In short
The episode debates whether hustle culture is a trap for Black entrepreneurs versus a necessary survival strategy. One guest references a Time article and Instagram commentary arguing hustle is “cruel optimism,” glorifying capitalism that can’t secure most people’s futures, creating exhaustion and a “race to nowhere.” The other guest counters that hustling is unavoidable when pay is commission-based (they describe working as a financial advisor) and that hustle builds ingrained habits, dignity, and control. They claim “there’s no blueprint,” scaling requires systems/teams, and “growth hacks/click funnels” don’t replace real work. They cite examples like Tyler Perry and 50 Cent, and discuss rising costs (e.g., housing price increases, daycare costs) and the idea that discouraging hustling keeps people employees.
Guests
Ernest (host) and a financial-advisor/entrepreneur guest (commission-based background).
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOExploring Hustle Culture
2:17 to 4:09
Discussion about the implications of hustle culture and its impact on black entrepreneurs.
“So I saw a clip on Instagram I thought was interesting.”
The Need for Hustle
4:09 to 6:06
Exploration of the necessity of hustle in today's economy and personal experiences with it.
“So I have some pointed opinions on that, but do you have opinions?”
Dilemmas of Hustle vs. Employment
6:06 to 8:07
Discussion on the challenges of choosing between hustle culture and traditional employment.
“When I started working as a financial advisor, I didn't work for a Wall Street firm.”
Life as a Game: The Hustle Perspective
8:07 to 10:39
A philosophical look at life and hustle as a game, highlighting the importance of ambition.
“So I had to kind of figure it out to be successful.”
Barriers to Entrepreneurship
10:39 to 14:01
Discussion on societal barriers to entrepreneurship and the narratives surrounding them.
“are going to make it to the last level and beat the game.”
The Necessity of Hustle in America
14:01 to 15:43
Explore why entrepreneurship is vital in America and the implications of discouraging hustle culture.
“That's going to have to happen, especially in the beginning stages.”
The Flaws in Critiquing Hustle Culture
15:44 to 16:51
Discuss the skewed narratives around hustle culture and why they're often targeted towards marginalized communities.
“Because they know if they will get the power and community and finance together, there could be some changes.”
Realities of Parenting and Hustle
16:52 to 19:25
Understand the financial realities of raising children in a hustling culture and the burdens it entails.
“2025, there's going to be real conversations.”
Choosing the Right Path in Business
19:26 to 21:45
Learn about the importance of making informed decisions in entrepreneurship to avoid stress.
“And the players who play in the league don't give a fuck about fantasy football like that.”
Navigating Modern Financial Challenges
21:46 to 22:56
Explore the impending economic shifts and the necessity of proactive financial management.
“Only people talking Drake and Kendrick and Drake being more quiet.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human Dell PCs with Intel inside are built for the moments that matter. Built for the busy days that turn into all-night study sessions. The moment you're working from a cafe and realize every outlet's taken. Yeah, the times you're deep in your flow and the absolute last thing you need is an auto-update throwing off your momentum. That's why Dell builds tech that adapts to the way you actually work. Built with a long-lasting battery so you're not scrambling for the closest outlet. and built-in intelligence that makes updates around your schedule, not in the middle of it.
0:34Find technology built for the way you work at dell.com slash dellpcs. Built for you.
0:44Ernest, what's up? Look, if you've been sitting on a business idea, a side hustle, or a brand you wanted to launch, this is your sign to finally make it happen. Wix Harmony lets you create an entire website just by telling it what you want. Literally, you type it and it builds a site for you with business features already included. And the best part, you still have full control to edit everything yourself. It's fast, it's smart, and it makes building a website way easier than people think. Try it today at Wix.com slash Harmony. That's Wix.com slash Harmony.
1:18During Memorial Day at Lowe's, shop household must-haves for less. Save$80 on a Charbroil Performance Series 4-Burner Grill to chef up something special. Plus, get up to 45 % off select major appliances to keep things fresh. Our best lineup is here at Lowe's. Lowe's. We help. You save. Valid through 527. While supplies last. Selection varies by location. See lowes.com for details. Visit your nearby Lowe's on South Loop 288 in Denton. Amazon Health AI presents Painful Thoughts. Why did I search the internet for answers to my cold sore problem? Now I'm stuck down a rabbit hole filled with images of alarmingly graphic sores in various stages of ooze.
