DeepMind IRL, Vibe Filmmaking, and Miami's O Cinema Censorship Battle

0:00In this episode of the DeNoise podcast, we're going to take a look at Google DeepMind, Vive Filmmaking. And the battle Ocinema is facing against my hometown, the city of Miami Beach. Let's get into it.

0:13Welcome back. Welcome back. How was your weekend? Good weekend. Pretty chill. Yeah. You went up the Malibu Coast. Yeah. First time driving up the PCH-ish as much as we could since the fires. A lot of the roads still shut down. So kind of had to do a big loop zigzag to go around it. But yeah, it's one of my favorite drives. So it was nice to be back there. It's always beautiful. Let's see. First up, we got Google DeepMind and Gemini Flash 2.0. So tell me about Google DeepMind, what you've been seeing with it. Yeah, let's take a step back. Google DeepMind is a research arm of the massive company Google.

0:46Now, when it comes to AI, we always talk about open AI and perplexity and anthropic, but Google just doesn't enter the conversation in that top tier kind of way, at least not the way I perceive it. However, Having said that, DeepMind and the team there are doing incredible work. Okay, so what are you saying? So there's this video that just came out where they have a humanoid robot and then bits and bobs of robots like an arm or whatever, doing things in real time, responding to commands in real time. So like what? Like what do you, what are they doing? Yeah, so like you roll a green dice and it shows up as number five.

1:24And then there is a red dice next to it. And you tell the robot, hey, take that red dice and match it to the green dice. You know, like do it in real time. Of course, it's a little bit slow. You're telling it in just plain English. Natural language. And then you can kind of see the camera feed of the robot. So the magic to all of this, and I think the overarching engineering project is that taking any camera feed as input, as like our eyes, and using AGI, turning it into actual responses and commands for the robotic limbs and so on. So kind of this like bridging the gap between like a computer being able to understand the physical world.

2:06So if you go back to Google AI Studio, and then I think you covered Google Flash 2.0 as well, what it's doing is it's grabbing a screen grab from a computer and then using those RGB pixels as an input into a real-time inference system. This is like a general sense of that. So you would need something like Cosmos, what NVIDIA has, which is a world model. So it can decipher everything around you. Chair, table, coffee cup, laptop. you name it in real time figure out what it is and then have an understanding of what the user wants you to do overlay that and then turn it into commands for the robotic servos so it can move its arm accurately okay so is it kind of doing this but in a slow or most like move arm take picture figure out what's happening move arm take picture figure out what's happening a little bit like is that what's happening now it's like 10 frames per second right but the future point is like it can move this and sort of like our brain operates up like i'm moving my hand and I see my hands approaching my laptop screen.

3:07It's crazy. To close it. So like that's where we're heading. And I don't know if you run AI inference locally on your machine. I do. I do Comfy UI stuff all the time. That stuff takes minutes, maybe tens of minutes. I mean, real time inference on a general purpose system is crazy. I mean, imagine the gigabytes of stuff that it has to churn through. Yeah. So where else do you see this? Like what applications, Where else do you see this going with the DMIND applications? Great, great question. So obviously the immediate one that comes to mind is cars, autonomous cars. I think what's happening with Waymo.

3:45Yeah, I see them all the time. Yeah, like that's a very specialized system. And I think it's a little bit legacy because it's built on LIDARs and just like an older system. Whereas if you convert that over to a general AGI type system like Gemini, that could really open things up to put it on motorcycles, put it on planes, put it on anything and it'll work. Now, obviously something like Waymo with a car that needs to happen in real time. Not at 10 frames per second, like a hundred frames per second. There's no delay for waiting for the car to figure out, am I about to hit a pedestrian or car? And yeah, I think that's probably why when you talk about legacy systems, like, I mean, we need that in a car for now, for sure let's actually just go to cut to the chase if you will joey like in our lifetime we're gonna see humanoid robot servants that's fully capable of doing the dishes doing the laundry picking up the kids whatever that is where deep mind is heading and they're making pretty significant progress yeah yeah are you scared am i scared i mean i'm more excited about interesting about this yeah uh well the flip side of it is if it's so good at a general problem solve and robot dexterity and real-time problem solving what's stopping china from turning it into military bots with guns i mean yeah i feel like i've seen videos of not like bipedal robots but those dog looking robots that are kind of medicine looking yeah yeah t-1000 right like a humanoid yeah yeah which is also like that black mirror episode with the killer robots chasing people with guns like drone swarms, drone warfare, being able to just mass produce thousands of drones.

