Futbol Americas: Poch extends with USMNT+Americans on the move this summer+Larry Berg new MLS commissioner+Messi back with a brace+Leagues Cup action+Vini Jr staying in Madrid

27:28I mean, anything can happen. They got themselves a prenup is what I understand. But the thing with this prenup, if you will, Ali, is that it's per other the athletic, you know, their reports. It's a number that teams can easily pay for. And U.S. soccer will be like, OK, at least we got something with. In 2016, the U.S. Men's National Team, the U.S. Soccer Federation, as you say, hosted the Copa America in the U.S. 2016. And their surplus after it was one hundred and sixty million. They just hosted the biggest sporting event in the history of sports. They're going to have a massive surplus. This is not a financial decision.

28:05No, it's not about the money. You know? So, as Jeff said, the feeling is that they know what they're doing and they believe that Pochettino can't complete the cycle. But Alde also said it best. He's a romantic. And he likes flirting. Yeah. And at some point, if you flirt a lot, then you get in trouble. And that trouble may mean move back to. How do you know? All right. For more discussion, remember, you can catch ESPN FC every single day on ESPN+.

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30:34While we were away, a bunch of American players are changing clubs. Some big moves, some lateral moves. So let's break them down and let's start with Gio Reyna. He will play in France's Ligue 1. Strasbourg completed the transfer from Borussia Mönchengladbach. 3 million euros the fee. Gio spent 7 years in Germany playing 149 games and a short spell with Nottingham Forest. So let's start with Gio. Herc, what do you make of this move? Is this finally the place that will see Gio Reyna become a regular soccer player? Listen, I hope so. But the dollar tag, the price tag right there is going to tell you a lot.

31:19You know, it says$3.5 million for a player that I think had a massive ceiling within U.S. soccer. And there are those out there who are looking at this as not a player who's probably top dollar, probably part of the elite. But it is a team that's used to buying cheap, finding gems, exploiting, and then promoting and letting them go on to bigger and better. They do have connections with the Premier League. It is a pipeline. But this team, in their essence, yes, this team, in their essence, is a team that is full throttle, front foot in how they press you. And he's not exactly the running type of athlete.

31:53He's not exactly a footballer that I think that suits him. We saw Gladbach. They're in a relegation battle. They have to fight. They have to claw. That wasn't his style. I have my doubts. He's going to be in direct competition with a player like Julio Enciso, who I think has a massive ceiling as well, but he's also got a massive engine on him. I don't know if it's his style of play. It's a very young team in France. They were the youngest starting at 11 last year with 22 years of age. He's going to come into this not as a young kid, not as somebody who has the benefit of the doubt in that way where you're young, you're inexperienced, you're green.

32:23No, he's going to come in as a veteran, somebody who's been there, done that, been in a certain platform. So there are certain expectations of Gio. I'm hoping this is the place, but I don't really like the setup for him. All right. For every move, ESPN.com has a grade. So the grade for Gio's transfer to Strasbourg is B. Jeff, do you agree with that grade? Yeah, I do. Obviously, he needed to get into a different situation. I think he is kind of moving down the European hierarchy, if you will. I mean, he was at Dortmund, which is one of the biggest clubs in Germany. Then he went to Gladbach, less so.

33:03Now he's going to a league that I think is a cut below the Bundesliga, at least once you get past PSG. But I think every conversation surrounding Gio Reyna begins and ends with, will his body let him reach the level that so many people have predicted for him and have hoped for him? And I think that's the big question because Gio Reyna's trajectory or path, if you will, seems to follow a familiar pattern. And that's, you know, he starts to get healthy. He starts to get some playing time. He's getting, you know, he's looking good in training. And then you don't hear from him for a couple of games because he's picked up some minor muscle injury or minor knock.

33:44And so, you know, I think, you know, there's a reason why he didn't start any of the World Cup games. I mean, his body just will not let him last, you know, the full 90 minutes. I think, you know, against Turkey, that might have been an exception. But, you know, again, it's a situation where consistently can he be on the field? I mean, it's the old, you know, cliche. The best ability is availability. And unfortunately for Gio Reyna, he has not shown enough of that. And that's where he finds himself, where he's at now with Strasburg. So the right move, trying to stay healthy, trying to play regularly, to move what it feels down in level in terms of European competition.

34:26I don't think he had any choice. Right. What else could Gio Reyna do at this point? If indeed we think that this is a move down, in all honesty, there was no other choice here. He wasn't playing Amwitzengladbach. He wasn't playing. There were no minutes available to Gio Reyna, and so therefore he needs to find something else. The good news for Gio Reyna, and I will tell you this from personal experience, Strasbourg is beautiful. Oh, yeah. I've been there a couple of times. The Alsace region, gorgeous. Yeah. Flamkuchen. It's a wonderful dish that you can eat there. I'm telling you. French-German culture.

35:02Yes. Did you like French-German culture? It's big. Did you say Frank's cooking? Frank's cooking? No. Flamkuchen. Kuchen is cake. Let me tell you. Speak of the Dutch. You're not going to bring culture to the conversation. Don't get involved. Wait, you haven't been to Strasbourg? No, no, no. Oh, no. Come on. That's sad. All right. Beautiful. The Alsace region. Let me stay with Ale. Let's talk about Max Arfsten. makes the move to Middlesbrough. He'll play in the championship. Makes the move from Columbus Crew. The fee,$7.5 million plus add-ons. 21 caps for the U.S. What do you make of this move, Ale?

35:42Well, if you're thinking about, and you asked me to look for positives for Pochettino. Yes, yes, please. If you're looking for positives. Glass half full. Absolutely, which is. Beacon of positivity. I am a beacon of positivity. Now, a guy like Max Arsten has really taken advantage of the opportunities that Mauricio Pochettino has provided for him. And a guy that perhaps may have been on the outside looking in, in terms of the national team picture, he was provided opportunities. He's taken advantage of those opportunities, carried that on to his club. And the end result of all of this is that he's now found this move.

