How to Succeed as an Entrepreneur in Dance and Arts with Roger Lee

0:01Boom! Shake the room, Fire Nation. JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire. are brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals with great shows like Talking Too Loud. Today, we'll be breaking down how to succeed as an entrepreneur in dance and the arts. To drop these value bombs, I have brought Roger Lee into EO Fire Studios. Roger is a recognized arts entrepreneur that creates arts business ventures that uplift people's spirits. He is the founder of Roger Lee Arts, LLC, and Roger Lee Dance Company. In today's Fire Nation, we'll talk about how to find success in this niche of dance and arts, lessons learned, gaining positive publicity as an entrepreneur, his advice for emerging entrepreneurs in this field, and so much more.

0:48And a big thank you for sponsoring today's episode goes to Roger Lee and our sponsors. Marketing Made Simple, hosted by my friend, Dr. JJ Peterson, is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Marketing Made Simple brings you practical tips to make your marketing easy, and more importantly, make it work. A recent episode all about how Liquid IV is using marketing to shake up the beverage world dives deep into the strategies that have propelled Liquid IV to remarkable success. A must listen. Listen to Marketing Makes Simple wherever you get your podcasts.

1:19Ever thought about giving a TEDx talk? It's one of the most powerful ways to share your message with the world. And four-time TEDx speaker Taylor Conroy from Thought Leader can help you get there. Visit thought-leader.com slash fire to join Taylor's free training where he teaches you how to land a TEDx talk and spread your message to millions. Roger, say what's up to Fire Nation and share something that you believe about becoming successful that most people disagree with. Hey, Fire Nation. It's Roger Lee. And here's something that I know helps with the success of an entrepreneur. It's sleep. Sleep is underrated.

2:00People keep saying you have to grind all day and night. You could sleep later on, but that's not true. If you don't get an adequate amount of sleep, you're no good to yourself and you're definitely no good to the people that you serve. So sleep, sleep, sleep as you grind. Fire Nation, I agree with this 100%. I learned this the hard way. And for the last seven years, I've been dedicated to improving my sleep. I now sleep with an aura ring on my finger every night. And if I don't have a sleep score of 90 or above, which is super high. I figure out why. Last night was a 94, Roger Lee. That's why I'm on fire today.

2:37Because listen, we need to grind, Fire Nation, when the daylight hours are up. We got to work hard. Don't just piddle around on Instagram and Facebook and pretend like you're doing something positive. Grind your face off during the day, during working hours. And then when it's time to rest, you better rest. You better recuperate. Because If you don't, your grinding is going to be terrible because you need well-rested brain cells to do great work. And I know you want to do great work. And we're talking today about how to succeed as an entrepreneur in dance and arts. And you are in that field, Roger Lee, of both dance and arts.

3:12How does one find success in this niche? Not easily, John. I have to tell you, it's a journey. And being an entrepreneur of any sort is a journey, but it's extremely difficult in the arts because we have to combat societal notion. A lot of people think the arts and entertainment are just for fun and that there's no real value to it. And for those of us in the industry, we know that that couldn't be further from the truth. This is a huge economic engine that changes lives. I'm a living witness to that. So in addition to just the general hard work of being an entrepreneur, you always have to push.

3:49You have to push so hard for people to just understand what you're doing and see the value in it. And it makes it challenging, but I have to tell you, John, it makes it so much more rewarding once you reach the success because you know how hard you're at the work to get there. Now, Roger Lee, you found success in this niche. And so we can always learn from others who have been successful before us. I love to call it standing upon the shoulders of giants. So for Fire Nation to start to learn some lessons from you about how they can become successful in dance and arts and then in other areas as well.

4:22I want to hear your journey to success. Tell us about that. Well, thanks for asking. It's been a long journey, one that's still evolving. I like to tell folks my origin story. I got started at 13 years old. My mom saw an ad for Fox 29. They were looking for young dancers to help boost up ratings and support the morning news broadcast. And I never danced professionally, never had formal classes of trainings, just the block parties and family functions. And I thank God that my mom saw something in my dancing. And she said, you're going to go to this audition. And I got there and there were over 300 hopefuls and they were amazing.

