Barcelona's LALIGA Crisis

15:08Herculez Gomez:Some breakfast intel you want to know about.

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15:47Herculez Gomez:They're the ones with the bear on the box. So it will be Brentford against the Hammers in all a Premier League affair. Newcastle will face Manchester City again. but one that really stands out of course is Wrexham against Chelsea. Wrexham partly owned by Ryan Reynolds. Here's his reaction along with Hugh Jackman.

16:11Herculez Gomez:Number seven. Wrexham will horse Chelsea. Wait, wait, wait. We're home with Chelsea. That's what you want. Yes. There we go. it's certainly one of the stand what's huge i mean eating salads a big salad not used to that on this show uh we welcome in uh mario malchia of course former chelsea player archie's still with us uh germaina as well archie that's kind of the standout ties that we're selling a bit more of the romance of the cup i think so that alongside mansfield hosting arsenal feels like a very significant tie and given what mansfield did to burnley as well and having been here in macclesfield tonight jermaine i tell you what if if macclesfield can get that close to brentford then any game is open it is oh my goodness me um do you know what i am really looking forward to that rexham rexham chelsea game i think with the what rexham have been able to achieve over the last few years especially the back-to-back-to-back promotions.

17:20Herculez Gomez:You look up the ownership model, what they're doing, the positivity around the place as well. And Chelsea, with the new manager, Leon Rossini, are doing really, really good stuff there. You know, it'll be interesting to see how he overcomes that challenge on a personal level. Wolves, Liverpool as well, Newcastle, Manchester City. That wasn't getting your juices flowing as much. Not really, no. Why not? Because it's not. OK. Do you know what it is? you sort of know what to expect from Liverpool. You sort of know what to expect from Manchester City. They're going to hog the ball. They'll dominate possession.

17:56Herculez Gomez:They'll keep the ball. They'll move it as quickly as possible. They've got some world-class players in their team and they'll ultimately end up, you know, in my opinion, I think they'll end up winning the game, but it wouldn't be an entertaining end-to-end game. Whereas when you're looking at the Wrexham v Chelsea and then you look at the, who did Arsenal? Mansfield Arsenal. Mansfield Arsenal, sorry. They're exciting. This is what the FA Cup's all about. It's all about the underdogs having an opportunity, having a chance. And in those games, I feel like they're the best opportunities to see a possible upset.

18:26Herculez Gomez:Jermaine, thank you. And as we were across the whole of this weekend, we will be there for round five in a couple of weeks' time, Dan. Thank you very much, boys. Much appreciated. Mario Marquillot joins us now to reflect on that draw. In particular, of course, Wrexham against Chelsea. Mario, you're loving it.

18:42Archie Rhind-Tutt:Cool, done.

18:43Jermaine Beckford:Oh, yeah, of course. Cheers, guys. Thanks, guys. We couldn't have a better marketing situation because this is perfect. You know, the owners, they are very intelligent, and this is a perfect game for them. For Chelsea, I think this is going to be a tough game. Why? Because, I mean, the guys who are sitting in the studio already, we all know when you play in England and you go into that stadium, oh, my God, it's going to be tough. You better kick off from the get-go because if not, every chance they get, and I'm talking every chance, And I'm talking about like even if they get a throw in or they get a corner kick or a free kick, the fans are behind them like crazy.

19:20Jermaine Beckford:So you better get an early goal. If not, Chelsea might be not happy going there.

19:25Herculez Gomez:Certainly something to look forward to, of course, those games to be played on the weekend of March the 7th. If I may, I want to draw your attention to what else happened this weekend in the FA Cup. Grimsby taking on Wolves. And look at the state of the pitch at Blondel Park. It was a complete and utter mess. It's been raining England a lot. Grimmsfeet's miserable at the best of times. Throw some rain and mud into the situation as well. Kieran, what's it like for Premier League players to go and play on this sort of surface?

19:57Archie Rhind-Tutt:It's incredibly humbling. Oh, yeah?

20:00Herculez Gomez:Is there any part you enjoy of it whatsoever?

20:03Archie Rhind-Tutt:I mean, it's always good to visit different grounds and different stadiums. You know, football was built on stadiums like this, you know. And so I think it's important for the players, especially players coming from abroad. You know, Arsenal was full of foreign players. Yes. For them to see that there are levels to this game and that you can draw against these kind of teams is brilliant. I remember we drew against Sutton United one year. Yeah. And, you know, that for especially for the foreign players was amazing, you know, them to be you know seeing Cesc Fabregas sitting in the dressing room in Sutton was was you know just uh an incredible thing so I think it's it's definitely important that the the cup brings that out of football you know so I love seeing this and it's also the environment is completely different you know when no disrespect to when these teams come to the big stadiums you can you can almost feel that their emotion is distracted by, you know, the big lights, the 60 ,000 seaters.

21:09Archie Rhind-Tutt:But when you go there, they are fully locked into the game. Yeah. So that's why I love it when big teams get drawn against the smaller ones.

21:17Herculez Gomez:Mario, what was it like for you when you were playing for Chelsea, obviously Birmingham, West Brom, you must have gone to these sort of places and it must have been a little bit of an eye-opener.

