwich, where they have spirited debates about your favorite foods. We're also joined by foodie Mona Holmes, an award-winning writer at Eater LA. Now, Mona, you gave us a great description of a smashburger earlier. When did these come on the scene? I'm trying to think the first time I ever heard of a smashburger, and it seems like it was about five years ago or something. But maybe that's because I'm in Austin. I'm not in the burger capital of the country.

16:34For us in Los Angeles, it started in 2017 with Burgers Never Say Die. Interesting. And it started as a pop-up in a backyard. And then it became this permanent Silver Lake spot and it just exploded. And with every trend, of course, everyone wanted to try and mimic it or improve it. And in a city like L.A., that can happen really fast. So it shows no sign of slowing, but you can go out in just about any part of the city and find folks that might be more established or on the sidewalk making truly excellent smash burgers. Now, Josh and Nicole, can you walk us through how a smash burger is actually made?

17:14I mean, how do you get to lacy meat? It's actually really interesting. So most, if you're not making a smash burger, you would likely form the patty as it's raw and then griddle it and flip it with a smash burger. You actually want the patty to be a ball. Now, a lot of people will take that patty, typically a 70-30 lean to fat ratio. You need good fat to get the smash action on it. And you will roll that in salt to get good seasoning on it. And then you will need some sort of patty smasher. Now, the original patty smasher, according to legend, was a large paint can. But people have actually made some chefs will stack two spatulas on top of each other.

17:50Some will use jerry-rigged devices where they put a handle on a big heavy weight. Wait a minute. Can't anything smash a piece of meat, a ball of meat? Give me a break. I mean, is there really a debate over this? One hundred percent. And it all, I swear, some are way better than others because what you really need is something heavy that you can press down on this ball of meat to flatten it completely evenly with force all around. That's how you maintain the circular shape. And then what a lot of chefs will do is you have to twist your wrist to create that circle because the goal is to get as much surface area and force as possible on that meat to the griddle to create what's called the Maillard reaction or effectively the browning of any meat.

18:31That's where protein effectively turns into glutamate, which is the main flavor that we taste with umami or savoriness. And then you flip that lacy, smashed, crispy, fatty meat. If there's enough fat in it, that's where the lace comes in because the fat evaporates through the meat to create these little pores. Flip that over, put some cheese on it to melt it, throw it in a bun, and that's the smash burger. I have completely underrated this. This is a science. This is beyond art. And they are hard to make, too. Yes, they are. Well, it sounds like it. We've had plenty of trial and error. Well, let's talk about how smash burgers compare to the originals, and perhaps the best way to do that is with a smash burger smackdown.

19:15I gather that each of you have two burgers in front of you. We have a smash burger from Heavy Handed, which was shouted out in Eater's Best Burgers in L.A., Roundup. You've also got the Irv's Original Roadside Single Burger. This was also featured on the Eater list, And that chain's been an L.A. staple since the 1940s, I think it is. So you've got one Smashburger, one classic, and we're going to have you test each one and give us the verdict on which you think is more satisfying. Team, you ready? Born ready. All right. Let's begin with the heavy-handed Smashburger. Josh, Nicole, maybe you can describe what you've got in your hands or getting in your hands there right now.

19:53Well, it looks like we have a burger, a double. Is this a double? Am I seeing? No, it's a single. You seem double. It's a burger. I must be. I'm hungry. It's a soft bun. I'm thinking it might be a potato. Is this a potato bun? It looks like a potato bun today. And then we have some caramelized onions a la In-N-Out. And then we have a smash burger patty and some American cheese. Some burger sauce with a little bit of pickle. And it looks pretty damn good. May I eat it? Well, hold, hold. I'm going to check with Mona. Mona, what are your first thoughts on the burger? the size, smell, all that. Well, listen, I've had both of these burgers multiple times, many times.

20:36And I'm actually a fan of both. And Nicole, your description is absolutely perfect. You know, these are made with short rib. And, you know, they are juicy and super fatty. Like The last time I had one, I basically went home and took a nap. And, you know, caramelized onions. And, yes, it's a potato bun. I think there's butter pickles on here, if I'm not mistaken, because I believe they deep fry them. Wow. And, yeah, they're a solid burger maker. All right. Moment of truth. Go ahead and take a bite. I'm not hearing any of that mmm sound. You know how when you like something, you sort of involuntarily go mmm.

