Transform Your Office Like a Designer

0:28So good, so good, so good. bringing back our transform your series. Do you guys remember that? It's been too long. I know. I will say that. One of my faves though. I do too. I actually forgot about it. And then we got a listener question in from Rowan and he wanted to know if we were going to do a transform your office series. Cause he's working on his office and it reignited inside of us that we're like, oh my gosh, we haven't done the office yet. So we've done the transform your bathroom, your kitchen closet your bedroom so if you're working on a project heading into the summer or just any project wanting to redo a space in your house that's a really great series to go look for any of the transform you are so today we're going to be doing your home office and a lot of these things can be applicable at work as well where we really take you through just how to set things up so that it really looks and functions great you have any other ideas of transform your that you haven't heard from us that you want to hear, write that in.

1:23We'd love to know. We love the series. Okay. So Corey, take us into Rowan's question. Rowan asked, I'd love a deep dive on where to start with offices, how you decide what to put in them and for a practical small room to be glamorous and efficient, not just for show. You got to put paper, pens, notebooks, whiteboards, cork boards, your vision board and inspirational messages somewhere. Yes, you do Rowan. As we thought about where we would start with the office and look through our portfolio of images and offices that we've designed, there are three things that we would pay attention to. The first being the function.

1:57Every office space is different. You have different shapes, you have windows, you have doors, you have fireplaces, you have maybe none of those things, but it's not very big. So how do you actually think about what do you need? How do you need it to function? And how do you space plan all those things, right? Second is the feeling. So we figure out the function first, but the second is the feeling. Everybody, when you're going into any space that you're going to actually invest in, put money into, you want it to have a feeling, especially when you're thinking about a space where you're going to go work, whether you're working full time in this office or whether it's just a place to escape the kids or anything to actually get something done.

2:32We want to have a feeling so that we can actually be productive and we're going to enjoy being in there. And often it's in the office that you can actually express your identity versus the whole family room or the whole kids rooms or anything because you want it to inspire you to be and do your best work. I agree. And I actually think the home office should feel different than the rest of the house. It will signal to your brain when you're going in there that you're going into work mode or even more important when you're done for the day that when you leave, then you have a different feeling in the rest of your home.

3:06So I think usually homes end up being pretty neutral in hallways and open areas. So I picture the office being a color and having this mood or this feeling. If you own your own business, maybe you even think about the corporate color of your company. Maybe that shows up in the background or maybe it's just something that you really love and identify with. And it's that color that you look so great in. Yeah. Because so much of working today, especially if you're working from your home office, is taking video calls. And we want that backdrop to be really good looking and we want you to be well lit.

3:34So that might be positioning you in front of the window. Exactly. So you look good on camera. Yes. Or the window for sure. We're going to talk about windows facing you. Yes. You look your optimal on your camera and you get that angel glow yes we all want yes we want to look like baby angels on camera we figure out what is the feeling is it dark and moody and studious or is it light and bright again along with offices we've done features on command centers is what we call it for those women in their house this is also for that too i think there's a lot of i think cross pollinating ideas there between your command center and the office whether it's his or hers or a whole family's office.

4:10And then the third thing that we're going to talk about is the foundational pieces. Now, these are the larger pieces that you need in the office to function. Talk about a desk. Is it an actual desk with drawers than a pencil drawer in a traditional desk? Is it more of a dining table? Because you need to spread out your project. Get those blueprints. Whatever it is that you're working on, you just need a project table. Or is it storage? Every office that we do, the office is where all you schlep all the papers you have all the leftover projects from your kids it's your files it's your socials it's your passports it's all those things whether it's in a safe or in a file drawer you have to store all that somewhere and that usually ends up being in the office so what are your storage needs and how are we going to satisfy those and so usually there's some type of built-in so what does that look like for your office run so those are the three things that we're going to go through and we're going to take you through several of our projects and show you how we solved for all three of these things in every space, which is really fun because you get to see same functions, but different personalities, which kind of goes to that feeling.