5:26Yeah, those drones would have to real-time inference on device, on the drone. And with the way compute is going now, and there is a shift towards GPU, away from GPU into TPUs, tensor processing units, which are more efficient at real-time inference, offline inference. and uh and they're smaller they're more like a chip and not a giant gpu so that's the world we're heading in yeah i'm more optimistic about the good stuff about this not not as uh excited about the uh crazy robot warfare i think we'll see both to be fair uh maybe more of the good stuff and a couple of the bad stuff i mean there's just gonna be a new arms race of like both sides developing like crazy robots and then it's like well we don't actually want to get into a fight and a stalemate or whatever happens if like just you just send swarms of robot armies after each other yeah and just to kind of uh recover robotics in general the robotic mechanical stuff like the motors the limbs the inverse kinematics to drive arms and like all the math that's old right that's been figured out like if you go to any disney park there's robots in there imagineers play with robots every day the new bit is the brain the general intelligence which unlocks everything being able to like actually understand the physical world yeah and without without running a crazy instruction set and then or pausing when you don't don't know what you're doing because it's not in the programming language or whatever right it has an understanding of the world doesn't need to have been programmed with everything it can figure it out yeah yeah yeah that's yeah that's the crazy part yeah and if it can learn from its mistakes like if it just gets better at picking up the dice every time and just becomes super proficient at uh hand-eye coordination if you will i mean the other interesting thing i've been seeing and this came out in a couple it seemed like disney imagineering did a creator push recently because i've seen two separate videos of like imagineer tours from two big youtube creators covering very similar Cleo Abrams had one.

7:29Cleo Abrams and Mark Rober had another one that just came out. And some of them covered some different stuff, but both kind of covered the Star Wars robots that they built that are - Autonomous. Sort of autonomous, I think. She was explaining, like, you control it, but you say, okay, get from point A to point B. Yeah. But it figures out how to get there and can go over obstacles. That's what I'm saying, because it has some level of general intelligence. But the training part was really interesting because they build virtual simulations of the robots in a physical world on the computer. And then in that environment, you're able to just train it thousands and thousands of times.

8:03They didn't get into speed, but I've always wondered that too, because you could also train them like time is relative in a computer. It doesn't need to be like a real time training. So you could amp up the speed that is running in a computer and have it run through. I don't know what the max speed is. I was curious about that. They didn't get into that. But like, how fast could you simulate time in a computer to have this robot? Oh, I see. Run through thousands of iterations. Like if you're saying, okay, I need a robot to walk around this room. And if you're doing that in real life, it'd be like, okay, well, the robot takes 60 seconds to walk around this room.

8:30So you can only do 60 trainings an hour, but a computer, you could run it at a faster training speed. I don't know how fast. So it was like, can you run thousands of simulations like in a minute, like the matrix? Yeah. Matrix style. That's crazy. I don't know what the, what the top speed is, but that's the advantage of like, you could run thousands of training simulations at a computer to like really amp up the speeding of mimicking the physical world. And then, so by the time you put it into your very expensive prototype robot, you're at least not starting from zero you have like this training data yeah from simulations that you can put into your robot and they do this for autonomous cars uh this is like four or five years back so before they i had i was interviewing for cruise the autonomous company competitor to waymo and they were looking for unreal engineers and unreal artists because they're building entire worlds in unreal so their cars can simulate yeah same thing yeah that's also what nvidia keeps picking up where they're just like, we're just vacuuming driving camera data.

9:23Yeah, because it's just cameras in the real world. Yeah, it's like you just keep sucking that up. Well, the one is interesting, because they could take all that image feed into Gaussian splits. So they can bypass much faster. Yeah, they can bypass game engines altogether and still have a 3d perception of the world. That's interesting. Yeah. So the other interesting thing that's come out of Google and ties into I believe it's they have so many projects or not, I'm assuming it's sort of as under DeepMind. It's definitely under Gemini, but it's Google Gemini Flash 2.0. And the thing that's been going around, it's available in the AI studio.

