Feel the Fear - And Do It Anyway with Cliff Nonnenmacher

0:01Boom! Shake the room, Fire Nation. JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire. brought to you by High Level, the all-in-one sales and marketing platform. Today, we'll be breaking down Feel the Fear and Do It Anyway. To drop these vibe bombs, I brought Cliff Nautamacher into EO Fire Studios. Cliff is a franchise expert and serial entrepreneur and built businesses from Wall Street to Main Street. It is now helping others find financial freedom through practical, proven franchise guidance. And today, we'll be talking about fear, about catastrophic thinking. We'll talk about why franchises fail and what separates the ones who succeed from those who don't and oh so much more.

0:40And a big thank you for sponsoring today's episode goes to Cliff and our sponsors. Are you ready for the ultimate all-in-one platform for entrepreneurs, marketers, coaches, and agencies? Build funnels, automate follow-ups, manage clients, and even white-label your own software. Say hello to our featured partner, High Level, and visit highlevelfire.com. to start your free trial today. Fire Nation, it's time to stop guessing and start winning with a proven playbook. Inside the Freedom Circle, you'll have access to my step-by-step systems for creating offers, building processes, and driving traffic, all in just 90 days.

1:21Ready for freedom? Visit freedom-circle.com to learn more. Cliff, say what's up to Fire Nation and share something that you believe about becoming successful that most people disagree with. Absolutely. Hey, Fire Nation, this is going to be a good episode, so tune in. I absolutely, I want to discuss fear today. So the one thing I believe about success that most people would disagree with is that fear is not a sign to stop. It's a signal to move forward, move forward with courage and clarity. We discussed this in our book, Beyond the Brand. we write that fear is not your enemy. Indecision is. Most people think they have to eliminate fear before making any big moves.

2:08They think everything has to be perfect. And we believe the opposite. Success demands that you act despite fear, right? So it's like, you got to feel the fear and do it anyway. So what we've learned by doing this for 25 years, if you're waiting for clarity, you're probably stalling on courage. And we see this all the time with people investing in businesses. They say they want freedom and they want all these platitudes. They want all this different lifestyle, but what they really want is certainty and freedom and certainty rarely exist in the same sentence. So I end with success belongs to the people that are willing to take risks before they're fully ready because there's, there's, they just, you have to understand discomfort is the down payment for growth.

2:54And for the audience, John, everything you've ever wanted, including me, everything I have ever wanted is on the other side of fear. I love to say all the magic happens outside of your comfort zone because I've seen that time and time again. People, of course, we want to sit on our couch and watch Netflix. That's comfortable. Have Uber Eats deliver us food. But guess what? All the magic happens outside of that comfort zone. That's why we're talking today about feeling the fear and doing it anyways. And we've already just taken a big chomp out of this, but I want to dive deeper. why, Cliff? Why is fear so rarely discussed in business circles, even though it drives so many flipping decisions?

3:35I know. It is. It's unbelievable. You could tune into podcasts all day long, and it's going to be the same stuff over and over and over. No one discusses fear. First of all, most people don't actually understand it. They just react to it. And what folks don't understand is that fear is biological. It's not logical. And that's why people like to dress it up and disguise it with words like, I'm being cautious. Oh, the timing's not right. We're formulating a strategy, the economy. And then the new thing now is tariffs. It's like, oh, so you're not going to do something because of tariffs? I mean, everyone dresses up fear, right?

4:14It's true. How many times have you heard someone talk about, I really want to wait and see how these tariffs play out. It's like, stop it, man. You have lost hundreds of thousands, if not millions of dollars sitting on the sidelines because you like to avoid fear. Fear is one of the most influential forces in our lives, and it is absolutely the least discussed. We talk about strategy. We talk about motivation, mindset, success, killing it, crushing it, a thousand to one. And the reality is that fear kills more dreams than failure ever will. This is actually, we've done a ton. John, we lose a ton of money because of fear, like a ton of money every year.

