Jodie Foster

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26:23As your mom said, well, your career's over at 18. Yeah. I would say 99 % of kid actors say, no, I'm going to keep this going. You decide I'm going to go to college, an excellent college, and get a superior, really fantastic education. Thank you. And so that is maybe not a usual move at that time. Maybe it's become more common, but to say, no, I'm going to take four years out of my career and study. Yeah, that was an unusual move. And I think we all assumed that my career would be over. So my mom actually sold her house and moved into a tiny condo and was like, okay, now we're ready because by the time you're 18 and you're going to go to college.

27:05We're going to spend every cent that we have sending you to college and you'll probably never work again. I did end up doing five movies while I was in college. So I did, you know, I worked during the summer and then I took a semester off, a couple semesters off. So I did do five movies while I was there. What was your major? I majored in literature, the literature major, which is, you know, lots of theories of literature. Yeah. And the area of focus was African-American literature. It's so fascinating because I can't make a case that my education had anything to do with my profession, but I wouldn't change it for anything in the world.

27:44And, you know, I studied history and literature of America. I was a very serious student. I wrote a massive thesis and had to argue it in an oral exam and was, you know, did all the things and then cut to, you know, 35 years of tomfoolery. but I was doing a I was doing a tour somewhere and I'm on stage and it's going really well and I'm also playing guitar and there's like a rock vibe to it and there's comedy but also there's some music and then at one point this big thing of paper came flopping up on the stage I didn't know what it was and this is usually the point in a concert when someone throws panties or a bra and if one is a certain performer not me I was going to say I didn't mean me.

28:34You get sheaths of paper. No, men throw their underwear at me, but it's more of a derogatory thing. And they're still wearing it. But they were like, this big thing of paper goes clump up on stage. And I'm like, I think I have the guitar on. I lean over and I pick it up and it says, you know, the literary progeria and the works of Flannery O 'Connor and William Faulkner. It was my thesis. Someone had gone and found it and photocopied it and threw it up on stage. And I thought, this is what I get. And also, I remembered writing this and having it thrown to me on stage was not part of the dream.

29:09But it's so weird. But I also, I can't explain why, but I know that doing all of that thinking and reading has informed me whatever I was going to do. If I was making clay pots now for a living, it would be helping me. It's whatever you were doing between the ages of 17 and 22, you know, that those years are really formative. And, you know, maybe if you were in, I don't know, you went to Rwanda and spent three or four years working in a small town, like that would be an extraordinary formative experience. So it's just about that formation. And for me, obviously, us that have had these, you know, great experiences with education, so much of it, yes, is about what you learn.

29:51But a lot of it is about the connections that you made with people that taught you how to be a good friend. And, you know, you learned all those hard lessons of people being disappointed in you and then never talking to you again, for example. or I, you know, I don't know. I definitely would not be the person that I am, but I also really feel like I learned to read, not in the real sense of, you know, cat and dog, but to how to look deeply into material, to how to look deeply into people, into relationships, into literature, and say, you know, what does this mean? And what are the different layers of meaning that are there?

30:27And I think that comes in handy every single day of my job. You have had this extraordinary career that any actor would say, yes, if I could have the Jodie Foster career, I'll take that right now. These multiple awards, two Oscars. But you have always shown a real interest in directing. And I've heard you say that the Jodie Foster who's directing is more yourself, maybe, than the different characters you play when you're acting. Is that fair? Well, yeah, we all have different compartments of things that we do. And I was born, like, basically in my DNA when I was born, I was born as a head first person.

31:11So I perceive the world as the head first, I think, before I feel. And a lot of people are the opposite. A lot of people are kind of stomach first people, instinct first people, or heart first people. I'm just not one of those, you know, as a head first person. And so I've always, in this job, especially a job that's very emotional and physical, I've always been sort of juggling, like, where is the space? Where is the space for my head? And how do these two things work together? You know, because so much of directing too, and I don't understand the job. I'm fascinated by people who can do it. It would terrify me is planning, thinking, making lists.

31:49Yes. Someone told me once. Yeah, it's admin. A lot of admin. But someone told me also a lot of directing is this or this, you know. So like choosing, do you want the Derringer or do you want the the the pistol Derringer? And it's some of it is choosing. But, you know, a lot of it is how you juggle the difference between intention and freedom. You know, I have lots of plans. So as a director, I'll you know, I'm in my hotel room all by myself. I got lots of plans. And then I come there and it's raining. And, you know, the guy I hired to play the priest is, you know, drunk or. And I'm sorry. One time you hire me.