5:01And I said, well, this has been a great experience. I made a few friends, but I'm out. There's no way I'm getting selected as one of the top eight. And John, I was selected. I couldn't believe it. I was the only gentleman selected. And And the rest is history. From there was a lot of catch up, figuring out how to dance formally in a way that wouldn't hurt my body. Being that older guy with a beard in the younger class with students who were just getting started. So I kind of went through it, you know, it was a big, big challenge. But again, the reward was amazing as gigs started coming in. And I never forget how it felt to cash that first check and say, wow, I can actually get paid to do something that I love so much.

5:42and now I'm looking at 23 years in this industry and 12 years of actually being an entrepreneur within it where I've created opportunities for other artists who are coming up. So it's been such a journey and it's still evolving day by day. Well, let's talk about that evolution. I wanna talk about specifically the business side of your evolution because people can love to dance, they can love arts and they can do that all day but at the end of the day, they're gonna have to generate some revenue that have to have some business savvy, some business side of things to continue to do what they want to do because money is oxygen.

6:18You don't need a ton of it, but you need enough of it to keep going, to support yourself, to do what you need to do, to support your family. So talk about your business evolution and the future projects that you have on tap. Sure is a great question. So for me, I didn't really know I was being entrepreneurial when I first started. I just thought this is how artists survive. I was based in Philadelphia, where I still am proudly. And in Philly, this is not really a city where films are made regularly, where music videos are shot, where there are celebrities. So if you want to work as a professional artist in Philly, you really have to do a lot of entrepreneurial exploration.

7:00So for me, at a very young age, I said, I want to do this, but I don't have the agent. I don't have a manager. I don't have a publicist. I need to wear those three hats and figure things out. And I did just that. And luckily, I found the love for those three hats, right? The more I wore them, the more I loved them. So I booked my own media features. I was booking my own gigs, negotiating my own contracts, and learned a lot about business along the way. But again, John, I thought that this was just pure survival. I thought that it was just a part of the job description for an artist and never realized until about 10 years into my journey that I was being an entrepreneur.

7:34Every time I created a class and marketed that class and charged, you know, tickets, prices for it, that was entrepreneurship, right? So once I learned that it was a thing, right, and I was a freelancer, I said, well, why not start a formal business for this? And that's what I did in 2012. What I started with was Roger Lee Dance. And you were kind enough to interview me on my first year in. I'll never forget that 2013. And since we last spoke, this has evolved from being just a dance business into being a multidisciplinary arts business. So yes, the dance entertainment is still at the forefront and probably will always be, but we've now expanded into the visual art realm.

8:16I've kind of revealed my other hidden talent of painting. So now I do like painting exhibitions, custom paintings for folks. And in addition to that, now I'm giving back to emerging artists through artist career coaching. So I actually take on clients now and help them figure out what do you want your career to look like, to feel like, to sound like, and then what steps do you want to take to get to your career destination? What I've learned through that work is that two artists can have the same exact goal, but the journey they go on to get to that goal could be extremely different. So I love the work that I'm doing now as an artist and an artist career coach.

8:55And because I'm doing them simultaneously, John, I'm learning that the more I evolve as an artist, the stronger I become as a coach, the stronger my coaching becomes, the better my artistry becomes. So it's really become a cyclical experience in the business realm. I love hearing about this evolution, Roger. To me, it's so cool when I can bring somebody on after a decade of their first appearance to do a little check-in to see what they've been up to and how they've turned whatever it is they were doing into success. And a lot of times, by the way, not in your case, but a lot of times, my past guests are in a totally different field than they were when I interviewed them a decade ago.

9:32It was, hey, 10 years is a long time. Like I love that quote by Tony Robbins that a lot of people overestimate what they can do in a year. They think they can get a lot more done in a year than they actually can because a year, I mean, it goes by. But they underestimate what they can do in a decade. And so that's why I've actually gone back now that I've been doing Entrepreneurs on Fire for 11 years. And I've kind of chosen some of my guests that I interviewed in 2012, 2013, 2014, and had that kind of 10-year reunion and said, man, where are you now? What are you doing? That can be really fascinating.

10:04And it sounds, Roger Lee, like we might be having a Puerto Rico reunion. So I'm pretty excited about that. Yeah, me too. It'll be my first time. I just can't wait. Good stuff. Well, listen, Fire Nation, we have a lot to talk about when we get back from thanking our sponsors.

