Zach Woods

21:52And Adam Sachs is a very genteel fellow. Adam hadn't known me that long. And what I had done is I was talking about, I was preparing, but he didn't know. But I was just saying like, look, I don't know. I think I just feel like I'm anyone else here. And I don't really feel like I'm any different than I was in high school. I went to a public high school. My parents didn't have much money and we just grew up in a middle-class house. And I just, I don't think, and I just think I haven't changed. And then I sneezed very convincingly and loudly. And what I had done is I had a money clip filled with money and I had rolled it up and hid it in my hand.

22:26I went, and this wad of, giant wad of money came out my nose and shot onto the floor. And I was like, oh damn it. Like every time I sneeze, a lot of money comes out. And Adam covered his, what will you say? Oh my God. Crying now, just remembering it. And I've remembered it many times. He was crying and shrieking. I saw it in my chair. I was yelling, covering my face. It was, and we had only known each other maybe for a couple months at that point. Yeah, yeah, you really didn't know me. And it's, and so sometimes like my comfort zone is something that's so insanely over-the-top, Warner Brothers cartoony, wrong, that it's okay.

23:06Does that make sense? Yeah, also it's funny that you said that he snorts money because that's clear now that I do. Yeah. This is like, look, this is, again, you're not going to like this because it's more, but I was thinking a lot. I was very excited to come here, pick me, girl. And another thing that I was thinking about too is that I feel like I've met a lot of people in comedy who are, you know, kind of lampoon, very cerebral, very smart and often a bit aggressive. And one thing that I've noticed over the course of the time that I've been watching you is it's really interesting. Like, I think sometimes people are so smart and kind of acidic, get more so over time.

23:44But you've somehow, I feel like you're like warmer and warmer. Not that you weren't like warm before, but I feel like you feel like, like, I think I was a little scared the first time I met you because I was like, this guy's funnier than me and smarter. And I'm like, I'm better educated and it's very like brainy and fast. And, and now I feel like I could be kind of a little bit of a puddle or a little sloppy and not feel scared. I never, I never thought that I, uh, I will say that I am happier at this stage of my life than I, than I was at, we've talked about this, but my twenties, thirties, forties, just so much pressure all the time.

24:21And, uh, I like to think that I was, you know a good person and nice to people but i definitely am a happier person now than i than i was then because you i don't know you over you just think okay i this is who i am and i'm doing the best i can you you come to this you settle a little bit in this really nice way also i i think smart is way overrated i agree smart is so overrated and and sometimes i i went to you know This school where there were tons of, quote, smart people who were much smarter than me. And I've, in my life, in my career in show business, I've met tons of people who are smarter than me.

25:01They probably have a much higher IQ. I just, I don't credit smart with a lot. Did you feel like you were more dazzled by intelligence when you were younger? Or were you always kind of skeptical of it? No, I think I probably was more impressed. You're more impressed with a lot of things when you're younger. When you're younger, you're impressed with a lot of things. And then I always would see other people and think, oh, man, I really want to be. I put everybody else on a pedestal. And as you know, you degrade yourself when you do that. And I was constantly not thinking that much of myself and thinking that these other people were gods.

25:33And I also think that reverence isolates both the revered and the whatever, the reverencer. I don't know. The reverer. Like, because. Man, you're not smart at all. I see. Fuck. I just realized I'm so much smarter than you. No, don't push me out of here. Don't push me out. He's hitting me. Did you guys hear that? The reverencer? Oh, no. I knew it was going to happen. I knew it was going to happen. I posed as a warm guy that wanted contact with you. Do you think I wanted to meet you outside and leave your car in? No, I don't. I think other people are probably smarter than me. He bought it. I'm the smartest fucking man that ever lived.

26:20Sorry, that was crazy. What a weird sting operation. just to lure people in with like a promise of not being smart. Someone told me, of all these quotes, I can't remember who told me them, but someone told me fame is a mask that destroys the face. And I think - Oh, I know that one. Who said that? I think it was Avril Lavigne maybe, but anyway, it was, someone said it. And, and, no, I'm pretty, I'm sure, I'm pretty sure it was Kaya Gerber. That's what it was. It was Kaya Gerber. So there's a variation that says celebrity is a mask that eats. Yeah. Yeah, eats into the face. Eats into the face, yeah.