32:33But there's it's that meditation of saying like, like, OK, now what? So what if, you know, what if what if the priest was drunk or what if there we no longer have a priest because I just fired him or, you know, you start having to have inspiration and making decisions in the moment where you collaborate with 175 people, whatever the energy is that's on the set. It's not just the actors. It's also all the people that are doing the various jobs bring their expertise, but also maybe even their past, you know, their relationships with their parents. Every time a prop master, you know, decides that the character is going to have a shot glass, an Elvis shot glass, it's because they're bringing baggage from their past into it.

33:09And they're saying, like, what is true to this character? I know I'm going to go for the Elvis shot glass. And so I love that. I love hearing other voices and then being the person that says, yes, no, yes, no, yes, no. I think what I can relate to, what you're talking about a lot, both in early television work and just throughout your career and even as you talk about your college experience, I like being around a gang of people. I like having that community. I spend, I've always say, if someone says they enjoy my comedy, I say 99 % of it you don't hear. It's messing around with people in my world and family and friends.

33:53I like all the jokes that happened as we're trying to build the thing that people see. Right. And that sounds to me like directing is this ultimate experience of a massive group. It's like Robin Hood and his merry man. You just get all these people together and say, let's let's work together on this thing. And a lot of the joy doesn't necessarily show up on the screen. It's part of the process. Yeah. And I mean, well, the big caveat is you are the last word. So you can do all the horsing around. People can have all the opinions they want. But at the end of the day, you're the person who has to have the personality to say, I see the big picture.

34:33You know, I'm not just in the moment enjoying the yuck yucks. I see the big picture and I want the train to leave at 835 and I want to arrive at 940. And you guys have given me all of these different choices along the way. we're gonna to see the big picture means to be able to see the way through and so much of that is about is about asking that question is it is it true or is it fake yeah those are the only only question i ask all day i same thing as an actor same thing honestly as a human being as a parent is it true or is it fake is this how i feel honestly or is this something that i'm trying to put on and to impress people or do i genuinely feel like the scene is funny or do i think that the audience will think it's funny.

35:15So I'm going to do it for them. You know, I'm always just trying to choose the most instinctual and the most true thing because I don't trust anything else. Yeah. I've always thought if I'm having fun in this moment and it's honest, most people watching it or listening to it will probably agree. That's not always true, but you just have that instinct and you have to go with it. And if you don't have that instinct, you're lost anyway. You should probably not be doing this. As you get older, too, I mean, the great thing that opens up as you get older is you've you spent a number of years thinking that thinking that your central story was the most interesting thing, right?

35:51Because me is very interesting. And and you, you know, especially as a woman, you know, there are things that you want to achieve. You know, I wanted to make films where where I was playing the central characters that were in charge of their own lives and that they weren't just adjuncts to the men, that they were fully fleshed, complicated human beings. But then you reach a certain point where you get older and you're like, wow, I'm just so bored with myself. I can't stand it. And you really start - Haven't hit that yet.

36:20You start realizing all the voices you left behind that you weren't listening to. And they're all out there and you think, oh my God, I can't believe I wasn't listening. I wasn't paying any attention. And then the real joy comes when you start saying like, oh, now that I have wisdom and I'm older, how can I serve your story? So you want to tell this story that nobody's ever heard before about a bunch of people that nobody's ever heard how this happened. How can I use all of this old patriarchy that I have to serve that purpose to support you? And that's so much more fun than anything else. And the pressure's off of you.

36:52Yeah, well, I look forward to having that moment. Because right now I am enamored with myself. I've been doing this a long time. You know, I have to bring up, many people consider it a perfect movie. I know I do, but Silence of the Lambs is just perfect in so many ways. The storytelling, and I think really revolutionary because there are about nine things that I see in Silence of the Lambs that now regularly occur in television movies. Ringing the bell, you think it's to one house, the door opens, it's not that house. When I saw that movie for the first time in a theater, I was just completely spellbound.

37:30and obviously your performance, a massive part of that. And what I'm thinking about is in that moment, this felt very revolutionary because Clarice is put in this very deep water and there are also scenes where she's in a very male experience. There are all these men in the room examining the body, doing the post-mortem and you need to navigate that. And I feel like that is a watershed performance that's defining. Thanks. But really defining women in a job that's always been depicted as a male job up until that point. Obviously, the script has flipped since then. But I don't know if young people realize how at the time that was, we hadn't seen, I don't remember seeing anything remotely like that.

