Can Mourinho Revive Real Madrid?

22:28It's a good job Liam Rossiniers not managing Real Madrid, is it? You know, Enzo Fernandes got a two-game ban for Senna. He quite liked to live in Madrid at some point. So what would he do with two players scrapping? It would be a season's ban there, wouldn't it?

22:41Dan Thomas:Yeah, absolutely. And a bad week could get very, very much worse. Badder. Luis went very almost a bad event. What are you going to say? It would get even badder. If Barcelona are to be celebrating at the camp now on Sunday, of course, that is why the boys are in Barcelona. Barcelona are looking to secure it against their rivals, Real Madrid, at home this Sunday. And ahead of it, we heard from Pedri in the latest edition of The Bicycle Diaries.

23:12Now he's an icon for Barca fans. But Pedri's connection with Barcelona began more than 1 ,200 miles away from Camp Nou.

23:45Yes, I saw Iniesta.

23:51He was my idol and I always had him on YouTube. I had Leo, Bussi, Jordi, Xavi, all those people. I enjoyed seeing him and I wanted to play some day. Although the first big club to knock on his door wasn't Barcelona. In a moment, Madrid appeared. I thought, what a lot of opportunity. Yeah, yeah. Another thing is that then, even some family member, some guy of Pedri said, I'm not going to go to see if you're going to Madrid. At just 15 years old, Pedri left his island and arrived in Madrid, right in the middle of a snowstorm. The snow of today will take a very intense storm. I came and I was just snowing, I trained for one or two days and...

24:39I did a couple of training with a bad time and a snowman and a canary, it was complicated. They told me that they would call me, and they would call me. Why did they say? Well, they told me that they didn't have seen the same guy who was giving the level in the team. How did you return? Well, it's true that everyone asked me about the same thing, but I wanted to be a professional football player, I had to continue working, so my father told me and put things in his place so that he continued training and enjoying it, and I'm not sure that a child has to be able to enjoy it. The one who truly recognized Pedri's talent was Manuel Rodriguez Donoro, the Academy Director at Las Palmas.

25:21He's a super-doubt player. He's a lot of hope for this player, who has 16 years, 8 months and 22 days. He's the second player who's younger to debut at Las Palmas. He always took good decisions. And also he had that special players that have the special players. That artistic part that solved situations always curious, but effective at the same time. There's a band that I remember very spectacular.

26:00People said, where did he come from? Pedri shows his talent at Las Palmas and gets the call he had been waiting for. I had the chance to come to the team, that my father always told me that he was a little and I wanted him to be. The team that rejected him versus the one that believed in him. El Clásico, always a special match and even more so for Pedri. This is the Bicycle Diaries. See you on the next journey.

26:33Dan Thomas:Yep, and you'll be seeing him this weekend and I'm sure Ali Moreno will be keeping a very close eye on him. Luis, yesterday we asked you how quickly you'll be getting down from the booth to the pitch if Barcelona are to be celebrating. Probably the same for you, isn't it, Ali? To go and try and get Pedri's shirt or get out the adoption papers and finally make him officially your son?

26:54That's already happened, Kay. Don't you worry about it. I've been busy the last couple of days. as it pertains to Pedri. There's no doubt that I would have liked to have done those bicycle diaries instead of Martin Einstein, who's, by the way, about 20 yards that way, making all sorts of noise. ESPN Deportes can't keep their... Yeah, they can't. Honestly, I don't know why they're yelling at each other. It's just a TV show, guys. Look, Pedri, for me, is... We know it's an outstanding talent, but we think of him as a guy that is just kind of sort of a tempo setter at times. And I think there's much more to his game.

27:31The quality of his first touch and then the ability to find through balls, which has been outstanding this season in particular, where he's playing a much deeper role and he's been able to break through lines of defending, not by dribbling, but by passing through those lines of defending against a well-set-up team like Getafe. In multiple locations, he's able to find that through ball and it's what Barcelona has needed him to do this season in particular. Again, playing from a deeper role. That's all right, Martin Eisen. Why are they clapping for Martin Eisen? I have no idea. Playing from a deeper position and being able to then find through passes and breaking defensive lines in the manner in which he does.

28:10I think from that deeper position, it's a different role for Pedri. He has been effective doing it. And I think he can take his game to an entirely different level, Luis, if he doesn't just settle for the pass out of pressure, if he actually takes responsibility himself and being a guy who can be a presence in the attacking half and inside the attacking 18-yard box. Because I think he's that good of a player and he can finish his own chances. Sometimes he's just looking for the pass. I think if he adds goals to his game, then we're talking about the complete player. Yeah, definitely. Now because he's playing a little bit more deeper, it's because we don't see that often closer to the box.

28:44When we saw at some point at Barcelona arriving second line, scoring goals, a fantastic goal of giving chances, giving chances, dropping the shoulder and scoring his goal. But right now, he's really far away. But let's not forget about his skills, ability. The guys that were doing the mountainous video, they were talking about the right decision, taking the right decision. And let's not forget the work rate of this kid. I mean, he was grounded as one of the best players recovering balls in his own half. That's something that for a quality technique and a skillful player and a very tiny guy is not easy.

