In short
ESPN FC episode focuses on the Premier League title race after Arsenal’s losses to Bournemouth and Manchester City, leaving City “in the driving seat.”
Guests
Dan Thomas (host), Ali Moreno (football analyst; discusses locker-room momentum and Arsenal’s “chasing” vs City’s “leading”), Shaka Hisslop (former player/analyst; uses Newcastle experience to explain chasing dynamics), and Mario Malkiot (guest; argues City’s run-in and goal difference favor them).
Key claims
City are likely champions if they win remaining games and manage goal difference; Arsenal’s attack/finishing in the “two boxes” is decisive, and Arsenal lack a true number 9.
Notable examples
Gabriel’s headbutt incident vs Haaland—VAR upheld no red; Haaland’s comments about staying on his feet and receiving only a yellow. Arteta’s post-match view: finishing and specific midfield/forward contributions (Silva, Rodri, Haaland). Arsenal transfer debate centers on Joao/“Jokeres” rumors and why Kai Havertz started but didn’t convert chances; Giorgian “Jokeres” allegedly had zero touches in ~14 minutes. Later segments critique Chelsea’s scoring drought and discuss Crystal Palace-West Ham and other match highlights.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOArsenal vs. Manchester City Overview
0:45 to 1:54
The panel discusses Arsenal's struggles and Manchester City's current form.
“That defeat against Bournemouth, of course, followed up by that big loss against Manchester City.”
Locker Room Dynamics: Arsenal vs. City
1:54 to 3:30
Insights into the mental aspect of the teams based on locker room morale.
“And it's not just following this result against Arsenal, which of course pushes everybody forward, but it also has to do with what has been going on with Arsenal, not just this past weekend, but over the last six weeks.”
Referee's Call: Gabriel Incident Analysis
3:30 to 4:50
Discussion on the controversial decision during the match involving Gabriel and Haaland.
“Well, we'll have this conversation Thursday morning and I'll probably be chasing.”
Haaland's Impact and Game Dynamics
4:50 to 7:50
Analyzing Haaland's performance and its implications for Manchester City.
“Like when someone, like this is fine, but then bang.”
Arteta's Strategy and Arsenal's Shortcomings
7:50 to 11:15
Critique of Mikel Arteta's tactics and the need for a dedicated striker.
“Obviously, we applaud him for staying on his feet, but in a way, he's been punished as a result.”
Discussion on Arsenal's Striker Situation
14:01 to 14:48
Explore why Arsenal is struggling without a natural number nine and the implications for Arteta's tactics.
“Which brings to the point as to why Havertz is starting.”
Giorgio's Performance Analysis
14:48 to 15:40
Analyzing Giorgores' performance and the impact of not scoring in crucial moments.
“And that is the regurgitation of the rhetoric we've been talking about.”
Cherki's Talents and Arsenal's Needs
15:40 to 17:46
Discussing Ryan Cherki's skills and how Arsenal lacks creative, match-winning players.
“Let's take a look at my pre-season predictions.”
Evaluating Arsenal's Current Squad
17:46 to 20:06
Critique of Arsenal's squad depth and the need for a creative spark.
“And I think what was most impressive in that goal is that once he goes past Gabriel, when you watch it on TV, the space looks tight, right?”
Chelsea's Struggles Under Pressure
21:48 to 25:49
Analyzing Chelsea's recent performance woes and managerial challenges.
“Six defeats in their last seven matches.”
Show all 22 chapters
Garnacho's Positioning and Team Dynamics
25:49 to 28:00
Exploring Garnacho's decision-making on the field and its effect on team dynamics.
“And it was very difficult to mark because he was very direct.”
Managerial Decisions and Player Autonomy
28:00 to 29:52
Explore the implications of player autonomy on team performance and management perception.
“they decide it without having to go ask the manager if they can do it.”
Chelsea's Struggles and Expectations
29:52 to 30:59
Discuss Chelsea's current challenges and the expectations surrounding the club's performance.
“Liverpool got that late winner, of course, Mario against Everton in the derby.”
Crystal Palace vs. West Ham Review
32:38 to 34:41
Review the match and implications for both teams following their recent game.
“Let's take you to the highlight, shall we, of Crystal Palace against West Ham.”
Parental Pride in Sports
34:41 to 38:27
A heartfelt discussion on the emotions tied to seeing a child represent their country in sports.
“Gab and Jules show is available to listen to.”
Extra Time with Audience Questions
38:34 to 42:02
Engage in a lively discussion featuring audience questions about team management and strategies.
“Mario is back, though, for Extra Time to answer some of your questions.”
Arsenal's Dressing Room Dynamics
42:02 to 43:00
Explore what it's like in the Arsenal dressing room amidst a tough season.
Evaluating Manchester United's Future
43:01 to 44:16
A debate on whether Michael Carrick or Julian Nagelsmann is better for Manchester United's stability.
“Stevie had a salad today doesn't mean that he's eating really well.”
Assessing the Premier League Competition
44:16 to 47:12
Discussion on the competitive landscape of the Premier League and the performance of top teams.
“But certainly the option and the alternative should not be Julian Nagelsmann.”
Concerns for the US Men's National Team
47:12 to 48:58
A look at the current struggles of Christian Pulisic and their implications for the USMNT.
“because they're showing that drinking a bottle while Arsenal is playing City.”
Players' Dream Clubs and Aspirations
48:58 to 50:56
A light-hearted discussion about which clubs the guests wished they had played for.
“Final question, Xhaka Which team do you wish you had played for In your day?”
Celebrating Personal Milestones
50:56 to 52:44
Shaq shares his recent achievements and heartfelt moments involving his daughter.
