An immigration crackdown gone wrong. What do we know?

0:00Today in Minneapolis, an Immigration and Customs Enforcement officer shot and killed a woman. The Department of Homeland Security described the woman as a violent rioter who attempted to run over law enforcement officers. Here's Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem. This goes to show the assaults that our ICE officers and our law enforcement are under every single day. These vehicle ramings are domestic acts of terrorism. But the mayor of Minneapolis, Jacob Fry, a Democrat, says the video paints a different picture. I myself saw a video of the shots being fired as the car was driving away.

0:43What I can tell you is the narrative that this was just done in self-defense is a garbage narrative. That is not true. Consider this an immigration crackdown gone wrong. What do we know?

1:03From NPR, I'm Mary Louise Kelly.

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2:02It's Consider This from NPR. It is a little past 6 p.m. Eastern on Wednesday, and here's what we know. On Wednesday morning, in Minneapolis, a 37-year-old woman was shot dead by a federal immigration officer. The circumstances around the shooting are hotly disputed. Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem said the woman attacked federal immigration officers and attempted to ram them with her vehicle. A DHS statement says an ICE officer feared for his life and for public safety and fired defensive shots. Minnesota politicians who have seen the video of the incident strongly contradict this account.

2:45Joining us from Minneapolis is reporter Matt Sepik of Minnesota Public Radio. Hey there, Matt. Hi, Mary Louise. Start with just the backdrop here. ICE has been on the ground. They've been in Minneapolis last year, now again at the beginning of this year. So update from there to what happened this morning? Video shows a maroon Honda SUV blocking Portland Avenue. This is a one-way street south of downtown Minneapolis. Federal agents are heard telling the driver, ma 'am, get out of the car. The footage taken by a witness shows one federal officer walk around the right side of the car and around the front.

3:24Moments later, two other agents walk up to the driver's side. One tries to open the door. At this point, the driver begins to reverse on the icy street. As the officer hangs on the door, the driver begins to drive away from the scene, and then an officer in front of the SUV appears to fire into the car three times. The driver was pronounced dead at a hospital. At a news conference this afternoon, Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O 'Harratt described the deceased as a 37-year-old white woman. He said that she was not the subject of any immigration actions. This incident comes as the Department of Homeland Security is stepping up immigration enforcement in the Minneapolis-St.

4:03Paul area with what the department says is 2 ,000 agents. Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem visited the area yesterday. Okay, and then what is the Trump administration? What is their account of what happened this morning? Because so far they've said the shooting was justified. Administration officials immediately tried to take control of the narrative. On social media, DHS called the woman a, quote, violent rioter who, quote, weaponized her vehicle. The agency says the ICE agent fired in self-defense. The president also posted on his website saying the woman was obviously a professional agitator.

4:37DHS Secretary Kristi Noem spoke to reporters about the incident during a news conference today in Texas. This goes to show the assaults that our ICE officers and our law enforcement are under every single day. These vehicle ramings are domestic acts of terrorism. We're working with the Department of Justice to prosecute them as such. We will continue to protect our ICE officers and in cooperation with other law enforcement agencies as well. However, Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Fry was clearly angry during his own news conference today. day he called the ICE officers' actions reckless and said Noam's version of events is not what happened.

5:16Having seen the video of myself, I want to tell everybody directly. That is b******. And using another expletive, Frye said ICE should get out of Minneapolis. He added that the Trump administration is trying to sow chaos and that he and city leaders had feared exactly this outcome when ICE started its enforcement push here. Let me ask about reaction from other stakeholders as we try to sort through what we know and what we don't. You mentioned Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O 'Hara joined the mayor at the press conference. What else did he say? He says the FBI and Minnesota's Bureau of Criminal Apprehension are investigating and added that most law enforcement agencies train their officers to avoid situations like this where they have to use deadly force.

6:01And just quickly, Minnesota's governor, has he weighed in? Yeah, Governor Tim Walz, also a Democrat, said he is preparing to mobilize Minnesota's National Guard. Walz called the administration's operations dangerous and sensationalized and a threat to public safety. What we're seeing is the consequences of governance designed to generate fear, headlines, and conflict. It's governing by reality TV. And today that recklessness costs someone their life. Reporting there from Matt Sepik with Minnesota Public Radio. Thank you. You're welcome.

6:33We've also reached Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O 'Hara. Welcome. Hi. Good evening. Thank you for having me. Hi, Chief. So the 37-year-old woman was pronounced dead at the hospital. I was watching, I saw at a news conference this afternoon, you described her as white, as not the subject of any immigration actions. Do we have that all right? So that the information that we had preliminary at the scene remains the same, that this is a middle-aged white woman who was not the target of a pre-planned law enforcement activity, that this is a woman who was, her vehicle was blocking the roadway, and then the immigration agents got into an encounter with her.

7:20She's not the target of any pre-planned law enforcement activity. Thank you for clarifying. What is in dispute is why she was shot. Department of Department of Homeland Security spokeswoman Tricia McLaughlin is on record saying, and I quote, an ICE officer fearing for his life, the lives of his fellow law enforcement, and the safety of the public fired defensive shots. End quote. Defensive shots. Was this an act, as far as you can tell, of self-defense? Well, I think very clearly in this country, we expect law enforcement to conduct a full and professional investigation. And that investigation should follow the evidence to its logical conclusion.

8:09And so, you know, while it is possible, like any other time law enforcement uses force, what's possible, it could be lawful. We should allow the investigation to run its course to its logical conclusion. So you're saying wait for the investigation. There are videos, as I'm sure you know, videos of the shooting that are circulating online. An ICE officer appears to be shooting into the front window of a moving vehicle. Have you seen these videos, Chief? What do you make of them? I know there's several videos that are online. I have seen at least one of those videos. And I know it has been very alarming to a lot of people in the community.

8:58This is a tragedy. I think there's no ways about this. any time a person's life is lost, it is tragic. And certainly in law enforcement, we expect our officers to be training and trying to do everything they can to de-escalate situations and avoid the use of force and certainly avoid the loss of human life whenever possible. I do want to ask just about the ICE footprint in your city. The officials in Minneapolis and state officials, the governor and Minnesota have been weighing in. The mayor had strong words saying I should get out. I want to play for you. We just interviewed Minnesota Senator Tina Smith, a Democrat.

9:48She said this on our air just within the last hour. The local law enforcement had no idea that those ICE agents were even there. And so what I see is that these agents are contributing to worsening public safety in my community rather than improving public safety. Brian O 'Hara, would you respond to that? Has ICE been helping or hindering your officers in trying to keep your city safe? Well, I responded to that scene myself very shortly after the initial call came in that there were shots fired involving law enforcement. And I saw really dozens and dozens, if not maybe a few hundred, federal agents ultimately at that scene.

10:35And so the thing that I have been concerned about this entire time, again, is not so much whether or not federal law enforcement is happening, but truly the manner how this enforcement action is being conducted. We should be doing everything in our power to ensure our professional responsibility. And that is that we are paying attention to the manner in which our officers are performing enforcement actions on the street. And I think that's a professional responsibility. Thank you so much. Brian O 'Hara is Minneapolis Police Chief. Thank you.

11:20This episode was produced by Michael Levitt, Daniel Offman, and Karen Zamora, with audio engineering by Ted Meebane. It was edited by Cheryl Corley, Ahmad Dahman, Jeanette Woods, and Courtney Dorning. Our executive producer is Sammy Yenigan.

11:42It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Mary Louise Kelly. On the ThruLine podcast from NPR, the former slaveholder who took on the KKK and won. He became more and more and more militant as time went on. Listen to ThruLine in the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.