36:16So there is growth from the player. He took advantage of the chance that was provided by Pochettino and this sort of expansion of the pool for the national team. and now makes this move, and now from here on out, you start thinking, okay, what's next for him? Well, consistently playing is going to be key at the club level, and consistently playing also with the national team, which I think is something that he can do and he's good enough to do. All right, Eric, ESPN.com gives this transfer a B+. Agree? Yeah, absolutely, and he's a player that can play in multiple positions. I agree. If there's one thing Pochettino did, there were few players, big players that took massive leaps with them.

36:56Max Arfston is one of those players. You look at a player who has the ability in this pool, like few others, to individually create space for himself with his 1v1 ability. He can do it as a wingback, as a leftback, as a winger. I think when he has the ability from a deep position to see the whole field, he's at his best. Middlesbrough is a team that was this close, nothing away from being in the Premier League. They're going to strive to do the same. So it's a setup where you've got a potential of being a Premier League player. He's going to be in a situation where he knows Hayden Morris. He knows Sebastian Berhalter.

37:25It's going to be very familiar for him. This is a very good move. And it's 7.5. We just saw Joe Reyna for 3.5. It's not a lot of money. But it's still. What I'm trying to say is not a lot of money, but it's enough where there's a certain amount of expectation on you, so you're going to get on the field. And I think he's going to do well. All right, let's move on to a goalkeeper, Diego Kochen, who has been a part of the Barcelona Academy since 2019. This move already happened to Denmark's Lindby Ball Club. He's actually already played a couple of games. It's a loan with an option to buy. How important, Jeff, was it for Diego to make this move and start getting minutes?

38:09It's absolutely critical at this stage of his career. I mean, I think training with a team of the quality of Barcelona is amazing, but I think that only gets you so far. You know, I think the pressure of playing, you know, in a league where, you know, Lingby is, you know, just been promoted to the top flight. They're going to be trying to stay up. There's a lot of pressure that comes with that. And just looking at some of the results from those first two games you talked about, I mean, five goals conceded already. I think he's going to have a busy season because I think, you know, Lingby is going to be, really struggling to prevent chances, to really be tight at the back.

38:50Just looking at some of the highlights, Koken has made some spectacular saves so far, but he's been facing a fair number of shots. But I think this will all help him grow. I mean, really, that's what he needs at this point in his career. He needs match experience. He needs the experience of being in a relegation fight or trying to keep his team up. And those minutes, I think, are really going to be the kinds of things that are going to make Mauricio Pochettino sit up and take notice if Koken performs well. So, you know, certainly everyone wants to play for Barcelona, but, you know, getting on the field is a different matter from just simply, you know, being in the squad.

39:31So I think this is a great move for Koken, and we'll just have to see the degree to which he takes advantage of it. In terms of the U.S. men's national team, the goalkeeper position is wide open. You would like to think that. minute, you would like, exactly, you would like to think that. Now, ESPN.com gives a familiar grade in my case, which is an A. Do you agree with an A for Diego Cohen making the move to Denmark? I'll raise my hand and say, um, never got an A, huh? Well, I questioned that professor. In any case, that I had to Google Lingby. What? What? Lingby? I suppose, if we're going to look this is a positive and it's to the point that Jeff was making.

40:15He's going to get a lot of repetition. He's going to get a lot of opportunities to make big saves. He's going to get a lot of minutes and a lot of chances to prove that he is the guy for the future eventually somewhere else because this team is going to give up chances there and it's up to him whether he takes advantage of this. I don't know that you call it an opportunity when you're getting bombarded with shots time and time again, but he was looking for repetitions. He's going to get repetition. Yeah, but I don't like this at all because it's a loan deal. So if you're Barcelona and you want him to come back.

40:46You have to Google Lingby or what? You have to Google. Come on now. I've never heard of it. No, no, never heard of it. If you didn't know Strasburg, you don't know Lingby. No, no. I've never been to Strasburg. There's a difference. But here's the thing with Lingby. It's not a team that's going to play the same way Barcelona plays with the high line and expect their goalkeeper to play with his feet. So what are you really trying to accomplish with this loan? because there's a difference between playing and just throwing him out there and developing. And I'm not so sure this is good for his development.

41:14Will you be a shot stopper? Sure. Will you develop in the way that Barcelona wants you to develop, to bring you back and actually fight for a chance to play within that system? I don't think so. And you have to be very careful with young players and goalkeepers especially. It's a confidence issue. This guy is not playing for Barcelona. No, I'm not saying he is. It tells you a lot that Manuel, no Manuel. Ter Stegen. Ter Stegen left. the club finally, and there's no... They brought in Juan Garcia, and he's a long-term... Chesney's... He will never leave. Chesney is eternal. Alright, Eric, this was for you.

41:47Sebastian Berhalter also joining Middlesbrough from Vancouver Whitecaps. He played in every single game during the World Cup, and he was actually okay. No, no, no, he wasn't okay. He did great. He did, yeah, okay. For what they asked of him, he did great. I agree. He did great. That's a$2 million move. How good is this move for Sebastian Berhalter? I think it's a great move. You could feel any type of way if you want, if you're a Vancouver fan of why he leaves now and all these different things. You couldn't lock him up then. He's free to leave. It's$2 million, which is a low fee because I believe he was about to be leaving on a free in the winter.

42:27But he's a player that is very contagious in his work ethic. He's technically sound. He's a pest to be around defensively. And he offers set pieces. He offers striking ability. And you see it in the game he had not too long ago. It was a preseason friendly. They scored five goals. He was involved in three of the five goals. I think this is a great move for him. And it keeps him in the U.S. men's national team picture. And I'll repeat with Middlesbrough. They were this close to already being in the Premier League. It's a team that's going to fight for Premier League status again. I really like the move for Sebastian Berhalter.

