In short
Actor David Morrissey’s Desert Island Discs choices and stories, focused on how his upbringing, masculinity themes in acting, and personal struggles (anxiety, sobriety) shaped his work and identity.
Guest background
Born 1964 in Liverpool; youngest of four; grew up in a crowded back-to-back house. Father Joe was a cobbler/key cutter/engraver who became ill and died when David was 15. He found refuge and belonging at Everyman Youth Theatre, later trained at RADA after Channel 4’s One Summer. He’s sober for 21 years.
Key claims
Perfectionism blocks creativity; “real creativity is in the mess.” He does meticulous research (e.g., Gordon Brown’s public/private split). Insecurity and caring keep him driven. Sobriety helped him realize authenticity can include joy, not just pain.
Notable examples
Roles include The Walking Dead, The Deal (Gordon Brown), Gone, Daddy Issues, and Sherwood. He describes trauma-linked fear around doors/keys, and using work as safety. Discs include “You’ll Never Walk Alone,” Beatles “She’s Leaving Home,” Bernstein’s On the Waterfront, Joni Mitchell “River,” Keith Jarrett “Cologne,” The Real Thing “You to Me Are Everything,” Ronnie Lane “Debris,” and Daniel Johnston “True Love Will Find You in the End.”
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOPerfectionism in Acting
1:52 to 2:52
David discusses his views on perfectionism and creativity in acting.
“So despite your focus on acting from such an early age, you say that you're not a perfectionist.”
Researching Characters: Gordon Brown
2:52 to 4:26
David shares his meticulous research process for portraying Gordon Brown.
“Well, I don't know whether it's the deepest, but when I did Gordon Brown, I was surprised that people from MI5 weren't arresting me outside his house in Scotland and stuff.”
The Role of Music in Acting
4:26 to 5:36
David explains how music influences his acting and character preparation.
“And then Edinburgh University and all that stuff.”
Childhood Memories in Liverpool
5:36 to 7:02
David reflects on his early family life and memories growing up in Liverpool.
“Well, disc number one is the one tune that's always been on my list.”
Family Dynamics and Early Influences
7:02 to 9:58
Discussion about David's family, especially his mother and her influence on him.
“What are your memories of early family life?”
Connection Through Music and Stories
9:58 to 11:41
David shares a significant childhood memory related to music and storytelling with his mother.
“People would light up when they saw her.”
Understanding His Father's Life
11:41 to 13:16
David talks about his father's work and the impact of his illness on the family.
“The first conversation I remember having, which was other than, you know, What's For Tea and Have You Seen This Thing On The Telly, was about this song.”
Dealing with Loss and Family Resilience
13:16 to 14:00
David reflects on the impact of his father's death and family dynamics following the loss.
“He worked in a, it was a heel bar, so it was like he made the shoes, but he would do engraving and he'd do key cutting.”
Navigating Childhood Grief
14:00 to 17:21
David reflects on the impact of his father's illness and death on his family dynamics and personal growth.
“But when he got ill, I sort of, I feel like I lost him a bit.”
The Influence of Theatre
17:21 to 19:35
He describes how the Everyman Theatre became a refuge and a source of identity for him during challenging times.
“David, I think this is a good moment to go to the music.”
Show all 24 chapters
Finding his Passion for Acting
19:35 to 24:00
David shares pivotal moments that solidified his desire to act and the emotional connections that drove him.
“performed by the New York Philharmonic Orchestra, conducted by Leonard Bernstein.”
Early Career and Independence
24:00 to 28:00
He discusses leaving home at 16, his early career in theatre, and the challenges of finding independence.
“Those men who were important in my life, there was another guy called Albert Byron, and he taught me about film and books and music as well, different types of music.”
Struggles with Alcoholism
28:00 to 29:16
David discusses his journey with alcoholism and recovery.
“And, you know, I am a recovering alcoholic.”
Finding Safety in Work
29:16 to 31:26
David reflects on his work as a refuge during his struggles.
“How do you feel looking back at you when you were that age?”
Unfinished Business with His Father
31:26 to 32:58
David shares his complex feelings about his relationship with his father.
“And then I had a bit of money in my pocket.”
Early Career Breakthrough
32:58 to 35:38
David recounts his early acting career and the challenges of fame.
“that I never had an adult relationship with him.”
Reflecting on Insecurity
35:38 to 37:42
He discusses the insecurities that accompany his career and how he copes.
“Sometimes it's just as well not to talk about things, isn't it?”
Health and Commitment to Roles
37:42 to 40:02
David talks about pushing through health issues for his acting roles.
“You know, I have to be, something needs to be at stake.”
Authenticity in Acting
40:02 to 42:00
He explores the evolution of his understanding of authenticity in his work.
“I was in A &E for hours and the nurse said to me, it's wind, just go home.”
Finding Joy in Authenticity
42:00 to 42:50
David shares insights on finding joy and authenticity in life and work.
“And then I suddenly, through sobriety and stuff, I suddenly realized that you can be authentic and have fun.”
Imagining Life on a Desert Island
42:50 to 45:28
David discusses his thoughts on isolation and what life would be like on a desert island.
“So one of the things I really need to do on the island, obviously, is dance.”
Books and Music for the Journey
45:28 to 48:02
David reflects on the books he would take and his love for music that inspires hope.
“So this is an artist who I knew his music and loved it and then I saw a documentary about him which really I found very, very moving.”
A Personal Luxury Item
48:02 to 49:05
David reveals his desire for a photo album and journaling supplies as his luxury item.
“And what is it that you love about Dickens?”
