Rachael Kirkconnell: I Was Blindsided

46:43from what we can see online when your relationship ended you were in Tokyo together what was the state of your relationship when you were going into that trip it was great I mean we were literally talking about engagement marriage all the things on that trip um we had been together since I think it was like January 3rd I met him in London okay so we were in London having a great time and then we went from London to Tokyo um just because we had the time and we had these like flight vouchers that were expiring um for like an international flight and Japan is like my favorite country in the entire world so we were like let's just do it while we can so it was very unplanned very last minute trip but it was fun exciting you know everything was great there was nothing wrong so okay so we're in Tokyo everything's going fine what happens?

47:47so it's just so hard to grasp because I still I don't even know if like he knew it was coming like or if he or if it was like he the moment i don't know so everything was fine the night before we didn't have an argument but i was feeling very overwhelmed i was like trying so hard to find like a good dinner spot for us because the spot we ended up wanting to go to was closed or something So we were scrambling and I was putting so much pressure on finding a good spot because he cares. Like this is like his career, you know, like going to good food spots. So he would do like a review if you guys got there of like food.

48:39Any anywhere we'd go if it was like literally every single meal that we would have, we were filming. so yeah I think I just put so much pressure on myself to find good spots if I'm the one that's finding a spot so on top of that I just started my period I felt terrible like just was having like a rough few hours I guess and I remember asking him to help me find a spot and he was like you know no like I think he was like doing something else on his phone and he was like it doesn't matter where we go like we can go literally anywhere just like pick somewhere I don't he kept saying like it's not a big deal it doesn't matter but I felt like it was a big deal and that it did matter so we get to this place it wasn't what I thought it was going to be and it was just one of those things where I'm like tired cranky emotional on my period feeling terrible overwhelmed with looking for a dinner spot for like an hour and then we get there and it was a disappointment so then I started tearing up at dinner two tears one two we're done didn't you know allow myself to get upset after that just tried to calm down we went home and did he say anything no didn't say anything but in the past if I have like a little meltdown like that or if I'm feeling overwhelmed or anything he just like lets me move through the motions get it all out of my system and then you know okay I'm ready to talk like something like that so dinner like did you guys have like normal conversation no we didn't even we didn't even talk like we just sat there had dinner got into the uber wait Rachel why did you feel so upset about like the menu not being good I felt like whenever we would go somewhere and it was bad that I it was just disappointing because I think like we're on trips it's like every meal counts like every dinner every everywhere we go it counts or it just it's important because you you know only have so many meals in the day and this sounds crazy but as like a food person I'm trying to just make sure that he's getting good content for our trip and stuff because I know like it's important to him and that it's something that we'll both post about so I'm just feeling bad I guess that it was a bad spot and then um are you feeling like you're disappointing him yeah I guess I guess yeah disappointing him or just yeah like I think he was just like what is the big deal so we finally get to the hotel and I give him a hug and he I could just tell like he was just like you know not very comforting and I'm like are you mad at me and he was like I'm just so confused like why you were so upset like what was that and I explained to him I'm like I felt like I had let you down like I felt like that was disappointing and I hate going to a place that isn't somewhere that like you could post about I feel like it's a waste and he just was trying to tell me like it's not that serious like it's not that big of a deal but then he was concerned about me getting so upset he was like that was like there was no reason for you to get upset like that and And he found it concerning that I got that emotional, I guess.

52:30And so then I was, and he just was trying to express to me, like, if you get emotional about little things like this, like, what is going to happen in life when something really terrible happens? Like, how are you going to be able to react to things that are actually really scary or disappointing or sad? and I think like I don't know I just hurt to hear because I'm like I probably would react to things that are terrible in a sad way like what do you mean I don't know I felt like I was being punished for crying I was just so weird I don't know still don't really know that whole situation I just was really confused by his reaction and in the past like how does Matt usually respond when you are upset?