4:57And that's one of the reasons why it's like, yeah, you could come on and pitch brands and pitch brands and pitch brands. People will not get off center until they understand how to harness their emotions. Again, it's biological. It's not logical. But listen to this. When we're born, we have two fears, two innate fears, the fear of falling and the fear of loud noises. That's it. That is it. All other fears, fear of public speaking, the fear of failure, the fear of snakes, darkness, the boogeyman, rejection, they're all acquired through experiences, mainly parents, well-intentioned family members and friends, peers, media, culture, maybe some personal trauma.

5:41So as I mentioned, fear is biological and the brain's amygdala detects threats, real or imagined, and I put emphasis on imagined because 85 % of what people worry about never flipping happens. And the moment, the moment I understood this, everything clicked for me. The root of fear is identification with the ego and the ego, which no one wants to talk about because nobody wants to admit it. The ego is that false self that believes it must control life, avoid loss, and protect an imagined identity. And if you think about all the moves you've made and all the things that people deal with, the ego is never at peace.

6:20It is always defending. It's always anticipating. And it's always seeking something in the future, which is usually more success, more approval, more security, because the ego thrives on dissatisfaction and literally the illusion of incompleteness. this shit is just people don't talk about this enough and that's why I really wanted to spend time with you today I've been coaching podcasters to launch their podcast for 13 years now through Podcasters Paradise and one of the biggest things that holds people back is they always say the same phrase well my show's not quite perfect yet and I'm a perfectionist so I don't want to launch until it's perfect and I finally just had to sit down and be like, what is the issue here?

7:09And then I realized what the issue was and so now I tell these people this and it really rubs them the wrong way but they need to hear it. I say, you're not a perfectionist. You're a coward. You are hiding behind the word perfectionism so you don't have to launch your thing to the world because yes, it might fail but you'd rather not know if it fails or succeeds. You'd rather not know that because it might fail and you're scared of that. You're hiding behind this word of perfectionism because of cowardice. And hey, let's be real about our emotions so that we can overcome them. And that's one thing when it comes to catastrophic thinking.

7:45How the heck, Cliff, do you coach someone through catastrophic thinking? That is very interesting. One, it's a psychological term, right? So if you met with a therapist, they would talk about it. People, I actually, I want to go back to what you just said because it's actually fascinating to me what you just said. And if you think about it, when I talk about ego, I'm talking about it in the context of business, right? I'm not talking about, you know, this guy thinks he's a great athlete. I'm talking about risk and business. The ego always lives in the past, which is regret. It's like, I knew I should have bought Bitcoin at$5.

8:23Like the whole world is saying, I knew I should have bought Bitcoin. No one bought it, but they're all regretting the past. And then it actually fears the future, which is fear and anxiety of what if I fail? But you said something that is so interesting to me because the ego is terrified of failure, loss, and uncertainty. And this is why, because it ties your worth to external things. If you lose money, if I downgrade my social status, if I take a reputation hit, the ego feels like it's threatened. And here's the issue. And this might surprise you. For most people, if your happiness depends on success, you will always be afraid of failure.

9:04And this is the biggest problem with people, is that their happiness depends on a positive outcome. People just don't take chances and say, look, big deal. I failed. I'll lick my wounds. This fear that we keep talking about, what you're experiencing, what I'm experiencing in my business, it lives in the mind, rent free. and it's a story that we continue to project into the future. It is literally a mental movie of what, by the way, it's a mental movie of only what could go wrong, right? That's all it is. Like there's no actual fear there. It's all about awareness. And when you become the observer of your own thoughts rather than a prisoner of them, fear begins to lose its grip.

9:45And what I found that most entrepreneurs aren't afraid of the market, they're not afraid of the economy, and they're not afraid of tariffs. They're afraid of an imagined failure of what people will think of losing that status and control. And that's really one of the biggest problems. But people need to understand something. The moment that you return to right now, this moment, like right now, John, do you feel threatened? No. Are you fearful? Right, right. Exactly. Right, right now I'm not. You and I can have a discussion right now about a business opportunity. There is nothing wrong right now in this moment, right in front of your face.