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13:07Visit thought-leader.com slash fire. Join Taylor for this free training and get your message out of your head, out of your heart, and out into the world where it belongs. That's thought-leader.com slash fire. Rogelie, you've already told us a lot about your evolution, what you're having success with. What are some lessons that you've learned from your entrepreneurial journey? I've learned a lot. I would say the most notable teachings has really been routed in PR. When I started as an entrepreneur, I got a lot of media coverage, and it was such a blessing. It really gave me exposure, connected me to some amazing individuals in the industry, people who wanted to be a part of what I was doing.

13:51What I learned is that there's true power in PR. And entrepreneurs sometimes underestimate that power. They see PR as a vanity metric. It's something they can do if they have time, if they have the bandwidth, if they want to pay a publicist to come on or not. It's almost like an optional thing in their world. It's all about sales for them, first and foremost. And what I would encourage younger entrepreneurs to think about is the power of PR and how it can lead to sales. Of course, sales are important in business and it's about revenue generation and ultimately profitability, but PR can absolutely be a tool to get there.

14:27It's not just a vanity metric. What it does is it gives you credibility within your niche, within your industry. It exposes you to potential clients and customers and partners and collaborators in a way that nothing else can. So this is not just pure marketing and advertising, right? Where you're talking about how great you and your company are, but really it's somebody else doing that work for you and giving you that social credibility that you need to form some real longstanding relationships. So I tell people, think about PR as not optional, but as something that can absolutely drive sales and the longevity of your business.

15:05And I have to say, being 11 years into my company, I attribute so much of that success and longevity to the early work in PR. See Fire Nation, I think you really need to understands that it's lessons from other individuals we can apply to our lives, to our journey. We can avoid their mistakes. We can emulate their successes. We can learn. We can stand upon those shoulders of giants. And one thing that you've learned is how to gain positive publicity as an entrepreneur, Roger Lee. Tell us some tips in that area. And I love PR so much that I actually became a publicist for a year. I had a great time doing that work for a really renowned ballet company in my area.

15:47So that's how much I loved it. And between doing that work and then being my own publicist over the years, I learned some tips that I would love to share with this audience here. So tip number one would be find your newsworthiness. We all have it. There are always things that make us newsworthy, but we have a hard time identifying those things as entrepreneurs because we're so close to the work. So if you can't identify it for yourself, bring in a friend or a family member or a publicist and say, hey, what is it about me and or my work that makes me newsworthy? And you'll be shocked at what you find.

16:21It could be your background. It could be something that you did, right? Like you achieved a sales milestone. It could be a partnership. It could be a really innovative service, a product that you're launching. But there's always something that makes you newsworthy. So find out what that thing is. Number two is promote that newsworthy thing in a way that the media representative can appreciate. You have to understand that media representatives are overworked and they're expected to do a lot with a little bit. And when they have millions of emails coming in and calls, they need something that stands out.

16:55So if you're just going through the flow, same old motions, you're probably not going to get their attention. But if you're able to take your message and share it in a way that resonates with that media representative, that will drastically increase your chances of getting the positive coverage that you want. So here's a quick example of that, right? You might have an event going on in your hometown, and that's cool. But is there something about that event that really speaks to that media representative? Have they been to the event before? Is it related to their hobbies? Do they have family members associated with that thing?

17:31So that requires you to actually do some background research. You can use LinkedIn, social media, you can take them out to coffee, but you have to get to know the people that you're pitching to in advance. And then last but certainly not least is be authentic. Don't just reach out to somebody in hopes of getting media coverage, but reach out to them because you're interested in connecting with them on a human level. From there, that relationship can evolve into a media relationship, but start at the humanity level. People really appreciate that authenticity, especially coming out of this COVID-19 pandemic where we were isolated for so long.

18:06People value connection. So don't be a robot just asking for a favor of a stranger, but take the time to be human first. And I promise you the results will pay off in due time. I would identify Fire Nation as emerging entrepreneurs for the most part. We have a lot of small business owners, entrepreneurs, solopreneurs, some entrepreneurs who are working the nine to five and are looking for that little idea, that light bulb moment to break into entrepreneurship. So what is your advice for emerging entrepreneurs? Well, these are good, John. on one of these questions. My advice for emerging entrepreneurs to break into it is start small.