53:15He'll let me, like, he'll give me my space. Do you want space? No, no, I don't. I, like, want to be comforted, but for some reason, Matt always thought that I'd need space, and then we'd talk about after, even though I would tell him, like, I don't want you to, like, give me my space, because then I feel like I'm not getting any support, you know, or, like, comfort from you. um but that was just something that he thought like he just needed me to calm down and then we would talk and everything would be okay so this happens and then is literally the next day the breakup yes so you wake up the next morning what are the vibes is he tense are you guys acting weird like take me through that whole day everything was fine like when we went to bed he was saying like it's okay it's okay so um I just let it go he let it go it was totally fine the next day okay and I think it was one of those things where I mean literally a few days before we're talking about how he feels lucky to have me as a partner and that you know there's just like so many qualities that he loves that I have and that you know we see relationships with other people where they deal with a lot and um or put up with a lot of things and he's like it's just so nice that you know I just feel like very lucky that I can call you my partner and that was so crazy to think like that was like two days before the breakup yeah and that morning everything was fine we were in good moods and I think it was one of those things where it was just a little maybe a little argument open up a can of worms so we were on the way to get some food and I was like scrolling through my phone showing him a bunch of videos I guess I was bothering him I was annoying him and he didn't snap at me, but he basically was like, okay, kind of snapped at me to where I got mad at him because I was like, you know, even if I'm annoying you, like don't treat me like that.

55:56And so then it seemed like we were both kind of like mad at each other or annoyed with each other. So when we got to this place, it was just this big market with a bunch of different food and everything. So we get there and I just walk off and go do my own thing for a second. I'm picking up like chopsticks and things for my friends. And he's going to find this like matcha spot that he was really excited to try. So we kind of just get there and split up for a little bit, which wasn't, you know, normal. Like usually we would be doing these things together. and how do you feel in that moment like are you do you have a pit in your stomach are you like something's off no I just was like I didn't think anything serious like too much of it I really didn't I just was annoyed with him that's all like I was annoyed with him and he was annoyed with me like it really didn't even seem like that big of a deal it was just one of those things where you're just like you know at that point we had been together non-stop for like three weeks And I think like you just get annoyed with each other about little things.

57:02And I think that's where we were. We were just like irritated with one another with little things. But I didn't think anything of it. It just it was what it was. And then we had some food. We got back in the car and I just was being really quiet. And he was like, you know, can I ask like why you're being so quiet? And I was like, I'm just, I feel like you're irritated with me right now. And I don't really like want to say anything if I don't have to say anything because I just don't want to bug you. Like, I just don't really want to chat right now. There's nothing I have to say because I just want to try and like give you your space because I feel like you're annoyed with me right now.

57:46And that is just like what opened up everything. and we had gotten into an argument right then and there like walking in the street we skipped lunch we went back to the hotel and just ended up having like a bigger conversation I think that's what I was saying like can of worms where it wasn't a big deal we were just a little irritated with one another but then it was like okay now that we're back here again where like you're annoyed with me I'm annoyed with you I feel like you're in the wrong you feel like I'm in the wrong um he really just kind of let out everything that I guess he had been feeling for a while I don't know can you share some of that yeah I mean he just

58:41he said that at the end of the day there were just qualities about me that he worries about having in a wife like at the end of the day like there are things that we aren't compatible with and like the whole accountability and saying sorry and all that was really the main thing and um yeah it was just one of those things where he I think just had this realization that I should want to propose to you by this time like at this point in our relationship I should be wanting those things and I should be ready for that but I'm not still I still don't feel like we're ready or I don't feel like I'm ready.

59:37I don't know if I ever see myself proposing to you. I can't actually see myself married to you.