42:59Yeah, three Americans now with Boro playing in the championship. Our friends at ESPN.com, Jeff, gave this transfer an A -. Agreed? I might have been a little lower. I might have been in the B-plus range, but, I mean, really, that's kind of splitting hairs. I mean, listen, I think Sebastian Berhalter brings a lot of good qualities. You know, as the guys mentioned, you know, great set piece delivery, great striker of the ball. My only concern is the champion English championship is a notoriously physical league. And, you know, there's one concern I have about Berhalter's game is its ability to kind of body up and win those duels.

43:44You know, we'll see what happens. I mean, and maybe he does well for a couple of weeks, but it's a grind. I mean, it's a long season, you know, just so many games, one right after the other. And physically, I think that wears down a lot of players. And so it's going to be very interesting to me to see how Berhalter lasts, you know, what's his stamina like? You know, how is he able to manage the grind and the fatigue and getting up for games continuously? Obviously, it's a huge opportunity for him, so I'm sure he'll be excited. it will keep him in the national team frame, but he does have to get on the field because I think, you know, Marisa Pochettino has shown that if you're not playing, even for a little bit, or if you're the slightest bit injured, you're not going to get called in.

44:27So a huge challenge for Berhalter, but also a huge opportunity. But overall, I think it's a positive move. Yeah, I agree with the physicality, maybe being a challenge, but also the style of play might play in his favor for him. Can I ask you a question now? Because I was thinking about this. You said you got an A. Yeah, only got A's, yeah. Only A's. Who got you that A? El Profesor Girafatis. No, any. Among others. Among others. El Profesor Chapatin, and he was a doctor. All right, we'll run it back. I was at the airport the other day, and the amount of Leeds jerseys I saw was unbelievable. Playing friendly matches against Liverpool Herk and Brendan Aronson in the score sheet, scoring.

45:08Left-footed inside the box. Good start for Brendan Aronson. He's ever present. He gets himself in great positions. And he's had, I would say, the last couple seasons, not so much great luck. Last season, he got us back onto the score sheet. All right. The action continues on ESPN, ESPN Plus, and ESPN Deportes. And it's the first trophy of the season. It is actually a shield. It's the Community Shield Arsenal Premier League Champs against Man City FA Cup Champs on ESPN. August 16th, 10 a.m. Eastern Time.

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46:51Finally, humo blanco, white smoke. Larry Berg has been named Major League Soccer's next commissioner. Following a vote on Monday at the league's headquarters, Berg served as co-managing owner of LAFC, also as co-chair of Major League Soccer. He will succeed Don Garber, who's been in charge for 27 years. Let's take a listen at Larry Berg. Look, we have a lot to do. Obviously, the foundation's terrific, but I think it all starts with quality on the field. I think there's a lot of other things that matter a lot. I think the new calendar was a massive move. I think the new playoffs, the new divisions, these are all really important.

47:34Youth development we talked about, but you know at the end of the day it's quality on the field which means roster investment model in part and that's something that the owners need to decide collectively. It was my job as co-chair of a sporting competition committee to help move those along. I'm really excited about the opportunity to have my fingers all over that even that much more and what I promised the owners yesterday and my presentation is I'd spend the first few months talking to and meeting with all the owners and hearing about all of their viewpoints because I think everyone unanimously wants to move forward.

48:06Everyone wants to take advantage of this rocket fuel from the World Cup, but they have different views of how to do so. I have had the experience, I won't call it the opportunity, but the experience of having invested in a few clubs in Europe and a few clubs in promotion relegation leagues. I can understand the appeal for the fan. I don't think it's a great way to build a league. I don't think it's a way to get stadiums built and to get training facilities built and to have owners invest in rosters and and all the other things you need to do so I don't think it's appropriate for our league I think Don has said before never say never but I just don't see it happening anytime soon I think there are other ways I I liken it more to jeopardy so the great thing about promotion relegation for fans is the jeopardy is quite severe but I think there are other ways to create jeopardy during the regular season to get into the playoffs during the playoffs to get to the next round.

48:56In the World Cup, we all enjoyed knockout games after the group stage. I call those games of consequence or games of jeopardy. And I think that's really what I'm more focused on than specifically relegation. All right, Jeff, very straightforward question. Why Larry Bird? Why did MLS owners decide he was the man to take the job? well he's he's one of their own to start with um so you know obviously he's a familiar face they're familiar with the way he operates you know in terms of the sporting and competition committee um and he's a guy that that tries to build consensus and so and listen that's you know that's not an easy thing when you're talking about 30 different clubs uh you know some owners who are you know kind of wedded to the old ways others who want to you know kind of break the bank and and really take the shackles off the league and start spending more.

49:50So I think, you know, that, that consensus building is going to be really important. But there's also familiarity. I think they know what they're getting in Larry Berg and you know, it's that comfort level, I think goes a long way when you're trying to talk about prickly issues like roster rules and, and, and how the league is going to move forward. I mean, I do think that they kind of missed an opportunity by not doing the calendar shift earlier if they were going to do it. But again, I think that speaks to the difficulty that Larry Berg is facing in trying to get these big changes approved by an ownership group that becomes more and more diverse and just has very differing opinions about a variety of topics.

50:34How big of a decision this was for Major League Soccer, Eric, and did they get it right? Well, we're going to see if they got it right, but it's a massive decision. Don Garber was with Major League Soccer for 27 years. And when Don Garber started, there were 12 teams, two had contracted, it went down to 10. And there was one soccer-specific stadium. And that stadium at one point had the billboard, the scoreboard, burned down. You know, it was a Columbus crew. And now there's over 20 soccer-specific stadiums. There's 30 teams. Don Garber didn't just, you know, grow soccer in America. It didn't just grow Major League Soccer.