38:24Yeah, that's true. It really tread over stuff that hadn't been thought about before. And mostly it was just like the hero's journey was reserved for men. And so it was a new thing to have a woman participate in what was a tragic, you know, has been a myth for centuries. But all of that was in the book because the book was magical. It just was one of those perfect texts. And it doesn't happen very often in your life. So I would say, you know, Silence of the Lambs for me and potentially for me, True Detective, like might have been the two greatest experiences that I've had working where you get a piece of material that is, I don't want to say inspired by the gods, but there's something happening in this material where it's just talking about something so true and so, so, so mixed up with our own collective unconscious that it's undeniable.

39:20and then everybody that climbs aboard does the best work of their life effortlessly. Yeah. And it really never happens. So when it does happen, like you really have to be jumping up for joy because when it happens, it's so easy and so much fun. And it was such a fun movie to make. Yeah. You know, we had Aloha Fridays where everybody wore Hawaiian shirts on Fridays and there was a lot of, yeah, it was actually a lot of fun. On Silence of the Lambs. Yes. That's great. Bring your kid to work day. What are we doing? We're throwing people into a pit who've been kidnapped. Shee, mommy. Yeah. That's a fingernail.

40:00Oh, wow.

40:04Yeah. I also think one of the most, I think it's one of the greatest depictions of what bravery really is, the climax of the movie when you are working your way through the pitch dark. Last day of shooting. Was it really? Okay, so. It was such a bad last day of shooting. We were all so mad. All of us were so mad. Yeah. And in some scenes, you can see you're wearing a Hawaiian shirt. He's got infrared glasses. You're like, is that a Hawaiian shirt on Agent Starling? But you are working your way through. And what meant a lot to me and still resonates with me about that scene is there are a lot of scenes where the hero and often the male hero is, traditionally doing the brave thing, and I love Clint Eastwood, don't get me the wrong way, but they're doing the brave thing and they're doing it in a kick-ass male way.

40:59Right. You are terrified. Shaking, shaking. You are terrified. Yes. Terrified and pushing forward. Right. And the combination of the two, it's completely believable. There's not one millisecond where I don't completely believe that that's what you're doing. You are pushing forward. Someone's life is at risk. This is what you're going to do. But you are terrified every second and you're making yourself push forward. And I think that is one of the best film cinematic depictions of real bravery I've ever seen because it's often portrayed as fire. I'm going to get in there. Get out of my way. And that doesn't read to me the same way.

41:40Well, actually, there's a big laugh in that scene where she finally gets to the woman in the pit and she says, like, you're safe. and the whole audience just like laughs hysterically. And then you say, I'll be right back. Yeah, I'll be right back. And then she curses you out. Be right back? I don't think I'm ever going to see you again. Yeah, because it's honest, you know, because it was really truthful and there wasn't a bunch of posing about it. And so that's, I think, a good example of saying, you know, what do you pick in that moment? What choices do you make? You know, who do you listen to?

42:12Well, you don't listen to a list of like, Like, whoa, what did Clint Eastwood do in his movie? I think you really, you say to yourself, you know, who would I be if this happened? And you follow honesty and instinct. And hopefully, that's really the only God that you pray to. Well, the people I'm always most impressed with are the people that keep challenging themselves, regardless of what they've achieved in the past. You have made this film A Private Life, which is in French. Yep. And your character is speaking fluent French the entire time in the movie. And I'm not going to take on that challenge, if you don't mind.

42:55I'd be there listening to, what's the, who is it? Or something. Yeah. Duolingo. Duolingo. I'd be like on headsets on Duolingo. I'm stunned by this challenge. and you have said, I didn't realize that this is a part of your career I did not know about, that you have been really immersing yourself in French culture for a big part of your life. Yeah, yeah. I had a French education. So at nine years old, my mom kind of dropped me into a French immersion school. At the time, it was the 70s and she had never traveled anywhere. And she took one trip to France, like a bus tour, a touristy bus tour. She went there and she came back and said, okay, that's it.

43:38You're going to, we're leaving this country. You're going to be a French actor. I'm going to put you in this school. And then, you know, if we have to split, that's, that's what's going to happen. And so she put me in the school. I cried for, you know, probably six or seven months because it was horrible. I didn't understand anything. And I was doing math and science and history and geography and French. And then finally I did. And so you, in this film, You're speaking fluent French the entire time. And did it change your acting style that you're speaking in this foreign language? Oh, yeah. I'm a totally different person in French.

