The Meltdown That Changed Me Forever (And 2 Phrases You Must Use To Teach Instead of Punish). #617

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1:49Get IXL now. Calm Parenting Podcast listeners get an exclusive 20 % off an IXL membership when you sign up today at IXL.com slash Kirk. Visit iExcel.com slash Kirk to get the most effective learning program at the best price. So you know those combustible situations with your intense kids when you don't know what to do? I have a killer phrase for you to use. In fact, I've got a whole script that I think will help with defiance, discipline, and meltdowns. And it was prompted by an email from a mom last night who asked six different questions. And I was trying to think all night, okay, how can I answer all these questions in one meaningful example?

2:34And I think I have it for you. And it happens to be the day that really changed me forever. So that is what we're going to discuss on today's episode of the Calm Parenting Podcast. Welcome. This is Kirk Martin, also host of the PDA Parent Podcast. You can find that and the last few days of our special Christmas in July sale. Casey and I wrestled with this one because we were trying to determine the price. And I was like, let's do the best price we have done this year because inflation, families are struggling and we want to help. So and if you need additional help, if you ever need a financial help or otherwise, we're just a family.

3:09We're not a company. So email Casey, C-A-S-E-Y at Celebrate Calm dot com. It's kind of surreal at times to realize the kid that I was reactive with in the following story is now a grown man helping families with kids just like him. Although we know we're really helping us as adults to change. So let's jump into this. I had a lot of triggers. My dad was career military. And one of my biggest triggers was when I would hear our son yell at my wife. So here's a common scene in the kitchen. Casey's getting upset. He's talking, kind of taking out his frustration or anxiety or disappointment on his mom.

3:49Why? Well, because at that point, he couldn't trust me, his father, to be able to handle his emotions. I mean, it's sad, but it's a smart calculation by a kid. Am I going to lose it on my dad, who's just going to overreact and take away all my privileges? so he would dump his frustration on my wife and that would frustrate and anger me even though I was the reason he was doing it. So let's look at how I mishandled it, what changed inside of me and then how I learned to handle these situations differently. And please forgive me, I didn't write out a script for this, just some notes because I like to record sometimes when the insights and feelings are fresh and raw.

4:36So I'd walk in the room and say, young man, you can't talk to your mother like that. How many times have I told you you can't yell at your mother? That's disrespectful. And I would begin to escalate the situation. But this wasn't really about him or my wife. It was about me. I was so consumed with how his actions were making me feel that I couldn't look outside of myself to see what was really happening inside my son. And I'm not saying it correctly, but it's almost like I turned the situation around. And so the adult here, me, it was more about like, oh my gosh, I can't believe how a child's actions are making me feel.

5:23It was very immature. And so I want to slow down here, which is unnatural for me because I like to try to fit in as much as possible. But think about that for a second. So often we make things about our kids and their behavior. But the real issue that this scene was being dictated, how my son's behavior made me feel. I was making this about me, not about helping Casey, not about helping a child, not about helping my wife. I was kind of standing up for myself because I was triggered, reactive, and just immature. And I know a lot of old school guys will justify this like I used to, right? Well, you can't be soft and let your child get away with things.

6:14True. Got it. But the truth is, when you yell and escalate, the child ultimately never learns anything. And the word discipline means to teach. The child only learns, oh, my reactive parent is untrustworthy. I was the one having the problem here, but that big grown-up over there, who should have figured life out by now since he's three decades older than me, apparently never grew up and can't help me. He's just going to get frustrated and send me away from him, which is, I guess, better than getting the belt or getting hit, but it's not helpful, right? Because that's what I got as a kid, but I still needed to grow up further.

7:03And so the child gets away with things because when you react as the parent, you never address the root of the issue. And I'll add one more thing for perspective. We act like there's one approach to discipline or talking to kids. But think about this. In the business world, the real world, we talk to different people in different ways daily. We take different approaches with different employees. Some need to be taught, spoken to very directly and bluntly. And some, you've got to put your arm around their shoulder and walk down the hallway and build them up a little bit. With customers, you listen and read their body language.

7:41You just don't cut your customer off as they're expressing their objectives, get frustrated and yell, you just need to buy my stuff. So in the real world, we read the person and the moment. But sometimes when it's our kids, we just want to yell at them or react and have them obey. And then we feel justified doing this because they irritate us. But that's not even true because we choose to be triggered and react. They can't make us do anything. So I would begin to escalate and kind of lay into Casey for some very personal things. You know what? You never pick up anything around here. You don't listen.

