S8, E13: Matt Goss, musician

0:00This is The Guardian.

0:08Before we start, a quick warning. Suicide is mentioned in this episode and there's a bit of spicy language too. I'm Grace Dent and this is Comfort Eating from The Guardian. A podcast where we pay homage to the lesser celebrated foods in life. because even as a restaurant critic I believe the food that matters most is often that snack you cobble together when you're curled up on the sofa. Each week I ask my guests to lift the lid on what comfort foods have seen them through their lives because you can tell a lot about a person from what they eat behind closed doors.

0:59Hello friends. Now you find me putting finishing touches on my Christmas decorations. There we go. Christmas is not a time or a place. It's a state of mind. Also said some old American president. And my state of mind right now feels like someone has stuffed my head full of silver a tinsel because on his way here is Matt Goss, an award-winning musician, a third of one of the biggest boy bands of the 20th century and as amazing as all that he is a record holder as the longest British residency in Las Vegas, in your face Adele. Matt has recently returned to our shores. He's moved back and he'll be touring around the UK next year.

1:53I am absolutely fascinated to meet this man. He was headlining a sold out Wembley Stadium age 17. They sold 17 million albums. They went platinum seven times. The song When Will I Be Famous? No, don't sing it great, stay in your lane. Made them a household name around the world. Brossmania, as it was called in my school and yours, I'll bet, lasted from the 80s until 1992, when, after a gruelling tour schedule and never-ending interviews, that fame they'd sung about longing for finally swallowed them whole and the band split up. Bross reunited in 2017, which was documented in a BAFTA award-winning documentary called After the Screaming Stops.

2:42Since then, Matt has released many solo albums, The Beautiful Unknown reached number seven in the UK album charts in 2022. He's going to be here in a minute. I'm going to get him in here and sit him down and find out what, in the little baby Jesus's name, this journey's been like. And what's he come for eating now he's back in Britain and it's an entire new chapter of his life? I'm going to find out, aren't I? God, this is exciting.

3:19matt gross welcome to comfort eating hello i am so looking forward to having you on this and even more so i'm looking forward to it because it is christmas and i want to start what all this stuff is because it's christmas yeah that's what it must be i love the fact that you're such a pop star that you just live in another time zone don't you you didn't realize that this actually is christmas I want to get an idea of what a multi-platinum award-winning musician feels about Christmas. Is it love or is it hate? Are you an elf or a Grinch? I'm an elf, without question. I love tradition. And being in the UK as well, I've seen all the beautiful lights and the cold.

4:05Being in Vegas, you don't get that much cold. I mean, when you do, it lasts about six minutes. So it's nice being back. it's cosy and yeah i like all that yeah but you must have missed that when you were away the britishness of christmas that british that slightly crap british christmas yeah i was looking at that i was really underwhelmed i think i don't i could be looking on social media it could be from three years ago but i looked at the trafalgar square lights as opposed to warsaw and every every single twig on the warsaw one lit up yeah and then they had like seven little strips i mean what was Yeah, from Poundland.

4:41Yeah, coming from Vegas, I mean, that's just, I don't know. Do you have an advent calendar on the go? I do. I have the Liberty's one, like you do. Yeah, that's the Liberty Cosmetics calendar. There is a drawer for every day. You get a cream or a potion or a serum. I actually made my boyfriend get it for me. I just had a tantrum about how no one ever gets me anything, especially a calendar. Sometimes you just got to have a sulk. Yeah, you're very zhuzh-y, aren't you? but how exciting is it when you forget it for a couple of days and then you go back and you can do two or three at once it's so funny you say that i've got about three hours on the way here i'm thinking i've got three more to open i think i might have used that i might have used a bit of skin products and i've got can i make a confession as well like i i use one of those things that you gives you the little kind of and i think i bruise my eyes so is it a thing that kind of like so you so you need the serum in it and all that and i was like i'm coming i'm going to talk about food and everything.

5:35I feel a bit beaten up by it. Right. I thought that you had been to a beautician's and had a very like a livening kind of facial that had just made your face glowy. Well, Flattery will get you everywhere but I also look like I've been in seven rounds.