9:53It's basically conversational photo editing. That's like really good. And it just like understands it. Give me an example. So I've seen a lot of examples on X of just colorizing historic photos. You give it a black and white photo and he said, colorize this. And it just like colorizes it. That's probably very simple. But do you know how hard that is to do? I know to understand what the color should be. Yeah. And then go through a channel by channel. That's how they do it. So you go through just the red, just like an actual, like when they were restoring or trying to restore the colors. But even Wilder examples are, you know, upload a photo of yourself and kind of similar to the Pika Editions thing we were talking about a while ago, you know, a picture of us and it's like, oh, like add a robot in between us.

10:28And it just like takes the picture and then adds a robot here. I'm usually not a fan of like chat and text interfaces for creative work because it's like, doesn't understand. But in this case, it kind of seems like it does understand if you're like, put a cup of water in my right hand and it like just modifies that segment and like adds the cup of water. But what about precise control? Like, hey, can you put a logo on that cup of water this logo i think you could maybe upload another image but you're still going to hit that issue when you're talking yeah if i'm like okay i put my hand you know on the table versus higher up like it's still lacking that precise control but the fact that it's able to understand the natural language natural language and the physics end of what's in the image and recreate a new output yeah i think that's just like a thin ligament of what they're really after which is like general world recognition and inference and intelligence yeah and i think just more updates in the 3d space and in the physical world is like going to be a big thing for the rest of this year like is there a point where you're done or it's just always a work in progress with a photo with general intelligence i don't know i mean right that's like a philosophical question do you mean once it's like actually once agi actually exists does it start just like improving on itself is Is that like what H.I.

11:42should be doing? Like, okay, let's say we have a humanoid robot that could 100 % do what humans can do. Do you say like, I just I think we want to exceed humans at this point? I feel like if the H.I. truly exists, it would probably want to do that. Right. Actually, this dice rolling thing is dumb. I know the odds of this already. I'm just going to like build a rocket ship and go explore the universe. Yes. By piece. Exactly. All right. So next up, Vibe Filmmaking. Vibe Filmmaking. Tell me all about it. We're making this a thing now. This doesn't actually exist. This is an example or an experiment of going off of Vibe coding, which has been a thing that's been going around for like a month or so.

12:21And so Vibe coding is a style of coding using these new AI tools that we've mentioned in the past that are AI tools that are focused on coding, where they could just code for you using natural language. So like some of the big ones are Replit, Cursor, Bolt, I believe is another one. and you just kind of give it a text prompt like we were just talking about with Gemini. Yeah. But instead of making an image, it's making a program. Snippets of code. These go beyond that. It builds out the full code where you could run... IDE, Integrated Developers Environment. Something like that. Yeah, I think it's a full...

12:52If you're trying to code in Claude, it can kind of run some of the code, but it's not like a full-fledged... It's not compiling. It's not compiling. Compiler, yes. This is a full-on compiler. Yeah, these can do the compiling and it can build out the full application just from text prompts. Yeah, so instead of you typing, you just vibe right so the vibe idea is you're not getting as in the weeds with like actually like figuring out what the code's doing you're just like telling the ai like build me this you know app and then it creates it and then you start testing it and then you start kind of vibing it's like no that's not working like make it better and there's a bunch of memes about this but it's like you're just fix this error uh all the elite coders like even like a zuckerberg or Bill Gates or you know these guys that kind of built the world right they're probably like what the hell I mean I think there are bad sides to this and we've also talked about this before where it's like well if this is how you're learning to code and you don't have the basic understanding of coding exactly how are you going to know what's wrong with it when it doesn't work three or four versions later or maybe like 20 30 years later that chunk of code is completely understandable like who can go in there and service it because it's all like mumbled.

