Mount Rushmore: Carry On Spidey, Don't Lose Your Head

0:14Chris Hewitt:Hello pod, I'm Chris Hewitt. Welcome to the latest episode, third episode of the show we're calling for legal reasons, the Mount, or we've decided we don't want to be sued by a mountain anymore. We're okay with that. Yeah, just a Mount Rushmore show. It's a different title every month. I don't know. Hi, I don't know. Harry, why don't you say the words, welcome to the Mount Rushmore Show, so that if the Mount Rushmore does decide to sue us, they'll come straight to you. That's fine. Welcome to the Mount Rushmore Show. Roll up, roll up. Sue Harry Stainer, giant bit of rock in America. Anyway, yes, my name is Chris Hewitt, and this is the Mount Rushmore.

0:49Chris Hewitt:Shit! The Mount Rushmore Show. Now we're both going to get sued. I know. It's a disaster, isn't it? Anyway, this is the show in which we tackle topics sent in to us by you, the listeners, on Instagram. And we come up with a Mount Rushmore pertaining to that topic. And, of course, it's film-related, in case that wasn't clear. And I'm joined by Harry Stainer. Hello. Hello, Harry. He's going to be sued. James Dyer is also here. Hello, James. Hi, Chris. How are you? I'm okay. That's not true, Lewis. It's not true at all. James seems quite stressed. You're massively stressed. This Mount Rushmore happens halfway between an episode of pilot, which we've interrupted today.

1:29But that's fine.

1:30Chris Hewitt:You're going to be able to, when you listen to next week's pilot, I wouldn't recommend it, but if you do listen to it, you'll be able to judge the exact moment that you were kicked out of the studio. Yeah. And then had to come and do this. We recorded this, and then you did that. So this is kind of like, you know the way that Robert Zemeckis shut down the filming of Cast Away, so that Tom Hanks could lose all that weight. and then he shot What Lies Beneath in between that and then when he came back to shoot Castaway he'd already shot What Lies Beneath So this is the What Lies Beneath of the Empire podcast I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing I like What Lies Beneath Do you?

2:05Chris Hewitt:I think I'm probably referring to Castaway so actually that's good We found the person who likes What Lies Beneath Hey that's mean This is very that's mean but completely and 100 % accurate and we're also joined by and I'm sorry I don't know your surname our worky this week Maddie? Yeah just Maddie is fine Just Maddie? Is it like a Beyonce thing? Like a Sandia thing? You don't have a last name. I do, but it's technically, people abbreviate it to DJ because I'm a double-barred name. So if you call me Maddie DJ, it feels good. Maddie DJ? And if you ever need a DJ name, DJ Maddie would make more sense.

2:37Is Maddie short for Madison and are there two Y's in it but not where we think? It's Madeline. Oh, so that doesn't work at all.

2:44Chris Hewitt:DJ Madeline. Madeline. Not being used with a mandolin, of course, which is what Peter Buck plays. Or a pangolin, which is an animal. Indeed. All right. So we're off to a good start. Time 25. Things that Madeline is not like. Yes. Pangolin. Mandarins, pangolins. All right. Mandarins. Anyway, so I have asked for questions, for topics rather, for us to consider for the Mount Rushmore. And you responded in your tens on Instagram. I can't find Instagram. What's the one? Oh, it's the one with the camera. Yes. This is going so well. you have thrown me so much your panic has thrown me I'm now infused with panic You have to go to a screening in like 20 minutes I do, I do which is why this might be a shorter episode of Mount Rushmore It's more like a hill So we should probably get to the actual Mount Rushmore part shall we?

3:34Chris Hewitt:Sure Let's do that Alright So Gary McClain1 on Instagram simply says a Mount Rushmore of Spider-Man fill-ins Now Matty I don't know if you've ever listened to this show it's only the third episode so I wouldn't expect you to have listened to it or indeed anyone to have listened to it but this is It's basically a Mount Rushmore, so what we do is we all choose one each, and then we have a communal one at the end. But of course, if you have a suggestion for our Mount Rushmore of Spider-Man villains, you can throw it in at any time. Okay, cool. Yeah, just have a little, yeah, have a think. I can have a think.

4:04Chris Hewitt:Have a think. Jimbo, I'm going to come to you first in this one, because I know Harry has a good one for the next topic, because he texted and said, I've got a good one for the next topic. Oh, I see. Preparation boy. Preparation H, that's what they call him. What do they call him? H for Harry. That is what they call him. Preparation H. They do. Yeah, that's true. Right, what was the question again? Spider-Man villains. Spider-Man villains. From the movies. From the movies. All right, Mount Rushmore. I see. So Mount Rushmore is a mountain in America. Okay. In one of the Dakotas. I see. Okay. Yes.

