Alien: Earth season 1 ft. Noah Hawley

46:33So again, it might be siloing at the company. Like you might have the colony, the terraforming group at the company going, here is a planet that is terraformable. That's a word. And we're sending colonists there. Brilliant. They don't have access necessarily to the files of this top secret files, which have, hey, there's a, on the other side of LV426, or at least some miles away, there is a site of interest to us. So it could be that the company isn't shaking hands with itself. That does exist in massive stage capitalism.

47:07Chris Hewitt:Classic Weyland-Yutani fannying around. It's true. But also, bear in mind that the idea of the Maginot is it is like the HMS Beagle. It's been going around collecting specimens. And the aliens are not indigenous to LV-426. They're brought there by the engineer's vessel. and like if we are completely pushing Prometheus and Alien Covenant out the window as not being canon which this kind of is right so you've got to think that they could have found those two alien eggs anywhere couldn't they like where did they get so you could argue that Weyland-Yutani knows that aliens exist it knows what they are but it didn't know they were on LV426 and it was generally just like go and check that out and then when they find out they're there they're like oh fucking bonus brilliant bring that back but that still doesn't necessarily mean that Van Leeuwen when he's talking to Ripley doesn't know that everything she's saying is real.

47:56He's still like, no, no, you break it. You bought it. You didn't pay for that fucking chip.

48:00Chris Hewitt:Yeah. That would also be like in character for the corporation, wouldn't it? To just deny all knowledge of the thing they want kept secret and blame the person who brought them the knowledge. And this is not, again, it's not that far from the real world. Not for reasons unknown. So I think, yeah, I think a lot of that can be explained away. And I actually think that the Covenant and Prometheus could still stand. I think they still stand. I don't think what disregards those movies I think he has talked about this kind of alternate timeline idea that this doesn't directly impact everything that comes after and it doesn't necessarily draw on everything that comes before it's kind of he's talked about as like a parallel alien timeline and I certainly read that as a Ridley Scott's a nice guy and I don't want to upset him but those films are not my alien hashtag not my alien and he doesn't Hashtag not all aliens.

48:52He doesn't want black goo and any of that kind of nonsense because look, I actually genuinely enjoy Prometheus but in my head canon, it is not an alien film. It is a separate science fiction film that I enjoy. I do not consider that alien canon.

49:04Chris Hewitt:Next, you will be telling us that Aliens vs. Predator Requiem isn't canon either. That's definitely canon. That is canon. That does end up with them taking off and nuking the entire site from orbit so that's all right. But all right, okay. So let's talk about Alien Earth and that's Focus. us focus back on the final episode so helen you felt that the final episode didn't quite deliver for you i have to say for me it surprised me i didn't do anything i thought it was going to do yeah i liked a lot of what it did don't get me wrong but i just wanted um maybe i just wanted a longer season again i don't know maybe i wanted some like two more episodes getting us to a slightly more advanced space or something yeah uh you know we obviously saw a bit of payoff for the Kirsch-Morrow fight.

49:52I may have shouted just kiss at the screen during that. I admit nothing. We saw, you know, we obviously saw some kind of, you know, claiming her authority, claiming her power from Wendy. We saw, I was unsatisfied with the confrontation she had with Joe, actually. That Wendy did. That Wendy did, yeah. Because on one hand, she's giving him grief for like, you turned against us when you fired on, what's the name? Nibs. Nibs, thank you. One I can't keep straight in my head. But she's also saying, but I'm not human. So it's like, well, pick one. Because a little bit, you're trying to have your cake and eat it with that.

50:32He didn't hurt. I thought at one point that he'd killed Nibs. So did I. In which case, she would be absolutely justified in being furious with him. He knocked her out. He knocked her out and stopped her killing his friend. That doesn't seem disproportionate to me. No, I agree. but I think she's very much in the midst of a massive existential crisis where she's like I don't know what I mean she says it doesn't she I'm not a machine I'm not a person like what the hell am I and I think she's trying to mentally stay in two worlds like she thinks she's better than people she thinks they can rule but equally and is he even still her brother but part of her thinks she is so yes I think she's trying to hold on to she's desperately trying to hold on to all the different fractured pieces of herself and the contradictory pieces and make a hole out of it and I think she's struggling with it but as Hawley says in the interview, you know, the whole now we rule thing is interesting because they're just kids.

51:23They don't know what the fuck they're doing. They're playing pirates in a fort. Like, they have no fucking clue what they're doing. So next season is Lord of the Flies, potentially. Yeah, basically that. And because, you know, the ships are coming, Weyland's coming, or Yutani, I should say, is coming. Don't know what Weyland's doing. He's off the, on the Prometheus. Indeed. So, if it were canon. But that's, you know, so what happens next? Is this even a good idea? Like, what the hell are they doing? and I think it's interesting at the end that Cavalier seems to find this endlessly amusing like he's clearly just excited at the chaos he hath wrought

51:56Chris Hewitt:and that he has created that's not how I read that smile at all I read that as a smile of utter fucking mania and terror that he doesn't this is not in his plans oh funny I read it that way as well Hawley says that from that he goes from his lowest point to his highest point in about 10 seconds because he's like with these tech pros it's all about disruption and he realizes then he's created the ultimate disruption. So he is cock-a-hoop because he thinks this is fucking great. Well, he might well be, yeah. Some billionaires just want to watch the whole world burn. Yes, they do. But that's interesting because there was a lot of things at the end of the finale that I didn't expect it to do.

52:34Chris Hewitt:I thought there would be a lot more blood on the walls, I'll be honest with you. I didn't think the boy cavalier would end up either dead or eyeballed. I thought so too. I thought there was a possibility. I didn't think that was going to happen because he's too interested in a character to do that to this early on. I did think that a few more characters, major characters, would die or at least be taken off the board, so to speak. He doesn't do that wholly. He flips the status quo. He leaves Wendy and the Lost Boys in a very, very interesting position where almost they become the antagonists of the show.