“Mario is that old that Super Mario came out when he was a player.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00Hey sports fans, the ESPN app has all of ESPN all in one place. The ESPN app is your home to thousands of live events, ESPN shows and originals across every ESPN network in service. And now you can check if you already have ESPN Unlimited as part of your TV package for no additional cost. Visit activate.espn.com to learn how to access your account or sign up, then start streaming in the ESPN app. It's all of ESPN all in one place. Sign up or activate now.
0:34Welcome to the latest edition of ESPN FC. I'm Dan Thomas, joined by Ali Moreno and Shaka Hisslop. We've all been off for a week. We left with Arsenal struggling at the top of the table. And we start, of course, in return. So I'm doing exactly the same. That defeat against Bournemouth, of course, followed up by that big loss against Manchester City. Putting Pep Guardiola's side very much now in the driving seat. Fate is in their own hands. City win all the games and they should, in theory, be champions. But that's, of course, if they can close that goal difference and Arsenal drop points along the way.
1:07The question is simple. Who will win the Premier League as we welcome in Mario Malkiot? Who will win it, Mario, now?
1:16Gabriel:Oh, man. Listen, I have to give you that. I think City, guys, I'm so sorry for that because, oh, my God, I knew the heat was coming. But then, you know, look, hey, the London rivalry, no, I go City 100%. Yeah, I think the way I like to answer that question, Dan, if you would allow me, is by placing myself in each one of these locker rooms where I would rather be right now, right? where you would feel like there's momentum, there's a vibe, there's energy, we're partying, we're thinking everything is with us, we're flying. That has to be Manchester City, right? And it's not just following this result against Arsenal, which of course pushes everybody forward, but it also has to do with what has been going on with Arsenal, not just this past weekend, but over the last six weeks.
2:08It's been a long extended period of time in which everything has been so hard and so difficult for them. And even when they're winning games, it seems like it's just like, maybe we're gonna get there and they're stretching every single thing they can stretch in order to eat a result. Momentum is not with them. But the facts are with them. In that, right now, they're ahead. And even with them being ahead, I would rather be in the Manchester City locker room because I feel we have something special going whereas Arsenal is trying to search for certainty that hasn't been there for a while. What's it like in that locker room, Shaq?
2:45Your experience calls this Newcastle. Yeah, and so much about that experience I think you've seen play our way with Arsenal over this last couple of months. I've said time and time again, it's far easier to chase than it is to lead. I think that was the cause of Arsenal's stumbles. Now, from here on in, while I think Manchester City probably has the easier of the run-ins, it will not surprise me in the slightest to see both City and Arsenal go absolutely perfect from here on in. Despite Arsenal's struggles, again, now that you're chasing, it just feels like you're better at it. You're more up for it.
3:23So I can see Arsenal running the table as I can Manchester City. But they're not chasing. Arsenal are not chasing yet. Well, we'll have this conversation Thursday morning and I'll probably be chasing. Okay, all right. I fully expect City to beat Burnley. the goal difference, again, City will edge just ahead, and then between now and again if they all go perfect between here and in it comes down to goal difference, and you look at Arsenal's attack, compare that to City's, you're going to favour City every single time, City go on and win it Everybody saying Manchester City then What really could affect things of course as well, if Gabriel would get sent off, then it would have been a three match ban for violent conduct, obviously he wasn't This is a big talking point at the end of the game.
4:09This is what Erling Haaland had to say about the incident. I think that it's a red card. Most of you agree with me on this. If I go down, it's a red card. I would never do this. My father taught me this. Stay on your feet. Maybe, yes, I should have gone down. Maybe it would be easier. But I didn't. And I got a yellow key. I did get a yellow card for it as well. This is what the Premier League match centre said. Here they come. The referee's call of no red card was checked and confirmed by VAR with the action from Gabriel deemed not to be excessively aggressive or violent. The thing is, when you saw this and you saw the replay, you're like, he's gone.
4:48Yeah. Because we've seen it every time almost. Like when someone, like this is fine, but then bang. That's the movement. Haaland goes down, it's a red card. I don't think that's the question. But I was, like everyone watching, I was so surprised that it didn't result in a red. I was not overly surprised. Were you? I was not. I think where you see this, and where it's given us a red every time, if there's separation of your two heads and then that kind of thrust out from Gabriel, that's a red every single time. But because the heads kind of stay together throughout, I think it's more 50-50 on those.
5:25So I'll be honest, I didn't have a problem with it not being a red. Wow, Shaq. Your definition of 50-50, Shaq, it's more like 80-20.
5:38As it did in that situation
5:54Gabriel:If it's new castle nothing happened But if it's something else then come on now my man come on you see those guys are standing there face to face As you know, the rules are there. You cannot do that movement. Regardless of what he did, nothing happened? Yes, I totally agree with that. But you cannot do that movement. Come on, like you're headbutting the guy. Again, I get it. I think it's split, according to my count, right down the middle. But how can it be right down the middle when he's the one who's made the movement? No, so what I'm saying is when those two heads come together, if they stay together and you have that thrusting movement, It's down in the middle as to whether it gets red or not.
6:34What? Shaq. Shaq. Shaq. I'm standing by that. I am constantly standing by that. Hey, Shaq, I'll correct myself. It's not 80-20. No, I'm. It's 90-10. Again, I stand by that. I didn't think this was a red at the moment. Still. Here's where I have an issue. The fact that we are arguing for Erling Haaland to go down in order for him to draw the red card is what really highlights as to what is wrong with this whole conversation. Now, it benefits me because it's more clients to the diving camp. But you're going down there. Yeah, absolutely I'm going down. And I understand why a big guy like Erling Haaland doesn't go down in that sort of circumstance.