26:56John Updike. Yeah, John Updike. But anyway. And he had, I mean, his face was just riddled with sores and open wounds. Because he got too famous. It was really antibiotic resistant Mercer that ate his face. And he blamed it. He blamed it on his fame as an author. It's like, you're not that famous, John Updike. You're fine. No one's recognizing you. He went around. You know Freddy Krueger. Later in life, he wore a Freddy Krueger mask and went around and went, of course, you know, I'm John Updike. I wrote the rabbit series and I can't take off his mask. I do want to say, no joke, have you met? Have you met?

27:40What is happening between you two? Just look at me like, did you catch that joke? I went down a John Updike rabbit hole as Freddy, and I look over and Sona was looking at me like she was watching a man go underwater for the ninth time, never to return. Oh, look at him, he's drowning. It was like, you felt like he was looking to see like, hey, I knew, is it one rabbit hole? I usually give him whatever validation he's looking for, but sometimes I just don't, and sometimes I just stare at him. John Updike wearing a mask, showing up at a party, wasn't doing it for you. I just want to say I actually through this show met Kaya Gerber, who is like way more literate than me by a factor of about a million.

28:24Well, yeah, she was in my mind because I just watched an episode of your show. I'm going to bring up your show now because you just did. And then we can go on and talk about other stuff. But you have done this show called In the Know and you did it with Mike Judge. Yeah. It is really funny and really well done. And I think you've made six of them. is that right six okay i watched the first one uh before you got here and i was like oh i'm totally down with this show takes place at npr and this is going to reel you in it's npr uh zach is the main character who's completely full of himself named lauren yeah lauren caspian lauren caspian who is the i think third or fourth most popular npr correspondent probably fourth but claims there yeah and um it's puppets it's like it's like i want to almost motion stop motion puppets and it's really funny it's it's so well written and it's it's so good and of course it's skewering a lot of the stuff that that i think needs skewering uh i mean so many things need skewering uh on on both sides of the spectrum but it is so funny i was watching it i was thinking this makes me really happy.

29:36But one of the parts that I really like is that your character in his interviews, the interviews are on Zoom. So it's all puppets. But then when you're talking to whoever one of your guests are, it's really them on a Zoom. And so Kaya Gerber happened to be in. Yeah, she was great and very game. I mean, it's interesting. Like I've never done stop motion before, but it's the people who did the Guillermo del Toro Pinocchio. So these are like the best stop motion animators in the world, it's crazy to see it because one thing I didn't realize when we started, but I guess I feel like, you know, people have a tendency to kind of winnow themselves down to one thing or to winnow each other down to one thing, this kind of reductive identity thing where it's like you are this one thing or you're this one thing you did or one thing you believe, etc.

30:21And so something that I always look for in stories and try to include is the kind of contradictory bird's nest of a person, you know. And one thing that's so cool about stop motion is because each character is played by 30 different animators plus the voice actor, there's a kind of multifacetedness that's bred into the process. You get all of these different people's little ticks and imaginations and facial features and stuff in the process. I thought that was really fun. I'd never experienced that before. Also, it was also created by Brandon Gardner, who's my writing partner and who listens to this show religiously.

30:57I thought Brandon Gardner was really the driving force behind it. Okay, well, let's not get carried away because I clearly... No, no, he just felt like he's the... He's an amazing human being. Yeah, no, he's like a giant, powerful, Evan Rood motor shooting the boat forward. And then you and my judge have like little tiny straws that you're dipping in the water to try and help push it forward. But he's also a great guy, though. He's just like... I love him. He's a fucking great guy. And guess what? He knows a podcast when he hears it. Yes. Okay, well, I mean, I don't think we're just like a pointless ancillary rowing team on the back of his catamaran.

31:27I think you guys are attractive appendages on a powerful engine that is, what's his name again? No, but one of the things that it's something that I'm really looking forward to seeing more in the show is you and one of your coworkers are always trying to out woke and out PC each other. And it makes for really good comedy because you will be saying, well, there's an unhoused person I met and everyone's very sanctimonious. And then she's accusing you of being insensitive because you didn't use the latest term. And I thought this is comedy that needs to be done right now. Well, you know, it's funny in the neighborhood where we're recording this, I guess a couple of years ago, I was walking around and it's kind of like a Tony neighborhood.

32:15And I was I passed a house that probably must cost like four million dollars or something. And in the front yard, there was a sign that said defund the police. and then right next to it was an ADT home security decal that advertised that they have armed guards who are on patrols. And I was like, defund the police because you have like hired mercenaries. And I was like - With shoot to kill order. Yeah. And then I felt very smug about it. And then I went to go get them tiger and ordered like a whatever,$19 matcha and was like my own hellish version of the same person I was just looking down on. So I just think there's like so much.