53:14Chris Hewitt:I think that's really interesting. And he left a lot of people alive, even including Arthur, who was one of the few major characters to die. And one of the reasons why I'm so... I mean, undead is not alive. Well, and that's not Arthur, obviously, but I'm still... There's a lot of dramatic mileage to be had from scenes like eyeball Arthur comes back and meets Dame Sylvie. what is that conversation going to be like is that going to be a conversation can he talk what's going to happen in season 2 I really desperately desperately want I should be checking my phone every 5 seconds to see what they've announced the renewal I'm so intrigued by where this is going to go that I'm prepared to forgive it not really having a sense of conclusion in this episode I thought it was a very very good episode and I love this series I love what Holly has been doing with this series throughout.

54:13Chris Hewitt:I think it's terrific. I think it's the best slice of Alien since Aliens. But this episode could maybe be seen as anticlimactic for a lot of people. I think, I mean, look, I feel like people, I have read that said online today. I was doing some reading up on this and a lot of people were saying, oh yeah, it's a bit of a calm down from episode seven, never mind episode five. And I think the love for episode five to me feels a bit regressive. You know, I thought it was magnificent, but it's also, you know, you love it because you love Alien and Aliens a bit. I don't feel like it's its own thing to the degree that the rest of the show is.

54:54Episode seven definitely had bigger action beats than this one does, but aren't we used to that by now? This is, it's 10 years since Game of Thrones. Do you know what I mean? Like, the second last episode of the season being the biggest action episode is now a very, very common thing in TV. It's happened a lot. Are we still shocked when that happens?

55:18Chris Hewitt:Yes. I mean, I guess, apparently, yeah. Yes, I am. But I feel like, you know, there was a lot to work out in the scene. I do feel like, you know, the idea that Wendy has the alien under too much control is interesting. and I maybe would have liked to have seen a little bit more. I don't know, tension or something there, or maybe for that to be explored a little more. Like, we get her point of view that, oh, I like them because they're honest, like they don't lie. But so what does she know about them? Like, what are they telling her? What's she getting? I mean, obviously she's getting a, you know, a dog like Brad Pitt in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood out of this.

55:57But apart from that, what is she getting from them in terms of information? These are all kind of questions that are just kind of left hanging. And I would have liked to just, I'm not saying answers, but just a bit more exploration or a bit more acknowledgement that those are questions.

56:10Chris Hewitt:I didn't take from that the idea that they've been telling her stuff, especially because the only one she can communicate with is the xenomorph. And if that's just a drone xenomorph, then how much knowledge does it have about xenomorph society, etc.? I just took from it that she observed how they behaved, and they behave like animals or insects or whatever and that that in itself is honest. You don't see them fucking each other over for a goddamn percentage. I don't think they are, no. And it's interesting. The aliens, I mean the eyeball, yes, not the aliens. Well, it's not intelligent as in it doesn't know prime numbers and it can't do pi.

56:47Chris Hewitt:But of course it's an intelligence and the aliens. On the reference, is it more intelligent than a Jack Russell? I don't know. Possibly. Is it on a level with it? But I think we are talking animal intelligence rather than like Like Velociraptor. Sure, yes. I don't think it's communicated with her in that way. I don't think it's going, hey, I'm a xenomorph, and this is how we work, and blah, blah, blah. I think it's more, she's observing their behavior. And also, crucially, as something Hawley referred to is, he's not sure she knows what she's saying to them. I don't think she can speak their language.

57:14I think it's similar to, like, you know, Chris Pratt talking to Blue. Like, she can make herself understood to it, but they can't have a conversation. And also, an interesting thing he said is, do we know, does she, is what she's saying to it what she thinks she's saying to her. Well, that's my question, essentially. Is it fully, like, is it on the same page as her or does she just think it is? And I thought that was an interesting thing for her to say. How much control does she really have? How much control does she have? That's what I'm kind of getting at. Like, I don't think, and look, again, I don't need that to be fully established, but I would like that to be a bit more hinted at, explored, acknowledged, or something, because I don't feel like it's really been gotten into.

57:51I feel like it's the kind of thing that Kirsch would have talked about if he wasn't being distracted by having his back broken, maybe this episode. He's, I mean, Kirsch is a fascinating character to me because even at the end here, I still don't fully know what his game is. Because all through these point of specials, I've been going, what is that dude's deal? What is his deal? What's his deal? Because he's clearly a fucking anarchist. You know, he knows all this shit is going on. There's a bit where Cavalier directly asks him, is everything okay? And he's like, yep. Now, you can interpret that as Cavalier's in on it and he's saying, is everything going according to plan?

58:25Like, is all this shit going on? and he's like, yes it is. Or, and this again is an interesting thing that Hawley brought up, it's like, Kersh doesn't like Cavalier. He's a good judge of character. Fundamentally, yes. Cavalier is a dickhead. But his programming limits him in how he can or cannot resist control, how he cannot resist instruction. Direct instruction. But does he try and undermine him in every conceivable way within the boundaries of what he's allowed to do? Yeah, I think he does. I think he does too. I also think he does feel something of a feel is maybe the wrong word uh see something of a possibility or feel something of a connection with the hybrids i like if it's not a traditional father-child relationship and it isn't but it may not be feeling based but i think it's very much a these are my creation based yes and i think he has more of a kinship with them than certainly than they feel with boy cavalier actually and um and has been much more of a kind of mentor to most of them than boy cavalier has been with the possible exception of wendy who's been more taken under his wing and kind of you know talked up by him so i just feel like there's a really interesting relationship there that again i'm hoping they explore a bit more and i just would have liked tiny bit more from him in this yes uh do you think

59:42Chris Hewitt:because kirsch in particular in episode seven is really interesting where he is literally showing slightly in Smee the way to get incapacitated face-huggered Arthur to the beach. That's really... Is he in some ways comparable to the eye, to the octopus eyeball? Because I know Jimbo from talking to you, but you're a Hawley interview. He describes the eyeball as an agent of chaos. Who just likes to put things against each other to see what happens it's not necessary it doesn't necessarily have a great plan or a great strategy it's just like what would happen if i stomp my feet at this exact moment close that caused that door to close and then see what happens oh this is fun and kirsch is doing that a little bit more dispassionately i think he's like okay well this is interesting so this guy's now infiltrated my lost boys and he's he's got slightly on his side and now i know he wants slightly to get a human to implant an alien embryo.