29:23And the amount of runs that he makes, not only going forward, but also tracking back. So that's something that makes him complete. He has missing maybe what you're saying. Arriving a little bit more closer to the box, trying his luck from outside the box sometimes because he got a fantastic shot right and left foot. So it's something that we would like to see more, but actually we enjoy every single time that he's on the field. And I think everyone, it doesn't matter if you are a supporter of Barcelona or not, you enjoy this kind of player. because there are no many around the world. Send two and many over guys to sort that deported lot out.

29:58Just send the big man in. I would tell him, if I could speak Spanish, I'd tell him to shut up. They're annoying that lot, aren't they? Why are they going to be so loud? Very, very loud. By the way, Martin Einstein needs to find his bike. For about six months now, I've not seen a bicycle diaries that involves a bike in it. Listen, I'm not going to add to what the guys have said. Claxon, Pedro's a good player very good brilliant he is along with Frankie De Jong in there when De Jong's available in fit and they two of them together even though they're not the biggest most physically imposing you wouldn't stand next to them in a tunnel and fear them physically but they just boss games with their game management, with their ability to control the ball and pass the ball and yeah they're obviously a very good partnership

30:51Dan Thomas:Yes we're going to let our boys in Barcelona go and shout behind the Deportes team and put them off their work tonight so we're going to let you guys go thank you so much for being with us they will be with us of course tomorrow and then on Sunday for El Clasico our coverage will begin at 2.30pm Eastern, you can catch the game on ESPN and ESPN Plus or maybe you're making your way to the torch at Los Angeles Coliseum for the watch party for Real Madrid and Barcelona. Alexis Nunes arrived there today. Carlos Puyol's going to be there. Edwin Hazard. You should be too. If you are in the area and you want to be, make sure to scan the QR code to join the watch party.

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33:27Dan Thomas:Okay, Bruno Fernandes has been named the Football Writer Association's Footballer of the Year, ahead of Declan Rice and Erling Haaland, who are second and third respectively. Effectively, Bruno Fernandes receiving 45 % of the votes. Bruno Fernandes, the winner here, Frank Leboeuf joining us. What's your reaction? Oh, where did he pop up from? Here he is. Reaction, Craig, to Bruno getting this? Splitting hairs, aren't we, really? You know, different players. Rice playing in a better team. Probably going to win the league. Good player. Slightly tailed off recently, I think, with some of his performances, along with his other teammates.

34:05but Fernandes on a poorer side particularly a struggling one under Ruben Amarim that had no direction he was a shining light for them and he's even more so since Carrick got the job and he's pushed him into his more natural position assists, goals, you know, everything so yeah, I haven't got an issue with it I think he's been brilliant for Man United that goes without saying so yeah, I don't think there's enough Arsenal players the Saka's had an injury ravaged second half of the season I think Rice has been their best player maybe he could look at one of the centre-backs but I don't have an issue with Bruno Fernandes winning it really

34:42Dan Thomas:I think Frank does have an issue with this is that right Frank? Well I always have an issue with individual awards first but yeah I think we are talking about consistency and clearly when I see and I compare the clan Rice season with Bruno Fernandes season Yes, Bruno Fernandes has an excuse having a coach who didn't put him in the right position. But still, you have to judge and try to find who was the best. And really, Declan Rice had a full, very good season, where Bruno Fernandes had a so-so season, beginning of the season, there has been very good under Michael Carrick. And I agree with that.

35:24And I agree with Craig. I don't really have a real issue with that. But I think it's unfair towards Declan Rice and the season that he had, because I think he was better than anybody else, more consistent than anybody else. Well, I do, before Shaq pipes in, I do think Bruno Fernandes was pretty consistent under Ruben Amarim, it was just the rest. You know, that's not something. And he was playing a little deeper, but he still was contributing. But I think the rest of that package under Ruben Amarim was just not very good. but he was and you know you can't and everybody has their own opinion and that's and I'm fine with that but just because you play for the best team doesn't make you the best candidate and Arsenal thus far and certainly Arsenal and Man City are the two best sides but that doesn't and cannot take away from what in fact in some sense you might it might push you further towards it when you think well how's he managed to do that in this team particularly the team when it was Ruben Amarim's side.

36:29But yet he still managed to have this huge influence. Even if United were poor at times, that's not something he can really control to a certain extent. So for that reason, I don't have an issue because Arsenal have a better package. And I'm taking nothing away from Declan Rice. If he had said to me Declan Rice was PFA player a year, I'd have been OK with that.