32:52Sorry, I'm spitting. There's so much like, you know, the kind of cosmetic progressive ideology where it's like it's a personal enhancement as opposed to a commitment that you're making to action. You know, it's it's a way of beautifying yourself, but you never really walk the walk. I mean, I think about that all the time of like how if you look at my credit card statements and you were to look at my journal entries, there's a terrible disparity between what I supposedly care about and what I swipe my my card on. sure sure is the plan to make more than one season you're gonna wait and see yeah i guess it depends if they if the network wants to make more and but we we've been daydreaming about it i mean at this point we're just trying to kind of get it out into the world and that's been preoccupying but i wouldn't rule it out yeah well it's a boring answer yeah that's a terrible terrible answer can we get your partner in here can i do something yeah i'm gonna text brandon Let's talk about Brandon more.

33:49Can I just say something? This was intended to be an interview with Brandon. Oh, shit. But he is so in demand. We couldn't get him. Yeah. Damn it, Brandon. And there was just no getting him. So he's, I guess, on some party with Kaya Gerber and Sia and everyone else who's named him. Sia? Yeah. That's a cool party. It's just the three of them. Just the three of them. And it's in a very large cheesecake factory that they bought out. And it's just, it's empty. Oh, man, I want to go. Oh, I love the Cheesecake Factory. They have so many choices. I really do. Can I tell you, though? I made a reservation at the Cheesecake Factory once.

34:23I showed up and they were like, the wait is 45 minutes. I was like, oh, no, no, I have a reservation. And she said, no, no, that's just an estimate. What? I was like, what does that mean? So the reservations at Cheesecake Factory are a lie and a fraud. You have to always wait. Let's get that word out. Wait a minute. I have a confession. What? My stepbrother is a regional manager for. Is that true? Cheesecake Factory Why haven't you ever Brought in Cheesecake He lives in Dallas God I hate that They would melt on the way I don't think he works For them anymore But Good No we're not picking A fight with Cheesecake Factory I'm not telling you I'm the Bob Woodward Of the Cheesecake Factory I'm gonna be on Zach's side for a second I think if you tell people You've got a reservation You've gotta honor that Of course Now look I respect that Cheesecake Factory I've never seen a menu Like that It's a menu where You think of something in your head, if it's not on that menu, I'll blow my brains out.

35:19Literally like an alarm clock covered in caramel that sits on a blintz and then there's a bolognese sauce. Page 17. I'd like the buffalo wings and a better relationship with my father. That's page nine and page 32. I once asked him if it was possible, if I came in and theoretically ordered one of everything on the menu, could you even produce that much food in enough time? And they said that they could. I don't know. Do you think that's true? They have a 3D printer back there. And they're just constantly. And giant pneumatic tubes firing foods from all around the world at hyperspeed. You were quite young when you started doing improv, weren't you?

36:02Yeah, I was 16. I wanted to be a jazz musician when I was a kid. Yeah. Friendship over. Friendship begun. There we do. I just checked you off for friendship over. What did you play? No, go ahead. What kind of instrument? I played trumpet. And the way I got hooked on jazz, like all great jazz musicians, was a CD-ROM video game about the history of jazz. I thought you were going to say heroin. My parents got me, it was called Living Jazz. What? Yep. And it was hosted - That's how you got into jazz? Yeah. Not hanging out in smoky clubs as a five year old? No. Like all the greats, it was, I switched from Encarta to Living Jazz.

36:42and Living Jazz was like, had sort of the format of a first person shooter, but you were totally, you're totally passive, but you're wandering through the history of jazz. That's the way it works. That's fantastic. Yeah, so you're like, I'm going to go to Storyville and watch Louis Armstrong. I'm going to go to Chicago after the Great Migration. And whoop, there's Lester Young. Wait a minute, that's incredible. Do you ever get to shoot up the place? You never, that would be amazing if you play enough Living Jazz. you just get to be, what do they call it? At one point I wanted to transition to Grand Theft Auto, that's all.

37:16Like there's a lot of jazz history, but then at a certain point you notice like, I think I'm in a strip club. That's so funny. I just hit Elephant's Gerald with a baseball bat.

37:33People are really mad at me online. Oh God. So that's how I got into jazz. And then I wanted to be a jazz musician, but then I got braces and I couldn't play anymore because it messed up my embouchure. But my parents took me because I had to get braces and they took me to Dr. Chops, who was this. Come on. Was that a jazz musician? Yeah. Well, he's a jazz dentist. OK. And he was he's Winter Marcellus's dentist. And we went to visit him and said, you know, is there anything that can be done? He said, no, but this toothpaste is$30 and you should buy that. And so we did. And then I went back home and the guy who gave me braces, I feel like I've talked about this at some point, but he had a life size mural of himself in a lab coat, putting braces on the animals in the jungle.