4:40Chris Hewitt:And you have to choose a giant face to go on Mount Rushmore. So who is your Mount Rushmore of Spider-Man villains? At the moment, off the top of my head, on my mountain, is Jake Gyllenhaal. Jake Gyllenhaal? Yeah. As Quentin Beck, a.k.a. Mysterio. Wow. From? From Spider-Man Far From Home. Brackets 2019. Exactly. Because I think the rug pull in that is masterfully executed. Isn't it? I think he injects it with a sort of maniacal glee, but also a twinkle in his eye. Like he's genuinely funny, but also suitably villainous. Yeah. And I like the heel turn that he does. I just think I think it's a really that was a really difficult thing to pull off and I think he does it exceptionally well so yeah I think of of the Spider-Man villains on screen I pick Mysterio because he's a proper unrepentant dickhead he is a thing you get with a lot of the Spider-Man villains and maybe some of the ones we're going to be discussing soon I don't know is that they are humanized and sometimes redeemed as the movie or movies go on we do not like redemption we don't believe in redemption me who's about to pick two people who are both redeemed.

5:49Chris Hewitt:And Quentin Beck is a complete and utter prick. You can see why Tony Stark fired him in the first place. You can. And frankly, I'm glad he's dead. Oh God, yeah, he is dead, isn't he? He is proper dead. I forgot he was dead. Yeah. Yeah. Oh no, he died. Yeah, he did die. His death is a catalyst for Spider-Man being kind of public enemy number one in the beginning of No Way Home. So he kind of half wins at the end. He does win. I mean, he's dead. I mean, dying doesn't win. He's not really winning. But he lands the globe. game. If anything, it's a Pyrrhic victory. Yeah. But the long game. Yeah, he's playing a long game.

6:23It's the long sleep. As long as, well, as long as, if Pyrrhic came to be dead. His decision to be dead,

6:28Chris Hewitt:it leads to Peter being, and of course, he outs Peter as well, publicly. That leads to Peter's decision to say, oh, I don't want the world to know that, you know, to forget that I'm Spider-Man. And then, of course, that has ramifications, which leads to everything that happens in No Way Home, which has more ramifications, which leads to Peter's even more stupid idea to go, I don't want the world to remember Peter Parker. And which then leads to Brand New Day, which leads to Marvel making over$2 billion at the box office. He hasn't thought this through. So he could be like the most successful Spider-Man villain in terms of like fucking up Peter Parker's life.

7:03Yeah.

7:03Chris Hewitt:You know, I'm talking about Peter Parker life fucker upper myself is what he says. I don't care if I die doing it. I'm just going to fuck it up. That sequence in the bar in Prague where he is revealed is terrific. So that film has quite a lot of fun with the idea that you kind of know he's the villain from the off and it kind of plays with that and I always quite like that part. You knew he was the villain? No, never. I had no idea. John Watts, I've spotted several people from Mysterio's entourage before Mysterio appears. But you know that sequence in Venice? So when Peter's walking through, Peter Parker, played by Tom Holland of course, is walking through Venice this is before he's encountered Mysterio or the Water Man and whatever any of those illusion villains are, you can see members of Mysterio's entourage stalking Peter and looking at Peter.

7:54Chris Hewitt:They're kind of hidden in the background or sometimes even in the foreground. And apparently Jake Gyllenhaal is in one of those crowd scenes kind of stalking Peter. And I haven't been able to find him. No, I've never noticed that. I've only seen that film once. Oh, it's so good. It's so much fun. No, it's not my least watched Spider-Man film. That's the amazing Spider-Man film. Oh, well, yeah. Which is why you've chosen Electro. Electro is my pick. no no don't worry don't worry he's just who's your pick what's your pick my pick is I'm going for low hanging fruit Doc Ock which one's that Alfred Molina okay which one's that um Spider-Man 2 you went for low hanging Doc Ock low hanging Doc Ock yeah that's fair um I he does get redeemed he does he's a fantastic villain you have all the great set up with him in the dining room and him having dinner together but also regardless of all the redemption stuff just some great action sequences Power of the Sun the part of his hand the part of his hand but you have the train sequence you have the amazing fight on the building I just think in terms of just like visually he's one of the most exciting Spider-Man villains we've had but also I think Alfred Marine is just really great as that character there's a reason they brought him back coward though didn't go for the classic Doc Ock bowl cut and I think that was a mistake creatively also it's got the absolutely bonkers scene in the surgery that's like something straight out of an Evil Dead film I think even watching that as a kid I was like I love this because it's kind of terrifying Sam Raimi made a good film.