1:00:46Chris Hewitt:All right, let's just see what happens here and how can I use this to my advantage? But he can't go directly against, he can't directly attack Boykavim here. But he might be able to sow the seeds of rebellion by fucking around with different areas. He's a fascinating dude, isn't he? He is. But it's, I love the kind of competing motivations like the eyeball, which is great because it is a complete agent of chaos. Like, it sows mayhem. But the idea I guess is that it believes that much like Littlefinger chaos is a ladder like it can sow the seeds of chaos and it can use that chaos to its ultimate advantage so it's an opportunist and it recognises that as long as the humans are in control it's fucked but if everything goes to shit it can improvise and just get up like you see that when it takes over Michael Smiley right where it's in there and it's just like okay now I'm in the shit I'm going to call the alien it calls the alien the alien tells me it goes fuck me now I've got to bite the alien and he jumps literally I love that scene because he tries to bite it and then it just becomes the eyeball and then the eyeball is on the thing's head and the alien's going fuck fuck get this fucking thing off me it's just brilliant yeah I love the eyeball I think this is a controversial statement maybe I think the eyeball is the greatest small screen big screen monster of the last 10 years easily it's so I was the way I was waving my hands at the TV when it was attacking Joe.

1:02:12Like, just as if I myself were being attacked and needed to fend it off. I was literally like, I couldn't keep it still. I find it so scary and so off-putting and so gross.

1:02:25Chris Hewitt:That was such a... I think they could have milked a bit more tension from that scene, if I'm completely honest with you as well. It's really good the way that Joe gets into the crate. And then it reminded me of that scene in Scream, where Sidney gets into the car and Ghostface is... That's the second time we mentioned Ghostface in this podcast. And then he sinks out of sight. He sinks out of sight and then the boot starts to open up behind her. It reminded me a little bit of that, but it's much more frenetic. But yeah, I love that. I love that little shit so much. Not Joe. No, no. The eyeball.

1:02:55Chris Hewitt:Joe, I can take relief. Joe, I think, has not maybe had quite as much development as he needed in these last couple of episodes, except for maybe that scene with Wendy. But then again, I just think he wasn't presenting the alternative point of view as much as he should have for me in that scene. And she's a kid. That's the thing as well. She is the smartest one, the most powerful one, but they're still kids. But it's because they're kids, I find the hind and seek thing quite chilling. Do you remember when she just goes, run. Yeah. Now you run. And he runs off and she goes, I've got someone special looking for him.

1:03:30And she's like, the fucking alien after him. I'm like, that shit is cold.

1:03:33Chris Hewitt:And now the, now we rule line at the end is great as well. There's so much I love about this series and so much I love about this final episode. So little quibbles. That's all I have. Little quibbles. Like I think the alien is too deadly. If that makes any sense. So we have gone from the, yes, the colonial marines and aliens are ultimately outrunned, outgunned, out-seen and morphed. But they can take them down with some pulse rifles. They can kill aliens. This is one alien in broad daylight and these motherfuckers can't hit it from 10 paces? When it's sort of like corner Dame Julia, Dame Julia, Dame Sylvia.

1:04:17Chris Hewitt:Dame Judi Dench is in this. When it corners Dame Judi Dench, who would absolutely take it down. But when it calls her at the gravesite, and it's behaving in an unusual way at that point because it just sort of watches her and kind of looms. It looks like it gets shot in the head because it looks like it gets shot. It does. It gets shot, but not by full bullets. it gets shot by I think like little not darts but electrical stuff that makes it are they using okay so they're not using they're using blank live rounds yeah not live rounds right okay because I couldn't work that out I was like suddenly bulletproof what the fuck is going on here yeah so can we count the aliens right now like I I kind of got confused about who's who and where's where so there was one live one on the Maginot that was killed and brought back as a body right yes and then we had one the little one was born out of the lung yes That's right, yes.

1:05:10And then the big one is the one...

1:05:12Chris Hewitt:No, the big one is the one that Wendy has bonded with. Right, and it came from where? It hatches on the Maginot. No, no, so you had... Yeah, so that one is the one from the lung, and then the other one is the one, like the small one is the one that came out of Arthur. And then the one that was from the Maginot is the one that she cuts his head off in the first episode. Yes, yeah, okay. Okay, so we've just got one normal size-ish. alien and one tiny baby alien. That's right. That's right. Little cute dinky alien. Yeah. And then the eyeball, a bunch of assorted insect looking things and the plant motherfucker.

1:05:51Well, because we got, so yeah, because there's four, aren't there? There's the eyeball, there's the tick, there's the kind of hornet thing and then there's the plant. And I think it's Smee says the eyeball and the plant are in the wind. Like, they don't know where either of those are but the tick and the hornet, they're locked down and they know where they are. I thought there were five.

1:06:05Chris Hewitt:I thought there were five. The alien is the fifth. There are four and then the traditional eye. So who are the four? Okay, so there's the xenomorph. Jesus. There's the xenomorph. There's the eyeball. There's the plant thing. The plant monster. Which kills that soldier at the end. The tick, slack, slash leechy, slash tadpolly things, which is one. And those are the things that suck your blood in its entirety. Right. Which is not good. No, it's bad. And they urinate in your AVN. And then there's the fly thing that kills toodles. Yes, the vomit hornet. Okay. All right. Okay, now I'm on board. Okay, just wanted to check that I had them all straight.

1:06:38Chris Hewitt:And there's the one, what's the one on Helen's shoulder right now? What is that? Oh, God. Oh, no. I don't like it. Were there any surprises? What surprised you about this episode? What took place? I thought Mora would manage more damage. Oh, it rhymes. I feel like I wanted maybe, I mean, he has a one-man army, but he's only a one man, I guess. You don't get quite as much. I enjoyed the fight. Aside from the just case, I enjoyed the fight with Kirsch because I enjoyed that relationship. and I think thinking about it now and based on what you were just saying about Kirsch, I think maybe the difference between them is that Morrow has the freedom to say, fuck you, I'm out of here, and doesn't use it.