7:26But if he goes down, it's a red card. So basically what you're asking Erling Haaland to do is to embellish, to draw a call, to draw a red card, to paint a clear picture, because the referee and the VAR official are not willing to make a decision themselves. If you're asking Erling Haaland, big, strong guy, to go down so that the correct call is made, there is something wrong with this whole picture. Yeah, that's the thing, isn't it, Mario? Obviously, we applaud him for staying on his feet, but in a way, he's been punished as a result.
7:58Gabriel:Yeah, because, you know, like, okay, we've got to follow the rules. I get that. You know, you've got to follow the rules. But, come on. you know like at the moment it would be a big change too for like okay we got over City won the game but if that red card was given it would be a totally different game you understand in the sense of the way City especially at the end it would have been a three match battle as well you saw yeah and three matches without him there was going to be a big one but don't forget this this was the same Haaland if you looked at the last five minutes he gets the ball in the box and he just shoots it like in English you would say he boots it right up the field and make it go out.
8:39Gabriel:What did it say? It said to him, like, listen, I don't care what happens. We got to win this game. This is the same. You understand what happened? You understand? And I'm sure you guys saw the Spurs game. You understand? What they didn't do, what they should have done. So that's what I'm saying. It's like he booted the ball forward. He didn't care. And normally you would say, like, especially Pep. Pep's teams normally keep the ball in the team and try to make it look good and play really with it. No, but this time it was like, no. This was the Haaland that could have gone down and stayed up because he wanted his team to win.
9:10Are these the same percentages that you use for your power rankings? Because things are becoming quite clear. They're beginning to make sense. Same algorithm. Haaland then proving to be the difference between the two sides. His finishing, of course, proving to be decisive not only in this game, but of course throughout the season if Manchester City go on and win the title. It was something that Arteta addressed after the match.
9:34Mikel Arteta:I'm very upset with the results, obviously. We came here to win the game. I think the message was clear from three days before. We prepared to do that, to take the game to the areas that we believe we could win it. We certainly done that, even though we started the game with a goal down and psychologically we had to play with that. We've done it. So we proved that we are there. But the reality is in the two boxes, today was a difference and that's what decided the game. That's what you think was the difference between the two sides, the finishing in the boxes? Yes, the styles have been different for the profile of players that we have available as well in certain areas, but the difference was 100%.
10:19Is it that simple, Mario? Haaland plays for Arsenal, they win the league?
10:25Gabriel:Oh, yeah, I mean, he was going to be closer at least, or easier to be there, but you know what the thing was? I think it was more than just Haaland, you understand, when I watched the game. If you look at Silva, what he did, how he produced, you understand. I always enjoyed watching him. And I've seen two types of Silva. The one that we regularly see on the screen or one that you watch from the stadium and his movement. And how he helps everybody that's not in the game. He gets you in the game because he will come and take the pressure off you. That's Silva. Then, you know, Rodri, you understand, like, the way he played in the middle, like, how they were leading.
10:59Gabriel:I think those three guys, including Haaland, of course, those three guys, for me, made a big, big difference for them. And I think that is what sometimes when I look at Arsenal, I feel like some of the guys got to step up. And really, sometimes it doesn't always have to look good. Sometimes you got to just go for the result. Talk to me about Jokeres, Ali. Yeah. Isn't this the reason as to why you bring him? isn't this the moment in which you need the one player to be able to score the one goal and so it's a combination that or it's a conversation that we've regurgitated in a rhetoric that we have recycled time and time again in this show not only this season but over many seasons with Arsenal they don't have a number nine and some people when Arsenal have been doing well over the last couple seasons well you know but do they really need that guy do they really need that player.
11:57Well, according to Mikel Arteta, they do need that player. And allegedly, Joqueres was supposed to be that guy. And yet, in this deciding game, you go with not a number nine, and Kai Havertz. Now, if there are Arsenal fans out there that want to have the conversation as to well, Kai Havertz scored. Oh yeah, I forgot about that. Kai Havertz scores. Well, if you're going to hang on to that as to why you want to make an argument for Kai Havertz, then let me just tell you, you're going to lose the league. Because more times than not, these mistakes from Donnarumma are not happening. What should happen is that your number nine, in this case, Kai Havertz, is putting away the sort of chances that he did not.
12:41Look, it's half chances, it's full chances, it's a clear chance. I don't know. But what I can tell you is that Erling Haaland, in a broken play, that the ball just kind of fell to him. He holds those as his defender, and he's able to put it in the back of the net. And you can clearly then see when you go to the other side, to the other 18-yard box, Kai Havertz has those half chances, clear chances, those moments. He's not putting that into the back of the net. And so he highlights two things. One is Mikel Arteta prefers Kai Havertz in this sort of moment than the guy that you brought in for this sort of moment.
13:13And two, good Lord. If you're Djokovic, you're thinking, this is the moment for me to score these goals. I'm not on the field. What is my place on this team? On the bench, apparently. Shaqri has no touches. And that's my point here. You've got me on. That's my point here. Djokovic, including injury time, he's on the path for 14 minutes. Does not touch a ball once. So how much is that to do with Arsenal not playing to him? No, no, no. to be on that park for 14 minutes, you are a goal down, you are a striker, and to not touch a ball, that's on you. You almost have to try not to touch a ball. I don't get it.
14:01Which brings to the point as to why Havertz is starting. Gioca Reza's bought to play in these kinds of games, to deliver in these kinds of moments, but Mikel Arteta has no choice to go with Kai Havertz, who's not a natural number nine, who's not a natural finisher, because this is what you've seen from Giorgores all season long. I cannot make any kind of an excuse for Giorgores here. I do not know how, in that situation, you do not touch a ball. When you're brought on as a striker, a goal down, it's simply beyond me, and speaks to why, in my opinion, Arteta has got to go back in the transfer market this summer, in want of a number nine who can deliver a title-winning performance.