10:17To break that illusion, fear cannot survive in the light of presence. the same way a child's fear of a closet monster can't survive in the light of day, right? And we go so much deeper into this if clients are working with us. But now I want to get to your catastrophic thinking comment. I just wanted to close the loop on that because it's just so powerful. Would you mind just re-asking that question? Yeah. So for catastrophic thinking, how do you personally coach someone through that type of catastrophic thinking? absolutely yeah people look you know this you're smart i've listened to your episodes people are motivated by the idea of gain right that's their motive financial freedom they want time control they want personal fulfillment but but we we know there's something deeper is that the fear of loss is two times more powerful right which is what it's a loss aversion you've mentioned catastrophic thinking, coupled with that, in comes loss aversion.

11:17We feel the pain of losing something twice as intensely as we feel the pleasure of gaining something of equal value. So when someone's thinking about starting a business, even if the upside's life-changing, it literally checks every box of what they're trying to do. The fear of losing their savings, their status, and their social security screams way louder than the dream that they're trying to chase. And I really hope that I mean, if I could touch one or two or three people with this, that's like, you know what? I got, I got to stop this shit. I got to stop this catastrophic thinking. It's true.

11:50And this is why so many people stay stuck. It's not because the opportunity isn't real. It's because their brain is trying to avoid pain more than it's trying to chase the possibility of winning. I'm going to share just a quick anecdotal story with you personally. We owned a restoration franchise in Annapolis, Maryland. Okay. Every single year we paid$50 ,000 to homeowners in property damage. Okay. There's, there's a point here. They would cut water lines, gas lines, damaged furniture, run over a bike that was laying in the driveway, 50 K each year. So we flew up to the low guy live in Florida.

12:29As you know, we flew up to a location, huddled with the staff and said, here's the deal. We're cutting checks for 50 grand a year. This is what we're doing Jan 1 this year. We're going to take 50 grand and we're putting it into a bonus account for year-end payments. It's your money. You could only lose it. But every time you cut a water line, a gas line, and damaged furniture, it's coming out of that 50 grand. John, guess what? No damage. No damage. People will exert a limited amount of energy to get what they want, but they will fight like hell to keep what they have. And that is loss aversion.

13:02and that was the psychological warfare game we played with our employees. I begged them to not cut water lines. We begged them and trained them, right, to not do personal damage, property damage in the home. What really worked was to say, you know what? You don't seem motivated by a bonus at the end of the year for not doing things, so let's do this. You already earned the bonus, 50 grand. Now you can lose it, wild. That is wild, and Fire Nation, what's wild is the amount of value that we have waiting for you as soon as we get back from thanking our sponsors. Okay, let's talk about a platform that's completely changing how entrepreneurs are running their business.

13:41And they are also our featured partner, High Level. If you're an entrepreneur, coach, agency, or course creator looking to grow faster and smarter, High Level is the all-in-one platform that replaces your entire tech stack. Seriously, think ClickFunnels, Calendly, MailChimp, Kajabi, and even your CRM all rolled up into one powerful white label solution You can build funnels, send SMS and email campaigns, schedule appointments, manage pipelines, run memberships, and even launch your own branded mobile app. It's drag and drop simple, incredibly customizable, and built for serious growth. My favorite part, you can resell high level under your own brand.

14:17That means recurring revenue, loyal clients, and total control. So whether you're tired of duct taping tools together or ready to start offering high value services with ease, high level is your unfair advantage. On top of it all, their support team is second to none and has your back every step of the way. Seriously, every question that pops up, they will have your answer waiting. And if you visit my special partnership link, you'll get a free trial. So visit highlevelfire.com to start your free trial and see why thousands of businesses are switching. That's highlevelfire.com, where marketing, sales, and automation finally come together.

14:54High Level, join the revolution. Energy, focus, and recovery are critical for high performers like us and finding the right supplements can make all the difference. Quicksilver Scientific makes advanced liposomal supplements your body can use fast. Quicksilver Scientific is a US-based company that manufactures advanced liposomal supplements. In everyday terms, this means nutrients are easier for your body to absorb and put to work quickly. I've been using Quicksilver's The One, which helps restore mitochondrial function for lasting energy and clarity. And when you knock out seven podcast interviews in one day.