5:12So whether it be masculine or feminine, whatever, this is just one of those spaces that really can be your very own identity. Cause usually an office doesn't need to be shared with everyone. Yeah. So it's a space where you can dream and like a closet guys, this is going to be a great episode. I can't wait. We're going to be showing you some visuals. If you're not where you can see them. We're going to do our best to describe these spaces. This is actually just a sketch of an office that we just proposed for our client. Again, it's not finished. We haven't even done all the edits to it, but I thought it was a really great example of having a space and having several different needs for the space and how we problem solve for that.

5:48So in this space, it's a lovely men's office. We have a fireplace. We have two built-ins on the sides, but it's not a really deep space. So if you were to try and center the desk, you wouldn't be able to have the sitting group that he also wanted to have. He wanted a little place to lounge for his wife to come in. They can hang out. Kids can hang out. But he needed a desk. He needed storage built-ins. He needed a TV. He needed all these things. And so in this space, I thought the space planning that we came up with was super clever in that we actually brought the desk and kind of created a peninsula from that far window wall.

6:21If you're looking at the actual sketch, you'll see this, but it's actually sitting up against the window and kind of creating peninsula coming into the space. So it's not centered on the fireplace. It's not centered on the room, like looking toward the door, but having it this way allows for it to not only feel smart, love this vantage point, looking in there and seeing that this is the function, but also being able to appreciate all the other beautiful things. And I think it's less ordinary also. Let me say something funny. I've worked for this executive probably for the last 24 years or so of my life.

6:52And when I first did his first office, I had a certain vantage point that I really thought would be beautiful for the office. And he said, no, I've got to make sure that wherever I am, I can't get murdered. So I need to make sure that I can see the door and the windows at all times. And ever since then, I've noticed that every man that I've worked for, that there's a certain power position that he wants to be in where his back is to the wall. He doesn't have windows behind him he doesn't have doors behind him and he can see the spy that he is he can see his windows or if he has french doors or if he's got just the mandor coming into the room that he's got a vantage point of these things and he is james bond in this room and nothing is going to happen full survey he does he has full survey at all times i think that is that should be true for everybody you want to make sure that you're not going to get murdered first just like we heard learn about on Schitt's Creek, right?

7:45Yeah. Yeah. And so if you're watching on the screen, you can see Suze's sketch. Even in this sketch, you can see that he's not going to get murdered here in his office. He's got wall behind him. He's got wall to the side of him and he has sight on who's going to come through that set of French doors. If there's any other windows, he's got a vantage point. I do think that is somehow true. It sounds funny, but as you're surveying your room and you want to figure out how to arrange it, just make sure that you're not going to get murdered. Also, people don't want, nor do I, I don't want to walk into the mess.

8:15Yes. I want that to be as concealed as possible or whatever is the least desirable thing for me in that office. I don't want to see it. Yeah. So how do you put that behind me or put it in a corner or something that's disguised by something more beautiful? Yep. So in this case, it was actually interesting. He also wanted a TV in the space. And so we put that in the built-in that's directly across from his desk so he can see it. I don't have to see it. And we can do something beautiful over the fireplace. So we all get to see something beautiful. it's not the center of attention but he has a direct line to that tv that sits in front of him because of how we oriented the desk smart so yeah i thought it worked out really well other things in this that you can't see is that the built-ins have a solid base to store anything that's not as cute all the paperback books they are tagged and ripped up but then you do have upper storage above for all your pretty collection of books and things that you need boxes of supplies whatever that is I can see it in my mind.

9:07It's breathtaking. Here's a sketch for you to try and identify. This sketch made me think of this because it's with all the paneling and stuff and it feels very traditional and studious, I would say. If the office is for someone who's maybe has a more creative, are you going maybe less studious, more inspirational or adding some funky things in to make you feel like alive in the room? The creative juices are going to be flowing when you're in there, when you're designing a space. Does that play? Absolutely. And actually what you can't see in this maybe i'll get any renderings of it is we did a panel play on this and you can't see how creative there's some really artistic intersections and stuff happening so it's not stodgy traditional old man he's fresh he's young we want to make sure that his backdrop shows that and the color that we do to the rhythms that we do to the line work to the art that we will eventually do on all those layers so that will always play into the space for the level he's at kind of want finished work or something that feels like better than drywall but if it was for a creative wallpaper.

