Functioning Failure Disorder - What It Is and What You Can Do About It with Ben Butler: An EOFire Classic from 2021

0:01Boom! Shake the room, Fire Nation. JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire, brought to you by the HubSpot. Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals with great shows like Content is Profit. Today, we're pulling a timeless EO Fire episode from the archives, so the giveaway may not be active, and we'll be breaking down functioning failure disorder, what it is, and what you can do about it. To drop these value bombs, I am brought to Ben Butler and EO Fire Studios. Ben is the founder of Top Hat, the seven-year-old 11-person creative agency with offices in Pittsburgh and St.

0:35Pete. Fun fact, they once did a project entirely in exchange for beer and fire nation. Today, we'll talk about functioning failure disorder, how it's not being able to recognize that perhaps you are not getting into your goals as an entrepreneur. We'll talk about finding a way to break yourself free to achieve the life that you want and so much more. And a big thank you for sponsoring today's episode goes to Ben and our sponsors. Business Made Simple, hosted by Donald Miller, is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Business Made Simple takes the mystery out of growing your business with episodes like how to get out of your day-to-day operations without crashing your business.

1:13Listen to Business Made Simple wherever you get your podcasts. Did you know that most leaders waste up to 70 % of their time on tasks they shouldn't be doing in the first place? It's time to delegate those routine tasks to a Belay VA. Learn how to make the most of your time and maximize your results today. Text FIRE, that's F-I-R-E, to 55123 to download your free guide to a productive work week. Ben, say what's up to Fire Nation and share something interesting about yourself that most people don't know. What's up, Fire Nation? So excited to come to you wherever you are, in your car, in your home, in your bed, wherever.

1:53hello uh something interesting about myself this was uh this is a hard one to think of i know some people are like hey you know i actually play warcraft or something like that for me you know most things you can find are on the internet so i had to really you know think about this one i would say my age most people don't know how old i am and that was you know started as a business technique where started my agency top hat when i was still in college and i didn't tell anybody that I was still in college because that wouldn't have been a good idea. And even to this day, people are like, Ben, how old are you?

2:27Okay, I want to guess. I'm going to guess that you're 74 years old. 74. You're dead on, man. I got that young voice. Recently, I was in a publication and they put my age and I got about five client calls that day. They said, Ben, I thought you were 35 years old. I thought you were like, you're mid-30s, but I'm actually 28. So I look old, I sound old. Maybe it's the wisdom, who knows? But yeah, my age is something that people don't know, but now they do. Maybe you're doing a little Benjamin button on us, who knows for sure. But Fire Nation, as I mentioned in the introduction, we're gonna be talking all about functioning failure disorder.

3:05What it is and what you can do about it. So before we dive into the symptoms, and there are a total of four, so hold on tight, Fire Nation. Break it down for us, Ben. What is functioning failure disorder? Yeah, so this is something that came to me. I've been a partner in many businesses, past, present, and future. And so I've seen this play out and it really dawned on me as I was thinking about a former business that I was involved with in a venture capacity. Functioning failure disorder, the real feel of this is as entrepreneurs, we know we need to sacrifice. We know that we're gonna put in long hours.

3:43We know that we're gonna have to give things up and work really, really hard. But no one really tells us when that should start to taper off or when that should stop or when we should have some semblance of normal. And functioning failure disorder at its core is not being able to recognize that maybe you're not getting to your goals. Maybe you're in a bad spot as a business owner. And so I like to assign it with, hey, are you about eight to 10 years into your business and you're still working 20 hours a day not making the money you want, not able to see your friends and family, not achieving your goals, not having that breakthrough, well, you might be a functioning failure who, you know, you look really, really attractive on the front.

4:26Your business is written up about it, has a good, you know, presence and brand and a lot of people respect it. But behind the scenes, there's a lot of nastiness going on. And so, you know, it's important to realize that so that we can correct those things. So that's really the crux of what that moniker I termed is. Functioning failure disorder. I mean, when I first saw those words, I was kind of getting the vibe and I'm going to have to go and look and see who actually quoted this, but he said that so many people are living quiet lives of desperation. Is there any connection with that quote and functioning failure disorder?