21:25So what are we thinking? So my initial thought is that the potato bun has a level of sweetness that really contributes to the whole bite. And then there's that savory funk with the onions that I think is really delicious. Savory funk. Yeah. I mean, the caramelized notes, it's like a funky, oniony taste without that crunch. And the pickles, I'm not wild about these pickles. Yeah, they're a sweet pickle. They're a sweet pickle. the biggest fan but if we're talking about the actual burger this is cooked really really well some smash burgers they get so thin that you lose the character the meat but here you get the best of both worlds get that lacy crispy edge like mona said it's short rib there's so much fat in it but then there's still a nice meaty bite in the middle maybe my favorite thing is the way that the grease from the burger becomes a condiment it soaks into that potato bun this thing is so soft that it almost eats like a dumpling which i love mona you want to weigh in here yeah but josh nicole i love I love your description.

22:22I'll say. So colorful. Adjective city. Good night. They're pretty amazing. I mean, listen. Well, first off, I'm not a huge fan of pickles in a burger. I don't understand it either. I just don't. But this combination with this bun, I think that there's a nice contrast or an extra sweetness that helps make this bearable for someone who typically doesn't like pickles on a burger. But the sauce, the sauce is so yummy. You know, it's just got, once again, the ratio is just right for me. And what's going on in that sauce? Is that mayo or something else happening? What's happening with that sauce? I mean, you would say, okay, this feels like a special sauce, but this is far better than a McDonald's special sauce.

23:08It's nice and tangy. It's just a really nice burger. And it's super awkwardly messy in a great way. I don't like my food to be perfect. And this is, you know, it's ugly and it's perfect. It's ugly and it's perfect. That is a quote right there. All right. Any other takeaways from burger number one before we move along? What a lovely treat it is to eat a free hamburger. I'm having a good time so far. Oh, that's great. It's great. Great. All right. Well, hearing no objection, let's move on to Irv's Original Roadside Single Burger. Now, Josh and Nicole, you may have to split that one. We do, but it's bigger than two.

23:44We're used to sharing. So, Mona, give us a quick description of herbs. What you got in front of you there? This is a historic burger. It is. I mean, like you mentioned before, they've been around since the 40s. And this is a place that's gone through multiple rounds of ownership that was brought back from the dead, effectively. And people have such a love for herbs. And, you know, there was a new order that brought them back in 2000. You know, I consider it one of L.A.'s historic burgers. People often in a city like L.A., they go on a taco crawl. I think that you could actually go on a burger crawl and Irv's would be a part of that tour.

24:27Yeah. Josh, Nicole, how would you describe this burger and how it's different from the Smash Burger? It's real big. It's a big one. It's a big one. It's a big one. That's a big boy. It is beautiful. I mean, as an L.A. native, born and raised, I agree with everything you said, Mona. Irv's is iconic. It is delicious. and people will do crazy things to get an Irv's burger. It's just big. The bun looks toasted. The cheese is covering all over that meat. There's veg in here, which I like. It looks like there's tomato and lettuce. What else is in there, Josh? You got some chopped white onion. You got some proper dill pickles, which I respect.

25:00Also, interestingly, the lettuce and tomato are beneath the patty and the onions and pickles are on top. And I agree with that. This is architecture. This is history. Right, yeah, yeah. It's a well-architectured burger. The Frank Lloyd Wright of burgers. Part of this is where the tongue meets first, right? I mean, it's where the taste actually kicks in. That's part of the architecture of it, right? I would agree. Someone's eating their burger already. All right, let's go on and take a bite. How does this compare with the smash burger, y 'all? What's standing out? Anyone want to jump in? This burger, it makes me feel taken care of.

25:37I feel safe with this burger. Hear me out. It's so big. That's a full meal, right? That's like you just left the Dodger game. You didn't want to pay$17 for a hot dog. You go to Irv's. This is filling you up at 11 at night. This has such great old school appeal to it. And I would argue it is still a smash burger. You can see the lacy meat edge. It's not crushed. It's not ostentatiously thin. But this has an incredible cook on it. You can taste the seasoning on that grill. I love this burger. Yeah, I'd say it has. It's much more harmonious than the last burger we ate. I think all of the veg really helps.