36:54Dan Thomas:Do you think there is something in that, Shaka, that you can look and that, as Craig said, he's been a shining light in what's been an awkward period. And that even sets him apart, given the fact that he could be so consistent when things have gone wrong. Listen, I agree in that there's no arguing that Bruno Fernandes has been an outstanding player. But for his performances with Manchester United, who knows what we'd be discussing about with their season. But I just feel inevitably, even though we're talking about individual awards, you look at the most successful teams in a campaign, their most important players, in those successes.

37:27Now, while you could make the argument for Bruno Fernandes and how he's led the line for Manchester United and the example he's been, Manchester United have played 40 games this season. Arsenal are on track to play 60. I could have four, maybe five Arsenal players ahead of Bruno Fernandes in that regard. Now, because you have that amount of players, that amount of good players performing at a high level for Arsenal, is why you see them as favourites to win the Premier League. is why you see them in the Champions League final. Now, that, again, is not taking away from Bruno Fernandes, his importance to Manchester United, and again, what it means.

38:03But I feel you start by looking at teams who have been successful. Nobody's going to sit here... But that's team, Shaq. Yeah, but... If you put Bruno Fernandes in that Arsenal team... Right. If you put Bruno Fernandes in that Arsenal team, they would have already won the league. And that's a hypothetical. That's like me sitting here... It's not. He's better than anything they've got. I disagree. He's better than Messi. Go ahead, Frank. Craig, how do you know, how would you judge Arsenal without the clan rights this season? Without the clan rights, maybe Arsenal wouldn't be the best team. And it's because they have the clan rights that they've been at the top.

38:41They're at the top because they have a better package. They have arguably one of the biggest squads in Europe. That's why they are at the top. But at the same time... If you're not that strong, Go ahead. At the same time, you put Erling Haaland in either of those teams. And I think they're even more improved than if you put Bruno Fernandes in that team. So if that's the measure, Erling Haaland deserves to win it. Because he improves any team he gets into far more than putting Bruno Fernandes into that team. I think Bruno Fernandes has been more consistent.

39:16Dan Thomas:Bruno Fernandes has been involved in more goals in the Premier League than anyone else in the Premier League since mid-January. To your point, you put Erling Haaland in that Arsenal team. That title is already won. I agree. No question about that. And so if that's the measure, then it's Erling Haaland. But regardless of how you spin this, in my mind, again, not taking away anything from Bruno Fernandes, his importance and his performances since mid-January. But I don't see how you make him Football Writers Association Player of the Year Now I'm with Frank in that a lot of these individual awards Just make no sense to me To start with And this just leans into that For all the reasons We are splitting hairs Because if I had come into it I'll be honest with you I really couldn't give a stop Nobody's losing sleep I'm not losing any sleep I'm talking to somebody who won the Scottish Football Writers Player of the Year.

40:24That year it was very important. 1998, by the way. 97, 98, look it up. That was the only year it was important. Paul Gascoigne. Ryan Laudrup. Henrik Larson. But we are splitting hairs. Because if I had come in today and somebody said Erling Haaland's won it, I'd have gone, yeah, OK, maybe a small argument. Or Declan Rice has won it. But, you know, Bruno Fernandes, and I'm not always a huge fan of his, the way he goes on, but yeah, I don't know, right? Now, it seems to be that, Craig, you are going into Bruno Fernandes because you give him an excuse. Because he was playing for a bad Manchester United at the time because they were under Amorim, that you think that he was good enough for him to get an excuse and say, OK, we can give it to him because the rest of the team wasn't that good, the coach wasn't good, So let's give it to Bruno Fernandes.

41:21I mean, that's not for me a question of how you handle playing around the other players. It's I want to see what you bring to the team. And I'm sorry, he wasn't able to make the team better. Obviously, for me, Deca and Rice were the X factor for the results of Arsenal. even if the others, they were playing well, Dick and Rice was in the middle of it, proving that he was right buying from Arsenal some years ago because the guy makes the difference. Yeah, I mean, I'm OK. Listen, listen, you guys don't like... Don't lose any sleep. Whatever you do, don't lose any sleep tonight over this. No, I'm...

42:03Don't be up, tossing and turning all night. I'm perturbed. I'm perturbed at the verbal assault that's come my way. I feel hot. I'm OK with it. Congratulations, Bruno. Yeah, it's OK. Just because Frank and Xhaka don't like them.

42:20Dan Thomas:Yeah. I can't do that. Yeah, so Manchester United fans, turn your vitriol this way. Oh, we've upset a lot of fans this week. Arsenal fans, they're very soft. Let's get to Man City against Brentford coming up in the Premier League. A lot on the line for both sides here. Obviously, City dropped points with Everton last time out. Brentford, however, know that sixth spot could be very important if Filler finish fifth and win the Europa League. We're not going to go into it. No, we know how it works now. We know how it works now. Only if they finish fifth, the sixth place, if they win the Europa League, this feels like a programme we did about six weeks ago.