51:12he saved Major League Soccer. It was on life support to see where it's at now. But now you have to go to the next level. And in a commissioner like Larry Berg, who, as Jeff mentioned, was one of their own. Well, what part of one of their own? He was of the new ownership group, the most ambitious of ownership groups, LAFC, a team that's constantly trying to push the envelope. And there's a certain sensation within Major League Soccer that there are certain owners who try to push the envelope, the LAFCs, the LA Galaxies, the Inter-Miami. I mean, some would say they push it a little too much, but they try to consistently spend, consistently get better on the field.

51:47And then there are those ownership groups who are just content with going with the flow wherever the tide takes them. Well, in Larry Berg, you would assume that being part of an ownership group like LAFC means you're going to spend. And it's not just spending and I spend it on one player, I spend it on two players, I spend it on three players. But you get better players along the way because you're willing to spend. and it's not about the ceiling. I hope with Larry Berg, you raise the floor. You make sure that these ownership groups have to spend and spend in the right ways because you look at some of these spends for these teams, 12 to 20 million, that's a lot of money around the rest of the world.

52:26But when you say of that 20 million, 17 million goes to three players, four players, then you're saying, well, now it's a competitive imbalance here. So I'm hoping with Larry Berg, things go down the road of they spend, spend smartly, and grow the game organically that way. But he's got tons of different things to deal with. They picked Larry Berg over a guy like David Nathanson, who was a TV executive for Fox, with a looming TV deal coming up in the next couple years, which is massive. So it shows you, I think, the ambition of where the league wants to go. Yeah, I mean, I think it's no coincidence that the fact that he has been a part of LAFC ownership group tells you a lot, the way they've handled their business in Major League Soccer.

53:09Now, Ale, we have a list of challenges that Larry Berg will face as Major League Soccer commissioner. Roster rules, media reach, calendar and competition, and life after Messi. What's the number one challenge for Larry Berg? And it looks like Jeopardy, so you know how to phrase your answer. Life after Messi. honestly look let's not let's not let's not kid around this and let's not sugarcoat this in this show pair our producer's instruction because he's the one that puts the rundown right there is no show that we go by without talking about Lionel Messi we haven't talked about Messi in this not yet not yet I just did oh you did you just brought him up I just did and yeah you're right okay And he will.

54:07He will. He will come back. He will be here later on. He was part of the TC. You're right. Yes. Okay. And so, and the reason that's the case is because there aren't that many interesting stories to the casual fan in MLS other than Lionel Messi. We, as analysts, and this is what we do. we make sure we watch the Messi game because we know that's going to be part of the conversation. But we're not diving deep into the Vancouver against Sporting Kansas City match. We're not. No. We're not. And here's the other thing that I think ties right into this. When you talk about this next media deal and next TV deal and Messi is not part of that conversation, what exactly are you selling?

54:58To whoever is interested in picking up this league, what are you selling? What are you selling a TV executive and saying, this is why our league is special. This is where our league is going, and this is how we're going to get there, and this is how we're going to get the interest of people. When right now, right now, as we speak, if you want to watch an MLS game, it's not readily available to you. You have to go through steps. You have to go search for the league. You have to go search for MLS. And let me just tell you, I love me some MLS. I'm a product of MLS, but I'll be the first one to tell you that if MLS is not right in front of me, Cashel fan is not going to search for MLS.

55:37And so now they're behind walls that weren't there before, and it's difficult to find additional interest in MLS that is outside Lionel Messi. So live after Messi, it's going to be tough. You know what's a little upsetting? Because I'm also a product of Major League Soccer, and you'd love for the domestic league in America to do well. and I always hear the United States is not a soccer nation. I could push back on that all day. It's not a U.S. men's national team nation. It's not an MLS nation, but it's a soccer nation. Look at how they consume the sport constantly, whether it's friendlies at the Rose Bowl in Pasadena on a Wednesday night that fill up the stadium between Club America, 90 ,000.

56:16Club America Chivas or the big house in the summer to see Man United, Liverpool, 120 ,000. They fill up, they consume. Look at the World Cup. They just don't have Major League Soccer as an intention here. We've heard, thank you, world. We'll take it from here, from Major League Soccer. They had, and it goes to what Jeff was saying about Larry Berg and the difficulties going to come of trying to get a consensus with the ownerships. They've had eight years, a runway alley of eight years to prepare for this moment. And could you imagine if eight years ago you said to them, we're going to give you Lionel Messi, the year of the World Cup playing in your league, and he's going to play a final and be one of the leading goal-scoring candidates golden ball candidates.

56:58As current World Cup champion, by the way. As current World Cup champion, take it from there. Do what you can. They didn't do that. They didn't do that. And that is just, it's disheartening because it makes you question who's making the decisions and where they're going. I agree. I obviously do not disagree. It's messy. The problem, Jeff, is there's only one messy. It doesn't get better. It doesn't get bigger than that. So maybe, maybe, flexing, adjusting, changing the calendar, flexing the competition rules can bring you not the next best thing, but whatever follows Lionel Messi. What's your number one priority on this list?

57:41Challenges that Larry Berg is going to face. Well, for me, it's the roster rules. I mean, because Lionel Messi, as great as he is, he's going to retire someday. He's not going to be able to play anymore. I mean, there's no stopping that. And so, you know, how do you make the product on the field as compelling as possible? And so I think that the way to do that is to modify the roster rules so that, yeah, you still got, you know, your stars. You've got your Griezmann's. You've got your, you know, Youngmin Son, you know, coming to L.A. And, you know, you keep those guys coming in. But I think there needs to be just more depth across the roster.

58:24and right now it's just not possible. And so, you know, I think they need to, you know, I'm not saying that they should go crazy and be irresponsible with the way they spend. I mean, I don't think they want to be in a position like, you know, some European clubs find themselves in where, you know, these clubs are going bankrupt because they spent beyond what was advisable. But I do think that the roster rules are going to be a way to really just improve the product on the field, you know, get not so much the Griezmann's of the world to come, but, you know, maybe a tier or two below that in greater numbers.

