Immersive Joy: Yinka Ilori & Kelsey Lu

0:03Only connect, urged the novelist Anne Foster. He wrote this more than a century ago. Today, those words resonate more powerfully than ever. Artists and creatives collaborating across disciplines, geographies, and perceptions are truly leading the way. So join us. Let's connect.

0:27Welcome to the third season of Chanel Connects. I'm Yana Peele, Global Head of Arts and Culture at Chanel. In this series, we bring together global changemakers from the worlds of food, film, art, architecture and beyond. Some are old friends and collaborators. Others are meeting for the first time. All are focused on what matters most and what happens next. And now we get to listen in.

1:08In this episode, we bring together two artists who challenge us to think in new ways. Kelsey Liu is a classically trained musician whose work is defined by otherworldly electroclassical sound and by collaborations with artists including Solange and Blood Orange. Yinka Elori is known for creating bold, colorful designs informed by his British-Nigerian heritage, often focused on accessibility and inclusion. They begin their conversation by exploring how joy feeds their creativity.

1:50Hello. Here we are. I feel like there's so many different worlds of joy, right? There's so many different ways to express joy. I'd say traveling is a big part of it. With the sort of questioning and exploration of home and the idea of that, I think that for me has come a lot from my leaving home when I was young and sort of going after my dream of not knowing exactly what that was, but going towards the arrow of something. And since then, it's led me to so many places all over the world. One of my practices that I love to do with traveling is collecting sounds. I mean, that's like just walking through the streets or...

2:43Parks are usually my favorite because you get a collection of nature sounds of the birds but also the nature sounds of the people and different languages and but I did this one I traveled to Alaska okay one time and I've been to a glacier okay and I brought these waterproof contact microphones and I slipped them in the cracks of the glacier and I recorded the sounds of the water rushing through the iceberg and then I used that as a sort of foundation for a song but nobody would know that but for me it's like the textures of life and that brings me a lot of joy. That's incredible what you said about sort of collecting sounds also sort of like makes me sort of think of a project I did a couple of years ago when I sort of first started you know creating objects.

3:40I was sort of going around London and collecting chairs from like the skips and the side streets and I was obsessed with the stories of these objects like these chairs so I ended up collecting like 100 chairs over like 10 years that I designed so that had been acquired by different museums but I was obsessed with kind of finding these chairs that were unloved in these dark and lonely spaces and sort of see these objects as people these chairs because they have stories so I would take these chairs into my studio and sort of give it a new sense of life a new narrative that's all personal to me so it was just like ongoing narrative and layers of stories in this one object and it was quite personal because no one really knew what this what these chairs were about only me in the chair had this kind of personal story this kind of connection which I thought was quite special and powerful so this idea of kind of you know of collecting sounds or objects or stories of yeah I definitely can connect and relate to that when When you're kind of collecting these sounds, what are you looking for?

4:36What are you trying to create from it? What are you trying to, what emotion are you trying to evoke from it? I think it's just adding a layer of life into it, spontaneity. There are certain things and moments that happen in life when you're just pressing your chord that you just can't duplicate or replicate anywhere. where you can look for a sample of a sound on YouTube or on, you know, the databases. But there's something about collecting it myself and just everyday life that makes me feel connected to it in a way that brings life into it. Like what you were saying with like your chair and your relationship with it.

5:16Yeah. And nobody may know that, but there's something that people feel towards it. And I think there's like a magic within that. and collecting sounds, it started when I was traveling, when I first started touring, going across the country for the first time ever, doing what I love to do, and it was a dream come true. But then I would also, like, wake up. I was usually the first person at the van, and I would be pretty hungover, and I would be, like, laying in the grass, waiting for everyone gonna come down yeah and I would just hear all the birds in the trees and and I would be like uh how can I capture like this place that I've never been yeah that isn't in so much of like going to a gift shop or like collecting all this stuff or like I didn't have money even to collect things like that anyways at the time so I was like sound I can bring with me sound and I can go back to the sound of that bird that was really annoying me, but also bringing me so much joy and comfort.

6:24And it's been quite freeing about accessing sound or listening to sound, you know, birds, the trees, you know, the wind blowing, you know, the raindrops and those kind of things that I find very kind of like soothing and very kind of therapeutic for me. You know, I sort of, my work is very much about colour and storytelling. It's very loud. It's in your face, very unapologetic. But I'm sort of going through a phase now where I'm trying to experience or, you know, express myself internally. so trying to celebrate joy personally just within myself and it being loud so I'm not wearing red or pink orange it's kind of an internal feeling um I think as a British Nigerian in London Nigerians we wear very colorful loud very expressive you know very we're in your face I think over the years as my work has developed I've tried to to sort of you know internalize that joy just for me and also just for the user so I did a project in London called the beacon of dreams where it was inspired by my visit to Margate.

