Courtney Stodden (FBF)

0:28What's up, Daddy Gang? Okay, daddy gang. If you are familiar with today's guest, you probably know them from the headline the media used to define them in 2011. Courtney Stodden, a 16 year old child bride marries a man in his 50s. I was also 16 when this story was on the front cover of every fucking tabloid. This man was hired by Courtney's mom to be Courtney's acting coach. It turned predatory. Courtney's parents knew and let it continue. And I remember when Courtney Stodden was signed away by their parents and granted permission to marry this dude in his 50s. At the time, Courtney received endless online hate and negative media coverage.

1:22Again, Courtney, a child, received death threats, was stalked by the paparazzi, sexualized, labeled a whore. This was a 16-year-old. Meanwhile, if you look back at all the media coverage, it's like they forgot about the adults in the situation. The 50-year-old fucking creep Courtney married, Doug Hutchison, this washed-up actor, would have been a pedophile if he had pursued a relationship with 16-year-old Courtney. But instead, Courtney's parents willingly welcomed Doug into their family and legally permitted the marriage. after suffering abuse at the hands of countless adults and reality TV shows being exploited.

2:16Courtney is now 27, gotten into therapy and started a recovery journey. Listen, I had not kept up with Courtney Stodden and sitting down with Courtney, I realized the reality of how layered their story is and how deeply the media betrayed that 16-year-old child. This is a story of child abuse that began 10 years ago. And after finalizing their divorce in 2020, Courtney is now beginning to process what it means to be a survivor.

3:08What is up, Daddy Gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper, with Call Her Daddy. I will probably take five minutes to get comfortable, so sorry. I think it's just this large thing in front of my face that's giving me a little PTSD, maybe. Just want to push it around. They all look the same to me at this point, honestly. Okay, let's drink our water. Would you prefer we were drinking vodka? Actually, yeah. We could maybe get some drinks in here in a little bit. I am down. Okay, what do you like? It's your show. I'm down to drink. What kind of alcohol do you like? I'll just do whatever you have.

3:50We have vodka or tequila, right? I think vodka, probably. I'll take tequila. I like that. It's like, welcome to Call Her Daddy. It's noon on a Wednesday and we are popping the bottles open. We were out like getting some like, you know, like a diva day and the entire place turned into a bar and like how long? In seconds. Are we recording? OK, yeah, maybe this will be the intro of us just summoning our drinks. We're like, get me some fucking alcohol because it's about to get emotional. I think we're going to need it for this. I do, too. Honestly, I do. Yeah. 45 minutes later, Courtney and I have taken 12 shots.

4:30We've fixed our flyaways. We've eaten the mic. And I think we're ready for therapy. I think we're ready for therapy. Cheers. Cheers. It's just so fucking amazing to meet you. We are the same age. And I remember seeing your story when I was like 15, 16. I remember watching it kind of unfolding in the news. And since then, so much has happened in your life. and I really appreciate you sitting down with me. You live in LA? Yeah, I live in Brentwood area. Love that area. Yeah. How long have you lived there? I've lived there probably for like a year and a half now and Kamala Harris is my neighbor, so.

5:12Bougie bitch, what? It was just really shocking because I am in the middle of studying for my license. Finally, at 20 freaking seven years old, like finally you know passed my permit like trying to get my license and I'm like trying to drive home and there is like so much traffic on this little street couldn't figure it out and then I like I went too fast and one of these guys was like it was like I don't know like a security guard he goes you don't just slow down you know Kamala Harris is getting trying to go home and I'm just like what the heck wow that's status right there that's also LA like how fucking just casual that you're just like neighbors with Kamala you're like what's up so crazy have you ever seen her um I've tried like since then I've kind of like been this like I've been driving really slow with my permit you know like looking over at her house literally two miles an hour just like so creepy right I know but there's like security in front so I think they're starting to kind of look at me like why is this bitch talking so wow but it's just yeah it's amazing I mean I it was the first time I ever voted in my adult life and I voted for Kamala and that's such a cool moment our president yeah comes full circle now you're just casually neighbors you must live in a nice neighborhood Courtney you're like no comment absolutely um did you always have aspirations to move to LA like when you were a little girl did you want to be like famous like what did you want to be I've always loved music I always wanted to pursue that at a really really young age and my mom she was always very supportive of it I think that she found a lot of entertainment in supporting her daughter as well and so her and I just kind of like became this almost like a momager to me and then you know was that mindset of helping her daughter when and why did your parents decide to homeschool you my my father wasn't involved in that situation He wasn't contributing at all to the decision to pull me out, nor did he really know that I was being completely abused and bullied at school.