5:57The time has come. This is the show where I invite a celebrity guest to my house and I I talked to them about the inner workings of their mind. When's the celebrity getting here? It's coming in a minute. We'll do you for now. The inner workings of their mind via food. And I asked them to bring me their ultimate comfort food. This is the one that makes them feel like they're back home in Blighty after they've been in America for a long time. Please. Do I unveil it? Can you show me what's under your tea towel? Please. Personal question, isn't it? Oh, my. I did not have you down as a man of such a substantial snack.

6:33This is sausage and fried egg sandwich with ketchup and mayonnaise. Ketchup and... Right, hang on, let's go in. Let's go in. We can chow down on this, right? We absolutely can chow down on it. Now, what you've done is you've gone double condiment. There's tomato sauce and mayonnaise. I'm a condiments king. You have to have sauce and you have to slice the sausages in like long ways, in half. Why? I don't like messy sandwiches. but I don't like them to be too messy. That, hang on a minute. That is a once a week sandwich. That is a once a week sandwich. Probably the weekend. This is one of those sandwiches I don't want to end.

7:07You know, so I know. It would absolutely have to be cut. Oh God, look, I've managed to get, I'm just going to put that over there. I spill everything. Anything I wear is a magnet to the food I eat. You know what I mean? You're taking a risk with cashmere. I know. You're comfy and casual. And when I wear things like that, I just look like a shoplifter. I shoplift in this outfit. Do you? Yeah. What do you think is the biggest thing that you could get up that jumper? I think the biggest thing I stole when I was a kid was a Rubik's Cube. One better than that when I was a kid. Because we never loaned money, but there was an action man that came with a boat.

7:41I actually opened the box and took the boat and left the action man in the box. And I remember it was just in my bath and my mum was like, where did you get that boat? And I found it.

7:58I'm going to talk about your earliest Christmas memories. Now, food is a sensory gateway into our memories. You've said you grew up troublemaking in South London. Yeah. What did an early 70s goss Christmas in Camberwell look like? We was always, like, trying to figure out, like most kids, what you've got for Christmas. And I remember, like, laying on the floor, and there was this little crack, and I didn't know what this word spelt. I couldn't, it was just too long. So I copied it down. I said, mum, what does that spell? She went, Evel Knievel. She went, ah. So like, it was like, then there was another big thing in my mum's bedroom and we wanted a snooker table.

8:40Like, you know, I went in there where they weren't there. We feel it. It was like a furry. Well, it's got to be. I'm like, mum, what's that? She says, it's a new front door. I'm like, why is it furry? Did you get the snooker table? It was a snooker table. It was not a furry front door, which could be a thing. So your earliest memories are you and your brother trying to find your Christmas presents and finding them. Oh, bless your mother though. That's part of it though, isn't it? You've got to try and hide the presents from your kids. Was Christmas kind of magical when you were little? Yeah, it was.

9:10I think my time when I was in Camberwell with my granddad, Harry, and my aunt Sally, my brother Luke, and my mum. um, Camberwell to me was a time when we were just, it was the only time probably in my whole, my whole life where I felt like there was family. So it was the only time really I can, I can, in my mind, I actually felt like we had a functional family. It was like, it was beautiful. It was like singing, good food, roast potatoes, white pepper, and it all seemed to work. And it feels like it lasts forever. I find that very profound at Christmas. Yeah. I feel like as well, like, you know, there's that wonderment.