1:07:20And Kirsch is like, why the fuck would you not? These people are awful. I hate this. That seems to be a lot of the kind of antipathy maybe between them. I love that on the surface of it,

1:07:33Chris Hewitt:their goals may be the same, that Morrow wants to kill Boy Cavalier and burn the whole thing to the ground. And that might, might be what Kirsch wants as well, ultimately. And yet they just fucking hate each other. Hate at first sight. It's like that moment in Pulp Fiction where Bruce Willis and John Trafalto meet at the bar and they just have that moment of enmity. And it's like, what the fuck did you say? And there's that great shot of Bruce Willis watching John Trafalto walk away. And they just fucking hate each other from the start. that's what this relationship is like loathing

1:08:12absolutely true I really enjoyed the not just the fight but the conversation you know the John Henry conversation John Henry versus the steam engine this idea like mankind will always win it's a matter of will and that's because Morrow just believes that and then Kirst very correctly going yeah but he died of exhaustion what the fuck yeah

1:08:31Chris Hewitt:but then he did become the name of a Lay My Be Giants album, so... Who's the real winner? Yeah, who is the real winner, ultimately? Whoever wins, we lose. Yeah. I love Lay My Be Giants. But, yeah, I thought that was an interesting conversation and an interesting idea, you know, what wins out sort of flesh over, you know, synthetic goo or whatever it is. But Mauro, like Mauro's character kind of evolves as you go through it, as you understand his kind of slightly weird backstory, but he is just driven by essentially loyalty at this point, like, because he doesn't have anything else left in his life apart from loyalty to Yutani.

1:09:06But that's everything to him. So I feel like the Cavalier thing, he hates him mainly because he wronged Yutani and he stole something that his duty bound him to deliver to Yutani. So it feels like he's just on this very singular blinkered mission. And obviously Kirsch is in the way. And also, like, he literally killed or allowed to be killed every single person on his ship in order to accomplish this mission. Crew expendable. Yeah. And then these fuckers are going to get in his way? Like, come on. Yeah. You know?

1:09:37Chris Hewitt:He's brilliant. He's so good. I love that character. I love that scene where Wendy has freed them essentially from the cell and they've got out and he's about to beat that guard to death and Joe stops him and says, I'm going to save the ones I can. And Mario goes, you better get to the children because I've got to burn this place to the ground and he's just growling it. It's so great. You could argue, of course, that he starts the episode in a jail cell and finishes it in a jail cell. And what really changes in between? I mean, he does break Kirsch's back and they do at least get to have that fight slash flirtation, Helen.

1:10:13I mean, there's just a bit of grappling, I'm just saying.

1:10:15Chris Hewitt:But what impact does he have on the overall events of the episode apart from incapacitating Kirsch? Which I guess is pretty major. Yeah, I guess pretty major. But I do think, yeah, I did kind of want more for him for his own sake. That's a weird thing. he's effectively a mass murderer I just want the best for him I want him to be able to complete his mission of bringing back aliens to the evil corporate shit I haven't thought this through that's a very good point I really loved we have a question we have a question about Kirsch and that fight in a second but I really liked how it was framed because I've seen the episode twice we did an Empire VIP club event last night where we showed it on the big screen and I love that the setup to it where you're introduced to the fact that there are two guards outside the laboratory and Kirsch is inside doing some experiment doing whatever the fuck he's doing and then Kirsch is at his desk and then he moves across and the camera pans with him and then the camera pans back again and those two guards are now bloodstains on the wall.

1:11:23Chris Hewitt:It's really, really nicely done. Just trying to think about any other surprises. I'm trying to think if any character was revealed as an android here we go fucking smart articulate here listen I don't get these things right very often but when you do you never we never get the end of it is this genuinely the very first successful you better believe it buddy I will I will many many spoiler specials my predictions are correct with uncanny accuracy I will I will point you towards me predicting Luke Skywalker at the end of The Mandalorian season 2 that's true he did yeah I think I don't remember I fucking did I've got the tapes mate if only there was some kind of audio record but I did I called it Adrian Edmondson yeah that was fun wasn't it that was fun I did have some questions about the boy cavaliers oh thank god I thought you were going to say geography of the island I was like not even you can have a question about that no it's a bit Jurassic Park-y the island but that's okay we can allow it I just kind of felt like okay so his his his reputation as a prodigy is because he was able to build a synth from parts question mark at the age of six yes I mean that would be prodigious because I know six year olds and they are not at that level it's just Lego I guess and they do build some impressive things out of Lego except I don't think that's where his reputation as a prodigy comes from because nobody knows Adam Aynes is a robot true although they must I was still to say he hasn't aged.

1:13:02Well, didn't he say he uses Atomines as a front to start his own corporation? Yeah. And then presumably does lots of clever things that makes him a trillionaire. That makes him a lot of money. Yeah. Exactly. So I think, but I guess what my issue with it was, if we're talking about this as a sort of satire in any way on current capitalism, most of the current billionaires are to some degree dickheads who got lucky once. and I kind of did want that for Boy Cavalier I think that's where we are

1:13:32Chris Hewitt:I think that's where we are I think he is genuinely well he does mix up his science fiction authors and that gives me hope but he does appear to have as they say some game and I kind of wanted him to have no game because I'm mean that way I guess but I like that you have that story so when we see Morrow's backstory and we start to understand him a little bit there's an element of sympathy that we get from Morrow not loads but we'd get some. Cavalier's interesting because he gives us a tragic backstory and it just makes him more of a cock which actually I thought was very well played and you have no sympathy for him after that whatsoever and yeah he's just an arsehole.

1:14:11And interesting that Wendy calls it I love the way she called it she said you act like you're the boy that never grew up and actually you're the person who never had a childhood and that is a powerful flip of the scales now we could have an argument about whether that does lack sympathy as you just liked sympathy for a kid who grew up in an unsafe and unnurturing environment, perhaps.

1:14:32Chris Hewitt:But as she says, he's not Peter Pan, he's Captain Hook. Yeah, that's fair. Yeah, the whole Boy Cavalier origin thing. I mean, Samuel Blankin is incredible in this. It's so weird how many of the cast are British, by the way. He's one of them, which is wild. But yeah, that's so unbelievably creepy. I'm still trying to get my head around how it works. So he's six years old. His dad is scared of his prodigious intelligence. And he senses that his dad is going to kill him because he's so jealous of him. Okay. All right. So he builds Adam Einz, which, by the way, is a six-year-old kid's idea of what a grown-up smart person would be called.