7:29In sixth grade, I was pulled out because I was bullied. I mean, I got a lot of, like, my old friends bullying me, and, you know, my arm was broken at one point. And I just was that kid that was really popular before I hit puberty. And then when I hit puberty, I was treated so differently. And as a child, like, you really don't understand why you're being treated differently. Assault emails that I was getting from, you know, the future middle school and stuff. You know, they're going to knock my teeth down my face and, you know, they're going to, you know, just it's just going to be a really horrible experience for me.

8:10So my mom pulled me out because of that. Yeah. At that time, your dad was not in your life. You know, I think in looking back at it, I feel like my father completely left me emotionally abandoned. And I don't know if he's that type of man to be able to properly emotionally be there for their child. It just doesn't seem that way because history wouldn't have been the way it is for me, like my life. Right. It all kind of falls back to that relationship. so many young women go through that and then it directly affects their romantic relationships absolutely we will be getting to you got married to a man in his 50s when you were 16 his name is Doug Hutchison how did you meet Doug let's take Courtney's grabbing for the vodka we're like hold on let's take a sip of our drink here we go let's get into Doug how did you meet Doug?

9:12Doug and I met through a mutual friend. So the mutual friend manager introduced my family to Doug because Doug was teaching acting classes here in LA. And I always kind of expressed, you know, interest also in singing, but in acting. And that's how we connected was through email. email yeah so you got connected with him on email and how what were the initial conversations you were having with him via email I think I just need a little break yeah yeah yeah sorry no take your time what's coming up for you right now I'm still healing from this it's it's very um it's very very very fresh for me um um, I wore, I wore a waterproof mascara specifically.

10:20I never wear waterproof. Um, but we met through a mutual friend. We started connecting through email and my mom and this, you know, our mutual friend, um, Tim, his name's Tim Wilson. He didn't know about the exchanges that Doug was having with me. My mom did. She was aware. She was like over my shoulder the entire time practically or having me print out the emails and she was reading them. And, you know, nothing was sexual, but it was definitely not about what it was supposed to be about, which was about teaching me acting and, you know, all of that stuff that, you know, professionally you're supposed to be doing.

11:13And then as a child, I didn't really see it as anything predatory. I mean, I don't think children have that capacity to really see that, especially if they're, they, they, they don't feel like they have a proper relationship with their father. You know, there were just questions like, you know, what's your favorite color? And, you know, what, where do you see yourself in five years? And, you know, let's play 10 questions and and then we're going to get to know each other that way first you know after that then I can kind of help teach you you know where I think you'd fall good in acting and just all of this bs now I know in retrospect right it's just a way to to to start figuring out the child and to get your claws in them and you know control them did he know what you looked like because you were only communicating on email did he know your age and did he know what you looked he knew what I looked like um my manager at the time sent him pictures and he was very much aware of what I looked like but he claims that you know he's never known my age he never knew my age it's not true he did because my mom received a call from him and he said you know so I really want to start teaching your daughter acting and she goes okay well you know she's only um you know she just turned 16 and he knew my age absolutely he did did you know how old he was I did yeah yeah so you were saying that your mom was like printing out the emails and looking over them with you do you remember your mom ever saying anything to be careful of or was it was she condoning this during the time too?