21:27Jermaine Beckford:Yeah, definitely. I think, you know, what Karen said also, because we all, we're young boys, right? When you're a young boy, this is a normal field to play on. So this brings back memories of where you came from and where you are right now. And the thing is that the guys that play against you for them is like a, like a final for you is like getting to the final. So you'd better be ready for that. So that's why we had like, when I was at Chelsea, we played against Oxford, I think quite a few times. And those guys, oh my God, it was like, you know, like normally we in preseason, we're taking it easy.

21:58Jermaine Beckford:and we're taking it easy with tackles and stuff? No. They're making you feel like it was the last game of the season. So they're going at you. So you just have to be careful, I think. But now this is in the middle of the season when they go in there, you know, when you play each other, the pitches are wet, it's raining. It's just everything is perfectly for them instead of for you. You just have to make sure win the game, stay fit, and go away healthy instead of, like, having a bad injury or trying to get, like, a stupid card.

22:25Archie Rhind-Tutt:You love it, Don. Oh, I love it. Takes you back as being a kid. you've got to embrace it. You know, like Mario said there, like we've all played when we're like sort of 9, 10, 11 into your teens and you're playing on mud pitches and it's like, just get stuck in. Go and like look at the environment and go like, this is a bit of me today. Like get dirty, do some slide tackles, have some shots, some tackles, crowd are involved, great atmospheres. That there, the Wrexham Chelsea, that's like the romantic side, isn't it? The big draws and the big games, obviously Newcastle Man City, that's the glamour game.

22:54Archie Rhind-Tutt:But it's where the romance of the cup is when you're seeing teams that are down in League One or the Championship or League Two and they're facing the Premier League boys, you think, can they? Go on, can they give them a test?

23:04Herculez Gomez:So obviously we see pitches in the FA Cup that we don't normally see. We also saw no VAR. And for people like Don, they're like, oh, thank goodness, no VAR this weekend. We can just enjoy the game. The problem is when you have a tie like Aston Villa against Newcastle, where the referee has such a shocker, it is impossible, isn't it, to back up your argument that we need to go back to the old days where there's no VAR?

23:28Archie Rhind-Tutt:Well, I hear you, but there's still mistakes in VAR. And what frustrates me about VAR is the guys that are on the VAR booth, when they're watching decisions and still getting it wrong, that's frustrating. But I take your point. I mean, you know, when you look at Tammy Abraham there, Newcastle have actually worked a really high line to play him offside. So the linesman should see that. The referee's got no chance. He's in the middle of the pitch.

23:47Herculez Gomez:So what you need is some video technology to help the linesman?

23:49Archie Rhind-Tutt:Maybe, or make the referee and the linesman better at doing their jobs. Because I'm not being funny. The linesman's looking across Newcastle's back line. He should see. You take the referee out of the equation, the linesman, come on, you've got to do your job there.

24:00Herculez Gomez:And then here, obviously, we talked about this possibility of being a red card.

24:04Archie Rhind-Tutt:This wasn't given. It's a red card all day long. I mean, when you see it again in slow motion, Luka Dean's nowhere near the ball. He catches him on the shin, then rakes him down the ankle. I mean, Murphy's lucky when his shin pads sort of got pulled up and the camera showed it.

24:18Herculez Gomez:If only we had a system in place that could help this out. So that should have been them down to 10. Exactly. So then we had, there was an argument, quite a heated argument between you and Stevie at half-time, wasn't there about that? Yeah. You were saying, look, OK, the referee's had a couple of mistakes, but then the second half happened, and the penalty then wasn't given as a penalty. Yes, it was a let-off, but this is where your argument and everyone's argument kind of falls down a little bit.

24:42Archie Rhind-Tutt:But it doesn't, though, because, you know, look at Dean's inside his own 80-yard box when Trippier crosses it. He wasn't standing outside. He's standing inside. So come on, ref. You can see that. So I know the VAR conversation, but look where he is. He's inside the box. So how can the referee determine and say he's outside the box?

25:01Herculez Gomez:But this is the thing, isn't it? We've opened Pandora's box. It's impossible now to shut it.

25:06Archie Rhind-Tutt:Yeah, like I said before, I think...

25:08Herculez Gomez:So there's no point moaning about it anymore?

25:10Archie Rhind-Tutt:Probably not. But I think instead of getting involved too much, he can't micromanage everything. I mean, that's an extreme. What we saw there in that Villa-Newcastle game, that's the extremes to bring it back. isn't it like howlers so when you sit there and you go what defence have I got but I guarantee you I'll be on this show in a week's time looking at a Premier League game or another game around the world and VAR's messed up a decision from the VAR not so much the referee so my angle and my point is if we can take a little bit of the micromanaging from the VAR and make the referees and the linesmen better that'll be a better place I would imagine I don't understand make the referees better but you can't you can't no no no I get that but I think the referees now have got a little bit subconscious where they think, that's a big call.

25:54Archie Rhind-Tutt:I'm not going to make that because VAR will get me out of trouble. But how can you stop them? Because you'll make the referees better. The referees were better than this, I would imagine, before VAR. I don't know, Tom. You must have played so many games in which referees had shot. Loads, loads, but it is what it is. So therefore, you've got the back of a VAR now. Yeah, but the contradiction to that is when you're talking about the modern game and you're criticising the guys that are sat in VAR, they've got three, four, five, six chances to look at something where you can use an ex-player, use a pundit, use a presenter.