5:02Not directly, but I can definitely see that. And I think that's a great way to put that. Absolutely. You know, these people are, again, they might look like a rock star. And I think everybody says, oh, I'm an entrepreneur. I'm a rock star. You're only going to hear about the good stuff. But they might go home and go work nonstop hours, be sleep deprived, not see their family, not be making enough money, be in tremendous amounts of debt. And so they could be silently desperate, but you may never know. Fire Nation, we're going to go through the symptoms of functioning failure disorder. And I know there's a total of four.

5:36So let's just start with number one and let's have a little back and forth on it. So let's talk about wanting freedom, but never actually finding it. Symptom number one is probably the most prominent where, again, you know you have to sacrifice, but at some point, most people desire some semblance of a normal life. You know, some, I would say the disclaimer, if you're an entrepreneur, you're never going to have a fully normal life. It's either going to be extreme work or something more extreme where you're managing and benefiting from your business. You know, the semblance of normal is, is comparable ish to an eight to five.

6:13And so, you know, people who are, again, I like to use the 10 year, eight to 10 year mark as a benchmark for this, where, you know, maybe you're not quite working normal hours and you desire freedom. You're burned out. Oh, man, I wish I could shut down at 4.30 p.m. But because of your workload and the things you're doing, you can't because the business will die if you don't keep your foot down on the pedal. And so really wanting freedom but never finding it is the most prominent again. But, you know, really, it's key as a business owner to move out of the weeds. And I know there's been a lot of people on the podcast who talk about building processes and people and people with processes to support the business and take over those things for you.

6:57And people with functioning failure disorder, they can't hire the help. And because they can't hire the help, they never think of the processes because they've never been necessitated to train anyone else to do it in the business. And there's a couple of reasons why people can't hire help. One is the classic, well, we can't afford it. And I always have to ask these people who I consult and I meet with both in a consulting capacity and an agency capacity, hey, why are you doing the job of two to three people 10 years in your business and you can't hire two to three people to do that job for you?

7:34That's a really big red flag. And really the solution to that is a simple supply and demand balancing. It's amazing how many entrepreneurs forget to look at the supply and demand. As you go on and you get more prestige and you get more recognition in your business, you're going to have more demand. But your supply is based on your people. It's based on your processes. And eventually, you have to balance that equation until you have either the income to hire those people or the ability to have a more balanced lifestyle. So the we can't afford it, if you're saying that, you're probably in a spot of trouble if you're 10 years into your business.

8:12Uh-oh, big red flag there. The second reason that you can't break free and have freedom is nobody does it as good as me. And there was a recent podcast episode with James Friel that talked about the genius paradox. And that is really applicable here. And I was really excited to hear about that because these people who says, nobody can do it as good as I can. And because of that, they never hire anyone. And to that, I say, you have to reevaluate your recruiting. Where are you getting these people? How much you're willing to pay them? And sometimes you have to get creative because I guarantee you, if you think you're the smartest person in every room you walk into, you're going to the wrong places, guaranteed.

8:52Love this. So symptom number one, Fire Nation, wanting freedom, but never finding it. And I'm going to put you on the spot here for a second, Ben, and I'm going to ask you to define freedom, but I'm going to give you a couple seconds to think about it because I'm first going to define it myself, how I actually define this word. and Fire Nation, I'm going to challenge you listening right now. How would you define freedom? Because you're never going to find your version of freedom if you don't first define and actually know what that is and what that looks like. And there's so many people, especially in corporate America that spend their entire lives climbing this corporate ladder and they get to the top and they say, I've been climbing the wrong ladder the whole time because they never defined what it was they were actually going towards or for.

9:35So for me, freedom is doing what you want, when you want to, where you want. So it's that location freedom. It's that actual time freedom, all important stuff. How do you, Ben, define freedom? Your answer is killer. And I love this question. It's really defining your priorities, number one. It's different for everybody. Some people's idea of freedom might be financial freedom. They can fly on the private jet. They can buy the private island. They can drive the car they want to drive and, you know, really do what they want financially. Other people, it has to deal with building a family to have time for their son or daughter, for their wife or partner or husband, whatever.