43:00I feel we're slightly more informed this time. If Filler finish fifth and win the Europa League, which are in the final, beat Forest 4 now yesterday, the sixth place in the Premier League, is up for grabs in the Champions League. Now, we sort of went around the houses with that one, which tells you how complex it is, or was, or how we made it. So that's big. Interestingly, it looks like Chelsea, who are in the cup final, obviously, May 16th, which we have, they look as if they're really struggling, even to make that sixth place.

43:33Dan Thomas:We're going to get to them, because that's another game we want to talk about. But this game... What games are we talking about today? Just a couple, don't worry. this game, does that cause more of a problem for City when they do need to get these three points that Brentford will suddenly be vying to try and get this spot? Well, I mean, possibly. But I think the issue is that Brentford have been a very good side this year. I think the issue is that Brentford under Keith Andrews, who was a novice manager at the start of the season, and I think a lot of us picked Brentford to struggle, certainly I did, because they lost in Bemo, they lost Visa, They lost Norgard, they lost Fleck in N 'Golo, although they've certainly brought a good goalkeeper in Kelleher.

44:14When you put all those things in the melting pot and you lose an experienced manager, that's going to be tough. But actually, not only are they in this hunt for the six plays, the football they've played has been generally excellent to watch. And so my point is, in a sort of roundabout way, they will go to the Etihad not to sit in, but to play. they will go and try and play against City and play their own style and in some sense that's what City want they don't really want a team that's going to come and try and shut up the shop, so if you're open against City, which I think Brentford will do not saying it'll make it easy for them, but it might make it slightly easier, as long as they can keep the back door shut, City that is because Brentford will have a go at them a lot of good players but that will mean a slightly more spread out game and we know when that happens, City are one of the best.

45:10Dan Thomas:They're not going to drop points again, are they Shaq? Well, they can't afford to, can they? Well, certainly they can't afford to, but to your question, Kate, Brentford are a very good team and regardless of what the reward may be in terms of that sixth spot, I felt you'd have seen the best at Brentford regardless because even if it means Europa League and we've seen what that did for Spurs last season, see what it may do for Aston Villa this season, though they're in the Champions League spots, that is a huge incentive in itself. That doesn't change. I'm with Craig on how good this Brentford team continues to be, how surprisingly good they continue to be.

45:47And once again, as we saw last week with Manchester City and Everton, they cannot afford to slip here. And, you know, the thing is with Brentford, I know there's a Champions League potential spot, but they're just playing with house money, aren't they? Yeah. They're playing with house money. Whatever happens now, it's been a great season for them. So they can go there, they don't have to worry about making a mistake here or there. They can take some risks. Because they honestly probably thought they would have been scrapping down the bottom. So they are playing with house money. And when that happens, and the other team are not, because they're under pressure, Man City, big time to get these points, then that can make it more difficult.

46:30But I just feel City, I don't see them slipping up again. As good as Brentford are, I don't see them slipping up again.

46:36Dan Thomas:OK, let's get to Liverpool against Chelsea then, Frank, because that's also coming up this weekend. And don't worry, Craig, this is the only other one we're talking about in the Premier League. A win for Liverpool would guarantee a top five finish in Champions League football next season. As for Chelsea, though, well, it's not been going well for them this season, has it? However, they do have that FA Cup final on the horizon. What do you think is going to happen here, Frank? I don't know how we can be optimistic about any games right now about Chelsea seeing the last game that they played the losing the way they played and and with with all and with all the fans you know thinking that maybe the player thinks it's already over and maybe they only have the FA Cup in mind but for the the spot in the Champions League you can already say it's over but even in Europa League.

47:26And maybe you can get something in the Conference League, which is going to be absolutely abnormal for a team like Chelsea. So it's disappointing. But really, it's like you want them to lose for something happening at the club. And a big reaction from the board and say, OK, it's over. We put a mess. We're going to try to clean it because that's not where we want to go. But that's the only thing you want. Liverpool had a very bad season overall, but they might get qualified for the Champions League. Chelsea is so far away. Eighth, ninth, we don't know. That's horrible. That's horrible for a team who pretended to become, again, one of the best clubs in England.

48:13We are so far away. So, yes, there is the FA Cup, but against that game, Why do you want them to win after losing six games in a row? I don't see why it's possible. And how the player is going to change their mindset, how they're going to be working together. Something is broken up to the coach. Do we have a coach? Up to the board to do something about that. But again, the players, they will have at some point to face the reality of their quality because do they deserve, some of them, to play for Chelsea? I'm not sure about that. I was trying to think about the games. I drew a blank, but it was Forrest, wasn't it?

48:56Forrest B team. Forrest B team with eight changes. There's nothing in the stats that are telling you, apart from Liverpool, haven't been very good. But then it was Forrest B team that demolished them. There's nothing in the stats that are suggesting that Chelsea are going to go up there and win. they're not playing for a manager they're playing for a young guy that is really the youth team coach and they don't really give a stuff about it the players do they they're getting paid they're not going to get sacked that's all taking place and Liverpool whilst they're going to make the Champions League you still feel there is a scrutiny and a pressure on Arne Slott about his job yes because of the results but also because of the way they've played and the lack of sort of fire in the team, the lack of pace in the team.