26:26Archie Rhind-Tutt:You can see they've got it wrong. Yet they still stick with their decision and haven't seen a replay six times. So it's on them to improve. It's not like the first year when we went transitional phase. It's not going to be easy for the VAR guys. Referees have got to get used to it. This has been in place a long time now.

26:41Herculez Gomez:So Mario, Don says get rid of VAR. He's had enough of all of the technology. What do you say?

26:46Jermaine Beckford:I think, look, look, There are moments, you understand, we need it. Because I think there are definitely crucial moments where we say it's very helpful. But what I do agree with him is that the ref has to be careful that he's not going to hide behind it. Because, come on, you don't have to be smart to see that penalty kick. Come on, guys, come on. It's like, come on. The Leisman stands there. Now we could go to Leisman and say, what are you doing? Are you part of the game or are you just part of the stand? Because then we must have put you next to the people. Because, come on now, it's not that far from you.

27:17Jermaine Beckford:And you know what the thing is also those are the same guys when you tell them something Oh my god, they let you have it So I would let him have it too because I'm calling my friend if you holding that line You got to see that the guy is standing in the box He's jumping the tackle if you see at the tackle how many times did he apologize to the tackle? How many times did he apologize? Why look as a defender? Kieran is there as a defender. How many times did we apologize only when we knew what we were wrong if not you don't apologize but when he goes to apologize three times you know he's wrong he should have gotten a red card and that's the same with the handball he walks away he goes like this yeah he knows it's red come on guys come on Dan stop it's red

27:59Archie Rhind-Tutt:Kieran never apologized in his life he's got a point but I mean I think Don just mentioned then it's been around for a while how long has it been around for I mean I got sent off wrongly mistaken at Stamford Bridge and that was 2014 14, right? So that was 12 years ago. So it's not, you know, it's what a decade, a decade old. In terms of actually how long compared to that it hasn't been around for, it's not that long. So the technology is still maturing. And yes, there are many issues with it. But you can't say that goal line technology wasn't a revolution. Offside as well is, you know, How many goals has that made real over the last 10 years?

28:48Archie Rhind-Tutt:So for me, I just think there are things that it needs to improve on in terms of the speed. I think the speed is the biggest issue. Yeah. You know, because people complain a lot that everyone's waiting around for the decision for so long. But going back and forth, you know, in terms of using VAR for a month and then having a weekend where there's no VAR. for the referees, they're human. It's human nature to get used to something and then all of a sudden it's taken away for a week. They're going to hold their hands up and say, oh, no, I don't want to make that decision. And that's what's happening at the moment and that's why the game's getting confused.

29:24Sebastian Salazar:Well, that would make sense up until you get to the handball by Lucas D. You could make that argument up until you get to that handball and you should be getting that call right 30 years ago, 50 years ago, 10 years ago, or yesterday for that matter. Don was making the argument and saying something along the lines of the modern game as he described the way that the game is played nowadays. Well, if we're going to talk about the modern game, VAR is going to be part of the modern game. We cannot ignore, hide our heads in the sand and say, well, technology all around us, but we are not going to use it.

30:00Sebastian Salazar:We have to use it better. We have to implement it better. but to say get rid of it because it's somehow against the nature of the game. I'll tell you what's against the nature of the game. Guys diving. I know all about it. Drawing fouls. I know all about it. That's against the nature of the game. And so even a person, a player that benefited from drawing fouls where perhaps there were none, I'm telling you, VAR is better for the game. We need the technology because more times than not, we're going to get calls right that are going to affect your livelihood, your livelihood, my livelihood, and fans, and what clubs are able to achieve.

30:42And so I cannot stress enough that if we focus on the amount of time that VAR takes in order to get a call right, we are losing sight of what's important.

30:58Sebastian Salazar:Yeah, it could be better. Yes, it could be quicker. But what do we want as players for calls to be made correctly?

31:04Archie Rhind-Tutt:Ali, can I take you back very quickly to the Man City-Liverpool game, or Liverpool-Man City game, where, in my opinion, when Mo Salah got put clean through on the right-hand side and he got tugged on the shirt outside the box, which obviously wasn't a penalty because it was outside the box, but he was denying a goal-scoring opportunity. That went to VAR, and the VAR decided there wasn't enough of a shirt pull. Mo Salah was going to get to that ball. Ruben Diaz, Mo Salah was two yards away from the ball. Ruben Diaz was six yards away from the ball. Mo Salah was getting there first. And VAR said, no dogs out.

31:35Archie Rhind-Tutt:But they're still getting things wrong. So you just get rid of it completely? No, no, no. I'm not saying get rid of it completely. That's never been my argument. I don't like some of it. But there's always going to be anomalies because humans are involved. So the humans have to improve, to Ali's point. But overall, what you're picking up is on little bits and pieces. Well, that little bits and pieces are quite significant. in that major Premier League game last week. But the problem is that those little bits of pieces are huge pieces when you don't have VAR. Yeah, but we had VAR and that was a huge call.