59:50He said that, you know, maybe one day he would get there, but he doesn't feel ready now. And I told him, I said, well, I feel like after four years, you should know or you should feel ready. And if you don't, then that's not a good thing. We probably shouldn't be together if you don't feel like that after four years, because you know me better than anyone. I know you better than anyone. So you should know by now if you see this for the long haul or not and it was just one of those things where it was like do you want to make this work like do you think that it's me or is it something with you like are you scared or is it really me like is is your perfect person somewhere out there you know is it not me and yeah he came to the conclusion that he didn't think it was me and that he um he said like he just didn't want me to end up resenting him by like wasting more of my time if it wouldn't happen um and yeah he just said you know you're you're beautiful smart and funny and you'll find you'll find someone you'll find a guy that will love you for you but yeah he just didn't think that it was him but it was just really um it's just a lot to hear at once because a few days before you know i'm hearing the opposite it in that moment Rachel were you like vocalizing like anything in terms of like why have you why have you been so vocal like I've seen him on podcasts and he's commented in random like fan accounts being like engagements coming soon like he's been overly vocal more than you about like telling the world like oh it's coming like it's coming which like is a little odd I'm not gonna lie like in my opinion I was like like how much he was speaking about it and yet like now what you're sharing for him to just like quickly be like never mind like in that moment where you're like then why have you been saying this why did two days ago you say I was like the perfect partner with you I think because he I think it's because he did love me or does really love me and I think he wanted it to work out and like I think he wanted to picture it and it was one of those things where it was like well it would definitely be easy to like it just wouldn't make sense and that was like the next steps naturally in a relationship and he does love me to where I think he just wanted it to work but I I guess at the end of the day like as much as he wanted it to work and as much as he loves me he still just doesn't think that I'm like the person for him and so I think maybe he was just trying to see if he could get there or convince himself that it was the right thing.

1:03:26But yeah, I'm at the point now where I'm like, I still don't know. Like, I don't know if he reacted out of anger or spite or if he didn't mean it. And to be totally honest with you, if he didn't post it so publicly, like right after he broke up with me, I don't even know where we'd be right now. Because I think when someone tells you that to your face, like, I don't think you're my person, I don't ever picture us getting married, it's your time to walk away. like I can't stick around after that even if I want to even if it's hard for me to let go and like I love him so much and I wanted him to be my partner but yeah I think when someone says that to you it's like what else else can you do yeah you have to give it up at that point when you were hearing him say all this to you like what was going through your head um honestly I think like I was worried that he thought that for a little while like I guess in the back of my mind I always wondered if he had doubts or like yeah just had doubts about me being his his person and I only had those doubts because you know the actions like I said weren't following up with his words.

1:04:53So I'm like, I feel like I just want to be with someone who like is so excited to be with me and wants to, wants to marry me and is excited to, you know, start a life with me. And I feel like it was definitely one of those things with him where I could feel like he was nervous, but I just always told myself he was nervous because of like how he grew up and he didn't want to end up like his father or just didn't want to like end up in like a broken home and that he took it really really seriously which he would probably say the same thing that he just puts so much weight on it because he never wants to do his family what his dad did to them but I also told myself that

1:05:55I think like sometimes that put like a hindrance on our relationship and I always wondered like is it me or is it something that like we need to like work through together so at the end of this conversation is it like okay so we're breaking up it ended with him saying you know you're beautiful smart funny you'll find someone I'll never say a bad thing about you and yeah we're done and I literally said okay I said okay didn't say anything else I just said okay and then I got my suitcase went down to the lobby got in a car went to the airport did you have a ticket yes so I had to leave a day before okay um I was trying to make it home for a baby shower that I did not end up going to he did this right before he knew you were having to go to the airport to fly from Tokyo to Atlanta yes so that was yeah just I just like couldn't believe it um going to the airport I was like what the hell is happening you know yeah like were you in shock were you crying both just like your shock so much confusion um obviously sad because of everything he just said to me very very hurtful which here's the thing he's allowed to feel like that if that's really how he feels you're so allowed to feel like that i wouldn't want someone to propose to me and be married to me just because they felt like they have to even though they didn't feel like they wanted to so at the end of the day if that's really how he felt and he is so valid to feel like that and at least we figured that out before yes married or anything also doesn't take away from the fact rachel that like it seems like you were completely blindsided i mean yes i it was definitely out of nowhere i don't think he was planning on doing it i think that it was one of those things where he just came to this realization in our during our argument i don't know so we have to talk about his breakup post