49:48Everything that got Liverpool fans in the edge of their seats, even when they weren't winning Premier Leagues, but it was sort of rumbustious and dynamic. And that's just gone. And there's a pressure on him because Alonso's out there and he's the obvious one at the moment to come in and potentially take this job and he's sitting on his hands and Liverpool know this. Slott knows it. If Chelsea were to somehow get a result, a winning result, and as bad as they've been at Liverpool, I think it almost puts, you could argue, potentially the final nail in Slott's coffin. Because they've lost, I think, I might be wrong, 10, 11 games now this year?

50:2911. We're looking at a dozen games if they lose this one. I think he's looking at being out, which he may be anyway. Some of the rumours are that they are on the edge with Arne Slott, even if they get Champions League football so a big game it's not a big game for McFarlane really the coach because he's going to go back to doing what he does but will Chelsea show well these Chelsea players show any desire to finish the season strongly ahead of the cup final or will they go up there and do what they did against Forrest at home which is roll over to a weakened side and really and truly get embarrassed I can't see how Liverpool loses I'll be honest and to your point about Anaslaut I'm with you I I think...

51:10You think he's gone, Shaq? I do. Not in a bad, but you think they're just going to make a change? I do. Right. And I think it's warranted. I think what you may very well see between the end of the season, though, is a continued back-and-forth conversation. They may very well go and beat Chelsea, and then all of a sudden we're having a conversation, has slot done enough? And then they may lose the following weekend to whoever it is they have, and we're back to having this conversation. As far as I'm concerned, seeing enough this season, I think a change is warranted. if Xavi Lonzo is still available, go out and secure that signature.

51:41Now, should have been done three or four weeks ago, as far as I'm concerned. But less about Arna Slaught, this is about a Chelsea team that have down tools, but for the FA Cup final. I just don't see how they put up. I don't see how they muster any fight, given what we've seen from them in recent weeks. Sorry, just to quickly go back to Liverpool. You said something about Man United that I think would stand true here and probably at most clubs about Michael Carrick. If you remember, you said United, when they're hiring the new manager, be it Carrick or somebody else, have to be ruthless. Yeah.

52:18Right. Which I agree with. I think most people would. I think Liverpool here have to be ruthless in their decision. And even though Arnley Slott won the league last year, the big question is these performances that they've been putting forward have been pretty much since the community shield that we covered when they lost to Crystal Palace one week before the season started. And we all watched the game and said, here's the issues that he has to resolve with these new players. And he never has got close to resolving any of them. In fact, he's made too many bad decisions. his first one was when he dropped Hugo Eketike for an extremely unfit Alexander Izak at Stamford Bridge and it sort of all unravelled as the season went on and I think Liverpool have to be ruthless and say look if we spend again if I want the best out of Florian Veltz, if I want the best out of this player, that player and we spend again is Arne Slott have we seen enough to say yeah this is just an anomaly and he will go again next year and I think the answer is no and I think when they ask themselves that they'll probably get the same answer and I think to me that will mean Arnely Slott being relieved of his duties at Liverpool and probably Chavo Alonso coming in to give them something different and some energy

53:33Dan Thomas:Boys keep talking about that FA Cup it is coming up on our network the FA Cup final which of course Chelsea are involved with taking on Manchester City May 16th, 10am Eastern Our coverage will begin at 9pm though Full hour build up for you ESPN2 and ESPN Plus We'll have you covered, and our team will be on the ground at Wembley.

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55:12Dan Thomas:In the Championship, we saw the First Lake semi-final between Hull City and Millwall played today. It was KG, finished 0-0. Tomorrow, it's Middlesbrough taking on Southampton. How are you going to cope? Well, it would be nice if Middlesbrough weren't getting spied on by Southampton people. Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Are they? Yeah. Yeah, that's what... Is that official or are you just chucking that out? No, I'm not just chucking it in. There are confirmed reports of somebody found at Rockcliffe Training Ground from the Southampton camp, spying, and the league will be having to take action for what's going on there.

55:49I think Middlesbrough should just get promoted straight away. It's not exactly a luxury mission, is it? Spying in Middlesbrough.

55:57Dan Thomas:Have you been to Rockcliffe, Craig? Sorry? Have you been to Rockcliffe? No. I think you might like playing golf there, actually. It's a little bit outside of Middlesbrough. OK, this is the Irish First Division. What is he shooting the wrong way? In Harps against Kerry. He was scoreless at this point. This is the 95th minute. And this is Max Hutchison. Oh, I know that last name. Oh, my word. Donslad. Donslad. Better finish it than his dad. Well done, Max. Love to see that. Well, Max, hope your mathematics is a little better than your dad's. I should think it is. What's the percentage chance? thank you so much for being with us stick around extra times on the way frank craig and shaka are answering your questions we'll be with you right there welcome in to the latest edition of extra time frank leboeuf is joining us craig's here shaka's here as well we're all off the rockliffe got a resume what i think you were safe on that bet there when in the live show for those that missed it.