59:00Cause I mean, I think there are, you know, some players like that who do come, but, um, you know, it's, it's, again, it's just, you know, getting those players to come, you know, looking at, it seems like every year when we talk about Hanka calf champions league or, or the champions cup, whatever they call it, um, You look at the guys coming off the bench and it's young guys as opposed to full internationals for the Mexican clubs. And so, you know, I think they need MLS needs to strive to where they're reaching that point where, you know, the first or second or third guy off the bench is a full blown international of high quality to really add to the depth.

59:43And at that point, you know, then you can make a compelling case that an MLS team can win the Kaka Kap Champions Cup. So all of these things are interconnected. I mean, the calendar is connected to it, you know, making sure that the transfer windows are in sync. The roster rules are part of it, you know, and all of that is going to help MLS survive in a post-Messi world. And all of those things that, of all the things that Jeff has said today, that last part is the most important. The list of four things that we just saw there, they are indeed related to each other and dependent upon each other.

1:00:19And if you're not able to actually build a connection between those four things, then you're not taking the steps that you need in order to make this league what we all want MLS to be. Jeff, as always, a pleasure talking to you. Thank you for your time, and we'll see you next time here on Football Americas. Thanks, Jeff. Anytime, guys. That's Jeff Carlisle, our good friend, senior writer, ESPN.com, with us. And WSL continues this Sunday, primetime, 9 p.m. Eastern Time, Seattle, rain-facing Angel City on ESPN, also en Espanol on ESPN Deportes. From first call to final invoice, Service Titan is the only integrated intelligence that automates your entire workflow.

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1:01:38Found is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services provided by lead bank member FDIC. El nuevo clásico de la CONCACAF. Inter Miami Atlético de San Luis. Oh, Lionel Messi back in action. What's going on with CONCACA? Back in the starting 11. Fourth minute, and it's awesome. There is Lionel Messi. Remember, Ree Suarez is suspended. Six games for League's Cup. Rodrigo De Paul starting. Casemiro starting. Lionel Messi starting for Inter Miami. First start since the World Cup. Fourth minute. Look at all the space. Romain Torres with the cross. And it's going to be David Rodriguez with a lot of Major League Soccer experience, by the way, Herc.

1:02:22And it's San Luis. San Luis is leading in Miami. It's a finish inside the six. Rocco Rios can't do anything about it. 1-0, St. Louis. But now it's San Luis. San Luis. Noah Allen had a big game, three assists. Yes, this counts as an assist. But what about the finish by Messi, Ale? Well, service for Noah Allen. And then Lionel Messi made it into an assist. That's right. That is delicious. It's a good ball though. Seven minutes blasted San Luis lead in Miami. We go to the 26th minute. Allen cuts back to Telasco and Telasco Segovia with the finish. Easy finish and now Inter Miami leading. Give it to them.

1:03:03What's Andy Sanchez doing? What's Andy Sanchez doing? I have no idea. Again, Allen. He's going to find the space on the wing. first time, the dummy, and then Messi with a brace in 43 minutes. Really good combination play. Beautifully done. Good finish. And that is an assist. It's a corner kick, and it's Mikael who heads it back to the net. Inter Miami leading comfortably. But the second half, San Luis played actually really well. Herc, they found the goal. Felipe Mora will play a pass, finding Rafa Llorente, who will score a golazo. El Español. 22 years of age. Hasn't played much with San Luis, but keep an eye on him.

1:03:44The Atletico Madrid ex-product. It's a golazo. Look at how he shapes that. Beautiful goal. In the end, victory for Inter Miami. 4-2. It is the start of League's Cup. Second time the season with three goal involvements for Lionel Messi. Had not scored a first-half brace. Look at the standards, by the way, since last season. Man. I'm sure he's going to be okay, guys. Really on a drop. Lionel Messi, multiple goals in five of 12 Career League Cup games. And now 14 Career League Cup goals leading the competition. I am going to be very honest. I thought after the World Cup, it was probably the worst that we would see from Lionel Messi after the World Cup.

1:04:33He took some time on vacation in Argentina. I had no idea how motivated he was going to be to come back and play for Inter Miami. That's totally on me. That's the idiot in me. Getting a lot of A's in school, but that's the idiot on me. What does that performance tell you about Messi? Something that I didn't already know. It's as business as usual for Lionel Messi. It's another day at the office. Part of me thinks it's just how competitive he is. But no, it's not being competitive. It's just how much he loves to play the game. He's enjoying himself right now. He's been enjoying himself in Miami.

1:05:07I mean, any day on social media, you open up your phone, you're going to see a video of somebody going, I just saw Messi at a Publix at the grocery store. Messi's hanging out with his kids, walking around, and they'll take a video, say, hi, Messi, and he'll just wave back and go about his business. He's loving life right now. They lost the World Cup final, and I'm sure that hurts him. But he's back to enjoying the game, and it doesn't look like, I'm sure it hurt him a lot, but it doesn't look like it affected him where we would see that hangover, if you will, on the field. Like the day he got to Major League Soccer and exploded onto the scene at League's Cup where it's with a Mai Tai in hand off the plane and scores a free kick against Cruz Azul in League's Cup.

1:05:47Very first moment we saw Lionel Messi, he hasn't missed a beat. He continues to do the same thing. So nothing that I didn't already know about Messi. The game had to be stopped for 25 minutes because of the weather in Miami. And I thought, Ale, all right, Inter is leading 4-2. It is after the 68th minute. They had to stop for 25 minutes. We're not going to see Messi again. What's the point? Once you go back to the dressing room, 39 years old, he finished the game. Rodrigo De Paul had to be substituted because he just couldn't play any longer. He was exhausted. So what are we seeing from Lionel Messi that should give Inter Miami, Major League Soccer, the confidence that we will still see the best version possible of Lionel Messi whatever time he has left?