9:13Who knew? But, hi Chris. Yeah, it's, I'll let that go. I do like Spider-Man 2. It is definitely the best of the Raimi Spider-Mans. It is still, I think, lesser than the current generation of Spider-Man. I'm fully disagreeing with you on that one. That's fine. You're allowed to be wrong. It's okay.

9:32Chris Hewitt:Okay. I'm not going to go for anyone from any of the Mark Webb Spider-Mans for obvious reasons. Although I do like Paul Giamatti's Rhino just because it's something Paul Giamatti always wanted to do. It was like a little box he wanted to tick to play the rhino for some reason. That's his favorite Spider-Man villain and he wanted to do it and he got it. I'm going to go for Bruce Campbell. Of course you are. From Raimi's Spider-Man trilogy. He plays three different characters. He plays the wrestling announcer, the ringside announcer who kind of gives Spider-Man his name. Yeah. And he plays Snooty Usher in Spider-Man 2.

10:05Chris Hewitt:He does. And he plays Maitre D in Spider-Man 3. And in each part, each installment, he kind of defeats Spider-Man. So even though he's not a super-powered bad guy, I think he's… He's your Spider-Man villain? Yes, because I wanted to choose someone good for the comic book choice. I mean, he got Bruce Campbell. Imagine Bruce Campbell's face up there in Mount Rushmore. It'll look amazing. I mean, he does kind of ruin his whole proposal in Spider-Man 3. And it kind of embarrasses him as well. Yeah. I've unfortunately blocked Spider-Man 3 out of my memory. Oh, God. Oh, God. You're going to be like, this is going to be one of your wild Gen Z takes.

10:39I like Spider-Man 3. Best Spider-Man. I like Spider-Man 3. What the fuck? Right. If you cut Venom out of that film. If you cut the film out of that film. It's brilliant. That's not true. Venom was forced into that film. Sandman, not going to bat for him for the Mount Rushmore yet. All the Venom scenes were improvised. He wasn't meant to be in that film.

10:59Chris Hewitt:He just showed up. But Sony forced that into the film. Sandman is good. Sandman is a good villain. Sandman, I don't think the effects are quite there with Sandman. but he has the pathos and humanity that most of Raimi's villains have. But again, I go back to Quentin Beck. I want my Spider-Bad guys to be irredeemable pieces of shit, for the most part. For the most part. Maddie, do you have one? Are you a Spider-Man fan? That's really putting you on the spot, sorry. You don't have to have. It's okay, it's okay. I mean, you kind of stole my answer. I was going to say Doc Ock, to be honest. That's fine.

11:34Because I think, for me, it's the most memorable.

11:37Chris Hewitt:Two people fighting for Doc Ock. I'm happy with Doc Ock to be on the big wall Do you like Sandman? How do you feel about Sandman? Goggles I can't say it's sticking in my brain as someone Okay, well just me Okay, literally just you So at the moment we have Bruce Campbell as three different characters We have Quentin Beck Jake Gyllenhaal and we have Doc Ock played by Alfred Molina from Spider-Man 2 Alright, call me no choice This is the tricky part Can I bring one to the table? Of course again Good God I hate to think Do you know what? James had a stressful day and he's taking it out on Spider-Man 3 anyway let Preparation Age speak Harry go for it The Vulture from Spider-Man Homecoming The Vulture yes purely because I think the twist in that the twist really well and I did not see it coming and when it all comes together I was like he has that scene where he has Peter in the back of the car and he's just being an intimidating piece of shit to this kid to this high school kid that is a great scene yeah it is a great scene and I was like at that point in the film I was like this is a great villain he's actually scary to like a high school teenager Major.

12:38Really good in it. Could we just say Harry had a good take and this is something that we should write down? Harry always has good takes. What are you talking about? James has kind of turned on me in the last. That's it. I don't remember this. You've always been nice to me.

12:49Chris Hewitt:You're tarnishing Harry here. You're painting him with the same brush you used to paint Ben. That's your problem here. There are two peas in a pod. Oh dear. But yeah, I feel very attacked today. That's fine. I want the viewers to know that I'm not happy about it. Harry's proof forward The Fulcher played by Michael Keaton from Spider-Man Homecoming. No notes? at all. That's a good choice. Can I just throw in Willem Dafoe as the Green Goblin real quick? I mean, the design on the Green Goblin in Raimi's original Spider-Man is, of course, famously terrible. Agreed. And regrettable. But I would say he's a great villain.