18:42A lot of times we want to go so big so quickly. And while that might be exciting, it's very rarely sustainable. And again, for me, I'm just speaking for me personally, it's about sustainability. It's about impact. It's about the long-term, right? Not just a quick quote unquote overnight success that never truly is overnight. So if you want to be in the game for a long time and have a lot of impact and legacy, you got to start small. If you're working nine to five, use that check to fund your entrepreneurial venture. Give it a try while you have the safety net of the nine to five. If you have a small business, have one location for a year or two, rent out the facility before you go and purchase the facility.

19:22These are the things entrepreneurs don't want to do because they're not as glamorous, but those are the things that set you up for the long-term success. And I just thank God there were so many times in my journey where I was about to go for the glamorous thing and just had to take a moment and say, how would this impact me in the long term? You know, buying that awesome, shiny new dance studio probably isn't the best bet until I have steady clientele. So I think back to these moments where I had to stop myself from making that common mistake, right? Which is going way too big, way too quickly.

19:55And again, if you build little by little, step by step, things will stick. Fire Nation, things will stick. Now, Roger Lee, we talked about a lot of very important things today. What would you say is the one thing that you would really want to make sure Fire Nation, our listeners today walk away with? I want our listeners to walk away with the knowledge of themselves, right? And I know that sounds kind of strange. What's knowledge of yourself? I want you to walk away knowing who you are, and why you do what you do. That matters so much in your entrepreneurial journey because there are always going to be people and opportunities and temptations that come along and try to get you to go off of your path.

20:40And I'm not saying that people have malicious intent when they do that, but it just happens, right? People have their own agendas and their own images of where they want you to be and how you can partner and do things together. So if you are not crystal clear, 100 % on who you are and why you do what you do, you're not going to be able to avoid the trappings, the missteps, or you're going to be pushed around into areas that you're not really meant to be in. So take the time to figure out who you are and what your motivation is before embarking on entrepreneurship, because it's going to make the journey a lot easier, a lot smoother.

21:18And it's going to make you be able to say no a lot more confidently, right? Saying thank you so much for that opportunity and for thinking of me. Unfortunately, it just doesn't align with who I am and where I'm trying to go at the moment. Perhaps there'll be a better alignment in the future. Let's stay in touch. So much easier to say that when you know who you are and why you do what you do. Such wise words, Fire Nation. And Roger Lee, if Fire Nation, our listeners, wanted to connect with you, wanted to learn more about you, what is your call to action for us today? Yeah, let's connect online.

21:50Let's have some conversations. I'm such a people person. and I love folks and uplifting people whenever I can. So please reach out to me online. I am all over social media at Roger Lee Arts and my website is rogerleearts.com. And there's so many ways that you can get involved and support the work that we're doing here in Philly from afar. So let's connect and see how we can work together. Fire Nation, you're the average of the five people you spend the most time with. You've been hanging out with Roger Lee and John Lee today. So please keep up that heat. For links to everything we talked about, visit eofire.com.

22:23Just type Roger in the search bar. The show notes page will pop up. And by the way, the episode from 10 years ago, 11 years ago almost, that was 2013, will also come up. Listen to that. I'm sure you'll enjoy it. It was one of the early ones. And Fire Nation, as always, keep up that heat. So Roger, thank you for sharing your truth, your knowledge, your value with Fire Nation. For that, we salute you and we'll catch you on the flip side. Hey, Fire Nation, a huge thank you to our sponsors and Roger for sponsoring today's episode and to Fire Nation. Are you ready to rock your very own podcast? Check out our free podcasting course where I will teach you how to create and launch your podcast for free, freepodcastcourse.com.

23:05I'll catch you there or on the flip side. Marketing Made Simple, hosted by my friend, Dr. JJ Peterson, is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Marketing Made Simple brings you practical tips to make your marketing easy, and more importantly, make it work. A recent episode all about how Liquid IV is using marketing to shake up the beverage world dives deep into the strategies that have propelled Liquid IV to remarkable success. A must listen. Listen to Marketing Made Simple wherever you get your podcasts. Ever thought about giving a TEDx talk?

23:35It's one of the most powerful ways to share your message with the world. And four-time TEDx speaker, Taylor Conroy from Thought Leader can help you get there. Visit thought-leader.com slash fire to join Taylor's free training where he teaches you how to land a TEDx talk and spread your message to millions.