14:02That's just like pie. Yeah, it's not making documentation as it's going along. Yeah. But so for the sense of vibe coding, and so let's just go with the assumption that people are doing this for fun and not putting it into production. People probably are putting it into production, but let's just go with they're doing it for fun. And some of the attendance about or ideas behind this are rapid iteration, acceptance without full understanding, minimal code writing. So this is a path for doing this with code, but how could we do this with filmmaking? Oh, that sounds fun. Vibe filmmaking. making so first of all you don't need a camera or a budget anymore you can i would say the number one driver is just generative workflows uh text to image text to video image to video for me i would start with story concepts uh what i want to create how about you i was thinking i was determining this more as like a mood board exercise so not necessarily like i'm gonna vibe they'll make something that i'm gonna like publish so you go right to the generation yeah i'm thinking well because if it's vibe filmmaking i want to like start seeing visual stuff and assuming i'm like i maybe have some i'm not going after a specific story like i'm going at this from i don't have a specific script from like or a specific shot of mine where like i gotta like execute that because i would i feel like you have to be much more specific about that yeah more like you know let me make like a vibe pirate you know what's something that has like a pirate vibe or something that has like an ancient egypt vibe and then you generate some something with pirates you're like i think that should have more pirates in it or yeah or i could just go into this was like, I don't really have a specific output I'm looking for.

15:30I'm just going to try to go with the flow. That's my interpretation of vibe filmmaking. And I guess if you're creative enough, you can kind of you could take these paths. I feel like it would be a path where you want to kind of just see like, I don't know where the destination is gonna be. But I want to like explore that. And there's a couple of tools or techniques, I think that can lend itself to doing that to vibe filmmaking. Yeah, I think there's some things are out there that already exists that would be a good example for this. What? Okay, so my go to one when we were talking about this beforehand, that I think is really ideal for this is a Luma Dream Machine.

16:00Oh, never heard of it. So Luma... Luma, I know. I don't know what Dream Machine product. Dream Machine is just kind of what they call their generative platform. But it's, yeah, it's Luma AI. It's the same tools, but the Dream Machine was something they... Like super hallucination induced, maybe just more creative. It's what they call their platform. It's like, it's the platform name. But it's running their new array two models. They just redid their interface and they called it the Dream Machine, but it's running their current models and some of their older models and what they can do. But it has some features built into it that I haven't seen anyone else do.

16:33And I think it lends itself to vibe filmmaking. So one of them is you sort of start a project and you kind of like give it your first prompt, and then it'll give you the images. But then it'll turn some of the words into pillboxes with suggestions for like other words, so like other characters, other styles. And so you can just click on a pillbox. And then as soon as you click on it, it'll start making a new set of images. Oh, that's awesome. And then it'll start making a new set of images. Like every time you change an option, it just, it doesn't even ask for permission. It just starts generating more images.

17:01It's like generate your own adventure kind of thing. Yeah, so it really lends itself to, and it just, it doesn't even put it in a new chat box. It makes a horizontal scroll. So it's very much like, just keeps putting out a bunch of images. And then it has a brainstorm feature where it'll kind of take what you've done so far and then give you more ideas for like different styles of prompts or different directions you can take it in. I feel like if you gamify it enough, you could turn it into a pretty fun game yeah i mean this is probably the most gamey just kind of like really just explore an idea or see where it takes you environment free open world kind of a thing yeah they're definitely the most like here's some ideas and here's where it takes you there's a restyle feature you can combine a bunch of images to like turn into different styles so i feel like dream machine as a all-in-one platform without having to bring in other tools is like the best for for vibe yeah there you heard it here first on the oh yeah well yeah luma dream machine vibe filmmaking, you can take that idea of Lumetri machine and just credit us.

17:55Maybe if any of our listeners want to submit a film, we'll talk about it here on the pod. Yeah. A Vive filmmaking. Yeah, just tag us. Yeah. The other one that came to mind is Mid Journey, which I know you know about, but when you're doing prompts in Mid Journey, they have different settings. And so there are three settings that sort of became famous for if you want to just kind of take things off the rails and really explore. Okay. And the three settings are stylize, chaos, and weird. Oh, wow. That's awesome. Now it's easier because there's a slider in the web interface of Midjourney, but you used to have to know these specific codes and call them up.

18:31So Midjourney, to me, feels a little bit old school because they were one of the first. And so I haven't revisited them in a while. They're still, I think, one of the best image generators. And for stuff like this. So stylize is, it's a setting. So you can max out stylized to a thousand and it determines how much mid journey applies its artistic flair to the prompt. So if you crank that all the way up, it's going to take a lot of liberty and interpretation. Yeah. Chaos, you can crank that up to a hundred. And that is how similar, because when you prompt mid journey, it makes four images. Chaos is how similar these images should or should not be.