57:06Ali Moreno and Luis Garcia were in Barcelona.

57:11Dan Thomas:We've got a new resume for you because we know it's important. What? Yes, yes. It has to be updated. Yeah, Scottish football writers. Scottish football writers.

57:26They didn't know that. They didn't know that. It wasn't included before.

57:31Dan Thomas:It wasn't included before because they didn't see how important it is. Nobody realized 97.98 was that important. With Stevie's including his. Nobody didn't care. Nah, only 97.98 counts. I mean, the players that I brushed aside for that. What did you say anyway? Better like than never. Did you thank your teammates for winning the Player of the Year? Nah, we won the league title, it was all about me. Did you buy everybody a Rolex? I said, you know. You do now? Oh no

58:06See you laugh People write us play the year I've always said journalists They're the best judge

58:17Honestly this is true That same year I came second In the PFA one Because I'd been fighting with too many people Jackie My colleague won it He won the PFA Jackie McNamara. He was really good. So what about this Middlesbrough spying thing?

58:36Dan Thomas:OK, so Southampton have been... It's actually coming off. We'll get there, we'll get there. The first one's for Frank. How do you see Jose Mourinho dealing with the Real Madrid dressing room at this stage of his career, Frank?

58:52I want to see it. I don't know, I see it, but I want to see it. Because I think it's going to be very interesting. I mean, yeah, I listened to the guys talking about the option of Mourinho coming. In terms of personality and character, I think it would be the best because something's going to happen, for sure. Something's going to happen with Vinny. For sure, something's going to happen with Kylian Mbappe if he doesn't run track back. And with big personalities, we think that better than the coach. He's going to be the boss in the dressing room. Now, in terms of football, and I agree with Craig that he was mentioning during the show that when Mourinho is in charge of a club, the club, the team plays more defensively than offensively.

59:37So in terms of entertainment, we wouldn't see what maybe the fans want to see. But I think, again, I don't see anybody else being able and having the guts to take care of that dressing room because I don't think that except Mourinho, nobody will be strong enough to deal with those players. And I think it's great we said that one day, some days ago, that nobody in the dressing room wants to listen to a coach. And that's the reality. But when you have Mourinho, you will have to. Because the guy will never let go. So it would be interesting. I wish him good luck if he takes it. But I would love to have a camera and see it.

1:00:25Okay. What are you watching over there, by the way? Are you watching a live show? No, it's that pop-ups have come up while I've got you. Are you watching some drama? Yeah, okay. EastEnders. EastEnders. Watching like a, I'm a celebrity, get me out of there.

1:00:37Dan Thomas:Love Island, like you. Love Island, watching. Hold on, hold on, like Craig is out there. Craig used to say, you know, that Cheryl and Heidi would be watching Love Island. Right, right, right. And he would just be in the area, so that's how he knew what was going on. But I think he was a very fan to be honest. Yeah, I'll be happy. What do you know? I'm hurt. I'm sorry. Comes out. Guys, is it apparent that Real Madrid's locker room is missing the presence of mature senior players that recently left, like Modric and Kroos? Are we still talking about Kroos leaving as a factor here? Real Madrid's dressing room.

1:01:15Listen, I will keep going back to the Ballon d 'Or a couple of years ago, where they boycotted because Vinicius Junior did not win the Ballon d 'Or. I took particular exception to it because you had the likes of Jose Lu, etc., who had denied that moment. Because we are the crown team of the year. Who had denied that moment of acknowledgement by their peers, by world football, because you're in a straw because one individual doesn't win the Ballon d 'Or. And that right there, Florentino Perez says, this one player is bigger than everything else. And it's no surprise to me that ever since then, things have just continued to spiral downwards.

1:01:59Dan Thomas:Frank, which club is in need of leadership more at this moment? Real Madrid or Chelsea?

1:02:10Wow, that's a good question. Both of them, I have to say, because I cannot deny that, and we just talked about that. Real Madrid need a real boss in the locker room. And Chelsea doesn't have any. They have somebody who's going to go back to the academy. But it's absolutely the opposite. It's different. You have a club of big stars and Chelsea, I don't see any star. I mean, yes, you have a champion of the world, Enzo Fernandes. you have very good players like Aisido, like Palmer. But I remember the time we were there with Craig, you know, we're talking about Ruud Gullit, we're talking about Vialy, Zola, Steve Clarke, Di Matteo, Weiss.

1:02:58I mean, Marcus, that was insane. That's where you, and after, with the draw by Ira, Lampard, John Terry, then you could have compared Chelsea with Real Madrid. But now I'm sorry, it's not the same. And they need a boss for different reasons. They need to find another shape of playing, another way of playing, another atmosphere in the locker room where you create wires. And in Real Madrid, you normally have all of those players because they are experienced players, but they don't want to listen to anybody. That's the thing. That's another mindset. So I think it's going to be more complicated for Madrid to find somebody to take care of that locker room than for Chelsea to find a big boss.