12:59My mom has always been a very protective mother. I mean, just, just going back and kind of trying to shine a little light on my backstory a little bit. My, my mom has gotten a lot of hate and I understand why. I mean, if, you know, if I ever have a baby and I'm raising that baby I I from my own experiences I would never sign my kid off ever to an adult man you know 34 years old like there's just no way that would happen but I think that she thought she was doing something that was going to make me happy truthfully I really believe that um but in retrospect she knows it was the wrong decision she's even she's apologized to me so many times and has said you know if I could just do anything to do over I would I'm just so sorry I wouldn't sign off on this how long were the two of you speaking online before you met in person we spoke online and on the phone for six months and then um I met him in person he came to my hometown.

14:10And what were the expectations of him coming? Like what was the purpose of that trip? I believe it was obviously to see his child in person, verify the parents are on board, I'm not going to go to jail, and I can get that free pass to molest a child. I just need that paperwork signed for me to get married because it's a loophole. Right. And then a week later we got married so I basically just met him in person one week and then a week later I'm married but just to get context so you had fully had a conversation of this is a relationship before you met in person like that was art now in the works fully and your mom was aware of it I was already groomed before I met him yeah he comes into town what was that like with him meeting your parents and everything like do you remember that week um I do but there was a specific moment that really stands out to me.

15:06After picking him up from the airport, my father was driving. My mom was there, felt like I had support. My dad just said he needed to meet him in person and then he could just sign off on it, which in retrospect makes me extremely angry. He was in his very own fragile state of mind at that point in the marriage with my mother. My mother was in a very bad place with my father, So this was like a perfect, like, you know, grooming situation for someone like Doug. I remember being, you know, picking Doug up from SeaTac, driving about an hour and a half to a cafe. And I thought maybe at least it would take the entire weekend for my father to then talk to me and say, you know, I don't know if you, you know.

15:58I feel like I really did want to marry Doug because I thought I was in love with him but there was also something in me as a child that made me question if my father really loved me so it was like this you know dichotomy and so when we got to that diner we had a little lunch my dad immediately before they ate their lunch took Doug outside and said you know what you have my blessing. He didn't even see him for maybe an hour. They didn't talk. My dad was driving. Doug was in the back seat and he gave Doug the blessing to take his child away from him. You know, even if he did feel like, um, you know, his, his family was falling apart and all these things, like, I feel like he did choose himself.

16:51Did your dad ever pull you aside and ask how you were feeling he did um before we met doug but it was just like five minutes in my bedroom kind of took my hands as it is this what you want i know he was i know he was arguing with my mom i could hear them screaming you know throughout the house and he he just but i just think he gives up so quickly that's just the kind of person he is he just kind of like runs away from issues and he's So, I mean, you know, it just makes sense why this happened. Right. And it happens to so many other children in the USA. I mean, about 300 ,000 children, underage children, were married to adults between the years of 2000 and 2018.

17:43and 86 % of those children are girls. And it's in this country. We think of child bride as some foreign situation, but it's so prevalent in the USA right now, and it's terrifying. And some as young as 10 years old. Did Doug treat you like an adult, or did he treat you like a child? I think that it's pretty obvious that he looked at me like a child, but wanted to treat me like some kind of object. How did he pitch you on getting married? Why couldn't you guys just date? I grew up in a really Christian family. And I was a virgin when I met Doug. And, you know, because of my mom's own, again, I mean, I'm going through this in therapy, so I'm not yet healed from all of this.