1:08:35because without a doubt it is one of the weirder cryptic I mean people on the internet like this is this is going to go down in history is like one of the weirdest Instagram breakup posts I've ever seen can you talk to me about like where were you when you saw this post um so I had just gotten to the airport and you know check my bags everything got on the flight okay and I'm in my seat and for some reason Then my phone, I think it's because I downloaded a VPN on my phone a few years ago. And now, for whatever reason, it cannot connect to plain Wi-Fi. It just can't. I don't know why. So whenever I take these long flights, like, I'm off the grid.

1:09:26So we're literally getting ready to take off. And my phone blows up. It's one of my best friends. And it says, Rach, with a bunch of question marks. and as soon as I saw that I'm like oh my gosh how does she know and then she texted me again and said I saw Matt's post is this real life and that's how I found out that he posted so then literally the plane is taking off and I see his post and that's it I'm I don't have any service or anything for like the next 12 hours. So I'm freaking out because, you know, just got broken up with. And now a few hours later, it's like for the whole world to see.

1:10:14And I'm still like trying to process it. Like I'm still in like total shock. So then knowing like the whole world is seeing this I'm like this is so crazy I can't even wrap my mind around this right now and I think that's why you know I didn't say anything still haven't like made a statement or anything because I'm processing this just like everyone else is like I'm a week out of this you know so how what would you say like two hours after I would say like yeah two or three hours he posted that when you read the post what went through your mind like what did you think of the post um I don't know I honestly didn't think I guess I was so freaked out about the breakup itself and then just now knowing that I'm gonna have to navigate this very publicly um that's kind of all I was thinking I wasn't even like analyzing the post like everyone else was yeah so I guess it was kind of funny just to see what people had to say like people thought it was weird that It was a bachelor photo because we definitely like tried to remove ourselves from the show.

1:11:31Um, and yeah, it was interesting to see the caption only because I feel like there was no, I don't know how to explain it. I guess it almost seemed like saying it like a prayer was the easier way to say it than to say something real. Not that a prayer is not real, but just something authentic to our actual relationship.

1:12:10But it's very him. I guess it didn't surprise me that he said it like that. I guess I was just surprised that he said it at all that he posted that why do you think he posted that I would love to know I don't know I don't know if it was out of just him being so worked up it was out of anger or if it was one of those things where he felt like he needed to do it to really finally just put a nail in the coffin but I have spoken with him since all of that and I do know that he definitely acknowledges that that was not the right decision the right decision so we're gonna get to that because i'm just thinking one was there any part of you on this 12 hour plane ride one that wanted to be like sir can i borrow your phone like were you i would have been like like just to even see like were you worried about what people were saying or no you were just still like oh no i was worried it's definitely yeah it was one of those things where maybe this ties into my insecurities from the very beginning but I just felt like there was going to be people like celebrating and breaking up with me I don't know I don't know I definitely didn't think that or just like people just sad just like oh like so sorry for you guys like sad to hear this but like wishing you both the best moving forward I didn't expect it to be this like people getting mad about the posts like that i mean i'm not gonna lie like sitting here and listening to it i know there's like different steps basically to like grieving a breakup but i can't help but be mad for you because you guys have been together for four years you've traveled many times together that man knows that your phone doesn't work on wi-fi on long flights yeah no I mean it's like when I step back and really look at everything I'm mad like yes that's fucked up like he should not have done that to me after four years like he didn't even text me to give me a warning like saying like hey I'm posting this so it just hurt to know that like that's how my friends found out and my family and like my little sister and that I didn't even like get to talk to them about it or just like grieve privately for like a day you know so even like landing was just so scary just like the anxiety that came over me knowing I was like about to get service back and I didn't know what I was about to see and I just knew my phone was gonna be blown up from all my friends and my family and everything so that hurt what happened when you landed like did you get an uber home who did you go to first who did you talk to um i landed and i did have my car at the airport so i was driving home and at this point i think the post went up like 6 a.m u.s time or like new york time so i think i landed at like 6 p.m so it had been like all day my friends were waiting to hear from me i got in my car and i just like did a voice memo and just let them know what happened and um yeah i just went home and you know by the time i got home it was like eight or nine o 'clock so i just went straight to sleep because i was exhausted and when I'm depressed I just like completely shut down and I just sleep and I don't get out of bed so I did that did you text him like what the hell you didn't text him no no I just felt like the best thing at the time was just to not talk to him and because he didn't give me the decency to like give me a heads up or even just give me a few days like it's one thing to I don't even think you should post a breakup announcement the same day you break up no but let alone you know not even give me a warning that you're doing it um so yeah I just went home slept for like what felt like you know 48 hours and then finally woke up to my sister coming in my room she has a key to my house so she like let herself in and like woke me up and hung out with me for like the next few days and then I finally like told my friends I could see I could see them and hang out with them on Saturday was the first time I saw some of my friends just because I just needed just to be by myself for a bit and just not talk about it or think about it i just wasn't ready to like debrief and like i think when you talk about it it just feels more real so i just wasn't ready to like accept it i guess