1:03:48You know, maybe John Terry. I don't know. Michael Carrick has been somebody, you know, unexpected at Manchester United. It worked like crazy. So why not John Terry coming back and because he's a legend having the dressing room with him and doing the job? Let's hope that. This is a consequence at the moment of Chelsea going down this route of younger players, longer contracts. Cole Palmer's not playing well at the moment at all. Talk about him not even going to the World Cup. That's where the drop-off, how far it has been. and the trouble is when you go down that route and you don't have the experienced players that Frank mentioned from our time there and but they were a lot of big stars is when it's not going well this theory of signing all these young guys could fall apart because it splinters he's not happy he's not happy because things are not going well so you have to if you're signing these younger players you have to make sure that they're going to hang around and it seems to me that because of all the changes because of the sacking of the managers because of the way they run the club and the silliness that's going on that these guys will all look to go in their different directions and your strategy of signing young and bringing them through is really a difficult one because for that to happen you have to keep everybody at the club for a good five, six, seven year period.

1:05:14And that is very unlikely in today's modern football, particularly when players are not seeing what they like, both behind the scenes and on the field. They're going to look to go somewhere else.

1:05:26Dan Thomas:What do you make of Southampton allegedly spying on their playoff opponents? So what did they do? Send somebody up? So the English Football League has charged Southampton with spying on Middlesbrough before they meet in the Championship playoff semifinals tomorrow. A Saints performance analyst recorded Borough training and taking pictures of tactics on Thursday morning. The staff member was caught, deleted the footage and left the area. But obviously Middlesbrough are furious. They've contacted the EFL. The EFL have taken these measures. He got caught, so he's not a very good spy. Oh, is he? Has he been on a 19 match?

1:06:01Dan Thomas:I know we were talking about this. We were talking about this. It's hardly the James Bond assignment, is it? You know, Bond, where are you sending me to, Miss Moneypenny? Marco, are we going to go this time around? Was it Moneypenny? Miss Moneypenny. Miss Moneypenny, where are you sending me to? Middlesbrough. But it is not Middlesbrough, it's Rockcliffe, and I know you would like Rockcliffe. It's a five-star resort where they train. There's no five-star resort in Middlesbrough. It's impossible. It's not in Middlesbrough, it's on the outskirts of Middlesbrough. That's where he's been. It is very nice where he's been, but he's been caught.

1:06:35Don't waste the story.

1:06:37Dan Thomas:Let me continue the question. with Premier League promotion on the line is a fine enough punishment for the club or should the penalties be more severe? I'll answer this. For a bar of fun. I can't answer this can I? Yeah, no you can't. I think the penalties should be more severe. I'll be honest I think they should be. I think what's made this awkward is the game that it is that we're going into the playoffs how soon it is before the playoffs. But I think Southampton are deserving of a far harsher punishment. I mean, I don't agree with it. You shouldn't be doing this kind of stuff, but it's not that much different to sending you a...

1:07:14Well, it is a little bit. But you can still send a scout to all the games and analyse the games. You kind of know what they're going to do. You may have an extra trick up your sleeve as a set-piece that you're working on with all these set-piece coaches these days. I'm assuming Minersberg don't have one. For obvious reasons. In the women's game... Did it ever happen? Did it ever happen? That's what I'm both to ask. In the women's game recently, somebody was found guilty of sending a drone to spy on another team. That was fairly real. And I can't remember what the suspension was. Well, that's quite an undercover way, isn't it, to have a drone flying above you?

1:07:53You were right. So I'm trying to remember. I'm sure my producer is looking it up right now, so you'll tell us. Canada. And what was your suspension? What was your suspension in that? I don't know. Was it a women's team? I was thinking about something else. You're going in front while they're looking this up. Yeah, because I remember hearing, remembering the same type of thing that were a team, but I was in a, I don't know if it was an international duty or it was for a cup game, in a male football where some club were spying another one. And it already happens. I don't know what was the punishment.

1:08:41No, Derby. Was it? Yeah. Derby were involved after I'd left a long time ago. It was a few years ago. Some sort of spying. It's quite pathetic, isn't it, really? I know you'd want to leave no stone unturned. We're just hearing it was. Bielsa. But, yeah, I don't know. where I stand. I mean, of course, of course, if Southampton were to prevail in these two games against Middlesbrough, that's only going to feel, the only way this goes away, and I'm sure the EFL are, in some sense, hoping, whilst not being, whilst being objective, you know, don't want Southampton or Middlesbrough to go up, sit in the middle, it's going to make life easier for them if Middlesbrough knocks Southampton out.

1:09:26Because if it goes the other way. The flames of the fire are just going to get higher because of this scenario.