1:06:43That he plays because he loves to play. Yep. It really is as simple as that. Did you know that he doesn't have to do this? He really doesn't. He could very well be at the golf course. he could really well be wherever he wants to be at the beach if he so desired and nobody would blame him for it. He certainly has earned the right to make that decision but this is what he loves doing. He loves playing and here's another thing that helps. He's still really really good. He's still the best player in MLS. He's still one of the best players in the world and given his performances in the World Cup it's hard to argue against him still being the best player in the world.

1:07:22And so when you're playing at that level and things come so easily to him and he's still enjoying it, and there is something great about being able to score every single game. There's something great about having opportunities to score and influence the game and impact the game in the manner in which he still does. And that fuels him. It is still fulfilling for him to be on the field, having an impact on his team and winning matches. And until that disappears and And until he notices that he's not quite seeing the field the same way or he's unable to do things that really impact the game or change the game or score a goal on an assist, until he himself doesn't realize that that's happening or doesn't see it, I don't think we're going to see him walk away because this is what he loves to do.

1:08:10But I do think that when he does feel like, yeah, things are not as easy as they once were, he may just say, this is about it. But to Mal's question, I can't help. It's not surprising that he does so well, but it is surprising the manner that he does so well physically. And I'm going to bring Cristiano Ronaldo into the conversation, because when we compare them, of course, you would think Cristiano, because he's a physical specimen, you're like, he's never going to have he's not going to be at a disadvantage physically and you would assume that out of the two Messi's the one at a disadvantage physically and we've played in this league if anything it's a very physically capable league Mel East Coast to West Coast is six hours three different time zones sometimes you're on turf there are physical limitations for a lot of players who come from an elite level to Major League Soccer that doesn't apply to Lionel Messi and when you look at a player like Cristiano who doesn't have the ability to separate by himself and create for himself, Messi still does.

1:09:10And he was never a physical player. I can't help to be surprised at that aspect of it. You mentioned the 25 to 30-minute delay there. That's not easy. No, exactly. That's my point. For a player to get back into rhythm that way, that's not an easy thing to do. Well, here's the other thing. It also tells you that he's the one that makes the decision as to when he plays and how he plays and how long he plays. Because if indeed the manager had the power to say, Hey, Leonel, after this 39, after this minute that we've been off the field, there's no need for you to be back out on the field. No need for you to take this chance.

1:09:41And he's like, ¿qué decimos? It is with Inter-Miami, and it's with the national team as well. All right, moving on to more League Scope action. Rayados de Monterrey. Orlando City. That's Antoine Griezmann. He still hasn't scored at home for Orlando City. Now he does it, Ale. Tyrese Pizer had himself a game. Here's the assist for the French star Orlando Lening. Puts it into a dangerous position. Sliding finish. Well taken. And then, what happened here, Eric? I don't think anything happened. I don't think anything happened, and all of a sudden, there's a red card being shown. Luis Reyes, Maxime Crepoll.

1:10:20A lot of backing up for Luis Reyes. Late contact on the keeper. Reyes initially giving red. What? Change to a yellow after our good pal, Adonai Escobedo. I don't even know why it's a yellow, if I'm being honest. Yeah. You know, he challenged for the ball. Very confusing. Very confusing. Fifth to sixth minute. Look at this play. Is this a penalty or not? I mean, it doesn't look like he gets a piece of it. It looks like he pulls out. Yeah, it looks like the goalkeeper pulls out. I don't know what that's called. Now, Antoine Griezmann took the ball, but it was Spicer. And take a look at the finish.

1:10:54Oh, my God. World class. And it's 2-0 for Orlando. 74th minute. Right on. Moving on. Lucas Ocampos goes down inside the box. Adonai Escobar says penalty. Now for Rayados de Monterrey. Orlando doesn't like it. There's a VAR review. And Adonai says, nope, I got that wrong as well. I know I die when I see one. 99th minute. Game's almost over. Lucas Ocampos for Hugo Kuyper. Wow, ex-Chicago. Monterrey's new signing. Yeah, and Orlando with Grisie wins it. 2-1. Now, in LA, LAFC facing Chivas. Who's playing home team here, Herc? Oh, it's Chivas. Is it? Oh, it's all Chivas. 38-minute. David Martinez, what a good player.

1:11:41What a good cross. What a great finish, Ale, from Denny Buanga. What a service from. Vamos, Venezuela! He's a star, man. Good player. He's a really good player. Yeah, we're going to need him. 42nd minute. Now Chivas. He's another good player. La Cotorra. And it's El Piojo Alvarado. can score for Chivas now. It does seem like but he's on the right track. He's always in good positions. He kind of scuffs it but it's lower corner and it's in. Yeah, he had himself a World Cup. El Piojo Alvarado. Seventieth minute. El Oso Gonzalez hits the crossbar. That's good buildup down the left hand side. Eventually they get their head up.

1:12:19Hits it really well but the ball is always rising off the crossbar. Chance for LAFC. El Talarrangel. Seems like a late reaction but in the end, saves it. Yeah, I think he had it covered the whole way. It made it look nicer than it should have been. Going to penalty kicks. Yeah, and if it's penalties and if it's Chivas, don't let Luis Romo take PK's hurt. We know this. We know this. And certainly like this. Everybody should know this. Walking. Oh, my God. He misses that one. Very casual. Very loose. Jude Terry, if he scores, LFC gets the W. They do. I see the bias in this show in which we don't show Marquis Delgado, Hercules compadre missing a penalty.

1:13:00Wow. I didn't rate that highlights. We also don't show the fact that Seattle got housed either. A lot of biases in this show. Another tie. Dig it in Salt Lake. Steffen did really well in that game too. Hey, finally a Leagues game played in Mexico. Toluca at home beat current champ Seattle 3-0. Alright, that's just part of the action we've seen from this edition of Leagues Cup, but let's talk big picture here, Herc. We got a list of teams. We got big teams. We got Tigres, not so big teams as well. Who needs to win Leeds Cup the most? Because in this kind of tournaments, you and I have agreed that if you win it, if you're a big club, it's like, okay, you won it.