9:45I still live in a complete state of wonderment. I don't want to be apologetic about that. Like I live in a constant state of wondering about everything, like life and being here and being allowed to be here. Did you mention white pepper? Yeah, it's important to me, white pepper. That's a big memory for me, like my grandfather. It's important to me as well. Yeah, right, roast potatoes and bum and squeak. Yeah, I love the flavour of white pepper. Did he used to sneeze when he got it out? Always, yeah. I know white pepper is, I think it's like a real, it yeah it unlocks a kind of a 70s feeling of like the older men in the family like getting out putting it onto stuff and it making them sneeze and there's it's a very specific taste back in that magical time when you were all a family who's cooking who's are you doing the traditional christmas like turkey and potatoes and everything is it all very well my granddad my granddad was it was a the star of the show when he was around he would get up at like five in the morning get spuds ready um yeah and they would all be just just before they were officially cremated they would they were ready so it was like crispy burnt ends on the carrots everything was slightly overdone but that really roasts beautiful and golden and just really good food i mean he really knew what he was doing he'd get the giblets yeah yeah yeah yeah so anyone that's listening doesn't though this was the giblets came inside the turkey what did he do with them did he make gravy make gravy with them rich rich gravy and just it was just an amazing time was he a was he a cook he was a gunner in second world war and then he became a healer he just had a way that everyone you know he would just have a certain way with his hands and just like it would make it would just very calming man my whole family's like that so east end east end family christmas and music go hand in hand and music has been your life tell me about music at christmas when you were a kid there was always music not necessarily christmas music i don't think our house has ever been those but like we would play that sinatra and dean martin those kind of tracks like this american standard so i think that's where the love of my the love of swing and jazz came in because my grandfather had the most beautiful voice he used to sound like nat king cole my grandfather when that was playing were you crooning along yeah always with my grand grandfather but i'd say i'd credit the person that taught me how to sing in a way was my aunt sally because we would always sing stevie wonder donny hathaway like big soul records and we would just try and out sing each other all the time but still have the joy of singing together look you're sitting in front of me right now very twinkly blue eyes and i've got to ask about young matt was he a huge hit with women yeah as humble as i can say it yes i did very well kiss chase was a big thing in my life there wasn't a lot of running there's a little bit of running my mate we went to a toga party you know his mum like kissed me against the wall at a toga party and i was like snogged your mum last night she ran the suite she was also worked at the sweet shop we were in a toga i was i think i was yeah oh god i don't really know i don't i don't know whether to just i don't know whether to make the entire interview about this incident or to just move on it was all like a bit of a laugh you know i mean it's like yeah was that christmas yeah it felt like christmas

13:13i've just spotted your your morton harkett candle sorry it's very distracting you know i would have i would have got you but you weren't in the shop there are certain times in your life and you've known you've made it and one of mine was being inside a christmas cracker was one of the questions

13:39let's go back to 92 when bros ended the third bandmate craig left and then your brother left and all of you just became tabloid staples and it turned out not to be the end for you far from it but it must have felt like it at the time when was rock bottom for you i don't know about rock bottom but definitely i lost my job people don't realize that when somebody leaves a bed i lost my job you know and it was like okay what do i do and but i knew that my my fortitude could handle that me getting on a plane going to america i knew that i had to get out of the observation of britain it was it was quite absurd almost what most people don't realize is that now on instagram or social media is you can correct everything you can go that actually is a load of bollocks and this is not true yeah back then you'd have to wait for the next interview to correct that last interview and you're like chasing your towel and it was quite exhausting and you also got rid of that as your family reading these things and when my sister was killed by a drunk driver she to me my sister was murdered you know he killed her killed her best friend and himself three people got killed at night we asked the press not to print the funeral address please don't and one of the newspapers did and it was extraordinary because at that time we'd have four or five thousand people wherever we were there was one fan turned up placed the rose on the car that was it didn't even look at us out of respect and we really respect the fans like really respected us and they've always kind of given us a lot of respect and we've given them a lot of respect but there were a bank of like 80 photographers 68 photographers massive bank photographers just by the right of the church and my brother's crying and i'm you know crying and and there's a the they start laughing when my brother gets out the car and my brother says f off you know and then the next day the front page four letter fury at boss funeral that's just like to me that's otherworldly just disconnected to anything humane that's the kind of headline or heroin dealer in bros house and we sued and we won but like you don't you shouldn't have to you shouldn't have to defend yourself never i've never had a drug in my life never a cigarette in my life and that will never that will always be the case so do you think that going to america was mainly about the tabloids what made you book that ticket i have a clear vivid memory just saying i really want to know what i'm made of i just want to i want to i have the belief that i can still continue with this journey whether it's the same or an alternate version whatever it is i knew that i could maintain some kind of momentum and i do believe and i don't say a lot but i do believe we shouldn't have broken up i think we should have just taken a moment off don't get let me get wrong i i love my journey i really love my journey but you know i also love getting on stage with my brother back then you started writing singles so it does feel like that wherever you were you did begin to build up again what what did that feel like how did it feel kind of coming out of that and almost sticking two fingers off at the people that were doubting it was i think that's the probably the darkest time of my life was where i i kind of gave up for a second because i feel like it's hard to explain when you've got you know see close protection like bodyguards and you you know you're you're known all over the world i felt agoraphobic i was quite afraid of not afraid i felt so uncomfortable around crowds and i didn't function very well at first and again i've never done any drugs or anything never tried to escape that but i remember thinking i've kind of had enough and i remember being in the hollywood hills and i was by myself i was terribly lonely um and i just i remember like the next being like i thought i was just i'm just gonna call it quick call it a day and just see if i can just drift off to nothing it was that low briefly or but it was just a battering and then my friend dear friend trevor i remember just being thrown into a bar i hadn't eaten for like i don't know how many days i was like did your friend come and save your life do you think or i think trevor did say my life i think he just was like no you know it was a moment in my life which is the only moment in my life that i'd given up yeah right at that point there was no help for you guys like you know people are talking about this now it was a moment in my life that i'm not necessarily very proud of because i i pride myself on having deep rooted fortitude that was the only time i've hit rock bottom where i didn't feel I didn't see where my light was.