19:07So if you crank it up to a hundred, the images are going to be as different as possible. So you get a lot of variety. Yeah. I mean, learning more and more about diffusion models, like there is a dial called CFG. it's something configuration free guidance uh and uh basically it's just a dial of how autonomous you want the generation to be and how much you want it to stick to the text that you gave it yeah and a lot of newer or some of the tools have under the hood yeah they call it like a magic enhance or something it's basically taking your text prompt and then running it through another prompt to like expand the prompt yeah and before it actually sends it to the image like doubling up on the basically like as if you were to give your prompt to like chat gpt and be like, hey, I need to create an image prompt, like improve this prompt.

19:48And then it makes a much more descriptive prompt that works better with image generation. It's kind of doing that under the hood. So you don't know it. You put in like, yeah, I want a picture of a table. And I was like, well, that's kind of vague. So in the background, it's actually like enhancing that text prompt before it gives it to the image generators on some of these tools. Mid-journey, last one, weird. You can crank that all the way up to 3 ,000. And that is just how much originality or quirkiness it adds to the images. So if you crank these all the way up, stylize 1 ,000, chaos 100, weird 3 ,000, and you put in your prompt.

20:16That's a good way. I've done this before too, if I'm just sort of like trying to mood board or brainstorm and it's like, I don't really know what style I'm looking for. Let me just put some words in here and see what comes out. Yeah. And that's another good way to just kind of vibe generate. Another thing too, is you could also prompt with emojis, which is another thing you can try. And sometimes that gets you weird and interesting results. So that's just another hack for like providing. I mean, it's a way to communicate with, you know, like emojis you can say so much. just ask any any kid i will say one thing i think with this idea of vibe filmmaking the challenge is uh speed because you're vibing you're making you want to like get that real-time feedback but with the generative tools it's hard because you put your thing in and then you wait yeah and you wait uh luma runs pretty quick but a lot of other especially like a cling or something where it could take like 10 minutes to get a video output that's an impediment that's that's yeah you lose your vibe the room's a vibe yeah i mean like just i i guess i'm so i'm so old school because i am so structured driven and uh sequence and shot driven that i can't i can't buy filmmaking i like the way you're you're dude you are the future this is too much of a too vibing so i can't i can't vibe enough there's no uh structure around the the creation well the one tool that i think could work with the real-time issue is a crea have you messed with crea a little bit yeah so they have a real-time generative feature it's lower res but it could take webcam and they could take a webcam they could take you could just start drawing shapes and then be like oh i need this to be like an alleyway and it's like and it's as you move it in real time it starts generating the image leonardo does that too oh yeah yeah yeah so those two would be really good for for this too because you can like actually see it in real time yeah it's funny side story with crea when i was filming the ai on the lot last year they did uh Cinema Synthetica filmmaking competition.

22:10Yes. With a couple of teams. And so I was filming the behind the scenes documentary for the whole thing. And one of the teams is doing a zombie film and they were trying to do like a webcam hooked up to Craya and turned it into zombies. And for whatever reason, it would keep making the female zombies topless. It's like negative prompt, negative prompt, not working. And yeah, we're never quite sure why. Okay. Okay. Interesting. seen like images of just topless like zombies yeah like where's the training with your more structured list vibey approach how would you uh how would you i don't know try to bring more vibe into your uh creative process yeah so first of all having an idea in your head of look i want to do a bank heist movie like um what's that famous michael mann movie heat yes yeah so i want to do heat uh but i want it to be set in the caribbean with the island vibe i don't know something like that okay like cayenne island heat okay so you know this what what would be the next what would be the tool you hit up so do i want to replicate all of the main characters like a robert de niro and da da da da or do i want a new set of characters so stories are always character driven so i would want to define and round up primary character secondary cast all that so that's my structure and then in each act what do i want to introduce what do i want to fill out and then how do i want the movie to end does it go into a sequel all those things are we're still in chat gpt land i think or some kind of natural language land yeah clod or chat gpt or something.