44:12First of all, I have a really high voice in French. I don't know why. Really? Can you give me an example? Well, a lot of the ladies that I learned French from, they all spoke a little bit like this. And I guess I imitated them when I was a kid. So I have quite a confident way about me in English. And in French, I'm just a total vulnerable person. Very unsure of myself. And I wouldn't say screechy, but definitely, you know, a little bit higher voiced. Yeah, I have a totally different personality. I have the personality of somebody who's eternally frustrated that they can't communicate themselves well enough.

44:46I swear to God, if I do speak some Spanish and I like to break it out every now and then. Oh, nice. And I was using it, I try and use it as much as I can in Los Angeles where there's a lot of opportunities to do it. It doesn't always go very well, but I like to try. And your voice gets a lot lower. Mine gets a lot lower and I sprout a little mustache. A little Telemundo mustache. But I know that there's a rhythm to these languages and you start to behave a little differently. And I would imagine if I spoke French, I could see myself becoming more existential. Yeah. And maybe a little more dismissive and, you know.

45:29And you should try it. Yeah. Learn French. I know. I know. But I might start smoking. Yes. And drinking red wine. And drinking red wine at 11 in the morning. And just being, never saying yes. That sounds like a good idea. Just being, I don't know. I don't know. But I do think that different languages. That's true. Yeah. I'm playing an expatriate in the movie. So there's something about that. You know, people that leave everything behind and they say my whole identity, everything that I am, my past, my family, everything about me that I've always considered as me. I'm going to leave that behind.

46:07I'm going to break out and be a brand new person. And in some way, very often expatriates choose some fantasy version of what it would be like to be a French person. Yeah. You know, suddenly they're wearing a beret and their, you know, their house is right on one of those lovely parks and they start telling you they're on vacation and that they can't do things. But I thought that was interesting, an interesting thing to explore. Like who wants to erase their past and become this new fantasy? And what happens when you do that? How do your relationships suffer? And do you become, I think the irony is, and the film does have a lot of comedy to it.

46:42But the irony is that this psychoanalyst, very Freudian psychoanalyst, which we make a lot of fun of her because of that, goes on this murder investigation thinking that her patient's been killed potentially. And then very quickly realizes, oh, no, she's just investigating herself. So she kind of goes on through hypnosis and a number of things. it starts realizing, you know, that maybe she's not a great mom and that she, you know, there's parts of her relationship with her ex that she still has questions about. So it's more of a self-discovery movie than it is a murder mystery. What's the longest time you've ever spent living in France or a foreign country?

47:20Because that's a little bit of a, it's a common dream, but I've always thought I would like to live in Paris for a year or London for a year or Dublin for a year and just immerse myself in being someone slightly different. You get to be a different person when you're in another country. Well, you get to do that when you're on location as an actor because when you're on location as an actor, you're usually there for three and a half months. If you're a director, you're there for at least six months. If you're doing a limited series like True Detective, I was there for seven months, but the director was there for a year and a half in Iceland, Reykjavik, Iceland.

47:51So yeah, you get to become this brand new person that's obsessed with something. If you're making a show or making a movie, you're just obsessed 24-7 with this one thing. And it's every bit of energy that you have is put into this one thing. And that's how I like to live. I mean, I do these travel shows and I get to go someplace for usually about 10 days. But I do, even given 10 days, I try to forget. And it's really nice because sometimes you're in countries where they don't know who you are, They don't care. And you get to be someone else. And I love to just, you know, when you're in the van and you're going to the next location and you're driving through Manila or you're driving through Mumbai, looking in little side streets and wondering, okay, what is that person's life like?

48:47or what is it like to live in that apartment or that house right there? And I find, I say this a lot, I think it's the best antidote to ignorance is to go to other places, talk to other people, see how they live. It's this great loofah that, you know, because we all get desensitized, travel as much as you can. Doesn't have to be expensive travel or innate travel, but just go someplace and try to take in what it's like to not be you. Yeah. And it doesn't mean that you ever really come to this conclusion where you totally understand that culture. You never will, right? You're going to, you'll always be bringing baggage from your own background and your own culture.