18:25I couldn't work out what the next stage was, you know. And then I ended up signing a beautiful record deal and making a wonderful record.

18:43I find it absolutely fascinating that you ended up in Vegas being the longest residency of any British artist, like 11 years in Las Vegas. That shows a lot of tenacity in a lot of ways. You remember us and people think that that's what they know you. But then clearly you go into Vegas and you're drawing on those, Camberwell and your granddad and the songs that he loved, surely. You're definitely pulling on your archive of memories and your love of that music. But then within nine months, Gary Celestia, who literally just passed away, he said, do you want to be here? And I was like, and I said, absolutely.

19:27So we shook hands at lunch at a place called Beijing Noodle No. 9. Brilliant Beijing noodles. What are you having at Beijing Noodle No. 9? Noodles. What? Noodles. What kind of noodles are you having? They make the udon noodles. Oh, they're doing the whole pulled, there you go. you know as we say broke bread and we had a few drinks and he said you want to be i said absolutely you said this is the most decadent experience of your life which is that's got to be quite a lot coming from you i do sense that you do like decadence what was decadent about this in last i like decadence as well in humble decadence as well i like that i like the sense of even that like when the eggs run in it's still decadent german i like humble decadence is the kind of thing that mariah carey says when she's going i don't want i don't want a lot for christmas in that video but she's sitting on a massive pile of you sent the car you sent me to get here i trust me i know humble i'm not hungry because i ate most of the crumbs out of the seat tell me about the decadence of vegas because look i come on you're you're a lot you're a lad from camberwell and then you get to vegas which i would say is one of the strangest places in the world i've been to vegas a lot of times again like it's the biggest misconception before we get to decadence that it's it's it's the most incredible city there's the most peaceful place i've ever lived if you if you it's like comparing london to oxford street it's like it's not that's not london and nor is the strip the strip is the most important street financially for the city but there's two and a half million people that have schools community and that town will always have a piece of my heart yeah well the decadent side of vegas is like you know the movie in hangover the movie like the roof on the roof we would sit on that roof in the caesar's palace quite often with a bottle of scotch with loads of us with our legs hanging over the roof of Caesars watching the whole strip.

21:17It was above Celine's penthouse. It was everything about Vegas. It was decadent. As the shows got bigger, did the hotel room get better? No, it was just beautiful. I mean, Caesars really knew how to look after you. I think they really care for their entertainers and they know that it's a graft and they would call me their dynamo. Like I was definitely part of the team at Caesars. Did you ever do the Caesars buffet? I made a show for Netflix. The Bacchanal, I've done, I've laid the stuff out at the Bacchanal. I like the thing you did on the sausage roll, is it? I did make a show about sausage rolls.