1:17:41when breakups also happen i think one of the biggest mind fucks is like you're sitting there you're laying in your bed you're so upset and the one person that you like want yeah to talk to is the person that just hurt you yep who reached out first and like yeah that was so hard I completely agree with that where it's like I'm laying in bed and I want him to comfort me but I'm but he's the that hurt me and I'm so mad at him but I'm also still like so sad and of course like I still love him so yeah just a lot of emotions to work through and I woke up at like at one in the morning and I had a missed call from him this was I don't know like four five days after maybe in the post.

1:18:41And so I called him back because I just didn't know why he was calling me. I didn't know if he was giving me a heads up about something or if he needed something or if he was just calling to talk. I didn't know. So I called him back just to see what he wanted. And he just asked how I was doing, which I'm like, what do you think I'm doing? Like what? Right. And then, yeah, I confronted him about the post. I said, like, you know, that really sucked. And that's when he was like, yeah, I fully admit that I could have handled this a lot better. And he apologized. and you know sometimes people when they're in a really bad state or they're really really angry or really really upset you know you make mistakes or you don't handle things in the best way you can but I don't think that I just I don't want people thinking that like he's this bad guy or that he's like not I don't know considerate of my feelings or whatever because he is a good guy at the end of the day but obviously he made a mistake doing that but I think he knows that and I think he regrets it so yeah it's just hard because I'm like I would I probably wouldn't even be sitting here if you didn't do that yeah so it's just a lot to like process and work through well no and I also just want to say, like, this is why social media is so confusing, because on one hand, I agree.