14:48And that is the regurgitation of the rhetoric we've been talking about. We've had this conversation in this studio time and time and time again. Now, Mikel Arteta, I'm going to guess over the last couple of seasons, has been defending the fact that there isn't a number nine, really. Look, we have different players that have different roles with different characteristics. And he tried to go down that path in the press conference in which he said, the guys with different characteristics and saying basically Erling Haaland is a goal scorer and we don't have a goal scorer. So I don't know if it's Mikel Arteta finally coming around and no longer being able to lie for his team or to lie to himself and to his staff and the fans.
15:30Yeah. In this sort of moment, you need that guy. Arsenal do not have that guy and it was shown in the worst time possible for them. Should we pinpoint the exact time where I think it went wrong for Jean-Claude Perez? Sure. Let's take a look at my pre-season predictions. Shall we? Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Oh, oh, oh. Oh, wait a minute. Hair of the year. Are we looking at jugglers or damn? Wow. Wow. They're both not bad. That was the absolute epitome of the kiss of death. How many buttons down is that? It's a lot. My button's falling off today. That's the excuse there. But then you've got the opposite.
16:12of a new signing here with Sean, certainly as the season's gone on. And that goal from Cherki, you take a look at it, Mario, and as a defender, how do you deal with someone with feet as quick as those?
16:26Gabriel:I think, you know what the thing is? You could see them, they didn't want to commit, right? Because when he started dribbling, you could see that they were like, hey, if I touch him, you know, I think it's Gabriel. If I touch him, so I tried to block his strike, but he didn't strike. He just kept on dribbling. And the key thing for Cherokee is, is what every footballer wants. Like all of us there, we want to be two-feated. And some of us are very good at it. And some of us say that we are two-feated, but we only have one. And he clearly, you know, possesses both of them and really comfortable.
16:57Gabriel:So the only way for you to play against him, I mean, I played with a kid, like I give an example, Sola, was similar on the ball, like dribbling wise. He always said, because I did that, wait for him to make the choice for you. because if you commit too early, that's what they're waiting for. Turkey waits for that too. But the good part for Turkey comes, like I said, if you don't bite, he will use the other feet from it. And then he just gets past you. And the way he did that, I mean, I think last week we spoke about the assist that he gave to Gay with his left foot, the outside of his boot. And then this week he dribbles like that and then strikes with his right.
17:34Gabriel:Come on, this is like, this guy is very, very talented. And I hope just one thing, that he just keeps on growing. Because if not, sometimes they get too comfortable, and I don't want him to get too comfortable. God, the Premier League needs players like this, doesn't he? Yes, yes, they do. Absolutely. And I think what was most impressive in that goal is that once he goes past Gabriel, when you watch it on TV, the space looks tight, right? Imagine on the field how tight it was. Because TV sometimes gives you the sense that there may be more space than there really is. when you're on the field and you have three guys in this space right here and he's able to have the patience.
18:15And patience that is slash arrogance. Patience of cutting past the defender and knowing full well that in this tight space, I don't have to hurry up and take this shot on. No, no. I'm going to take my extra touch because I can do that. Because I'm skilled enough. Because I'm confident enough. Because I'm arrogant enough. Because I can go off script. The things that Arsenal don't do, that they don't go off script, Ryan Cherokee was willing to do. I would also say that Ryan Cherokee hasn't been number one choice for Pep Guardiola over the course of the whole season. It's been as of late that when he's been given opportunities for long periods of time, when you start seeing this sort of thing, he has it in him.
18:58Now, he can be a frustrating player at times because as a striker, you're kind of going, okay, play me the ball, play me the ball, play me the ball, and this guy doesn't always do that because he loves himself some dribble. But you take that because he's willing and capable of doing what he just did in this sort of moment, taking on. We always say taking on responsibility. This is taking on responsibility. I'm going to take on players. I'm going to finish the chance because I'm good enough to do so. He's a match winner, which Arsenal are lacking, obviously. Yeah, and listen, I'm not sure how many players in any league can do what Chirky did just there.
19:30But when you look for Arsenal, you are asking for who's that creative spark, who's that player who produces something out of nothing the feeling to start the season whether it was that Eberici is a would would be that player but he's not he's not delivered had one very good effort in this game but not an awful lot more to talk about he's had his moments but they've been too few and too far between Arsenal are in desperate need of that player this is a situation pointing at Eze where you wonder if this is about Arsenal not playing to his strengths That, for me, is a bigger question than about Jocheres.
20:06We talked, of course, just a few weeks ago about the possibility of Arsenal doing the quadruple. Manchester City can still do the domestic treble, of course. They're in the semi-finals of the FA Cup. That game live on ESPN Plus. Excuse me, on a Saturday and then on Sunday, Chelsea against Leeds. And La Liga, full programme this week. Real Madrid taking on Alaves, our coverage star. Don't make that noise, Ali. It's a big game. And everything's up the line. 3 p.m. Eastern, join us on ESPN+. As you know, managing maintenance, repair, and operations is never easy. But for the ones who always rise to the challenge, Granger has your back.
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21:28and if you need help, we could recommend a shop for you. Ask for O 'Reilly Veriscan today. O, O, O, O 'Reilly Auto Parts
21:47Mario's on, so we've got to talk about Chelsea. Do we know? Six defeats in their last seven matches. they haven't of course scored in their last three Premier League games. Here is the one and only Liam Rossini. Last week club owner Bedard Iqbali spoke about you and about the attributes he admired in you. He said he thinks they're behind you and optimistic of long-term success. What about that support from the owners? 100%. They've been supportive of me and our daily conversations, sporting directors involved. They've been magnificent in their support of me and the team. and yeah, we're aligned and we know we need to win games of football in the now.
22:26Why haven't there been good preseason? Again, when we go through, I don't want to talk for too long. I could do. You should be a long life. No, no, what I'm saying is we do a lot of information gathering. We do a lot of, we look at data, we analyse the games. A lot of it comes down to moments. Mario, were you at Stamford Bridge at the weekend, Mario?