32:05Archie Rhind-Tutt:That didn't go in Liverpool's favour. You're ignoring my point here. You have a little problem here, but you have a big problem when there's no VAR. Well, as I said before, it's not a perfect solution. The referees are human. They're subjective. They're going to make subjective calls. They're going to make honest calls. They're trying their best to make honest calls. But to Ali's point there, when the Kieran Trippi and the free kick and Luca Dean is standing inside his box and you give it outside. The worst one of all of that, I actually thought, was the Tammy Abraham goal that was allowed. Because it's from a static free kick.

32:34Archie Rhind-Tutt:Everyone can relax. You've got the 18-yard line. You've got the 18-yard line if you're the linesman. The referee, I'll give him an out because he's obviously central. But the linesman looking right across the line, you've got one eye on the ball, which is the kick point. You've got Newcastle's defenders all staying in a straight line. Abraham's two yards offside. You have to call it.

32:52Herculez Gomez:I'll tell you what though, it's not just in England obviously. There are problems globally around the world with some officiating. Of course a big story this weekend was the red card shown to Kululu. We'll show you that incident in a moment. Clearly there looked to be hardly any contact on him. But Gianluca Rocchi, who is the referee designator, said, We're very disappointed both with La Pena's decision, which was clearly wrong, and with the fact that VAR could not be used to rectify it. It was his second yellow. La Pena is mortified and why we sympathise with him, But I have to let you tell the truth.

33:23Herculez Gomez:He is not the only one who got it wrong because yesterday there was a clear simulation. The latest in a long series in a league where they try everything they can to cheat us. The coaches have never helped us but have made things difficult for us. I believe that someone should examine their conscience to be clear. I am referring to those who go out of their way on the pitch and behave in a certain way. Shall we take a look then at the incident? This was the second yellow.

33:55Archie Rhind-Tutt:Dive, Bastoni dive. But look at him asking for a card. So this law change, this will change I think in a year's time where they'll actually be allowed to look at second yellow cards. Because it's crazy that they don't. Here we are. Is there not clear, Paul? Hey! So that's what it's all referring to. Bastoni cheating by diving, to Ali's point. feigning or getting free kicks by going down easy.

34:20Herculez Gomez:So for those who didn't see Ali Moreno play, he had a reputation for somewhat of a simulator? Is that fair enough? Embellishment, I think, would be fair. Now, he is saying that you're... Basically, the referee's coming out and saying that you're not doing anything to help the referees by acting as you do. Do you have a defence for that?

34:40Sebastian Salazar:It's not my responsibility to do that. My responsibility is to my team and my teammates. Oh, come on. You can't just say I'm going to cheat my way to... Wait a second, Don. Wait a second. You can speak when you have a chance. I will finish my point. You know, as it pertains to my responsibility with my teammates and my team and my fans, if I think drawing a foul is going to put us in a position to win a game, I will do it. I did it. I will do it now. And I will do it years from now. My responsibility is to win games. And I don't care how I go about it. It's professional sports. This is not juice boxes and orange slices.

35:25Sebastian Salazar:This is not recreational. We're here to win. And for anybody in this panel or anywhere that has played at a professional level, at a high level, to say that they did nothing to cheat, that they did nothing to gain an advantage, that they did nothing to get a step ahead somebody else, they are lying to you. 100 % lying to you and measuring the truth. It is our responsibility to win games. And for all of us, we would do anything in order to make that happen.

35:59Jermaine Beckford:Okay, Ali, I agree with you. All of us had a moment of our beautiful things that we pretended like, okay, we could stand on our feet, but we let ourselves fall. But one thing I think goes a little bit over the top. when I see somebody celebrate and someone else getting that card. That is a bit for me too much. I don't mind, look, all this stuff, but come on now, you celebrate like you scored a goal. No, that's not, come on, that's killing the game. I don't mind you doing your little things because everybody will do that. How many times you got penalties against us, you understand, or little disfusion.

36:30Jermaine Beckford:Okay, I don't mind that. That's the part of the game. I totally agree with you and I think that is just part of football if you play as a pro. But one thing I don't like, it will definitely get in my head. If I do something and I know it's like a minimal like little thing and I see another player celebrating. Oh my friend. Ooh Especially in England. I have a nice tackle for you when it comes

36:53Archie Rhind-Tutt:I mean I take exceptions to Ali's point where he said he would do anything I mean there has to be a line You can't just stamp on someone's foot or punch someone in the face by doing anything I get you drawing a foul. I've done it myself. I've dived. I've tried to bend the rules a little bit And there you go. No, no, no. But I wouldn't do anything to win a game. You have to have a level. Surely you can't go on the pitch thinking, I'm going to do whatever I want to do, because I've got, to your point, an obligation to my teammates. Well, within the fringes of legality. You never said that.

37:24Sebastian Salazar:Within the fringes of legality. And if you step over... He never said that, Your Honor. No, no. Here's the thing, Don. You're trying to sit on a high horse right now. No, no, no. In which you're suggesting, like... I'm quoting you. We are all choir boys. And we were not. I'm quoting you. Nobody was a choir boy here. Nobody was. Right? I am fine with saying, look, yeah, I had some limitations to my game. So in order to make things work for me, I had to do certain things that other people may frown upon. I don't frown upon it. I look at it as part of the game. And it is the referee's responsibility to say, that guy is embellishing.