8:16How are you going to be successful? You know, all those kind of things that we throw out when we're frustrated. And what I realized later is that I was resentful toward Casey because I felt like he did make life more difficult than it needed to be, especially after all the sacrifices we made for him. But that's not real love. That's manipulation. So I would use an opportunity when he messed up, like yelling at his mom, to release those resentments. That's obviously horrible, so be aware of that. Now, I could see his face was all red and something was going on, but I didn't know what to do. As he'd run up the stairs, I'd just keep piling on.

9:02And then Casey would go to his room, slam his door. That was another trigger of mine, right? Like, you don't have to respect me, but you're going to respect my door. I work hard to pay for that door. So looking back, I'm embarrassed by this. I'm ashamed. I was so immature and selfish. And I know this may sound strange, but I had really good intentions back then. I spent a lot have time with Casey. We'd go do fun things together. It's just that it usually devolved into me being critical and yelling because that's what my dad did to me. Not an excuse, but I was engaged and I was wanting to be a good dad.

9:38I just felt helpless. I didn't know what else to do. So then I come walking back downstairs thinking, oh, I just stood up for my wife because that's what I'm supposed to do. And you know what my wife was thinking? No, no, you didn't. You just ruined the whole evening because now I have to go upstairs and spend two hours consoling our son and letting him know, hey, your father loves you. He just has some unresolved issues from childhood. Now, she didn't say that, but that's what she was thinking. See, it wasn't fair that I was making my son deal with my own issues that I never worked through from childhood.

10:18And that was selfish. And again, there's no blame or guilt for any of you, any of us. We didn't know what to do, and we often feel helpless. And I, the truth is, I had just made a mess. Oftentimes, we as men put our wives in these situations, and it works both ways, where they have to clean up the mess, or then we bark out consequences we can't even keep. And then your kids and spouse will lose respect for you. and that's one thing that's really important to men because they know you're just full of bluster and you can't control yourself. So I began working on myself and I developed a different game plan that I began practicing and that's if you ever go through our 30 Days to Calm program, this is where it all comes from.

11:06It was a game plan I put together and what I tried to do for you is to prevent you from having to go through like two years of therapy and spend thousands of dollars and I put it through in this program. And so here's the thing. I knew I needed to deescalate before disciplining. Otherwise, it's just pouring fuel on the fire. So I'd focus on controlling myself first. And that's why sitting, using a matter of fact tone is so powerful. Many people were taught to discipline right away, but does good discipline and problem solving ever work when everyone is upset and frustrated? No. So quick real life example.

11:45Let's say at work that you heard that a potential client you pitched chose your competitor. Do you want your boss coming into your office at Cubicle right then, thrilling you with questions? Why don't you anticipate their objections better? If you would have been more prepared, you wouldn't have lost that sale. No, you need time to process your disappointment. And you're probably going to beat yourself up anyway over losing the sale. Well, guess what? Our kids are doing the same thing in the moment when they mess up. In that moment, Casey was thinking, why do I do these stupid things like yell at my mom and get in trouble?

12:20Why can't I even calm myself down? See, that's the exact moment I used to pounce on him and then wonder why we didn't have a good conversation. That's like your boss pouncing on you after every mistake. Instead, you want your boss patiently walking alongside to teach you. Hey, I've been in this industry a long time. I know the ropes a little bit. Let me show you how to do it differently next time. See, you'd work hard for that kind of leader. And that's what your kids are looking for. A parent they can trust who comes alongside and shows them a different way. One of the best ways to de-escalate and calm your kids is with movement.

13:02You've heard me say motion changes emotion. So I began coming into the kitchen and saying to Casey, Hey, until you're frustrated, hey, when you're ready, meet me outside and we'll play catch. I'm going to go to the basement to play guitar. Join me when you're ready. We'll learn that Zeppelin song. I'm going to go dump some Legos on the floor in the living room. When you're ready, let's build a cool spaceship. See, sometimes you can't do that. It might be, hey, I could really use your help. Could you get a jar of spaghetti sauce from the pantry and twist that top off for me? You're getting some movement.

13:32You're getting out of the same physical, mental, and emotional space where you are all upset. You are leading your child and inviting them to come do a specific activity, not talk about their attitude. And you're inviting them to be with you rather than sending them to their room. You are giving them something they feel in control of and are good at. And you're together, not separated by anger or distance. You aren't there to punish them. Instead, you want to help them make a different decision next time so they feel competent. just sending a child to his or her room means you're sending your child away from you.