23:52So then I would actually finish out a whole script and then take that script, feed it into a shot generator, a type sequence generator. And then I would use the Vive filmmaking tools knowing exactly what shot I'm making. You know, I think one of the tools we talked about in the past, the newer ones, Flora. Yeah. Could work well with that because that one of their examples was like, took a script, looked at the shots, figured out what the shots were, turned it into a prompt. Turn that into an image. Yes. And it was like kind of like a way to do a first draft of like a storyboard. So my vibe filmmaking would be problem solving at a shot level, which is way easier to me than just freestyle vibing.

24:36Okay. Yeah. So you're like structure, step one, still structured. Step two. Yeah. I want the main character to walk into this beautiful Cayman Island bank and I want there to be a giant palm tree because you're in Cayman Islands. and the main character is wearing a Hawaiian shirt and I want the white shirt. Like very specific things. And then I want to vibe on those needs. Okay, okay. Yeah. But I feel like, I mean, you got to vibe, but then you got to lock it in because then you want that consistency, right? So like you need to like, that's why I was like thinking like, this feels like a brainstorming, mood boarding kind of process.

25:11But I mean, if you structure it and vibe it and finish a 90 minute thing, then you go get your funding using that thing. Yeah. Make a real movie. Right. Maybe you have a script and you're like, all right, I need to take my script, turn it into a visual vibe to convey what I'm trying to go after. Like you talked about a while ago with the Matrix. Yes. Because the Wachowskis did it 26 times or something insane. Yeah. They just couldn't convey to the people like what the vibe of the Matrix was supposed to be like. If they had vibe filmmaking back then. They just let the robots make the vibe film about the film about the robots.

25:42How ironic. Yeah. What else would you want to see in vibe filmmaking to, I don't know. To make it more productive? Yeah. To make this like more productive for brainstorming. Like where do you think the gaps are like i think i'm the wrong person to ask because no i mean look i am a type of filmmaker or what whatever name you associate with that i think vibe filmmaking and the way you create stories is it should be unstructured and non-linear and for a new generation of filmmakers so like i can't think of how to make a proper film with vibe filmmaking tools because I'm not that person, but I respect the person that picks up these tools and does something amazing with it.

26:21Partly, I think, yeah, it'll be interesting to see where things go in the future or with like, you know, new generation of filmmakers where like, this is sort of the baseline of what they learn on. Yeah. And then other part of me is like, maybe they'll dabble with this. And then maybe as things mature, they'll realize that the structure and process that has already been established sticks around for a reason. Well, that's the thing. Like we've been making movies for over a hundred years and the way movies are made with pre-production, production posts like it's there for a reason yeah like i'll do things even on youtube stuff where it's like well we'll shoot and you know we'll just kind of edit it down and then it's like i was like we just would have saved so much time if we like had scripted some stuff out some more just like at least have an outline yeah before going in it's like oh right you know that's why that's why we do this that's why i did this yeah to like save time in the long run yeah but i i if you can beat it you know go for it yeah right i mean and maybe that you know at least some people the process works differently or they're better with other processes and so it's like having more options too that could ultimately lead to uh we have such a good problem process the filmmakers of today have such a good problem on their hands which is we have too much tools yeah they have too many things to do the same thing with yeah it's a good problem to have yeah it's a good problem all right and next story something that kills the vibe uh so yeah all right so this one this one's personal this one's my hometown of miami beach there's controversy with O Cinema.

27:39So O Cinema is the local art house movie theater. Currently, their location is in the city of Miami Beach. They were going to do a screening of No Other Land, the Oscar winning best documentary, which kind of focused on the Palestine-Israeli conflict. And the mayor, Stephen Minor of Miami Beach, asked them to not screen it and said that it was biased. And initially, they were going to comply. And then they realized like, no, you know, freedom of speech is the point to play this film. Yeah. So they went forward with it. And then now Stephen Biner wants to, basically he wants to - Shut the movie theater down.

28:10Yeah. So from background, the theater is on, it's in a city owned building. So they leased it from the city. And they also received some funding from the city. So now he wants to cancel the lease and evict them. Do you know what his public reason is for that? Like what did he say vocally about it, the mayor? He called the film antisemitic and inconsistent with Miami Beach's values. Oh, interesting. Is it? Is the film antisemitic? I mean, I have not seen the film, so I cannot make that call. I mean, as far, like, from what I know and from what I saw from winning Best Documentary, it was made by both a Palestinian and Israeli.