15:27Energy and clarity are especially important. What's also important to me is that Quicksilver has clean formulations. All of their supplements are non-GMO, have no unnecessary fillers, and are allergen tested. Quicksilver Scientific makes advanced liposomal supplements so you can actually feel the difference. Energy, focus, calm, recovery. Get 10 % off plus free shipping at tryqs.com slash fire. That's T-R-Y-Q-S dot com slash fire These statements have not been evaluated By the Food and Drug Administration This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure Or prevent any disease Hey Cliff, let's whisper Yeah man Let's whisper If you could whisper one truth into the ear Of every person who's letting fear Hold them back from business ownership What would that whisper be?

16:18I don't even know if I can whisper No, no, don't whisper That was just for effect. Oh, I was going to say, I'm not even sure I can whisper. I'm so wound up. If I could whisper one truth in the ear of every person, it would be be a disciplined investor and add structure to your process because structure kills fear. Fear only thrives in the unknown. Again, the kid in the bed at night with the closet in the bed. The kid's paranoid. There's nothing there. He checked it before he went there. It's all about the unknown. When you give someone a due diligence checklist, a funding roadmap, or a financial forecast, they move from emotion immediately to execution because that structure kills fear.

17:07I'll give you a perfect example because my brother went to school to become a pilot at Embry-Riddle. Just picture a commercial airline pilot at 35 ,000 feet. One of the engines fails mid-flight, right? That moment, alarms are blaring, drop in altitude, your stomach's in your throat. You could easily trigger panic with everyone on board except two trained pilots in the cockpit. They're the only two people out of hundreds that are calm. And the reason is simple, discipline, right? Because fear doesn't lead. The discipline does. The structure does. Instead of catastrophic thinking, we're going to crash and die, the pilot immediately drops into protocol.

17:48Do we have aircraft control? What is the problem? They do their cross checks. You hear them doing these things with their clipboards. They confirm and verify the check engine indicators. Maybe they're going to dump fuel. They're going to declare an emergency. Every step is calm, structured, and precise. The pilot doesn't need, this is the key to this whole thing. The pilots don't need to suppress fear. They feel the fear. They just override it through discipline, structure, systems, protocol, et cetera, et cetera. And that's what keeps 555 passengers alive in a near fatal situation on an Airbus A380.

18:29I didn't even know that an A380 is 555 seats. Now, exactly. Now, and again, only two people are calm. Now apply that same principle to entrepreneurship to your audience. when a potential franchisee spirals into what if I lose everything, right? What they lack is encouraged. It's the structure at Frenosity. We're providing them a flight plan, a franchisee flight plan, right? We become the co-pilot. We help you with a written investment discipline. We give you the due diligence checklist. We're the ones doing the pre-flight inspection. We're the ones telling the person, don't do this. You don't have the intestinal fortitude to be self-employed.

19:12Close the file and move on with your life and go get another job if you're so miserable because business ownership isn't for you. You've had a whole, you've had many episodes on this isn't for everybody. Come on. Like we're very candid people. We're not sitting here saying this is the best life you're ever going to live. There's, there's hair all over it. So the whisper, the, to recap the whisper, be a disciplined investor, add structure because the structure will kill the fear. That's my attitude. Cliff, I want you to take this home for us. What the heck separates the franchisees who actually succeed in this world from those who don't?

19:48It's got to be execution. I think that execution is everything in business. If you think about the business model. It's the business model is not what failed. The model works. The fail is because of misalignment, wrong person, wrong brand, wrong expectations, right? So there are people right now listening, they want passive income. They want to keep their career and do passive income. There's no passive income in self-employment. Like you got to engage. You got to get involved. Others fall in love with the product. They ignore the operations. You know, John, do you know how many people call me every day and say, I want a Papa Murphy's?