38:22And then he also had a portrait of himself dressed as a dentist working on himself dressed as Superman. So this guy was a fascinating character. Yeah. I mean, we've got to talk to him, too. We've got to get him in here. I feel like any time I allude to someone, you would prefer that they were here. I would just say anyone. Anyone but. But no, but this is crazy to me, which is that you get braces and they can't make a special mouthpiece that goes over your order. They were just trying to discourage you from playing the trumpet. Maybe that was it. My parents got tired of it. But I would take pliers and rip out the wire because I would get so frustrated and I wanted to play.

38:59But then I just sort of gave up and I had all this free time where I used to be practicing trumpet. And so my brother had gone to college in New York and he'd gone to an early ASCAD at UCB, the Upright Citizens Brigade, and he told me about it. And I thought, oh, that sounds fun. So I would take the train up to New York from Pennsylvania where I grew up and I took classes. And back then, the Upright Citizens Brigade was in this kind of dingy X strip club where you remember this. Oh, yeah, definitely. Yeah, and they had cleaned out. He remembers the strip club. Yeah. They cleaned out the strip club and, yeah, turned it into a small black box theater.

39:40That's right. But they would still sometimes find condoms and stuff because I guess it was a house of ill repute. And then also, I guess there was like a mix of, someone told me that there was like, I guess for some reason the strip club was popular with the seeds. So sometimes like these Hasidic guys would come in and like sit down thinking a strip show was about to start, but then they'd just be stuck in like Brett Gelman's one man show or whatever. And like, you just end up like watching alt comedy for an hour and they couldn't leave. So just the idea of like these like Hasidic dudes just watch.

40:09It makes me laugh. Anyway. Yeah, I performed. I did some stuff with UCB back in the day. And I remember going down to that theater and they would do a thing where you just go out and do a monologue based on something someone shouted out in the audience. And I remembered finding it incredibly fun and therapeutic. day. Have you ever had the experience of oversharing? Have you ever done like a monologue or an interview or something and then had that kind of vulnerability hangover thing where you're like, oh, I didn't want to talk about that, but I did. I mean, I talk so much. I probably have, but I don't know that I've ever come to you, Matt, and said, I mean, take out that part where I talked about my younger sister beating me.

40:51That was exactly the thing you asked me to take out. I was just embarrassed that my younger sister could beat me so easily. Yeah. No, no, I don't remember. And throughout the course of your life, too. It's not. It wasn't an isolated incident. She was three and I was 15. And she totally just was hitting me through walls and then falling me into that room and then punching me through another wall. Yeah, I don't think so. I don't think so. Yeah. Do you? Sometimes. Do you guys have that? Oh, daily. Really? Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Sona has admitted to many crimes that she committed. I used to shoplift.

41:23Really? Yeah, my parents were horrified. Can I ask you about that? Because I have so many questions about that. But was it the thrill of shoplifting or was it like you wanted the item? Was it you wanted to shoplift or you wanted the thing? Like, I mean, the first thing I stole was a 45-cent sticker book from Sanrio. And I could get that. I could have afforded it at that time. But I just was like, I'm just going to put it in my pocket. And scrunchies. And scrunchies and hair things. And I would steal things and I would put them on my head like a hairband. and I would walk in front of the customer service reps.

41:56Oh, wow. And that was a thrill. But I never stole a bunch of stuff and ran out. When I met Sona, she was running down Olympic Boulevard holding a Samsung flat screen, a very large one. And then I robbed you, remember? That's right. Yeah, I beat you with it and I took everything you had. You smashed it over my head, ruining the flat screen, and then robbed me of$8, which really was stupid because the flat screen was worth so much more. but uh yeah i'm i'm one of those people that the way i was raised was someone's always like god is always watching so every now and then i would put gum in my mouth and i would be walking along and crinkle up the tiny little trident wrapper into a tiny little ball and just sort of drop it on the sidewalk and keep walking and then i would stop and walk back and pick it up and it's not that i'm the best person in the world it's just that i thought that i can't have that hanging over me And I had a therapist tell me once years ago, you have the largest conscience, which is probably a shock to you guys.