Final Thoughts and Thank You
49:05 to 49:37
David shares the song he would save and reflects on his time in the interview.
“would you save from the waves first if you had to?”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00Hello, I'm Lauren Laverne and this is the Desert Island Discs podcast from BBC Radio 4. Every week I ask my guests to choose the eight tracks, book and luxury, that they'd want to take with them if they were cast away to a desert island. For rights reasons, the music's shorter than on the original broadcast, but you can find a version with longer music tracks on BBC Sounds. Listeners will also get access to episodes 28 days earlier than everyone else. I hope you enjoy listening.
0:44My cast away this week is the actor David Morrissey. For over 40 years, he's been a welcome presence on our screens, playing everything from a ruthless survivor of the zombie apocalypse in The Walking Dead to former Prime Minister Gordon Brown in The Deal. He starred in stories set everywhere from Britannia's Roman Empire to James Graham's Sherwood. If there is a common thread in his work, it may be an examination of masculinity. His characters are often men struggling to maintain the facade they present to the world as they wrestle with inner turmoil. Whether it's a buttoned-up headmaster in recent murder mystery Gone or hapless grandfather-to-be Malcolm in the BBC comedy Daddy Issues.
1:25He was born in Liverpool, a city that he says took the arts seriously. The famous Everyman Theatre's youth programme embraced him during a tumultuous time in his teenage years. And from then on, he declared his intention to become an actor to anyone who would listen. He says, I did what you're not supposed to do and put all my eggs in one basket. But I looked after that basket. David Morrissey, welcome to Desert Island Discs. Thank you very much. It's a real pleasure to be here. Delighted to have you, David. So despite your focus on acting from such an early age, you say that you're not a perfectionist.
2:00No, I'm very mistrustful of perfectionism. I mean, I think sometimes it means that you don't get started. But, you know, I take my work seriously and I want people to bring everything to it and work hard and be researched and all that. But I find that the real creativity is in the mess, really. And the more you try to control that mess, the less sort of magical it can be, you know. I used to get really hung up on an audience's reaction, both good and bad. You know, if I got a laugh one night, I'd chase that laugh the next night until it sort of died, really. But it really freed me up not to care too much about where it lands.
2:42It's what do I want to do? Where's the story going? What do I want to do with this character? You're known for your meticulous preparation. You can go quite deep down a rabbit hole, I think. I can. What's the deepest you've ever gone? Well, I don't know whether it's the deepest, but when I did Gordon Brown, I was surprised that people from MI5 weren't arresting me outside his house in Scotland and stuff. I did do a lot of research into him. I never met him, but I met a lot of people who knew him. And it was very obvious for me from early on that there was two people. There was the public person who was very accessible.
3:15I could find him. But that private person, he kept very guarded. So how do you get into someone like that? So I get really nosy, really. So I'll pick up a phone, I'll talk to people that might be peripheral to the characters or in that job. And usually people want to talk. You know, when you meet people, if they're teachers or policemen, they want to tell you their story. You know, what helps me when I'm doing the job is when I've looked in the eyes of a policeman who's been through some of the circumstances that my characters are doing or a teacher or whatever. and then I hold that responsibility all the way through the job.
3:52And music's a part of the process for you too, I think. Well, music is a part of it for many reasons. One, I always do a playlist for the character. I actually do two playlists. So I do a playlist for the music that I think that character would listen to. OK, so say for Gordon Brown, what's that? Well, Gordon Brown was a lot of Scottish folk stuff, really, and sort of traditional sort of Scottish music. Whether he listens to that or not, there was something very traditional about him, I felt. There was something steeped in that sort of country. It was about the sort of the shipyards and the countryside and all that.
4:25You know, he was a union man from that place. And then Edinburgh University and all that stuff. So it was very much about Scotland in that playlist. And then the other playlist I do is a mood playlist. Because when I'm on a film set, everyone's got to go to work. You know, you've got to have the electricians have got to do the work. props, people, everyone. But I've got to be on set and I can't shut them up all the time because they're working. So I put my earpods in and I'll listen to mood music for the particular scene. Sometimes it can be a banger because I need to have a lot of energy. Sometimes it can be something that pulls on the heartstrings a bit more.
5:02And it keeps me in a moment whilst everybody else is working. So, yeah, I tend to just lock out with music as well. Well, that's handy. Perfect for today. What does that mean about putting your discs together? Music's obviously important to you. Has it been difficult? Oh, it's been, Laura, it's been awful. It's been absolutely awful. It's been torturous. I mean, I had a playlist of four and a half hours long at one point. I thought, I wonder if they'll go with that. And I'm still very nervous about what's coming at you. Well, I think on that note, we should get started. Let's just get into it.
5:36Disc number one, please. Well, disc number one is the one tune that's always been on my list. Even before you invited me on the show, I always thought, I wonder what would be on my Desert Island discs. And this track has always been on it. It'll come as no surprise to people, growing up in Liverpool and also being a Liverpool supporter. I've sang this song all over Europe. I've sang it standing next to my brother and next to my son and next to, you know, 80 ,000 other people. If you don't get football, you don't get it. But for me, it's a really, really important part of my life. and when I stand up in the Anfield singing this song or anywhere across Europe, it really means a lot to me.
6:16So this is Gerry and the Pacemakers with You'll Never Walk Alone. Walk on, walk on With hope in your heart And you'll never walk I walk
6:45You'll never walk Alone Gerry and the Pacemakers and You'll Never Walk Alone. So, David Morrissey, let's go back to the beginning. In Liverpool, you were born there in 1964, the youngest of four children to Jo and Joan. What are your memories of early family life? I was born in the house that my grandmother had been married in. I have a photograph on the wall of her wedding day, which is taken in the yard that I grew up in. And it was a classic sort of back-to-back sort of house, really, with an outside toilet and a tin bath. And there were seven of us in there. Oh, blimey, so who's the seven?