1:15:17Yeah. Adam Einz.

1:15:19Chris Hewitt:He just stops sort of Einstein, which is another little wrinkle that I love. So he builds Adam Mines, programs him to kill his dad, and then, as far as I could tell from Boy Cavalier's monologue, take his place as his dad to the world. Yeah, okay. And no one notices that he doesn't age. But that's okay, because A. Edmondson hasn't aged. To be fair, I mean, and, you know, once you kind of lose your hair, you kind of stop aging. look at him he's looked the same for the last 20 years but I am also a synth so you have to put that in mind that is true podcast crew expendable no yeah it's interesting but the the Adamines revelation and the fight I thought was terrific and it's such a shame that I haven't had a chance to talk to Ed Edmondson yet because I'm still convinced he's channeling Claude from The Apprentice although Claude from The Apprentice has never tried to beat the shit out of someone that I know of.

1:16:19Chris Hewitt:Yeah. And I love that. And the moment where Wendy goes full Neo on him and goes, no, and stops him. And he is frozen in place and his eyeballs are flicking around. That was so Eddie Hitler. I can't even begin to tell you. I had so, I had very welcome bottom flashbacks at that point. So that was great. Hopefully it'll give him a frying pan in the next season. The less we hear of your bottom flashbacks, the better. getting flashbacks to that chicken restaurant we went to that time oh no okay let's not name it let's not name it oh dear shall we have some questions please sure alright so Brewy Chris Brewy underscore Chris on Twitter sent in a bunch of questions as ever thank you for those I'm reading these as I'm seeing them if there were future seasons of Alien Earth I thought it may have charted the downfall all of Wayland Yutani's competitors, starting with Prodigy, each one somehow involving their quest for the Cenomorph.

1:17:23Same.

1:17:24Chris Hewitt:But it looks like going forward, everything will be set on Boy Cavalier's island with the hybrid now trying to escape. What direction do you think they should go in? I don't think it will. He's mentioned that this is a Prodigy series and there are other corporations to explore. And I think he definitely wants to look at that. I think the whole, you know, corporates, corporocracy, whatever you want to call it. Oligarchy. Sure. I think that form of governance and all that that really interests him so I think we'll explore that more but I definitely think like the nature of the hybrids is going to be centre stage for the foreseeable whether it will be for the whole show I don't know but it feels like that's that's certainly where we are at the moment but I think I think absolutely we'll get off this island and yes I think we'll see more of Weyland-Yutani and I think you know what's it threshold and dynamic and Lynch will all come into it at some point like which is the one that controlled the moon like 100 % I feel like we should have a moon base.

1:18:15Yes, aliens on the moon. Yeah. Alien Earth, alien moon, alien Mars.

1:18:21Chris Hewitt:Alien Uranus. Hey! Ew, that sounds very painful. In Uranus, no one can hear you scream? I mean, that's possibly accurate. I don't really know. I don't want to test it. I shouldn't have maintained icon. That was quite creepy. Part threat, part promise. Oh, no. Jesus. Oh, dear. Is this what's like a pilot? This is so much fun. All right. Here's another couple from Bruby underscore Chris. How did the creature hear Wendy slash Marcy when she was inside the facility and it was outside? And then also, any ideas why Wendy is special? She can hack into the systems. she can talk to aliens she can talk to Doodle she can talk to the animals she can do things that the other Lost Boys cannot why?

1:19:23she might just be more developed because she was the first I suppose but the sound thing is interesting because I meant to ask Holly about that and I didn't get a chance to what the fuck did you ask? we just chatted about Metallica for 20 minutes we were just going

1:19:35Chris Hewitt:I love you yeah a little bit like that but I yeah because I wondered about that because it seems to have extraordinary hearing whereas he references the communication in Aliens when the queen sends its drones away when Ripley threatens it with a flamethrower now that felt almost when I watched Aliens I've always interpreted that is it part psychic is it part you know is it just like a gesture pheromones even yeah because it hisses but I didn't get the impression that it was talking to them it just maybe it's like you know it's not even that it's kind of just gestures you know when kids are fucking about and the parent just looks at them and raises an eye about mmhmm And they just know, right?

1:20:13They know they're misbehaving. That was the equivalent. It just raised an eyebrow and looked disapproving. And they backed off. But given she does control the systems of the whole base, and given that she does have this weird connection to the alien, which, yes, I would have liked to have been a bit more explained, if I'm honest. I think there was some random stuff online about, well, she's a new body and the alien's a new creature, and therefore they can sort of bond over that. It didn't make a lot of sense to me.

1:20:40Chris Hewitt:But if the alien came out of her body, I could maybe understand that, but it comes out of Hermit's body, or Joe's body. Well, they are kind of related then. Well, yes, but also she is communicating with the aliens before that. Well, she can hear them. That's when she wakes up, she can hear them. But if she can hear them, what I'm saying is, and she controls the systems in the building, she could maybe literally kind of put herself over in a loudspeaker at that end of the building. Yeah, conceivably, that's true. That's a very good point. But I like the fact that when Cavaliss has talked to her, And she's like, how?

1:21:10And she's like, it's like the whole magic thing, isn't it? You're so advanced. If you just imagine you can do it, you can probably do it. Which is a wonderful hand-wavy way of saying, we don't know how this works. Shut up. Shut up. Don't ask questions. Do you think Holly knows the answers to these questions? I don't. And actually, I think Helen's right. We want to know the reasons why, but I equally think it's important that they don't tell us. Because inevitably, the answers are more disappointing than the questions. So I think it's nice that we don't fully understand it. And I kind of hope we never do, even though I want to.

1:21:39Chris Hewitt:Do you not think we could have maybe done with a little bit more resolution in this season? A little bit more resolution, yeah. Because I wanted more of it. I wanted this story to continue, but we're going to have to wait for the second season, if we get one, to find out where it goes. So, yeah, I definitely agree with that, but I'm a big believer that less is more in terms of answers. And I think so many TV shows undo themselves by giving you too much information too early on. And it takes some of the fun away of it. Part of the joy of these things is the sense of unknown, the sense of not understanding.