21:51Yeah, I like that. I like that. Do you like it? You like it? You're like a Greg's. No, no, this is the thing. I've heard, being in America, oh, you've got to try Greg's. Oh, Greg's, Greg's, you've got to try Greg's. I'm like, first of all, who's Greg? And then I think because of one of your, that show, I was like, I've got to have a sausage roll. and then I tried the meat pie and I still think it's I've still got a burn mark on my tongue from it nobody told me that they were like the same as lava are you saying to me that you had your first gregs because of me well I think that you were the confirmation that I had to try a sausage roll did you did you or did you not have a butler in Las Vegas absolutely he would look after a lot the entertainers so his stories of you know about sinatra and muhammad ali and you know who i met both yeah i was i was with ali in his house i flew there with larry and his jet and we were sitting like table like this and he's grabbing my arm and he's rock solid man and then i met sinatra when i went to i was invited by eliza minnelli to be her guest at the royal albert hall and she's like well come to the subway and tell me what dress you think i should is best so i went there with neil tennon from the pet shop boys we went and um it's in the suite with liza minoli and then hang on a minute did you choose the dress for liza with neil from the pet shop boys i think i've just died and gone to pop heaven but then we went to the abert hall and then sammy davis walks in wants to wear my jacket so i'm with sammy and liza and then i walk into another room and frank's there and we we raised a glass we did a toast if you died then that's all life why do i have to keep dying in your stories i don't know i'm gonna keep making stories i'm like you die and then leave me in your way i'm not gonna die i'm gonna live forever so sinatra muhammad ali liza minnelli talking of stars the notorious london gangster reggie craig yeah he became a close friend how did that come about so basically i was i was eating sushi at fifth floor of alvinix when yo sushi used to be there yeah and it was one of the places that was near to my my house that i felt comfortable being by myself and i remember getting the phone call and it went hello matt and i was like you know when you well you any fellow watching this is gonna be like i didn't know it was but i'm like hello is this even oh mate it's reggie reggie cray and i'm like everything all right we good i was like and he ended up just chatting he goes i really love your book i love love your journey i love your style i'm a twin he has my name i said is it all right if i call you from time to time and he would call me very often and just call me and say hello matt you want to hear my words and that would be his opening i'm calling for my majesty's you know and it was just he would read poetry he would tell me his ideas about design And he had such a verve for life.

24:46When he got out, he just wanted to do so many things. And I wish he'd been let out sooner. And we could have got to see a reformed Reggie where he had, you know, I would have loved to have seen that. But he got let out on compassionately and he passed away a few months after. But he was a really interesting man and full of life. And I always say where the voice takes you. My voice has taken me to extraordinary places. sang for you know the last one the last gigs i did in the states was i sang for joe biden and and your voice you know you're seeing is underneath the venue with the secret service and the president united states he just sung for i feel like i hope that i have a little bit more freedom here i hope people don't try and squeeze me into being a singer of bros which was when i was a child you know i've lived a big life and i've succeeded as a singer and as a songwriter I hope that I'm able to be that man in this country.

25:39Not as easy as I thought it was going to be.

25:50I haven't really spoken about being in Bross. I mean, you were 17. What's your main memory of that? 17 years old. It was everything. You know, like I had the most incredible time. Yes, it was peppered with heartache and tragedy, but that's life too you know how did you feel about the screaming i think the scream is obviously a distraction for the so-called critics but when you're in it like you're okay i'm singing people having the time of their life i'm a young man very young man and shouldn't it be that fun shouldn't it be i've got plenty of time to to be slapped in the face and punched down and and get yourself up dust yourself up but it was the first few years of a very very big band globally and um this massive confidence that you ended up having almost you almost earned your earned your stripes there by being a 17 year old boy standing on a stage standing at Wembley was just a sea of it's a lot to cope with yeah see a sea of people that just have gone lost their bloody minds Ross always brought a kind of big a big sense of it was a big sense of occasion and it was the shows were massive and the sound was massive and um and then life life happens and then you have to figure out if you still want to do it you've gone from being a lad in camberwell then suddenly the money starts coming is there a point at this point during bros where you're like restaurants you find restaurants you find eating out do you do you get a bit fancy michelin star restaurants that type of thing i'm not i'm not really i'm not a food snob I don't need I don't like things because they have a price tag I'm the opposite of that did fans give you food?