7:26So the seven was my mum and dad, my grandmother and the four kids. OK. We were all on top of each other, really. My mum and dad had the front room where their telly was. My grand then had the next room. And then there was the kitchen that we all, you know, did everything in, really. And then upstairs there was three bedrooms. And I shared with my mum and dad for a bit before I went in with my brothers. But my sister shared with my grandmother for a long time, you know. But those houses were condemned even when I was sort of born, really. So we were waiting for them to be knocked down. Our street, which was Selden Street, was one of the last to go.
8:00So there was just this waste ground of rubble. I mean, those clearances were very common all over the country in that period. I saw a photo of you, five years old, I think five or six, about to make your first Holy Communion in your suit and everything with your mum outside the house. What comes to mind for you when you see that picture? I have mixed feelings about it, really, but in retrospect. My brothers were much older than me and my sister was six years older than me. They were off doing their stuff, really. The church was a big thing. You know, my first Holy Communion was a big thing. I went to a Catholic school.
8:37We left when I was eight, and we went to a new estate in Notty Ash. It was like a new housing, a straight-brass. Did it feel like luxury? It did at first, but what happened was my dad got ill very quickly when we were there. I think it might have been our first Christmas there, and I was sitting on the sofa, and he was on the chair watching TV and then he suddenly got up and went into the hallway and I heard this horrible noise. And I went out and his ulcer had burst. So he was lying on the hall floor and just like blood coming out of him. And my mom rushed down, she had hold of him and she was trying to hold him on the phone to the ambulance.
9:21And I just froze really and watched it and it was really, you know, I can still see it now. And my dad survived. He was in hospital. We went to visit him in hospital. But that started a series then of him being ill and fragile and slightly distant. I was really close to my mum and I never really, from then on, I was frightened of that. I was frightened of what I saw really and that it could happen again. And he was very ill then until he died when I was 15. So you said you were very close to your mum. Tell me a little bit more about her. I want to come to your dad, but start with your mum Joan first.
9:58What kind of person was she? Oh, she was really sociable, my mum. People would light up when they saw her. She was an Avon lady, which was, like, really important. She worked in Littlewood's catalogue. That was one of her jobs, but her other job was being an Avon lady. She was brilliant at it because she was so sociable and she would have these Avon parties. So she'd have people round and get the products out and everything. Doing all that with the little catalogs, makeup, you know, makeup. We had moon wind talc and soap on a rope and all that in the house. It was just great. Smelt amazing. And then these big boxes of makeup and products would arrive and she'd have to divvy them up for different customers.
10:39I'd help her with that. And that was one of my favorite things was these big boxes arriving and then putting them in piles for different people. And I saw the world through her, really. You know, one of the things that she did, my mum, was she would parent in her absence through catastrophising stuff. So she was very much about the bogeyman and stuff like that. She was very much about telling me stories she'd read in the Echo, in the Liverpool Echo, about some boy who got killed crossing the road. She wanted you to be careful. So she wanted me to be careful, and she instilled that into me so much that I was quite anxious about the world, quite frightened of it.
11:17But that's how she did it, really. and also the evidence in front of me with my dad as well was that the world was quite unsafe. Not a safe place, yeah. But yeah, I mean, I adored her and she was very, you know, unlike my dad, she saw my success and really shared in that and yeah, I was very proud that she got to see my work. David, let's have some music. I think it's time for your second choice today. What's it going to be? So this is all about my mum. The first conversation I remember having, which was other than, you know, What's For Tea and Have You Seen This Thing On The Telly, was about this song.
11:53It was on the radio, and it's a story, and it's sort of, it's a complicated story. It's a multi-character story. And I remember saying to my mum, gosh, that's really sad, isn't it? And we had this discussion, the first time we had this empathetic discussion about other people and other people's lives and what it's like being a child, what it's like being a parent. and I knew when I was having this conversation something different was happening. A connection was happening, another world was opening up to me. A sense of just what the story brings but also talking about story itself and how story can move us and open up things to us and it was a really powerful moment to me.
12:34So it's the Beatles, She's Leaving Home. She, we gave her most of our lives is leaving, sacrificed most of our lives. We gave her everything money could buy. She's leaving home after living alone for so many years.
13:06The Beatles and She's Leaving Home. So, David Morrissey, tell me a bit more about your dad, Joe, I mean, before he got ill, what was life like for him? What did he do for work? Oh, he was a cobbler, really. He worked in a, it was a heel bar, so it was like he made the shoes, but he would do engraving and he'd do key cutting. I've always been slightly embarrassed by my hands because his hands were workers' hands, ingrained with leather and glue and stuff. And him and my mum met in Timpson's. She was on the shop floor and he was down below doing all the repairing and stuff. And, yeah, they caught it and got it together.
13:41and my earlier memories of him in the house was that, you know, he worked hard. He was someone, he had his own shop. He worked for a company called Mr. Minutes, but it was his shop, him and his mates ran it and it was just around the corner from where the cavern was and around there in Liverpool. I mean, he was just a really great guy, I think. He had a lot of friends and stuff. But when he got ill, I sort of, I feel like I lost him a bit. He was so fragile from then on. I mean, it sounds like it was traumatic for him to go through that experience and to not know what was happening to him. It must have been terrifying.