10:06Wallpaper is a really fun thing to do in a space like this, whether it's just a texture to feel enveloped or if it is more artistic print or it is always that thing when you are on camera, what is your backdrop? What are people seeing behind you? Because then what does it say about you? I think that is really important. And you're really artistic. We probably will play with color or do something really interesting in a big way that feels less ordinary, feels like an expression of them. I think that's a good point. What does your background say about you? Fake ones let's just can we just get rid of those everyone knows you're not into the blurred you know what i mean like yeah that's always driven me nuts but yeah we have a client in puerto rico and every time we pay his time i'm just like it's not a back joint it's actually if it's real more power to you you know what i mean yeah if i do say so myself so but yeah that's a great question one thing i will say before we get into the actual color of all these next images and offices we're going to show you is i can't remember when we heard it it was years ago and I believe it to be true, you believe it to be true, that when you are trying to focus your attention, it's not always the best idea to surround yourself in a bright white space where you see the contrast of every furniture piece.

11:12The world just escapes and there's no containment. Color, doing a dark color, it allows your mind to focus and allows your thoughts, your task at hand, to be contained. Really get it onto paper or your computer, whatever that is. Be able to finish projects. I swear finished projects happen more efficiently in a space that has saturation. So true. And hue. That's actually scientifically proven. Yeah. Yeah. Whether you're like trying to connect to the muse or whatever, write music, that type of thing. It's more often done in rooms that are enveloped in color. Specifically like dark, vibey ones, actually.

11:46That's why studios and control rooms always lights down. If it is dark and focused, you can be able to focus on the screen, focus on your print, whatever it is. And I'll say that for the ceiling too. having a deeper ceiling again just even that contrast line where the dark meets the light doing something up there just to hush it it'll allow you to your work to be I think better this next slide this is fun because this is our house of flora and we did a whole episode on house of flora if you haven't listened to it it's really great they're empty nesters and she had an extra guest bedroom and she wanted an office for herself created this space and what her asks functionally she's I want a desk where I can have my laptop out and I can actually get work done whatever that is whether it's paying bills doing actual work writing a love letter whatever it is she's on a desk i want a sofa and i want a little scene group so my husband can come in and talk to me if i want to have a tv bed i don't want to see it all the time how do i do that how do i sit in my sitting area watch the tv but just have it look like a really beautiful backdrop if i am on a call or something so enter this scene this is her office and you can see where the desk is vocal in the room it's sitting there it's floating and behind her what i think is the most brilliant thing is that we again have a built-in with closed storage on the bottom to hold all the riffraff, paperwork, files, things like that.

12:59But then up above, we did a really clever system where we have two open shelves on the left and the right. And in the center of that open cavity is where her TV is actually housed. We actually did sliding doors that can cover up the built-ins and expose the TV so she can watch it full view when she's sliding on her sofa, just right in front of the desk or she can close it and see her beautiful built-ins. It was a really great, I think, solve for all the things that she wanted. She wanted to see pictures of her grandbabies and have books and just beautiful display when people were coming over. But girl wanted to binge to watch some stuff.

13:34She can hide that TV behind closed doors. I think it just turned out so beautiful. So pretty. The overall feeling, she wanted it to feel put together and she wanted it to feel soft. This was like one of her favorite colors. She loves pink. She was very much an anthro of a girl. We went through her closet. The individual expression in the space you can call your own is the office. So very much felt like her and her. The key pieces for this were the desk, the sofa, and the built-in for storage. Love it. Anyway. You nailed it. I think storage is such a key part of the home office. And really we've done full walls of storage, able to lighten up the rest of the room.

14:10In her case, it was the lower half. So we'll be getting into just different examples of how you're going to gain that storage. If you're in a rental space or budget doesn't allow, some of these built-in pieces, we're always going to do an interior design, but we also have clients that are wanting to have a really custom look. Just know that you're going to be clever in how you're going to go about it, but storage is the main thing in making an office function and not having your desk constantly be full of everything. Yeah. Because it's just too much stuff to be able to focus. You want that to be behind you in drawers or in a wall or something where you can hide it all away to really be productive.