27:30gave us food one of the funniest experiences of food I was doing the Royal Variety performance and and I came out of the theatre and there's this fan screaming like I gotta take this gift absolutely screaming and and I said to the driver I said stop mate we've got this let's go that really really looks like she needs to give is it so we put the window down i went thank you so much it was really heavy and i put it on my lap and it was uh it was frozen turkey it's frozen turkey and i was like do i must look emaciated she's been handing me a turkey she's like what what can i bring him but wrapping that turkey it was soggy in the bottom like it literally kind of fell out i didn't have to unwrap it it was only like it's a turkey and it was like it's like it's like the beginning of a joke in it yeah yeah pop style in limousine was it was the oil seeping out of it but it's all that it's just you try and explain that one if a pap gets you you've got a cold a raw turkey on your lap like explain that one it's not a fetish it's a gift and that doesn't sound right but then that same fan would also it's not a fetish oh god she would also end up she didn't give it but she'd always wrapped gifts and then she had a thing for frey bentos which by the way i should have mentioned yeah that was one of my guilty pleasures when i was kid i forgot the crispy top and frey bentos she would always give us the frey bentos so just to explain frey bentos pies for the poor people out there that've never had one yeah so it's a pie in a tin just don't ask what's in the pie at some level though when you were very busy and you wouldn't have eaten for days you must have been quite excited when you saw that girl because you knew she would have the fray bentos in her i've seen this before i saw you my mum because we would literally promo promo pro you'd be there for literally three hours in the uk and you fly up to germany wherever you are and i'm like mum can you so my mum would on a ziploc bag she would chop up her roast dinner for me and i'll drive by give have a quick have a cup of tea and she could go and we'd be and i'd eat me um tupperware or or even sometimes in like a ziploc bag it'll be like chopped up roast dinner yeah roast potatoes A bit of stuffing.

29:46That's broke. A bit of gravy. That's made me a bit emotional. The thought of her trying to put the roast dinner into a Ziploc bag. Yeah, yeah. That is love. That is the purest form of love I can think of. Your mum trying to put a roast dinner. And I bet she put it in like bite-sized pieces so you didn't have to. No, she mixed it all up. Mixed it up so every bite was a proper deal. Because I do love stuffing as well. My God, I love stuffing.

30:21I want to talk about the documentary, When the Screaming Stops, about you and Luke, reforming Bross, you prepping for tour. I don't think any sibling relationships could bear the scrutiny that yours had. Oasis, planning a reunion tour next year. Now, as a wise elder of music, what advice would you give to the gallagher's for going on tour with a brother i will say that i respect the fact that they have sorted out their differences and just move the fuck on and just it is not it is not painful singing music you love with your brother yeah and i'll say to my brother as well like i understand we've all got our own things and and i think sometimes the hype even around me and my brother like there's they say we're gallo because of pop it's like it's funny that we're known that we have a dysfunctional relationship and it saddens me because i never thought in a million years i never thought in a million years at this time in my life i wouldn't be like this with luke i love the fact that the galloids have just said like let's get on stage and smash it out, you know, with song and music.

31:36There's something quite raw there still, though, about your brother. Right now, I mean, I'm talking to you at Christmas. I feel like it's just I don't quite get it anymore. I mean, I understand all the moving parts. I don't totally get it. And I will never speak about detail. But one thing I do want to say, and even if you're listening, this is my life and I've got every right to say, you know, rather than lie and say, yeah, it's great. That's just not cool to me. And I've been doing that for a long time. And I refuse to do that because I must live my life. And part of my environment involves, obviously, you're going to ask me a question, as most people do.