7:17As a young kid, my parents are so religious. We went to a Pentecostal church in East London and we would wear a white garment and go to the seaside called Margate. And I remember as a kid picking up a seashell and putting that to my ear and hearing that sea sound, that shh. And just for a few minutes, just sort of being there for like five seconds and sort of listening to that sound and making me feel really relaxed and calm. But as I've got older, I think I've been so busy with life and I don't really sort of reflect enough on my winnings or my losses or my experiences. Everything's just so fast-paced.

7:49So I'm finding myself now really kind of reconnecting with nature, birds, you know, the trees sort of withering, raindrops, just talking to people, listening, like hearing my thoughts, reading, making notes. And I just find myself kind of more in touch with myself, you know. So that's been quite a new chapter in my work is nature. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting that it's your memory of joy. Of joy. It's joyful, yeah. But also it's like as kids, you know, children have a purity, a purity of self and awareness and of life and everything around you. And now being an adult, but also in your work, like you expressing joy, bringing joy to other people's lives, expanding the imagination for children, and for adults, but like for everyone, how do you see that affecting your work or affecting it at all?

8:48It has affected it, yeah, in a really sort of positive way. I think, you know, my work is always around kind of communities and, you know, making architecture, design, you know, that creates a space accessible for a lot of people. But I think I just love talking to people, I love meeting people, I love hearing people's stories and just trying to create these kind of safe spaces where we can dream. you know I think for me like dreaming is is is free and I think for me I always try to you know dream up my own reality and make it possible with myself or my team so I think yeah it's definitely going to take a change into how I think or how I process things how it's executed where it might be a pavilion or a graphic design project or a set design project for a musician but yeah it will definitely change the way I you know see the world of how people might see me I think people are so used to my work being colorful and loud and joy being expressed externally but I think my community will be surprised as we'll see like he's designing a white pavilion where is the color yeah I didn't expect that but yeah but I think also like this idea that you know black and white are not colors or they can't give you joy but they are such powerful there's different chairs of white, the chairs of black.

10:02And they can give you joy. And I think that's what I want to express a lot more, is that you can find joy in anything, you know? Yeah, absolutely. I started this series over lockdown called Hydra Harmonia. It was my way of coping through everything that was happening and providing a sense of relief from that. And every day was my ritual of watching the sun rise and set and documenting it. And it was like a way of me to express in the moment instinctually how I was feeling. So the music that I made went along with the imagery that I captured. And I just sort of sat and played whatever came out.

10:53And then I built off of that. so it was a real sense of trusting and releasing and letting go. How comfortable are you putting your personal self in your work and letting the world take it in? Because that's what I've always found quite hard is really kind of pouring my soul and my emotions into an object and the world gets to see it. What's that like for you? I'm really inspired by vulnerability. Okay, wow. Sometimes I feel like I tricked myself, like I didn't know that I was being so vulnerable. I didn't know that I was putting my whole life out there. I was just doing it. I was just doing what drove me.

11:32And it happened to be me spilling my guts out for the world to see and hear and listen to and read. And my album Blood is extremely personal. You know, it's about my relationship with my parents and their relationship with one another and my departure of them and I and bringing back together. And it's an extremely personal body of work, you know? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I could definitely relate to that. Yeah, I mean, you know, like, I grew up in an Nigerian household that was very religious, strict, strong cultural values, which in a way has sort of shaped me and sort of the man I am today in a number of ways.

12:19But I think I've always sort of found this kind of confusion, this sort of sense of, like, belonging. Where do I belong? I'm sort of Nigerian, more so British, born in London, had this really rich heritage. You know, who am I? I've got a Nigerian name. I eat Nigerian food. But I always eat bangers and mash and fish and chips. I'm like, it's confusing, you know? I think as a kid going back to Nigeria for the first time, when I was like 11 or 12 for the first time, was just like mind blowing, like kind of seeing the culture, the heritage, the people, the language, the smells, the sun, you know, just that kind of rich energy.

12:54And I did a project in Dulwich called the Colour Palace a couple of years ago, which was one of my biggest commission, commission that kind of, I don't know, put me on the map or give me sort of, I don't know, worldwide recognition. It was inspired by my visit to Lagos. It was this market called the Balonga Market. And they sell like fabrics from like jacquard weave to Swiss foil lace, like really expensive market where you can kind of get your clothes if you're getting married or going to church. And I went there with my mum and dad. I was inspired by the colours, the energy of the people in that market.