14:17Exactly. And then the insecurity then of, you know, your health and what that means to you. But then financially, what does it mean to you as a family? How are you going to carry on? And my mum and dad, they didn't talk about the things to me. People just didn't. You know, when my dad died, the funeral happened. So you were 15? Yeah, and after that, you know, my brother, I remember my brother coming home the day my dad died and gave me a hug and stuff. But quite quickly afterwards, we were all supposed to go back to sort of life as normal. I remember seeing my mom through the front window coming towards the house with these shopping bags.
14:56And I'd go, oh, who's that old woman, you know? And it was my mom, and she looked drained of everything, of any vitality. and I suddenly realised that that's what it meant, that she was carrying this real grief and sorrow. But as soon as she came through the door, I didn't mention it, I didn't say you're all right or anything like that. We just carried on, where's my tea sort of stuff. And I really regret that. I was able to speak to her later in life. But, you know, Dad was very... What did she say when you did speak to her? You know, she was very stoic about it. The day my dad died, that night I went to the Everyman for a drama session.
15:35I don't think I told anybody in the session. I just got on with it. And at the day of his funeral, I went to the drama session because that was sort of, it rescued me. Going to the Everyman Youth Theatre, I suddenly found my tribe. I found people who were vibrant. They were experimental. They lacked embarrassment. They lacked all that stuff of don't talk about it. The stuff that was going on at home and at school where people were very private and held and sort of caged, they had none of that. And I suddenly went, oh, I want this. The first thing I ever did, I did two shows. I did a nativity play when I was about, probably about eight.
16:17And it was a different sort of nativity play where I played an old man coming down the aisle of the church and my mom saw me. And afterwards I remember her saying, God, I didn't know it was you. You're so great. I thought it was an old man. And that look in her face, I thought, oh, I want that. And then I did The Scarecrow in Wizard of Oz. And I remember getting on stage and the audience laughed and I thought, oh, I want this. You know, I wasn't a footballer. I wasn't academic. When I heard that audience react to something I'd done, I thought, yes, please, I'll have that. And then I went searching for that.
16:49And I got it at the Everyman. And the main theatre was full of actors like Tracy Allman, Jim Broadbent, people like that. and Anton Lesser, who I remember going up to and badgering him and saying, I want to be an actor, I want to be an actor, can you help me? And he did, he took me seriously. People like Pete Potterswick, they took me seriously. None of the actors in the main company ever told me to go away. They all sat down and said, well, what are you doing about it? Do you know about drama school? Do you know about the stage newspaper? They all took me seriously and wanted me to succeed, wanted to help me.
17:21They passed on what they knew. David, I think this is a good moment to go to the music. What's your third disc? This is Leonard Bernstein with the soundtrack to On the Waterfront. And why are you taking that to the island? So this is all about my dad as well. So, you know, it was quite an odd relationship with my dad. There wasn't a lot of chat. He had his chair. He sat in his chair. As I said, he was quite often quite frail. And I'd sit on the sofa. And one night, we must have been watching something quite late. And the announcer came on and said, next is this movie. And my dad said, oh, this is a great movie, this, this is great.
17:59And he got up off his chair and he came and sat next to me. And I was amazed. I was like, oh, great, great, we're going to watch a movie. And the music started. And my mum came into the front room and she said, what's this? And my dad told her, she said, oh, he's too young to watch that. So I had to go to bed. And this music was playing, as I was going to say. And I was really upset for many reasons. But years later, I saw the film. She was probably right, to be honest. but when I saw the film I thought God I wish I'd shared this moment with my dad that was it
18:44¶¶
19:12¶¶
19:31Part of Bernstein's Symphonic Suite and the soundtrack to On the Waterfront, performed by the New York Philharmonic Orchestra, conducted by Leonard Bernstein. So, David Morrissey, your dad's illness cast a long shadow over your childhood. You talked about how it affected him, obviously, and your mum. What about you? Was there a sense that you had to be careful, that you were walking on eggshells around your dad a bit? Yeah, very much in the house that did feel, for me, you know that you'd come home from school and mum would shush me sometimes because you know dad was having a sleep or whatever I've always had a fear of the key of the door not so much hearing it from inside the house but actually getting it out of my own pocket and putting it in the lock of thinking what's behind that door what am I going to find when I go in will everything be okay or has something happened?
20:24What's the atmosphere like? And I had that for years, actually, but it stemmed from that time. It's interesting that when you say that key in the door thing, so in that case, you have to kind of find your refuge outside the home then. You know, you've talked very fondly about the Everyman Theatre, but also about Liverpool, you know, as a place. You said growing up in Liverpool, you felt you were at the centre of the universe. So where did you go when you needed to feel happy, to feel free? The Everyman had a bar underneath it called The Bistro. And you'd be in there and sort of, you know, Echo and the Bunnymen would be sitting in the corner or, you know, Teardrop Explodes would walk in or Pete Wiley would come in and stuff.
21:06And then you'd see them on top of the Pops on a Thursday night, you know. And then, you know, just down the road was Manchester and that scene was happening. So you did feel that you were at the centre of the universe. The Beatles at that time were slightly uncool. but knowing that they'd walked down the very streets that you were walking down and they'd achieved world fame it did give this kudos to the city and you as a member of the city and then the football on top of that. David, you know, listening to you talk, despite everything that you were dealing with at home you sound like such a motivated, engaged young man.