32:14But as of this kind of month, I think, knowing that promo's coming, I've decided that I'm going to be truthful about the situation, but no detail. The thing is, I am a fan of discretion, but there's also got to be a bit of realism in there as well. like i can't come and have a chat with you and avoid all of that can i can i talk to you sorry a little bit about the about about the dock though because i mean this this dock it is warts and all it's showing the absolute reality and it had so much attention were you surprised at the attention did it take you off guard and are you happy with the dock it was received so well in america so we felt like we we had something but after it came out i was you know to get the bafta and all that it was an incredible achievement but it was quite reassuring everybody i met was like oh my god i so relate and then i found out how many dysfunctional siblings there were out there and it was that was very comfy and we're like okay we're not the only we're not the adams family of music you know when people said to me the first time i watched it people said oh it's funny and i watched it and yeah it did make me laugh but then they got it out again last christmas and i watched it the second time looking for the joy and i and i realized it's actually a very it's a very difficult watch it's very difficult watch and there is a lot of pain in there like how do you feel when you see it to make that film my sister had to pass and my mother had to leave so there's a there's genuine moments in there where you're just like you know and we haven't technically obviously when i saw his some of his reactions and mine and you could see that there was a lot of stuff that was unresolved again though like i've been in i've been i've been a musician now since i was 12 i've been in a band since i was 12 years old um i really know what i'm doing and i'm going into acting next year and i want to be able to say to my brother like can you you know what is this where do i stand on set what does this mean on set like and i wish he would do not say that to him but i but i also say to me like hey matt you know i trust my i trust my guy i trust my brother well you see you won't see each other around christmas no who will you spend christmas with my girlfriend um her mom my stepfather and we've got some friends wonderful poor friends anthea turner um no partner hang on a minute stop you're spending christmas with anthea turner we're all gonna go and have some food and yeah just sorry i wasn't i wasn't gonna keep a pro but why not i love anthea turner yeah so we're just we're all straighties in our own way and we're just like we're gonna have some food together it's gonna be very humble little christmas yeah i'm sorry i'm looking at you and i don't say i think i think i think you're humble and everybody else is humble is a very different thing because you're absolutely swathed in cashmere There's a lot of Gucci going on.

35:10And I just think that nobody... This is not Gucci. What is it? Just run and get up and start checking his labels. When you've been in Vegas for as long as you have, I think that... I mean, it's not like you're all going down Wetherspoons, is it? Are you going to Wetherspoons? I am going to Wetherspoons. I'll be there. Unlimited gravy. Yeah. How do you feel about the bit between Christmas and New Year when it's... What do they call it? Betwixtmas. Are you one of those people? Can you lie horizontally? on a sofa and do nothing for four days just chipping away at a big christmas cake i can't do that for four days no way no i mean i like having a good walk and certainly the cold i like i love the cold i do not like the rain but i do like boxing day when you tuck into the leftovers and make some bubble and squeak so you're into bubble and squeak what is your technique do you fry it in small portions i think everything everything's game in my body anything that actually is still you can use the next day is going in you've officially moved back to the uk It feels like a very brave thing to do because it feels like the UK at a point broke you and then you went across the pond and you broke America and now you're back.

36:19Is there a sense that you're re-breaking this country? Okay, so I like that question because the one thing that frustrates me about being back is that people want to compartmentalize my life. Everyone else is allowed to have a bloody career. I've had a very long career. every time i come back here i've got to somehow justify the next version of me it's like it's me i don't want my persona in like the states i'm a singer and a songwriter what's the thing that you want what is it you what do you want what's what is the part of your career that would make you feel as if people were understanding what it was that you are i feel like to be included it's an easy one for me i feel like to be included in the music industry more and considered in my industry a bit more when i come back i want to be on on stages do i do glastonbury i'd love to do it i'd love to do it my brother that's what i'd love to do if bros do glastonbury can i already reserve a bit at the side of the stage will you cut the sandwich next time absolutely look it's coming to the end all i'm gonna say is that when i had craig david on this christmas show he did sing a little bit of a christmas song to me at the end he didn't sing a lot not a lot it's just a few lines i don't mind singing the christmas song just not roasting on an open fire jack frost snipping at your nose Utah carols being sung by a choir and folks dressed up like Eskimos everybody knows I tell key and some mistletoe how to make the season bright Tiny tuts with their eyes all aglow We'll find it hard to sleep tonight

38:29Oh! My gosh, thank you for comfort eating with me. I need to go and lie down now. Thank you. You are lovely.

38:41Thank you for listening to Comfort Eating. This episode was produced by Hattie Moyer and the mix-in and sound design is by Solomon King. The music was written by Axel Kakutie and our executive producer is Lucy Greenwell. If you love comfort eating, go and leave us a review and you can follow or subscribe so you never miss an episode.

39:08This is The Guardian. you