42:56But he said, you have the largest conscience of anyone I've ever talked to. So those things, the idea of taking even, you know, stealing one Alka-Seltzer from a drugstore, not because I'm better than you, because I'm superior to you. It's an important clarification. I mean, it's a really interesting thing. Like, I think there was a store where I grew up where if you stole, they would either call the police or they would take a picture of you with the item that you stole. And then they would put that picture up in the grocery store. So it's this sort of humiliation. It also feels a little bit like Salem, Massachusetts, 1650.

43:37That kind of this is the way we will shame people and then they will behave or putting people in stocks. You know, it's a public humiliation, which is something that maybe used to work. I don't know. We should do more of it. No. Okay. I thought you were saying that's not the way to go. No, I think people should be shamed. You saw the Crucible, that play about the... Yeah. And you were like, that's aspirational. I thought the Crucible by Arthur Miller was a how-to. I did. I said, okay, I'm down with that. Shame on ye. Shame. Remember when I tried to dunk you in water to see if you were a witch?

44:17Yes. And all this hair product floated to the surface. Oh, come on. Well, you use a lot. You use a lot. I have curly hair, dude. I know, but various waxes and oils, come on. No, what do you mean? It's frizzy if I don't. Why do you have to bring that up? I don't know. I think there's no shame in it. I think someone told me, I wonder if the shame thing works as a term, because someone told me that, again, these are like unsighted, probably bullshit stories, but that shoplifting in 19th century London was like a big epidemic. So they made it a hanging offense to shoplift. And the place, so they have these big public hangings and those public hangings was where there was the most pickpocketing and stuff.

44:55Yeah, because everyone's, yeah, it was a great place to shop. And also I think, I mean, that was back when you could get shipped off to Australia for, you know, taking a loaf of bread. That's it. If you were starving, yeah. And then you're, you know, boo-hoo, Australia. Have you been to Australia? It's amazing there. I wish I had been shipped off. Yeah. Instead, we went to America and to central Massachusetts. Conan, come back. Come back. Hey buddy. Come back, Conan. It's our country too, man. Oh, hey, sorry man, I blacked out for a second. I'm just saying if they had sent me to Australia, which is where we should have been sent - You would have surfed?

45:27No, yeah. I'd have like a V-shaped torso right now. I'd have like a six pack, I'd look like a Hemsworth if I had gone - Yeah, I would. Yeah, I would. Yeah, I would. I would have lips instead of this keeping gash for a mouth. I'd have eyes that were the right size instead of these beady little rat orbs. They should have shipped me off to Australia. But no, we had to go to Sturbridge. Oh my God. I've never heard the word Sturbridge with so much venom in my life. Sturbridge. Shout out to Sturbridge. It's a friend of a lovely place. My dad told me once, this was so nice, because I made this short film that's sort of about a therapist.

46:11He's a therapist. And he said this thing to me once that I thought was so sweet, where he was like, he said, I know you love me and you can have it all. He was like, you can tell a story about anything from our family from my vantage point, and I trust you to handle it humanely. That's so sweet. Damn. That is my, I did not get that shit from my parents. My one message my mother made very clear that I understood and got was, the O 'Briens were to be told of as lace curtain, respectable Irish people who, you know, were upstanding members of the community. And my whole career has been tearing that down.

46:52Well, that's so interesting. Like my I have an uncle who got into researching the family's history. And I guess like my great grandmother came to escape the czar and the pogroms and stuff in Russia. And I think she was a sex worker in the in the Lower East Side. She was by herself. She was a teenager. And then she married a Jewish gangster and a jewel thief who eventually got killed in Chicago. But she divorced him first. And like they had very amazing. It's crazy. Right. And then it's so funny how you just try to sort of wash the stink of the old country off you as fast as possible. Because then my grandfather changed the name from Woodensky to Woods, started talking with kind of a fake British accent, apparently smoked a pipe.

47:32And you just try to kind of ape this respectability as fast as you can. I thought you were a Protestant Earl. Like I really, I thought you were landed gentry. Mission accomplished. From Oxfordshire. I swear to God. I was like, oh, they're growing pretty tall there in Oxfordshire. I could talk to you for seven hours. I really could, but I have to respect your time because you're a man with things to do. Also, we got Brandon coming in. Oh, God damn it. Oh yes! Brandon, Brandon. Choke on it, Brandon. Choke on it, baby. Let me just mention again, In the Know, it's a really funny show. It's out now and it is on Peacock.

48:14It is very unusual. It's original and it's really funny. It's really funny. So check it out. I will carry that with me for a long time. Thanks for saying that. Well, I meant it. It came from my heart and from part of my brain that has things, the control of the voice. What's happening? Oh my God. Those are your dying words? Yeah, we're witnessing. Yeah. Oh God. She's gone. Oh my God. I was trying to say, I'm trying to say, what I'm trying to say is it, it came from the heart, but then I also wanted to credit the speech portion of my brain. Cause when people say it came from the heart, I'm like, yeah, okay.