1:13:49But if you don't win it, and you miss out on a lot, But who out of these clubs needs it the most? Okay. Now, this needs it the most could be pressure. This needs it the most could be a trophy. This needs it the most could be many different things. Exactly. Go with me here. According to you. According to you. Number five, who needs it the most? And this team's not going to even get close, but it's Monterrey because they've invested probably more than any team in North America. Matias Almeida, Ruben Pineda, Kuyper's now new forward there. They've invested a lot and they need a trophy. It's been a while.

1:14:21I don't know if Dennis De Closet and his team are going to get close. I say no. Number four. They don't really need a trophy, but they need an international trophy. That's all they kept saying, international trophy. Uh-oh. I don't think they've been this good. I don't think they've been good, and they're in first place in Liga Mekis. It's a team that doesn't have a deep roster. Guillermo Amara is a guy who's a system coach. He works with young players. I think we're going to see a generational change in many ways with America, but they're still a team that's always pressured. Even though this feels like a transition.

1:14:49Correct. semester for Club America. Break out the excuses, but I wasn't. It's not an excuse. It's just reality. It's reality, he says. All right, top three. By the way, only Liga MX clubs. Here goes a Major League Soccer one. Can you drag LAFC over here, please? Of course. LAFC is a team that for the longest time, we have said the pieces are there, the elements are there, the players, they invest, they push the envelope, but the style doesn't convince. And Marco Santos, he's tried many different things, but there are games where this team is only in games because of how individually brilliant some of these players are.

1:15:27Son, Boanga, etc. It's a team that needs to prove they're up for the big moment. And in times like international tournaments, they've not proven it. They're a team that needs something badly, if you will. When you talk about investment with Rayados de Monterrey, LAFC, they are also heavy investors. Now, sometimes it's just in the short term, the deals like they did with Chiellini, with Gareth Bale. But now they invested for the long haul with Heung-Lin Sohn. They were able to retain Denny Wanga. Yes, it's a new manager, but it feels like still hasn't clicked the way it must, right? They've made very smart transfers with players, bringing in Hugo Lloris, bringing in a player like Marquis Delgado, giving stability in the midfield.

1:16:12Smart little buys like Jacob Schockenberg here and there. But this is a team that needs to provide big for their fan base because they always show up Does it feel like Leagues Cup is a priority for LAFC so far? Any trophy should be a priority for LAFC, which is why they're on the list. Okay, number two. And this is interesting for many different reasons because Chivas isn't a favorite per se, but they're one of the favorites to me in how they play. All they're missing, and this is crazy to say, is the goals, the goal scoring. La Romina Gonzalez was almost bicampeón de golo, back-to-back goal-scoring champion in Mexico.

1:16:47He won one, and I pegged him to be the next Chicharito Hernandez at the World Cup. He didn't explode. He played 40 minutes, Mal. But this team plays probably the best I've seen out of any team in League's Cup. They just can't put the ball in the back of the net. But they need something, because we're talking about a tournament that's a short sprint to a trophy, and in Liga MX, when it comes to playoff time, it's going to be home and away, and I think it's going to be much more difficult. If you want a chance of a trophy, If you want a chance of CONCACAF Champions Cup, I think this is their best bet.

1:17:15That's the thing. It's a short tournament. You have a shot. You've played well last semester. In terms of Liga MX, it felt like that was their shot last season. It's not going to be easy to repeat what they did last year, especially if Ormiga Gonzalez is not scoring at the rate he did last year. Ten games without a goal. Exactly. That's almost 500 minutes for Ormiga Gonzalez without scoring. Without that, it feels like it's not going to be easy for Chivas to win it all. But I like the way they play. They play very good football. They play good bread. Let's say they play fine. They play fine. They're not 0-9 Barcelona.

1:17:53They play okay. It's a good team. They play worse, but they're not reinventing soccer. Settle down, Americanista. Number one. This is going to be strange to some people because what do you mean they need it the most? What do you mean? But what do you mean they need it the most, Eric? There you go. Do you know that when you think about all-time World Cup goals, all-time Champions League goals, all-time La Liga goals, all-time any type of competition, World Cup qualifying in South America, Messi's not the leader in any of those. You know where he is the leader? Let me guess. All-time League Cup goals.

1:18:29That's where he's the leader. Well, why does he need? It's not for Messi. It's not for Inter Miami. It's for Major League Soccer. They've won before. They have won, but they represent Major League Soccer. And I think Major League Soccer desperately needs. Hey, remember, we will take it from here. That's what they said. There is no we will take it from here unless Messi is front, center stage of everything Major League Soccer does. This is their tournament on their network. They need to have a big Messi moment. He gave it against your beloved San Luis. He needs to continue to do it and he needs to lift the trophy again.

1:19:02Not for Inter-Miami. They've won everything. Not for Messi. He doesn't care about this tournament, but he's a beast competitively. Major League Soccer needs it. All right, surprise Tigres and Cruz Azul are not a part of that list. You can catch some more of this kind of interaction every single day on Ahora o Nunca, the very popular ESPN. Five days a week. I can't take you seven. Catch it. All right, five days a week. You can subscribe to the YouTube channel Ahora o Nunca ESPN.

1:19:37soccer. Vini has re-signed with Real Madrid. Six-year deal. It wasn't easy. Arsenal became a part of the story. But in the end, Vini stays with Real Madrid. Jose Mourinho was a big part of the negotiation. Talking to Florentino Perez, convincing him that they needed to keep Vini in order to have a successful season. Now, we can see this both ways. Is this a win-win situation, or was there any aspect of this negotiation that maybe led you to believe that this was not going to happen and Vini probably would move on from Real Madrid? I don't think the Arsenal conversation was ever a serious conversation.