14:11I want to draw my child to me so I can teach and impart wisdom to actually show them what to do with their frustration, anxiety, and disappointment. And if you're just going to ask, hey, why did you do that? They'll become defensive, internalize anger, think they're stupid, and lie to get out of your punishment. So I want to teach and problem solve. And there's a phrase I began using that is incredibly powerful, and it works like 99 % of the time. Okay, I'm a little embarrassed to admit this, but I bet you've fallen into this trap. We've had the same knives for decades and they aren't sharp. So every single day when I'm cutting up a salad, pineapple or chicken, it's frustrating.

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16:24Go to HungryRoot.com and use code CALM. That's HungryRoot.com slash calm, code calm, to get 40 % off your first box and a free item of your choice for life. You're going to love Hungry Root. I love the phrase, hey, when you're ready, because it gives your child some ownership and autonomy rather than pressure. Because you know if you demand anything from a strong-willed child, they will resist. when you're ready releases your child to do the right thing without you standing over them. This is especially important with kids with PDA. I've been through this in greater detail on the PDA Parent Podcast.

17:05Check that out at CelebrateCalm.com. It's really helpful. I noticed Casey would respond so much better to this little phrase, and it helped me release control and put it in his court. See, it allows your child to have a little control in the exact moment when they feel out of control. And this was a big discovery for me, that most of our meltdowns happen when we sense a loss of control. That's why when I am upset, I like to organize a closet or drawer, stack firewood. There's a sense of symmetry there. It's very physical. I do some work in an Excel spreadsheet because every number has a place and it adds up perfectly.

17:43cooking, right? Mixing ingredients and moving from disorder to something complete and tangible. So one of my first steps isn't to try to calm the child down. It's to give them something they feel in control of. And that's why building with Legos is so comforting. It's tangible. They can manipulate them with their hands. They're in control of what they're creating. I've used that example of like, oh man, I just remembered we're going to go fishing this weekend. Could you organize the fishing lures so we don't forget them Saturday morning. I have a nephew who loves organizing his matchbox cars and lining them up when he's feeling out of order.

18:20So look, now rather than needing my child to calm down or do what I asked, with the child being in control and me being the reactive one, I am now leading my child to a calm place where they feel competent and in control of themselves. Before I was so flustered, I was caught up in my own anxiety and helplessness. I missed all the signals. And I remember that moment when it hit me on those steps in that townhome. I was essentially saying this to my son. I need you to behave in this moment so that I can behave. I need you to do exactly what I tell you to do. Because if you don't do that, I'm going to lose it and you do not want to see me angry.

19:06See, I was the needy one. I was asking a child to manage my emotions for me. I was asking my wife to control my emotions for me, for them to walk on eggshells because I couldn't control my own emotions. And that is devastating to your spouse and kids, and ultimately to yourself. So when I began focusing all my energy on controlling my own emotions, watch the shift that happened. Now what I could communicate to my son was, hey, when your world is out of control, mine's not. I can handle any situation that you go through, and I can actually help you. See, that's when Casey began trusting me and coming to me for help, because he knew that he could trust me.

19:53And that's what you're really after. It will help immensely through the teen years when their world is nothing but drama and you can be that anchor, that one no drama person in their life that they can count on. And I can tell you, he's in his early 30s now. It is still incredibly helpful. So back to our scene. I've said, hey, when you're ready, let's build or create something, color, play catch, go get some tacos or a smoothie, whatever it is. I have invited my child to come be with me when he is ready. Sometimes I would just say, hey, I'm going to go to the garage to organize a few things. And it was a more subtle invitation.

20:31And oftentimes, after a while, he would kind of slink into the garage and there was this awkwardness there at first, like, who's going to speak first? He just yelled at his mother and was expecting some deep, serious talk or admonition from me. Instead, I wouldn't really look up. I'd just say, hey, could you help me move this? And we'd ease into it. And then I'd begin talking. but there wasn't eye contact at first right that's why i like riding in the car sitting on the floor building with legos there's no eye contact but we were together and that together part is a huge key i've mentioned right we'll say like go to your room and there's nothing really wrong with that but over time it begins to send this message when you do something i don't like i can't handle it and send you away from me.

21:21And it kind of communicates, I only want to be with you when you're behaving the right way. Many of us were treated that way as kids and it's caused problems in our relationships with abandonment, with not being able to handle conflict. So you just avoid it. It can warp your view of God. I always thought God was mad at me because my dad was always mad at me. And that can really mess up your life in tangible ways. So I want to draw kids to, I want them to be drawn to you. Now, some of you will have this question. Hey, I was kind of left on my own as a kid and felt abandoned. I feel like I need to be right there for my child so they feel loved and cared for.