22:53Gabriel:Yes, I was. Let me channel my inner Alexis. What was the vibe there? The vibe, it was actually very good, you know? Like, okay, I mean, like, being on the field, I was on the field and talking, you could hear the noise and everything, so I had to speak a bit louder on the mic. But I think it was an exciting game to start with. But then when the referee blew the whistle, the game kicked off. It wasn't a lot happening. You know what the thing is? I think when I watched, it was a team that came there, like Man United came there and they were willing to let them play the game. And you can play the game and we're going to hit you on the break.
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23:28Gabriel:They play with Embuemo, Cunha and making sure that Fernandes can hit the break, you know, like open up. Okay, Cesc played up front, but he is more for the finishing product if that was possible. Okay, but then you look at Chelsea. They play at home. They play up front with Nato and, you know, Esteval. Esteval got injured. So Garnacho comes on and you know how the fans are towards Garnacho when it's the United fans. They start whistling and booing for him and everything. But for me the biggest thing I saw then, that was really sad for me to see. Garnacho is on the field for five minutes. He walks over across the field.
24:08Gabriel:He is on the right hand side. He came on, across the field, goes over to Liam Rosinha and ask him, can I play on the left-hand side and not to play on the other side? You know what Liam says? Yeah, that's fine. Wow. I'm watching that because I'm sitting right behind the bench and I'm like, which player in the world decides where he's going to play? Nah, that's not. When I saw that, I was like, nah, this game, how's this game going to turn if players decide where they're going to play and how they're going to play? Nah, that's not a good thing. When I saw that, that's not good. And then, you know, how they were playing and the lap was more worried about how he could beat his defenders up, you know, physically instead of scoring a goal.
24:44Gabriel:And I think those kind of things, this is the answer why they're not scoring. Because their focus is not on the right thing. They're focusing on other things. And then they don't play well. And then you have two guys in the middle. And then Fernandez and Caicedo. They were picking the ball up from the center halves, five meters away from them. You might as well play without the center halves then, and play them at the back. Because what they were doing, the center halves could do. If you buy them for that boy's money you can let them play the football game too and play them the 20 the 20 30 meter passes i'm sure those players can do that you don't need players to sit right in front of them so those kind of things slow the game down and there was no danger at all so mario if you've got garnacho dictating things it what it shows doesn't it that rosinia's out of his depth yeah because you know like i know what you what you're going to because Because people are talking about, is he going to be there next season?
25:39Gabriel:They're talking about he might be going. They might want to sell him and everything that was going on with him. Look, I have seen Garnaccio in two phases, right? The phases when he was in form, he felt really well. And it was very difficult to mark because he was very direct. When I watch him now, there is no danger from Garnaccio. And one of the key things I always say, any winger I watch, if you don't take on a defender on the outside, that means that you have fear. and a winger with fear will never beat his opponent because if you have no fear in you if you look at, I'll give an example Doku, what is Doku's strength?
26:15Gabriel:He takes you on the outside, why? Because he's in your head then as a defender but if a winger only goes inside inside inside all the time then it doesn't become dangerous anymore and that's exactly what he was doing, so for me Ganacho at the moment no, the kid doesn't look good and not the Ganacho that I know I'm going to quote Mario Melchia when describing my feelings about leaving Rosinia, and he starts talking about data gathering. Nah! Nah! Data gathering. Nah! When a manager starts talking data gathering, look, I know there's a place... Sorry, can I just... Data gathering blah. I'm interested in the fact that a manager is being told what to do by his players I was going to get there eventually that's alright, that ain't happening we haven't worked together for a while, we've been on break a little rusty when the manager is talking about analytics and data gathering instead of focusing on what's going on on the field on the match problem solving, the great difference between good managers poor managers, and great managers, is being able to problem solve on the field.
27:33And that you have such respect from your players that they're going to trust that the information that you're giving them and the role that you're providing these players, in their minds, is going to be what is going to give them the best chance to be successful and the team the best chance to be successful. If a player has to come across the field to then tell you that he's going to go play somewhere Or else, first of all, any player who has anything about them, they decide it without having to go ask the manager if they can do it. That's one thing. Second thing, that the manager allows it to happen freely.
28:08That is a terrible look for him as a manager. It's a terrible look for the player. It's a terrible look for the team. But it helps to explain why this team is all over the place. Because we're more focused on paying respects to the ball and data gathering than we are about problem solving on the field by both the player and the manager. This is not tenable. Let me just say, on the one hand, I want to say it happens. Players come to the manager, I'm shifting position. You want to play up front. Thierry Henry or Patrick Vieira does that. Gio Fragozola, Mario just mentioned. Fine. Garnaccio, though.
28:47And that he feels he has it wherewithal to do it. And he's allowed to do it. And he's allowed to do it. And that's my point here. You have to have a certain standing in the game, an understanding, an aura about you, to be able to make that call, whether you go to the manager or not, as Ali alluded to. But that, Garnaccio's not in that class of player. I'm sorry. So for Garnaccio to be making, not only is he not in that class of player, just in terms of presence and in terms of respect, he doesn't have that impact on the puck. To say, well, yeah, listen, If you move me from the right and play me on the left, I'm going to have a greater impact.
29:25Garnaccio is not that guy. He really isn't. So for him to be coming over and there being as little pushback or to Mario's story, no real consideration. Well, if we do this, how are we? It's just like, ah, go ahead. It just seems like a free-for-all. Yeah, but how about you tell your player, hey, no, I put you over there. You stay over there. And that's, you know, it's not a good look. It's as nice as I can put it. Liverpool got that late winner, of course, Mario against Everton in the derby. It looks like Chelsea are going to really struggle to get in the top five now.