21:39You're interested in everything, working really hard, you're on the board of this theatre. It's making me wonder how you got on at school. You know, was that potential and that engagement embraced there and spotted? No, not at all. I got good friends at school. I was head boy at my school, which was weird. But it was a secondary modern. They didn't do any drama, so I had to go and find the drama myself. It was very much like the school in Kez. It was chaotic. You were not encouraged as a young lad in my school to put your hand up and answer a question in the class. That would guarantee you'd get your head kicked in in the schoolyard.
22:14afterwards. It was quite oppressive. I made good friends there. I really did and I have them today but I did feel cheated out of that. And for you, do you remember when you started telling people, I want to be an actor, I'm going to be an actor? Because I think you were quite intentional about it. I was. I was very intentional. I knew there was two things. Cares was a big film for me but I also saw an episode of Cold It with Michael Bryant where he pretends to go mad in order to escape. And that troubled me. It really upset me. I identified with him, his character, his situation. And that sort of thing that bubbled up inside me, I wanted to find out how to control that or understand it.
23:03And therefore I went looking for acting. I went looking for a way out. And when I walked into the door of the everyman, I found it. I found these people who were having fun, but experimenting. And it was about emotion. It was unashamedly about feelings. And I've spoken to a couple of actors of my generation about that episode, and they all remember it. They all remember it. And he was, you know, he was someone who pretended to go mad so that the Germans would have to let him go. And he succeeds in that. And then just at the end, the British commander comes in and reads this letter from his wife saying, We're sorry he's in an institution now, but thanks for looking after him.
23:45And he'd driven himself mad by trying to go mad to escape. And that broke my heart. I mean, it was just wild.
23:55Yeah, emotional just remembering it. David, let's take a minute and go to the music, shall we? Yeah. Those men who were important in my life, there was another guy called Albert Byron, and he taught me about film and books and music as well, different types of music. And he would take me to the corner house to see Tarkovsky's Mirror and all those stuff and it was a real education and I owe him so much. I remember going round to his house once and he played me this and it was like a revelation and I bought the album and then I've taken it with me everywhere and it's Keith Jarrett's clone concert.
Read the full transcript
24:40Thank you.
25:14piano plays softly
25:35Keith Jarrett, the beginning of the Cologne concert from 1975. David Morrissey, you left school and you left home at 16. and got a job, I think, with the Zip Theatre Company based in Wolverhampton. What did your role entail? At that time, Thatcher had brought in this thing called Youth Opportunity Programmes, YOPs, and they were basically to take people off the dole. You got paid£23.50, I think, but if you left your hometown, you got paid£28. And a couple of my mates had found this, it was called Volunteers in Another City or something like that, and a couple of my mates just decided to apply for it.
26:16And I applied for it, and it was this theatre company, Zip. And we got there, and they were great. It was four drama students from Birmingham who got together, formed their own company. We did a little bit of acting, but really what we did was we made the set, we made the costumes, we'd tour with them. They toured all these Midlands sort of venues. What kind of shows? Well, the panto was the big thing. Oh, yeah. Yeah, we did Mother Goose. The main actor in it was the guy who ran the company called John Lingard Lane, and he was like Mother Goose. and he wasn't going to let you get anywhere near a gang.
26:50And he was brilliant. And we would do a children's sort of party in the morning, maybe like a school in the afternoon. But in the evening, we'd do these working men's clubs. And the show, you can imagine, changed during the day. Rather more blue. By the end, it was like, yeah, it was a revelation to see it. But he was amazing. And I was there for six months. I was away from home. That was difficult. I found that very difficult. That must have been tough for your mum as well, because that's what, a year after your dad died? Yeah, it was. I just knew I wanted to get out. I had to be on my own. Part of the thing for me, with my dad's illness and all that stuff, was that I was left in no doubt that it was up to me.
27:34Whatever was going to happen, it wasn't going to happen for my parents or anything like that. I had to make it work. And I knew that academically I was never going to be able to go to university or anything like that. That was never going to happen to me. So I had to make it happen somewhere else. It was hard for my mum, but I knew I had to cut the strings and find independence. You know, they say that that hyper-independence is a trauma response. I do tend to cut off sometimes. And, you know, I am a recovering alcoholic. I was someone who has been sober now for 21 years. And that was all part of that, being in trauma.
28:14and not knowing how to stop, being sort of in a depressive state and sort of just, you know, needing to be on my own. Drinking first was about anxiety. It was about I've had this terrible social anxiety, and that helped me get through it. And does that go back to your teens then? Yeah, it really does. And Liverpool is a party city. You know, you would have been abnormal not to drink, you know. But then I got, later on in my life, in my adult life, I couldn't stop and I wasn't drinking to be convivial and I wasn't drinking to sort of get through the anxiety I was just I was on my own in the pub you know and that was really hard and very hard for my ex-wife and um and people around me I worked with a guy on a job he gave me his number on the job and I knew he was in AA and then two years later I was in a terrible terrible state and I phoned him quite late like early in the morning time and he came around to my house and just sat with me and that was i've not drank since that day really so it's been tough i mean the other thing for me is when i stopped drinking i didn't stop being an alcoholic my behavior was still very self-destructive for many years when you look back at yourself now as that as that young lad leaving home leaving school and moving to a new town at 16 it's interesting because you know you describe the sense with your anxious you know about the world and also socially anxious and isolating yourself, but really brave.
29:42How brave to do that? How do you feel looking back at you when you were that age? Now I feel I was in crisis a little bit, but the thing that rescued me was work. And so that's why I've always had this weird thing with work, is that's where I feel safe. There's a great Barry Humphreys quote where he's sort of on tour as Day Med now and he's doing all these different functions and stuff. and then at the end of his busy day, he walks out on stage as Dame Edna in front of 5 ,000 people and his immediate thought is, alone at last. And I can relate to that. When I'm in work, I feel safe. I feel I know, not necessarily in control, but I feel it's where I should be.