49:26But that's part of it is growing and learning and evolving and changing. So that's kind of what I do when I'm not shooting is, well, first of all, I go home and I, you know, walk the dog every single day at the same time. And I eat the same thing for breakfast. And I, you know, I do, I love my routine. And then I start getting a little itchy. and then that's the thing that I like to do I like to travel the same thing every morning yeah I'm one of those is it anything crazy or is it pretty simple no it's really simple what's your breakfast I'm granola I'm a granola person I get you I know that has some bad references oh I like to party I know you get you yeah yeah let's talk you're saying it like I like cocaine too oh I got a granola guy if you want to meet him okay you got any granola with you right now he's crazy my wife Liza makes granola and it's like the greatest granola in the world and the smell just fills the house and I'm thinking oh wow that should be a cologne I would wear that as a cologne well that might be your next sponsorship yeah and there's a ring to it yeah right after we sell the pomade we're gonna do that because that's gonna be a real money maker Conanola Conanola Conanola I messed it up I don't think so I was trying to combine Granola with Conan What?

50:47You should own it There are no mistakes Okay I was trying to combine Conan with Granola And it didn't go well So I'm sorry Conanola Never call out a mistake Okay Alright Conanola Yeah see I killed it I killed it That's what show business is Yeah that's right The biggest mistake All those years Of doing a late night show That I ever saw Was a guest would come out And it's going okay And then the guest Would inevitably like maybe three minutes in or four minutes, if they hadn't been to the rodeo before, they would say, I'm sorry, this is just terrible. And the whole audience would say, I could see them, they would completely lose the audience.

51:21Because the audience would say, we've just been told this isn't good. And I would think to myself, don't ever tell them this isn't good. But Conanola was bad. Oh, terrible. Yeah, yeah, it was bad. Absolutely terrible. And I'm glad it was the only thing you chimed in with.

51:40I was saving it. When you brought up granola, I was like, this is my moment. This is my back pocket. You've been honing that all night. If she brings up granola, I'm going to say, Conanola. But now, look, we wouldn't be here at this moment without it. Sonos, you're a genius. You know, Jodi, you have, and it's such a part of your personality, especially when the times I've gotten to know you, but your sense of humor. You have a great sense of humor. And one of the things that I, and I remember because I think sometimes when someone has success on a certain level in these important areas in film and you think, oh, well, you know, it's Jodie Foster.

52:22And I remember the first time you came on the late night show, I was thinking, oh, you know, I, you know, I, okay, I, I don't know how this is going to be. I've got to be ready because Jodie Foster's coming. She's very important. And then you said like midway through the interview that you wanted to wear a Wisconsin cheese head. Yes, that's my team. On your head. Yes, that is your team. Yeah, big Packers fan. So you brought a big block of cheese that fits on your head. And I think I wore one too. Yeah. I left the beer cozy at home. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I remember thinking like, oh, and it's just, I mean, it is sort of like, oh my God, there's Laurence Olivier.

53:02Oh, he's got a fart cushion with him. It made me really happy. Thank you. I'm a really light person, honestly. People say, like, wow, you're so serious. I'm like, well, why they asked me those serious questions? Of course I'm going to respond seriously. But no, I'm a very light person. And strangely, I just love dark drama. I love doing dark drama, but there's not a moment of darkness. Really what you see is, that's it. There's nothing more. All right. Well, it has been an absolute thrill talking to you. I've not seen A Private Life yet, but I'm thrilled to see it. I watched the trailer. It looks so good.

53:37I'm so excited to see this. It harkens back to another time, you know, kind of a Woody Allen movie of the old days that, you know, you could have something that has many different genres. So it's kind of like a comedy, but it's sort of a romantic thing, but it's also a thriller and kind of a mystery. And probably you also felt a little bit of freedom that if you're making a film like this and it's in French that there's like this freedom almost to switch genres a little more and not be pigeonholed. Yeah, and even like, well, so what? I mean, I just want to do something hard. I like doing hard things.

54:07And if it's no good, then too bad. C 'est la vie. I'll just go home and polish all my awards. Oh, you didn't like it, did you? Is that an Oscar? Well, it's my second one. Oh, okay. Well, don't you feel crushed that? Not really. Well, Jodi, I hope we've edged you a little bit out of ambivalence, but that's going to maybe take a while. Thank you so much. This was a real joy. Yeah, me too. Really fun.

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56:01Terms apply.