1:20:24It's like we probably wouldn't be sitting here if he didn't post that. But also it's like. Knowing that you are going to at one point have to speak, and I think we kind of like we're talking about that before this of like, maybe it is nice to just like sit down and even though it's still so fresh, like, I think there's a chance you're going to look back on this interview in a year even six months and watch some of your responses and be like oh my gosh like I didn't see it then you know what I mean like everyone has that Rachel like I've literally done that in every relationship I've ever been in and so does everyone in the world like you are still in this like grieving period clearly and you're still even like understandably like the way that you're defending him I'm not saying it doesn't he doesn't warrant it it's actually just like when you're getting out of a relationship you're still kind of in the relationship yeah like that you were together for four years it's what been what two weeks one week yeah not even not even two weeks yeah not even two weeks so it's like I think a lot of this is on one hand there's the part of that me feels bad of like we're having this so fresh that like of course you're not gonna have like all the answers or the insight or whatever but I do think hopefully this conversation is going to like alleviate you from listen bachelor nation is amazing they're also very intense and i feel like every single thing you would type would get picked apart like there was no we talked about this there wasn't going to be like a perfect instagram post or caption or comment you could leave that would like leave people feeling like they have an understanding not that they deserve it but they feel like they do because of the way that your guys relationship started so publicly yeah so I think it's this like mixed bag of emotions yeah um when you were finishing like that call with him like where did you guys leave it like what did you say we left it like it's so weird I was about to say like I just wish we could somehow be friends because he was my best friend and it hurts to not have him as my best friend anymore but that's like how we left it like we were just talking like everything was okay you know I asked him like how his last day was in Tokyo and like you know he filled me in on like what he he did and then um yeah we were we were just talking like you know everything was fine and he ended up falling asleep because I called him back at like 1 a.m because both of our jet lag was so crazy at the time and yeah he ended up like falling asleep and I just hung up and that's that how long was the conversation it was like it was pretty long it was like over an hour at least did you guys talk about like are you gonna do no contact for a little bit or you no we didn't discuss that i don't even i think like that's something that we probably have to do um we haven't talked a lot like he's called me every like few days just to make sure i'm okay but i told him that he didn't need to do that the last time we spoke i was like you don't need to like call and check up on me like I'll be okay and so that was that was that um but yeah I don't know why he's I don't know if he's feeling bad or he just wants to see where I'm at I don't know in your head right now like if you're being really really honest with yourself do you think there's any chance you guys ever get back together I don't think I can which is sad um i don't think i can because i think when someone says those things that he said you know like i don't think you're my person i don't see us getting married i think that's when you like have to call it quits um and then yeah just the way that he handled all of this and his posts and everything like I forgive him but I just don't think I can be with someone that I felt like he disrespected me at the end of the day doing that so yeah it's just one of those things where you like have to stand up for yourself even if you don't want to like of course there's part of me that wishes that we could just get back together and pretend none of this ever happened but yeah that's not the case and I think as hard as it is I think the right decision is to just stand up for myself and be on my own I was gonna say like I'm so impressed by one just like how you're handling everything because I think I think a lot of people listening right now understandably are gonna like dissect what you've been saying and they're going to judge certain things you've said.

1:25:42They're going to try to analyze things you've said. I've even been trying to do it. I'm like, oh, I have an opinion on that and that. But then I'm also like, it's not my life. This is your life. And I also, again, recognize like this is so fresh for you. I do just have to say in the most painful way, and I don't think the way he did it was right. I do think you're going to look back and you are going to be so fucking grateful that he posted not how he did it not the way he did it but the fact that he did it and put it out there because I think we all can feel it when there's love and when there's history and when there's not something huge that happened of like cheating or whatever it's so hard not to go back yeah it is easier to go back than to stay away because it's your comfort it's the person that you love it's the person you've cried with it's the person that you've envisioned having kids with and a life with and a marriage with and a wedding with and all the best things that come with life you've pictured it with this person you've spoken about it with this person so the fact that you now have to be kind of just cut off from this i do think it will be a blessing for you rachel that like you will look back and be like i don't know anyone that maybe would have been as strong if if that post didn't go up to not go back you know what i mean because like you said you're like i don't know if he did it in the heat of the moment i couldn't really tell if we were really breaking up in that moment or if he was just angry like you do deserve someone that without a doubt wants to be with you and wants to start a life with you and wants to build a family and all the great things and you're right it doesn't make him a bad person but just from like another woman sitting across from you like why i said like it'll be interesting what you if you look back on this in six months it's like there are a lot of things you're saying that as a girl sitting across from you i'm like babe stand up you deserve so much fucking better and it doesn't mean he has to be then deemed a dick it's just like objectively you deserve so much better like you annoying him or he not like all these little things that I know we're only getting like basically one percent understandably you're not going to like share your whole relationship but like you deserve so much better and you should not have to feel like you're in doubt you should not have to feel like you are second to him and like there's a power imbalance like you shouldn't have to feel like that and I know I don't need to like preach to you but I just want you I can tell yeah it's hard right now no I mean yeah I completely agree with everything you're saying like I definitely have an attachment to him right now I mean how can you not when you spend you know every day with someone for four years straight and I do love him so much but yeah it's just one of those things where maybe in another universe we worked out and things were okay but it just really sucks to like step back and look at how things ended up for us it's just like heartbreaking um but yeah I just think I I do need to just stand up for myself and you know tell myself that what he did wasn't okay and that I just need to try and move on I also think like to everyone listening and even us having this conversation right now like I almost started crying when you were like, like those like children that we envisioned creating together, like no longer will exist.