20:26I wanted this. I wanted that. Why? Why? Oh, man. Love their product. Do you love waking up at X in the morning? Do you love managing 16, 14-year-olds, 15, 16-year-olds, 18 minimum wage employees? Do you love throwing food out that doesn't sell? Do you love the – they're like, dude, what are you, trying to talk me out of this? And I'm like, no. You're the typical guy that comes to me that says, I love a product, but you don't love what it takes to run and grow a business, right? And no one actually plans for that. They don't plan working capital needs. They don't plan their exit strategy. So most successful franchisees, they get real about upfront risk, right?

21:07They get real about it. They know their numbers. They remain coachable. I put a ton of emphasis on coachable. Remain coachable if you're going to be self-employed and be in business and leverage the system's collective intelligence. You joined a system of 100 franchisees and you spoke to none of them? right? Does that even make sense? You have a hundred entrepreneurial family members. You didn't call one of them, like not one to get the answers to the test to execute flawlessly, right? Did they have adequate runway and operating capital? What was that number? Were they unreasonably selective regarding site selection and hiring?

21:43Did they ask the franchisor, how can I, how can I versus can I change? Think about what I just said. There are people listening to like, how can I do this? How can I win? How can I retain my staff. And then there's another group of people listening are like, man, I just want to know, can I offer hot dogs? Can I do tattooing? Can I change this? Can I change that? Right? Franchising is all about execution, getting really granular and being flawless about it. You have to obsess, obsess over fast break, even new customer acquisition, average ticket size, obsess over retention of your customers, your clients, right?

22:20And you, and the frequency of purchase. And that to me is really what separates folks. So Cliff, if Fire Nation's listening to your infectious energy right now and they're like, I want to connect with Cliff. I want to learn more. I want to see what is out there for me on the other side of fear. What is your call to action for Fire Nation today? Visit us on the web, frenocity.com, F-R-A-N-O-C-I-T-Y.com. Reach out to us. Schedule a 15, 20-minute call. We'll take a good temperature check on whether or not they're a fit for franchising? Do they have that intestinal fortitude? What is their risk tolerance, right?

22:58What's their fear tolerance? We're having that whole discussion today. You know, if they're paralyzed in fear, it's not going to work and they're going to end up losing a ton of money. So we want to help people properly navigate the process. Start by, stop being a perpetual listener, right? And I love that you listen. I love that you're tuning into podcasts and I love that you're growing and you're learning. You can't just be an observer, the listener of everyone else's life. At some point, you got to stop being a spectator and start playing your own game. Fire Nation, it's time to play your own game.

23:31It's time to grab that control and start pressing some buttons. And there's a reason why Cliff is the featured, the only, the exclusive franchise partner of entrepreneurs on fire. There's a reason for that because he's amazing at what he does. And you're the average Fire Nation of the five people you spend the most time with. And you've been hanging out with Cliff and JLD today, so keep up that heat. And for everything we talked about, links and all that jazz, go to eofire.com and type Cliff in the search bar. And the show notes page will pop right up. And Cliff, thank you for sharing your truth, your knowledge, your value with Fire Nation today.

24:09For that, we salute you, brother, and we'll catch you on the flip side. Thank you, folks. Thanks, John. Hey, Fire Nation, a huge thank you to our sponsors and Cliff for sponsoring today's episode. And Fire Nation, are you ready to rock your very own podcast? Check out our free podcasting course where I will teach you how to create and launch your podcast for, you guessed it, free, freepodcastcourse.com. I'll catch you there or I'll catch you on the flip side. Are you ready for the ultimate all-in-one platform for entrepreneurs, marketers, coaches, and agencies? Build funnels, automate follow-ups, manage clients, and even white-label your own software Say hello to our featured partner, High Level, and visit highlevelfire.com to start your free trial today.

24:55Fire Nation, it's time to stop guessing and start winning with a proven playbook. Inside the Freedom Circle, you'll have access to my step-by-step systems for creating offers, building processes, and driving traffic, all in just 90 days. Ready for freedom? Visit freedom-circle.com to learn more. Thank you.