18:37but you know she believed that this guy would really take care of me and really love me and she was also in a position to feel like she could believe him I mean she really did you know I'm just gonna say it when I went through this divorce process with Doug I found out that right after I left him he started pursuing a 15 year old girl in the UK and I have all of the proof I have all of the emails um I got connected with an ex um assault victim and um he was doing the same thing to another 15 year old girl while I was going through this process um is there a tissue I'm I'm I'm still working through all of this so you're going through the divorce and you find out he's already on to his next victim yes I found out through um I found out through uh a step a stepmother who reached out to me on Instagram and um I just I can't tell you how how much that broke me like even after all of like the control I felt like I didn't even have control over my own body my own finances I couldn't sign any legal documents in that marriage I couldn't you know sign off on my own marriage like I was just so controlled but then I think that there's this trauma bond that happens when you're that age like right you have like this I don't want to say I had Stockholm Syndrome because I did but it there's this grooming it's the effects and the mental effects of grooming right where I didn't want to believe you know right I mean a few people reach out I just didn't want to believe it I just you know it's not what how he made me feel he made me feel really really special and unique I just really believed him and then just finding out everything.

21:11It's just, it's just, you know, horrible. And then reading that, you know, that he's, he's doing, he's ready to marry another minor. I just helped with the attorneys there, get this little girl away from him. It just became my mission because I know exactly what he was doing. I saw the emails. They were the same emails to me and they were the same letters because in 96 same letters he was writing in his handwriting to this other 15 year old girl it just clicked that I was with a predator and I never I never I was just so groomed I never wanted to believe it legally how were you able to marry Doug I was able to marry Doug because my mom signed off on the paperwork did your parents prior to that or any adult have a conversation with you of like this is what's going to change in your life if you marry this man did anybody have that conversation with me yeah like hey if you get you're about to get married at 16 like this is what's gonna happen no no I mean I really didn't even know what was gonna to happen on the honeymoon I had no idea really your wedding day you're walking down that aisle what do you remember feeling on that day I was beyond nervous because I just wanted to play the part for him like I wanted him to be impressed with me like I was a woman I mean I was a kid so I feel like I was playing dress up in a sense but I was so madly in love with him that I just like I don't know it was just this really strange feeling that I always carried with me and I mean the photo of my father walking me down the aisle is really interesting to me because he has this look on his face I mean you can google like it's he has this look on his face where he's just so

23:32angry but he's still doing it which which was really you know it's just I don't know how does it make you feel when you look at that photo angry yeah I definitely know like the more awareness and therapy and the more I come to terms and like go through all of these things I'm seeing things so much more clearly it's so hard to see something so clearly when you're the one who is in you know that spotlight and you get so much you know support but the hate and like all of that like it's so hard to just make sure that you're listening to a healthy amount of it all I believe but like I just got to a place where I was just listening to so much negativity because that's that's really I mean I really didn't have that much self-worth did you ever ask your dad seeing that photo like why did you then walk me down the aisle nope my father has completely disowned me he texted me and said you were not my daughter this was about three years ago so i don't have a relationship with that man what triggered him disowning you my marriage to doug because i was obviously old enough to make that decision my mother not wanting to be with my father because of my decision she wanted to go with me and that broke up their marriage um he obviously hits the bottle pretty hard i think he he's he runs away from a lot of things um he's kind of always been like that but he's a I really believe too like underneath it all he is a really scarred amazing gentle man he just doesn't know how to deal with any of this properly I mean even you know even serial killer parents like never disown their kids right what did I do you mentioned that you were a virgin when you met Doug and you mentioned that you had no idea what the honeymoon was going to entail right what do you recall about that night and losing your virginity and the whole experience I mean for that whole experience for me was so like insane I mean coming from a really like I I grew up where Kurt Cobain grew up and it is like the most depressing freaking town like nobody does anything like it you know like it's and so from that to being pulled a week later into this I mean I just I just shut down I disassociated myself I tried the best I could to put on that that role, you know, because that's what grooming is, really.