38:03Sebastian Salazar:That guy is simulating. That guy is trying to cheat. And I'm not going to make the call. That's on him to make that call. That's his job. It's not my responsibility as a player to make his job easier. I'm going to push the boundary as far as I possibly can, and I do not apologize for it. Hearing games.

38:22Archie Rhind-Tutt:Need I say any more, to be honest? I mean, I think the verdict's out.

38:25Herculez Gomez:You don't need to say it because you have to pick a side.

38:29Archie Rhind-Tutt:There's always going to be people that bend the rules in order to get the results.

38:34Herculez Gomez:Dom was saying cheaters, Ali should be banned from the game because of what he was doing. The life.

38:39Archie Rhind-Tutt:He should be banned from the game. No, no. Did you hear me say that, Kieran? No, no. No, but I'm in agreement. I'm in agreement. Everyone's going to try to bend the rules. The referee has to get involved and make sure that those rule benders are punished when needed. Right. And that's, you know, that's the way it has to be. Which I think was the case in the clip that we've just watched. So if Bastoni dive in, he has to have repercussions of that. Or in a year's time when that second yellow card, because as it stands today, they don't look at second yellow cards, maybe that's the future of a VAR to help Kalulu in that situation.

39:16Archie Rhind-Tutt:Hold on.

39:16Sebastian Salazar:So you're asking for more VAR now? In that situation. Oh, I see. Full circle. You didn't want VAR, now you want more VAR.

39:27Jermaine Beckford:Go on, Mario. You know what's also the thing is, Dan, you know what the thing is with all the guys who are sitting there? believe me we all of us had a problem with the ref once so that's why you are talking as a referee they are not talking as referees because they all knew that when it comes down to the conversation with the ref you on his own with him oh he let you have it and they are not nice i've never been a friend with the ref maybe they've been but i've never been mario's such a nice guy until you bring

39:55Herculez Gomez:up referees. Their hands go gone. I don't like them. They're nice. I don't like them. The nicest guy you can meet if it's a referee and he's gone. Just a reminder, a lot more of what happened in the weekend, especially that game between Juve and Inter on the latest edition of the Gab and Jules show. If you've shopped online, chances are you've bought from a business powered by Shopify. You know that purple shop pay button you see at checkout? The one that makes buying so incredibly easy? That's Shopify. And there's a reason so many businesses sell with it. Because Shopify makes it incredibly easy to start and run your business.

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42:56Herculez Gomez:So it was a very disappointing night, wasn't it, for Barcelona? Losing 2-1 against Girona. We'll be hearing from Hansi Flick in a moment. But first, Gemma caught up with Rooney Parche.

43:08Archie Rhind-Tutt:I think we need to just, you know, when we come back to training, to look at ourselves, try to see what's going wrong and to fix these things. Because in the end, like I said, we create a lot of chances.

43:20Sebastian Salazar:We just need to maybe be more clinical in front of goal. And to just have that hunger to win games and to score the goals,

43:29Archie Rhind-Tutt:if you ask me. But more than that, I don't know, because it's not me.

43:33Sebastian Salazar:There's been quite some controversies, especially that goal of Girona with Koundé fault. What do you think?

43:39Archie Rhind-Tutt:I was quite close to the situation, to be honest. From what I saw, I saw that, you know, of course they were both on the ball, but I saw in the end that I think Koundé was maybe first on the ball and then that he came a little bit with his foot. That's what I saw, I was close to the ball, but then I don't know how it looks on the video, I didn't see, but from my perspective, I mean, it looked like a fall, but I'm not the guy to, you know, in the end it's the referee, so yeah.

44:03Herculez Gomez:I think we had our chances in the first half, second half, Gerona has more chances. I think they also deserve this win, this victory. At the end we are not in a good moment and of course, especially the transition in the defence, we didn't make it good.

44:23Archie Rhind-Tutt:We saw you asking for the referee for explanations, maybe after the game,

44:28Jermaine Beckford:maybe with that fault on Koundé on the second goal. What do you think? What's the fault?

44:37Herculez Gomez:Come on, now you can say it.

44:38Archie Rhind-Tutt:No, no, no, no, I'm here for ask. I'm here just for ask. Yeah, yeah, yes, yes, yes.

44:42Herculez Gomez:You have no opinion? No? No. Okay, then I also not. Okay, no, nothing to say. Okay, thanks a lot. Oh, he should have said, no, it's not a foul. What do you think? Oh, Mario, we haven't heard your opinion on it. What do you think?

44:59Jermaine Beckford:I think he had to follow through on him. But you know, look, for me sometimes I feel like as a defender, sometimes you also got to go for it. And I think he kind of left his foot there. Yeah, I think Koundé could have gone stronger, but I think he was late. The attacker was late, so that's why he went over it. Look, he goes over his foot.

45:17Herculez Gomez:Yeah. Mario, what about Ali's point that he made earlier in the show about Koundé needs to get up when he realised the foul isn't going to be given?

45:26Jermaine Beckford:Oh, that I definitely agree. Because when I look around, look, he's even looking away. If you wait, you see Kune looking at the shot. Look, he looks back. He looks at the strike. I mean, if you have the power to look at the strike, you might as well get up and just try to defend your goal. Exactly. He's just waiting on VAR, Don.

45:39Archie Rhind-Tutt:Exactly. And VAR should have given it.

