The Wedding Ringer

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1:37Conan O 'Brien needs a fan. Want to talk to Conan? Visit TeamCoco.com slash Call Conan. Okay, let's get started. Hey, Brian, welcome to Conan O 'Brien Needs a Fan. Hello, Brian, how are you? Nice, nice. Look at you guys. Amazing. Look at us. You look even better on Zoom. Yeah. That's great. Just look at us. Isn't that an incredible sight? Brian, very nice to meet you. I'm told that you are a wedding vow writer. Is that correct? Yes. Yes, sir. And you don't just write wedding vows. You write any speech that would be a part of a wedding ceremony. Is that correct? Speech is the wedding ceremony itself, if you have a friend or a family member doing it.

2:24all the written parts of the wedding that have been largely neglected from professional guidance. I mean, first of all, this sounds like a job that's much in demand. But second, how did you create this gig? Where did the idea come from? Well, it's actually got a connection to you, slightly adjacent. A guy named Doc Schweitzer, a friend of mine, a very close friend of mine, recommended, or introduced me to John Max, the writer, the TV writer. And Max, I interviewed him during COVID. I, like many people, started a COVID podcast where I just started interviewing friends that had done something in their lives.

3:08And he started talking about his role as a ghost writer. And I had officiated a few weddings and helped friends and family write speeches, because before this, I was in politics. I was a political consultant. Sure. So you had written speeches before. Correct, correct. And so I was looking to get out of politics because politics sucks badly. That's what I hear. Yeah, yeah. It was soul-crushing, and I just felt a part of the problem, so I wanted to get out of it. And so I had this idea, and I started looking around, and there were people that wrote speeches, but there was nobody that was making a real business out of it.

3:48There were a couple of people that had been doing it at some level or another, but I went on, there was an app called Clubhouse at the time where all of the wedding people were congregating because they had nothing to do during COVID. And I went in there and it's like an audio conference room where you raise your hand. I raised my hand and I said, hey, what do you guys think about this? And they loved it. And I made a site that day and I put some stock photography up and put an ad out and got a client the next day. And I was like, okay, there's something here. So we explored that. My wife and I were in politics together, and now we're in this together.

4:26We went to a conference and started talking to people. And my wife, Nicole, was like, you know, you've had a lot of cockamamie ideas before, but this isn't one of them. And so we figured it out. It's the very sweetest thing she ever said to you. You know, you're a real idiot, but I think you accidentally hit something. I'm more about quantity, you know? Yeah. All right. Well, Brian, I think about speeches a lot. I watch other people's speeches. I take them really seriously. Let's discuss our do's and don'ts. My first thing I would say is, and I just want to know if you agree, that the biggest mistake people make is they go on too long.

5:08Oh, absolutely. I mean, what do you think the longest speech? so I talk to wedding planners and I ask them this question like what's the worst story you have what's the longest speech or whatever it is the record is 50 minutes 5-0 5-0 for which speech for like who at the wedding is getting this would be a father of the bride speech all of the long ones are father of the bride speech I mean it really depends on what it is but I think that if you're saying some words at a wedding, I'm guessing it, I mean, you should really be thinking about three minutes or four, tops. Three to four minutes. Three to four minutes is plenty to do justice.

5:51You know, you're there to give a gift, right? You're there to honor the couple, both sides, right? Not just one of them, not just the person you know. You're there, no matter what you feel, you're there to make people happy, including them. And if you're going, even, look, you're in comedy. I'm a huge fan of comedy five minutes is hard like five doing a straight five minutes where you're funny unless you're trained it's hard and i i think uh people try to do five all day long without being funny or without having any instincts at all and uh and it just starts to drone and so uh 20 minutes is wedding disrupting and 40 minutes is like a wedding killer i mean that's what what people are going to talk about.

6:37So when people reach out to you, well, 50 minutes is a war crime and everyone should be arrested. Yeah, for sure. And here's another thing too is,

6:48I think when people underestimate the value of sincerity, that if you're talking, it's a very important occasion and this is the biggest day of these people's lives. And if you want to be funny, great, but also remember that it's a big thing that's happening. And people sometimes don't realize you can just be nice and you can try and talk about the emotional power of the event without just trying to kill. Does that make sense? Yes, it does. I mean, sincerity, as long as it works towards the mission, right? I mean, I've had clients where they don't like the person they're talking about. I see. Yeah.

7:29They have their best friend and they don't like who they're marrying. I had one extreme case where I had a client who was marrying his third wife. The kids did not particularly like the third wife, and we had to work around. It was like, hey, you must have something nice to say about them. And they're like, well, they're good at getting their nails done. And, you know, it was stuff like that. And so you have to work your way around that and make it fun for the audience at the same time. So, yes, sincerity, but this is not confessional, right? This is a time to talk about the good parts and to make it entertaining, but also make them happy.