22:02But my child often gets mad at me when I do that. So isn't going to the garage going to make your child feel like you don't care? That's an awesome question. So I'll let a kid answer this and then I'll add my own two cents. A mom emailed, I let my strong-willed son listen to some of the downloads this summer while building with Legos. He called me into the room and said, listen to this. This is what it feels like when you talk when I'm upset. It makes me angry. I just need some space, please. Now, I love when families use the programs or the podcasts as a bridge to help understand each other and have good conversations.

22:42So when I would go to the garage or car or outside, there was always an invitation. But there was also space. Because sometimes kids need space. Sometimes we as adults and spouses need some space to process before engaging. But when you get down and look kids in the eyes and start asking about their feelings, sometimes it's overbearing. It's too much. in some ways I feel like it's disrespectful in that moment it's more about hey I really need to deal with this right now and the child's like no I need a few moments and that's why we always say parenting isn't really about kids it's about us as parents now these moments are a beautiful but often terrifying gift to you because now you're unwinding your childhood pain and learning to heal it through raising this child and doing it differently now than your parents did it.

23:43So look, now we're together and we're both calm and in a more rational state. Now I can discipline, which means to teach, not punish. Here are two phrases I love. I'd say, hey, Case, I know that you know yelling at your mom, hitting your sister, stealing, lying, whatever it is, is wrong. So I'm curious. What was going on that led you to get frustrated with your mother or hit your sister or steal her lie? See, that phrase, hey, I know you know that's wrong. It's way better than what were you thinking? How many times have I told you? Those phrases basically mean you're an idiot and you're in a lot of trouble.

24:24There's no way to answer them because your kids don't always know why they messed up, but they do know that they messed up. So, hey, I know you know that's wrong. That's very settling and takes away the defensive posture. Now, I love I'm curious. Hey, I'm curious. That tone means I'm coming alongside of you to help you. I'm not standing over here against you to punish or shame you. I'm coming alongside you to give you wisdom and tools to handle this differently next time because I know it doesn't feel good to yell at your mother, lie, or steal. So there's no denying that he did something wrong, but the focus is on restoring the relationship and problem solving so it doesn't happen again.

25:15So I remember one time Casey opened up and said, Dad, school's so hard for me and sometimes I feel stupid after being there all day and I'm tired when I get home. And then when I get home, mom just asks how my day was and wants to look at the homework folder. And I just lose it. And I remember blurting out good. And what I meant was it's so good and helpful to recognize your triggers. And when you're overwhelmed, I love the self-awareness because then you can be assertive and honest and speak up for yourself and your needs. So you say, well, that makes perfect sense to me. I probably feel the same way, kind of like I do after work.

25:56So you validate with some intensity so they know you understand and have heard them. Now that we understand the root of the issue, not that he was being some mouthy, defiant jerk who yells at his mother, well, now we can problem solve. So in this case, I just asked, so what do you think you should tell mom when you go inside? There was no snotty tone or threat or shame or lecture, just talking to him more like an adult with some respect. And he said, well, I need to apologize and then maybe just tell her how I feel after school. And I was like, yeah, that's perfect. And then maybe we can come up with a code word or use a certain color when you get home.

26:41So you can say whether you're on green, it was a good day, yellow or red. Like, I don't want to talk about school. I just need some downtime. And then we can develop a new afternoon routine that meets your needs. So when we went back inside, I remember my wife saying, I'm sorry, I didn't realize asking how your day was felt like more pressure to you. I just wanted to communicate that I care about you and your day. And Casey replied, Mom, everyone knows you care. You do everything for me. So you don't have to ask or try. And it's really interesting. When I just said that, I kind of felt that little crying thing come in, right?

27:21Like that's a very deep, powerful moment. Like, I know you care. You do everything for me. Because moms often are like, why really? Moms, you try too hard. Your kids know that you love them more than you can possibly. And they know that. And it was a really beautiful moment. And you can hear that. Like in Casey, when I just said that, you can hear that sweetness, That depth of heart that is inside your kids, you've seen it, but sometimes they're too busy masking or feeling defensive or misunderstood to let that out. So watch what happens here. What began as a shouting match with the entire family in conflict ended in problem solving.

28:07We actually practiced a new afternoon routine. That afternoon, we didn't have a defiant mouthy kid. We actually had an overwhelmed kid who didn't know how to speak up for himself. And you'll love this. At dinner, Casey says, hey, Dad, maybe we can practice a new routine for you when you come home from work all stressed and get upset. And at first, I was like indignant, typical guy thing like, I don't come home like that. But then we worked on that. And it's like these kids are like, it's like a dagger to the heart. They see through all your pretensions and lies. Because our kids are sharp like that.