1:22:06It's why he came up with these new aliens, right? The thing about the alien, when you first meet it, is I don't understand what this thing is, what it wants, or how it works. And the more we understand about it, the less interesting and scary it is. Whereas the eyeball, we don't understand what it is, what it wants, or how it works, which is why it's so fucking cool. And I think that's important. I agree, yeah.

1:22:25Chris Hewitt:All right. Another one from Brewing underscore Chris. I love the eyeball. MVP. How do you feel about its ability to puppet a dead for at least a day body? I can't wait to see the result of it walking Arthur around but shouldn't its host be alive nearly dead or a fresh corpse to work? I mean don't overthink it would be my suggestion yeah I mean like if its blood started to kind of like you know pool and its like muscles are atrophying you could argue that it wouldn't really work but that's not fun let's not let's not go down that road it's cool I mean this is like arguing about zombies and not being impossible why are they eating they're dead it doesn't make any sense Why do they want your brains?

1:23:06Chris Hewitt:Isn't the cat half dead anyway? The cat has a face off or something? So I think it's established that it doesn't need to be a living host for that to work. I'm just really intrigued. I can say, can it make Arthur speak? Will it be satisfied with Arthur? Or will it want to upgrade? Will not make it intelligent? I suspect it will not be satisfied with Arthur. I'm interested that it went all the way to the beach when, as we know, there are a whole number of corpses right around the facility that have been killed in the recent past. But anyway, maybe when it went through the little grate in the floor, it came out by the beach.

1:23:41Chris Hewitt:Maybe it's the beach bomb. Maybe it is. It just wants to go to the beach and have a great time. Who could blame it? 20%. Okay, here's one from Adam Shortland. This is on Twitter. There's another couple from Blue Sky as well. My Alien Earth question would regard the likely two to three year wait for the second season if we even get one. Yeah. Would that dilute any anticipation for it, as we see with quite a lot of these high-budget cinematic shows now? Yes. And is the lack of any real cliffhanger good or bad? Lack of any real cliffhanger. I think there's a cliffhanger. I think there's a cliffhanger.

1:24:16I think there is a cliffhanger, and it makes me very annoyed that I will have to wait two to three years. And what I would like them to announce this afternoon is that they actually already have season two in the can. They've gone full slow horses. Yeah, they've shot it. Yeah, and they just have to spend, like, I don't know, six months to a year, that's fine doing the effects. Yeah, that would be amazing. But this whole giving us like eight, ten episodes of something and then you have to wait three years for the next freaking series is bullshit, if I'm honest. I could not tell you what happened in the last two seasons of Stranger Things.

1:24:47No fucking idea. Well, I re-watched them recently, but otherwise I wouldn't either. I'd like, and I'm not anticipating the new one because I don't remember who anyone is. I literally don't remember most of their names. Yeah. And I'm going to have, am I supposed to do homework? Yes. Fuck off. Like, no. I just want seasons to be predictable and especially if they're only 10 episodes at a time at the very least hire writers and get the things written so you can start the you know the cheap stages of pre-production and everything else in good time at least do that much this is why you kind of want networks and streaming services to just green light two series off the bat you know save yourself some money make them back to back produce them and then you know take the slow horses model just go with that like that's great because that's that's easier on the viewer but you're absolutely right like certainly for for some of these shows the wait between seasons can be interminable like it really can be can be a real problem and you exactly you said

1:25:43Chris Hewitt:you forget stuff why is that such a problem though because we're willing to wait three four years between installments of movies why is it different with TV because you wouldn't like you'll definitely wait between alien and aliens because one's not built predicated on the other really like no one went into alien thinking we need to see how this story ends we would not have been happy if we'd had to wait three years between June Part 1 and June Part 2 although we kind of nearly did but if better analogy maybe Fellowship of the Rings to Two Towers if that had been a three year wait fuck off do you know what I mean like we can just about do a year but yeah and there's also I mean you know we are having to wait for example for something like Spider-Man Across the Spider-Verse the third one Beyond the Spider-Verse I mean we are you're absolutely right and you know it has blunted my excitement a little bit just because I can't maintain it for four years or whatever it is.

1:26:32I think, and also there's much less to keep track of in these films than there is in some of these shows. Exactly, and you can re-watch a film in an hour and a half. Exactly, I don't have a day to commit to re-watching every freaking show. I had to watch four seasons of Stranger Things to find out what's, like that's a big ask. Yeah, it's too much. And yet too little because it's only eight to ten episodes so it's not like, you know, like all day stuff like Supernatural, 22 to 24 episodes a season. Yeah. It had only been six months since you last saw it. It's not that big a deal to try and refresh yourself on the little bits you missed, you know?

1:27:06On the quote-unquote story. Hey, there was a lot of story. They fought literal God. Don't get me started. The point is, like, that was a smaller gap between seasons. Even if there was a lot of story to remember, it was a smaller gap between seasons. Classic network production schedule, yeah. Exactly. And this shit that we have now, honestly, is killing TV for me. I hate it. I mean, look, we waited three years between Severance Season 1 and Severance Season 2. Fuck knows how long it'll be till we see Severance Season 3. Will we remember what a Severance is by the time the third one comes out? It's hard to say.

1:27:40But look, I guess these are very first world problems, right? They are, but I mean, it genuinely makes you hesitate before diving into Season 1 of something, and that way, the show might be cancelled. You know, if you know... That's always been a danger. That's true, but if you know that there's more coming, you're much more likely to invest. But then that was a problem since the dawn of network television, where if not enough people watched a show, it would get cancelled, but then you didn't want to start a new show in case it got cancelled, so you kind of have a problem there, don't you? I think it's much more of an issue now.

1:28:08So there's a lot more entertainment. Yeah, maybe. Anyway.

1:28:15Chris Hewitt:Glad I asked now. Sorry. Sorry. That was a downer. Have you heard of Fantastic Four Sports Special where you talk about the death of cinema? That's a downer. Anyway, Helen's in her soapbox again. Get her off the soapbox. Jesus Christ, get her off the soapbox. Like every day is Christmas Eve. Hey, here's something exciting. No news yet about a renewal for Alien Earth. I've been refreshing news on my phone, poking it with a stick, going, make it happen. But last night at the Empire VIP Club screening of the finale, sign up now, empireonline.com forward slash VIP for possible access to those events.