48:50But without the speech portion of your brain, what the fuck? So I think the heart gets too much credit. So anyway. From your mouth? From my mouth. That's coming from your mouth. That gaping hole with no lips. Stir bridge, stir bridge! Thank you, sir. Thank you.

49:19And I want to tell you what we were just talking about in the studio. And I insisted, let's turn on. I said, let's activate the microphones. So Eduardo turned them on. This is what we were just talking about. I made a declaration that I'm pretty sure I could take anybody in this room in a physical fight, except I said, Blay, I don't think I could take you because you work out all the time. Thank you very much. You could. I don't think I could. But and then everyone started to get into it. Like, no, you couldn't. You couldn't take Eduardo. You said more than that. Yeah. You said I'd fight you without my hands.

49:53Yes. Well, I know that you're a huge. And I still think he'd win. Yeah. No, I think you're a huge. You're a huge soccer fan. You love Lionel Messi. It's Lionel, by the way. and I just think you're probably like in the back of your mind think I can't use my hands I've got to get him with my feet and then I just lay you out you know and then Adam I'm sorry but I just it would be over very quickly I disagree yeah I think Adam's the quiet prize fighter you know have you been in many physical fights very few very few very few Sona I think rightfully said that she couldn't see me getting like working up enough rage.

50:32I don't. Yeah, I think, first of all, you remind me, and the listener is probably thinking, well, we can't picture this Adam Sachs. Imagine a milder Michael Cera. Is that fair? Like even milder and not as strong. I don't know. Like Michael Cera is like on steroids compared to. No, no. But is Adam tall and lithe? I think, do you want to arm wrestle across the table? Oh, yes. Come on. No, I can't. this rotator cuff. Oh, really? I'd like to see this. My money's on this guy right here. Well, wait a minute. Whoever wins an arm wrestling struggle does not win the fight. No, it is a one indicator of strength.

51:12It doesn't mean I would beat you in a fight, but it means I'd beat you in a single feat of strength. Well, this thing's in the way. No. But listen, let's keep the conversation going for a bit first, okay? And then we'll see if this so-called test of fighting aptitude and it gets us there. You know, so every time you're in a stressful situation or let's say you're walking down the street with your wife and some thug stands in the way and says, give me your money, you're going to say, we'll arm wrestle and see who gets my gold. Is that what you'll say? It's, I mean, it came to mind. We can figure out other ways to test.

51:46How about I fight you? I fight you, but you're blindfolded. I mean, I'm - You can't do that, you know, mic'd up. It's easier to sit at the table. And what about, now, Matt, when you see me, when you see you coming after me, I know you're ageist and stuff, but come on. I mean, look at this guy. No, you look great. You're super fit for your age. And I want to say this. The only thing I've got going in my corner is a desperate need to prove something to you, my father figure. Yes. And so that might be enough to take me over the top. Also, I'm betting, just because I know you've got a lot of flea markets and you love to buy weird things, I bet you have a Flemish suit of armor at home.

52:18And probably some kind of antique brass knuckle. Oh, yeah. Or a umbrella with a knife cane. You have all kinds of weapons, ironically. What's an ironic weapon? Oh, you know, like a bumper chute that has a little - That's what I just said. A little knife that comes out. That's what I literally just said. I know, but it comes out - Before you even got there. But one that has like a James Bond - That's what I just said. You didn't say one that has a little knife that comes out. I did, I said - Did you? I did. Did he say that? Oh, I think I would lose this fight. I wouldn't even know I was in a fight.

52:44I'm telling you, as my body grows stronger, and it does every day, ladies, I think my mind is going. I didn't hear you say that, but then again, I was yelling at you and I wasn't really listening. You need your mind. You know, you can't just be fleet of foot. You need your mind in a fight, you know? Yeah. And coordination. You have no coordination. You have no coordination. Let's get to the bigger thing and I think Sona could take you. I can easily take you. And you know I can take you. You would have the rage. You know what? I do have the rage. I will say this. An angry Sona beats everyone in this room.