1:29:15Like it's devastating. Like it's absolutely heartbreaking. But I also think when you get broken up with and you're forced to move forward, I think you're going to have a lot of beautiful reflection, not even on that relationship, but of yourself like even just like in the past almost two weeks like has there been anything that you looked at where four years is a long time like do you think there's any part of yourself that you compromised or you lost within that relationship because when you're in a partnership you do compromise yeah I'm sure um I think that's something that with time I'll start to realize but I think like when I have talked to my friends about it I think that they definitely said like it just seemed like you were always like giving 110 percent but it was difficult for him to like reciprocate it at times like it was like pulling teeth to try and get him to come to a wedding with me and just like little things like that and I love to think I'm this like you know like badass independent woman but I definitely would say that I like compromised my values at times because I felt like that was the right thing to do in the moment um it was definitely like you know he was like not the one in charge or anything but you know he definitely took lead and I just wanted to support him through everything whatever that was and I didn't mind you know letting him have the spotlight I guess if that makes sense that's more wording but I know I get what you're saying like just to back you up there like a lot of what you've shared with me today is like a lot of it's been on Matt's terms it's like if it's good for Matt then you're being a supportive partner but at what point is it like what does Rachel want and like why don't you get to call some of the shots and like what would make you happy and like why are you having to beg him to do certain things and then when he ever wants to do things you're like I'm ready to go like I think that's where I can feel it every woman in America watching this is going to be like Rachel I cannot wait and I know this is so premature to even be saying but like you've said it to your friends before we've all said it to our friends when they go through a breakup and because I've lived it and you're about to live it where it's like you're gonna feel the difference when you meet a guy that is all about you and has no doubts and it doesn't take away from what you and Matt had but like you are like he said you are so beautiful and smart and interesting and you're like a great person I can already tell we just met and I'm like you're great you're great Someone's going to be so lucky.

1:32:17And that is how you should feel in the relationship where it's like reciprocal, not you keeping like, wait, wait for me. Like, wait, what about that? Like, you deserve that. Everyone deserves that. Again, it doesn't make him a bad person, but maybe this is like the biggest blessing that needed to happen in order for you to finally find that partnership that is 50 50 where you do feel like you have a voice of value and you get to stand up for yourself in moments. to be like hey no I don't need to take accountability because why are we having this conversation because you made me upset over this so you know what I mean it's like little things that will come and I'm still working on it and I'm married you know what I mean so it's like it's tough though yeah why did you want to speak on this today I know I've spoken a bunch but like why did you want to speak on this today I feel like well when you reached out to me I I just really thought about it and I felt like it needed to have a longer conversation than just you know a little story or a caption or there it was just there was so much to it and a lot to break down and I wanted to do this for me I felt like I needed to do it to get some closure with everything and I did want to do it for you know anyone else who cared like you said like we did have a very public relationship and we did have a lot of people supporting us and I know at the end of the day like the only people who really matter in the relationship is you and the other person but I did just I saw all these rumors and the speculation and the theories and all this craziness and I just wanted to get the true story out there and just share my side of it in case anyone is going through anything similar or if they just feel lost, confused, blindsided, anything.