1:28:58Chris Hewitt:I interviewed at the end Jonathan Ajayi who plays Smee and Lily Newmark who plays Nibs. Nice. And they were very, very lovely and Nibs was not terrifying in the flesh, which was good. Hooray. And they still have their hairdos. Now, of course, it could be just their hairdos. But they might also have been told to keep their hairdos just in case we're going to go. We get a season two renewal order and we're going. We're going. Go, go, go, go. Both of you are obsessed with hair this episode. We just need one more mention of Ghostface. But it can be a giveaway. He's right. It can be. I mean, it can be conspiracy theories.

1:29:37But also, do you remember when Robb Stark, not the other one, Jon Snow. Jon Snow. Tony Stark. Jon Snow was dead and he was all like, I'm definitely dead. I'm not coming back. But he hadn't cut his hair. And everybody was like, He's totally coming back. And you know what? Well, no spoilers, obviously. He totally came back. Oh, my God. Yeah. That's one of Game of Thrones.

1:30:00Chris Hewitt:I understood that reference. And I know, Littlefinger as well. That was a big reference. Which I totally understood. Oh, my God. That guy reaped the benefits, didn't he? Yeah, it's such a Littlefinger. Oh, my God. And you know what they say about men with Littlefinger? Tiny gloves. Yeah. Small rings. Small rings. He was the Lord of the Small Rings, wasn't he? Do you know why he's called Littlefinger? Because he's, I don't know why. Because his sort of, his holding was in an area of land called the Fingers, because they're sort of promontories, and his was the smallest promontory, and so it was known as Littlefinger.

1:30:32See, you should have known you would get an answer like that. The question, I guess, really is, why would he tell us?

1:30:39Chris Hewitt:I mean, what useful information has been pushed out of your head to make way for that? I do often worry about that. Like, basic things, like how to do the household tasks. If I had a heart attack right now, would you know how to do CPR? Well, I've recently watched all 15 episodes of The Pit, and there is a CPR episode in that. I don't have time for you to re-watch all 15 episodes. It's in here somewhere. Look, Noah Wiley managed this at one point. What episode is it? Oh, yeah, here we go, here we go. That's it. Okay, one a second. Good, good, good. Yeah. All right, so I'd be in safe hands? Yeah.

1:31:13Chris Hewitt:Or would you just hope that an eyeball creature would reanimate me and walk me around for a bit? Okay. We'd go full weekend of Bernie's. Because I do worry about that. Because I've got all the eyeballs. Being reanimated by an eyeball creature? No, about all the shit that's got out of my head. Yeah. Oh, yeah. You know, in order to store all the useless arcane nonsense that will mean nothing to me, ultimately. Have you ever done that thing where, like on your iPhone, you can check storage, and it gives you that line which color codes how much your music is using up, your apps are using up. Mine is being like, Game of Thrones knowledge, like 48%.

1:31:44Taylor Swift knowledge, 20%. And it's like, basic human tasks, 0.3%. Like, there's nothing left. Bottom wiping, nothing.

1:31:53Chris Hewitt:It's just no idea. Yeah. Didn't want to bring it down, but there you go. You did. Yeah, you did. And yet you did. And yet I did. Well, you know what to do. If you have problems wiping your bottom, just use your little finger. And we're back. Okay. Bye to the pilot listeners who have... They've long since deposited. Boyd, he would never do that. Boyd, he would never do bawdy humor. Filth Pure filth Boyd Cavalier Does Boyd walk around with his shoes and socks off? Regularly Misquoting Arthur C. Clarke Alright, let's wrap this up Oh shit, more questions Shit, I forgot Fileshopaholic Has nobody ever taught Kirsch never to sit with his back to the door?

1:32:38Yeah, it's bad luxury

1:32:39Chris Hewitt:Reacher would be fucking disgusted by that behaviour Who would be? Reacher Reacher, yeah Never said we'd be about to know. Good scene, though. Yeah, it was. It was a good scene. Did you think he knew? Did you think he was aware? Were you waiting for him to turn around and confront Morrow? Oh, yeah. Or did you think he was going to be caught unawares? No, I didn't for a second think he'd be caught unawares because he's Kirsch. He's Kirsch. He's cool, even though we still don't know what the fuck he's up to. Yeah. Yeah, we like that guy. What about the Lost Boys? Are we happy with the Lost Boys?

1:33:11Chris Hewitt:Do we think that conceit works? I mean, they got a lot of shit. Certainly, like, the subreddit was awash with people furious with the performances of adults playing children. I thought it was spot on. I thought their performances were great. Yeah, I loved it. I thought, in particular, Smee and, insert name of... Nibs. No, not Nibs. Jane, as she knows. Again, not Jane. Oh, the other one. Keep going through them. Yeah. The one who's always with Smee. Yeah. Smee's friend, who is... Slightly. Slightly, yes. Those two together were brilliant, where they're, like, pushing each other, and they act so much like young teenage boys.

1:33:43And just the way they talk, the way they're like, oh God, I'm bored. I thought that was great. I love them so much. Really enjoyed them as a double act. I was a bit worried that something bad would happen to them and I would have been furious. Yeah, I thought that was great. And yeah, I think it did work as it can see. And I think it's a fun wrinkle. And again, and all your references in the interview, who else would have come at this from a Peter Pan perspective? Who else would have come at this from a hey let's put kids in and what the fuck like as a pitch for alien on earth this is extraordinary yeah i love the ball swings that it takes i guess it's a way of playing with some of the alien iconography without being boring yes um so you're kind of you know you've got you had newt in in peril in aliens and it worked really well my name's newt and he calls me rebecca except my brother okay are we done now what's her surname go on what's her full name tell me now get fucked fine my point is

1:34:48Chris Hewitt:CPR has gone out of my head but I know she's called Rebecca Newt Jordan so since that we've had endless action movies that have put a kid in peril in the middle of the you know big burly whoever's who are trying to save the world right I just feel like partly because aliens is aliens, right? Everybody wants to be aliens. This is a way of kind of referencing that and putting kids in the middle of the action without putting kids in the middle of the action. And I think it also plays off this idea of the alien as an animal because you have kids who are also kind of figuring out the moral universe and how to be humans, which is also an interesting thing to play against the synths.