53:11Yeah. Oh, yeah. I think we're all agreed. And I've seen you when your blood is up. Yeah. And you are the Khaleesi. It's insane. The dragons, the whole thing. You're just - But you don't have - Yes, you are a strong person. And I have a lot of inner rage. Oh, for sure. But you also, you don't have very much coordination. And I think you'd be doing a lot of bits. I would do bits. You'd be putting the pen and be like, hey, mustache pen. Yes, yes. I would do bits as I fought, which I think is very impressive. I managed to do bits when I fight people. I don't think that is impressive. And I think you get beaten up.

53:42Unless it's a distracting tactic. Oh, it wouldn't be distracting. It's a lot of me using glasses. If I have a pen, I make it a mustache. or I make it like, oh, I'm a walrus with one tusk. I'm the walrus with one tusk, you know? There's only one way to decide this, and that is right now. Fight club. Yeah, Battle Royale. Fight club. Why don't you guys go right now? Okay, so. Jesus. What are you doing? Trying to swing at you. Already I feel like, I don't know anything about arm wrestling technique, but I can tell it's not right. I know nothing about arm wrestling. Okay, all right. And I don't think it's a chest of strength.

54:12All right, on your marks. And we hold these hands? Ready? Wait, what are you guys doing? What? What are you guys doing? Do you see something? Matt reached over and held my other hand. This is over the top rules. If we don't have the little joysticks. Wait, what? But why did you hold my hand? This is what you do. Hey, do you want to get one milkshake and two straws? Hey, how about we both, we both start on different ends of a strand of spaghetti and move our way to the middle. Have you people never arm wrestled with someone you loved dearly and wanted to get closer to? Can I say something else?

54:41Sona, give me your hand. He held my hand and he did a little bit of that. There was a little bit of a rub. No, you do this. Why are you doing it? You do this? No, that's on the side. That's not in the middle. That's on the side. There's nowhere for your arm to go. That's blocking, then. A disagreement is broken out in chess club, is what's happening. This is the weirdest. I have never seen this technique. My microphone is over here. What are you doing with this? I have never seen this technique before. I have never seen this technique before. Ready? Yeah. Wait. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute.

55:11He's, wait a minute. You're on this side of the table pushing that way. I got to do it right. That's totally fucked up. Gorley. Gorley won easily. No, but you saw what he did. You're on this side of the table. There's no way. Well, let's switch places then. Arm wrestling. No, just stay there, but get here. This is chaos. Here we go, ready? Yep. Wait, wait, no. When, when. No. That's two. One to one. One to one. One to one. Hold his other hand, Soda. Oh, come on, I'm not doing shit. And go. And go. He's using this. Lift down his arm. Oh, wait. You okay? You okay? What happened? What the fuck's wrong with you?

55:53What the fuck is wrong with you? Can't you arm wrestle? Oh my God. Oh my God, look at that. He broke my skin. Dabbed him with a pen. Here's the thing. Dirty. You have the most poison dipped umbrella. Look, when I said I would win, what I'm telling you is I would win. I would use anything in the room to win. Yeah, you know what? You would. I think you would. I think you're the best like cheater. Yeah, I don't call it cheating. Is it cheating when Jason Bourne uses, he uses something in the kitchen when the Russian attacks him and beats him. That's not cheating. He does use a pen, but he uses the pointy nib and you just took like the blunt curvy ends.

56:33Because I didn't, look at that. Matt, I didn't want to hurt you. Do you realize if I'd use the sharp? I thought about that. You did, you could have killed me. I would like, my dream is that all of you attack me at once. That's my dream too. Okay, I think we all - That's so weird. I think we all have the same dream. You all attack me at once, and then I just become this like, whirly gig, this red tornado. There's potatoes in there and fists, and then there's single shots of each of you flying up against the wall. And Eduardo, you hit the wall and then you go like, you hear birds and you slowly sink to the bottom.

57:08And then you hit the wall and your hair has turned jet black, Bley. Guys, he's begging us to attack him. This is our one chance to take this man down. I'm giving you, listen, it doesn't even have to be now. You're allowed to attack me at any time. I'm like Clouseau. Yeah, I just want to, I love the idea. Do you have to see it coming? Or can we ninja style it? Oh, I'd like to see you try, Eduardo. I can hear you coming a mile away, muttering the latest soccer scores. That's what you do, Eduardo. So that's what you do. Arsenal two. Two? That's a score? Ridiculous. Manchester one. I always hear you before I see you.

57:52I do think that when powered by rage or if I feel that my career is at stake, then I become a whirly gig. Yeah, but you don't feel that. So when you don't feel those things, you're powerless. Yeah, I'd be killed quickly. Yeah, okay. At least you know that. I do feel like you, and this is not a joke, I do feel like there is some kind of superpower that activates when you're shooting a remote. Yes. Or we're doing a bit. Like we were, if I can say this, we were in Thailand and it was 180. Well, that was a sex trip. You don't talk about that. Oh, you mean for the new HBO Max show? The new HBO Max show.