10:19You know, it's what are your priorities and how are you matching up to those? and so it could be a mix of those things, but it's, you know, again, what are your objectives in life? What are your priorities and are you doing them? And if the answer is no, I would say you're not free and you're still getting there and if you're eight to 10 years in and you're still not getting there, then you're probably in a spot of trouble. Sign me up. I love that definition as well and for me at the end of the day, Fire Nation, is your finger on your pulse? Like, do you actually know what it is you're trying to achieve, what you're trying to move towards?

10:52And that's why I love how this kind of segues perfectly into symptom number two, which is intending like you're intending to, but you're never achieving an exit. So kind of expound upon what that phrase means, Ben, and then dive into the symptom. Sure. Yeah. I've seen this one firsthand. I've coached this. I've seen this with clients. Intending but never achieving the exit. You know, some people, you know, there's two things you go into business with. I want this to be a life-sustaining lifestyle kind of business, or I want to grow this to sell. And there's only really those two things. And if you don't know what you're going to do, you're not really leading your company in the best possible position.

11:30But if you go in and you say, hey, we're building this thing to sell, you better not miss that window. Because if you do, that's probably the most dysfunctional, toxic chain of events that are going to follow that I've ever seen in businesses where people say, I want to build and scale this business and I want to sell it by five years into it for this number. If you miss that, what happens after year five is your six, seven, eight, nine, 10. I've seen people 15 years into this, their passion, their leadership, their quality, it all erodes exponentially. And so if you want to sell, you better sell.

12:09And so, you know, two solutions to this one is or get off the pot. Some people get caught up on stupid things that don't matter. They think about, oh man, if only I had this website or if only I had this, you know, venture backer or this spot or this feature, you got to think of the MVP mode. What is the minimum viable product you need to sell your business within the timeframe you want it at the price you want it. So you better do it and you better do it soon and not get distracted. And then solution two within that is to run through the finish line. One of my favorite analogies, and maybe this is something else that people don't know about me, is I used to run track and field in high school, is the track and field coaches tell you always run through the finish line.

12:55You don't look at the ribbon as you're approaching it. You look at the fence 100 yards down past the ribbon or wherever that fence is. You look through it and you run through it. And so if you're intending to sell, you need to run all the way through the finish line. And I know a couple of stories and one jumps to the top of my head of a fellow agency owner who built the business to sell and he had a buyer lined up. And within 90 days, he completely slacked on the business. He let everything lapse. Some of his people quit, his clients unsigned up and a lot of the recurring revenue that attracted the buyer walked away.

13:33And when the buyer came back 90 days later to say, okay, let's take a look at how things are right now. We're ready to go. He's like, oh yeah, X, Y, and Z happened. They're like, well, we're going to have to walk away. So you have to run through the finish line. So much value here, Fire Nation. I mean, let's be honest. It's time to poop or get off that pot, Fire Nation. That's your options right there. You got to go into that MVP mode. It's such a critical mindset. And running through the finish line. Think of that concept. I mean, honestly, my analogy to this is I'm a big Pelotoner. Like I have Peloton.

14:05I love it. Shout out to Leanne Hainsby. She's my favorite trainer on there. And whenever we get to the countdown for each little iteration that we're doing, you know, she'll always go, all right, Pelotoners, five more seconds, five, four. I, in my head, I'm going 10, 9, 8 because I know that if I do her countdown at 3 or 2, I'm slowing down. Even if I don't want to subconsciously, I'm slowing down because I'm like, I'm there, I'm at the finish line. And guess what? My final score is going to reflect that because this little leaderboard is very competitive. So I have hacked that by just doubling whatever the countdown is.