26:21I, you know, came from a really small town and then immediately like right up in the Hollywood Hills and, you know, the honeymoon's going to be scheduled at the Chateau Marmont penthouse. And I remember running into the bathroom, shutting the door and just looking in the mirror and crying for, I don't know how long, I was just crying. And I know I was feeling stuff that I wasn't necessarily letting myself process or I wasn't old enough to process or something. I don't know. I take my bra off. I was wearing those bombshell Victoria's Secret bras. Do you remember that? It was like two big cup sizes.

27:01And then inside of that, I had a cutlet. So they were like, and I was so freaked out to undress because I'm like, he's just, he's not going to love me like this. Like he, like how, like I look like a kid. Like I looked like a 12 year old with my clothes off. Little did I know it was a fantastic night for him, but I was a complete nervous wreck. So you were petrified to get undressed? Petrified. Yeah. Once you did, did you ever loosen up or did you feel uncomfortable the whole time like how did he handle calming you well he gave me a little wine before when I went into the bathroom so I had a little wine at 16 before you have sex for the first time just a little yeah were you was that the first time you had had a drink um I had a corona the day I arrived to Doug's house with my family um before we got married before we all jetted off to Vegas the next day.

28:10I remember I opened his fridge and I'm like, I'm fucking emancipated. I'm having a Corona. So it was like my first Corona ever. So I started drinking when this, yeah. So at 16, starting to drink. Right. Being married, you go to this honeymoon. Afterwards, what was early marriage life like for the two of you? i just remember waking up the morning after at the chateau mormont and i'd be you know i i was growing up in such a religious household and i remember looking down at the sheets the white sheets and i was just i was praying to god i was like please and if for some reason i kind of felt like the one that wasn't good enough all the time like you know i'm like please i pray to god that there's some cherry on there because if there's no freaking cherry like I'm not I am not gonna be good enough for this man like literally how sick is that like I mean I'm not putting down anybody's beliefs but like for me I just look back at it and I just feel like it's so sick and I I saw it and I was like I felt like okay so this is ordained by God like this is an ordained situation how was he towards you after that first night together I have never seen him so on top of the moon I mean I woke up and he had his little like hat on he was playing the piano like you know he he just was I mean he just got to molest a child legally

29:57with a 34 year difference between you and Doug back then what was presented to you that you guys had in common he would you know what he would always answer this question so whenever we would do like you know our media rounds or he would do an interview or I would do an interview I would always kind of fall back on what he would tell everybody like my dad I'm like oh yeah okay so that's that's how I answer this media question what do you have in common we love I love Lucy you know we love the honeymooners we love you know um you know ACDC and you know Jack White and all these like bands that we really love and it's just so crazy how much we have in common so that was like the how he would connect it for people to be like you know what I'm I'm like a back door of life she's like front door like we meet somewhere yeah with tv shows and music yeah what were like dinners like between the two of you drinking all the time drinking drinking drinking and he condoned it if anything he pushed it on you I mean you said the first night he never told me no

31:12did you have to have sex with him like on his schedule

31:19I still have scars on me. Physical scarring.

31:28So, yeah.

31:47when did you start to realize this may not be what I want to do forever with this man

32:01I was way too young to be crying on the kitchen floor every freaking night with a bottle of wine and opening another one I felt like I didn't have at that point in time like 17 years old I didn't feel like I had anybody in my corner I felt like you know because I was being told to commit suicide at 16 I mean every moment I would turn around there'd be another hit piece you know in the grocery store somewhere else you know um people talking about how i'm dressing or behaving and little did they know then that that is a part of grooming i was trying to be that part right and um yeah that that part really did a doozy on my my self-worth really when did you realize he had a drinking problem?