58:30Oh, but don't talk about the other time we went to Thailand. That really gets us right. The second time we went to Thailand, It was 108 degrees, and even people who lived there were, like, dying. And not only did you outside do a whole kickboxing thing, like a very physical for, I think, like two hours. You also, we went to a climbing gym, and you climbed to the top. Well, my thing is I've always been able to, if I think it's going to be funny, you can shoot me. I don't want to put this out there. No. With a glass, with a fake bullet. No, but if I think it's going to be funny, I can do things.

59:09You can walk on water. You will walk on water. No, that's making me Christ-like. Okay, sorry. I think I'm more of a Buddha. All seeing, all knowing, omniscient, big belly. I think that, yes, I need those kind of stakes. Otherwise, yeah, I would collapse immediately. Yeah, I think I'm a tissue man, a man made of tissue. Yeah. But let's see. You're all welcome to attack me at any time. We should attack you off camera is what you're saying. Or whatever you want to do. If you want to attack me. Would your brothers kick your ass? Well, first of all, that's just rude. And secondly, yes. Yeah, for sure.

59:47Neil, bigger than me, much stronger than me. But actually, Luke and I together couldn't take Neil. So we used to try and we were like these two small countries in the Ottoman Empire that banded together to try and take on a huge empire. And he could still take us and he would just laugh and throw us around the room. So I think maybe a secret to why I'm so hostile. Who can know? Who can never know? Did you pick on Justin because he was so little? I would never do that. And Justin, if you're listening, my apologies for 15 years of hell. I had to go to college, so I had to stop. Oh, OK, OK, good.

1:00:26No, I would play with Justin all the time. He's our youngest. But I would play. My games were insane. I mean, he was like trapped. It's like he was trapped with a madman. So most, he would say, can we play cops and robbers? And I'd say, sure. And so I'd be the robber and he'd be the cop. Then he'd like say, you're under arrest. And I'd say, well, okay, I'm suing you now. And he'd be like, what? And I'd set up a table and say, you need to fill out these forms because I think you had no right. And I think you avoided my constitutional rights. And then I remembered it ended once with him. I said, you have to go into this prison because you've been taken off the police force.

1:01:03This is like 1981. He said, you have to go into this prison. And I said, you're the guy who shares a son with you is a robot who's there to spy on you. And he was like, what's happening? I just want to play cops and robbers. Oh my God. So that's, I mean. And he's a lawyer now. He's a lawyer now. I think to fight those same injustices. I love you, Justin. And I apologize. I thought we were having fun. I don't even know you. And I love you, Justin. And I sympathize. And I feel for you. And I apologize. It's so funny. I had to leave my family. And I recreated one here. And I figured out a way to turn it into a quasi business.

1:01:46Yeah, I know. And then just, oh, good. I can pick on these guys. You're the Neil. Yeah, not really. All right. Well, this was, I think we learned a lot. I think we learned a lot here. which is, Gourley, you would fairly beat me arm wrestling. I still think if it was a real fight, I could distract you. I could say there's some memorabilia over there from the Nixon Museum, and then I would just take your head off. That's true. And I don't think it's worth it to arm wrestle unless you can hold hands. So what's the point otherwise? Give a little, give a little. That was weird. It's not weird. Look it up, people.

1:02:17That's how you grade school arm wrestle. I don't know. And he had like, it's weird. It was really weird. And it was tender. That thing you're talking about isn't in the middle. Can I say something? No, that's what you use when you don't have the over-the-top joysticks. You don't hold hands. They've never held hands. Sona, Sona. He wanted to hold my hand. Let it go. You hold hands. You arm wrestle. You see each other later. You realize you're closer than you think. You find out what's in common. Okay. And then you take a little drive. All right, I'm going to end it there. Attack, it will. Conan O 'Brien needs a friend.

1:02:52With Conan O 'Brien, Sona Mavsessian, and Matt Gorley. Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Nick Liao, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Earwolf. Theme song by The White Stripes. Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino. Take it away, Jimmy.

1:03:12Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair. And our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples. Engineering and mixing by Eduardo Perez and Brendan Burns. Additional production support by Mars Melnick. Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Britt Kahn. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Conan? Call the Team Coco hotline at 669-587-2847 and leave a message. It too could be featured on a future episode. And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O 'Brien Needs a Friend wherever fine podcasts are downloaded.