45:41Herculez Gomez:Well, it didn't give it. There you go. There you go. Again, he wants more VAR. There you go. Burn it in the trash. Be sure to stay tuned. Extra time is coming up next. But let's not forget to remind you what's happening this weekend in Lali. Liga, Real Madrid against Osasuna. Real Madrid, of course, could have a big lead at the top of the table come Sunday as Barca take on Levante. That's at 9.45 Eastern. Partner with Amazon Hub Delivery to earn extra income for your business with your business. Assist with local Amazon deliveries and get paid for each package you deliver. When you become a partner, you and your staff will deliver packages to customers in your area on a schedule that works for you.

46:20Herculez Gomez:Gain extra income, increase exposure for your business, and connect with neighbors. It's easy to get started with no delivery experience, long-term contracts, or startup costs required. Interested in learning more? Visit Amazon.com slash hub delivery. That's Amazon.com slash H-U-B delivery. As you know, managing maintenance, repair, and operations is never easy. But for the ones who always rise to the challenge, Grainger has your back. From professional-grade products you can count on to fast, dependable delivery, they're there to help you keep things running smoothly. Plus, their technical product specialists are here to help answer your toughest questions.

46:55Herculez Gomez:And because Grainger knows safety is always a priority, they're committed to being your partner in protecting both your people and your facilities. Call 1-800-GRAINGER, click grainger.com, or just stop by. That is it. That brings us to the end of today's show. Don, you feeling picked up? No, good. Always. Always. Mario back with us as well to answer some of your questions. Please be sure to stay tuned.

47:25Herculez Gomez:Welcome in to the latest edition of Extra Time. It's the last day, isn't it, for Don? Kieran. Yeah, we're off. Kieran's never worked so hard. Money left.

47:38Herculez Gomez:Ali is with us as well, as is Mario. Mario, have you got a little bit of glitter on your face? What's that?

47:44Archie Rhind-Tutt:A little bit of what? Glitter? Looking shiny.

47:46Herculez Gomez:Feeling shiny? I heard you mean... No, no, no, no, it's just... I heard, baby, you were at Carnival. What?

47:54Jermaine Beckford:No, no, no, no. Look, look, look, my friend, Dan, you understand. Look, there is one thing when you're playing you cannot do, but when you're retired, you can do a lot more things. Learning how to dance a little bit of samba. Oh my God, you know, look, you just have to make sure you have a lovely woman at home, and she tells you, of course, keep going, have fun. And she said that so I won.

48:17Herculez Gomez:Mario, I don't think we're going to continue with that conversation. So he was a Carnival. Let's establish that.

48:24Jermaine Beckford:He was a Carnival. You know why? Because your mind is going the wrong way. Mine is going the right way.

48:32Herculez Gomez:Oh, Matt Schack is obviously there at the moment.

48:34Jermaine Beckford:Ali, Ali, help him out. Ali, Ali. Come on now, Ali. Come on, man. Help him out, man. Tell him what the South Americans are doing. Come on now.

48:40Sebastian Salazar:But here's the thing, Mario. You never answer the question. Were you or were you not a Carnival?

48:47Jermaine Beckford:Hey, my friend, of course I had to do a little bit of summer. I know you will like it.

48:55Archie Rhind-Tutt:Mario living his best life. That face was always at the carnival. I love it. I love to see you at the carnival. No, that's not me.

49:02Sebastian Salazar:You know Mario is enjoying something when the hands start doing this. Weaving. Oh, man.

49:11Herculez Gomez:For the former defenders, that's Kieran and Mario. Kieran, would you have gotten up quicker than Koundé did? If you didn't see it, Koundé goes down looking for a foul. It was never given. VAR looked at it, didn't think it was a strong enough challenge to warrant a foul. Therefore, Jaroni would go on and win. Can I be honest?

49:25Archie Rhind-Tutt:Because I know you said that he should have gotten up. Yes. I think he's caught him quite bad. I think it's a yellow card as well, by the way. I don't think it's just a foul. So I think it's one of them. I don't know. If he continues the game, if he can continue the game, he probably should have gotten up. Obviously, if he's got to come off, then... Well, he continued the game. But he continued the game, so I think... So this goes back to... It is a dirty tackle. What would you have done? It is a dirty tackle. What would you have done? I don't know. Honestly, I don't know in that situation. I don't know how painful it was.

50:00Archie Rhind-Tutt:I would have lent on the teammates. His teammates should have helped him. When you see that goal again, when you see it back again, there was about four Barca players just sort of standing, like, pointing, going, look, that's a foul. I said, get back in. Right. Don't help your mate, because as you said, Koundé might have had a bad ankle injury. Go and help him. Don't forget it looked that bad. No, no, no, but we don't... No, he knew. He knew how bad it was. Listen, he should have got it. His team mate should have helped him.

50:23Herculez Gomez:So, all the discuss... Oh, Mario, sorry, what would you have done in that situation?

50:28Jermaine Beckford:No, in that situation, I would have done the same. After a while, look, I'll go down, because, you know, you clearly see it's a foul, and what Kieran said, yeah, yellow card, definitely. But if I'm not getting it, or the ref is not even looking at me, Okay, then I'm going to get up and try to at least do something about it. And we also have to remember, this is the league in Spain. In Spain, there are different rules than when you go to another country. In this country, in Spain, it's a yellow card. Guaranteed.