1:34:13And if anyone can take something away from this, then, you know, I'm glad I came. But yeah, I just really wanted to do it just to help myself move on and get some closure. And I just feel like after four years and after all this craziness, something just needed to be said. No, I really appreciate you being so open because I'm aware like if we had this interview even in like a year from now, I bet if I asked you these same exact questions, maybe 75 % of the answers could be really different. Yeah, which is the beautiful part of life and time of you just being like you're in it right now. You're in the grieving stage and slowly more things are going to become more apparent to you.

1:34:59And I really respect how thoughtful you're being about the way you speak about him. And I think daddy gang listening like once you go through a breakup now you get to just fully focus on yourself. And I know that I am excited for that. Yeah. And I know probably feels weird a little bit because you've been in a partnership where for four years it's been like me and him, me and him. But now I think in a fun way, it's like taking this and knowing all the things of how he didn't make you feel good or when moments where you felt like shit and then the good. yeah and basically know like what you want next in a partner I'm sure there's things that you're like oh I have to have that Matt had that one thing of whether he's funny or whether it's that and you're gonna look for that but then let's be real you got a list now of things that you're like I will not put up with that in my next relationship as you should yeah as you should um is there anything else just in terms of whether it was like rumors that you wanted to just like dispel that you've read that you're like wait that's so not true that you were like should we just put an end to it i'm trying to think like i've seen so much crazy stuff i try not to look but then when i realized we were doing this i was like okay i definitely just want to see like what is being discussed and i think the only thing that made me really sad reading was people saying that he cheated or that I insinuated that he cheated because he did not cheat I don't think he ever cheated I don't think that you know at the end of the day he's at least a good enough guy to be faithful like I never worried about that and so I just don't want people thinking that he was this like unfaithful guy that yeah you know broke my trust or cheated on me or anything but it's It's also kind of fun to tell myself that I can find myself again and get back to just loving me and finding my own confidence because I think it's been missing for four years.

1:36:56I'm not saying that's his fault, but there was probably a lot of stuff that I needed to work through from the show that I never have. So, yeah, I guess in a way I'm just excited to work on myself. I also will say just girl advice. Don't let him keep coming back in. I so know what you mean by you want to be friends because how can you envision a world not only not him being your friend, but like without him. I get that. No, I know. I'm going to cry because we've all been there. It's like it's unfathomable to be like Matt's not in my life anymore. But what I will say is like from experience, I feel like sometimes the person that ends the relationship has the guilt.

1:37:41like there's guilt that and he keeps calling you to check in and unfortunately it's going to be on you to have to be like one he's moving on right but he's also checking in on you yeah it's gonna prolong you being able to actually be like okay i have to cut ties and sometimes it does take no contact because it's like how can you have someone in your life that you did everything with you loved all of it and still be cordial while you're trying to move on I don't I don't think that it doesn't mean you can't in a couple years like see each other out or at a bar and so be cordial and yeah but I don't think in my opinion I don't think friends at least in the very beginning yeah is gonna allow you if we're being selfish for you for a minute to move on yeah you gotta no and that's why I told him I said you know you don't have to call me and check in on me like I'll be okay um because yeah I do agree I think that like even just hearing his voice on the phone it's just really hard you know and it makes me miss him but I promise you the best part and everyone that's gone through this you know what I'm talking about is like you're literally like no I literally can't live without him like how is my life gonna go on like he's my best friend he's my everything yeah and then when you do no contact all of a sudden whether you're like at the nail salon one day or you're walking down the street or you're at a friend's birthday party or having a wine night with your girls you're gonna like smile to yourself and you're like oh my god I haven't thought of him in like weeks I haven't thought of him or even if it's days you know what I mean like it's slow wins but then all of a sudden you move on so thank you so much for coming on you you are such a sweet person and i'm really really really sorry that this happened to you but like i said like girl girl girl we're getting back out there yeah it is only the beginning well thank you for having me appreciate it thank you so much

1:39:58For more information visit www.fema.gov