14:44And I go 10, 9, 8. And when she says 1, you're finished, I may be at like 4 or 3. And then I do slow down, But I've run through that finish line, and that really helps me maximize my results. And again, that's just one analogy on the reality that you, Fire Nation, have spent years, sometimes decades for others, building this business. And then when you just don't run through that finish line at the end, I mean, all those years or decades of hard work are for naught. And it's so sad to see. And Fire Nation, we're going to be talking about some super important things. Never-ending debt. I mean, that's such a crusher.

15:18and consistently failing in your marketing. We have so much more value to talk about as soon as we get back from thanking our sponsors. I remember back in 2013 when Entrepreneurs on Fire was scaling fast. And in those early days of our business, we sometimes found ourselves struggling to keep up because we couldn't find software solutions that were easy to use and that would grow with us. Wasting time worrying about software that's complicated, a pain to use, and that doesn't do what you need it to do is not fun or productive. So what do we wish we knew back then that we know now? That a powerful all-in-one CRM platform that will accelerate your business growth is a HubSpot CRM.

15:58Unlike a lot of solutions we were using back in 2013, HubSpot's CRM grows with your business. Whether you have an MVP or you just IPO'd, HubSpot CRM is built for scale because your tech stack should work for you, not against you. And with over 1 ,300 flexible apps and integrations, you can customize HubSpot's CRM to the way you do business. Get started for free at HubSpot.com. That's HubSpot.com. Did you know that most leaders waste up to 70 % of their time on tasks they shouldn't be doing in the first place? You know, like managing routine details, scheduling meetings, replying to emails, and processing reports.

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17:14Learn how to make the most of your time and maximize your results today. Just text FIRE. That's F-I-R-E-2-5-5-1-2-3 to download your free guide to a productive work week. So Ben, as I kind of teased before the break, never ending debt. We're going to talk about it because man, it breaks my heart. And we're not going to go down this specific rabbit hole, but I mean, it breaks my heart when I see these poor 21, 22-year-olds kids that have no idea what$50 ,000,$100 ,000,$200 ,000 in debt means. It's sad because they think, oh, if I get a job for$75 ,000, I'm going to be able to pay off$150 ,000 in debt in two years, right?

17:5775 times two. When you realize, oh, my paycheck's actually$4 ,000 and it's costing me$3 ,900 a month to live and I have no money to pay off my debt and I'm in this never-ending debt cycle. So talk about that symptom, Ben. Nailed it. That's how so many people think. But multiply that in a business sense. You took venture funding or a big loan. You know, that$50 ,000 is now a quarter million, a half million, a million, two million, 10 million. Rutt row, big trouble. And so really, you know, functioning failure disorder could present itself this way where you took a loan, but you never pay it back.

18:33You're 10 years in, your plan to pay back the loan was maybe five years or you're 20 years in and your plan to pay back the loan was 10 years. You can't be a constant debt machine. And I know a lot of people on the podcast like to mention Jeff Bezos and Amazon, who's a company that is a anomaly where they've never turned a profit and they have just constant debt and balancing that way. And they have a business model around that. You're not Jeff Bezos. You're not Amazon. You need to turn a profit. You need to get out of debt. And really the reasons for this are really core to the functioning failure disorder where maybe you haven't priced yourself properly.

19:10Maybe your production processes or costs are really inefficient. Or maybe you have significant customer complaints, returns, etc. And really the solution to this is really, really simple. It's all about the money in your business. Businesses are built on getting out of debt, maintaining profitability, balancing the sheets at the end of the year, all of these kind of things, and hopefully turning a profit, you need to look at the cost of everything you're doing. You need to look at the cost of your team, your materials, your processes, et cetera, et cetera. You need to follow the money, and you need to figure out where you're lacking, if this is where you've been.

19:46Again, a little bit of debt is okay for business. Sometimes it's really important to get started. Maybe you're manufacturing something, or you need to hire people to build a product, but you can't last this way forever. It has to end and eventually it will crush you. It will cripple you and you need to figure out how to get out of it. There's so much truth here. I mean, you cannot be a constant debt machine, Fire Nation. And I actually love that you brought up Jeff Bezos because I've done a lot of studying of Jeff Bezos. And what's really true and interesting when you actually listen to when he goes in depth about this, because a lot of people just give that headline of Amazon never makes a profit.