50:53Sebastian Salazar:If the foul had been committed in the attacking half, roll around. Go down and roll around all you want. But when you're in a defending position and you're under pressure and your first job is to be a defender and you know that you're not fully injured, you know you didn't get the call, get your backside up and defend until that ball goes out. And once it goes out, then you can go down again if you so decide. He's trying to sell it, yeah, Kieran?

51:20Archie Rhind-Tutt:That's why he's staying down. He's trying to sell it, yeah. But again, it comes down to the league as well. I think that's how they play a lot in Spain. He's back at the end, didn't he, when he wanted a penalty? Yeah. He stayed down. It's almost like their mentality is, if I sit here, I'll force the referee to make a decision to go to VAR. it's like they're still going to go to VAR anyway. So, get up.

51:40Herculez Gomez:All the discussions, all the hand-wringing, the firing of Xavi Alonso, and yet Real Madrid, Ali, sit top of La Liga. What was all the fuss about?

51:49Sebastian Salazar:Well, there's still fuss going on at Real Madrid. And there will be conversations about Real Madrid, independent of what's happening with Barcelona. See, what makes this title race so intriguing is you don't have a runaway team because neither one of these teams are anywhere near perfect. They have flaws and major flaws. In the case of Barcelona, defending is a problem, and we've already established that. In the case of Real Madrid, whatever is going on inside that locker room and who's actually mandating in that locker room, the structure of the team, the organization of the team that affects how they defend and how they attack, those things haven't been resolved.

52:31Sebastian Salazar:And so therefore, that Barcelona was going to run away with it, it seemed like it would happen and then you see them defending, you kind of go, no, this cannot last. That Real Madrid is going to run away with it, it's not going to happen because, as I just mentioned, they have their own issues. So this will go to the end like this, dropping points against teams that they shouldn't and eventually they have a Clásico to play in Barcelona and that may just be the game that decides quite a bit of this title race.

52:59Herculez Gomez:Mario, any chance Flick getting sacked if they don't win La Liga and embarrassed in the Champions League?

53:08Jermaine Beckford:I mean, that is us guessing now. And I don't think we're at that stage yet in the season that we have to guess. Because, I mean, look, games like this that can happen, it's just how they're going to bounce back from it and then carry on and do what they have to do. I don't think so. Come on, you're on the top of the league now. Why do you have to worry? OK, maybe you lost today and then you dropped a little bit, but the battle is still on between you and Real. Is that something new? No, it happens every season. So that's why I don't think it's fire yet, but he knows something has to happen. Because if not, people are definitely going to look at you and say, hey, do we need to change him or is he going to keep on bringing us trophies?

53:55Herculez Gomez:So what's it, four points at the moment, you've got Moulton's on Wednesday. Should be seven points in there.

53:59Archie Rhind-Tutt:Yeah, we've got Wolves and Spurs. It's got to be a six-bagger this week. Right, OK. You would like to think, given the form of both teams. Will Arsenal still win the league, if City overtake? I think it's possible, yes. Yes. Because City, more than ever, over the last five years, have the ability to drop points I think to most teams in the league so yes yes

54:30Herculez Gomez:yes okay what was the worst away ground to visit across your career Don and why

54:38Archie Rhind-Tutt:I think I actually ironically because I played for Coventry but was when I played against them so many times and never played well never played well

54:46Herculez Gomez:at Liverpool everything in to come true yeah I can remember our manager Graham soonest when we played Coventry away and he nailed all the Coventry players in the team talk

54:56Archie Rhind-Tutt:he's rubbish he's rubbish and he went through the lot five one we got beat luckily i was on the bench Jeremy Rednacht got sent off in the game and Graham soonest my manager he said get on now and cause a 22 21 man brawl what do you mean he went just go on there now and two foot someone I want to chin their manager. He sent me on there and I just launched someone because we were getting beat 5-1 or 5-0, whatever it was. Embarrassing. I think Mickie Quinn and Robert Rosario scored 3-2. But that was a place where... And did you get sent off? No. Just couldn't have VAR. There's my point. Don't have VAR, you don't get caught.

55:36Archie Rhind-Tutt:Don't have VAR, don't get caught.

55:37Sebastian Salazar:What about... So, but then go and two-foot somebody so you will do anything on the field. Not for my manager, not for myself. You will do anything on the field then. Listen, when Graeme Sunez tells you to do something. So you've incriminated yourself.

55:51Archie Rhind-Tutt:No, no, no, that was a young don. That was a teenage don listening to the boss. What about worst ground?

55:59Herculez Gomez:Is it quality, is it state, is it dressing rooms, stadium, that sort of thing?

56:03Archie Rhind-Tutt:It probably was all the cup competitions that you played. Right, there's no one, nothing to stand there. No, because I think everyone and Mario will agree, in the sort of 90s into the noughties, everyone was rebuilding their stadiums. We played at Old Trafford many a time and two-fourths of the ground, the stand was either knocked down or getting rebuilt. I remember playing at Highbury. It looked like Blundell Park we saw Grimsby, yeah? Well, the weirdest one I ever had was playing in an FA Cup tie for Liverpool against Bolton. And Bolton turned the undersoil heating off. It was ice. It was live on TV.