33:00Gradually. Because when we, when he first was reaching out to me, you know, he was claiming that he was getting sober and he wanted to be sober and he was cleaning up his life and things like that. And I believed him. I didn't know anything really about it anyway I mean I know my dad drank a little bit but I wasn't really that close with him so it wasn't some like alarming thing but it became an issue probably two months into our relationship when I started noticing like Jacqueline Hyde okay you know like what was it like living as a child with an alcoholic adult in a house together which time with my dad or Doug I'm sure okay um there there are so many to count I mean it was almost every night I mean for years and were you scared in the house yeah there was a gun I mean I I yeah I mean you know did he ever when he was drunk take it out um i i i don't want to legally talk about that right now yeah was doug physically and verbally abusive he was extremely emotionally abusive to me at times physical but mostly emotionally and abusive because I think that that's the ultimate power a groomer has over a child is that emotional um abuse and control yeah were you always playing the part and then behind the scenes kind of trying to figure out at one point an escape plan?

35:03We separated a couple times, but every time we separated, I just felt like I couldn't live without him. I mean, I was raped a few times when I left him, and I go back to him, and he's just kind of like, well, what do you expect? You know, you left me. Like, you know, I'm the one who loves you. I'm the one who takes care of you. And so that's why it took so long. I know the media is always wondering like why did it take so long that's what was happening is this abuse this emotional abuse and I think too like so many victims and survivors blame ourselves we blame ourselves because we think it's our fault but the full picture is the the abuser is the one who is controlling that it's not your fault at all and I wish I could have told myself these things in those moments yeah oh this is a deep one girl you're doing amazing seriously I feel like I'm on Oprah right now you did bring up during the me too movement those sexual assaults can you explain what happened just more more adult men exploiting either a minor or a very young teenage girl at that point in time.

36:33When this happened to you because you explained you were on a break with Doug, like your initial reaction was to run back to him, which if people aren't educated, they'd be like, what the fuck, that makes so much sense. I got that a lot. When I chose to go back with him the first time, I mean, even some celebrity friends were like, what the fuck are you doing like why in the hell are you doing that and it's so hard to explain this to somebody who hasn't been through it now knowing like what are some tangible red flags to look for that indicate grooming i feel like you can google a sociopath and get the exact same definition charming intelligent um an empath someone who can disarm you disarm your family and that's the scary part it's like you don't how can you always you know spot that the public hate you were getting not only just from like random people like celebrities you got courtney love called you publicly a whore anderson cooper shamed you on national television and chrissy teigen took it to a new level she publicly wished you dead and at the time it seemed like no one gave a fuck no one saw anything wrong with it some of her tweets i hate you go to sleep forever what drugs make you do that with your mouth asking for vodka asking for a friend who really wants to know how to look like an idiot thanks to confirm have had you ever met chrissy tegan not have i only not met her but i've never spoken to her in my life like and I actually really liked her like I followed her I mean obviously I love John Legend like I love I just was like I was following them and then I started seeing this on my timeline and I was like but I love you I just had this feeling but I really like you but like other than that at that point in time because I was so young I don't think I processed how deeply that led to my future depression I mean you're literally getting publicly shamed but at that point in time as a kid I was just like I was just like oh she's she's sexualizing toddlers and tiaras like oh big deal because I was a kid right I mean she was shaming Lindsay Lohan she was struggling with a lot of you know her own stuff and I just I just freaking love Lindsay like you know I think Chrissy was in a really she had to have been in a really dark ass place to tell these child children and women you know these things to I don't know make herself feel better about herself I know now you know she's she's saying she's doing the best she can and I really hope that she means it.

40:01You know, if that stuff continues, we're just going to see more suicides, unfortunately. It's not going to help. Those were public tweets. Did she, she privately messaged you, right? She privately messaged me a lot. It was like, sometimes it was like really late, like two in the morning, like, you know, and I don't know what it was. It wasn't just like one or two tweets, you know, like Courtney Love, you know, she just called me a whore, big deal. Love you too. but Chrissy it was like it was over wasn't it over like two years of harassment it was a really long time what was she privately messaging you she privately messaged me I specifically remember this one because I was I was just like so shocked right um it was really early in the morning at some point this was a really I mean this was a freaking decade ago I know a lot of people can change in that time frame but I didn't hear from her when she apologized I was blocked from everything she messaged me um I cannot wait for you to die and that was just one of them that I remember and then publicly she was saying you know dirt nap or something you know I can't wait for you to take a dirt nap and she was just obsessed with seeing me die