1:20:27But when he was presenting and kind of put on the table and I started doing the math, I kind of went, wait a minute, let me see. Let me see if I'm Real Madrid. And I'm trying to bring an argument for this. I'm saying, if we're able to sell Vinny for a big number to Arsenal, then can we then reinvest that money and go get Michael Olisse from Bayern Munich? And then that resolves the situation in between Mbappe and Vinny organically. Vinny gone, Michael Olisse down the right-hand side. They obviously have a good relationship from the French national team. You can possibly even make the argument that Jean Diomande coming and playing on the left-hand side.

1:21:04It's not Vinny Jr., but could be comparable in some ways. And he is more of a left-sided player. And you have now resolved the front three conversation for Real Madrid. But as I said before, the Arsenal conversation I never thought was a real one. And it was all about convincing Vinny Jr. that he was just as important to Real Madrid as Kylian Mbappé. Because this became not so much more about money. Hold on. It's not so much about money as it is about if you scratch his back, you've got to scratch my back. If he gets back tickles, I want back tickles. It was about ego. It was about show me that you love me just as much as you do that guy.

1:21:44It was jealousy. It was ego. oh, take care of me just like you took care of that guy. And now that he's been taken care of, I assume that they actually trickles down to the field. And their understanding between Kylian Mbappe and Vini Jr. may be better because everybody feels taken care of. I don't think there's any personal beef between Vini and Mbappe. But, I mean, so far, after two seasons, it doesn't feel like the right chemistry is there to make them work up to their expectations. because Mbappé has scored up to that level. Vini hasn't really performed. And when he performed was when Mbappé was hurt and he was not starting games for Real Madrid.

1:22:26Yeah, it was also under Xavi Alonso where he wasn't happy, correct? And he wasn't a full-time starter. I just still can't get over the back tickles. Is that what you call them? Yeah, back tickles. Back tickles. Yeah, that was very graphic. Let me tell you something. Back tickle is nice. No, I'm not saying it's not a nice thing to have. Listen, Alec doesn't think the Arsenal thing was ever going to materialize. And I necessarily don't think that either. I think that was not on the table for Vinny Jr. I think Vinny Jr. used Arsenal as a leveraging chip, as leverage in this negotiation. Did you just make up a word there?

1:22:58I said leveraging chip. Yes, yes. A term. Yes. I believe that's what he did there. He got Real Madrid to go over the line and they met at a happy medium. That said, there's a narrative that Vinny Jr. and Kylian Mbappé cannot coexist. A lot of that could be true, but what we've seen on the field. Real Madrid had an array of problems in the last two years. A lot of them were health. A lot of them were keeping players on the field in important positions. The whole back line. It was always a new back line. And it was always somebody else being injured. And then it was the coaching change of Xavi Alonso.

1:23:35and Vinny Jr. can never coexist within that new regime. So there's a lot of things that went bad, not just with Vinny Jr., not just with MAP. I'm very curious how it's going to work now with Jose Mourinho. And I think Yandio Mande is an interesting piece to inject into this because now you have two players, very much like the Spanish national team had and Nico Williams and Limiñamal, Barcelona had at one time with Rafinha and Limiñamal, where it's a double-headed spear on both sides and you've got somebody in the middle of that attack, in the heart of the attack, to put things away. I'm very interested in how they coexist now.

1:24:11If they can't hear, then we have a problem. Then we have the narrative that you can strike down. This is an issue of they cannot coexist. But until we see that, I have my doubts. That is going to be the biggest challenge for Jose Mourinho now, back at Real Madrid. Can he make Kylian Mbappé and Vini coexist and perform at the level that is expected from both of them? There are no more excuses. No more excuses. Everybody's got taken care of. They got their back tickles. Everybody got their back tickles. What is it? What is it? What is it? What is it? What is it? What is it? What is it? What is it?

1:24:44You know who's not getting any back tickles? Neymar. Especially. Oh, here we go. Especially from what happened over this week. Santos made it through the next round of the local cup, and then he started making fun of the opponent. and he was then called low life for provoking the fans and the players that way. Are you okay with that, Herc? No. Are you okay with that behavior? No, I think it's beneath a player like Neymar. I would hope it is beneath a player of Neymar's status, which is legendary in Brazil. That's not the way you want to be seen, and I could understand you being upset, but that's not the way you should condo it or should act, I should say.

1:25:29You shouldn't be surprised, though. It's been happening. This is who he is. If you win the World Cup, then you can provoke anyone you want. This is just advancing in the Brazilian Cup against Remo. Come on, man. La Liga is about to start Saturday, August 22nd, is when Real Madrid will play the first game. La Liga starts next weekend, but we'll see. Jose Mourinho's Real Madrid for the first time playing at Espanol. that Saturday, August 22nd, 3.30 p.m. Eastern. And the next day, Elche will host Barcelona. Both matches, coverage at 3 on ABC. Papi is going to be there. This guy. Oh, yeah? All right.

1:26:13All right, in case you missed it, I mean, all family members have disagreements. How about when the disagreement is with the club that you went to see at the statement? And look at the little kid wearing the split jersey. No, that's not healthy. Flamengo and Vasco da Gama. Oh, my man. I mean, that's a good family dynamic. No, that's not a good family dynamic. It's a good family dynamic. Yeah, it looks good. The argument stays on the field. It's on the field. Look at the kid. She's under control, though. She's got the hands back and only brings them out when she's going to make a point. and she attacks and then hands back again.

1:26:56She's under control. The other guy, emotional. Now, problem is the kid. Poor kid. I mean, if you're the kid, you got to pick a side. You cannot be wearing the split jersey. You can't pick a side. You're seeing this at home every day. Either you love your mom or you love your dad. You're seeing this at home every day. All right, on Monday. This is not the first time these guys argue. An exclusive conversation with Weston McKinney and Chucky Lozano. What is that? You play with the LA Galaxy. Thanks for watching. Gracias, Ale. Thank you, Herc. This has been Football Americas. We'll see you on Monday.

1:27:30Good to be back.

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