2:03I can clear my search history, but I can never unsee that. Don't go down the rabbit hole. Amazon Health AI gets you the right care fast. Healthcare just got less painful. Let's talk about this hustle culture. So I saw a clip on Instagram I thought was interesting. Let's play this clip, please. Hustle culture and cruel optimism. It leads to a lot of crazy things for black folks like exhaustion. Here's an article from The Time. It says that the hustle is an idea, a discourse and a survival strategy often glorified as economic opportunity. It is an ode to a type of capitalism that cannot secure the futures of anyone but the wealthiest.
2:43But his popularity lies and now hustling can feel like an equal opportunity struggle. Okay, in that clip, and shout out to that brother. He does a lot of political different takes. So he pretty much was saying that, you know, what I've been hearing a lot as far as on Instagram, social media, that also culture is a trap to keep people unhappy. You're never really going to really reach the level of wealth that a lot of times out of 10 that you're really going. So it's just the treadmill that we've brought into to kind of feel like we're running a race to nowhere type thing and the traps of capitalism.
3:32and it's really only designed for the top 1 % to get wealthy and all of that. So I saw that and like I said, I saw other people kind of like, you know, I've been seeing this a lot. That theory. It triggered you? I wouldn't say...
3:54We got to get through it. We're going to get through it. Teamwork. I wouldn't say that it triggered me, but it was something that I think was worth talking about from a different perspective. Stoicism in the answer. I love it. For sure, for sure. So I have some pointed opinions on that, but do you have opinions? Of course.
4:23On the positive side, let's sandwich the situation. On a positive side, But well, let's take the negative first. I understand what they're saying by the connotation that you need balance. You do need rest. You do have to make time for family and friends. But in every society, it takes capital to make reality come true. I think one of the biggest things is not talked about is like you have to put individual hustle into a system or business that allows you to scale. Now if I'm on canal street selling fake ferragamo bags, probably not the best business But the idea that you can just like lay on the beach everything's automated uh click funnel funnel hack Growth hack your way to it does not work.
5:10How many people have you met at invest fest robert smith? um Barack obama Who should have been there, right? None of these people are talking about growth hacking. They're doing the work every day Tyler Perry, 50 cent Yes, you have systems, you have teams But I think The bigger issue, I think a lot of people Are giving up on the American dream of finding Out that it is an illusion and a nightmare But the thing I was talking to my barber about Yesterday Man, the cost of living has gone up so much Like even for everyone who, Matt posted this If you were waiting on a rate decrease Well, you finally got the rate decrease But the$500 ,000 house you now want Is now$795 ,000 So you're paying the same thing So if you don't hustle in this environment that you're in, you're going to be on the wrong side of history and you're financially not going to be in a good space and it's going to lead to a lot of depression.
6:00But what do you I know this is near and dear to your heart. What do you think? so yeah i think um you know it's it's it's an interesting conversation because looking at it like all right you know this hustle thing is is killing us and it's counterproductive and we wasn't meant to you know live life like that but i think they're not really looking at it from a hustler's perspective like for me some people don't have an option there is no really no other option. You have to hustle. That's the job requirement. So it's like, all right. When I started working as a financial advisor, I didn't work for a Wall Street firm.
6:45I worked for an insurance company. So if you're familiar with the difference, Wall Street firms, you get paid salary. From my situation, I got paid a commission. That's how you make money. So it was no option of not hustling. You don't have an option not to hustle. Like you got to hustle. Like I never had like a job where I'm getting a salary and I can just work nine o 'clock to five o 'clock and then leave and then go home. We had to hustle. Starting what we started here, earn your leisure. You had to hustle. Like you got to do things like, I mean, like that becomes a habit. and that becomes ingrained in you.
7:25And that's something that I think is actually something that people don't fully appreciate. That's part of the process. More so than even having the money or having the freedom. I think that there's dignity and actually it's like figuring out a math problem. It's like a rule of excuse. You got to go out. There's no blueprint to this. It was no blueprint. When I was a financial advisor, there was no blueprint. I had the literally like I was all over. I had to go to different neighborhoods. I had to go to churches. I had to go to sororities. I was writing insurance policies inside the project. I would go to the projects.
7:59I would go anywhere because at the end of the day, I'm trying to figure it out. I didn't know. And if I don't do it, then I'm not going to be successful. That wasn't an option. So I had to kind of figure it out to be successful. So as far as the hustle, I love the hustle. So I'm always looking at that a little different because I'm like, all right, you're saying that that's not what we meant to do and it's a trap and all of this. Well, what's the alternative to just have a regular job? Well, that's a trap, right? Now you're making somebody else rich. You're expanding somebody else's dream, right?