56:08Okay, America's been holding its breath. And I say America, the world. We are a global concern. Recently, I believe it was Netflix, announced that they were coming out with a new star search. and to promote it, they were talking about all the great stars that were discovered on Star Search and all these impressive names went flying around the screen and my name was there. Yeah. And this puzzled us because I really have no connection to Star Search. I didn't start out on Star Search as Sona pointed out. I have no real talent. Oh. I just wasn't sure what your talent would be. I don't think you know either.

56:48You don't know either. Yeah, yeah. It's fine. It's fine. Yeah, you don't know either. Ventriloquist. But anyway, I, uh, that's what I would have tried. So respect. So, uh, this, this was a puzzle and we brought in, uh, our, uh, crack legal expert who works here at team Coco, David Melmed. And this is now part three because the story keeps evolving. Now, David, welcome. Thank you for having me here today. Okay. Appreciate it. Yeah. All right. Okay. Well, all right. God is good. He's incredibly formal. Yeah, yeah. And you know what? Incredibly formal. I love your jazz station. I just, it's cool jazz.

57:27I've been working on that voice. David, we brought you in to ask you some questions. You've been very helpful. All of us were first wondering why they might have been using my name, promoting Star Search, and inferring that I was someone who came up through Star Search when I did not. Yes. Sona was very angry on my behalf and said she wanted to cut a bitch. Cut a bitch. Cut a bitch. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was not angry. I was interested in both being paid, but I didn't want it taken down, which you said was a very complicated legal maneuver. Yes. I wanted to insist because I love my name being out there.

58:02So all this to say, things have evolved. What's the latest, David Melmed? The latest is your name has been taken down. Okay. That's not what I wanted. I know. I know. so I apologize for that. But it has been. Is this because you took some action? I'd like to think that I was part of it, but I think it was sort of a collaborative discussion. They heard the podcast. They did. We yield to the power. You did yield. So they heard the podcast. They did. They did. And you didn't make a call. I did not. Oh. I did not. You were saying, well, I'd like to take some credit. You didn't do anything. Well, that's, I was on the podcast.

58:37You did nothing. I was on the podcast. Like most lawyers, you did nothing. No, I sat. And then you're getting paid. I sat here to discuss possibilities. His presence is everything. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. But no, no. I think it was the group discussion, I think, went out. And immediately, I wouldn't say immediately, I would say in the next 24 hours, name was taken down. That is fast. And were you told why? Is there a reason? I looked into it. Okay. And I don't want to say that this is exactly what happened, but I have a pretty good idea how it happened. Well, this is why we brought you in. And the only reason we brought you in.

59:16Let's hear what you have to say. So I think it's a two part. Okay. The first, I think there was a, there was a, I think the first part is there was a human error. The second part, which I think is more interesting is it was an AI hallucination. Oh, that's fascinating. Yes. So tell us how this happened. And you know what? As always, David Melmed walked in with a lot of notes. Yes. And it's a printout. And then it's just covered in highlights. It looked like you just took the MCAT. Yes. Highlights and squiggles and notes. Tell us what happened. Isn't the LSAT for lawyers? I changed him over to a doctor, MCAT.

59:54Oh, okay. Yeah, he already took the LSAT, clearly. Oh, yeah. But I wanted to take the MCAT. Oh, I didn't get it. Good call. Okay. Worthwhile interruption. And man, are we the podcast that never has a hitch. Go ahead, Dr. David. So, okay, let's get into the, I can't tell you exactly how the human error, but I would imagine that someone within the marketing team at Netflix was asked to research this, right? It's a reboot. It's a ton of celebrities when you hear star search have been on the show, right? Beyonce, Adam Sandler. Chappelle, Britney Spears. I mean, the list goes on and on. It's an impressive list of huge stars.

1:00:34So if you were to run this. Buddy Ebsen. Go ahead. Continue. Buddy Ebsen. Yes. Brad Garrett was one. Okay. I think if you were to run a search in just a basic, I'm just going to use chat GPT, for example, right? That's kind of everyone knows that or Gemini. What is Conan's connection to the show? We've said that. But your connection to star search in terms of a search. And I did look up some past connection that you may have had with the show, at least in print. So I just want to read you something that if you could end this sentence, I'd be thrilled. This plane has been circling the airport For a while I'm worried you're running low on fuel Ken you know what there's a fog coming in off the Pacific This is our third installment of this segment We have about eight minutes to get through this Oh we will don't worry Don't you worry As soon as he's done talking we'll be more confused than ever So 1993 You took over late night There was an article that was written That suggested O 'Brien had probably had less quality experience than an average star search contestant.