20:24Well, they actually had a lot of profit positive revenue streams. But the reason why they never made a profit was because they were always three years ahead investing massively in a lot of things, some things that didn't work, some things that did work, but their focus was never profit. And unless you have venture capital and investor money that's coming in in the billions of dollars like Amazon's had, then you really need to focus on not being this constant debt machine. Amazon is one in a billion company that did that from the beginning. But at the same time, they had a lot of profit, positive revenue streams within their entire business model.

21:04So symptom number three, never ending debt. Anything you want to share, closing that down, Ben, before we move on to symptom four? No, I think just do a little soul searching. Why are you in debt still? if you should have paid it back. Really follow the money and figure out, you know, where is it lacking? Where could you be better? Follow the money. I love that phrase. And there's a great book, Michael Michalowicz, Profit First. He's been on the show multiple times. When you really understand that philosophy, you can really start following the money and you can really start paying down that debt by paying yourself first.

21:36So take us to symptom four, Ben. Here we're running through the finish line. Yes. Certainly, last but certainly not least here is consistently failing marketing or even worse, no clue how marketing is doing. Whether you are a self-professed marketing guru or somebody who relies on a team of people, you need to have a basic understanding. And if you are seeing that your marketing is failing for your business, there's going to be repercussions, reverberations, the pebble in the pond kind of effect that's going to happen to you. And even worse, if you have no clue what marketing is doing, you're in a spot of trouble because that, again, is critical to any business.

22:17And I, as an owner of a marketing agency, as somebody who's been involved in them, I don't believe in the, if you build it, they will come. That is totally not true. It's build it, market it, then they will come. And so I think that really puts it in perspective for business owners. And if you're missing the mark, you're gonna be in trouble, maybe not today, but maybe tomorrow. We just went through a pandemic and the value of marketing and channels was ever present in businesses. How fast can you turn to a digital product if you need to? How fast can you turn on online ordering and how good can you market that?

22:56You need to understand how your business can meet the mark, make the mark, and hit those different points. And worse, if you have no clue, if you delegate it to a CMO, they might be the best CMO in the whole world, but you need to understand what their results are and how they are performing for your business. And so the solution for this is really simple. Number one, follow the money. Again, follow the money. I don't believe in, oh, we got a million impressions. I really don't care about that. I care about what is the business objective? Did you want to make$10 ,000 this month and you made one?

23:32Well, you failed. I really think that marketing should be black and white. What are we trying to tangibly do within what time frame? And did you do it? And if you didn't, well, something's not going right there and your business is going to feel it at some point. And that leads into the second solution is what are your business objectives? How many widgets are you trying to sell? How much in services are you trying to sell? And it's so timeless. It's so easy. the smart, objective format, specific, measurable, attainable, realistic, and time-constrained. It's a really simple formula that you could put together where it's, we want to sell$10 ,000 a month within the first year, and within the second year,$20 ,000 a month, and within the third,$30 ,000.

24:20You can always go over, but when you go under, you're really going to feel it, and you could just be maintaining your business and not feeling freedom, not finding an end to debt and not really growing to where you want to be. So consistently failing marketing and or no clue how your marketing is doing is a really big symptom and might be one that a lot of people who have business savvy but might not understand the mystique of marketing, they might say, oh man, that could be it. And it could. It definitely could. This is huge. And my experience with this, especially in the podcasting space with Podcasters Paradise and just coaching a lot of up and coming podcasters is they say something along the lines of John, like, I know I'm late to the game, but you know, it's no problem because I'm just gonna run a bunch of ads to get a bunch of listeners to my podcast.

25:06And my response is always, well, what's your ROI? Like, what is your return on that investment? What can you put as far as a dollar amounts that each listener is worth? Like what call to action do you have within your podcast is getting people into a funnel that's converting them actually into dollars back into your pocket because I know that you just can't be doing this full time. You're going to run out of runway at some point unless you have this system in place. You have to have a clue in how that marketing is actually doing. It is critical stuff. So Ben, you've broken down the four symptoms.