1:35:30And then if you have these kids and these pretty near indestructible bodies, but not totally indestructible, which is important. I think that gives you such rich pickings, frankly, for this show to play with. So I'm loving it. I don't understand why you wouldn't.

1:35:46Chris Hewitt:Yeah, in that regard, the death of Tootles in episode six was really startling. Tootles, Pip. Very good. Because you were already conditioned to see them as indestructible. indestructible. And it's like, oh, this little fly, that's not going to take out one of these multi-billion dollar prototypes. And then, oh shit, no, he's gone. He ain't coming back. I think it was a smart move because I guess there's an element of so many of these alien films have tried to recreate the kind of Ripley archetype. And I like that this leans more into the Newt archetype, which I think is a lot of fun. So, yeah, here for it.

1:36:21Chris Hewitt:And also, because they're kids, they can make dumb decisions. Yes. Yeah. And you'd be totally fine with it. Yeah. And Amon can stop shouting at the person for running upstairs or whatever. The thing is, I put it to you that if you were being chased by an alien, you would not necessarily make good decisions. You would just shit your pants and run into a wall. But things like Tootles, you know, in a normal, if he were an adult and he has that moment where Curly's like, oh, do you want me to come to the library with you, mate? And he's like, no, no, no, I'm totally fine. I've got this because he's got that childlike hubris.

1:36:57Chris Hewitt:Yeah, very much. very much that and then he makes the dumbest decision possible but it's fine because he is a kid but also not being funny not just a kid like how many times have you done something kind of like oh if I just I know it's a bit and you don't really think about it and you know it's stupid but you think oh it'll be fine like I could totally see even an adult just thinking oh that's fine I'll just hold the door I'll just hold the door open it'll be fine for a second yeah and of course and then fucking psycho sheep head past the glass in one of my favourite moments yeah the night because I lived in LA for a year and the night I was due to fly back to London and I was packing furiously and I was really well behind as you might be surprised to know and I got very little sleep that night and I had to take something to the garbage bin, the massive bin outside the block of flats which had a, or the apartment block which had a automatic door that closed and I went outside and I went to hold it up on my foot and I put the thing back in the thing and the door literally an episode of Friends isn't it the door closed and I was suddenly like I don't have my keys on me like one time I don't go out with my keys I can't get back in and it was like two in the morning and I couldn't call anyone to come and get me and I had to I had to somehow clamber onto the bin and clamber over the fence and you know what I'm like with heights and it was it was it was a thing it was a thing yikes I could have died wow maybe I did maybe you did anyway maybe you are like the Lost Boys ghosts that's a fun story for the pilot listeners so last last knockings what else do you like about the show music yes I like the music and some people really didn't like those kind of because it's very kind of 90s rock metal grunge type stuff but also it's not just the music it's just the fact that no one has ever done anything like that really in an alien thing before.

1:38:57No, and Metallica is now canon in the alien universe, which is wonderful. But I really liked the final episode, which is Animal by Pearl Jam, which the whole song is about I'd rather be with an animal, just basically how awful humans are and that animals are better than humans. I thought that was a really nice button to end the series on. And that's from Versus. And what's on the cover of Versus? Oh my God, a fucking sheep! Wow! Wow, it all comes full circle. That hadn't even crossed my mind. I think it's a sheep, unless it's a ghost. It is a sheep. No, it's a sheep. It is a sheep. It's a full-on sheep.

1:39:23oh my god so what we're saying is it works on so many levels yeah the eyeball fuck me wow

1:39:30Chris Hewitt:the eyeball fuck me yes it would it would I fuck you completely but yeah that's it would I fuck you E-Y-E-I I understood not I okay wasn't another what did you say bottom remnant

1:39:48Chris Hewitt:yeah I loved it I loved the music I thought those those those Passion Pumpkins, Chirp Rock, Ends of Sandman, there was Jane's Addiction in there. It was distracting at times. Episode 7 ends with Songs for the Dead by Queens of the Stone Age, which is one of my favorite introductions of all time. It has this amazing guitar riff, and then Dave Grohl comes in because he was a drummer at the time. And it's just one of the best pieces of drumming I've ever heard. And I was so, I genuinely was watching it. I was like, fucking hell, this is Queens of the Stone Age. And I started getting ready to air drum.

1:40:22Chris Hewitt:And I was air drumming so much, I missed the key for the dialogue at the end of the episode. Should I rewind it? Nah, I'm air drumming. Fuck it. It'll be fine. Arthur's fucked. It's good. Wow. Yeah. Not that it's good for Arthur. I liked Arthur. I didn't want him to die. Yeah. Did you hope he would get out? Somehow they would find a way that maybe he would be taken tomorrow before the alien came out of him. No, he was always doomed. Yeah. I don't think you could be that revisionist and still be alien, if I'm honest no although I guess Prometheus kind of did it yeah she did yeah yeah alright are we done?

1:41:01Chris Hewitt:is there anything else you want to say? or should we I think we're yeah can I dream? of electronic sheep hi hi hi hi there we go anyway on that note it is game over folks a game over for this Alien Earth spoiler special I hope you've enjoyed it and for the pilot TV listeners who are experiencing us for the first time, this is what we're like all the time. Yeah, I'm so sorry. It's true. Yeah. It is true. So, so sorry. But anyway, there we go. That is it. Hopefully we'll be back in four or five years for season two. Keep and peeled on your Empire Supporter special feed for some movie stuff and on your pilot TV feed for some TV stuff.

1:41:44Chris Hewitt:I can't be more specific than that. But we welcome and cherish your love and ongoing support. Speaking of love and ongoing support, bye James. Not bad for a human. Eh, I don't know. I don't know. Goodbye Helen. Toodle, toodles pip then? Wow. Too soon. It doesn't really work. Too soon. Hey! It was brilliant. He's barely cold. He's been cold for two episodes. It's fine. alright. And it is goodbye from me. I'm off to airdrum and thus miss my own outro. To the queens of the Stone Age. Oh yeah, here he goes. And then he goes. That is indistinguishable from the real thing. It's the real fucking thing.

1:42:34Chris Hewitt:That's the rhythm and everything. Oh God. Thanks for listening. See you next time. Bye. Pilot out.