30:02Gabriel:Yeah, definitely. I mean, like when I saw that game, of course, you understand, you know, the Mersey derby, you know, it's a different type of game. And you know the heat is on. I mean, I'm sure when you watch Liverpool, they felt it too. but scoring that goal changed a lot of the big perspective for Chelsea because it's a club that has to play Champions League. Because when I was there, the feeling and the expectation and what people expect the club to do is still there. But for it to succeed, and you could see the doubt, you could hear the doubt as well, the way they speak to you. You know, when some people that work for the club, when they speak to me, I could hear the way they were communicating.
30:42Gabriel:and that's why it's just like a sad story because it doesn't look good and even if you play like they're fighting for the next European spot if it's not Champions League but financially to be in balance Champions League is very important Just a reminder ESPN FC returns to your screens tomorrow we're talking a bit of La Liga plus looking ahead to what's it Manchester City Burnley Schrader League as well yeah why not
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32:28Find Kodiak frozen waffles and flapjacks in the frozen aisle at your local grocery store. They're the ones with the bear on the box. Let's take you to the highlight, shall we, of Crystal Palace against West Ham. And that's it. And there you are. West Ham getting a point, though. They are two clear as Spurs after that goalless draw. Mario is here. Shako, let's start with you. Former Hammer of the Year. Precious point or two points dropped? No, precious point. Thank, thank. Good. That's it. Move on. Yeah, pretty much. Thanks to Spurs, just picking up a point. Right now, all you're trying to do is match Spurs.
33:05and thankfully Spurs has set a pretty low bar. They most certainly have. I heard you screamed and shouted at our producer in glee, Mario, what Danso was doing. Sorry, come again? I couldn't hear you? You shouted at Mike, who goes to bed in his Spurs kit, about what Danso did.
33:26Gabriel:Hey, we have to... You know what we do? If Spurs does something... Look, for me, I already said I want the derby to carry on, So I don't want him to go down. But this you cannot do. Kick the ball forward. It doesn't matter. You understand? Look, I don't like the controversy what they gave him afterwards because I'm not a fan of that at all and I will support him in that case. The people start jumping on him, you know, in the race of the views what he was getting. But come on now. In that moment, my friend, you get the ball. Just forget about it. Don't worry where you're playing. Look, at this point, Spurs is not a club that you have to entertain, that they are being entertained.
34:07Gabriel:Just boot the ball forward. I don't care. It doesn't matter. And then you see all the other players start putting their head down, start crying. Come on, guys. Look, a mistake can happen in a team, right? But then you see the other one going down. No, guys. Who is going to help who? So stand up strong and fight together. But no, the old girl starts sobbing and saying like, oh, what happened? No, I was watching that game. I couldn't believe it. Are they down, Mario? It's a big one, yeah. Wow. It's a big one, Dan. It's hard to say, but it's a big one. Oh, there you go. Well, there's a sketch. We can only see that.
34:40They're down. Gab and Jules podcast. I don't know what I'm saying. The band mic, it's over. Oh, boy. Gab and Jules show is available to listen to. Now be sure to check it out.
34:55911, where is the emergency? It's the middle of the night in a small town on the Jersey Shore. Someone reports an abandoned car on a bridge. A search gets underway for the missing driver, 19-year-old Sarah Stern. Is it a missing person? Is it a suicide? At this point, nobody knows. Old friendships, buried cash, and a sinister plot that was once pitched as a movie plays out in real life. I'm Juju Chang from 2020 and ABC Audio. Listen now to Bridge of Lies Wherever you get your podcasts I have a new king of the pitch Marilene is always invested in this Marilene, which one for you?
35:41Gabriel:Oh my god Look, I go for the one that we already picked prior to it Because I was actually one of the ones that was Because I went for the people But if not Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait No, wait But come on If not, it was turkey or it was a guy outside the boot with his right. That was for me would be a dispute. But if not, I go for the old-fashioned style, guys. The team go. Wow. See, questioning Ali. Well, I don't know what Marius was doing over the weekend in London. All I'd say is that that volley is so difficult to hit. It pops up straight in the air from that sort of distance. The technique to then have the ball dipping over the bar.
36:24For me, the execution of that was perfect, and I think that's a far more difficult skill than the one from the other goal. I'm going to suggest that the volley should be the king of the pitch.
36:35Gabriel:Yes, Ali, I go against Ali. Before Xhaka says anything, no, Xhaka, please, don't go with Ali, because Ali, we like music, Ali. You like music too. The goal I picked was like music, my friend. Wow. All right, what sort of music? Tick-tack, tick-tack, tick-tack. Yeah. That sounds more like a clock. That's a clock. That's not music. What are we doing? What kind of dancing is that? I'm not familiar with that dance. Is Mario trying to bribe Hollywood music? I think so. Does TikTok TikTok? No, I'm not convinced by the old TikTok. Mario Maris. This week's. Here we go. A brand new king of the pitch. More questions to come, especially on what we saw at the weekend over on X-TOP Time.
37:23Check it out on YouTube. What? We have one final video before we go. Shaka, do you want to take us through? What?
37:41How cool is that? That's my youngest daughter coming on for her debut for the Trantabaga Reefense National Team. Shaktastic. it was let me tell you it was a special night shame about the result we lost it to El Salvador but you brought up the risk on nobody else I'm just I'm just saying I as disappointing result as it was it was a really special night for from my wife my family and really it's pretty in shock how cool is that it was it was it was surreal yeah I'm I'm not sure how to describe being a parent and seeing your kid run on to represent the country. It's beyond what it really is. Brilliant, Shank.
38:26You need a hug? I can give you a hug. I got my hug from there. I'm good. Good stuff. That is it. That brings us to the end of today's show. Mario is back, though, for Extra Time to answer some of your questions. Be sure to stay with us.