8:09And so, yeah, sincerity is fun. Or sorry, sincerity is important, but it has to be fun. And it can't be something that's odd. But also, what I see a lot, too, is people at weddings that they're giving a toast, you know, a best man speech or, you know, bridesmaid speech. They think they really have to roast the person. And you just have to know what you're doing if you're going to roast the person because that can go horribly wrong. And you've probably seen it go horribly wrong. Well, I haven't seen it go horribly wrong. What have you heard? What's a horror story you've heard of? The worst horror stories I've heard of involve people disclosing things like past relationships, cocaine use, getting up there.

9:02And well, the worst, hands down, the worst was the was conveyed to me by a luxury wedding photographer. And she talked about how at one wedding, a very expensive wedding, the father of the groom thought it was the right time to disclose that he and the he and the groom went to a brothel in South America. No. And yes. Well, it is a bonding experience. And that's where he met his bride. Especially when you share the prostitute, according to the story. Wedding over. Wedding over. Wait, who goes first? Everybody yelling and crying. That's your question? Yeah, I'm interested. I'm doing some research.

9:40You know what? I've read about the etiquette of this. It's fascinating. I really didn't, and I've got nowhere to go on this. This is extreme. Look, this is an extreme story. But in most of the stories. Can you imagine being at a wedding where the groom's father says, And then my son and I shared a prostitute. Yeah. But I love those moments. I prefer train wreck moments and moments where you cringe over a smooth wedding. I like it way more. Would you feel the same at your wedding? That is more interesting than mediocre, right? But not at a wedding, you know. And so it was, yeah. I mean, most of the stories that are bad, I have one where like the groom's best man had everybody get ready.

10:25and with their keys. And at some point in the speech, he goes, jingle your keys if you've slept with the bride. Right? And so, you know, all the groomsmen, like, like stuff like that. But it's like. The crowd went, like, key jangling crazy. But even with vows, there's a viral one about, you know, where the bride talks about how much she loves her husband. And then the groom gets up and he goes, I just want to smack that booty. Oh, God. And that's all he says. Come on. Man. Well, wait. Is that a bad thing? Or, I mean. Well, if she's pouring her heart out to you. There's nothing wrong with that.

11:00Yeah. Yeah. And then he responds, I just want to smack that booty. Yeah. And he wants to smack that booty. Yeah, but that's not okay. But that's sincere. That's a vow. I mean, how was her booty? And they're a very traditional couple. He was waiting to the wedding night to smack that booty. You just want them balanced. You want both of them to say that, right? If one's saying love and the other one's saying booty, this is an imbalance we've got us all. Yes. Yes. That's a tragic imbalance. That's why you need somebody to look over it, you know. Yes. That's why we started Vows and Speeches. We're doing this thing, you know.

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15:39So what you're doing is you're meeting with them, you're finding out basic information and then you're helping them write it. They participate in the process. Absolutely. You know, I interview them. I record it. So I try and get their, you know, in politics, I had to, I couldn't write like myself. I had to write like the person I was representing. So that's what I'm doing here. I'm ghostwriting. And so I interview them. I'm asking questions like, hey, when you guys moved in together, what did you want to throw out that they wouldn't let you? you know like what do they have an odd collection of his sex robot sex robots yeah yeah why do you want to throw me out i have nowhere to go please but that would make a fantastic vow right then now you've got a personalized vow because sometimes she'll leave town you'll still need me she goes to the grocery store doesn't she you make love robotically notice who's been cleaning the bathroom it isn't her Yeah, so you pull all that stuff together, you write about the robot, you throw that in, the crowd loves it, and especially the robot.

16:48If my wife and I ever renew our vows, I'm doing 20 minutes on a sex robot. She'd be worried if you didn't. I know, yeah, yeah. She'd be the one to hire me. So I'd have to figure out how to balance this out. Do you have them read the speech or do they memorize it usually? I never encourage people to memorize it. You could sit in your room all day long, try to memorize something like this, but this is the first time they've read it in front of their friends and family. They need something to reference. I want them to get fluent with it so they can look up. And when you listen to somebody read something for the first time, there's a cadence that I'm sure you've heard where it's almost word by word.

17:30When somebody's read it enough times out loud, they've got some muscle memory, and now they can speak sentences. And that's really where I want them to get to. But yeah, we do delivery coaching as part of it. There's no AI whatsoever. Except for the transcribing process when I interview them. That's the only time I ever use AI for this. But the writing itself is all me and them. And I'm using as much of their words and stories as possible. And sometimes we'll write something that's specifically new. but it's only to accentuate the stories that they have. All right. Well, Brian, I have a pet peeve.

18:10Yeah. I see now if I'm at weddings or occasions and people get up and speak, younger people primarily tend to read off of their phone. And I just don't love it. I don't love people. I would rather they have it on a piece of paper and that makes me probably sound like an old man. But there's just something. I agree. that feels very inauthentic. You see the glowing screen. The minute they take their phone out and go, I just want to say a few words, it almost gives the impression that they used an app. Or they just wrote it. Or they just wrote it. Some of these people have spent tens of thousands of dollars hiring photographers and videographers, right?