41:19if you could say something to Chrissy Teigen right now like what would you say to her if you saw her I I really don't have anything to say to her I don't need to speak to Regina George it's not something I need I don't need that I'm Lindsay like I will push you in front of a bus no no I I think that's um very mature of you so you were on multiple reality shows how did you make the decision to enter reality television I didn't um my pedophile husband is the one who decided to sign me up for things because you know he needed the money people you know another misconception is people thought I was a gold digger.

42:15I married him for money. I'm the one who was taking care of him. That's why I entered reality TV because I felt like I had to. I mean, he controlled the bank account. I didn't even know how to write a check. So whenever I was sent into something, it felt almost like a conservatorship, right? In a way. But yeah, I was the one making the money and that's why I would do the shows. I mean, I would get so sick before the shows. I know on mother daughter I was so underweight I felt so anorexic before that I mean I went on the show I was throwing up right when I got there I was throwing up nothing I didn't have anything to eat in a few days I wasn't eating on set you know I I just I got to a point where I was so freaking sick and I was sent to the hospital on the show because of it because I just I was gonna faint like I was so sick but really Doug cared about me finishing it out and getting the money and then returning it to him so you would get the money and then he would take care of the finances do you think that the amount of hate you were getting even bonded you more with Doug because it's like absolutely we felt like Bonnie and Clyde I mean that's what he would tell me yeah You know, he was like, you know, we're Bonnie and Clyde, baby.

43:37That's it. That's it. It's you and I. And there were things that would bond us together, right? That only we would know. And abusive tactics that he would, you know, put into play throughout the 10 years of the marriage. Can you give an example? Was there anything he would say abusively? It got to a point where he would have to convince me just to do it. Like he would be pushing me, like literally, like pushing, like the conservator, you have to go collect this money. You know, you are the, what did he call me? Something all the time. He called me the golden goose. You're the golden goose. You got, you know, we're going to, you got to pay the rent, you know.

44:27that's that's that's what it is and then he would guilt trip me if I didn't want to do it or if I said I was too sick or I'm not mentally I can't you know I need a break you were on celebrity big brother when you were 18 this was the first time you were really apart from Doug yeah can you take us through what it was like moving into that house and what that experience was like when we got to London I remember being on a hotel room in the room I'm just I have this trauma right now that I'm just even thinking about this but he he was standing there Doug was standing there and I I was holding on to his legs and I was just crying my eyes out because I knew the producers were gonna come pick me up I couldn't this was the first time I was ever like truly away from him I couldn't breathe like being away from this man that's how groomed I was like I didn't know how the hell I was gonna get away from him and be away from him for a few weeks or a month a month or whatever and I was so distraught and I was so depressed but then by the time I got on the show and by the time I you know became friends with Dustin Diamond like he he was the one who was in there that kind of made me realize some things in my relationship with Doug um and by the time I ended the show I knew I I didn't want to be with him anymore I knew there was something not up right like that that that wasn't right and by the time we got back to the U.S., I told them I wanted a separation.

46:15And that's when I finally felt free enough to get away from him, strong enough to get away from him. I was assaulted. And then I went back. Yeah. That's a pretty big moment to realize what was helping you process that.

46:38space I mean really space um you know it it kind of felt like college for me or something like I went I went away to college and I and it just made me realize I don't I don't need him controlling me outside of this like I don't I don't need that but at that point in time it felt completely impossible to get away from. Your experience on Celebrity Big Brother was the first moment you started to see like what life would be like without Doug. Then a few years later you wind up on another reality show that focuses on your relationship with your mom, the mom and daughter experiment. When you went on the show what was the status of your relationship with your mother at that point?