38:45Welcome in to the latest edition of Extra Time. Thank you very much for all your questions. Mario is with us. Mario, it's a simple one. Would you still keep Miko Arteta if Arsenal end up trophy-less this season?
39:01Gabriel:Oh, it's going to be a difficult one. I am not the guy, first of all, Dan. You put it in my shoes. I don't like firing managers. Oh, shut up, Mario. Come on. Consistently, he's not winning it. I might have to thank him. Wow. Mario says sack him. Ali, what would you do? I think you'd keep him. Yeah. Why? Because I think Miguel Arteta and Arslan have now become one. Yeah, but it's one that keeps losing. Well, not yet. We're not quite there just yet. And they become one and it's almost that they have formulated this whole personality about them that is them against the world and generated this identity about them.
39:44I think you're better off keeping Miguel Arteta. I'm keeping him as well. I think a big part of the reason is I'm not sure who else is up there. At the very least, you know, Mikel Arteta is guaranteeing you second place. So I keep that. If I was to offer you Vincent Kompany. Well, let's be honest. Vincent Kompany is not even buying to go to Arsenal. I'm just saying. No. Yeah, I'd probably take Vincent Kompany. But that's not happening. I have to go back on my answer. You might as well offer him a pop guardiola. Dan, I'm just offering. It's not your offer, it may not be your offer, Dan.
40:24Gabriel:There's a lot I can say about that, but just... Dan, I have to come back to my answer. I have to agree with the guys. I might have to, you know, I said Saki. No, you said Saki. No, nothing, nothing. No dancing, no dancing. Look at Saka, look at Saka. Tik Tok, Tik Tok, Tik Tok. Ali, Ali, Ali, Ali, what did you give him? Ali, what did you give him? I'm sorry. It's done. Is there any way to defend the left side of the City attack? Nico O 'Reilly overlapping, underlapping when Jeremy Doku has the ball at his feet is such a frightening prospect. How do you stop them, Mario? You just make sure that if you're the right defender, you always take the runner.
41:06Gabriel:So if someone goes around Doku, you know, around his back, you stick with the runner and let the midfielder pick up the winger that is gonna go inside because that's that's the best way you can deal with it because you never like you say that before the game you just say before the game listen I got the runner if the runner goes around his back I take the runner I stay with him and you stay with the one that's on the ball and if you don't understand that you know what's gonna happen then you're gonna get two players to one side and when that happens it's wide open for him so you got to do it like that.
41:38I think the best way to go about it is to attack Nico Reilly to actually get after him so that he has to defend because when he has to defend he has issues it actually becomes an area of concern for Manchester City and has been an area of concern so if you force him to defend then you don't have to concern yourself so much whether he's overlapping or underlapping and all this nonsense you force him to defend that's the best way. Shaka, yeah from your experience what's the dressing room like after losing a double-digit lead in the league and going through a tough run like Arsenal have this season right now how far were Newcastle ahead at least eight I'm not sure there's more than that at one point right right now the there's an air defiance in that dressing room you're kind of up for the fight okay the challenge to that as the challenge to that is now you need somebody to do your favor it's no longer only in your hands and that's why it becomes a whole lot easier to kind of play with a little bit of freedom which you've not seen from Arsenal I thought they played really well against Manchester City but probably for six eight weeks before that you've not seen that really well oh well by by comparison to what
42:53Gabriel:we've seen previous eight weeks let's let's call it that um I thought Arsenal I thought also compared to... Stevie had a salad today doesn't mean that he's eating really well. Try to convert Stevie of that. Try to tell Stevie that. Did he really? He's on a diet apparently. Again, like I see, try and tell Stevie that. Alejandro, who gives Manchester United a better chance at stability? Carrick or Nagelsmann? Oh, Michael Carrick. I would not touch Julian Nagelsmann. Wow. No. But he skates boards to work. No, no, no, no. You talk about somebody who likes to tinker and who thinks he's smarter than everybody else in the room.
43:39And when he walks in, he has all the ideas that have never been discussed or created in the game of football. That is Julian Nagelsmann. If I'm Manchester United, I'm thinking very strongly and deeply about the possibility that Michael Carrick may just be the answer for you. given the results, given the performances, given the personality of your team that you didn't have before and that you've been searching for. And some may say, well, isn't this what we saw when the Holy Gunnar Sorskjöer came in? It's been different about this Manchester United with the same group of players that Ruben Amorin was struggling with and everybody else had been struggling with.
44:13I think Michael Carrick, as of right now, is the answer. But certainly the option and the alternative should not be Julian Nagelsmann. No doubt. Was that? That was very clear. Let me think about this for a minute. Take that, Julian. Considering the title winner in the Premier League this year can only finish with a maximum of 85 points, does this show that the gap is closing between the big six and smaller teams? No. Who are the big six? The Spurs are the big six? No, Spurs are traditionally part of the Big Six, but it's been a long time since. But that's an old tradition.
45:06Gabriel:The stadium is. Well, when the gap is closing, I think it's always been a very competitive league. And you've just had the emergence of clubs like Brentford who've surprised. But then you've seen the big six Spurs who've surprised it differently. It's always has been a difficult league to win. And I just think that ensuring that I don't think I don't think City are back to where they were. No, I'm not going four in a row, Shank. Yeah, but this this city, while they made very well with the league and we all kind of picked them, too. I don't think this version of City is anywhere near as good as the version we saw two years ago.
45:46So have teams below them got better or have they got worse? I think, to my point, I think City this year is worse than they were last time they won the title. So teams haven't got better? Some. You should be clear like Ali. Ali hates Nagelsmann. Don't touch Nagelsmann. Let's just go back to that. Whatever you do, don't touch him. You want some more Liam Rossini in your life? He comes in the room and thinks everybody's a good guy. Oh my god. Excuse me. Now this one comes into the room and thinks everybody's a dunce. Dunce. Good. Right. What did I say? Dunce!