28:45Oh, so it's an award-winning film. This one, Best Picture. This one's Best Documentary. At the Oscars? At the Oscars. We didn't cover it in the Oscars episode. So, look, if a movie is Oscar-winning, it's certainly balancing out both sides of the story. I feel like no matter what, that validates, agree with it or not, it validates that it is important important like to show media and like yeah that it is not that is can't classify it as propaganda yes maybe you disagree with it maybe you know you could voice your opinion against it defamation of the jewish people like he's saying it is i mean that's not i mean that's not what i've heard i mean i can't i have not seen this film also i mean this film does not have distribution no one wanted to touch this film for like reasons similar to this where it's just such a hot topic and like it's important controversy yeah and it's like stuff like this is happening where i mean it's such a slippery slope right it's like the minute you start to penalize movies for being a vehicle of free speech like at that point any movie is fair game look i mean you he's more than welcome to like voice his uh you know opinion against it totally obviously yeah fine please voice your opinion against it but to then you know if you don't get your way to try to retaliate by shutting down a movie theater right which also they play they host the jewish the might be jewish film festival like every year there's like no i mean i don't want to get this debate of like how supportive of the jewish community are they i mean i mean it's a it's it's a slippery slope and ridiculous argument to like then also retaliate have your opinion fine but then to retaliate try to kick them out also just some backstory so like oh cinema it was uh co-created by uh my good friend of mine kareem taps and uh vivian martell and they initially started in Wynwood, which is a area turned into an arts district across in the city of Miami.

30:29It's the cool part of town? It is the cool part of town now, but O's Cinema and Panther Coffee were single, dual-handedly responsible for like turning Wynwood into like what it is today. They were the first, like Wynwood was 10, 15 years ago. Wynwood was just like a rundown warehouse district that had like some art studios, but there was like no vibrance. Oh, it's kind of like the arts district in downtown here. Yeah, similar to that. We're just like now it's the grungy warehouse. Yeah. Now it is like Ducati dealerships and like parents with baby strollers. Yeah. Now you have Michelin star restaurants there.

30:59Yeah. I mean, it got so crazy where the Wynwood Walls, which was like a famous place where like they had a bunch of Wall Street art. They started charging admission to go into that. Yeah. It's turned into like Disneyland. Come on. Like this was like a pretty kind of sketchy bullet casings on the floor area like 10, 15 years ago. And Panther Coffee came in, had a coffee shop there. and then O Cinema was around the corner and they were like, they gave you reasons to go there. Yeah. Outside. Does that help turn and establish the like cultural art scene? I would also say like without, sort of indirectly without O Cinema, Moonlight.

31:32The movie. Yeah, which was shot in Miami, Barrett Jenkins shot in there. Another Oscar winner. Another Oscar winner. That like, I would say that also like would not have existed. Wow. Indirectly. I can't remember trying to like. That's cool. It's just like they brought the independent film scene and like made it worthwhile in Miami. So like hugely culturally important. Okay. Has done a lot for the culture of Miami. So, and the independent, let me ask you this, this, like you're from there. Uh, is this mayor like problematic just in general? I didn't know anything about him until this thing came up.

32:03Okay. So, so no, I've not heard anything else, but I mean, I haven't been involved in the like day-to-day action of Miami beach. Yeah. Look, I'm just glad that, um, like, this is not something that's going under, uh, underreported. no and now this is making like international news like now like i first saw this in like my local like you know facebook feed and like miami herald yeah now it's like the guardian the new york times npr npr yeah yeah it is i mean it's just kind of it's it's not like because i'm trying to think okay what would be the line of like oh a propaganda film and like something that like maybe someone has a right to say like no you can't play this and if it's an actual defamation of the jewish people then i get it like yeah yeah and and and that there's no i don't know who produced it or Or like, I'm trying to think, how would you like draw the line between like, you know, a piece of media that is accurate, but maybe you disagree with or straight up propaganda with like, you know, like inaccurate facts or like warping facts.