30:28In my life, I'm less confident around that. And I do, I'm always looking for an exit strategy. In what, in life? In every situation, yeah, even now. Even now, your door's behind you. Yeah, it's that type of thing. You're not going anywhere. I'm much better nowadays, but for a long time I was really telling myself I wasn't enough and all that stuff, and that added to the sort of, the alcoholism really, and the inability to stop. So as a teenager, work-wise, things took off for you pretty quickly. You were only 18 when you got your first big break. You were cast in the Channel 4 drama One Summer.
31:09It was much talked about, very well reviewed, and I think gave you your first taste of fame, really. How did it feel to be recognised? It felt great at first and then got very strange. I was actually 17 because I had my 18th birthday on it. And I, you know, you do it. And then I had a bit of money in my pocket. So I went travelling, I went to Africa and stuff. And then I was sitting in Nairobi in this hotel having a coffee or something. And there was a guy in front of me with a newspaper and he turned it round. It was the Times and there was a picture of me on the paper. So I went over and asked him if I could borrow it.
31:46And it was a review for the first episode. It had come out and I didn't know. So I thought, well, I better get home. So I got home. I got to Euston and people were looking at me. And I was like, this is very weird. This is odd. And then I got on the train and people were always looking, still looking at me. And then I got a cab to my mum's and the cab driver was like all over the place. He was like, oh my God, they have me watching you and all that. Instead of taking me home, he took me to his house first to introduce me to... To show you off? Yeah, to introduce me to his brother, I think it was.
32:15And I was like, hello, you know, can I get home now? And then I got home and my mum was like, the phone's not stopped ringing, David. My God. David, let's have some more music, I think. What's disc number five? I realise that there's unfinished business with me and my dad, and it will never be finished, really. There's a search for me about that relationship. And I know that because every now and again it hijacks me, it catches me up. What kind of moments? Well, sometimes when I'm watching TV or reading a book or like this, when I hear this song, even now with my own son and my grandson, I can see what it's like to be a father and have a connection and stuff like that.
32:57And I do, you know, I do miss the fact that I never had an adult relationship with him. But this song is about this man's relationship with his father and he's a real hero of mine, Ronnie Lane, Debris. I left you on the debris
33:20At the Sunday morning market
33:27You was looking through the odds and ends You was looking for a bargain
33:40I heard your footsteps... Ronnie Lane and Debrie. David, after the success of One Summer, you got your equity card and you moved to London, where you went to RADA. How did you get on there? Did you feel like you fitted in? But the first person who came up to Mitrador and sort of said they'd seen one summer and they were really friendly was Ralph Fiennes. And, you know, I'd never met anyone like Ralph Fiennes. I didn't, you know, that was only seeing people like that on the telly. You know, he spoke very posh and he was such a, and he is such a lovely man and was very friendly. And then I saw then amongst my fellow students that it was a real mixture of people.
34:20There was people like me, but there was people who'd been to public school and Oxford and Cambridge and all that. They were all meeting in the same place and it was a meritocracy. It was very much about what you did. Nobody was asking me what my A-levels were. And that was a real freedom for me. So you found your feet at RADA and were successful in your course. Your first play after you left was called... It was called WCPC. Yes. And it was back at the Liverpool Playhouse. 1986. and so I had to I think you're laughing because your auntie and your mum came to see it so I had to in this place it was about policemen cottaging in toilets and I was this young recruit and there was a bit where one policeman sort of assaults me in a toilet and then the next bit was I had to sort of dress up as Liza Minnelli from Cabaret and do a little song and then at the end I had to strip off and dance around with the other actors singing YMCA.
35:21And, yeah, my mum and my auntie Pat came to see it and I was dreading it. What did they think? So I met my mum afterwards and the first thing she said to me was she said, have you been eaten properly? And that was it. I thanked her so much for that because it was, like, really embarrassing. Sometimes it's just as well not to talk about things, isn't it? It was. But the other favourite thing was when I stripped off, the head of the police force had to say to me, I still have my underpants on, and he had to say, and the underpants, their police issue. And then I take them off and keep my hands in a certain place.
35:53But then one night he was just about to say it and three guys in the audience said it. And the underpants, their police issue. And that was it from then on. People used to shout out the audience. So that was quite weird. But yeah, it was going back to Liverpool and doing that play at the Playhouse, which was, you know, the posh theatre as far as I was concerned. That was really great. And I had a great time doing that. And then I was off and running, really. You know, it was not long after that, I went to the RSC and had a wonderful time. You've worked very consistently since the beginning, but I think never really felt secure.
36:28Like you've never been able to relax into thinking, oh, you know, this is me. I'm fine now. You once said, there's something I must love about the insecurity I profess to hate, which sounds like you sound like you know yourself pretty well. Have you figured out what it is? Well, there's something about, yeah, that it could all stop tomorrow, which it's those eggs in the basket thing, is that you treat it seriously. I don't take it for granted. You know, there's great actors I've worked with and it has suddenly stopped for them, you know, or something has changed and they don't get the work they want anymore.
37:03So I try to, I try to keep my head where my feet are and sort of enjoy the day, enjoy it right now. it's quite interesting though because being asked to be on this show was the first time in my life where I thought oh maybe I've done maybe I've done something worth doing it was like that thing of suddenly going you never guess what I'm on Desert Island Discs that's amazing whereas everybody else is going of course he is there was some sort of knighthood going on there but I must like the insecurity and the other thing about that is then taking ownership of it that actually you're playing it it's not playing you and that's what's really important for me is that I have to start from the point of view where I go I chose this and it's fun and it's buzzy and it's risky you know there's no the other thing I came to learn is that I I'm I'm pleased when I'm nervous because I care you know if I if there's nothing at risk why why I do it.