18:53And now you've got a shot that's like somebody took a flashlight and it's for Halloween, right? Like that ghoulish, you know, up lighting. That's one thing. But all of the photographs will look like, hey, they're looking at their phone. They're on stage, but they're looking at their phone. It looks terrible. It's also hard to track. I mean, it's also something, if you're reading off of it, you'll lose your place very quickly. Oh, yeah. People are always going to, hold on, hold on, hold on a second. Yeah. Let me scroll for a little while. That's great video. So it's very unnatural. And yeah, so there's basic stuff like that that we advise them.

19:26But mainly it's just like you have people that are just good at math or they're good at something else and they're not they're good at science. They're just not the best writers or they're terrified of doing this publicly. And and also some of it's just they're just not funny. And you need a little bit of that humor. I mean, and I, you know, I've been watching you from the beginning. I actually was a big fan of not necessarily the news back in the day. Oh, cool. When I was, I think, two or three. I'm not sure. Yeah, yeah. And I know how to find very mild humor in what they're saying. And just as an offset to the sentimentality, you can't have the same tone for the same three minutes.

20:10Otherwise, it's going to be a very boring song. I just think we all have that situation where we see something go horribly wrong. But mostly, I think the biggest crime in public speaking is when someone just keeps going and going and going. and you think it's ending and then they go, oh, and another thing. And then you just feel disrespected. Like time is precious. And when someone's up there going and going and going, you just want to throttle them. And there's people that have, you've stuck people on a table. I want to throttle them. You want to get violent. Yeah. And that was one of the motivating factors for starting this.

20:46I'm like you. I can't stand it. And you put us at a table with people we're supposed to like. We're supposed to be talking and laughing and whatever. where you're asking us to be quiet for four speeches sometimes, maybe five if there's like a stepparent. And if they don't stick to the timeline, we're in for like 40 minutes of people talking and us not talking. And for people like me, it's hard. And so, yeah, you have to pay credence to that and give the audience the respect of like, yeah, I'm going to keep this short. I'm going to make it punchy and make it fun. And if you just hog the mic, you're not doing that.

21:24I also think people should lie more. I think Norm MacDonald discovered the perfect formula because he would come on my show and his celebrities are always trying to think of their funny story. And I went and I got the cake and it fell. And that's when Harry Hamlin said, well, OK, great. I want to hear that story. I know. That sounds cool. It's a really good story. But Norm Macdonald would come on the show and just tell old salesman jokes from like the 1920s that you could probably buy in the Sears catalog. And it was insane. But he would commit to them. And I would think, yeah, people should just say, you know, I just want to tell a funny story about the bride.

22:05And then it's just the plot to some great comedy movie from the 1950s. 1950s but i have retold the moth joke yeah like a thousand i mean a thousand times yeah that that joke i mean that that you're telling me he didn't learn that from a cabbie i mean that that you know well he didn't know he was gonna you know he wasn't doing that he wasn't supposed to do that segment he was supposed to do one segment and i on this fly said let's do a second segment norman he was like what and then i he just had to make it up and he just i mean i think he had maybe told that before, but he just went for it. And, uh, it's become this.

22:42Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. My son, Alexander. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Um, well, this is, I'm, I'm glad you're out there. This is going to help people immensely and mostly you're helping their audience because I want more and more people who are giving toasts at a wedding to get some advice before they do it. Yeah. Cause if I'm going to be sitting there, I don't want to get violent. we ask people to do these like people uh ask their friends and family to be officiants all the time and it's it's one of the bigger trends in in weddings where you don't hire an officiant you hire a friend you ask a friend to do it but they don't know how to do it nope right they don't know how to write an eight to ten minute narrative of a love story and make it beautiful and funny and keep it going they don't have no guidance so our our whole job here is just to help people along through this process and and make it fun and make it fun for everybody including the audience Well, I'm glad you're doing it.

23:33It's been lovely chatting to you, Brian, but I want to make sure this doesn't go on too long. And I just got out on a big laugh. But Brian, take care. Thank you so much. Hey, it's been a real pleasure. I love you guys. We drove across country listening to you. Thank you, Sona and Matt. You're welcome. I'm a national speech champion. I feel like I had to mention that at some point in this interview. And I've been married. Yes. Have you officiated a wedding? Yes, I have. I have. Incredible. All three of us have. How'd you do? I have. Oh, I crushed it. The couple immediately broke up. Because of my speech.

24:16How did I do? I officiated for one of your friends. Yeah, it was really great. I did a great job, of course. Okay. All right. Well, Brian, go forth and continue your good works. Thank you, Conan. And thank you all. Thanks, everybody. Take care. Conan O 'Brien Needs a Fan. With Conan O 'Brien, Sonam Avsessian, and Matt Gourley. Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross, and Nick Leow. Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino. Take it away, Jimmy. Supervising producer Aaron Blaird. Associate talent producer Jennifer Samples. Associate producers Sean Doherty and Lisa Berm.

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