14:47Yeah. And I think that there are options out there, be it Ikea or whatever, if it's your budget, right? Remember my in-laws, they, in their previous home, they had a basement where she just needed to keep just a lot of storage. She just had books on books and books. And she found this one system, this tall piece from Ikea, and she bought eight of them and she just lined the house. It did the job and it felt like a system versus just one single bookcase on not really creating a scene or a backdrop. I'd rather see multiple of something sandwiched together to look the appearance of a built-in or something really thoughtful than just one.

15:19This is a fun one. This is the next project we're talking about. And this is from our Manchester house. And what was so fun about this is that she had a laundry room. She had a craft room for her kids, but she's, I need a spot. I can go and take a call. I have my laptop and I can pay my bills and it's small enough that no one else can go there it is my like my own it's full no room at the end and there was this pocket underneath the stairs sometimes people would utilize that for built-ins or things like that but we actually created this little office under the stairs with a glass door that can slide shut so when you pass by it's so cute because you have this little glass door but when you look inside we have full built-in where you do have a desk blotter and open space lots of closed storage for all the flim flam that gets put in mom's office every time and we wallpapered it we put a great chandelier it just felt so unexpected like when you walk by you're like what's in there am i invited in the two-person office space i thought this was a great use of space if you don't have a lot of space there's still opportunity to create a room for you an office or something that you can express yourself and you can get projects done i know it's not the beginning of the year but it's the beginning of a season and i'm like i want to get stuff done right now yeah and so i'm like this idea of an office i don't have an office right now because of my kids yeah but when they do eventually fly the nest i'm excited to create an office but these little pockets of space are should be utilized for something and be at an office i think it's a great idea chandelier underneath the stairs too it just feels so intentional it's cool yeah it's Harry Potter the best way.

16:57You know what I mean? That's what makes me think that little like cozy spot. This next one is actually a project that we haven't, we're in the middle of shooting right now over the summer. We're taking it floor by floor because there's so much to digest. But this was her office, the space to have an office for her and an office for her husband. And they both express each so beautifully. They're very much East Coast. I think that whole feeling of just feeling studious. And so the navies and the richer colors with the woods, I think is a big priority. as far as feeling and so what we did for the feeling is like just to try and dissolve that a little bit and not have so many lines we took a toile and we papered all those vaults so that this little hat lid again contain the excitement and the busyness of what you need to do in an office there's the lines on all the facets this is a space where she wanted to be able to have a tutor come in and work with her kids that are still at home and that it could be away from the noise and be in a more smaller space that will just allow them to focus and study.

17:57But there's a couple different areas to this room, which really accomplish so much. I think this office is a really hardworking room, even though this viewpoint that we're showing right now is just a really lovely shared desk with two chairs for a tutor and a student or for her to be able to sit down and process some online shopping or some returns or whatever she's got to focus on, do some emailing. Just like Jess said, you have this space with the built-in, which when you look in, the first thing in this space that you look into is not this vantage point. It is two really beautiful chairs sitting in front of a window, kind of calling you to come and have a conversation with mom.

18:33When you look to the left, then you have all the busyness of the built-ins happening behind you. So again, keeping that function behind you, sitting far left, and even in the pocket on the right, you see there's a whole built-in for her wrapping paper. And then we actually nested a walnut table within the cabinetry but we actually had our cabinet maker create a walnut table a waterfall table that's nested into the base cabinet that pulls out and then you can pull it for projects for sewing whatever it is you're working on yeah exactly and so it becomes again office is a space where you need your space to be smart in how you utilize your surfaces and so that was one way a really custom way that we were able to give her one additional surface to use in that space.

19:16So, but the overall feeling, I think, was also just, again, that nautical navy and the toile and the woven. She wanted to feel approachable. Her kids want to be there. She want to be there. I think we accomplished it. A clever way to utilize something, too. An office is a room of function, really, to start, like we've been talking about. So finding clever ways to do that, I think that just makes her more remarkable. Yeah, and inspiring. I've been thinking about that a lot lately. I'm like, I want to be inspired. where do I go to be inspired? And I don't know if it was someone that asked me that question.