38:06You know, I have to be, something needs to be at stake. You know, you can chase that. That can be addictive in a way that you're trying to sort of get this feeling of this frisson of excitement that you could, you know, you could fall flat on your face. David, let's make some time for the music. It's your sixth choice today. What are we going to hear next? My brothers and sister, they would have big record collections, you know, and this record I'd see. in my brother's room, I'd see in my sister's room, I'd see in my cousins would play it. One of my cousins is a musician and he would play stuff off this album.
38:43I bought it in cassette, I bought it on album, I bought it on CD, I've downloaded it, all those things. It stayed with me all my life. The album is Blue by Joni Mitchell and this track is River. Why have you gone for River specifically? It's just something that breaks my heart. I love it. I love the sentiment of it. I think the way she's sort of, the The lyricism of it is just like all of her stuff. But it's the one that sticks in my mind most. I wish I had a river I could skate away on I wish I had a river so long I would teach my feet to fly
39:32Oh, I wish I had a river I could skate away on Joni Mitchell and River. David Morrissey, you've always been committed to whatever part you've played. I read that when you were cast as a policeman in Clubland, you actually insisted on returning to work after being operated on for a burst appendix. When you look back on that now, Do you ever think you were a bit too all in and that you could have looked after your health a bit more? I went to the hospital. I was in A &E for hours and the nurse said to me, it's wind, just go home. Okay, went home and then I was in agony and I phoned an ambulance and they took me in and it was an emergency operation appendix.
40:15And I woke up and the writer was sitting at the bedside and he said, it's okay, we've cast someone else. And if someone else, I knew it was a friend of mine. So I got in touch with him. He came to see me and I said, no, I'll be fine. I'll be fine. Don't worry. and I literally, I have to sit down in the first two scenes. It's just an interview scene. I'll be fine. I'll be fine. And I went and I did it with my stitches in and I wasn't going to lose that job. So things like that, I have pushed myself, but there's two things there, isn't there? There's pushing yourself and then there's the consequences of the people around you with you pushing yourself.
40:47I have done jobs that's taken me away from home that have meant that I'm absent rather than be where arguably I should have been. And so that's been a trade-off that sometimes I regret. You have also said that, you know, things have changed in recent years for you because you've started finding the authenticity that you were looking for in roles in different places. And in comedy, you know, being able to do something like Daddy Issues for the BBC, which has been a big success for you. It's really interesting that, because talking about Michael Bryan before and stuff, I wanted to be an actor, and the thing I wanted to be was I wanted to be authentic.
41:26And for me, what that was, was authenticity was always in the bad stuff. It was always in the gutter. It was always in pain. It was always in stress and broken hearts and stuff like that. It could never be in joy or love. It couldn't be frivolous. That was not authentic for me. And so I spent years pursuing this authenticness, which was banging my head against a brick wall and being miserable, basically. I felt that that's where it was. You know, someone like De Niro banging his head against the cell wall, that was acting. And then I suddenly, through sobriety and stuff, I suddenly realized that you can be authentic and have fun.
42:06You can have joy, you can have love, you can have connection. That's just as authentic as anything else. And I got confused in that. And so when Daddy Issues came along, I was able to have fun still go to work to not work any less you know it was still hard work to do and but actually have joy in doing the job itself making people laugh you know I see it now when the edit sometimes I can see that they've had to cut away from me and Amy Leward just before we crack up you know because we crack up all the time so comedy has been part of my life but for such a long time as a young actor, I felt that you could only get truth through misery and pain.
42:49Let's have some more music, David. It's your penultimate disc today. What are we going to hear? So one of the things I really need to do on the island, obviously, is dance. I mean, I love dancing. I mean, I love dad dancing, obviously, but granddad dancing now. You know, all those bands we were talking about before in Liverpool with the Echo and the Bunny Man and Teardrop Explodes, I was thinking of those things. But there was another band around that I was just, I couldn't believe we're from Liverpool when someone told me. I saw them on top of the bops and I thought they were from Philadelphia or something.
43:19They were just grey. And then I saw them around town and stuff. And this is the real thing. You to me are everything. I would take the stars out of the sky for you Stop the rain from falling if you ask me to I'd do anything for you Your wish is my command I could move a mountain When your hand is in my hand Words could not express how much you mean to me There must be some other way to make you see The Real Thing and You to Me are everything. I think Chris Amour, who is the lead singer of The Real Thing, holds the record as the only person to have a number one hit and win Crofts. That is a strong, strong trophy cabinet right there.
44:14That's it. Do you know what breed he won? Yeah, it was an Afghan hound, I think. He might have won it twice. An Afghan hound looks like the real thing, Sound. Perfect. Perfect. So, David Morrissey, it is almost time to cast you away on the desert island. I read that you travel so much that you actually keep a bag packed at home, ready to go. I have a set of drawers, actually, which have my sort of travel stuff in. Yeah, so if I need to go, if I need to go quickly, I have that stuff there. Okay, so I think you'll adapt quite quickly to life as a castaway. How do you feel about it? How do you think you'll get on?