56:38Archie Rhind-Tutt:2-0 down. We got a 2-2 draw. They took us back to Anfield and won. but it was like, it should never have been on. Like we never fancied it. We're sitting there going, how's this game on? Call it off. The ref was like, no, it's live on TV. You're playing. And like the superstars of us just couldn't. I'll say it very loosely. I think Stevie played.

56:55Herculez Gomez:The superstars of us? No, I meant the Liverpool big boys.

57:00Archie Rhind-Tutt:I was a teenager at the time. I just meant like the sort of big hitters. We sort of... We didn't fancy it. Nice.

57:08Sebastian Salazar:Snort over the side. What are we doing here?

57:10Herculez Gomez:Mario is one of the superstars at Chelsea. Was there a place that you went that you didn't enjoy?

57:16Jermaine Beckford:I think, I don't know, like maybe Kieran didn't go there, but I'm sure Dan went to Bolton away. Oh my God, I'm going to tell you. All those corners, it was windy and you had, I don't want to quote the name, but I think it was the lap is dead. They were very good at throw-ins. And what the thing was, you were playing a game and soon as they came on your half, you were just playing. Normally you played not to give a corner away. No, we were giving, we were playing not to give a throw in a way because they would throw it in the box. So they were just playing like that and it was like no football almost.

57:51Jermaine Beckford:It was just like, what we see now in the Premier League is nothing. This is like 10 % compared to the 100 % they were doing. Every throw in in the box, in the box, in the box. Four tall guys in it and you just had to fight. And you know you're going to walk out with some stitches in your eye or next to your eye or whatever. Because it was like that. Bolton away from me was one of the worst.

58:10Herculez Gomez:Was that Stoke Mario? Stoke Mario.

58:12Jermaine Beckford:Oh Stoke, Stoke, Stoke, Stoke. Sorry, yeah, Stoke. They built their stadium, but because they didn't have enough money

58:17Archie Rhind-Tutt:to sort of cover all four sides of the ground, all four corner flags in terms of the stand was left open. The wind just used to drive through and it was like the lap throws into the... It was so harnage. Yeah, he's right. He's right. Stoke was a nightmare. Yeah, Stoke was a nightmare. I would say Bradford. Bradford was a bad night for us. We got knocked out of the quarters, the Carling Cup maybe. Leighton Orient away was a difficult one. You can't see the lines on the pitch. Oh, is that a problem? Your boots are clumpy. You're trying to run through the mud. Where else? I think, I would say, yeah, Bradford, Leighton, Orion.

59:06Archie Rhind-Tutt:Played Luton? Did you play at Luton? That was hard. Yeah, played Luton, played Luton. I never liked pitches that were really close to the stadium. Of course. Because you just felt like you couldn't really get whipped in the game and the pitch is narrow and the crowd is destroying you. But yeah, I would say those.

59:31Herculez Gomez:But no bags of surprise being thrown at you, like maybe in South America, Ali. Correct.

59:36Sebastian Salazar:Well, yes, many surprises. And none of them good. None of them good.

59:43Herculez Gomez:You don't get that at Carnival.

59:45Sebastian Salazar:Well, there may be good surprises at Carnival. But no, yes, no, you're correct, Dan. You're correct. But in terms of the worst feel was Dragons. This is old school MLS. Dragons Stadium was a high school football stadium that we were using because the Cotton Bowl in Dallas was getting remodeled. And if you know anything about the weather in this country, in the summer in Dallas, the heat is unbearable. And we used to have ESPN Soccer Saturday, which was kickoff 4 o 'clock Eastern time, which was 3 o 'clock Dallas time, Central time. And I've told the story before how your shoes, because the turf on the end zones, what was the end zone in the football field, was black.

1:00:31Sebastian Salazar:and the heat would hit the pellets in the artificial field. Feet were on fire. And so your cleats were melting. So by the end of the game, your cleats had melted to where your shoes were now flat, didn't have the cleats. When something like that's happening, maybe we're endangering the safety of the player. Wow.

1:00:54Herculez Gomez:Thanks. Merely suggesting. Oh, there we are. That is it. That brings us to the end of today's game. You were going to say something to Mario? I was going to say something to Don, but I've been too busy. Dan, come on, say it. Say it, Dan. No, no, no, it's all right, Mario. It's my dear precious. Do it, do it. He hasn't got it in a Mario. Va might intervene. That is it. Any plans for the week, Mario? Oh, you know I've come up with something good. Don't worry about it. I know you will. Don't worry. What a life Mario Malkiot lives. We are all living envy of him. And we'll be back tomorrow here in the studio.

1:01:31Herculez Gomez:Thank you very much, Don, for being here. Thank you, Kieran, as well. Me, Ali, and Stevie tomorrow.

1:01:40Sebastian Salazar:From 30 for 30 Podcasts.

1:01:50Archie Rhind-Tutt:Brian Pata, senior defensive lineman from Miami. Gunned down. The key to this case, it's Brian. A hour before he died, he was on the phone arguing with somebody. This might be a hit. You want the truth. They just want a conviction.

1:02:05Herculez Gomez:Being placed under arrest. We had a killer amongst us. Murder at the U. Listen now.