46:34Mario, are the top teams getting worse or are the bottom teams getting better? I'm good.
46:42Gabriel:It's a mixture. I think definitely, look, this season, we have seen, you know, the guys at the top, they dropped so many points, right? Because City was not in good form. Look at what's happening to Liverpool. So when you see that Chelsea spent so much money, they cannot stay at the top. Arsenal is again, you know, ups and downs. We thought, like, if we talk about, what is it, three months ago, we were like, wow, this is a team. Or two months ago, I mean. and now you start questioning it. Do you understand? People are getting famous because they're showing that drinking a bottle while Arsenal is playing City.
47:18Gabriel:By showing them that they are again letting it drop. And I'm like, what? It's gone far, man. No, this is why I'm saying like, no, the top, great, but they're dropping too many points. That's why it's so shaky. But it's good for the league to watch because we can watch it till the end now. No, it's true. Ali, meanwhile, should fans of the US men's national team be a little worried that Pulisic has gone scoreless in 2026 and hasn't scored in 17 consecutive matches for club and country. They should be a lot worried. If you watch any coverage around the United States men's national team in this country, around that coverage there'll be a bunch of commercials.
48:02Christian Pulisic features in all of those commercial or most of those commercials he is the flag bearer for this team he is the image of this team and he is the recognizable difference maker if he's not playing at a high level this team becomes far more limited in the attack there was a time in which i thought if gio reina's on the field and he's playing at a high level christian pulisic benefits over that and they become a interesting team in the attack well gio reina hasn't been playing for much in gladback Christian Pulisic Plays but it's not all that productive And has struggled with injuries And has struggled with consistency Yeah, I would be worried The only thing that you have going for you right now Is that Balogun is hot He's scoring goals But you need Christian Pulisic To be the different makers that he's expected to be Otherwise the attack of this team Again is going to become very limited Final question, Xhaka Which team do you wish you had played for In your day?
49:06Gabriel:That's a good question. The one that made music.
49:19I don't know. Who did you want to play for when you were growing up? When I was growing up, I was a Spurs fan. Oh boy.
49:28Yeah. Oh boy.
49:32They were the traditional Big Six. See, bye bye. Big six first. Back then. There you are. Yep. All traditions. Yeah. I don't know. I'd have liked to play in a country where English wasn't the first language. I'd have liked to learn a new language. Immerse myself in... What happened to the tape you were listening to? The CD driving back and forth listening to Spanish. Oh, I said duolingo. Yeah. How did that go? In Spanish, please. No bueno. No bueno. How embarrassing. Oh my goodness. Ah, boy. You should have spoken to Dan. Yeah, exactly. What conversation that would be. That would be like West Ham Crystal Palace.
50:17No bueno. No bueno. No bueno. No bueno. Mario, where do you wish you were? When you were a teenager, you played for Ajax. I imagine your dream club.
50:29Gabriel:Yeah, no, definitely. You know, as a kid from Amsterdam, it was like, you know, like, also at home. right you know you grew up in Amsterdam all the kids are talking about it then you made your debut and in the time of making my debut was the Super Mario game that just came out so it was perfect timing I couldn't have it better steady I'm singing your name you're like as a kid you hear 50 000 people sing when you're 19 years old come on Dan you think that you own Amsterdam it's not true but you think it fun you must have had Mario um so question so Mario Mario Mario is that old that Super Mario came out when he was a player.
51:08He's that old. Yeah. I thought Mario was younger than that. No, look at him. Well, I mean, he's looking nice, but he's living the life. He is living the life. He is indeed.
51:21Gabriel:Thank you, Ali. Thank you, Ali. I'm taking care of myself. Ali, where do you wish you to play? I was a big fan of Juventus. Serie A was really in the league, of course. And it's your jacket today. Yes, well, kind of, but different colors. A bit black and white. No, it's actually navy. Never mind. You're a long way, we're done. I was a big fan of that team that had, like, Michel Platini and Boniak and Laudrup. Yeah. I thought, yeah, that would be the team to play for La Vecchia Signora back in the day. And it was basically because my dad and my brother were big fans of Napoli when Maradona was playing for Napoli.
52:02You had to be there. I had to. Yes. Some things don't change. I've got to. That is it. One last thing. Shaq has been busy. Obviously he saw his daughter make his debut. Yeah. Her debut for Trinidad and Tobago. Hey! Talk us through this Shaq. I got the Keith Alexander Award at the Football Blacklist for services to community. Presented by Shola Amiobi who is another patron for Shola Amiobi and former Newcastle player. It was a special night. It really was. So much of it to be proud of, emotional about. It was a night well spent. Well, man, I tell you, you do. What a week you have. I had a very good week.
52:45What did you do? Horseback riding? Yeah!
52:53The horse is the horse. There you go again. Horseback riding in the Smoky Mountains. With that shirt shrinking the... Ellie! That was an awkward side. Oh boy, oh yeah. Ellie! Oh my God. What the heck? Poor horse. Ellie! The horse is like, oh God.
53:13Gabriel:It's a workout for the horse. It's a workout for the horse, Mario. That brings us the entrance. Ellie, you're the man. You're the man, Ellie. ESPNC, pack on your screens tomorrow. It's far more important than Shaka's week. Yeah!
From the publisher
The FC Crew react to Sunday's match between Manchester City and Arsenal, questioning whether Gabriel should have been sent off for his headbutting antics with Erling Haaland. Also, a breakdown of Mikel Arteta's decision to start Kai Havertz over their big money signing Viktor Gyökeres. Then, a discussion on Chelsea's horrible form as they attempt to keep up with the race for Champions League football.
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