44:48Isolation's never been a problem for me. I'm sort of excited about it. I do think, oh, yes, that would be great to have a bit of time. But I know that I will miss people and I'll miss life. It'll have to be, I'll certainly miss work, but I'll miss people as well. So I don't think I'll get on that well. I'm not that practical. You know, I'm not DIY a mirror stranger. You know, I'm not able to do things like that. So that's going to be tough. But I think I'll love it for a bit. And then I think I might just have a little crush. What kind of island are you hoping for? What are you imagining? Oh, sun and sand.
45:25Yeah, sun and sand with a freshwater sort of lake, which has loads of fish in it. And then, you know, all that stuff, just sort of fruit around the place, maybe some veg already growing there that type of stuff and a Sainsbury's you know things like that It sounds like you've thought about it already it sounds like you've started your research I have been thinking about it yeah but yeah definitely sun and sand yeah that's what I want Alright well you're about to find out we'll let you have one more disc before we send you away David what's it going to be? So this is an artist who I knew his music and loved it and then I saw a documentary about him which really I found very, very moving.
46:07He's someone who's struggled with, you know, he's no longer with us but struggled with mental health crisis in his life. The documentary shows his family dealing with that, particularly his mum and dad who are so amazing with him. But his work, both his songwriting and his artwork, he's quite an interesting artist as well. I really am drawn to. But there's a simplicity about his work which obviously isn't simple. It's just the way that he encapsulates a mood and a feeling. It feels rudimentary, but actually there's something so open, raw and honest about him. The film is called The Devil and Daniel Johnston, which is amazing.
46:52And this is his track, which I think is such a track of hope, but also of action. You have to be active for this to happen. And it is true love will find you in the end. True love will find you in the end.
47:11You'll find out just who was your friend.
47:20Don't be sad, I know you will.
47:27But don't give up until... Daniel Johnston and true love will find you in the end. So, David Morrissey, I'm going to cast you away to your desert island. I'll give you the books. Of course, you can have the Bible, the complete works of Shakespeare and one other book. What's that going to be? Well, yeah, it's such a hard one, this. I mean, the book I come back to a lot is The Power and the Glory by Graham Greene. But I think just for the size of time I have, the amount of time I have, I think I will take the complete works of Charles Dickens. Okay. And what is it that you love about Dickens? I like the fact that he's funny.
48:06I mean, I do like that, you know, his humour is amazing. But I also like his humanity. And I also like the fact that his stories, you just fall into them. And there's a lot I haven't read, so I'll be looking forward to that. You can also have a luxury item. What would you like? So I don't know whether you're going to give me this. Oh, let's find out. So what I'd really like is, it's a bit of a combination, but it's a photograph album, a massive photograph album with pictures of people who have meant things in my life, my family, you know, my mum and dad, all that, and friends and colleagues. But I'd also like a lot of blank pages at the end and a never-ending pen because one of the things I do all the time is journal.
48:47I've been journaling since I was about 14 and I find that process of doing that is really therapeutic for me and wonderful. I get it all out and I do it all the time. I've got notepads everywhere. So I'd like to do that. Well, I think that would be a lovely luxury, of course. It's yours. And finally, which track of the eight that we've heard today would you save from the waves first if you had to? It would be The Beatles. It would be She's Leaving Home, just for me and my dear mum. David Morrissey, thank you very much for letting us hear your Desert Island Discs. It's been a pleasure.
49:32Hello. It was lovely chatting to David and I hope he's very happy on the island with his photo album and blank pages. There are more than 2 ,000 programmes in our archive that you can listen to. We've cast many other actors away over the years, including Stephen Graham and Michael Sheen. You'll also find Monica Dolan and Leslie Manville, David's fellow actors in the TV series Sherwood, along with its creator, writer James Graham, who's in the archive too. You can hear their programmes if you search through BBC Sounds or on our own Desert Island Discs website. The studio manager for today's programme was Sarah Hockley, the executive production coordinator was Susie Roilance, the assistant producer was Christine Pavlovsky and the producer was Sarah Taylor.
50:11Join me next time when my guest will be the North America correspondent for BBC News, Gary O'Donoghue.
50:39I'm Noel Titheridge and for BBC Radio 4 from Shadow World, this is Impulsive. What happens when someone's personality changes completely? It was completely out of character. Never done it before, never done it since. And it's because of a prescription drug. I asked myself, why would you do such a thing? What were you thinking? I've been uncovering the shocking side effects linked to medications called dopamine agonists. For BBC Radio 4, from Shadow World, this is Impulsive. Subscribe to Shadow World Impulsive now on BBC Sounds.
51:24Thank you.
From the publisher
David Morrissey is an actor who grew up in Liverpool.
His screen work ranges from playing a ruthless survivor of the zombie apocalypse in The Walking Dead to a troubled police officer in James Graham’s Sherwood.
His television debut performance came playing a teenager in the Channel 4 series One Summer. Since then his career has seen him win awards including the Royal Television Society award for Best Male Actor for his role as Gordon Brown in The Deal.
Morrissey’s interest in acting started in primary school, when he was cast as the Scarecrow in a production of The Wizard of Oz. As a teenager, he developed his passion further at the Everyman Youth Theatre in Liverpool, where he took guidance from professional actors.
After his first TV role, he went on to train at RADA. He is best known for portraying complex and troubled characters, and in more recent years has also demonstrated a flair for comedy in series such as Daddy Issues.
David lives in London.
Presenter Lauren Laverne Producer Sarah Taylor
Desert Island Discs has cast other actors away over the years including David’s fellow actors in Sherwood, Monica Dolan and Lesley Manville. The writer, James Graham is in there too. You can hear their programmes if you search through BBC Sounds or our own Desert Island Discs website.