8:36You're never going to have enough money to ever have any level of financial security at all. So which trap would you prefer? At least one trap, you can actually, at the end of the day, have some level of control of your own self, your own financial freedom, your own, if it works out. So I just don't agree with that. I don't buy into that because i feel like it's it's not like we doing this because we just want to get extremely wealthy that's part of it but another part of it is that i did not want to work a job like i would have rather i'm not working a job i'm not working a job like you know i'm saying and that's the part and that's okay too it's like everybody's so judgmental it's like i shouldn't show up said don't judge me i'm not going to judge you i'm not going to judge you if you feel satisfied working a job that's where i come from that's you know i'm saying that's the environment we come from a blue class working environment i understand that like i'm saying but i never wanted to work a job ever that was never in my in my trajectory in life so if you don't want to work a job you got you got to hustle you got to figure shit out like you know i'm saying you can't just expect to just check to just fall into your lap so and at the end of the day what are we here for like you here you on earth to do shit you're not on earth to just roam the plains and just harvest grass i mean some people are but vast majority of us we on earth to do shit commerce hustling we doing this we we trying to you know better our situations we trying to move the scale.
10:18It's like a game. To me, that shit's like an adrenaline rush. So I don't necessarily look at it like, oh, it's a trap. Life is a trap. It's one big video game. Who's going to make it to the last level? That's it. You got to pick out cheat code to it. It's like Mario Brothers. Who's going to make it to the last level? Some of us are going to make it to the first level. Some of us are going to make it to the last level and beat the game. But even if you don't beat the game, hey, it's been a hell of a ride. A lot of times going after it is what makes it fun. And for those of you who be like, hey, I want to just walk the beach.
10:55As a person who is like taking three months off, what people won't tell you, you'll be bored out of your mind after 30 days. You'll think that that's peace. You're going to be bored. Your friends aren't going to be able to do anything with you. Your significant other won't. Your kids still have school. So you're going to sit around and do nothing all day. Now you can invest in international arbitrage. I shall make money in the States and go to other countries and have more freedom. But even then, you still have to find a deeper purpose for what you want to do. And this goes back to the previous conversation of having ambition.
11:26But on a systemic issue, hustle culture is needed because the American economy is not as strong as it once was. And so many jobs cannot be provided like how it used to be. Like I remember when I started being an entrepreneur in 03, 04, a lot of people made fun, not laughing out because the job security is not there. And even if you work in corporate, you still have to hustle your ass off and be productive and know how to work that skill set of knowing who to be connected to, who endorses you. There's no way that you can escape it. That's why even like last week when we did the levels of wealth, we got people, you guys are out of touch.
12:05once again I've been broke as hell before I've had the fortune of making two or three dollars in a year I prefer making two or three dollars in a year to be honest but if these levels of wealth are not true Dak just got paid 60 million guaranteed and never won a title Brady's getting 350 to sit in a broadcasting booth to predict what's going to happen like if these love and this is the reason why people gate keep information and a lot of people who are rich and wealthy are shutting the fuck up and not talking. Y 'all say y 'all want the truth, then get it, and now all of a sudden you hate it. Okay, I'll be quiet.
12:41I didn't understand some of the selective outrage but it's like, we just was commentating on that list. We didn't necessarily even agree with everything on that list. The thing about it is that you can't change it to make it convenient to your situation. This is just the facts. When you start talking about money, it's like, well, then you're saying 95 % of America is broke. No, that's a fact. that's the fact that 95 % is that's a fact would you want me to say a lot we could lie to you and say no because bro I remember when I first made$100 ,000 and it wasn't no life changing situation and that was better than probably 80 % of America so it's like no I mean we could just not talk about it at all but when you're like oh that's saying that most of America is broke yeah most of america's broke the country's broke so therefore most of the citizens are i mean what you want what you what you want that you want the truth or you or you want some smoke screen bullshit like everybody not gonna make it that's the harsh reality of life everybody's not gonna make it i mean and the people they was like yo this hustle mentality is is is bad they tell you that to make sure that you stay a worker because what's the alternative this is america it ain't nowhere where you can just live off the land so you either are an entrepreneur or you're an employee that's what you're doing in america if you're in the in the legal system of things so if they're discouraging you if these people are discouraging you from being a hustler which essentially they're discouraging you from being an entrepreneur because if you're an entrepreneur you're hustling there's no way around it ain't no there ain't no easy shortcuts to entrepreneurship You're going to have to work 15-hour, 20-hour days.