13:20Chris Hewitt:He's a great performance. You know, that line, you know, I'm something of a scientist myself, has entered the lexicon. He was great in No Way Home. He was the main villain of No Way Home. That sequence in No Way Home where Peter is working with all the baddies to try and arrest their condition. And his spider sense tells him something is off. And it's the Green Goblin asserting control over Norman Osborn. That is a great moment. So I'm maybe going to suggest him. So what do you think? No. Is it him? No, it's Keaton. Or is it Keaton? Although Willem Dafoe has a great goblin face. And not the mask, his actual face.

13:54And would look good on a mountain. But I would go with Keaton.

13:57Chris Hewitt:I don't think I've ever seen Willem Dafoe's goblin face. I'm in two minds. Because I think there's the great scene when he's not in the costume. and there's blood on the ceiling. Yes. And that's really unnerving because you're like, I know, he knows that Peter is Spider-Man. However, there is also a scene where the Green Goblin captures Spider-Man on a rooftop and both of them have masks on. That was terrible. And it's absolute dog shit. Because they're like, it's meant to be really emotive, but both of them are like barely moving. It's so bad. So it's just really awkward and uncomfortable. It's the one scene in that movie I'm like, why?

14:29Chris Hewitt:Just get them to take the masks off. Awkward and uncomfortable. That's where I live. This podcast was founded on those emotions. We've got to make a decision because we don't have a lot of time left. Keaton, always Keaton. I'm about for Keaton. All right, Keaton, majority rules. All right, so there we go. Michael Keaton is on the Mount Rushmore, the fourth Spider-Man villain. I'm sorry, Norman. I tried. You didn't try hard enough. That was meant to be him, by the way. Okay, so next up, and this is from someone. This is from someone. This is from Simak Attack. Mack, Mount Rushmore of movie decapitations.

15:10Chris Hewitt:Hell yeah. Carry on. Don't lose your head. Harry, you said you had someone good for this. If you have my choice, which is just the greatest decapitation of all time, I will be very mad because I don't have a backup. Okay, I've got two, but I'm going with this one. Let me paint a picture for you. All right. I'm at university. You sounded a little bit Michael Caine there. I've got two. I've got two. I've got two. bloody decapitations. Let me paint a picture for you. I'm at uni. My housemate is like, I've heard of this film Hereditary. Oh my God. We should throw it on. I've heard it's a good horror film.

15:44Me, I've not heard of Ari Aster yet. No one has. No one has at that point. We chuck it on TV and for the first hour or so we're like, this is good. This is scary stuff. And then the scene happens and the four of us were sat on the sofa and literally we had to pause the fucking film because we were like, did that? because it comes so out of nowhere. What happens, Harry? Paint a picture of that. The child, I've forgotten her name. She has a weed brownie and she's kind of tripping balls in the back of the car. Major ball sag. Pops her head out the window to get some air while her brother is driving drunk.

16:16And within a moment, they go past the lamppost and her head comes clean off. Clean off. And the brother is so in shock that he drives all the way home, parks the car and goes to bed. And then the opening shot the next day as the mum comes in the house it's just the head on the floor with like flies and maggots on it and it's pretty fucking gnarly and we had literally paused the film and we're like did that did that just happen and it's kind of burnt itself into my brain ever since and i haven't watched hereditary since hereditary

16:47Chris Hewitt:hereditary do you know i uh i interviewed ari aster um just uh shortly after that movie came out and at that point there was the i don't know whether it was a meme or a theory that the film was called Hereditary because her head hit a tree. And I put this to him. It did not go well. Yeah, I can't. Had he heard it before? No, he hadn't. So I had to explain to him. You know, you know, Ari, because her head hit a tree. No, hello? Ari? Is this thing on? Is this when he left the room? Is this when he just disappeared? Yes. Whenever people leave the room, I go, is this on? Why are you talking back to me?

17:25Chris Hewitt:Yeah. Her name is Charlie, by the way. He did take it in good humor. Okay. But no, he refuted the allegations. So that's a cracker. Yeah, her name is Charlie, by the way, the character. So Charlie gets decapitated. Oh, dear. All right. No, Charlie, no head. Maddie, do you have a decapitation on your mind? No, I'm definitely not a horror movie person. People get decapitated in non-horror films. It does happen. but I just get like I'm not good with any sort of blood scene gore scene alright don't watch Hereditary don't it's not for you I mean he spoiled the best bit I did start Hereditary and I just I was like you I just I couldn't continue it did you get to the the head being lopped off no so that's actually news to me alright wow we just ruined that for you she's never gonna watch it again it's fine Jimbo I can't decide between three I'm struggling what do you mean you can't decide between three I can't decide between three because I mean Basically, the nature of Mount Rushmore, for a start, is decapitated heads.