19:48It was like one of those 50 questions that we go through with the kids and they're like, where do you go to be inspired? And I was just like, good question. I go to books. I go, I go to all these different avenues, but is there a space that I go and really do remarkable work that I'm excited about? And I think clever planning, just these little hidden Easter eggs function, make you feel smart. I solve for that. I'm going to solve for this next big thing in this next phase of my life. And if you can create a space that inspires you, high five. You've already have your backdrop. And if you haven't created that space, that's what we all should do.

20:19We should figure out what is our space that inspires us. And I think that goes along with something we talk about often on the podcast, but maybe don't dive too deep on is thoughtfulness. So really all of that work. And I think the clever design and the thoughtfulness of it is before the project is before you start. That's really the homework right there. And that's what's going to make the finish product room space whatever that much better the more time you can spend on that thoughtfulness kind of time before the project starts so whenever we talk about that being thoughtful it's really the prep done before the legwork of recognizing what you want in the space what we talked about the function feeling and the foundational pieces of it yeah and that can really relate to multiple rooms in the home.

21:07Oh, you guys, I love the spaces. Again, another project that we're capturing this summer. This is our chestnut row. This is our project in Boston. And we had two spaces, one for him and one for her. This is a more traditional office with a desk and things. She's, I want my office to actually just be a project room. I want a project room where I can just go and I can be happy and it can feel like me and I can have storage for all the things get put in my space and I can wrap a present I can go and work on a project I could have Rory and my daughter come and we could do a fun something together and so in this space again these are just cell phone shots from our install but what's so great about the space functionally you have a dining table it's floating space we don't we didn't have a ton of room we had a space enough for a dining table four chairs a little open bookcase for her to put all of her loves that she wanted to see but then we also had a closet that you can't see that's in the corner of the room that's filled with a closet system that has like all of her wrapping paper it has open shelving that's adjustable it has space for all the things that you just need to store that's not necessarily the cute things if you have a closet and a space put a system in there do some finish work to just throw up what you need to store what you need to get it out of public eye so you can be inspired to do the things you want to do to finish those projects so those were like the functions of the space as far as the feeling goes like wrap me in raspberry it's so pretty they were down to do high gloss paint and lacquer and just like it just feels like a candy coated shell it's so beautiful the walls and the ceiling are all done in this again this kind of like mauve raspberry color and you can see your reflection the light like even though it's not a big space because it's so shiny the light just like pierces against it and bounces all over the place and it's so much fun to be in there i can't imagine anybody like not being like a gravitational pull into this room and that's what we create for the home office right is we want this different feeling than the rest of the home so that it does signal to your brain i'm here to be creative yeah i'm here this is my time and i just love the feeling here and i love this for her yeah you want to know what you're gonna love this kori okay they collect original art there's not a print in the place they go to galleries they just have been collecting for a long time and she had this piece originally i think of over her bed it's a long linear piece that sits on this wall and we didn't know where we were going to put it and when we started to place the art at the install i was talking to her i'm like tell me about this piece and she's actually from a vegas artist and they actually take songs like artists and songs and they create like the rhythm and like the keys of the notes and everything in the song and that is what the art is so right now you're just seeing a bunch of lines but it's actually a song from the killers that's awesome in this space and she's i love the artist it's from my hometown and i want it in my space and i was like it should go in your office it's totally good and you put it in there and it's just it's not like we looked at the art to pull that paint color but like art does that paint colors do that especially when you have a myriad they start to just pull with chameleon wise pull from whatever's around it and it's just it's the perfect most like it's like ignition to the space and i just i love that's like your very first direct shot of that good reminder of home and then also it's artistic something she loves she looks at it and she knows what she says she hears the song i'm sure when she sees it so i just i love it cool this is my home i wanted to just point out really quick open storage closed storage obviously vantage points is the first image here where you come in you see the side of the desk but again i needed to be in the power position so i wouldn't get murdered or if i was about to get murdered, I could see them coming and I could hurry and choose.