14:29That's going to have to happen, especially in the beginning stages. So if they're discouraging you from being an entrepreneur, what are they encouraging you to be? And even if you're legal, they took the cannabis business away. Defending a crisis is... But why would they encourage you to be an employee, though? Right? Like, think about that. Exactly. Absolutely. They put out narratives. You ever hear these... Black people are at the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to wealth, when it comes to home ownership, when it comes to stocks. Why would you have a main focus and study that hustle culture is bad for black people who have the least amount of money out of anybody?
15:12Have you ever heard hustle culture is bad for white people who's on Wall Street sniffing coke just to stay up for 20 hours a day? They hustling like a motherfucker. Have you ever heard of Silicon Valley when they running around doing all this shit? Mark Zuckerberg probably met with 300, 400 people in three weeks to try to raise money. Is that hustling? Did they ever discourage him and say, the hustle coach, that's going to kill you. That's bad for you. Don't worry about that. That doesn't even make any sense. You're trying to discourage the people that need to hustle the most, not to hustle. Absolutely.
15:44Because they know if they will get the power and community and finance together, there could be some changes. That's why I keep saying as soon as we got into the market, the rules, regulations changed. Creator culture changed. NFT stuff changed. Like you have to just continuously adapt. But you're not going to be able to live off your mom or dad or significant other for free. That causes a lot of tension, too. And then like child care is getting more expensive. Like even if you have kids and people like, well, hundreds a lot. If you live in which I'm from the Midwest. But if you live in the Midwest in a smaller city with 50 ,000 people, that's 100 grand, maybe a lot.
16:21If you live in a major city, if you take good care of your kid and if you're an active parent, you're going to burn through 30 or$20 ,000 a year just taking care of your kid and extracurricular costs by design. So but what do we know? We just grifting. And then the last thing is like, yes, I'm sorry, you got to switch your hustle. if you're doing something that has no chance of scaling and counterproductive that's not something that is sustainable and that is something that's going to burn you out without any recourse but that's up to you to know what is scalable we've produced enough content on earn your leisure that you can watch episodes going pretty much any business that you want and you can say okay this is more scalable as opposed to me just selling t-shirts on the on the street corner yeah that could lead you to become the next Fubu, but you're probably not.
17:162025, there's going to be real conversations. And if you don't like it, that's fine. You can't always, this is not a fairy tale. Not a fairy tale. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, the only thing that's going to happen is you keep telling people fairy tales is that you're going to make them delusional and you're going to lead them to disappointment. Absolutely. The entire world is waiting to see what Jerome Powell does. the American economy is at one of its shakiest points since 2008 and people are telling you to work less. They're trying to offset the workforce by making the AI shit work.
17:53Meanwhile, motherfucking Apple keeps re-rocking that same phone with a new button and Huawei got a trifold phone out. You got to constantly innovate, man. And for the record, assets, homes are an asset, Commercial buildings are an asset. So our stocks are only going to go higher. That's what they're meant to do. So if you think that you can just chill and coast by, like I remember even in 2008, there were some homes, five bedroom, four bath, 3 ,800, 4 ,000 square feet in Alpharetta. I was going for 525. You won't find a three bedroom in Alpharetta. That's 2 ,000 square feet for 500 grand now. It wasn't that long ago.
18:32Like, what do you want to do? We're not even going to talk about New York. And Leisha has never been, that's never been something that we don't lack. We over index in leisure, to be honest with you. Yeah. I should, I should sold out 10 shows and bar shot to us, but it's like, we don't have no problem. We go, go to a concert. We're going to go. They usher. Yep. We're going to watch football all day. Sunday. We're going to do fantasy. Crazy. But the fact that you, you try to just like, yo, this is don't hustle too much. No, we need to hustle more, more. We over-index on bullshit. We spend hours a day on social media just scrolling with aimless rap shit that has nothing to do with anything.