1:09:34Dan Thomas:Saints run an incredible unbeaten run as well. Yeah. What's to say he's not been up to some other sessions? Well, they were actually pretty good against Man City in the FA Cup semi-final, beat Arsenal in the quarterfinal and gave a really good account of themselves, to be honest. So I'm kind of surprised, but you know. So I was just being told by a producer, the game I was thinking of Canada against New Zealand in the Olympics, women's. Canada sent a drone to spy on New Zealand and their tactics. Well, that's a long way for a drone to go. And the Canadian coach was sent home. The Canadian coach was dismissed from the tournament, sent home.

1:10:12So, following that precedent, at the very least, Southampton's entire coaching staff, well, bar the kit man, should not be on the sideline for those games, should be, I think, suspended. and the very interesting head coach has spent it for both games against Milsburg.

1:10:28Dan Thomas:Well, one thing we do know is that Steve Gibson will not be inviting you to Rockcliffe training ground any time soon, Craig. Unlucky. Don't lose any sleep over that either. Between that and Bruno Fernandes, I know you're going to have a tough night. I like... I know you're not going to be able to sleep tonight. I like Milsburg. They actually did all say it without me on the show one night. I did hear them because they like my chairman. Our chairman. Yeah, everybody likes Steve Gibson. He's a great chairman, right? Yeah. He is. I think so. The Riverside. Yeah, I've had a few good pints out in the pubs in Middlesbrough and watching the women scrap and all that at the bar.

1:11:08That was my... There are many, many teams or national teams here who have been accused of spying on other teams. Norway in 94 in 94, so we have to talk to Jan Arnold about that, where they tried to spy England they tried to spy England I'm reading that, you know but you had Genoa trying to spy on Sampdoria, it's like many cases of clubs trying to, I don't know what were the punishments, but it happened quite a lot, that's insane really insane Wikipedia over here There's a lot of horrible places in England, isn't there? Oh, don't stay. Well, you know, I looked at that playoff game, Millwall, Southland, Hull, Grimsby, Middlesbrough.

1:12:05I've lived in England for 25 years. That's a fine place.

1:12:08Dan Thomas:It's a fine place on earth. All right, Frank. Given how well he's been able to manage a locker room filled with superstars and massive egos over the span of 14 years, Would Deschamps be an ideal candidate to take over and steer Real Madrid back to winning ways this summer? Named on the list, isn't it? Yes, I read that during the show where he was, I think, the fifth maybe in the list. He has a strong personality. He knows how to talk to players. He will have backups with Chouamini, Kamavinga, Mbappe, all the French guys. and he will have respect to the locker room. Why not? Why not? DJ has been a great coach.

1:12:58You remember that he went to Juventus. They were in Serie B and put them back up. He played very well. He did very well with Monaco, brought them to the Champions League final. They lost in the Champions League final and he brought the title to Marseille in 2010. So he's a great coach, he's a very hard worker and he will give his best. I think he's a good option and he knows how to deal with the players. I would say unlike Jose Mourinho, who would go to maybe fight with them, DJ would try to understand them, talk to them, making sure that it goes well and make them work. Mbappe is the captain of France and you can have complaints about him not tracking back, but nobody complains about the fact that Mbappé is the captain and plays for France.

1:13:52So it works with everybody. It will work with DJ Deschamps. I'm pretty optimistic. That would be a good appointment, wouldn't it? Yeah, when we were discussing this a couple of weeks ago, I said Jose Mourinho didn't make any sense a couple of weeks ago again. I said Deschamps for me ticks a lot of boxes, especially, I think France is going to win the tournament and all of a sudden you're talking about a manager who's gone to three workup finals wins two without any question a galactico of football managers in today's game he might be the man to come in and get the best out of this dressing room and I stand by that the old question was well can Real Madrid afford to wait till after the workup which my position then was to get the right man absolutely You keep your powder dry.

1:14:44You wait until then.

1:14:46Dan Thomas:Last question. Has anyone ever considered losing their passport on purpose because the place they visited felt like heaven and they didn't want to go home? I feel like this is rather pointed. I think I do. Not Craig in Middlesbrough, clearly. Well, no, well. What, you need a passport to get in the Middlesbrough? To get out. No, it was bad. You needed to get out. You don't need to go in, but you need to get out. Oh boy. Nicest place, basically. Listen, I'm from Trinidad. Yeah, maybe if I go to Trinidad and Tobago, or maybe Scotland, maybe I will try to lose my passport, but I never been there, so I will wait for that.

1:15:34What?

1:15:35Dan Thomas:I don't even say something. I know you are. I just thought I'd leave you hanging. Oh boy. All right. Why are you not coming to the cup final with me, Frank? You don't like me. Yeah, Frank. Lost his passport. Oh, I'm sorry you have to be on, I would be on stage, I'm sorry. I would have to. Priorities, Frank. Yeah. Priority. Priority. I would love to. Priorities. Thank you so much for sending in your questions, guys. Not in Middlesbrough that stage, is it? But it's been a little bit of a fine establishment. I'm getting out of that.

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