24:47So my back is against the wall, which is my back goes to that wood Chinese chest that's in the middle of the room. And then I can see out the window, the French doors. And then there's a big open case that comes in from my entryway. And then you can see the home office there. I've had different things over the years. I've had some upright occasional chairs, which gave the room a more formal feeling. and I feel like I'm in my more laid back casual era. So I've got two of our cocoon chairs in there now, which is so fun to get in there and just lounge and really be comfortable, especially if Adam happens to be working at the desk.

25:22I don't have to sit upright in an occasional chair. So I just want to give you guys permission. If you have room, you don't have to do the upright chair. You can do like a dining size type chair. You can do something a little bit more lounge where you can hang out and spend some time. And then the open closed storage debate here, I solved, I had a ton of design books that I really wanted out. I think if you have books, you kind of want them out so that you can see the spines and you'd be like, oh, here in this book or borrow this or, oh, there's this great quote. You just, you always want to be able to see your books and books bind.

25:54So I have two really tall brass edigers in this room with holding all my design books and boxes. And then all of my closed storage is just behind the desk in this really large chest. And inside the chest is multiple shelves where I have thank you notes and printer paper and all of the things that you don't really want to look at. So anyway, that's how I solved the storage issue in my room. Because my edigers are open, I did want to do an art paper on the back wall so that your eye had something to read. But anyway, that's how I'm solving for storage. And Rowan, maybe this is something that you can do.

26:26Depending on how much of your stuff is good looking and you want to look at it, you can do open storage. Or if it's stuff that you don't want to look at, then maybe you need more closed storage that goes floor to ceiling. I think one of the ideals is one of the first offices we showed you where you have closed storage on the bottom, open on the upper. Because you always have beautiful things that you pick up on your travels that you want out and you want to be able to see. So anyway, you're going to want both in a space. And that's how I solved for it. Yeah, the feeling you nailed. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

26:57The Italian car. And the backdrop. I've had plenty of meetings with you and Adam, and I'm just like, yeah, the wall behind you is great. Oh, it's getting so hot lately. It's hard to sleep. I don't know about you, but I have nightmares when I get too hot. So I finally swapped my bedding for the Cozy Earth sheets. Good call. Why didn't I do that so much longer ago? They're amazing. They really are. They keep you great. I think that the science says they're like 40 % cooler than cotton. Oh my gosh. I know. And they're like, got this great hand. They're so slippery. I love how they feel. And I'm finally sleeping through the night again.

27:31Bless. And I think just overall summer, like as temperatures are rising, also in addition to your sheets, what becomes our everyday set that's going to keep us cool? Yes. Tom was complaining about that. And he actually finally just pulled the trigger and I bought the every wear pant and the everyday polo for him. He loves them. We're going to get him multiple pairs because they're light stretch, breathable, barely any wrinkles he loves them and this is going to be his summertime uniform because it's finally something that he can wear that looks good dressed down dressed up and will keep him cool all throughout the summer guys cozy earth stands behind everything they make they have a 100 night sleep trial on the sheets and a lifetime warranty on the clothing and hassle-free returns if anything isn't right summer should feel easy for everyone in the house cozy earth's bamboo sheet set, everywhere pant, and everyday polo are designed to keep him cool, comfortable, and actually relaxed all summer long.