19:15That makes no money. And most of y 'all argue with bots. For those of you who don't know, at least 60 % of the internet has been bots or NPCs for real. And you just don't know it. For what? And the players who play in the league don't give a fuck about fantasy football like that. You're watching it all Saturday, all Sunday. some do some shout out to bro that uh got kicked out the joint okay yeah the parlay he was on the parlay some do some do i'm gonna care about the fantasy what at least they getting some money off of it they they doing it for a different reason it ain't just no regular like and then y 'all dudes is playing fantasy for no money some people play fantasy for no money a lot of y 'all playing make believe on instagram too and then cashing out on that stay focused man like life is hard but you can make it harder be focused and the truth is like when you focus on things that you love the journey of getting better at it is incredibly rewarding be fearless you complaining about it isn't gonna make it better you're gonna take your fear to a real estate agent and say let me put 20 down of my opinion doesn't work like that man and that's what i'll say like If you guys are actually parenting, these are hard costs.
20:37In New York City, what is a daycare cost in New York City? A thousand a month. A thousand a month. Minimum. Facts. Facts. That's for the bare minimum. If you're not on any assistance or help program, if you're just trying to pay it out your own pocket, you're$1 ,000 a month. That's a fact. High quality daycare, two, three grand. Easy. Come on. What you going to say? I'm not going to go to work. There's no comfort in being broke. I was never comfortable when I was broke. I never felt like, oh yeah. Man, that's the most stressful shit ever. Y 'all painting these fairy tales for people. Who wants to have comfort not even fucking knowing if they can put enough gas in their tank or their car is going to get overdraft?
21:28Yeah. Their car decline and hoping that it go through? Not fun. been on both sides i'm telling you it's a lot more fun to be like hey xander needs this cool i don't cool but you have to pick what path you go down that's what you have to pick there's no money in argument and entertainment like once again america's going through a shift 2025 we're waiting on the rate cut buffett isn't talking iron horn is not talking to the jones is not talking that much drunken miller's not talking that much tyler perry's not talking that much Lucian Grange ain't saying a motherfucking thing. His kid not saying nothing.
22:06Only people talking Drake and Kendrick and Drake being more quiet. You have to get up and go after the, like make your mom, like my mom and dad sacrifice too much for me to not have turned myself into something. Give your kids something. Like I went to the Astro game with Xander. Go to the concession stand. Shout out to my guy Chi Chi. Took me over there. The lady, oh, I love you so much. She's working at the, I'm 74. I started investing because of you. I'm up. Don't listen to what nobody tell you. I started with a thousand. I got twenty eight thousand now. I love Xander face lit up. Why are you so happy?
22:40It's amazing how these people treat you. Ask yourself, what are your best people spending their time on right now? Expense reports, receipt chasing, month in close that takes weeks. You become what you spend on and that's not what you're building toward. Brex is the intelligent finance platform that eliminates that work before it starts. AI agents that handle the manual stuff automatically so your team can spend their time on what actually compounds. It's time to get Brex AF. Learn more at brex.com slash AF. Paramount Plus is now the home of all your BET favorites. What? Yes! With all new episodes of Tyler Perry's Divorce Sisters.
23:20You've always liked a little drama. Plus a whole new world of movies like Gladiator 2. Now I will control an empire. Original series like The Chi. Just make sure we protect each other. In live sports like UFC. Welcome to the history books. New home, same family. Your BET favorites are now on Paramount+. Subscribe now. Here's the truth. You could literally be adored by everyone and then come home and still get completely ignored by your own cat. It's classic cat behavior. But new Shiba Premium Puree is a lickable treat that changes all that. They're protein-rich, made with bone broth, and have the smooth, creamy texture cats go crazy for, especially when it's hand-fed.
24:03Yeah, it's more than a treat. It's a fast pass to favorite human status. So feed your cat Sheba and go from totally ignored to truly adored in just 12 days, guaranteed, or your money back. Learn more at Sheba.com. Every small business starts with a dream and the courage to chase it. But even the strongest dreams need protection. That's why the Hartford has been a trusted partner for more than 1 million small business owners across America. From retail shops to financial professionals, the Hartford understands that every business is unique. Their customized coverage options help protect what matters most, your work, your people, and your future.
24:46Because when life throws the unexpected your way, you deserve a partner that helps you stand strong. Help protect your dream. Visit thehartford.com slash small business for a quote today. This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed human.
From the publisher
Subscribe and watch more videos here: https://www.youtube.com/@EarnYourLeisure
Join the EYL community for deeper training and a more detailed approach:
https://www.eyluniversity.com
Join the number one stock club in the world:
https://www.ianinvest.com
Invest Fest | August 7-9, 2026
Grab early bird tickets now: https://www.investfest.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