18:26That's the whole thing. So this is a perfect example for it. So on the one hand, I've got David Warner, the omen. Don't you fucking touch that. But I know you're going to want that. Yes. So I'm going to leave that alone. Good. Which leaves me with two possibilities. Yes. And the first one is Clancy Brown in Highlander. Oh. There can be only one. It's the worst Clancy Brown I've ever heard. Thank you. It's the worst Scotsman you've ever heard either. but there are so many decapitations in Highlander obviously because that's the whole premise of the film but that particular one is quite gratifying and then it ends with him getting the prize and the quickening and all of that so that's a big one for the light show for the electricity for the kind of like is my head still on?

19:05No it's not then it bends backwards and the light comes out I think that was the first movie to do that sort of like you've been decapitated but you don't know you have and then suddenly the head falls off

19:15Chris Hewitt:yeah it happens a lot you see Taye Diggs kind of has a situation like that in Equilibrium. Not to spoil that too much. Not to ruin Equilibrium. But there's a number of movies that are like that. Hans, I think, in Highlander 3 as well with Married and Done Peoples. Yeah. Cube, where people get sliced in bits. And Resident Evil, where you see Colin Salmon, some cubed salmon going on there. True. So spoilers for all those movies. But yeah, that's a good one. What's your third? The third one is King Willy from Predator 2. King Willy. Because you have that bit where the Predator comes for King Willy, head of the Boogie Posse, and then it cuts to Willy's face, and then you pull out, and the Predator is holding his head, and walking away.

19:57Chris Hewitt:His scream is played over his decapitated heads. So you hear the scream, and the mouth is open. That's a good one. It's got to be the Kurgan, right? The Kurgan's probably the pick, but I do have a soft spot for King Willy. It's got to be the Kurgan. Alright, well listen, we have a communal choice. now I could leave David Warner in the omen until until then if we wanted to do that David Thule this is a good one in this regard because he's been decapitated I think about four times on screen and once told me that he actually had some of his mock heads that he kept them at home and now and again he would pop one in the fridge if he had a mate coming around so he would pop his severed head in the fridge or if he had a friend staying over in a guest room he would put his severed head in the bed.

20:47Chris Hewitt:That's kind of fucked up. I mean, good for him. It's fun. It's a fun thing. Maybe. I don't know. He was decapitated, I think. He was decapitated in the remake of The Omen in 2006 because he played the photographer Jennings, who is doomed to have his head lopped off. But his decapitation in that movie is not as good as David Warner's. I don't trust you guys to vote for The Omen from 1976, which I think is the greatest decapitated head of all time. So Jennings, real quick, Jennings in that movie he knows that something bad is going to happen to him because there's some nonsense with photographs of people predicting their fates etc and Gregory Peck at this moment in time has relented he doesn't want to kill Damien because he's just a child he doesn't quite believe is the Antichrist and so he throws away the daggers of Megiddo and Jennings goes to retrieve them and wouldn't you know it then an omen style accident happens in the omen and a pane of glass shoots forward, runs down a hill on a truck, stops suddenly, the pane of glass shoots forward and decapitates poor old David Warner in broad daylight in front of loads of people, and Richard Donner, the director, shot that thing from about 14 different angles, and I've said this before, but he replays it constantly and in slow motion like it's the winner in the World Cup final, because he knows that this thing is the showstopper.

22:10Chris Hewitt:The Omen's got so many great moments in it, but you're going to come out talking about that time that Keith Jennings photographer David Warner lost his head so that is my choice it's a good choice I think it's a great choice alright we have to choose a communal choice Harry you had two right? I had a second one okay and I know James is going to about to jump down my throat it's not King Willy is it? no it's not it's Count Dooku from Revenge of the Sith Count Dooku that's a pretty good decapitation because you don't expect Anakin Skywalker I mean he's not Vader but Anakin you don't expect him to go full you know you go oh I'm gonna see how he kind of becomes Darth Vader in this film I'm gonna see his slow slow transformation across Revenge of the Sith and about half an hour in he just flat out decapitates and you're like oh okay we're there already and with two savers scissors him and he's begging for his life yeah and absolutely just completely he goes for it do it and he just do it absolutely and I'm a big and you see the head roll little CGI head roll afterwards although to be fair it's not the first decapitation because in the previous film we of course see Django yeah that's another good one Django loses his head unchained yeah and without a head I like both of them I think Star Wars does a good decapitation what can I say but I love the Count Dooku one and I think if we're going to get a big sci-fi blockbuster in there because Bulba lifts up Django's helmet and I've always which is coolish I've always wondered why his dad doesn't just fall out.