13:27So I wanted to sort of bring this market to London, a place called Dulwich, which is this kind of middle class posh area next to Peckham, which is called the Mini Lagos. It's very close, but they live like two different worlds. So I created this pavilion in Dulwich, which was called the Kala Palace, which was paying respects and homage to this market in Nigeria. And what you get is this kind of box, which is this kind of timber slats, and it kind of changes colour as you walk around it, which is kind of trying to sort of mimic the energy of the market um you know in nigeria so for me that project for me really symbolized i don't know maybe sort of be proud of my culture and sort of give people in that particular area sense of my identity sense of kind of who we are and what i represent but also what was really funny was that you know there was a someone who lived in the area had emailed the gallery and they said we think that this pavilion will be better off in the lake was shantytown but it would feel it's starving millions and they said that they don't believe it belongs here so this idea of ownership of space this this is my space this doesn't belong here i like to disrupt those types of spaces and people and say hey this is for everyone and i think culture and i think you know architecture and design i think does make people feel uncomfortable but that's what i'm here to do i'm here to tell stories i need to shake that space i mean it's also kind of you know change the narrative of what people think is theirs or is ours you know so I can connect with you on that.

14:51Yes, yes, yes. Let's talk about it. Let's talk about disrupting spaces. And, yeah, reclaiming them, reclaiming the ideas of what things have been prescribed to be and for whom they're supposed to be for. And, you know, growing up playing classical music, I was usually like one of one or two black persons in the orchestra. and I loved it. I love classical music and it's always like a sort of struggle between the two because of like loving it but then also seeing the disparities within it so wanting to disrupt it. It is at the core of a lot of how I write has been a beautiful foundation for me to build off of And my journey of really finding my way through music and through sound has been with the mission of welcoming everyone who didn't feel like they belonged in that space.

16:04I wrote an opera last year. Wow. And it's something that I'd like dreamt of doing for so long. And then I was finally given the opportunity. It was amazing because I always thought opera is just this thing that I just don't understand. It's oftentimes in a whole other language. And it's not really accessible for everyone. And so wanting to disrupt the idea of what even an opera could be. and to welcome anyone into expanding the idea of, you want to call this an opera? Call it an opera. This is your opera. That's right. This is your building. This is your space. This is your mind. This is your work.

16:50Create how you want to, you know. So I feel you on that. That's beautiful, yeah, because for me what I love about this is that there is no kind of right or wrong way of kind of telling a story or expressing yourself, you know. And I think as a young kid, I always felt I couldn't go into a gallery or a museum or all these spaces that I felt was quite elitist or I was afraid I didn't belong there. And I think what I want to try and do with these works is try to say, hey, you do belong in these spaces. You can tell a story. You can have an opinion on this Van Gogh piece or whatever piece it is. How do you subvert your practice?

17:29So with what I do, I work with lots of communities and young children, in, you know, like, canted estates or public spaces. So we did a project in Battersea called Happy Street, like, three years ago, where we redesigned this underpass that was really sort of dark and unloved. And we worked with local kids in the schools and parents to redesign this underpass that became a lot more safer. It also gave them a sort of sense of belonging. It made that place become a destination to go and visit because of the underpass. So I think for me, like letting people have a voice or a say in whatever we make, I think is really key because they're the ones who breathe and live the space.

18:05They are the fabric of those spaces and those ideas get passed on from generation to generation. So I think for me, yeah, it's kind of working with young people or families to give them a sense of belonging or a say in what they want to visualise or see in their reality. than the council saying to them, hey, this is a sculpture and there's no connection to people who live in those spaces. And what you see a lot of in London is that these developers or curators will just plunk a sculpture in a public space with no link to people who live there, what's their cultural background, what's their age, what they need.

18:40And I think for me, I want to disrupt those spaces and say, hey, let's speak to the people who live in these spaces, but also give them a voice to have a say in what they see around them. Yeah, absolutely. Jinka, what's your dream project? I think for me, you know, like my dream project would be to have a Jinka Ilori Sculpture Park that can sort of travel around the world. So any open spaces, fields, it will be a mixture of like slides and swings and this kind of like magical space where you can just dream and just create joy with your loved ones. So yeah, it'd be a sculpture park. So if anyone's out there and they've got a park for me, I have ideas for a sculpture park.

19:21Beautiful. What would be your dream project? My dream project, I would really love to make a children's book. Oh, wow. Filled with language, with colour, with visuals, but also sound. So it's interactive. So they're able to create sound with the visuals that they're being given. For me as a kid, textiles, being able to feel stuff was so connective for me. I kind of feel like we're going to collaborate, you know? You know, I think so too. Because you keep talking about sound. I know. I'm really sort of experimenting with sound at the moment. Yeah. I'm not just saying it, but I actually believe we're going to collaborate on time.

20:05I know. Are we going to connect? We're going to connect. Perfect.

20:19This was Chanel Connect Season 3. It's been great having you with us. Don't forget to follow the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Revisit conversations from the first two seasons with guests including Tilda Swinton, Kehinde Wiley, G-Dragon, Keira Knightley, and Grimes.

20:46Thank you.