1:01:43Right, right. Okay. Yeah. Hey, that is the, first of all, that's the tenor of the environment I was working in. And at the time I was proud my dad got an article published. But yeah, I came out of nowhere and people were freaked out. That was my sort of hesitation to say that because I didn't know how you would take it. That's okay, listen, I can slam before I'll be slammed again. Okay. Okay. Andy, your former sidekick, did a remote as a judge in 1994 on Star Search. So that would be a possible connection there. You've also had Ed McMahon on your show multiple times, right? So there is that connection.

1:02:20And then the Netflix is current. You know, you mentioned the Mark Twain Award. So if you were just to run a basic sort of search and celebrities, possibly including Conan O 'Brien, the AI would generate your name on a list, right? So where that runs into issue is the verification. And it's become a problem. It's become a problem within marketing, within companies like a Netflix. You need someone to double check chat GPT. Correct. You need someone to double check because AI, here's the thing, I am connected to many things because I've interviewed hundreds of thousands of people. That's insane. That's not true, but a lot.

1:03:02I've interviewed a lot of people and there are all these different connections and the different bits I've done and the parodies. And so, yes, ChatGPT is going to be throwing my name into lists of serial killers, recipes, you know, various weather conditions. I'm going to be showing up in a lot of places I shouldn't show up. Yes, and I think what's interesting too, and let's, so if we narrow this just to comedy, AI can't differentiate between what's satire and what is true. I see. AI is not, there's no fact finding mission within AI. It just reads patterns. Okay. Right? So that - I thought this was going to be more fun than you explaining AI.

1:03:41No, but I think - You thought him explaining AI was going to be fun? I didn't know that it was going to go this deep. Oh, yeah. And we're also at our time limit. Also, also, you're not interjecting at all. You're just listening to him. You - In my defense, I fell soundly asleep. I know. I'm so sorry. I didn't mean you should interrupt you. And you know what? I got to the deepest level of sleep. Yes. A level of sleep that is very restorative. I read in an article about this that the Backstreet Boys were also included and they were never on Star Search either. So it's like a double mistake that no one's verifying.

1:04:11What I want to know is, has Netflix answered for this? Yeah, have they issued an apology? They have not. They have not. Also, can I just be careful here? Yes. I'm okay if people want to list me as one of the greats that came up through Star Search along with Beyonce and Adam Sandler and, you know, Dave Chappelle. fine go for it i was not insulted you were the one that was insulted i was upset and now my name has been ripped from this promotion yes i think i've figured it out oh while you guys oh wait so we brought in i'm sorry we brought in we saw we brought in melmed yes we brought in melmed who who brought in a ton of notes yes well and um and then blithered and blathered and then you quietly have the answer?

1:04:57Well, because thanks to Melmude's suggestion. Nice save. Nice save. I decided to Google again, just kind of Conan O 'Brien and star-seed. Oh, so you did in a second what he's been spending. He's been in a library for six weeks. But you also did the thing he said was erroneous in the first place. It's a play. Could you put this on the screen? I found this article from June, if you look at the date, June 5th, 2023, and it was by this website or this publication, and it lists 39 stars. And Conan, you are, along with some of those others that we saw on that screenshot. You are listed here. That's crazy.

1:05:29This has to be the source. So, wait a minute. This is an article from... From 2023. But it says it's in the Saturday Evening Post. Right. That's a magazine that went out of business when we won World War II. The last person read the last Saturday Evening Post. So my guess is that whoever at Netflix was in charge of putting this list together found this article and did not do any further research. Are the Backstreet Boys listed in this? Sharon Stone? Steve Oden. Backstreet Boys are listed. Oh, wait, it says crazy. So I think Aguardo. Charles Manson? That's insane. That is insane. I think what also, just to elaborate, I'm going to, what do we say, piggyback on that?

1:06:12I think that is what AI would take an article like this in addition to what has already been existing and it would spit out your name. So AI is reading the Saturday Evening Post? No, no, no. I don't think it's reading. It's that someone has entered this data into the platform. And I guess the point is the verification is the important part that in business, you know, and I will I know you're falling asleep, Conan, but I'm not. I'm not. But you know what? I just woke up because I have a dentist appointment. I think the important thing is damages. Netflix owes money for an explanation. All of us an apology.