28:27Dad lives here. Head to CozyEarth.com and use my code DearAlice for an exclusive 20 % off. That's code DearAlice for an exclusive 20 % off. And if you see a post-purchase survey, mention that you heard about CozyEarth right here. This is in our Lover's Lane project. And again, this is another space where we had an office for him and an office for her hers was this is where we like you the command center title she's i need my space i need a command center and so there were several functional things that she needed in here she's i need spots for at least two people to be working on computers however you space planet i have a lot of stuff to store i have wrapping paper i have reams of paper i printers i have all those things like for my office i need a store i she wanted a chaise she's i just want a chaise i can lay down while my kids are doing homework if they need to use the space and i can just like doom scroll or whatever you do and so that those were like the directives of the functionality of the space was like closed storage not open storage shay's desk we came up with such a pretty solution this is probably one of my favorite desks that we've ever designed it was out of a viola marble and we did this again a peninsula to instead of an actual desk centered in the space we did a full built in with an offshoot of like actual desk space and a peninsula where two people could park themselves with laptops opposite each other and it turned out so beautiful because it's not only sometimes the desk isn't always the prettiest you'll have a sitting area that's like your first shot of the house but or of that room but this I think is just centered right on the actual door system glass door system looking into the space and it's something you want to feature and as a parent I want to see what are my kids doing what's on their computer all those things and so visibility is beautiful the design is beautiful so functionally I think we get right on the nose or feeling though she likes she loved light and bright but she also loved interesting and so we kept the beltons and everything light we kept the walls actually in a beautiful paper that was like she's from Arizona so we did it just kind of a little bit more natural texture that she might feel more like reminder of her home state but then like she also just had a lot of like different little fashion points so we actually did a darker ceiling to again bring that hush give her some containment and then we did this like little pinstripe navy just to add a little like designer detail into the space on that hood and then we put that light in there that looks like the halo of the queen that she is feathers yeah it's basically beautiful that's the light that's sitting in the middle and it's massive.

30:57I want to say it's like four inches round and it just like floats like a halo. And I just love, especially at night. I'm like, I would do the daytime is beautiful, but nighttime study in here with that glowing is sensational against that dark color. If the light ceiling were light and the light would disappear, you would never get credit for it. But the fact that you gave us some like contrast is everything. It's so beautiful. Let me say this about home offices. It's the same thing as kitchens. You're really dealing with a lot of things that have straight lines. Desks, right? Your chairs, your office chairs are pretty square looking.

31:29There's just all of the built-ins and the rhythms of the drawers and books and everything else is really a lot of straight lines. What I love about this office is that whenever they could, they used this non-directional circular shape. The end of the desk is a semicircle. The sort of center piece below it, that pedestal, is a complete cylindrical shape. You've got this beautiful folded fan art that makes a circle. You've got a circular light. You've got circular shapes in the iron windows. We really brought in these soft shapes to keep your eye moving. Even the tub chair in the corner is a circular shape and just takes the edge off.

32:09Because whatever your office is, Rowan, at home, just do whatever you can to bring in soft shapes. because no matter what in office design, you're just always going to end up with a lot of straight lines. And it can start feeling a little bit rigid, so you're going to get a lot of credit for these softer shapes. Especially when you introduce tech, when you introduce desktops, computers. Things like that adds a real cold to a space. And so whatever you can do, again, to just form it up through shapes, I think is really smart. This is a really fun one. Rowan, you talked about your office being 9.5 by 9.5 wide, windows, doors.

32:43and I know a lot of people would think oh that's so small but I want to say this is even smaller than that this is an office that we did within the first I'd say five or six years of being open at Alice Lane so it was probably let's call it 2015 and this client was renting this space and had this little tiny moment in a historical old downtown apartment if you will and we painted the walls pink and we brought in that really big huge circular mirror this is probably 40 inches round at least and then we did a little writing desk is really all that the room could hold it couldn't even hold a proper full-on desk with drawers and then we did a little ottoman as a guest chair if you will there's no back so your eye can keep moving beyond it and then a really beautiful desk chair for her now this desk chair is a gorgeous dining chair so this isn't a space that is going to be that you need an eight hour sit chair this is just I'm going to perch and send a few emails at the end of the day or do some online shopping but you can really make any space in office we couldn't even we did a cow hide on the ground to bring some organic lines to this so that it wasn't yet another square in the space but this has forever been a favorite little moment I think all women love small spaces and to have it be so feminine in color I think the mirror with those is it capiche shells that make up this beautiful sort of they fan out and bring a lot of texture to the space and the light bounces a wall around the walls it's just gorgeous and that chandelier again when you're dealing with small space try not try to have colors that bounce off of each other and evolve to one another because even that light in the glass that's pink it takes on the form of what's happening on the walls even the capiche shells pick up on the pink and so there's nothing that's too hard of a contrast in this small space to feel like it's being like attacked Yeah.