1:06:51Yes, they do. Well, I don't see how you guys come into it. I don't see how you guys come into it. We're part of your lore now. No, no, please, no damages for you. We're part of it. You mentioned legacy, though, right? You mentioned legacy and the idea of there's a legal claim of false light, where it's highly offensive. Your professional legacy, where you came from, where you started, Right? They were getting... Am I right? And I knew you hate when I use this word, but I'm going to use it again. I've been using it a lot lately. They're getting some riz off of my name, right? Yes. I don't think you used it right.

1:07:25Suddenly they're like Ansel Elgort because they use my name. Yes. Is that A, a person, and B, did I use riz correctly? It is a person. I don't think you used it correctly because Netflix is a streaming service. So why would the streaming service... I guess maybe, I don't know. They wanted to sex up. I just want you to stop saying the word. You think you sexed it up? Yeah, I gave them riz. You think you did? You made this rated G. Yeah. Ah. Okay. You brought it down for something, you know, flyover states. Listen, I think for the first time, this is what's valuable with this conversation, and I'm desperate to figure this out because I want it to be valuable.

1:08:05I think for the first time, someone finally has pointed out that AI might be problematic. Oh. Yes. and that's what I was trying to articulate okay yeah yeah and I know I'm gonna get comments you don't know this you don't I I'm speaking general are you reading the comments yes don't never read your I said comments may and yes I read every are you kidding me this is the moment so when you're on our podcast you read the comments if I don't read them they're sent to me though right well if I don't read them they're sent to me anyway okay usually oh did you see this did you You see this and you see the negative ones.

1:08:41Hey, can I, a question. Yes. Do you bill me for your time when you're reading your comments? Of course I do, Conan. Do people? Right now? Because I got a bill from you the other day for$600 ,000. Yes. And it said comment reading. And that was a discount. Yeah. That was a friends and family. So don't read the comments. You get objectified because of how he objectifies you? I'm not going to tell you exactly what these comments are. Yes, look what you did. I pointed out that he's a good looking fellow. You objectified him and now the comments think it's okay to do that. Oh, so now we live in an era where one guy can't say to a male employee, you're a good looking guy, sexy.

1:09:20I want to do you. I'll do you like a ham sandwich. No. What? I just made it up. I'll do you like a ham sandwich? It's a joke I read in a 1945 edition of the Saturday evening post. Listen, we're going to wrap this up. Yes. But Malmed, thank you for the deepest sleep I've had in a while. Yes. Restorative sleep. Yes, absolutely. Really like cells dividing, cells that usually don't regenerate, nerve cells. Correct. Regenerating in my body right now because you droned on. But I also thank you for your expertise, for putting the time in. And I wanna thank you, Eduardo, for within seconds of this guy consulting shelves full of old English legal volumes.

1:10:04And the Saturdays being posted. And you just checked out the internet and it said, I think it's this article. And you went, excuse me, might be this one. And you in the corner, you opened a book that's as large as an adult heavy man and you blew onto it. Dust and moths flew everywhere. That's true. You know what he did though? You verified. That's the genius. Yeah. I mean, that's what they needed to do. Yeah. Trust but verify. Yeah. Verify. This has been gotten to the bottom of, but I don't think satisfaction is here. Netflix, you owe an apology. Yeah, fucking bitches. That's right. Cut that bitch.

1:10:42Yes. Cut that bitch. We're coming to your office and we're going to start cutting some bitches. Netflix, you've been warned, bitch. Netflix, I just want to point out, I don't take part in this feud. This guy wants to pleasure a bitch. I know. I think you are a very comely bitch. I like the turn of your ankle. I like the way the sun glistens off your brow. Oh, no. And I want no trouble from you, you king of all streamers, you. And rightly so. Rightly so, Netflix. I sell out. No, we want an apology. We want some money. Love you, Netflix. Bye. Conan O 'Brien Needs a Friend. With Conan O 'Brien, Sonam of Sessian, and Matt Gourley.

1:11:30Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross, and Nick Leow Theme song by The White Stripes Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino Take it away, Jimmy

1:11:45Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair And our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples Engineering and mixing by Eduardo Perez and Brendan Burns Additional production support by Mars Melnick Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Britt Kahn You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Conan? Call the Team Coco hotline at 669-587-2847 and leave a message. It too could be featured on a future episode. You can also get three free months of SiriusXM when you sign up at SiriusXM.com slash Conan. And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O 'Brien Needs a Friend wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.

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